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View Full Version : Invisible planes at shooting distance. Patch after patch... It's not only me



Tipo_Man
12-20-2005, 02:36 PM
Here we go again, new patch, new (invisible) planes.
Seems like Maddox team is not aware of the problem...

I dare to bump my post again.

Well some time ago I posted some pics of planes completely invisible at shooting ranges:
http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/63110913/m/5921060163/p/1

Unfortunately I still can not solve that problem, nor I'm sure it's not a bug in the game.
Now I post some more pics and a very simple mission
My request is:
Please, run the mission and immideately at the start press pause key and tell me do you see the same as me. I would much appreciate if you can post pics of "what you see".
Here is what I see:

Largest view:
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b128/TipoMan/View.gif

medium view (I think mine is set to 55degrees FOV):
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b128/TipoMan/View.gif

Closest view:
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b128/TipoMan/CloseView.gif


Please, give me some feedback, since this really stops me playing.

Here is a link to the mission:
http://tipoman.maddsites.com/visibility.mis

or simply copy-paste this in a some file with .mis extension ()


[MAIN]
MAP Moscow/load.ini
TIME 12.0
CloudType 0
CloudHeight 1000.0
player g0100
army 2
playerNum 0
[Wing]
r0100
r0101
r0102
g0100
[r0100]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.YAK_1
Fuel 3
weapons default
[r0100_Way]
NORMFLY 31395.76 77822.76 100.00 215.00 &0
NORMFLY 30919.55 78126.91 130.00 300.00 &0
NORMFLY 30725.05 78350.29 200.00 300.00 &0
[r0101]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.YAK_1B
Fuel 100
weapons default
[r0101_Way]
NORMFLY 31122.33 77837.56 130.00 165.00 &0
NORMFLY 30866.98 78265.65 160.00 300.00 &0
[r0102]
Planes 1
Skill 1
numberOn0 0
Class air.LAGG_3SERIES29
Fuel 100
weapons default
[r0102_Way]
NORMFLY 31024.88 77815.18 40.00 170.00 &0
NORMFLY 31143.54 78230.43 150.00 300.00 &0
[g0100]
Planes 1
Skill 1
Class air.BF_109F4
Fuel 100
weapons default
[g0100_Way]
NORMFLY 31982.08 77810.14 600.00 260.00 &0
NORMFLY 30776.81 78742.39 500.00 300.00 &0
[NStationary]
[Buildings]
[Bridge]
[House]

LEXX_Luthor
12-20-2005, 05:03 PM
Thanks TipoMan.

Paused, the planes cannot be seen, but in motion they can be. Its bad but not too bad. The planes are not very distant at all, being within LOD range, and FB has always had rendering problems with medium range small LODs and very inconsistent in distant LOD sizes for different planes (Bf-109 larger than Bf-110). The winter forest background cammos the tiny LOD planes, which are too darkly rendered in my opinion, but once you locate them and then Pause the game, you can see them with the game Paused -- for a while.

Buzzsaw-
12-20-2005, 05:55 PM
Salute

This is a very valid concern, and one which should be addressed.

Right now, the visibility of aircraft silhouetted against terrain similarly coloured as their camoflauge, is clearly problematic.

The closer an enemy aircraft, the easier it should be to see it, not the converse. Unfortunately in the game, it is often easier to see a plane at 6.0 distance, when it is a dot, than it is when it is much closer.

BoB needs to address this issue and to fix the visibility problems we have with IL-2/PF.

Ratsack
12-20-2005, 08:34 PM
Agree, Buzzsaw.

And it's not just incosistent LODs: it's broken LODs, too. Take the one-winged Spitfire, for example, or the invisible SBD.

The views need work.

Ratsack

LEXX_Luthor
12-20-2005, 09:13 PM
StrikeFighters does aircraft grafix best. For distant aircraft, they use small grafix friendly LODs that simply get smaller and smaller until they become a natural pixel in size without needing special "dots" (ie...high resolution lets you see aircraft shapes much farther away -- there simply are no artificial Dots). However, the LODs usually vanish before becoming very small but only because the default SF LOD range settings, among many other settings, are way overly conservative. There is no limit to the LOD display range that you can set, although the LODs become smaller than a pixel you will have harder and harder time seeing them, as it should be.

