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Opticaly
11-18-2007, 05:07 PM
Free running/Le parkour

Free-running is great but the climbing is kinda slow, it's realistic but can get annoying after a couple hours of playing; so maybe giving the next character a good upper-body strength would help.

Time

Night & Day cycle. You don't really notice the day all the time because your too busy kicking ***! But if there was a few missions in the night and a few in the day, maybe some in morning and times like that, that would be amazing, standing on a roof while watching guards and peasants walking around, using shadows to your advantage and all that jazz.

Stealth

Stealth is a big thing in the Assassination world so I think it should be used more frequently, obviously Assassin's Creed has proved that there is more than physically hiding in the darkness from guards but I believe there should be a good old shadow-type stealth, hiding using darkness and camouflage, it's a great way to sneak up on targets.

Difficulty

As most of you know; killing guards can become pretty easy, but still quite fun, but why only one difficulty? If we had a difficulty setting the game would be more challenging, maybe on hard mode the guards could be tougher and sometimes more aware of your action.

Random Events

Ubisoft has come up with a couple of great events inside Assassin's Creed but they can get a little old, so you might want to consider putting different events in, e.g. random people trying to pickpocket you or others, random fights over certain things like bumping into to people etc, murders and much more.

Shopping

We all know the weapons were amazing on Assassin's Creed, a lovely sword with great combos, a small but effective short sword, throwing daggers, fists and your hidden blade, but having a bigger variety of weapons would make this game simply amazing, killing a guard and stealing his bow or sword is just amazing, buying new weapons and tools from merchants and much more.

Hide-out

The hide-out/mission starting thingy-ma-bob was pretty cool with it's entrance location and look but it didn't exactly do much, maybe being able to store weapons, ammo and tools in there would be help and just a place to practise your skills.

Clothing

Your clothing is one of the best things I love about this game but changing it could be more realistic, I mean; walking around with the same uniform on can be a little weird. If the Night/Day thing does kick-in I think that having black/red uniform would be more sufficient.

NPC's

I'm aware of the work that has gone into the AI and it's outcome is good, but it could be great! Maybe the AI could do more, all they do is walk around, maybe be they should have lives like the game Oblivion, need to eat, sleep, socialise, enter houses, getting into a little trouble on accident?

Indoors

The cities on Assassin's Creed are giant, beautiful, accurate and brought to life by the interaction, but what if indoors was possible? Like walking into to a church or castle?

For more visit here. (http://www.videogamer.com/features/article/15-11-2007-190.html)

Cilist72
11-18-2007, 07:51 PM
I agree with some of your ideas. Stealth is key in a game where you assassinate people. Especially when in the beginning of the game it says stay hidden until after the kill.
The different weapons would be fun but in this game how would you do that? All of a sudden after I gain a rank all the merchants in the three cities all of a sudden start selling swords?
Anyway, personally I don't think this game was that good. Did not live up to the standards Jade Raymond set. In the next games, the extremely repetitive game play needs to stop. Climb tall buildings, then Interrogate, Eavesdrop, Pickpocket, or talk to the informant. For developers: next game don't make the same animation after you pickpocket someone. Make it so they realize you took something and then chase you or something. Make it so when you eavesdrop you don't just sit there. Make it so you have to walk with the two people without them noticing. Dodging guard-blockaded entrances and what not.
Also, why not do group assassinations where you have to time your kill with chain of other assassinations? Just change it up a bit. I liked the mission where you kill the book-burner.
For ps3 users, don't you think they realized it was glitching all the time. Come on ubisoft. This game was suppose to be ready a year ago. You ruined the chance of having a great ps3 exclusive so you could dumb down the game. Gamers want a next gen game. Climbing, though amazing and well appreciated is what the entire game is based on.
Also, last comment I promise. The fighting is cool. I enjoy the counter animations. But a little more freedom with kicks? headbutts with the triangle button? Or broken arms in fistfights.not just one animation punching. Please Jade Raymond, make the game that you promised to us gamers when it first was suppose to come out. Make up for it in the next must buy game, Assassin's Creed Two.

Psiclone01
11-18-2007, 09:47 PM
Opticaly,

First of all, I agree with everything that you have suggested. My friend and I have been discussing these points and have come up with a few extras.

Time

Time is a great idea. Just having a day&night system alone would create countless more mission ideas.

Stealth

This is another good one that I never understood. For example, pickpocketing is much too easy, as well as assassinating and interrogating. If it was possible to make it so you actually had to use the crowd to blend in and pickpocket someone, for example, would be good.

Difficulty

Another important one. Nothing more needs to be said. Except for, perhaps, a much more balanced health system for Altair. It seems ridiculous that you can get so much health and take all these hits while you kill off guards in 1-3 hits. I propose a system where Altair can only take 4-5 hits before dying. Perhaps lowering it slightly with a higher difficulty as well as more intelligent guard AI.

Random Events

I believe random events would tie into the day&night cycle. For example, perhaps there will be a shop that is open during the day, but closed at night, or a peddler that walks around at night time with a cart behind him. Which brings me to the next item.

Shopping

Having weapons, armor and even street clothes to buy would greatly increase the diversity of the game. Also, being able to sell random items you get off pickpocketing or killing guards or, if you're evil enough, citizens, would be good too. To me, the armor shouldn't really have 'stats' per se, just have a modifier on how hard a weapon will hurt you in <location>. Heavier armor would offer more protection while lowering speed while running and swinging, and vice versa for lighter armor.

Hide-out

The hideout place is fine the way it is, I think. There wouldn't be a point to storing anything in the hideout because you'd have your sword, short blade and knives/crossbow and armor. Then to get more knives you'd just pickpocket the thugs or buy them at the store.

Clothing

Already touched on in shopping.

NPC's

I agree with you. A major part of this is the 'save citizen' mission. It is very weird how the guards just keep harassing the citizen and never do anything else but push him/her back and forth and say threatening words, which, by the way, need way more variety. All the citizens do.

Also, where are all the children? The dogs that we hear while climbing viewpoints? It seems strange that everyone is just grown up, and old at that. I suggest having children in the game, even women with babies, even if they are 'invincible' so as to keep it somewhat moral. Just being able to see them would greatly increase the atmosphere of the cities.

Yes, the NPC's should be able to get into trouble other than simply 'save citizen'. Perhaps a young child who has stolen a piece of bread runs by you with guards chasing him. If you assist the guards, they thank you and it raises your faction level..

NPC's should be parts of different factions, or groups. There should be such a system so that, if you save a citizen for example, your rating with citizens go up, and they become more and more likely to help you with information or stopping a guard from attacking/chasing you, bypassing the vigilantes altogether. The factions would be broken up into the different sections (poor, rich, middle) of the city, as well as further differently for each city.

The factions would come in handy for information gathering for your assassination target, while at the same time not greatly hindering your ability to gather information, just offering bonuses and achievements.

Indoors

Indoors would be good. Nothing more to say..

Swimming

An assassin can't swim? Is it because he's missing a finger? His buoyancy is compromised because of it? He's unable to keep afloat? Come on.. water is not a killer.

Eagle Vision + Viewpoints
Warning: Spoiler Alert!!!

Eagle vision.. possibly even more useless than gentle push. It was a nice idea to include eagle vision for the beginning of the game, so you can see who guards are and who your assassination targets might be at the beginning of the game. But once you remember what guards and safe benches look like, it becomes useless until the end of the game. Eagle vision needs a major change, as well as viewpoints. Instead of viewpoints just updating your map, you climb a 'viewpoint' (which can be any building, not just places with the eagles) and use eagle vision to find special markings below that only you, or a trained assassin, can see. These markings can range from an Assassin bureau (which there needs to be more than one of in a city) to informant hideouts where you can gather information by not collecting flags within 3 minutes.

I do love this game, though, don't get me wrong. But there are just so many things that could have been done to make this truly an epic game.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 06:14 AM
Originally posted by Cilist72:
All of a sudden after I gain a rank all the merchants in the three cities all of a sudden start selling swords?

Well, ok I've thought of an idea about this too, you know your not allowed to enter parts of the city because of view point? Maybe putting the merchants in different parts of the city which your can't get too, so when you start the game you'll only have a merchant that sells low priced/bad swords, then the next part of the city will unlock slightly better, and the next etc.

Thanks for the ideas guys :P

Drenon88
11-19-2007, 07:19 AM
A day and night cycle is a must have for AC2. It makes sense for assassin's to use the cover of night to kill.

I would not want to see stealth added though, that would cheapen the experience. Going completely invisible (stealth) would be somewhat magical and I don't think fits into this game well. Night time and taking cover in shadows would negate the need for stealth.

Swimming is a must and I can't believe that I have to drown when I fall into water. Silly.

I would like to see bows added in AC2. Watching the arrow pierce a guard's neck on the slow-mo kill-cam would be amazing!

ScytheOfGrim
11-19-2007, 07:26 AM
No it would not make sense for there to be a day/night cycle. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Gosh where are the older forumers?

The assassins, or hashashiyeen, were known for their public assassinations.

They made sure to let people know that they were the ones to do the kill.

At night at the time of the crusades there would be no man outside of his house, save the guards.

Therefore the assassination will not be public and therefore nobody will know who did it.

Now this should be the same even in the next game. Because they are still assassins.

Unless of course the game makes it to modern times, then the devs can play with it as they wish.

Bows were also against the assassins beliefs. They found it to be dishonourable to kill using a bow. The same went for poison (not that it was mentioned... yet).

Drenon88
11-19-2007, 07:45 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
No it would not make sense for there to be a day/night cycle. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Gosh where are the older forumers?

The assassins, or hashashiyeen, were known for their public assassinations.

They made sure to let people know that they were the ones to do the kill.

At night at the time of the crusades there would be no man outside of his house, save the guards.

Therefore the assassination will not be public and therefore nobody will know who did it.

Now this should be the same even in the next game. Because they are still assassins.

"Where are the older forumers?" What an ignorant assumption! Just because some of us don't retain the same knowledge you have about this time period doesn't make us dumb kids!

All the points you made about the "public" assassinations are perfectly valid! However, this is a game, not a historically accurate portrayal of The Crusades. A day/night cycle would be a cool game effect if nothing else.

Bobzer77
11-19-2007, 07:50 AM
Originally posted by Drenon88:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
No it would not make sense for there to be a day/night cycle. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Gosh where are the older forumers?

The assassins, or hashashiyeen, were known for their public assassinations.

They made sure to let people know that they were the ones to do the kill.

At night at the time of the crusades there would be no man outside of his house, save the guards.

Therefore the assassination will not be public and therefore nobody will know who did it.

Now this should be the same even in the next game. Because they are still assassins.

"Where are the older forumers?" What an ignorant assumption! Just because some of us don't retain the same knowledge you have about this time period doesn't make us dumb kids!

All the points you made about the "public" assassinations are perfectly valid! However, this is a game, not a historically accurate portrayal of The Crusades. A day/night cycle would be a cool game effect if nothing else. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Why the sudden outburst at sythe about the older forumers, and how could you have retained information back then seeing as you only registered today?

ThePheonix1030
11-19-2007, 07:52 AM
Night/day cycle wouldn't work, as Scythe explained. As for 'Indoors' I would like to see that. And the reason why he can't swim is because an incident happened to him in childhood and caused him to become waterphobic. The clothing was something I was hoping for http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif



Originally posted by Drenon88:
"Where are the older forumers?" What an ignorant assumption! Just because some of us don't retain the same knowledge you have about this time period doesn't make us dumb kids!
Um, he never said that you were dumb http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 08:23 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
No it would not make sense for there to be a day/night cycle. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Gosh where are the older forumers?

The assassins, or hashashiyeen, were known for their public assassinations.

They made sure to let people know that they were the ones to do the kill.

At night at the time of the crusades there would be no man outside of his house, save the guards.

Therefore the assassination will not be public and therefore nobody will know who did it.

Now this should be the same even in the next game. Because they are still assassins.

Unless of course the game makes it to modern times, then the devs can play with it as they wish.

Bows were also against the assassins beliefs. They found it to be dishonourable to kill using a bow. The same went for poison (not that it was mentioned... yet).

Even though poison was a very popular weapon used by Assassin's, they have used mushrooms and other plants to kill there victims in the past, oh and people would be out at night, so your saying that nobody stepped a foot outside of there door, not for pubs, partys and get-togethers, don't try to act smart, and a night & day cycle does make sense, if it didn't you might need to see a doctor.
This is a game, not the real thing, and AC 2 will be more modern, and what do you mean Assassin's don't use poison, if this game was mordern what would this mean: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2006/12/17/assassins-used-10-millio_n_36583.html

HMFC_1874
11-19-2007, 08:35 AM
I agree that the outburst about being of the younger generation was out of order as i feel there is alot of good points being addressed here.

I also think that Ubisoft haven't delivered a Next Gen experience game, just look at what Halflife 2 introduced to the world when it was realsed years ago!

I agree with most of the points that have arrisen on this thread.

HMFC_1874
11-19-2007, 08:40 AM
Also i wanted to say with what i've seen so far from the cutscenes with the doc, it looks like it's going to progress into the future and this would be quite cool if you got to play at different stages of time up untill the present day or even future? who knows but due to may expentations of the game i'd only give this a 7.5/10

Kariko762
11-19-2007, 08:48 AM
Just picking on a few topics here...

Scythe Good point on the ol'e day and night. it would make whole story line a little wrong

Why are people trying to turn this game into some kinda RPG with Weapons shops cloths and a hideout where u can obviously store stuff.. omg ...

Indoors? i love this game becuase of its Fluidity. no loading times.. u wanna have a place city that has streets alleys and buildings u can climb and roofs to walk.... have no loading spots AND then ADD indoors to each building? YOU MAD? - THAT aside.... it would rock.

would u are looking for really guys is what i have mentioned in other posts... a game base on a book Called "Magician" u play a Charactor called Jimmy The Hand (a thief) u can run around indoors outdoors day night rpg style steal kill everything u want. on AC's foundations would be great.


Stop trying to change this game too much i love it the way it is

ScytheOfGrim
11-19-2007, 08:51 AM
Ugh... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif
I hate misunderstandings...

What I meant with the older forumer statement was that there used to be forumers here that would have literally eaten up threads like these (moqqy, noobfun, anybody?).

The assassins did not use poison. And I am only talking about the hashashiyeen. Not any other group of assassins. They found it to be dishonourable.

How would a night and day cycle make sense?

Do you know how people used ot live in the crusades.
At night only murderers and thiefs and guards were about.
The crusades was a very dangerous time, and going out at night was not advisable.

Plus there were no crowds as there were during the daytime. therefore one of the biggest beliefs of the hashashiyeen would have been ignored; public assasinations.

Sure this is a game, and I know that.

So please tell me how you would navigate the city at night?

Oh, yes, using the light of the moon is very enteretaining when you are trying to do parkour...


"Where are the older forumers?" What an ignorant assumption! Just because some of us don't retain the same knowledge you have about this time period doesn't make us dumb kids!


Of the two of us, it was you whom assumed. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 08:52 AM
Originally posted by Kariko2006:
Indoors? i love this game becuase of its Fluidity. no loading times.. u wanna have a place city that has streets alleys and buildings u can climb and roofs to walk.... have no loading spots AND then ADD indoors to each building? YOU MAD? - THAT aside.... it would rock.

Stop trying to change this game too much i love it the way it is

Indoors

The cities on Assassin's Creed are giant, beautiful, accurate and brought to life by the interaction, but what if indoors was possible? Like walking into to a church or castle?

When did I say I wanted every building to have an inside.
Second, what do you mean? Try to change it? I'm not the anything to do with the creation of AC2 so obviously this thread will make no difference to the games design, so don't try and point the finger at people who are thinking of ideas.

EDIT: Yeh, it would rock

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 08:53 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
Ugh... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif
I hate misunderstandings...

What I meant with the older forumer statement was that there used to be forumers here that would have literally eaten up threads like these (moqqy, noobfun, anybody?).

The assassins did not use poison. And I am only talking about the hashashiyeen. Not any other group of assassins. They found it to be dishonourable.