BfHeFwMe
12-20-2005, 10:21 PM
Why can't the user be allowed to set LOD distances? What's so difficult about putting an .ini setting to adjust? Most of us are running rigs that can hack it.

Steg.
12-20-2005, 10:59 PM
Not sure if this is the same problem as yours but anyway

A while back I had a problem with several aircraft types (FW190 being one of them) just disappearing off the screen between 1200m and 700m. The Icons would remain but the aircraft would vanish, even against empty sky. The aircraft would just blink out and in when they should have been plainly visible, these were not dots but aircraft close enough that I could identify make and markings on my 24" monitor.

I solved the problem by doing a clean install of the game from the disks, and scrapping the backup I had. It seems that at some time a file somewhere in the multiple patches I had done was corrupt some how, and the fresh install fixed this up.

If it is the same problem as I had, then it is next to impossible to play, as half the time when you are trying to set up for a gun run the other aircraft is not visible.

Anyway hope this helped, but at worst it will not hurt.

LEXX_Luthor
12-20-2005, 11:29 PM
Good point Steg, thanks. But, enough people have this problem reliably that the LOD system is porked.


Bf::
Why can't the user be allowed to set LOD distances? What's so difficult about putting an .ini setting to adjust? Most of us are running rigs that can hack it.


[AircraftData]
AircraftFullName=B-52D Stratofortress
AircraftDataFile=B-52D_data.ini
CockpitDataFile=A-4B_cockpit.ini
LoadoutFile=B-52D_loadout.ini

[LOD001]
Filename=B-52D.lod
Distance=1000

[LOD002]
Filename=B-52D_lod002.lod
Distance=2500

[LOD003]
Filename=B-52D_lod003.lod
Distance=5000

[LOD004]
Filename=B-52D_lod004.lod
Distance=10000

[LOD005]
Filename=B-52D_lod005.lod
<span class="ev_code_yellow">Distance=100000</span>

I bumped that 5th LOD up to 100km (default 16km), although by about 50km its so small it may as well be invisible even under high zoom view. The key is that under certain rare conditions (sunlight, cloud background, etc...) you can see a B-52 from 100 kilometers away -- without contrail, although contrail will, like an arrow, usually tell you where to look where you would otherwise never look.

For FB/PF, this Power in the hands of flight simmers would mean the return of the old Online LOD Distance Cheat. We can't allow that. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif StrikeFighters is mostly Offline sim, although if Oleg can *think* through this, he would make this a server setting, to prevent the Online LOD Distance Cheat while allowing Offline players to use the settings they prefer much like server people.

Tipo_Man
12-21-2005, 03:25 PM
Thanks for the feedback guys...

So it's not only me as I see. (or actually don't see http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif )

Well today I bought a new system with a new video card: Radeon X550.
I was much excited since I hoped I will solve this problem... but to my surprise the things are all the same...
The only semi-cure I've found so far setting the LandscapeDetails to Lowest. This makes forest disappear like this:
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b128/TipoMan/visible.gif

But should I play to lowest graphics settings just to be able to see planes at 500meters?

Is Oleg or team aware of this issue?
Can we have some feedback?

Jetbuff
12-21-2005, 06:25 PM
The visibility pecking order in FB has always been:

109/P-47/P-51/P-39/La-5/7: big blotches spotted from miles away
190/Spit/hurri/Lagg: Variable, sometimes you see them, sometimes you don't
Mig/I-16/yak: covered in invisipaint both at Dot distance and at the first few LOD models

I personally think that at least the dots should be the same for all fighter-sized planes, afterall, they were within a few meters of each other in wingspan. Hardly enough to make such a difference on how we see them on a 2D screen.

Good luck meanwhile on the camo issue. There is a powerful lobby who want to be invisible - possibly because they are flying the planes that actually benefit from this bug.

Pentallion
12-22-2005, 01:16 AM
And don't let people tell you that you can see the planes when moving. That's not true. What happens is peoples brains fill in the blanks so they see a plane as it goes invisible and if it doesn't turn and they are able to reacquire it fast enough, their brain tells them they "saw" it the entire time. But the still pics prove otherwise.

LEXX_Luthor
12-22-2005, 01:24 AM
Pent::
And don't let people tell you that you can see the planes when moving.
Aha, I was zoomed in when I unPaused the game and noticed that moving plane, so I may have been looking at a larger LOD than the zoomed out LOD TipoMan is talking about.

Tipo_Man
01-10-2006, 02:23 PM
Bump for my own thread...

No comments from the dev team ...nothing...

Are we doomed to be blind?

BfHeFwMe
01-10-2006, 08:22 PM
So your conclusion was an unlimited LOD Lex? Now why would you derive such a conclusion?

Why can't we be able to bypass the broken LOD's right out to the point of becomming a dot?

LOD_MAX = 1

Too much for the fan fare crowd to handle perhaps? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

CaptAce
01-10-2006, 09:34 PM
This problem can be really bad for me, especially on summer maps. I'll be tracking an enemy at distances sometimes less than 50 meters and often they just disapear.

I have the graphic settings up as high as they will go, in perfect mode. Has anyone found that messing around with ATI or in game settings helps this problem at all?

WWMaxGunz
01-10-2006, 10:06 PM
I've never had em dissapear at under, I guess 300 meters. Between 300 and 500-600 though
is yes. I've watched LOD's as I zoomed in and suddenly alakazam, presto, it's magic just
as I'm doing final lineup for the coup.

Answer for me is ICONS. With ICONS I can stay close until the target reappears and maybe
get that good shot for 1/4 to 1/2 second.

I'd still love to be able to keep sight as when the target jinks I can see the pitch and
bank as it begins to.

The Romulan Cloak Trick also completely destroys whatever immersion I might have had and
is worse than whatever was lacking in older FM's. I hope that Maddox Games will ever
realize this, that functional parts of a combat sim are really more important than pretty
models of cockpits. Situation Awareness is worth too much to handicap by ignoring what
the hardware is not capable of showing. And broken LOD's on top of that is like a very
bad joke when I'm wanting to play this. I'd rather see half or less the planes if that
is what it would take to get time spent on these view parts. Unfortunately it does seem
more that someone there has gone 'artsy' and screw what the rest of us think.

Once I've caught sight of another plane in the air any time I've been up, I've not lost
it. But then, I've never flown low in semi-haze over Vietnam or Cambodia as one poster
had written he'd lose sight of his wingmate. Somehow I don't see that applying to what
I see in any IL2 series. It's hard to FIND other planes usually but not once you have.
Once I have, I can make out details even at distance. Wings, etc, don't just dissapear.

Tater-SW-
01-10-2006, 10:48 PM
I had a P-38 disappear head on (I was diving) as he was shooting (and he hit me). I watched him disappear. Rather f-ed up my return fire.

tater

Deadmeat313
01-11-2006, 07:04 AM
I remember once following close on the tail of a Me-262 (I was in a YP-80) that had a cloaking device. It blinked out of existence perhaps 100 - 150m in front of me.

The aircraft was clearly visible against the sky in wide FOV but was invisible in gunsight FOV. Fortunately for me, the cloaking device could not hide the twin trails of smoke emerging from the engines so it was a kill nontheless. *

Its happened to me a couple of times with prop planes which is far more annoying. The planes simply disappear as if they€d entered a blind spot. Invisible against a clear sky.

I€ll try to get a screenie of the 262 scenario next time, as it looks cool. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

T.

Kuna15
01-11-2006, 08:48 AM
Originally posted by Pentallion:
And don't let people tell you that you can see the planes when moving. That's not true. What happens is peoples brains fill in the blanks so they see a plane as it goes invisible and if it doesn't turn and they are able to reacquire it fast enough, their brain tells them they "saw" it the entire time. But the still pics prove otherwise.