How would a night and day cycle make sense?

Do you know how people used ot live in the crusades.
At night only murderers and thiefs and guards were about.
The crusades was a very dangerous time, and going out at night was not advisable.

Plus there were no crowds as there were during the daytime. therefore one of the biggest beliefs of the hashashiyeen would have been ignored; public assasinations.

Sure this is a game, and I know that.

So please tell me how you would navigate the city at night?

Oh, yes, using the light of the moon is very enteretaining when you are trying to do parkour...

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> "Where are the older forumers?" What an ignorant assumption! Just because some of us don't retain the same knowledge you have about this time period doesn't make us dumb kids!


Of the two of us, it was you whom assumed. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What are you taking about?
"Do you know how people used ot live in the crusades."

Assassin's Creed 2 will not be in the crusades you dumb idiot

ScytheOfGrim
11-19-2007, 08:53 AM
He never meant it as an attack.

he was merely posting his opinion about your opinion about what the next game should have. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

EDIT:

I find it so interesting that your original post talked about buying weapons such as bows from merchants.

Then you call me stupid for continuiing upon your assumption that the next AC will be in some sort of medieval environment. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 08:54 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
He never meant it as an attack.

he was merely posting his opinion about your opinion about what the next game should have. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

When did I say it was an attack?

EDIT

"have no loading spots AND then ADD indoors to each building? YOU MAD?"

What is he talking about? When did I ever say I wanted indoors in each building and no loading spots, I said a few open building like a castle or a church, if oblivion and Asssassin's Creed can do what they have done with the map I think that they can make a litte extra with one building having indoors

ScytheOfGrim
11-19-2007, 08:58 AM
When did I say that you said tht it was an attack? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

By the tone in which you replied you seemed to be offended (for lack of a better word) by that post.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 08:59 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
He never meant it as an attack.

he was merely posting his opinion about your opinion about what the next game should have. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

EDIT:

I find it so interesting that your original post talked about buying weapons such as bows from merchants.

Then you call me stupid for continuiing upon your assumption that the next AC will be in some sort of medieval environment. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Merchants is still a word used in the present day, and you've never saw a bow being used today?

Shopping

We all know the weapons were amazing on Assassin's Creed, a lovely sword with great combos, a small but effective short sword, throwing daggers, fists and your hidden blade, but having a bigger variety of weapons would make this game simply amazing, killing a guard and stealing his bow or sword is just amazing, buying new weapons and tools from merchants and much more.

I said killing a guard and stealing his bow or sword is just amazing, I didn't say anything about what weapon you could buy.


I find it so interesting that your original post talked about buying weapons such as bows from merchants.

I didn't say anything about buying bows from merchants or buying them at all at that.

ScytheOfGrim
11-19-2007, 09:00 AM
Why the hell would you want to use a bow in a modern day AC if you could use a gun?

Where is the logic in that?

So you call your local grocer a merchant? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Kariko762
11-19-2007, 09:02 AM
Sorry Opticaly if u think i was disagreeing with you about the indoors bit but as i said "That aside - It would ROCK" im totally for it but as the same time i was taking it to the extreme with the "ALL buildings"

This AC as it stands i love it because you CAN go everywhere "within reason u can just NEO it up and fly around the place" If you make half, no even a quater of the buildings accessable then i will feel that i cannot get everywhere just... a few places.

And i wasn't "Pointing the finger" at you, i applogise, i was making a broader statment at people in general, i have been reading SOO many post about what AC SHOULD have been like, why can't people be happy with what they get, very few posts on here about OMG this games awesome. its either CRASH this LAG that How i get past This, Ending WTF? and what should have been.

If i made this game........ and then read the forum i wouldn't have a feeling of Gratitude from so called "Fans of the game"

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 09:04 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
Why the hell would you want to use a bow in a modern day AC if you could use a gun?

Where is the logic in that?

So you call your local grocer a merchant? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

No, I said that merchant is a word still used today, and why the hell would I buy a gun from a "local grocer" and I didn't say you could use a bow to kill someone, I said it would be awesome to steal a bow or sword from a guard, which obviously means this is that where I'm talking about AC (1)

Kariko762
11-19-2007, 09:05 AM
I agree, being able to steal Guards weapons would be cool.

Got 6 people surrounding you, You kill one pick up his sword in your off hand and start to duel weld :P would be cool!

P.S i see what your both getting at too, Merchant is still a word in the english language but at the same time its very rarly used. I havn't used the word in YEARS without refering to Oblivion or some game.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 09:07 AM
Originally posted by Kariko2006:
Sorry Opticaly if u think i was disagreeing with you about the indoors bit but as i said "That aside - It would ROCK" im totally for it but as the same time i was taking it to the extreme with the "ALL buildings"

This AC as it stands i love it because you CAN go everywhere "within reason u can just NEO it up and fly around the place" If you make half, no even a quater of the buildings accessable then i will feel that i cannot get everywhere just... a few places.

And i wasn't "Pointing the finger" at you, i applogise, i was making a broader statment at people in general, i have been reading SOO many post about what AC SHOULD have been like, why can't people be happy with what they get, very few posts on here about OMG this games awesome. its either CRASH this LAG that How i get past This, Ending WTF? and what should have been.

If i made this game........ and then read the forum i wouldn't have a feeling of Gratitude from so called "Fans of the game"

Atleast you can say that instead of ScytheOfGrim starting arguments about Assassin's never using poison even though there has been documents/news that has had people being assassinated by poison.

ScytheOfGrim
11-19-2007, 09:08 AM
I saw your edit after posting that, so certain things may need adjusting. Sorry.

So you use the word merchant in your house?

You say, "Hey mom! Can I have some money so that I can go to the local merchant's?"...?
I never said that you would buy a gun from your grocer... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

And now I retract the statement about buying the bow.

But using it in AC 1 is still a big "no no".
It is against the hashashiyeen's beliefs.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 09:09 AM
Originally posted by Kariko2006:
I agree, being able to steal Guards weapons would be cool.

Got 6 people surrounding you, You kill one pick up his sword in your off hand and start to duel weld :P would be cool!

P.S i see what your both getting at too, Merchant is still a word in the english language but at the same time its very rarly used. I havn't used the word in YEARS without refering to Oblivion or some game.

The duel thing sounds good; like picking up another sword so you have more chance of kicking *** :P (or a gun so that other guy doesn't moan at me about AC1 or AC2)

Kariko762
11-19-2007, 09:10 AM
This is also true,

BUT why Scyth is getting at is that Altair is a purticular type of assassin a "hashashiyeen" assassin from the 11th Century, now back then the hashashiyeen didn't believe in killin a foe with poision there wasn't honor in it and also they prefer to do all their killing publicly to send a message to others!

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 09:12 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
I saw your edit after posting that, so certain things may need adjusting. Sorry.

So you use the word merchant in your house?

You say, "Hey mom! Can I have some money so that I can go to the local merchant's?"...?
I never said that you would buy a gun from your grocer... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

And now I retract the statement about buying the bow.

But using it in AC 1 is still a big "no no".
It is against the hashashiyeen's beliefs.

Here we go again, trying to lie, when did I say "Hey mom! Can I have some money so that I can go to the local merchant's?"
Never. So stop lying, and trying to act like you know what your talking about.

Oh and when you said I never said that you would buy a gun from your grocer...I never said that you would buy a gun from your grocer...

You know that merchants sell a variety of items from swords to clothes, meaning my local grocer sells swords? No.

And if a merchant was in the modern life it would be a black-market merchant selling guns or tools for breaking an entering or something similar to that

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 09:18 AM
Originally posted by Kariko2006:
This is also true,

BUT why Scyth is getting at is that Altair is a purticular type of assassin a "hashashiyeen" assassin from the 11th Century, now back then the hashashiyeen didn't believe in killin a foe with poision there wasn't honor in it and also they prefer to do all their killing publicly to send a message to others!

I'm talking about Assassin's Creed 2, nobody really knows what date it's going to be but obviously it's more modern than 1191 meaning Assassin's have changed there ways, this has been known by modern news e.g. JFK being shot from long distance, might not be in a clan; but still.

Kariko762
11-19-2007, 09:19 AM
Here we go again, trying to lie, when did I say "Hey mom! Can I have some money so that I can go to the local merchant's?"
Never. So stop lying, and trying to act like you know what your talking about.

Ermm i would re-read what Scyth said..


So you use the word merchant in your house?

You say, "Hey mom! Can I have some money so that I can go to the local merchant's?"...?

Look at the punctuation..there is a "?" in there , he was making a point that people rarly use the word merchant in normal life these days...

The problem Optically if your mis reading his posts

you said you can buy stuff from a Merchant
he said so you call your local grocer a merchant
you said No, I said that merchant is a word still used today, and why the hell would I buy a gun from a "local grocer"

ALL SCYTH was point out was that MERCHANT IS NOT COMMONLY USED

before you get all red in the face and frantic read his posts properly

ScytheOfGrim
11-19-2007, 09:20 AM
I never really had any problems with some of your ideas.
I, in fact, like some of them.
Indoors sounds amazing, as long as loading times are taken care of, and faster climbing I would most sincerely agree upon.

But there are things that I posted that you may have somewhat misunderstood.

The hashashiyeens never used poison or bows. And Altair is one of them. therefore he can not use them as you wished (when you said it would be cool if you could pick up bows and the such).

Sure, other assassins may have used poison, but hashashiyeen? Never.

I had a slight typo there, I meant "Do you say". http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
My fault.

I do know what merchants sell, thank you.
And yes, they would exist in the black market nowadays, but they wouldn't be called "merchants".
They would be called "smugglers". or maybe even "salesmen".

Where did I say that your local grocer sells swords?!

Merchants in that time used to sell goods. Everyday goods.
The same things that a grocer today would sell.
Besides the goods you could find weapons. That is true. EDIT: for merchants only, I don't know about your grocer, but mine does not sell weapons. ^_^

But when I said that you called your grocer a merchant, it was to show you that a merchant has long gone. Sure you could use the word, but it wouldn't be as accurate as saying salesman, now would it?

HMFC_1874
11-19-2007, 09:36 AM
I see what you are meaning now ScytheOfGrim.
total other subject now!

I think it would be better if you could pick up weapons if that's by the use of pickpocketing,stealing from stalls etc or after you've killed someone.

Bows are in the game so we should have the right to use them.

Real issue is the difficulty its too damb EASY!!

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 09:41 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
I never really had any problems with some of your ideas.
I, in fact, like some of them.
Indoors sounds amazing, as long as loading times are taken care of, and faster climbing I would most sincerely agree upon.

But there are things that I posted that you may have somewhat misunderstood.

The hashashiyeens never used poison or bows. And Altair is one of them. therefore he can not use them as you wished (when you said it would be cool if you could pick up bows and the such).

Sure, other assassins may have used poison, but hashashiyeen? Never.

I had a slight typo there, I meant "Do you say". http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
My fault.

I do know what merchants sell, thank you.
And yes, they would exist in the black market nowadays, but they wouldn't be called "merchants".
They would be called "smugglers". or maybe even "salesmen".

Where did I say that your local grocer sells swords?!

Merchants in that time used to sell goods. Everyday goods.
The same things that a grocer today would sell.
Besides the goods you could find weapons. That is true. EDIT: for merchants only, I don't know about your grocer, but mine does not sell weapons. ^_^

But when I said that you called your grocer a merchant, it was to show you that a merchant has long gone. Sure you could use the word, but it wouldn't be as accurate as saying salesman, now would it?

I never said that you said they sell swords.

Actualy merchants in that time did sell goods, such as swords etc, coming from blacksmiths to the merchant to gain profit.

If you don't know what merchants sell then you must know nothing about history, I mean playing a simple game based in 1191 like AC shows what some sell, swords, fish, spices, carpets etc, go to india or egypt now and they still sell things like that, clothes, carpets, rugs, spices, fishes, prawns and much much more.

And this is a game it doesn't need to be historicaly acurate, I mean it does make it better but deep down inside most people don't give a damn about the games background, like it's creators or if it was all true, you just want to have some fun, the Assassin's did exist but nobody really knows exactly what they used or did, things can lie, anyone can put what ever they want on a cover or the insides of a book, a lie, an in-acurate fact etc, things can be missed and stuff like that.
The game doesn't need to be acurate, and at the start of AC he kills an innocent, whats to say using a bow is the same, who cares about rules in a game.

Just to make this clear, stop saying that the assassin's didn't use bows, maybe they didn't but one of the first weapons in assassin's creed was a crossbow, meaning that it would of been in game but it take a long time to reload.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 09:47 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
Why the hell would you want to use a bow in a modern day AC if you could use a gun?

Where is the logic in that?

So you call your local grocer a merchant? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Well I didn't say the you should use a bow instead of a gun, and if I had to choose between a bow and a gun I'd probaly choose bow, guns are illegal where I live, a bow isn't, you can easily create a bow, not a gun, getting ammo for a bow is easy not the same with a gun, bows are light and gun are heavy, guns are loud, bows are quite, bows are easy to repair, guns aren't, guns need lots of treatment after every shot, bows don't.

hunterd1970
11-19-2007, 09:49 AM
As long as they don't go 'POP: Warrior Within' with it, I'm all good.

I'm one of those 'POP: Sand of Time' purists. This game has a lot of the fun I had in 'Sand Of Time'.

They better not ruin the sequel just to please the mass.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 09:52 AM
Originally posted by hunterd1970:
As long as they don't go 'POP: Warrior Within' with it, I'm all good.

I'm one of those 'POP: Sand of Time' purists. This game has a lot of the fun I had in 'Sand Of Time'.

They better not ruin the sequel just to please the mass.

Yeah, Sands of Time wasn't all that realistic, the same with Assassin's Creed and the ball thingy-ma-bob, Warrior within just went over the top

AirRon_2K7
11-19-2007, 10:02 AM
You seem to like RPGs, but this game simply isn't one... adding shopping is a bit ... unnecesary in my opinion.

Hide-out

Again, RPG like...

Clothing

Again... RPG, and public assassination.

NPC's

Agreed, but would you really want the constant loading of going into buildings slow down the action?

Indoors

Agreed, but would you really want the constant loading of going into buildings slow down the action?

For more visit here. (http://www.videogamer.com/features/article/15-11-2007-190.html)[/QUOTE]

ScytheOfGrim
11-19-2007, 10:25 AM
What aided your arrival to the conclusion that I knew not what merchants sold? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

I did not want to get into too much detail about what they sold specificly, so I merely generalized.

You, on the other hand, were eager to show that you knew what a merchant was, kudos to you on that.

Who said that this game has to be historically accurate?

There are specific things which the devs cannot make up. Things that people would complain about because they weren't "realistic".

I don't care about the bows and the guns and what not, as long as it staystrue to the Assassin's experience.

Just because they put in a crossbow into a CG trailer does not make them correct.

Part of the reason it was taken out of the final build was because in those times crossbows took too long to reload. and I am also willing to bet that they didn't like it because assassins did not use them.

Does that not show that they cared somewhat for realism?

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 10:57 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
What aided your arrival to the conclusion that I knew not what merchants sold? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

I did not want to get into too much detail about what they sold specificly, so I merely generalized.

You, on the other hand, were eager to show that you knew what a merchant was, kudos to you on that.

Who said that this game has to be historically accurate?

There are specific things which the devs cannot make up. Things that people would complain about because they weren't "realistic".

I don't care about the bows and the guns and what not, as long as it staystrue to the Assassin's experience.

Just because they put in a crossbow into a CG trailer does not make them correct.

Part of the reason it was taken out of the final build was because in those times crossbows took too long to reload. and I am also willing to bet that they didn't like it because assassins did not use them.

Does that not show that they cared somewhat for realism?

What aided your arrival to the conclusion that I knew not what merchants sold?

You've played AC, merchants sell items on there that were sold in that year.

Just because they put in a crossbow into a CG trailer does not make them correct.

I didn't say they were correct.

Part of the reason it was taken out of the final build was because in those times crossbows took too long to reload. and I am also willing to bet that they didn't like it because assassins did not use them.