That is true.
I have that experience all the time.
Here is the track
p51c_vs_2xki84 (http://free-vk.t-com.hr/domagoj/tracks/offline/402__kunap51c_vs_2xki84.zip)
I shot down first Hayate and I tailed second one; he goes for a second beneath the nose of my aircraft and I lost him.
Now if he had choosen to run away on sea level he would most probably escaped but he has taken paralel course and I have spotted him.

LEXX_Luthor
01-11-2006, 09:15 AM
BfMeHeFw::
So your conclusion was an unlimited LOD Lex? Now why would you derive such a conclusion?

Why can't we be able to bypass the broken LOD's right out to the point of becomming a dot?

LOD_MAX = 1
I understand small pieces of your post Bf -- "lod, dot, lex, etc..." but I don't understand what the overall meaning is. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Another thing the invisible LODs and invisible Dots (at high resolution) kills in this sim is the ability to Bounce airplanes from a higher altitude, thus contradicting pilot accounts of the Bounce. For this, we must use Text Icons, and if we recall Patch 3.01, dozens of no-icon servers blossomed like spring flowers, only to wilt under Patch 3.02. Flying without Text Icons proved very popular and refreshing for the 2 weeks we spent under Patch 3.01.

BfHeFwMe
01-11-2006, 11:42 AM
Problem is text icons reveal to much information. Some don't wish to be spoon fed range, type, who the opponent is, or even which side he's on. Now if there was a one colored universal (*) type icon to mark where the Klingon Kloaker was, even that would be an improvement over the icons.

But running full, the most detailed, LOD out to 5Km where the last level turns to a dot would be best. 5Km's isn't that far, and using the zoom in gunsight view one could actually make an identification and look for markings and mark of friend and foe inbound. Can't be that dang hard or complex to do.

LEXX_Luthor
01-11-2006, 12:24 PM
Bf::
Now if there was a one colored universal (*) type icon to mark where the Klingon Kloaker was, even that would be an improvement over the icons.
Yes, Dots scaled to resolution would be the same thing as a universal (*) type icon, and be 100% realistic.

Think about it for a while.

(*)

WWMaxGunz
01-11-2006, 08:03 PM
Offline or MP Coop online/offline (Coop without connecting, you can use online console and
still have AI) and Icons are controllable using the console mp_dotrange command.

>mp_dotrange

followed by whichever apply:

friendly -- the rest of the command applies to friendly units icons
foe -- the rest applies to enemy icons
dot -- specifies to the range where the dot is seen
name -- the range where pilot name is seen
color -- range where icon turns friend or foe color
type -- range where aircraft type is seen
range -- range where range info is seen
id -- range where aircraft id is seen
DEFAULT -- restores icons to defaults

LEXX_Luthor
01-11-2006, 08:34 PM
We know, but....if I may borrow a popular slogan on the flight sim boards -- Oleg "porked" the mp_dotrange in Patch 3.02. It doesn't work to help people running at high resolutions. The dots are still a single pixel -- all the mp_dotrange does is let that one pixel stay a constant darkness for far greater ranges than it should, so we also lost apparent distance estimation by judging dot fadeout, in the Patch 3.02.

WWMaxGunz
01-11-2006, 10:41 PM
NP, I run at 1024x768 and have enough trouble with occasional low FPS.

BUT with ranges limited it does at least something to cover the target vanishing at 500m,
just before I fire on high-closure-rate B'n'Z's, or at least try to sometimes. At high
closure my shots have that extra bit of speed and impact to make it worth it from 400+m.

LEXX_Luthor
01-12-2006, 12:53 AM
mmm, I see. I run 1152x864 with my old ATI-9200, and I refuse to go lower and I refuse to use icons. I just Deal with it these Dots best I can (which means...I'm spending my simming time in StrikeFighters now hehe). Often, I just follow the AI wingpersons when they fly off on their own to attack something. My 9800Pro broke and I am not wasting money on another gamer video card anytime soon.

Another thing is the instant jump zoom controls. I often lose sight of LODs during the dogfight when I jump the zoom simply because the position on the screen changes instantly and you can't follow it like if the zoom was smoothly changed.

BfHeFwMe
01-12-2006, 08:01 PM
That's news to me, when did they patch it so the dots work less than 500 meters. They've never worked at ranges below 500.

Usually one knows the simple fundamentals first before discussing fix it solutions.

WWMaxGunz
01-13-2006, 05:16 AM
What I wrote is for control of ICONS not DOTS. Want reduced ICONS? That is how.

jimDG
01-13-2006, 07:46 AM
it also depends on your anti-aliasing settings at closer ranges. with a high-end video card and adaptive AA on - camo will actually work and planes would merge with the background quite well.

WWMaxGunz
01-13-2006, 02:49 PM
I had a GeForce2 and it was really bad. Now I have a GF5200FX and it's not as bad.
I can run 2xAA at most now. What's this about high-end cards? Low-end ain't so
good either and low-middle ain't so great but at least now I can run full range.

Triple_AA
01-14-2006, 02:47 PM
I have a 6800 Ultra and it's bad. It was bad with a 5900 Ultra as well. So bad that last night I gave up battling Spitfires that went completly invisible when against the ground. I can't fight what I can't see.

Oh, and don't over emphasize the camo scemes. That ones getting old. World war 2 camo wasn't that good! Hell I sit on a mountain (more a foot hill) near my home to watch the local air show. I'm about a mile from the action and sometimes slightly above and I have no problem with disappearing camo'd air craft.


It's not the cards we use, it's not the dot range, It's the sim and the LOD's and the poor contrast between the planes and anything behind them.

It's FB's "Achilles Heel"

A shame too, because other flight sims, even an oldie like EAW didn't have the problem and since the problem has seemingly been ignored by Oleg, I'm betting BoB isn't going to be any better.

carguy_
01-14-2006, 04:49 PM
Originally posted by Triple_AA:
A shame too, because other flight sims, even an oldie like EAW didn't have the problem and since the problem has seemingly been ignored by Oleg, I'm betting BoB isn't going to be any better.


I don`t think you been following IL2 since 1.1b?As far as I remember Oleg responded to dot change requests few times,4.01 being the last change.

At first dots were black,just black.They were changing sizes on next patches until Oleg gave us a real option of having ugly but really more realistic dots.They were just black dots but so big that you could see them pretty well from above and they were very nicely visible from a distance.Formation escort was not a problem.I got to fly 6 online sorties even with 3.01.Dotrange was configurable too but people didn`t like it.

Oleg stated that really the majority,and a big majority wanted to have dots from 3.0.The possibility of configuring 3.01 dots has been throughoutly IGNORED.So we came back to old dots.4.01 introduced new dots with a bit of white.Like a dot is part white part black.It was a step forward from 3.0 but a HELLUVA BIG step back from 3.01.

In 3.01 overall perception of a full real pilot was greatly enhanced to an extent where dots weren`t such a big problem.

However,it seems people just cared about them looking ugly so they dumped it.

I have heard from a source which credibility I cannot prove,that something like 90% Russians wanted old dots.Numbers did matter in this case.Oleg forgot that they pirate 80% of the whole gaming market though. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Triple_AA
01-14-2006, 05:15 PM
Carguy_, No offence but as I said above

""it's not the dot range, It's the sim and the LOD's""

To clarify further, it's not the dots. Forget the frickin dots. The post isn't about the dot's. It's about the entire plane disappearing from one moment to the next when it's within 500 (0.31 mi) to 1000,(0.62 mi) 2000 (1.24 mi) meters.

We shouldn't have any difficulty at all seeing and even identifying a/c at theses distances.

It's an LOD or plane rendering problem inherant to FB.

If you don't have the problem then I envy you, and please know that you're in the minority.

carguy_
01-14-2006, 05:40 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/1072.gif

TooCooL34
01-14-2006, 06:04 PM
Dot is more than ok.
It is easier to see than in Aces High 2.
Dot is somewhat over-visible but LOD at close distance is under-visible.
People find opponents too easy at long long distance and ridiculously lose them at close distance. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
This is the problem.
My suggestion is occasional(maybe every 2 or 3 secs random?) small shimmering or glimmering effects.