Not really, it's a game, I've said this before.
Who gives a s**t about the history or the bow & crossbow, please get a life and stop speaking to me, and stop starting arguements.

"Who said that this game has to be historically accurate?"

Well you, you dumb idiot.
You've been moaning for the past hours about bows not being in the game because of the Assassins belief; now your saying that.
Your just contradicting yourself all the time.

AirRon_2K7
11-19-2007, 11:06 AM
Shut up Opticaly, all your attempts to be clever have failed. Turn off your computer and stop insulting people that are bringing up genuine facts. Go play Oblvion, or go to a warddrobe so you can change your clothes... yippy.

EDIt Oh god, I just read the rest of your topic, god you're dumb.

You obviously don't know anything about the Assassin's in this game (hasashin rofl I can't spell...), you lack the ability to read, you also lack the ability to make decent arguments. Plus you seem to be gifted with knowing exactly what AC 2 is going to be like. Actually AC 1 wasn't set in the crusade you *******, and AC 2 (if you've read the about the ending topic) is quite likely to be set in even earlier periods, in feudal japan. So don't try getting all smart *** without doing your research.

Apart from that, it seems that this topic has turned into you being over sensitive, over defensive and somewhere along the line you decided that reading every other paragraph was enough to stage a debate. 'bout time this got locked in my opinion.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 11:13 AM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Shut up Opticaly, all your attempts to be clever have failed. Turn off your computer and stop insulting people that are bringing up genuine facts. Go play Oblvion, or go to a warddrobe so you can change your clothes... yippy.

What genuine facts, I'm just trying to share ideas with people and people start trying to act smart, people like you, you seriously need to get laid you little f*cker, seriously go get a life you over weight ******, you also need some friends or just a girlfriend, get a life you obese tw*t and what kind of insult is that "Go play oblivion", with pleasure.

"Go change your clothes" Wow, that must have been the most pathetic insult I've ever head, go chew on your mothers *ss or something

AirRon_2K7
11-19-2007, 11:16 AM
Aww don't cry Opticaly, let's look at your short fallings there:

You don't know whether I've been laid or not. I do have a girl friend, you don't know how old I am (and if you do, and are still calling me a little fuc*er, then you are at least 26 + ... sad little boy)

You don't know how much I weigh, I'm not overweight.

I have friends

I'm not obese

Me being a tw@t is your opinion

Go change your clothes was a reference to your obvious love of all RPG games... if you lacked the knowledge to read into that...

Is it that time of the month? Or do you usually explode whenever you're wrong?

EDIT: I'm assuming you're calling me sad as a reference to the amount of posts I've got (annoying when people assume isn't it) Allow me to point out that you've over 100 posts in just over 10 days...

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 11:26 AM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Aww don't cry Opticaly, let's look at your short fallings there:

You don't know whether I've been laid or not. I do have a girl friend, you don't know how old I am (and if you do, and are still calling me a little fuc*er, then you are at least 26 + ... sad little boy)

You don't know how much I weigh, I'm not overweight.

I have friends

I'm not obese

Me being a tw@t is your opinion

Go change your clothes was a reference to your obvious love of all RPG games... if you lacked the knowledge to read into that...

Is it that time of the month? Or do you usually explode whenever you're wrong?

EDIT: I'm assuming you're calling me sad as a reference to the amount of posts I've got (annoying when people assume isn't it) Allow me to point out that you've over 100 posts in just over 10 days...

Actualy, I didn't say anything about your posts but now I think of it, yeh you do need to get laid, god! Get out more, and yes I have over 100 posts, thats it, thats all you have?
Me saying "little f*cker" doesn't mean your young, dumb ***, it means your a tiny piece of sh*t, your pathetic, your nothing, and you seriously need to get a life, and I see you've joined the bunch of *** holes that lie about themself to act cool online, oh and I don't see how I like RPG's just because AC could allow you to change clothes at one point, I don't game that often because of college, yes, I'm in college, and smart enough to laugh at your pathetic insults that have no harm what so ever
and when did I say anything about your age, learn how to read. Whats, that you've called me dumb?!?! OH NO

AirRon_2K7
11-19-2007, 11:35 AM
You poor soul, get back to your studies. If you re-read any of your posts you'll see how defensive and childish you come off... again, turn off your computer. Bloody hell, you go to college, that must make you smarter than the rest of us... spart from those that have lives.

Oh, and for someone at college, surely you'd know by now that it's "you're" not "your"... yes I'm calling you dumb.

Excuse me about the pathetic insults but:


it means your a tiny piece of sh*t, your pathetic, your nothing, and you seriously need to get a life, and I see you've joined the bunch of *** holes that lie about themself to act cool online

Ermm, yeah... real pathetic I am.

I love your (yes it is "your" this time - English 101) ability to read minds and personalities. You think I'm lying? Any proof to back this up? 'Cos without it, all you've got is speculation. And last time I checked, it was pretty sad to speculate at someone's offline life. Especially trying to argue like you are.

Maybe you're (yes it is "you're" this time - English 101) very obese, but it doesn't mean other people are too.

Cue classic "Actually, I'm a top athlete" argument.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 11:44 AM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
You poor soul, get back to your studies. If you re-read any of your posts you'll see how defensive and childish you come off... again, turn off your computer. Bloody hell, you go to college, that must make you smarter than the rest of us... spart from those that have lives.

Oh, and for someone at college, surely you'd know by now that it's "you're" not "your"... yes I'm calling you dumb.

Excuse me about the pathetic insults but:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> it means your a tiny piece of sh*t, your pathetic, your nothing, and you seriously need to get a life, and I see you've joined the bunch of *** holes that lie about themself to act cool online

Ermm, yeah... real pathetic I am.

I love your (yes it is "your" this time - English 101) ability to read minds and personalities. You think I'm lying? Any proof to back this up? 'Cos without it, all you've got is speculation. And last time I checked, it was pretty sad to speculate at someone's offline life. Especially trying to argue like you are.

Maybe you're (yes it is "you're" this time - English 101) very obese, but it doesn't mean other people are too.

Cue classic "Actually, I'm a top athlete" argument. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

All that typing and you have one thing, I'm doing about 5 things at the moment, speaking to someone in real, look for a few new films I can watch and speaking to people on gaim, as you can see I'm doing a few things at once; so typing on here has to be quick, why the hell would I care how I type, the people who care what others grammar looks like have no life at all, I mean come on? What kind of insult is that, hahah you spelt your not you're omfg dumb ****ing idiot go back to college, what the hell is that? You actualy care about how people type, well mate, you seriously need a friend, go out, get a social life, if you care so much about me saying your not you're, sue me.

AirRon_2K7
11-19-2007, 11:55 AM
Carry on talking to your real friend, since it's obvious that you think I'm trying to insult you. We're not all half wits here, I'm just trying to show you that you're actually rather pathetic, and this post... like all your others, is too defensive to be called creditable.

Get over yourself with the whole 'get a friend' aspect. You still think that you have the power to know anything about me... well let me say this:

You are a 30 year old virgin, living at home with mum, no friends and no qualifications.

That's about as true as anything else that you've said about me. Neither of us know what the other is like. Do you understand that. If you do, post "Yes" and get on with your life. if you don't: then don't post in reply to this, and get on with your life which is apparently so much more interesting that ours.

It's like you're trying to break a record for having the most amount of pointless arguments with people that aren't even trying to have arguments - ever.

pecky
11-19-2007, 11:58 AM
both of u grow up, do people really want to read your arguments in here, i personally dont

AirRon_2K7
11-19-2007, 11:59 AM
Pfft, I'm trying to drop it, but mr argumentitive can't seem too.

But really, you registered just to say that xD Welcome to the forums in any case. It's just lots of this and repetitive topics nowadays.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 12:15 PM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Carry on talking to your real friend, since it's obvious that you think I'm trying to insult you. We're not all half wits here, I'm just trying to show you that you're actually rather pathetic, and this post... like all your others, is too defensive to be called creditable.

Get over yourself with the whole 'get a friend' aspect. You still think that you have the power to know anything about me... well let me say this:

You are a 30 year old virgin, living at home with mum, no friends and no qualifications.

That's about as true as anything else that you've said about me. Neither of us know what the other is like. Do you understand that. If you do, post "Yes" and get on with your life. if you don't: then don't post in reply to this, and get on with your life which is apparently so much more interesting that ours.

It's like you're trying to break a record for having the most amount of pointless arguments with people that aren't even trying to have arguments - ever.

Yes, you are trying to insult me, then you pretend that you are not?

I'm 16, not 30.

I'm not a virgin, and don't say something stupid like "omg you had sex at 16"

I do live with my parents, guess why? :l

Yes, I do have friends, online's and social friends.

I've got a B in english and A in maths, c in chemistry, a in bioligy and b in physics, 6 passes in IT, going for 3 a levels in college, the course is an IT based course; level 3, got a C in PE & RE, I didn't take geography or history I went to something else which gives you a couple diplomas.

That's enough for me.

erikaudet
11-19-2007, 12:30 PM
Haven't had the chance to read everybody elses ideas so I might be repeating something already stated...but I would very much like to see an Online Co-op ONLY...where several missions with alot more complexity need be played by 2-4 Assassins cooperating online in a single mission. Somewhat similar to SOCOM: Combined Assault for those familiar.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 12:58 PM
Oh yeh, I forgot about Co-op, god I really want that, it would be amazing

HMFC_1874
11-19-2007, 01:32 PM
The handbags at dawn have finnaly dropped! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Co-op would be decent.

It should be harder to climb instead of grabbinmg everything there is on the way up and sepcially when jumping from and grabbing while airbourne.

When falling from the top of buildings into the barrels of straw IMO this should be manually controlled if possible its just boring only after a couple of days. And when you are hiding in the straw you should be able to move, this could introduce the guards to stab into the straw to check if you are there.

Psiclone01
11-19-2007, 01:32 PM
I would not want to see stealth added though, that would cheapen the experience. Going completely invisible (stealth) would be somewhat magical and I don't think fits into this game well. Night time and taking cover in shadows would negate the need for stealth.

Maybe your definition of stealth is a bit misguided.. Stealth: The act of moving, proceeding, or acting in a covert way.

This isn't a suggestion to copy Metal Gear Solid's stealth, just being able to use shadows, crowds and nighttime to your advantage.

AirRon_2K7
11-19-2007, 01:36 PM
Originally posted by Opticaly:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Carry on talking to your real friend, since it's obvious that you think I'm trying to insult you. We're not all half wits here, I'm just trying to show you that you're actually rather pathetic, and this post... like all your others, is too defensive to be called creditable.

Get over yourself with the whole 'get a friend' aspect. You still think that you have the power to know anything about me... well let me say this:

You are a 30 year old virgin, living at home with mum, no friends and no qualifications.

That's about as true as anything else that you've said about me. Neither of us know what the other is like. Do you understand that. If you do, post "Yes" and get on with your life. if you don't: then don't post in reply to this, and get on with your life which is apparently so much more interesting that ours.

It's like you're trying to break a record for having the most amount of pointless arguments with people that aren't even trying to have arguments - ever.

Yes, you are trying to insult me, then you pretend that you are not?

I'm 16, not 30.

I'm not a virgin, and don't say something stupid like "omg you had sex at 16"

I do live with my parents, guess why? :l

Yes, I do have friends, online's and social friends.

I've got a B in english and A in maths, c in chemistry, a in bioligy and b in physics, 6 passes in IT, going for 3 a levels in college, the course is an IT based course; level 3, got a C in PE & RE, I didn't take geography or history I went to something else which gives you a couple diplomas.

That's enough for me. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are you actually trying to impress me? Pfft, you're pathetic. I make one comment of complete sarcasm (surely you - the only person EVER to get an A B C grade set, could understand sarcasm), and you completely argue it.

Let me make this D grade clear:

Nothing you say, on the internet, will make me... annoyed, or upset. Stop trying to read peoples thoughts, stop telling me about your life, and stop trying to say "wow I have friend" yeah... so does literally everybody else on the planet.

Pathetic.

Where I live, the only 16 year olds that leave school are those that A.) Don't want to carry on their education or B.) Don't have high enough grades to stay on for A levels.

That's why I can't say I'm in college, 'cos I'm still at school doing my A levels.

HMFC_1874
11-19-2007, 02:04 PM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Opticaly:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Carry on talking to your real friend, since it's obvious that you think I'm trying to insult you. We're not all half wits here, I'm just trying to show you that you're actually rather pathetic, and this post... like all your others, is too defensive to be called creditable.

Get over yourself with the whole 'get a friend' aspect. You still think that you have the power to know anything about me... well let me say this:

You are a 30 year old virgin, living at home with mum, no friends and no qualifications.

That's about as true as anything else that you've said about me. Neither of us know what the other is like. Do you understand that. If you do, post "Yes" and get on with your life. if you don't: then don't post in reply to this, and get on with your life which is apparently so much more interesting that ours.

It's like you're trying to break a record for having the most amount of pointless arguments with people that aren't even trying to have arguments - ever.

Yes, you are trying to insult me, then you pretend that you are not?

I'm 16, not 30.

I'm not a virgin, and don't say something stupid like "omg you had sex at 16"

I do live with my parents, guess why? :l

Yes, I do have friends, online's and social friends.

I've got a B in english and A in maths, c in chemistry, a in bioligy and b in physics, 6 passes in IT, going for 3 a levels in college, the course is an IT based course; level 3, got a C in PE & RE, I didn't take geography or history I went to something else which gives you a couple diplomas.

That's enough for me. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are you actually trying to impress me? Pfft, you're pathetic. I make one comment of complete sarcasm (surely you - the only person EVER to get an A B C grade set, could understand sarcasm), and you completely argue it.

Let me make this D grade clear:

Nothing you say, on the internet, will make me... annoyed, or upset. Stop trying to read peoples thoughts, stop telling me about your life, and stop trying to say "wow I have friend" yeah... so does literally everybody else on the planet.

Pathetic.

Where I live, the only 16 year olds that leave school are those that A.) Don't want to carry on their education or B.) Don't have high enough grades to stay on for A levels.

That's why I can't say I'm in college, 'cos I'm still at school doing my A levels. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Or C.) The profession they want to pursue in life does not require further education.

AirRon_2K7
11-19-2007, 02:06 PM
Right... I keep forgetting that one. My bad.
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

Seriously not being insulting but: What job types don't require education?

HMFC_1874
11-19-2007, 02:17 PM
In the UK you dont need further education for sports.

Not that you want to end up in these type of jobs by choice IMO, but there's the Cleaning Industry,

Sales Industry i.e Door to Door/Call Centres ect

Shopping/Retail work i,e Ikea/argos/"Mechant"lol

and Security. i.e bouncer, store security, survailance if thats how u spell it.

There are other jobs that dont need further education, and i'm not trying to start an argument.

HMFC_1874
11-19-2007, 02:19 PM
Originally posted by HMFC_1874:
In the UK you dont need further education for sports.

Not that you want to end up in these type of jobs by choice IMO, but there's the Cleaning Industry,

Sales Industry i.e Door to Door/Call Centres ect

Shopping/Retail work i,e Ikea/argos/"Mechant"lol

and Security. i.e bouncer, store security, survailance if thats how u spell it.

There are other jobs that dont need further education, and i'm not trying to start an argument.

I forgot Restaraunt/Hotel/Pub work

AirRon_2K7
11-19-2007, 02:31 PM
And building presumably

HMFC_1874
11-19-2007, 02:39 PM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
And building presumably

Building work requires going to college on block release.

Cheezyb3an
11-19-2007, 02:45 PM
jesus, you guys are sad! all im saying is i dont care whats in AC2 cause its gonna be bad arse with japanese assassins and stuff, hiding in trees (crouching tiger style, although i know thats a different time period) and it does look like its going that way from what ive seen in the end of AC1.

Opticaly
11-19-2007, 03:43 PM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Opticaly:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Carry on talking to your real friend, since it's obvious that you think I'm trying to insult you. We're not all half wits here, I'm just trying to show you that you're actually rather pathetic, and this post... like all your others, is too defensive to be called creditable.

Get over yourself with the whole 'get a friend' aspect. You still think that you have the power to know anything about me... well let me say this:

You are a 30 year old virgin, living at home with mum, no friends and no qualifications.

That's about as true as anything else that you've said about me. Neither of us know what the other is like. Do you understand that. If you do, post "Yes" and get on with your life. if you don't: then don't post in reply to this, and get on with your life which is apparently so much more interesting that ours.

It's like you're trying to break a record for having the most amount of pointless arguments with people that aren't even trying to have arguments - ever.

Yes, you are trying to insult me, then you pretend that you are not?

I'm 16, not 30.

I'm not a virgin, and don't say something stupid like "omg you had sex at 16"

I do live with my parents, guess why? :l

Yes, I do have friends, online's and social friends.

I've got a B in english and A in maths, c in chemistry, a in bioligy and b in physics, 6 passes in IT, going for 3 a levels in college, the course is an IT based course; level 3, got a C in PE & RE, I didn't take geography or history I went to something else which gives you a couple diplomas.

That's enough for me. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are you actually trying to impress me? Pfft, you're pathetic. I make one comment of complete sarcasm (surely you - the only person EVER to get an A B C grade set, could understand sarcasm), and you completely argue it.

Let me make this D grade clear:

Nothing you say, on the internet, will make me... annoyed, or upset. Stop trying to read peoples thoughts, stop telling me about your life, and stop trying to say "wow I have friend" yeah... so does literally everybody else on the planet.

Pathetic.

Where I live, the only 16 year olds that leave school are those that A.) Don't want to carry on their education or B.) Don't have high enough grades to stay on for A levels.

That's why I can't say I'm in college, 'cos I'm still at school doing my A levels. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Everything you have said that I've said is bullsh*t, I said I have friends, who doesn't? You trying to tell me that I haven't and say that everybody on the planet does, you literally just said the opposite to what you said before.

Oh, and what are you talking about "Nothing you say, on the internet, will make me... annoyed", if that is the case, why are you stilltrying to insult me.

HMFC_1874
11-19-2007, 05:56 PM
Originally posted by Opticaly:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Opticaly:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Carry on talking to your real friend, since it's obvious that you think I'm trying to insult you. We're not all half wits here, I'm just trying to show you that you're actually rather pathetic, and this post... like all your others, is too defensive to be called creditable.

Get over yourself with the whole 'get a friend' aspect. You still think that you have the power to know anything about me... well let me say this:

You are a 30 year old virgin, living at home with mum, no friends and no qualifications.

That's about as true as anything else that you've said about me. Neither of us know what the other is like. Do you understand that. If you do, post "Yes" and get on with your life. if you don't: then don't post in reply to this, and get on with your life which is apparently so much more interesting that ours.

It's like you're trying to break a record for having the most amount of pointless arguments with people that aren't even trying to have arguments - ever.

Yes, you are trying to insult me, then you pretend that you are not?

I'm 16, not 30.

I'm not a virgin, and don't say something stupid like "omg you had sex at 16"

I do live with my parents, guess why? :l

Yes, I do have friends, online's and social friends.

I've got a B in english and A in maths, c in chemistry, a in bioligy and b in physics, 6 passes in IT, going for 3 a levels in college, the course is an IT based course; level 3, got a C in PE & RE, I didn't take geography or history I went to something else which gives you a couple diplomas.

That's enough for me. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are you actually trying to impress me? Pfft, you're pathetic. I make one comment of complete sarcasm (surely you - the only person EVER to get an A B C grade set, could understand sarcasm), and you completely argue it.

Let me make this D grade clear:

Nothing you say, on the internet, will make me... annoyed, or upset. Stop trying to read peoples thoughts, stop telling me about your life, and stop trying to say "wow I have friend" yeah... so does literally everybody else on the planet.

Pathetic.

Where I live, the only 16 year olds that leave school are those that A.) Don't want to carry on their education or B.) Don't have high enough grades to stay on for A levels.

That's why I can't say I'm in college, 'cos I'm still at school doing my A levels. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Everything you have said that I've said is bullsh*t, I said I have friends, who doesn't? You trying to tell me that I haven't and say that everybody on the planet does, you literally just said the opposite to what you said before.

Oh, and what are you talking about "Nothing you say, on the internet, will make me... annoyed", if that is the case, why are you stilltrying to insult me. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Bury this one it's boring!

HMFC_1874
11-19-2007, 05:58 PM
How do you get Signatures working?
As you can see mines is just links?

ScytheOfGrim
11-19-2007, 11:46 PM
You need to post it as an URL HERE tag. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Opticaly, read my second post in this thread.

I clearly said that I hated misunderstandings.


What aided your arrival to the conclusion that I knew not what merchants sold?

You've played AC, merchants sell items on there that were sold in that year.

Just because they put in a crossbow into a CG trailer does not make them correct.

I didn't say they were correct.

Part of the reason it was taken out of the final build was because in those times crossbows took too long to reload. and I am also willing to bet that they didn't like it because assassins did not use them.

Not really, it's a game, I've said this before.
Who gives a s**t about the history or the bow & crossbow, please get a life and stop speaking to me, and stop starting arguements.

"Who said that this game has to be historically accurate?"

Well you, you dumb idiot.
You've been moaning for the past hours about bows not being in the game because of the Assassins belief; now your saying that.
Your just contradicting yourself all the time.


Reply 1:
You really didn't understand that statement, did you?
A "B" in English? Ha! I would not have given you a "G". >_>

Reply 2:

Just to make this clear, stop saying that the assassin's didn't use bows, maybe they didn't but one of the first weapons in assassin's creed was a crossbow, meaning that it would of been in game but it take a long time to reload.


And they took it out... why? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Reply 3:
I know it's a game. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif
Actually.. I never realised... >_>
Many people do.
This game was made on the basis of historical accuracy. Sure, the devs decided to stray from the goal, but the detail in the cities is enough to prove this mandate.

Reply 4:
Moaning? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif
Why would I be moaning because the creators took out what I hated?
Your logic does not add up. For somebody in college, you are pretty bovine.
Inever contradicted myself, it was you whom contradicted yourself.

You said that these were ideas for AC 2, but many of the ideas you mention are clearly ideas for medieval times.

Your argument was lost from the beginning.
You misread just about every other post and misunderstood even the simplest of concepts, then assumed that I was wrong and began calling me stupid.

As much as I hate to continue this, I can not let such ignorant, arrogant posts pass by.

Read through the full post, then reply. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Opticaly
11-20-2007, 07:36 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
You need to post it as an URL HERE tag. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Opticaly, read my second post in this thread.

I clearly said that I hated misunderstandings.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> What aided your arrival to the conclusion that I knew not what merchants sold?

You've played AC, merchants sell items on there that were sold in that year.

Just because they put in a crossbow into a CG trailer does not make them correct.

I didn't say they were correct.

Part of the reason it was taken out of the final build was because in those times crossbows took too long to reload. and I am also willing to bet that they didn't like it because assassins did not use them.

Not really, it's a game, I've said this before.
Who gives a s**t about the history or the bow & crossbow, please get a life and stop speaking to me, and stop starting arguements.

"Who said that this game has to be historically accurate?"

Well you, you dumb idiot.
You've been moaning for the past hours about bows not being in the game because of the Assassins belief; now your saying that.
Your just contradicting yourself all the time.


Reply 1:
You really didn't understand that statement, did you?
A "B" in English? Ha! I would not have given you a "G". >_>

Reply 2:

Just to make this clear, stop saying that the assassin's didn't use bows, maybe they didn't but one of the first weapons in assassin's creed was a crossbow, meaning that it would of been in game but it take a long time to reload.


And they took it out... why? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Reply 3:
I know it's a game. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif
Actually.. I never realised... >_>
Many people do.
This game was made on the basis of historical accuracy. Sure, the devs decided to stray from the goal, but the detail in the cities is enough to prove this mandate.

Reply 4:
Moaning? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif
Why would I be moaning because the creators took out what I hated?
Your logic does not add up. For somebody in college, you are pretty bovine.
Inever contradicted myself, it was you whom contradicted yourself.

You said that these were ideas for AC 2, but many of the ideas you mention are clearly ideas for medieval times.

Your argument was lost from the beginning.
You misread just about every other post and misunderstood even the simplest of concepts, then assumed that I was wrong and began calling me stupid.

As much as I hate to continue this, I can not let such ignorant, arrogant posts pass by.

Read through the full post, then
reply. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Your taking this argument too serious, and what do you mean you know it's a game, well obviously.

"And they took it out... why?"
I said why, because it took time to reload.

Reply 1: You really didn't understand that statement, did you? A "B" in English? Ha! I would not have given you a "G". >_>

Well considering you can't give me a G in english; why would you even post that, and you say "I would not have given you a "G"", exatly, just like the guy/girl that gave me the B. Idiot.

Ubisoft was going to put the crossbow in but it took too long to reload, so obviously this has nothing to do with Assassins never using bows, the game doesn't need to be historically acurate so why do you insist on Assassins not using bows? Who cares? It's a game, and as you have said before you know it's a game, if you know why are you still arguing about it, god, you seriously need to get over yourself.

Steef7
11-20-2007, 08:05 AM
what is up with you people, i have played many stealth MGS, Theif, Splinter Cell:CT and hitman, all good games because there all diffrent, and assassins creed has gain it place because its diffrent, yes i would like indoor areas and more mission types but thats it, assassins creed is great a 9/10 game and the best next/current gen sort-of stealth game and my favoreit xbox360 game

AirRon_2K7
11-20-2007, 08:30 AM
Opticaly, shh please. You're not making any sense, you obviously think that you're superior, so prove it to us by dropping the whole thing. And get back to what you made the topic for.

Opticaly
11-20-2007, 09:19 AM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Opticaly, shh please. You're not making any sense, you obviously think that you're superior, so prove it to us by dropping the whole thing. And get back to what you made the topic for.

I never said I was superior and I don't think it.

I am making sense, you just don't understand the simplest things e.g. you being a complete idiot, like right now.

I made the topic to share ideas, not to argue, but some people (you and that other guy) start arguements etc, It's pretty weird, you actualy want to argue with people, pathetic.

Now please shut up, and stop replying to the thread.

maddog111
11-20-2007, 09:41 AM
it would be cool if there is food in game..or make Altair go to bathroom and change his clothing...and make him sleep...that would be fun...lol it sounds as if im talking about The Sims:ASSASSIN CREED Version LOL

MarcAntonyy
11-20-2007, 12:05 PM
Forgive me for not reading the other posts (at work)

So hopefully this hasn't already been said, but with many people desiring more variety of killing methods I would like to suggest the 1st person projectile effect that Heavenly Sword had.

That would be killer to be able to fire an arrow from atop one of the towers or something and slow-motion lead it right into the back of the guy's head with a sweet animation.

That would feel Assassin like

That effect was my favorite part of playing Heavenly Sword

AirRon_2K7
11-20-2007, 12:14 PM
I said I have friends, who doesn't? You trying to tell me that I haven't and say that everybody on the planet does, you literally just said the opposite to what you said before.

I didn't say you didn't have friends. That's just you trying to find new ways of arguing.


It's pretty weird, you actualy want to argue with people, pathetic.

That's what I said to you on the last page, yet you still managed to whine some more, didn't ya.


Originally posted by Opticaly:
Now please shut up, and stop replying to the thread.

Reply: no.

Now what would I like to see in AC 2?

More emphasis on the Sci Fi plot, it only really kicked off in the second half.

Karl_93
11-20-2007, 12:46 PM
Well some things that i would like to improve

1. Harder chases, i've run down the street, turned two corners, and lost all the 10 guards following after me. I think that they should be faster and harder to lose, but they shouldn't be able to be as flexable as you while climbing, maybe they should only use ladders and they are only able to jump between buildings, but no crazy parkour with running up walls and stuff. and i think people in armor shouldn't be able to jump from building to building as well.

2. diversity in missions. The main investigations are fun, and i have no problem with the 12 save the citizens missions, but if they are going to keep that number then they should add some more diversity, maybe some more side assassinations or kill all the guards in an area without alerting them to your presence. And the save the citizens missions could be different, maybe one of them could have lost a balloon that you have to get http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

3. They have too many hiding spots, especially on rooftops. if you get to a rooftop you notice that bascially every 3 buildings is a roof hiding spot, i think they should decrease this to maybe 1 hiding spot every 7 buildings to make the chases more challenging. Also if you are in cover you cant get out ahead of time untill you are in the green, this pisses me off because i try to run away and just stay out of sight for a minute to lose the guards, it makes it more fun than just sitting down on a bench after turning a corner. So you should be able to leave cover whenever you want and not be forced to stay there.

4. Climbing is a bit slow. It annoys me when im trying to be fast. Maybe they should have a fast climbing thing so that when you hold R you climb faster but are more likely to fall when hit with a rock or something? The free runnings amazing though

Even though ive expressed my opinions, dont think i hate this game, its probably one of the best games ive ever played!! good job ubi!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Opticaly
11-20-2007, 01:22 PM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I said I have friends, who doesn't? You trying to tell me that I haven't and say that everybody on the planet does, you literally just said the opposite to what you said before.

I didn't say you didn't have friends. That's just you trying to find new ways of arguing.


It's pretty weird, you actualy want to argue with people, pathetic.

That's what I said to you on the last page, yet you still managed to whine some more, didn't ya.


Originally posted by Opticaly:
Now please shut up, and stop replying to the thread.

Reply: no.

Now what would I like to see in AC 2?

More emphasis on the Sci Fi plot, it only really kicked off in the second half. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, you did say I don't have friend, you stupid idiot.


Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Carry on talking to your real friend, since it's obvious that you think I'm trying to insult you. We're not all half wits here, I'm just trying to show you that you're actually rather pathetic, and this post... like all your others, is too defensive to be called creditable.

Get over yourself with the whole 'get a friend' aspect. You still think that you have the power to know anything about me... well let me say this:

You are a 30 year old virgin, living at home with mum, no friends and no qualifications.

That's about as true as anything else that you've said about me. Neither of us know what the other is like. Do you understand that. If you do, post "Yes" and get on with your life. if you don't: then don't post in reply to this, and get on with your life which is apparently so much more interesting that ours.

It's like you're trying to break a record for having the most amount of pointless arguments with people that aren't even trying to have arguments - ever.

Look at the bold.

That's what I said to you on the last page, yet you still managed to whine some more, didn't ya.

So you said that I whined about myself arguing with myself, and starting arguments, what the hell are talking about, you are making no sense.

You said that I'm starting arguments? I don't think so, you and that other guy clearly started it, idiot.

Opticaly
11-20-2007, 01:23 PM
Originally posted by Karl_93:
Well some things that i would like to improve

1. Harder chases, i've run down the street, turned two corners, and lost all the 10 guards following after me. I think that they should be faster and harder to lose, but they shouldn't be able to be as flexable as you while climbing, maybe they should only use ladders and they are only able to jump between buildings, but no crazy parkour with running up walls and stuff. and i think people in armor shouldn't be able to jump from building to building as well.

2. diversity in missions. The main investigations are fun, and i have no problem with the 12 save the citizens missions, but if they are going to keep that number then they should add some more diversity, maybe some more side assassinations or kill all the guards in an area without alerting them to your presence. And the save the citizens missions could be different, maybe one of them could have lost a balloon that you have to get http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

3. They have too many hiding spots, especially on rooftops. if you get to a rooftop you notice that bascially every 3 buildings is a roof hiding spot, i think they should decrease this to maybe 1 hiding spot every 7 buildings to make the chases more challenging. Also if you are in cover you cant get out ahead of time untill you are in the green, this pisses me off because i try to run away and just stay out of sight for a minute to lose the guards, it makes it more fun than just sitting down on a bench after turning a corner. So you should be able to leave cover whenever you want and not be forced to stay there.

4. Climbing is a bit slow. It annoys me when im trying to be fast. Maybe they should have a fast climbing thing so that when you hold R you climb faster but are more likely to fall when hit with a rock or something? The free runnings amazing though

Even though ive expressed my opinions, dont think i hate this game, its probably one of the best games ive ever played!! good job ubi!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Finally! I agree with almost everything you just said.