Brain32
01-14-2006, 07:13 PM
Same problem here, everything OK, but when opponent dives(especially the case with SPit over forrest), it completely dissapears, I can only guess his flightpath...
I use 4xAA is that a problem?

LEXX_Luthor
01-14-2006, 08:51 PM
carguy::
I have heard from a source which credibility I cannot prove,that something like 90% Russians wanted old dots.Numbers did matter in this case.Oleg forgot that they pirate 80% of the whole gaming market though. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif
I am guessing that Russians are generally running older video cards than we over here in Ussia, and so they must be using less resolution. Oleg claimed that "real life" pilots said the "tiny" Dots were the most realistic. I figure that Oleg did not have them test the Dots at resolutions higher than 1024x768, which is what our Dots are made for, and no other resolution. The FB/PF Dots are made purely for 1024x768, and work well at that resolution, but no other.

The 3.01 Dots were never ugly -- that was a computer gamer webboard slogan -- but the default mp_dotrange was set too high which caused the 3.01 Dots to be far too large for simmers running low resolutions of 1024x768, and at 800x600 the situation is even worse -- BasketBall Dots they called them, and at those low gaming resolutions from last century, BasketBalls is what they looked like. Oleg did not make clear that the Dots can be easily changed with mp_dotrange. I was the first to try to educate the gamers here on how to use mp_dotrange, but you don't educate computer gamers. The "mp" is for multiplay and interestingly, we would be surprised at the number of Online multiplay computer dogfight aces wailing about "ugly" Dots that don't know this.


TripleAA::
""it's not the dot range, It's the sim and the LOD's""
Dots are the issue, not dot range, although the mp_dotrange control over the Dots was made somewhat worthless in Patch 3.02.

LODs are also an important issue. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

If you run high resolutions and don't want to use arcade Text Icons, then you will have Dot issues in addition to LOD issues which we all have and -- I think -- regardless of resolution (not sure about that).

When they say Dots are easy to see, ask them what monitor resolution they use. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

BadA1m
01-14-2006, 11:58 PM
I ran a couple of quicks with a 109 against the Spit and I found it VERY difficult to see against water / not so bad against land (still not great though). I suspect my 7800GTX running 4x 4x may be helping a little. I also noticed the wings kind of fizzling in and out at the transitions, kinda freaky. BTW, I'm using 1024x768 res. I may also be having less trouble since I tend to shoot inside of 500m. Just my couple 'o pennys
~S~

WWMaxGunz
01-15-2006, 03:12 AM
Perhaps Maddox Games generates the LOD's with a program. A nasty program made to cut the
parts on a 'shouldn't see' or 'always round down' basis regarded as realistic. Put into
the IL2 world though...

if it was really so then attack from above would have been attack from below. Book after
book and all air combat doctrines from even before WWII would be based on attack from
below where you are invisible. I read that DF is already that way. Congratulations to
whoever has engineered this reversal of the real through rhetoric based on reality.

Triple_AA
01-15-2006, 07:53 AM
Lexx_Luther. "Dots" have become the issue. The title of the post is

"Invisible planes at shooting distance. Is it only me?"

Dot's only became the issue when the "dotters" hijacked the post.

LEXX_Luthor
01-15-2006, 05:22 PM
Ya, I see your point TripleAA. We apologize, but the Dot Problem and the LOD Problem are both important issues and closely related -- visibility of aircraft.

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif If we Recall, every Dot thread is "hijacked" by posters claiming they can see Dots but can't see LODs. The reverse is generally not seen, and I think its because the LOD Problem is resolution independent -- all (or most) simmers agree on the LOD Problem, but the Dot Problem is extremely resolution sensitive, and the simmers that run very low resolutions are aware of the LOD Problem but are NOT aware of the Dot Problem, and they are very hostile and insulting to the "dotters" -- why I don't know, but I have a few guesses.

Anyways, yes I kinda forgot this was TipoMan's LOD thread. We are all into the LOD thing, the dotters and the low resolution players. Be Certain.