AirRon_2K7
11-20-2007, 02:14 PM
You are a 30 year old virgin, living at home with mum, no friends and no qualifications.

You didn't notice the sarcasm there? Gosh... let it go.

You go on and on calling me a stupid idiot... Yes well done you're at college... here have a cookie.

Sandwarrior1990
11-20-2007, 02:19 PM
If you actually read AirRon's post you can see that he wasn't implying that you have no friends http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif That sentence was used in one of the points he was trying to make... bla bla bla, internet forum, everybody stop arguing.

In AC2 I don't actually know what else I would like >_>
Overall the basics of the game sufficiently rocked my boat http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

No doubt after I've replayed the game there will be a few things I'll think of...

AirRon_2K7
11-20-2007, 02:24 PM
Originally posted by Sandwarrior1990:
If you actually read AirRon's post you can see that he wasn't implying that you have no friends http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif That sentence was used in one of the points he was trying to make... bla bla bla, internet forum, everybody stop arguing.

In AC2 I don't actually know what else I would like >_>
Overall the basics of the game sufficiently rocked my boat http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

No doubt after I've replayed the game there will be a few things I'll think of...

Hopefully it didn't rock your boat to much, lest you fall in and drown xD (Alty can't swim >_> )

Opticaly
11-20-2007, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">You are a 30 year old virgin, living at home with mum, no friends and no qualifications.

You didn't notice the sarcasm there? Gosh... let it go.

You go on and on calling me a stupid idiot... Yes well done you're at college... here have a cookie. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

There was no sarcasm, you are just denying meaning it.

Why do you keep going on about college?

"It's about as true as anything else you've said to me"

Well I did say you tried to argue with me, which means you did mean that insult.

AirRon_2K7
11-20-2007, 02:36 PM
Even Sandwarrior understood it. I'm not denying it, but you seem to be the only stuck up brat here unable to understand anything.

Opticaly
11-20-2007, 03:27 PM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Even Sandwarrior understood it. I'm not denying it, but you seem to be the only stuck up brat here unable to understand anything.

Yeh, I'm a brat alright

rogue_tom
11-20-2007, 03:28 PM
I've just copied and paste this from enoughier post i did, i agree with alot of what the op said so i'll bump it.

1) Involved assasinations. For an assassin game there really isn't much thought into how you're going to kill the target. Compaired to hitman it's rubbish.

A) The targets should have a life, they should move around the city. Sleep, eat, drink, meet people (allow player to ease drop). Devs have a great asset of creating these cities but don't use it for the main gameplay(assassinations), Why?

B) Day / night. I know this is a social stealth game but there is a need to add light/dark stealth to an assassins game. Surely they could add this to there building blocks that they used to create the game.

C) If the targets could moves around the city this would give a reason for the investigations, which sounds to me like the original idea. The investigations are repetative because they give no benifit to the gameplay.

2) Social stealth: Hitmans use of social stealth is much the same, costumes. What makes hitman alot more enjoyable is there varied use of costumes. All ac uses is munks (press a button and you're done) or blend which also dull as you only use one button. The player is infront of his target before he knows it. Add varied ways to get past guards. such as...

A) Allow the player to use guards to escort them past other guards. The player would find a guard alone (special guard for this purpose) punch him a few times, just like the intimidaiton investagtions they talk, then altair puts a knife to his back and can control himself and the guard past other guards then the player would kill the guard when there past.

B) The messenger: while doing your investigation you find out that the targets wife is expecting a letter, You kill the real messenger and steal his documents that show he is allowed into the castles (or where ever).

Multiple different types of these should be added to each target to give alot of replay value.

3) Layout: Add alot more obstacles, This is why I think ignoring hiding / dark / light is a bad idea. Guards should normally attack a man dressed in weapons. This would give the free running a reason. The social stealth should be there for some mission but not all, i don't feel it's fun enough for a whole second game.

3a) Free running: For the most part all you do is run on walls and roof tops. More should be done inside buildings to give more multiple, liniar appouches to the target. ie original splinter cell stuff.

-Spoiler -


4) story. I like the future element. I hope the artifact turn out to be alien tho, the idea there magical stuff ruins it for me. It might have been better if we found out the future stuff later in the game. They should have played on it a bit more.

Each part of the story felt very segmented. I never felt each part was rewarding enough and i didn't like the way the game would fast forward to different memories.

5) Assasinations: They should have more ways to kill the targets, poision, accidents, throwing knives, etc and make it harder to get up close and kill with the hidden blade. This way you would have to play well to be rewarded with a cutscene.

I find it very annoying when people talk about how assassin were known to kill in the crowd. If they killed in the shadows no one would know so how do you know they didn't?

Also i don't like the idea of costume and merchants (rpg stuff). I don't feel there is a need for them. Just my opinion.

Merc_G
11-20-2007, 04:44 PM
Some great suggestions in this thread.

I want to comment on the night/day cycle.

While it would be cool to assassinate targets in the dark, I think from a practical standpoint it may be difficult because considering the time period, without street lights as we know them for illumination, and without electricity, there's a danger of the game being TOO dark. And too dark is horrible.

Think about the reasons of WHAT made AC1 so good - the free runnning and the climbing and the excellent landscape views from the high vantage points were all so powerful in gameplay because you could clearly SEE the city around you in the day time.

Therefore not only will night possibly backfire on the gamer (I was not a fan of the tutorial mission in a dark cave where I could not see the grapple points for the climbing clearly), but also it means the great texture art and building designs may not be appreciated fully.

A racing game like Project Gotham apparently has different assets for their "night" and "day" courses which also cause conflict on disc space.

However, if AC2 has night time cities and missions, I suppose Ubisoft will introduce a good range of lighting because with flames and bonfires and the ravage of a burning cityscape we could have some potentially great illumination on the new cities giving a brand new feel to the high point "syncronisations".

So leading on from that, in the night time, one thing I'd like to see archers have is fire arrows that could zip towards you, like something out of Braveheart, or Robin Hood: Prince Of Thieves.

And while i'm talking of Archers, I think a weapon I'd like to see usebale is the bow and arrow, the ancient equivalent of the sniper rifle, for those tough to reach, heavy guarded targets.

Ecksphive1
11-20-2007, 07:09 PM
is spelled "Hashshashin"

and everything Opticaly has said regarding bows and poisons is correct....which leads me to the question, why in the freakin opening movie/teaser does Altair have a crossbow?? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

"Nothing is true. Everything is permitted."

ScytheOfGrim
11-20-2007, 09:05 PM
So you agree with Opticaly about the hashashiyeen using bows and poison?

Oh, moqqy, where art thou?!

Opticaly, I am not taking this seriously. In fact, I can not take a joke seriously.
You are that joke.

You failed to prove that you are smart.
You failed to do so because of your ignorrant and misunderstood posts.
You are a failure.

Every reply to me made no sense.

At first, I mentioned that the hashashiyeen did not use poison or bows, only for you to give me an article in 2006.

Do you know anything about the hashashiyeen?
Obviously not.

Even Wikipedia has more accurate information than you. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Then you continued to reply to my posts, while seming to have only read half of them, or completely misinterperating them.

Which on its own is useless in an argument.

Air, I think it is time you put down that statement about failing. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

AirRon_2K7
11-21-2007, 02:17 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
So you agree with Opticaly about the hashashiyeen using bows and poison?

Oh, moqqy, where art thou?!

Opticaly, I am not taking this seriously. In fact, I can not take a joke seriously.
You are that joke.

You failed to prove that you are smart.
You failed to do so because of your ignorrant and misunderstood posts.
You are a failure.

Every reply to me made no sense.

At first, I mentioned that the hashashiyeen did not use poison or bows, only for you to give me an article in 2006.

Do you know anything about the hashashiyeen?
Obviously not.

Even Wikipedia has more accurate information than you. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Then you continued to reply to my posts, while seming to have only read half of them, or completely misinterperating them.

Which on its own is useless in an argument.

Air, I think it is time you put down that statement about failing. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Owned. Optically you fail.

You failed to make intelligent arguments. You failed to be funny. You failed to be cool. You failed to be smart. You failed at making your point. After reading this you're going to try and commit suicide, but fail at that too, killing two cats and a small schoolgirl.

Had to necromance this thread just for that. (Grim... it's getting bigger http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif )

rogue_tom
11-21-2007, 02:38 AM
How about you lot just drop trou and compair d^ck sizes! Pointless arguement.

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 06:03 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
So you agree with Opticaly about the hashashiyeen using bows and poison?

Oh, moqqy, where art thou?!

Opticaly, I am not taking this seriously. In fact, I can not take a joke seriously.
You are that joke.

You failed to prove that you are smart.
You failed to do so because of your ignorrant and misunderstood posts.
You are a failure.

Every reply to me made no sense.

At first, I mentioned that the hashashiyeen did not use poison or bows, only for you to give me an article in 2006.

Do you know anything about the hashashiyeen?
Obviously not.

Even Wikipedia has more accurate information than you. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Then you continued to reply to my posts, while seming to have only read half of them, or completely misinterperating them.

Which on its own is useless in an argument.

Air, I think it is time you put down that statement about failing. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

If you are not taking me seriously why are you still posting, you would atleast shut up and stop posting.

Do you know anything about the hashashiyeen?
Obviously not.

I've never said once I know anything about Hashashins or hashashiyeen

Right, I'm the failure I'm the one with 2476 posts, right, I get out, I have a girl(tiffany), I have a social life, and then we look at you, obviously ugly considering you spend all your time on here posting to make yourself look cool, same with the other guy 1292 posts, ****ing hell! You both seriously need to get laid, god you both are the type of people that sitting around in their house all year eating pizza and masturbating to anime, you are two basement dwelling dumb asses who have nothing better to do than trying to be cool online because you have no friend in real-life. You both are completely pathetic, you try to act smart, you try to speak about the hashashiyeen to make it look like you have an understanding of them, you obviously don't know nothing about them, everything could of been a lie etc, don't try to tell storys about the assassins when you don't know anything about them, and oh my lord! You actualy tried to do the whole "You are a failure." thing, that is how low you will go to try and hurt me, you pathetic little thing you. Don't try and reply again, be the big man and shut the hell up, please, go commit suicide or atleast try and speak to a cat or something, man; you need to get a life, both of you.

In both of your next posts you'll write something completely stupid e.g. "What are you talking about, that didn't make sense", like you have said in previous posts, you just don't understand a basic insult like: You smell, come on guys, cheer up it's not all that bad, atleast you still have your mom/mum/mam to look after you; when times are tough http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

You are an insult to mankind, a waste of space, you both are nothing, null, zip, nout, you can now both, turn around, open that wooden thing that some might call a "door", walk outside, breathe in some oxygen, then walk off a bridge.

AirRon_2K7
11-21-2007, 06:05 AM
Your mum hits you, doesn't she? If you want to carry on this argument, then do so in private chat. Otherwise, go have sex with your girlfriend, but don't assume that we haven't had sex either. 'Cos I know for myself, that isn't true . . .

Bloody hell. You sad little boy. You're 16... 16! You shouldn't be on the internet whining 'cos you're so thick.

Merc_G
11-21-2007, 06:29 AM
I honestly don't get why you guys are arguing.

There's some good ideas from everyone for an AC2, and you guys are just ruining a thread having a flame war.

Just stop it.

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 06:36 AM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Your mum hits you, doesn't she? If you want to carry on this argument, then do so in private chat. Otherwise, go have sex with your girlfriend, but don't assume that we haven't had sex either. 'Cos I know for myself, that isn't true . . .

Bloody hell. You sad little boy. You're 16... 16! You shouldn't be on the internet whining 'cos you're so thick.

What kind of insult is that "your mom hits you", obviously not.

"Otherwise, go have sex with your girlfriend", thats more compliment than insult so thanks, and I haven't assumed you haven't had sex, I just said you need to get laid because you are 100% in love with yourself

AirRon_2K7
11-21-2007, 06:40 AM
Coming from the guy that thinks everyone else should kill themselves? Pfft, mixed messages. This argument is over, move on.

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 06:42 AM
Originally posted by AirRon_2K7:
Coming from the guy that thinks everyone else should kill themselves? Pfft, mixed messages. This argument is over, move on.

When did I say I want everyone to kill themself?
You are really weird.

AirRon_2K7
11-21-2007, 06:44 AM
Don't try and reply again, be the big man and shut the hell up, please, go commit suicide or atleast try and speak to a cat or something, man; you need to get a life, both of you.


...nout, you can now both, turn around, open that wooden thing that some might call a "door", walk outside, breathe in some oxygen, then walk off a bridge.

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 06:47 AM
Since when was two people everyone?

And walking of a bridge doesn't mean you will die and as you can see in the above quote I put "or".

AirRon_2K7
11-21-2007, 06:51 AM
Yeah but commiting suicide does.

You want two people to die, I'd say your life isn't going how you want it to.

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 06:53 AM
It's actually doing quite fine.
My life is good enough for me.

BTOG46
11-21-2007, 06:54 AM
I'm surprised that one of the mods or Forum Managers hasn't already locked this thread to stop the flames. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif
@ Opticaly
As far as asking when did you tell other members to kill themselves, you told ScytheOfGrim to kill himself, less than an hour and 6 posts ago..... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 06:57 AM
He said I've said it to everyone.
I said it to two people, not everyone.

BTOG46
11-21-2007, 07:05 AM
Well, anyway, the two of you seem to have calmed down now, that should be enough to keep the thread safe from a lock. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 07:11 AM
Yup, I think we should get back on topic, I wonder what city/country AC2 will be in =]

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 07:16 AM
If you are not taking me seriously why are you still posting, you would atleast shut up and stop posting.
I enjoy a good joke every once in a while.
That's why idiots exist in this world.


Do you know anything about the hashashiyeen?
Obviously not.

I've never said once I know anything about Hashashins or hashashiyeen
I never said that you did.
You implied it.
You tried to prove that you knew something about the assassins when you replied the bows and poisons.


Right, I'm the failure I'm the one with 2476 posts,
How does having a large number of posts make me a failure?


right, I get out, I have a girl(tiffany), I have a social life,
You don't "have" a girl. She is not your possession. And that is reason enough for you not to be throwing her name around the web.


and then we look at you, obviously ugly considering you spend all your time on here posting to make yourself look cool,
Why do you assume that I am ugly? Because I spend time crushing risible fools such as yourself?How can I make my self "look" cool by text?


same with the other guy 1292 posts, ****ing hell! You both seriously need to get laid,
You tell me to get laid... yet you know nothing of my beliefs and religion. I have enough respect towards myself to know that it is unfair to get a woman that I will probably not end up marrying into sexual problems.


god you both are the type of people that sitting around in their house all year eating pizza and masturbating to anime,
I don't like pizza... or even anime for that matter. Again you and your outlandish assumptions. And I am probably more active than you.
And now I am going to brag about my life the way you have done multiple times before (evidently for the uncertainty of whether you are socially flushed, or not).
I can play any sport that is placed infront of me. I am the top of my class, with my average being one of the highest in my school. I am the most outgoing person that you can think of (but considering how limited your imagination is...). I am constantly competing in tournaments set up by my school, and even in ones set up by the company my father works for. Heck, it was only yesterday that I was in a football (soccer) tournament.


you are two basement dwelling dumb asses who have nothing better to do than trying to be cool online because you have no friend in real-life.
You are correct, I have no friend... I have friends.


You both are completely pathetic, you try to act smart, you try to speak about the hashashiyeen to make it look like you have an understanding of them, you obviously don't know nothing about them, everything could of been a lie etc, don't try to tell storys about the assassins when you don't know anything about them,
So, by what you are implying, you know all about the hashashiyeen, correct? WRONG.
Proof? You seriously thought that they were just your average assassins! Proof? Have you forgotten that link already?


and oh my lord! You actualy tried to do the hole "You are a failure." thing, that is how low you will go to try and hurt me, you pathetic little thing you.
We did not "try". We "did". The visual evidence is there, right infront of your very eyes. At points in life, you will have to admit that others are better than you. And you just did. By saying that we would go so "low" to "try" and hurt you. Meaning that to hurt you, we would have to stoop down to your level. I love people that insult themselves without realising.


Don't try and reply again, be the big man and shut the hell up,
So you admit that you aren't the man?
I am the man to have enough courage to attempt to erase ignorrance from your wretched soul. But you are too arrogant to accept that. And that is why you fail.


please, go commit suicide or atleast try and speak to a cat or something, man; you need to get a life, both of you.
Oh dear! Now I am a man?!
Oh, the lovely contradictions...
We have lives, otherwise we would not be able to beat the mental stuffing out of you... verbally.
Trying to teach a wall a double backflip is easier than communicating to somebody of your intellectual capacity.


In both of your next posts you'll write something completely stupid e.g. "What are you talking about, that didn't make sense",
What are you talking about? That didn't make sense.
Why did it make no sense? Because your grammar sucks.


you just don't understand a basic insult like: You smell, come on guys, cheer up it's not all that bad, atleast you still have your mom/mum/mam to look after you; when times are tough
And if we did not understand such insults we would not be replying... your logic is flawed.
Thank God you too have your mom, because you are in dire need of her. Come on, get her to wag that finger at me...


You are an insult to mankind, a waste of space, you both are nothing, null, zip, nout, you can now both, turn around, open that wooden thing that some might call a "door", walk outside, breathe in some oxygen, then walk off a bridge.

While we may contemplate that, I suggest that you search for a seventy-three storey building and get onto the roof of it. Then leap off of it head first, while flapping your arms and clucking like a chicken.
Doing so many things at once hopefully will send your brain into a perpetual bind, and if not, then the cold, hard surface of the concrete may knock some sense into you...

EDIT: Oh, damn... I had this post ready a while ago, but it seems I forgot to post it... >_>

Foolish me... if I am starting something again, then I am sorry, and I will not reply to any reply that comes...

AirRon_2K7
11-21-2007, 07:24 AM
OWNED lol.

You're not bringing anything new up. We're both condemned to death by sir Optiwilly anyway.

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 07:27 AM
Ha! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

I was just readong through that.

I think we should say our final words... I'm really interested in how he's going to get rid of me... >_>

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 07:28 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> If you are not taking me seriously why are you still posting, you would atleast shut up and stop posting.
I enjoy a good joke every once in a while.
That's why idiots exist in this world.


Do you know anything about the hashashiyeen?
Obviously not.

I've never said once I know anything about Hashashins or hashashiyeen
I never said that you did.
You implied it.
You tried to prove that you knew something about the assassins when you replied the bows and poisons.


Right, I'm the failure I'm the one with 2476 posts,
How does having a large number of posts make me a failure?


right, I get out, I have a girl(tiffany), I have a social life,
You don't "have" a girl. She is not your possession. And that is reason enough for you not to be throwing her name around the web.


and then we look at you, obviously ugly considering you spend all your time on here posting to make yourself look cool,
Why do you assume that I am ugly? Because I spend time crushing risible fools such as yourself?How can I make my self "look" cool by text?


same with the other guy 1292 posts, ****ing hell! You both seriously need to get laid,
You tell me to get laid... yet you know nothing of my beliefs and religion. I have enough respect towards myself to know that it is unfair to get a woman that I will probably not end up marrying into sexual problems.


god you both are the type of people that sitting around in their house all year eating pizza and masturbating to anime,
I don't like pizza... or even anime for that matter. Again you and your outlandish assumptions. And I am probably more active than you.
And now I am going to brag about my life the way you have done multiple times before (evidently for the uncertainty of whether you are socially flushed, or not).
I can play any sport that is placed infront of me. I am the top of my class, with my average being one of the highest in my school. I am the most outgoing person that you can think of (but considering how limited your imagination is...). I am constantly competing in tournaments set up by my school, and even in ones set up by the company my father works for. Heck, it was only yesterday that I was in a football (soccer) tournament.


you are two basement dwelling dumb asses who have nothing better to do than trying to be cool online because you have no friend in real-life.
You are correct, I have no friend... I have friends.


You both are completely pathetic, you try to act smart, you try to speak about the hashashiyeen to make it look like you have an understanding of them, you obviously don't know nothing about them, everything could of been a lie etc, don't try to tell storys about the assassins when you don't know anything about them,
So, by what you are implying, you know all about the hashashiyeen, correct? WRONG.
Proof? You seriously thought that they were just your average assassins! Proof? Have you forgotten that link already?


and oh my lord! You actualy tried to do the hole "You are a failure." thing, that is how low you will go to try and hurt me, you pathetic little thing you.
We did not "try". We "did". The visual evidence is there, right infront of your very eyes. At points in life, you will have to admit that others are better than you. And you just did. By saying that we would go so "low" to "try" and hurt you. Meaning that to hurt you, we would have to stoop down to your level. I love people that insult themselves without realising.


Don't try and reply again, be the big man and shut the hell up,
So you admit that you aren't the man?
I am the man to have enough courage to attempt to erase ignorrance from your wretched soul. But you are too arrogant to accept that. And that is why you fail.


please, go commit suicide or atleast try and speak to a cat or something, man; you need to get a life, both of you.
Oh dear! Now I am a man?!
Oh, the lovely contradictions...
We have lives, otherwise we would not be able to beat the mental stuffing out of you... verbally.
Trying to teach a wall a double backflip is easier than communicating to somebody of your intellectual capacity.


In both of your next posts you'll write something completely stupid e.g. "What are you talking about, that didn't make sense",
What are you talking about? That didn't make sense.
Why did it make no sense? Because your grammar sucks.


you just don't understand a basic insult like: You smell, come on guys, cheer up it's not all that bad, atleast you still have your mom/mum/mam to look after you; when times are tough
And if we did not understand such insults we would not be replying... your logic is flawed.
Thank God you too have your mom, because you are in dire need of her. Come on, get her to wag that finger at me...


You are an insult to mankind, a waste of space, you both are nothing, null, zip, nout, you can now both, turn around, open that wooden thing that some might call a "door", walk outside, breathe in some oxygen, then walk off a bridge.

While we may contemplate that, I suggest that you search for a seventy-three storey building and get onto the roof of it. Then leap off of it head first, while flapping your arms and clucking like a chicken.
Doing so many things at once hopefully will send your brain into a perpetual bind, and if not, then the cold, hard surface of the concrete may knock some sense into you... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It makes you a failure because you have nothing better to do than post ****, and argue.

Yes, your the man, thats what I just said.

I'm not "throwing" her name around the web, you try to make things bigger than they are, I posted the name of a female.

Do you know anything about the hashashiyeen? Obviously not.

^ That means you are telling me I know nothing about the hashashiyeen, I've never said that I do know anything about them.

I have enough respect towards myself to know that it is unfair to get a woman that I will probably not end up marrying into sexual problems.

Sexual problems? How can having sex a couple times or even once get you into those problems, you wont have problems, the condom might help you in that department.

No, I know for a fact that you are not more active than me, even though I don't know how active you are I still know that you aren't as active as me, I don't want to speak about myself that much but I do live next to a mountain and near a gym.

What are you talking about? That didn't make sense. Why did it make no sense? Because your grammar sucks.

If it makes no sense how do you understand it?
And how does everyone else.

So, by what you are implying, you know all about the hashashiyeen, correct? WRONG.

I know nothing about the hashashiyeen, neither do you.

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 07:30 AM
Owned? You still say stuff like that do you? Owned, you n00b arrr, yeh, hurts.

Guess what? You smell.

I wonder how they are going to react?

And please stop lying about the anime and pizza

I make a couple mistake in spelling like friend instead of friends and you try to insult me haha.


I was just readong through that.


It's reading not readong you dumb little thing.

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 07:33 AM
BOO! I scared you! I scared you!
now I just contradicted myself... saying I wasn't going to reply...
Meh... it was worth it...

Now where is that little manipulation of mine...?

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 07:41 AM
And why is a 27 year old arguing with a 16 year old, get a life.

Virtus_Vrtra
11-21-2007, 07:42 AM
Originally posted by Opticaly:

Even though poison was a very popular weapon used by Assassin's, they have used mushrooms and other plants to kill there victims in the past, oh and people would be out at night, so your saying that nobody stepped a foot outside of there door, not for pubs, partys and get-togethers, don't try to act smart, and a night & day cycle does make sense, if it didn't you might need to see a doctor.
This is a game, not the real thing, and AC 2 will be more modern, and what do you mean Assassin's don't use poison, if this game was mordern what would this mean: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2006/12/17/assassins-used-10-millio_n_36583.html

dude, you're really clueless aren't you? first off, the term assassin today is 100% different that what it was during the crusades. the "assassins" during the crusades, originally pernounced hashashayeen ((something like that) translates from ARABIC to "hash eating killers" yes, they were "potheads," the word assassin is derived from this. they DID NOT use poison however. the killings they did were strictly to send pollitical messages to both the europeans AND the saracens. your little news clip is a LITTLE different than the 3rd cruade wouldn't you think? i've been watching this game since it was first announced, and ACTUALLY had the chance to interview an art designer for the game at PAX in seattle and he constantly mentioned how historically acurate they wanted the cities and background info on the assassins to be. granted the storyline wasn't but thats another story

sorry for the rant, i'm not very fond of ignorant people haha

anyways, back to the game.

in AC, the cities have the look of being alive. but when it comes to the information people, they just sit there and wait for you. what i think should happen is that everytime for go to a high point, there should be a sort of snapshot on important things going on in the city. if a guy you can pick pocket a message from is just walking around, he wont show up. maybe have few assassin informants in the city, but if you really wanna do a bang up job on the hit, you should have to do some detective work. as far as saving citizens, MAKE EM SAY MORE THAT JUST 6 BLOODY LINES! it wouldn't be that must harder to give each citizen their own little tale about how much they love your nuts because you saved them.

aside from that, you guys have some great points with the choices from weapons etc. I myself would choose to leave behind the longsword in exchange for a little more speed and mobility (keeping the dirk and the hidden blade).

one more thing. when it comes to actually killing the target, he should be accesable from the second you walk in the city gates. if he's hiding in his office (or whatever) you should be ABLE to bust open the window and choke a *****, (not what i'd do, but an option nonetheless)

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 07:45 AM
Assassin's

Did you notice I said Assassins and not hashashiyeen or hashashins

EDIT:

I just found this

"That Hasan-i Sabbah and other early Assassin Masters had gardens seems likely since the garden is such an important part of Persian noble life and of mysticism. The water channels and meticulous care to ensure regular water supplies at Assassin castles echo the care which Persian and Arab villages and country houses today give to the presence of running water. So the legend of the garden in which Assassins were taken probably has its origins in fact." "Many scholars have argued, and demonstrated convincingly, that the attribution of the epithet 'hashish eaters' or 'hashish takers' is a misnomer derived from enemies the Isma'ilis and was never used by Moslem chroniclers or sources. It was therefore used in a pejorative sense of 'enemies' or 'disreputable people'. This sense of the term survived into modern times with the common Egyptian usage of the term Hashasheen in the 1930s to mean simply 'noisy or riotous'. It is unlikely that the austere Hasan-i Sabbah indulged personally in drug taking." "There is no mention of that drug [hashish] in connection with the Persian Assassins - especially in the library of Alamut ('the secret archives')."

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 07:50 AM
I really do not like anime and pizza.
How do you know if I am lying? Oh, great Optidiot!

"I make a couple mistake in spelling"

Yes, only a couple... >_>
Not just in spelling, your tenses are way off too...
And you are English... in college... you are such a disappointment.

The letters "I" and "O" are right besides each other. A bit of common sense there.

http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa286/ScytheOfGrim/ladenkillcopy.jpg

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 07:52 AM
And when I'm typing at 97.43 wpm I think I miss a few letters.

Karl_93
11-21-2007, 07:55 AM
everybody shut up... plz

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 07:55 AM
Originally posted by Karl_93:
shut up... plz

Yes I should

But he's 27, he should see I'm young and annoying

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 07:57 AM
And you also "adds" a few letters too. xD

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 07:59 AM
Yup

"Once established in a secure and permanent base, Hasan sent da'is [missionaries] out from Alamut in all directions, At the same time he pursued a policy of territorial expansion, taking castles either by means of propaganda or by force, ad building others....Life at Alamut, and we may suppose in the other fortresses at this time, was characterized by extreme asceticism and severity." "Political assassination was not unknown in Islam before Hasan-i Sabbah. Earlier sects had used murder as a political technique, and there is evidence that Mohammed himself disposed of his enemies by suggesting that they did not deserve to live - and hoping that faithful followers would take the hint. There had even been an extremist Shiite group known as the 'stranglers' after their preferred method of assassination." The word assassin "definitely entered the literary vocabulary when it was used by Dante." In The Divine Comedy: Hell, Book XIX, "Dante describes himself as 'like a friar who is confessing the wicked assassin': 'Io stava come il frate che confessa Lo perfido assassin...' "Here the strongest possible noun is required since the criminal being confessed is being buried alive head down, thus denoting a sin of particular horror. The connection of assassin with wickedness reinforces the clarity and precision with which Dante used the word, and it was in this sense that 'assassin' then passed into other European languages." - Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam

Virtus_Vrtra
11-21-2007, 08:04 AM
Originally posted by BTOG46:
I'm surprised that one of the mods or Forum Managers hasn't already locked this thread to stop the flames. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

HAHA! yeah i'm willing to bet the Forum managing gods are just watching and laughing their asses off, seeing this battle of epic proportions unfold. but hey thats how life goes.

Just so i'm not off topic (don't want to anger the gods) i think the clothing idea is kinda dumb. Altair looks like a BAMF, walks, talks and stalks like a BAMF, and kills *****es like a BAMF. the white robe is a symbolic icon of the species known as the BAMF... case closed.

oh yeah, Opticaly... your girlfriend is ugly and is terrible at sucking ****, you mom hates you and your real dad is the milkman...

nuf sed

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 08:09 AM
Originally posted by Virtus_Vrtra:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by BTOG46:
oh yeah, Opticaly... your girlfriend is ugly and is terrible at sucking ****, you mom hates you and your real dad is the milkman...

nuf sed

Actualy my dad is a manager dude thingy at Seabank, my mom loves me, my girlfriend is pretty hot, and she is **** at sucking, wow you got one thing right! GOOD FOR YOU!

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 08:10 AM
Allow me to clear a few misunderstandings.

I am not 27. I merely put the year 1980 just in case the site would not allow me in because of age limits, and I was too lazy to calculate the proper age.

Second, those facts are wrong.
It is a known fact that the prophet Mohammed never disposed of his enemies. EVER.
Even the very tribe that had bashed him right and left in his childhood he let live. After capturing Mecca he stood infront of the Ka'ba and said to the people of Mecca, "Go, you are free.".
And not one of them did he kill.

A woman hired a man to kill his uncle ( I can't remember the names at this moment, but if I do, I will be sure to mention them). After the dee was done, and the prophet's uncle was killed in the middle of a battle by this man, the woman tasted of his blood, and it is said that she made a cup out of his (I'm not sure) skull, or some organ.
When the prophet finally met her, he refused to look her in the eye. but he never eventried to harm her.

There are more facts suggexting agianst your searches. But at least you tried. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

And I am 16, by the way. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 08:11 AM
Allow me to clear a few misunderstandings.

I am not 27. I merely put the year 1980 just in case the site would not allow me in because of age limits, and I was too lazy to calculate the proper age.

Second, those facts are wrong.
It is a known fact that the prophet Mohammed never disposed of his enemies. EVER.
Even the very tribe that had bashed him right and left in his childhood he let live. After capturing Mecca he stood infront of the Ka'ba and said to the people of Mecca, "Go, you are free.".
And not one of them did he kill.

A woman hired a man to kill his uncle ( I can't remember the names at this moment, but if I do, I will be sure to mention them). After the dee was done, and the prophet's uncle was killed in the middle of a battle by this man, the woman tasted of his blood, and it is said that she made a cup out of his (I'm not sure) skull, or some organ.
When the prophet finally met her, he refused to look her in the eye. But he never even tried to harm her.