Triple_AA
01-15-2006, 09:34 PM
Very agree'd on both points.

I can only hope that Oleg see's both points and deals with them before BoB, or at the very least, makes sure the same two problems don't occur in BoB.

Fixing both will certainly reduce my frustration level to near zero!

~Salute!~

WWMaxGunz
01-15-2006, 10:30 PM
I've heard of Triple-A when I was in the service. Anti-Aircraft Artillery.

But what is Triple-AA?

jermin122
01-15-2006, 11:22 PM
I am also annoyed a lot by this problem. Sometimes in a 40 players server I fly for about 30 minutes but can hardly spot one aircraft. This problem make B&Z tatics totally unuseble cause it is very hard to spot an enemy 1000~3000m bellow you, especially when the mission is of low brightness.

F19_Ob
01-16-2006, 07:55 AM
The planes lod's are also different and some planes dissappear or wings vanish at 300-400m while others are still visible at 600-700m.

A few examples on planes that dissapear early are:
* Ki-61
* Seafire (wings dissappear at 300-400m )

Example on planes wich are visible longer is
* bf 109
* the other spits


I have fought seafires online and often lost sight of them in the dogfight because the wings dissappear and leaves a thin fuselage only at 300-400m.

The I-16 turns to a small dot at some distance (sorry can't remeber the distance) and it looks funny to see a dot fire at a bigger plane like a 109.

Hurricanes are nearly invisible at some distance and especially with a forrest as background.
But with the hurri its in a way ok because it's such an inferior plane in most situations anyway.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

II_JG1_Falke
01-17-2006, 08:14 AM
One thing, actually two things that I think would help with the invisible planes, or at least level the playing feild, would be to make the "Default" 109 skins use the lighter grey colors schemes with no yellow nose, (except for under the cowling) instead of the dark greens.

The other would be to ask Oleg to into the sims code and make all dot sizes the same, regardless of aircraft type.

LEXX_Luthor
01-17-2006, 08:45 AM
Hi Falke. One thing I have experimented with is massively brightening skins in a paint program, but that does not help Online simming if default skins are used. For Offline play, this works well, although it does nothing to help the vanishing aircraft LOD models.

Its Bad to make dot sizes the same, because even now, the multi-engine bomber Dots can be seen more easily than single-engine fighter Dots, and this is both realistic and useful in simulation of air warfare. Patch 3.01 showed the Dots can be easily fixed (and were fixed) for all flight simmers and all Online servers no matter the resolution they fly with. We don't have to ask Oleg to make dot sizes the same -- Oleg knows a better way to fix this, and we know he knows. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

II_JG1_Falke
01-17-2006, 06:15 PM
Bad? Maybe, maybe not.

Sure, If I were in charge, the bombers would have bigger dots then the fighters, and the fighters might be broken up further, with say a P-47 having a smaller dot then a bomber, but slightly larger dot than a 109, but I'm not in charge.

As it stands now, the 109 is the big boy on the block, even though it was a realitivly slim and small fighter, on par with the Spit at least, if not a "tad" smaller.

But what's the first plane you see in the midst of a dogfight involving several planes? Why the 109 of course, even if it's battling against P-38's!

As to the colors, you can see default skinned 109's against the ground as easy as can be. Change the colors to the lighter and darker gray pattern, and they become almost, key word "almost" as invisble as spits and hurry's.

Manwhile, if dot's can be changed, (and I know they won't be, unfortunately) then it should be done with common sense and balance.

Tipo_Man
01-25-2006, 10:21 AM
Well I think I can call this one "Let us Boom and Zoom"

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b128/TipoMan/VISIBLE9.gif

What is the need of new graphic dlls when you can't see your opponent at 500meters?!

SlickStick
01-25-2006, 11:55 AM
The most obvious ones I've seen have been mentioned, Seafire no wings, Mk. VIII one wing disappearing...etc. LODs are created during implementation of the 3D model into the game. These types of glitches are distinct errors in one level or more of each LOD. They have to fix them all individually, no?