There are more facts suggexting agianst your searches. But at least you tried. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

And I am 16, by the way. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 08:12 AM
I didn't say they were right, I just said "I found these".

What are you talking about you put the year to 1980?

Edit:

The Assassins
Origins of the Nizari Isma'ilis
(1) The Schism in Islam

"...in the year the Christian calendar calls AD 632, a schism even greater than the Reformation was to produce engulfed Islam. Its two great forces, the Sunnis and the Shi'ites, became irrevocably divided. The Shi'ites insisted that the leadership of Islam should have remained in the Prophet's family and, upon his death, they had pledged their support to Mohammed's cousin, Ali, who became Caliph or successor to the Prophet."
- Gordon Thomas, Journey into Madness

"...Legend has it that Mohammed's son-in-law Sidina 'Ali, the ideal warrior, once became so caught up in the frenzy of killing that he began to kill his own people after finishing off the enemy. His frenzy had to be cooled down before he could stop."
- An Encyclopedia of Archetypal Symbolism

Ali was murdered in AD 661. But, in the Shi'ite theology, Ali and his descendants were Imams - divinely guided leaders and mediators between God and Man, Christ-like figures on earth. There were twelve Imams before the last disappeared in AD 940. It is a fundamental Shi'ite belief that he is hiding in one of the vast Arabian deserts, awaiting the right moment to re-emerge and establish a purified Islamic government of justice...The Imam, on his return, would launch a jihad, a holy war, more violent than any before fought over the centuries by his Shi'ite disciples."
- Gordon Thomas, Journey into Madness

"One of the most successful secret societies which the Shi'as founded was centered around the Abode of Learning in Cairo, which was the training-ground for fanatics who were conditioned by the most cunning methods to believe in a special divine mission. In order to do this, the original democratic Islamic ideas had to be overcome by skilled teachers, acting under the orders of the Caliph of the Fatimites, who ruled Egypt at that time."
- Arkon Daraul, Secret Societies

"The fundamental doctrine of the Shi'a is based upon the ta'lim, or authorized teaching. The imam was responsible for this teaching, from which no deviation at all was possible. This is the basis of the authority of the Shiite imams, and informs their role as descendants of Ali..."
"The essential division between Shi'a and Sunni is based upon the dispute between the mutually exclusive notions that authority may be explained by ta'lim or that it may be explained by means of reason and analogy."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam

"Much of the well-known mystical symbolism of Sufism, often best known through the Rubaiyyat of Omar Khayyam, was taken over by the Isma'ilis. They joined Sufism and Shiism in a peculiar and unique blend, often appearing as a particular group of Sufis with their own Shaykh....It would not..be surprising if the use of hashish and other drugs for achieving mystical ecstasy was also carried over from the Sufis."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam



(2) Old Man of the Mountains

In 1074 "the Armenian general Badr al-Jamali traveled with his army from Syria to Cairo and took effective control. From that moment, the power of the caliph was extremely limited and the real ruler of the state was the commander-in-chief of the army. the last caliphs were little more than figureheads."
"On the death of the Caliph al-Mustansir in 1094, the new commander opposed the Caliph's own designation of his son Nizar as caliph and placed Nizar's brother al-Musta'li on the throne....The Isma'ilis in the East [Persia] refused to acknowledge al-Musta'li and broke off relations with the dynasty in Cairo."
"The dissenting group proclaimed their allegiance to the by-passed Caliph Nizar, and it is for this reason that members of the sect which became known to history as The Assassins were first known as the Nizari Isma'ilis."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam

"'Assasseen' in Arabic signifies 'guardians', and some commentators have considered this to be the true origin of the word: 'guardians of the secrets'."
- Arkon Daraul, Secret Societies

"Hasan-i Sabbah was a revolutionary of genius who devised and put into practice the 'new' preaching or da'wa of the Nizari Isma'ilis, which was to replace the 'old' da'wa of the Fatimid Isma'ilis at Cairo.....It is likely that he was born around 1060 in Qom, one-hundred-and-fifty kilometers south of modern Tehran."
"He had a fine mind, an excellent knowledge of theology, and evidently possessed the phenomenal strength of will necessary to pursue his ideal for so many years....We can imagine him converting the people of Daylam just as he had himself been converted, by patiently digging away at a potential proselyte's religious doubts until they were strong enough to admit the possibility of an alternative."
"Hasan-i Sabbah had managed through careful theological argument and relentless logic applied to the Shi'a doctrines, to create a powerful sectarian sense of community based on the traditional secrecy and conspiratorial nature of Isma'ilism."

"The Alborz Mountains, which rise to a maximum height of over six-thousand meters in the volcanic Mount Damavand, constitute a natural barrier between the Caspian and the vast gently tilting plateau which constitutes Central Iran. Although not distant as the crow field from Tehran, this mountainous area has always been and still is remote. It was presumably for this reason that many shi-ite sects and fleeing Isma'ilis and other Moslem heretics had...for many centuries taken refuge in the mountain kingdom of ancient Daylam."
Within a high mountain valley stands "the castle of Alamut, the fortress retreat of Hasan-i Sabbah, which became almost legendary after the supposed 1273 visit of Marco Polo and his description of the 'Old Man of the mountains' and the 'Ashishin'..."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam

"The Old Man kept at his court such boys of twelve years old as seemed to him destined to become courageous men. When the Old Man sent them into the garden in groups of four, ten or twenty, he game them hashish to drink [sic]. They slept for three days, then they were carried sleeping into the garden where he had them awakened.
"When these young men woke, and found themselves in the garden with all these marvelous things, they truly believed themselves to be in paradise. And these damsels were always with them in songs and great entertainments; they; received everything they asked for, so that they would never have left that garden of their own will."
And when the Old Man wished to kill someone, he would take him and say: 'Go and do this thing. I do this because I want to make you return to paradise'. And the assassins go and perform the deed willingly."
- Marco Polo - on his visit to Alamut in 1273

"That Hasan-i Sabbah and other early Assassin Masters had gardens seems likely since the garden is such an important part of Persian noble life and of mysticism. The water channels and meticulous care to ensure regular water supplies at Assassin castles echo the care which Persian and Arab villages and country houses today give to the presence of running water. So the legend of the garden in which Assassins were taken probably has its origins in fact."
"Many scholars have argued, and demonstrated convincingly, that the attribution of the epithet 'hashish eaters' or 'hashish takers' is a misnomer derived from enemies the Isma'ilis and was never used by Moslem chroniclers or sources. It was therefore used in a pejorative sense of 'enemies' or 'disreputable people'. This sense of the term survived into modern times with the common Egyptian usage of the term Hashasheen in the 1930s to mean simply 'noisy or riotous'. It is unlikely that the austere Hasan-i Sabbah indulged personally in drug taking."
"There is no mention of that drug [hashish] in connection with the Persian Assassins - especially in the library of Alamut ('the secret archives')."

"Once established in a secure and permanent base, Hasan sent da'is [missionaries] out from Alamut in all directions, At the same time he pursued a policy of territorial expansion, taking castles either by means of propaganda or by force, ad building others....Life at Alamut, and we may suppose in the other fortresses at this time, was characterized by extreme asceticism and severity."
"Political assassination was not unknown in Islam before Hasan-i Sabbah. Earlier sects had used murder as a political technique, and there is evidence that Mohammed himself disposed of his enemies by suggesting that they did not deserve to live - and hoping that faithful followers would take the hint. There had even been an extremist Shiite group known as the 'stranglers' after their preferred method of assassination."
The word assassin "definitely entered the literary vocabulary when it was used by Dante." In The Divine Comedy: Hell, Book XIX, "Dante describes himself as 'like a friar who is confessing the wicked assassin':

'Io stava come il frate che confessa
Lo perfido assassin...'
"Here the strongest possible noun is required since the criminal being confessed is being buried alive head down, thus denoting a sin of particular horror. The connection of assassin with wickedness reinforces the clarity and precision with which Dante used the word, and it was in this sense that 'assassin' then passed into other European languages."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam



(3) Fate of the Isma'ilis

"After the destruction of Alamut by Hulegu in 1256, many members of the Nizari Isma'ili sect are thought to have fled to Afghanistan, the Himalayas and above all Sind....Several of them had traveled to India as early as the eleventh century, but the founder of the branch of the sect known as the Bohras was probably a certain Abdullah who traveled from the Yemen and arrived in Cambay in about 1067. He traveled and reached extensively in the province of Gujerat, where still today the Bohras are a powerful and secretive presence.
"The other major branch of the Isma'ilis in the East today are known as the Khojas, who are particularly strong in what was once the Punjab but is now part of Pakistan. Their tradition relates that a missionary known as Nu Satagut, which means literally 'teacher of true light', was the first to arrive in India. He is thought to have traveled to north-western India some time between 116 and 1242. It was the Khoja sect which descended directly from the Nizari Isma'ilis or Assassins, and on whose support the Aga Khan's leadership of the Isma'ilis today is based."
"The present Aga Khan, correctly known as Prince Karim El Husseni, Aga Khan IV, is recognized as the forty-ninth hereditary imam of the Isma'ilis and claims direct descent from the Prophet Mohammed. He is recognized as head of the world-wide Isma'ili sect, today estimated at between four and twenty million in number. His income from voluntary contributions was estimated by Mihir Bose [The Agha Khans] in 1985 to be seventy-five million pounds a year."

"The theology and politics of the revolutionary of genius Hasan-i Sabbah can in fact be seen as the first original creation - both religious and political - of a specifically Persian ethos after the conquest of the country of the Arabs and consequent conversion to Islam. In this wider sense the thought and doctrines of the inventor of the 'Assassins' may be said to have an enduring influence in the religious and political life of the Middle East. This legacy is shared both the Aga Khans and by contemporary revolutionary groups in Lebanon and Persia."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam



The Secret Doctrines of the Assassins
(1) Schools of Thought

"The real problem of the Isma'ilis in general, and the Nizari Isma'ilis or Assassins in particular, is that they were always considered heretical and persecuted by official Islam, except for the period in which Isma'ilism was the official religion under the Fatimid caliphs of Egypt. The consequence of this is that no comprehensive formula of the Assassins' creed was ever generally recognized. Their doctrines were maintained in secrecy by the Assassins themselves, while their enemies were content to dismiss them as heretical without studying or reporting them."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam

Hasan-i Sabbah "prevented ordinary persons from delving into knowledge; and likewise the elite from investigating former books, except those who knew the circumstances of each book and the rank of the authors in every field. With his partisans, in theology he did not go beyond saying, our god is the god of Mohammed."
- Shaharastani

"Islam is not a messianic religion and has no room for a saviour-messiah. Nevertheless, there gradually developed--probably under Christian influence--the notion of an eschatological restorer of the faith, identified as a descendant of the Prophet or as the returning 'Isa (i.e., Jesus). He is usually referred to as the mahdi; i.e., the '[divinely] guided one'. After the appearance of 'Isa, the last judgment will begin: the good will enter paradise; the evil will fall into hell. Heaven and hell possess various goals and steps of recompense for good and evil. The time before the end is viewed pessimistically: God himself will abandon the godless world. Ka'bah (the great pilgrimage sanctuary of the Muslim world) will vanish, the copies of the Qur'an will become empty paper, and its words will disappear from memory. Then the end will draw near."
- Encyclopaedia Britannica

"In the Koran Jesus is mentioned no less than thirty-five times, under a number of impressive appellations - including 'Messenger of God' and 'Messiah'. At no point, however, is he regarded as anything other than a mortal prophet, a forerunner of Mohammed and a spokesman for the single supreme God. And like Basilides and Mani, the Koran maintains that Jesus did not die on the cross, 'they did not kill him, nor did they crucify him, but they thought that did.' The Koran itself does not elaborate on this ambiguous statement, but Islamic commentators do. According to most of them, there was a substitute - generally, though not always, supposed to have been Simon of Cyrene. Certain Muslim writers speak of Jesus hiding in a niche of a wall and watching the Crucifixion of a surrogate as is described in the Nag Hammadi Scrolls."
- Baigent, Leigh & Lincoln, The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail

The doctrine of rebirth, or more correctly transmigration was "widely accepted in Persia, and evolved in the particular Moslem form of belief in the Mahdi, the 'one guided by God to the truth'. The Isma'ili version of these ideas consisted of two schools of though: first, a belief in Ismail himself as immortal, and consequently that he is the Mahdi; second, some believed that Mohammed, son of Ismail, was the Mahdi who would not die until he had conquered the world.
"The Druzes accept reincarnation as one of the chief distinguishing principles of their religion: their founder and apostle Hakim is held to have possessed the soul of the twelfth imam, and it is from this fact that his authority derives. Druzes, about whom we have more information that the Assassins and whose doctrines are usually almost identical, believe that all human souls were created together and that their number is fixed...Souls progress though a series of transmigrations to a higher degree of excellence."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam



(2) Haqa'iq - The Esoteric Truths

"The religious revolution of man was considered to have taken place in seven years under seven Messenger Prophets, the firs six of whom were Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Mohammed. Each of these messengers revealed a religious law in esoteric form, which was readily interpreted even by the uninitiated: this is the zahir or external aspect. But each of these messages also contained an inner, esoteric truth which required interpretation by the small number of initiates capable of receiving them: this the batin, or esoteric truth.
The esoteric truths themselves, haqa'iq, were explained by a successor of each of the Messenger Prophets known as the wasi (Legates) or by the sami (Silent One) whose task was to explain the batin of the Scriptures and Law. Each Legate was in turn followed by a series of seven imams, the seventh of whom became the next messenger Prophet in the series. The last era would be marked by the Mahdi, who would make the inner doctrine public and inaugurate an era of pure spiritual knowledge.
"Isma'ili theology was thus revelationary in character. The haqa'iq transcended human reason and ultimately derived from gnostic doctrines, considering the principles of spiritual and physical worlds in Neoplatonic terms. The Gnostics held that the physical world had been created by an inferior deity, the Yahweh of the Old Testament, who was allowed a certain lassitude until God decided to send His son to inhabit the body of Jesus and free the world from false teachings. Certain Gnostic notions passed into Islam when Mohammed adopted the gnostic idea that the body which was crucified was only a phantom which the Jews and Romans could not harm."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam

"The heart of the Isma'ili haqa'iq, which consists in their denial of rationalism and forms the basis of their 'heresy', lies in the denial that God is the first cause. For them, the first cause of the Order or Word of God, which became united with the Universal Intellect. Hence the idea of the Order is at the heart of their esoteric doctrines, and achieves their synthesis of Neoplatonic philosophy and Islam."
"The power of Hasan-i Sabbah himself, and the fanatical devotion of the fida'i, ultimately derived from this categorical insistence on the transcendental nature of God. Such an absolute God, and absolute imam, demands absolute faith and obedience."

Group A: descended from Ali and Nizar
1 Imam
Group B: fully initiated
2 Da'i 'd-Du'at (Cheif Da'i)
3 Du'i 'l-Kabir (Superior Da'i)
4 Du'i (ordinary Da'i)
Group C: partly initiated
5 Rafiq (comrade)
Group D: uninitiated
6 Lasiq (adherent)
7 Fida'i (self -sacrificer, self-devoted ones, the destroying angels)
"Although the details of the stages of initiation...derive from a historian writing around 1332 about the Druzes....the major difference is that the degrees have...been increased from seven to nine, perhaps to agree with the nine celestial spheres."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam



(3) The Nine Degrees

"Members were enrolled, on the understanding that they were to receive hidden power and timeless wisdom which would enable them to become as important in life as some of the teachers."
"Students had to pass through nine degrees of initiation.

First Degree.
"In the first, the teachers threw their pupils into a state of doubt about all conventional ideas, religious and political. They used false analogy and every other device of argument to make the aspirant believe that what he had been taught by his previous mentors was prejudiced and capable of being challenged. The effect of this, according to the Arab historian, Makrizi, was to cause him to lean upon the personality of the teachers, as the only possible source of the proper interpretation of facts. At the same time, the teachers hinted continually that formal knowledge was merely the cloak for hidden, inner and powerful truth, whose secret would be imparted when the youth was ready to receive it. This 'confusion technique' was carried out until the student reached the stage where he was prepared to swear a vow of blind allegiance to one or other of his teachers."

Second Degree
"The neophyte is taught to believe that God's approval cannot be won by observing the prescriptions of Islam, unless the inner Doctrine, of which they are mere symbols, be received from the Imam to whom its guardianship has been entrusted.

Third Degree
"The neophyte is instructed as to the nature and number of the Imams, and is taught to recognize the significance in the spiritual and material worlds of the number Seven which they also represent. He is thus definitely detached from the Imamiyya of the Sect of the Twelve, and is taught to regard the last six of their imams as persons devoid of spiritual knowledge and unworthy of reverence.

Fourth Degree
"The neophyte is now taught the doctrine of the Seven Prophetic Periods, of the nature of the Natiq, the Sus or Asas and the remaining six Samits ('Silent' imams) who succeed the latter, and of the abrogation by each Natiq of the religion of his predecessor. This teaching involves the admission (which definitely places the proselyte outside the pale of Islam) that Mohammed was not the last of the Prophets, and that the Qur'an is not God's final revelation to man. With Mohammed b. Isma'ili, the Seventh and Last Natiq, the Qu'im ('He who ariseth'), the Sahibu 'i-Amr ('Master of the Matter'), an end is put to the 'Sciences of the Ancients' (Ulumu 'l-awwalin), and the Esoteric (Batini) Doctrine, the Science of Allegorical Interpretation (Ta'wil), is inaugurated.

Fifth Degree
"Here the proselyte is further instructed in the Science of Numbers and in the application of the ta'wil, so that he discards many of the traditions, learns to speak contemptuously of the state of Religion, pays less and less heed to the letter of Scripture, and looks forward to the abolition of all outward observances of Islam. He is also taught the significance of the number Twelve, and the recognition of the twelve Hujjas or 'Proofs', who primarily conduct the propaganda of each Imam. These are typified in man's body by the twelve dorsal vertebrae, while the seven cervical vertebrae represent the Seven Prophets and the Seven Imams of each.

Sixth Degree
"Here the proselyte is taught the allegorical meaning of the rites and obligations of Islam, such as prayer, alms, pilgrimage, fasting, and the like, and is then persuaded that their outward observance is a matter of no importance, and may be abandoned, since they were only instituted by wise and philosophical lawgivers as a check to restrain the vulgar and unenlightened herd.

Seventh Degree
"To this and the following degrees only the leading da'is, who fully comprehend the real nature and aim of their doctrine, cHospian initiate. At this point is introduced the dualistic doctrine of the Pre-existent and the Subsequent, which is destined ultimately to undermine the proselyte's belief in the Doctrine of the Divine Unity.

Eight Degree
"Here the doctrine last mentioned is developed and applied, and the proselyte is taught that above the Pre-existent and the Subsequent is a Being who has neither name, nor attribute, of whom nothing can be predicted, and to whom no worship can be rendered. This Nameless Being seems to represent the Zerwan Akanana ('Boundless Time') of the Zoroastrian system, but...some confusion exists here, and different teachings were current amongst the Isma'ilis, which, however, agreed in this, that, to quote Nuwayri's expression, 'those who adopted them could no longer be reckoned otherwise than amongst the Dualists and Materialists'. The proselyte is also taught that a Prophet is known as such not by miracles, but by his ability to construct and impose in a kind of system at once political, social, religious, and philosophical...He is further taught to understand allegorically the end of the world, the Resurrection, Future Rewards and Punishments, and other eschatological doctrines.
- Arkon Daraul, Secret Societies

Ninth Degree
"In this, the last degree of initiation, every vestige of dogmatic religion has been practically cast aside, and the initiate is become a philosopher pure and simple, free to adopt such system or admixture as may be most to his taste."
- Edward Granville. Brown, in St Bart's Hospital Journal (March 1897)

"The seventh degree brought revelation of the Great secret: that all humanity and all creation were one and every single thing was a part of the whole, which included the creative and destructive power. But, as an Ismaili, the individual could make use of the power which was ready to be awakened within him, and overcome those who knew nothing of the immense potential of the rest of humanity. This power came through the aid of the mysterious power called the Lord of the Time."
"To quality for the eighth degree, the aspirant had to believe that all religion, philosophy and the like were fraudulent. All that mattered was the individual, who could attain fulfillment only through servitude to the greatest developed power - the Imam. The ninth and last degree brought the revelation of the secret that there was no such thing as belief: all that mattered was action. And the only possessor of the reasons for carrying out any action was the chief of the sect."
- Arkon Daraul, Secret Societies

"Know that the soul, the devil, the angel are not realities outside of you: you are they. Likewise, Heaven, Earth, and the Throne are not outside of you, nor paradise nor hell, nor death nor life. They exist in you; when you have accomplished the mystical journey and have become pure you will become conscious of that."
- Najmoddin Kobra, 13th C. Sufi Philosopher

"The message is that we are God and (our) creation. With the gift of free will each individual can put wings upon the serpent of his basest nature, his selfish self, elevating it, transforming a static vacuum, a black hole of endless desires and greed, into a blazing star-that emblem of beauty and truth the Magi followed, appropriately, in search of a perfected being."
- Paul William Roberts, Journey of the Magi (1995) p. 313


The basis of these steps of graded knowledge was derived from the "Brethren of Sincerity".



(4) The Occult Tradition

"Khadhulu is the Arabic word meaning 'abandoner' or 'forsaker'...Khadhulu is a type of spiritual force that powers the practices of Tafrid and Tajrid. These are exercises that are used to transcend (abandon) normal cultural programming. The idea is that by transcending (abandoning) Dogma and fixed beliefs a person can see reality as it is. Khadhulu is stimulated by the Nafs (breath or soul.) The stimulated 'abandoner' then causes the Hal or spiritual state. Khadhulu appears in the Quran (25:29)...The verse translates as 'Mankind, Shaitan is al khadhulu'. They have explained two orthodox interpretations of this verse to me the first is that Shaitan will abandon man. The other is that Shaitan causes men to forsake Islam and its culture. You'll note that this second interpretation is fairly consistent with the spiritual meaning the ancient Muqarribun give Khadhulu . (Obviously an orthodox Muslim would think Muqarribun practices Sinful.) This verse in the Quran is important because it links the 'abandoner' Khadhulu with Shaitan the Old Dragon, Lord af the Abyss."
- Parker Ryan, "The Necronomicon and Ancient Arab Magick"

"At least part of the veneration of Sinan was based on is well-attested powers of telepathy and clairvoyance, such as the cases reported by Abu Firas of him answering questions thought outside his window. Hasan-i Sabbah himself was renowned in his own day as an alchemist. That the Assassins engaged in what would now be described as occult practices seems therefore to be beyond doubt. The 'sciences' of alchemy and astrology were then part of philosophical studies."
- Edward Burman, The Assassins - Holy Killers of Islam

"From the Ismalils the Crusaders borrowed the conception which led to the formation of all the secret societies, religious and secular, of Europe. The institutions of Templars and Hospitallers; the Society of Jesus, founded by Ignatius Loyola, composed by a body of men whose devotion to their cause can hardly be surpassed in our time; the ferocious Dominicans. the milder Franciscans - may all be traced either to Cairo or to Alamut. The Knights Templar especially, with their system of grand masters, grand priors and religious devotees, and their degrees of initiation, bear the strongest analogy to the Eastern Ismailis."
- S. Ameer Ali

MarcAntonyy
11-21-2007, 08:16 AM
Originally posted by MarcAntonyy:
Forgive me for not reading the other posts (at work)

So hopefully this hasn't already been said, but with many people desiring more variety of killing methods I would like to suggest the 1st person projectile effect that Heavenly Sword had.

That would be killer to be able to fire an arrow from atop one of the towers or something and slow-motion lead it right into the back of the guy's head with a sweet animation.

That would feel Assassin like

That effect was my favorite part of playing Heavenly Sword


so i didn't feel like reading through all that kindergarten dribble, but does anyone else agree with this?

i absolutely feel that this would be a huge edition to this franchise

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 08:19 AM
Ugh... I never said that you said that they were right.
I was just telling you that they weren't, so don't use them in a future argument or something.

I put it as 1980 because the UK Assassin's site (at least) doesn't allow you in if you are under the age of 16.

I am not sure about the US site.

I was lazy at calculating what the exact date would be, even though I was only 15 at the time (yes, adding three for an Arab is a tough errand... >_> ), so I just typed in 1980.

Laziness is my friend.

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 08:22 AM
Originally posted by ScytheOfGrim:
Ugh... I never said that you said that they were right.
I was just telling you that they weren't, so don't use them in a future argument or something.

I put it as 1980 because the UK Assassin's site (at least) doesn't allow you in if you are under the age of 16.

I am not sure about the US site.

I was lazy at calculating what the exact date would be, even though I was only 15 at the time (yes, adding three for an Arab is a tough errand... >_&gthttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif, so I just typed in 1980.

Laziness is my friend.

Where are you from

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 08:28 AM
And why would that be...? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Oh, now I see that you copied that out of context, and it was not the Prophet Mohammed that was being mentioned. My bad.

I do not know so much about the hashashiyeen either, but I do know some of their beliefs thanks to previous forumers.

Trust me, I do not search the web to get knowledge... I prefer to ask my teachers questions that I know they will not be able to answer. xD
And that in itself is knowledge, the knowledge of the limits of the knowledge of my knowledge bearers.

Virtus_Vrtra
11-21-2007, 08:30 AM
oh sorry opticaly, when you kept saying assassins in the BEGINNING of the thread, i could have sworn you were talking about the ones during the crusades... in fact, you started this whole thing off becuase you were arguing against scythe on the poison issue, when he was talking about hashashiyeen and the like, then you jump into this news article bit when you obviously dont even know what the hell you're talking about in the first place. please just know a little something about what you're saying, and not use a google search as a means to counter someone's argument. try getting as close to the source of info as you can (such as a friend from syria? who KNOWS how to translate arabic to english... and perhaps has studied the crusades in syria for 15 years, moved to america and is now your professor?) just an FYI that kind of information is a bit more reliable kid...

BTOG46
11-21-2007, 08:32 AM
@ Opticaly
Try and take a bit more care when editing quotes, when you quoted Virtus_Vrtra, you made it seem as though I was saying it, and not him. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 08:33 AM
And I care why?

ScytheOfGrim

I don't know =D

Sorry BTOG46

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 08:41 AM
Sorry Opticaly, but the reason why I continued to argue was because it gets annoying when somebody pulls out "facts" in a counter-argument that he is either not sure of, or because he did not understand what the other was saying.
That's all...

Anyway... seeing as you asked... U.A.E.
Search it. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 08:47 AM
Abu Dhabi?

MiniAssasin
11-21-2007, 08:54 AM
what happened to this being a topic about the next two games

MarcAntonyy
11-21-2007, 09:03 AM
for the love of god children - either PM each other or open up an IM

get the F$@#! out of this thread!

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 09:04 AM
Originally posted by MarcAntonyy:
for the love of god children - either PM each other or open up an IM

get the F$@#! out of this thread!

No thanks budy =]

AirRon_2K7
11-21-2007, 09:13 AM
how much did I miss in one bath o.O

*sits down next to BTOG and the rest of the spectators xD*

*cough*united arab emirates*cough*

I'm not an Arab, so the UAE doesn't even deserve captial letter >_> http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif uae HAHAHAHAHA

Kidding ...

MiniAssasin
11-21-2007, 09:13 AM
get a life

ScytheOfGrim
11-21-2007, 09:19 AM
And I'm not from the uk, therefore it doesn't deserve capitals. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Abu Dhabi is correct. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

And yes, the tables have turned quite a bit in that... umm... "bath".

So I gues I can go back to being my usual sarcastic self... sad really... xD

Opticaly
11-21-2007, 09:32 AM
Originally posted by MiniAssasin:
get a life

Gimmie

Emery17
11-22-2007, 11:27 PM
Even though these guys are going to continue to talk about their issues with eachother..
It shouldn't stop other people who actually want to talk about game ideas. I really agree with alot of what you guys say about Having a day/Night cycle and a few more mission types. I also think they should make the things your character does a bit harder to do. I'd like to see it be more about timing your jumps right at the edge of the building and so if its too far you fall short and you've gotta find another way up or try again. And based on the way the writing looked I lean more toward it being set japan or somewhere in the orient. possibly with bows. even though some people don't agree because of the assassins clan or beliefs as time moves forward or to different parts of the world assassin's used different weapons. Mainly only the 3 Altiar already has would be used but to take out another archer before he notices you from farther away or to shoot some one down from atop a building to create a distraction. but you'd only have 1 shot because it would take longer to reload it so you'd likely switch to one of the other weapons. Just some thoughts.

bendukane
11-23-2007, 05:09 PM
It would be neat of course if there were night missions, and if the weather would change. Like rain and even sandstorms. Rival assassins that would attempt to pursue the same targets you are after. and if they get to one before you, your mission would be to hunt down the other assassins. Making the informants a little more mysterious. Maybe hanging out in a dark pub, or even a church confessional booth providing you with information. hell you could even make some templars informants. Having other side missions like protecting families against thugs. or even protecting a village like robin hood.

unnamedninja
11-23-2007, 07:42 PM
Probably been mentioned, but having a type of infinite mission mode would be cool. Remember in gta when you'd jump into a cop car or a taxi cab, press in the stick and suddenly you're doing a free mission?

Something like that would be cool, perhaps there would be some guy at the bureau who hands out contracts to you now and then which just detail a person who needs to be killed, and you have to wander around the area till you kill them. The investigation missions where you had to assassinate targets for your friends were the best! especially the ones with no time limit.

Also for freeplay assassinations you could get a minor bit of cash, which could be given to those annoying beggars or spent on food/extra knives or disguises.

FlowerOfAdun
11-28-2007, 09:03 PM
I hate Opticaly... A lot.

tonymd
11-28-2007, 11:20 PM
1. Would like to see the second game in a time period not too far from the Crusades.

2. Side-contracts is a great idea...much more involved and should unlock new abilities and new combos.

3. Weapon selection: there has to be a rationale for using a sword vs. a dagger vs. a hidden blade. A sword is stronger, but swings slower. Dagger is faster, but when faced with stronger enemies, you have a higher chance of being locked or even countered. Hidden dagger is for silent assassinations. In close corridors, a faster leaner weapon may help you string attacks better and dispose of your enemies quickly, vis-a-vis big fights when you need your sturdy sword. Other weapons should be available to Altair, but only as adjunct in side missions: a crossbow for a long-distance assassination from a rooftop, a fire-lit arrow to start a fire in a hay-stack and cause a diversion.

4. Night/Day cycles: while assassins have to perform their "terrorist" acts in day light, side missions can happen at night? Infiltrate an army camp and release all the horses? Posion a keey figure at night? infiltrate a castle and steal a map?

5. Clothing: should have the ability to disguise as a guard or a templar, etc...but only after finishing certain side quests...would add another angle to "social stealth"

6. At the time of assassination, there should be a context-sensitive interaction that would unleash a sequence similar to those seen in the cinematic trailers...if the right button is not pushed, you stand a chance for your jab to countered.

7. Higher difficulty can be made possible by making Altair's life shorter, allowing him to take only a certain number of hits...this will make each fight a heart-bounding experience...Higher level guards should be able to alternate attacking you much faster.

8. Offensive moves would have a smaller effect on guards with better armour...Shields?

9. Not all counters should be instant kills...some should decrease the health of your enemy. Instant kills happen when you have decreased your enemies strength substantially (countered once and injured them, and then countered them again---> dead) or when have a lower level guard ---> higher chance of your counter being lethal. This will make each fight much more interesting.

10. The getaway: Give the option of having safe houses where you change your clothes, have a character that you saved, open their door for you (sure is more realistic than hiding in a stack of hay)

12. Horse back chases with improved horseback combat?