I've also noticed a strange change in SHVAK tracers. Like they are only there once every few seconds. Is that considered a bug or a fix? Did they change the ammo belt for SHVAKS?

WWMaxGunz
01-25-2006, 01:47 PM
Originally posted by SlickStick:
They have to fix them all individually, no?


No. They need to change the LOD generator and cut down the roundoff.
Then run out a new set of LOD's for all planes.

SlickStick
01-25-2006, 02:40 PM
Why does it only effect certain planes then? I thought each plane's LODs were unique to each 3D model and what was actually modeled by the artist as to how much was seen at each. I might be confusing damage levels though, sorry about that.

WWMaxGunz
01-25-2006, 10:31 PM
I sure hope it's not by 'individual taste'. That would be 'unfair'.
Perhaps that would better explain since the first demo the 109's vs P-39's and others LOD's.

Parts could be dissapearing on the basis of seperate 3D components rounding down to zero.
A wing with many parts could calculate as width = 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0
It depends on the method used if a program is used.

However even if the LOD's are by hand now, a fix could be done by a program that uses the
3D models and would run well under 1 minute. Or fix the program used and it would run......

Tipo_Man
01-31-2006, 09:05 AM
So many new planes,but

Are they going to be visible

or you simply added new text icons for them?

I'm ironic sorry, but these invisible planes really hurt my eyes...

Tipo_Man
02-27-2006, 04:14 AM
BUMP http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/touche.gif

Buzzsaw-
02-27-2006, 09:09 AM
Should be addressed

Vike
01-17-2007, 09:44 AM
Originally posted by Buzzsaw-:
Should be addressed

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif BUMP http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

...For the 4.08m<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://vike01.free.fr/images/avatars/signIL2.jpg
- AthlonXP 2400Mhz + 1024MB DDR CL 2.0
- Radeon 9800XT 460/790Mhz
- Saitek X-52 + Track IR 4 Pro
- Aka JV69_Vike http://vike01.free.fr/images/avatars/jv69.jpg

DKoor
01-17-2007, 10:12 AM
Originally posted by Tipo_Man:
So many new planes,but

Are they going to be visible

or you simply added new text icons for them?

I'm ironic sorry, but these invisible planes really hurt my eyes... +1

Oleg please we need a fix here...http://mission4today.com/images/smiles/3_9_3.gif so that the game becomes even more enjoyable for us!<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

<hr class="ev_code_hr" />http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/5638/g14hartmannlh1.jpg (http://airwarfare.com/mediawiki-1.4.5/index.php?title=Main_Page)<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">@ STURMOVIK?: 1946 - coming November 2006 in ETO and Australia

slipBall
01-17-2007, 10:28 AM
When a aircraft turns on his nav lights, they are seen very well...can't some of that code be used to make the aircraft more visable...or possibly give aircraft skins better sun light reflective qualities...this area needs to be fixed for sow<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f394/SlipBall/orders.jpg

russ.nl
01-17-2007, 11:07 AM
I have the same problem, that the disappearing of some planes at a surten distance.

The last patch made it even worse with more planes disappearing. It also seems that it only happens to a fixed number of planes, I know I don't have to try and dogfight a me262 because it disappears in a window of about 500 to 700 m distance and it is not the only that plane I have the problem with. At first I thought it was my graphics card so I changed my 9600pro/256mb for a fx5700/256mb but the problem stayed.

It seems for me that the problem is from the last couple of patches.

Please fix this.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

PH-Valken@HP
http://xs411.xs.to/xs411/07010/banneruss2.png (http://xs.to)

RegRag1977
01-17-2007, 12:38 PM
Originally posted by DKoor:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tipo_Man:
So many new planes,but

Are they going to be visible

or you simply added new text icons for them?

I'm ironic sorry, but these invisible planes really hurt my eyes... +1

Oleg please we need a fix here...http://mission4today.com/images/smiles/3_9_3.gif so that the game becomes even more enjoyable for us! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes!<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

Regards!

Mysha76
01-17-2007, 04:26 PM
BUMP!