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darkhorizon11
12-27-2004, 11:44 AM
I just had to mention the Tragedy in SE Asia and give my condolences to anyone in the community directly associated with the disaster.

Last I checked the toll was 22500 dead and many more missing. Hopefully we can learn from this tragedy get some better warning for future quakes like this.

Scientists are worried that the quake was so powerful it may have shifted the earth's orbit around the sun, go figure...

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

tsisqua
12-27-2004, 12:25 PM
I just went to msn.com , and saw some of the video. Absolutely tragic.

My heart goes out to all there.

Tsisqua

p1ngu666
12-27-2004, 12:39 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

woofiedog
12-27-2004, 01:08 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif My Prayer's go out to the People of this Tragic Event.
My Local Salvation Army and Red Cross will be getting a Donation earmarked for the Families in these area's.
Again to any of Our Forum Family affected by this... My Family's Full Prayer's & Hope's that You May Put Your Life's Back Togeather Some How!
God Bless!

LStarosta
12-27-2004, 01:27 PM
Over 23,000 killed. That is unheard of in modern times for so many lives to be lost nearly all at once.

T_O_A_D
12-27-2004, 01:47 PM
Yes quite a shame in todays time, and technology.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Cajun76
12-27-2004, 02:05 PM
Our thoughts and prayers go out to the victims and survivors. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Friendly_flyer
12-27-2004, 02:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by T_O_A_D:
Yes quite a shame in todays time, and technology.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm afraid there is very little modern technology can do when Mother Earth flexes her muscles. No gadget can help you when you are crushed by tons and tons of water, or are flushed out into the sea.

What really bugs me is the "some hundred" Somalians that are reported dead. The Somalians have had ample time to prepare. Even a casual look at the map would tell the tsunami was on its way. They had at least a full days warning. And yet, three villages washed into the sea, and it was something that could be done about it!

HansKnappstick
12-27-2004, 02:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by darkhorizon11:
I just had to mention the Tragedy in SE Asia and give my condolences to anyone in the community directly associated with the disaster.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yes this is very sad. My prayers are with the deceased but more so with the survivors who will have a hard time rebuilding their countries while mourning their dead.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Last I checked the toll was 22500 dead and many more missing. Hopefully we can learn from this tragedy get some better warning for future quakes like this.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
there can be no warning for such an event. Unless you count the forecast "this place will shake badly within the next 200 years", in which case we should evacuate the whole San Francisco area today.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Scientists are worried that the quake was so powerful it may have shifted the earth's orbit around the sun, go figure...

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Could you please provide a quotation for these "scientists" please?

berg417448
12-27-2004, 03:05 PM
He may be referring to this quote from several news sources:


"All the planet is vibrating" from the quake, said Enzo Boschi, the head of Italy's National Geophysics Institute. Speaking on SKY TG24 TV, Boschi said the quake even disturbed the Earth's rotation."


No actual proof has been provided as far as I have found so far.

Friendly_flyer
12-27-2004, 03:13 PM
Notice that the Earths rotation and orbit are not the same thing. Any influence on the rotation will be relative to a landbound observers point-of-view. The rotation itself can only be affected by external forces (Newton).

Bearcat99
12-27-2004, 03:34 PM
Makes my problems pale by comparison..

LStarosta
12-27-2004, 03:39 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Friendly_flyer:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by T_O_A_D:
Yes quite a shame in todays time, and technology.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm afraid there is very little modern technology can do when Mother Earth flexes her muscles. No gadget can help you when you are crushed by tons and tons of water, or are flushed out into the sea.

What really bugs me is the "some hundred" Somalians that are reported dead. The Somalians have had ample time to prepare. Even a casual look at the map would tell the tsunami was on its way. They had at least a full days warning. And yet, three villages washed into the sea, and it _was something that could be done about it_! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


That's the point. In many developed countries there are warning systems that could have saved untold numbers of lives. Most of these countries lacked such systems, and such were the consequences.

Hans, there ARE warning systems. The effect of an earthquake at sea is NOT instantaneous in terms of Tsunamis. Travelling at around 1200kmh or so still leaves a LOT of time to sound an alarm, provided a system detects abnormalities. It isn't impossible to measure tectonic activity or even ocean swelling with deep sea buoys (not sure how that works but I've heard such a system being discussed by a few marine geologists), it's just not very cheap and underdeveloped countries either can't afford it, or such a thing is so remotely occuring that it's not on their federal spending priority list.

LW_Icarus
12-27-2004, 03:52 PM
I too feel much sympathy for anyone who became a victim of this tsunami/earthquake.

I am also awed by the strength of nature.

As far as this amount of loss of life being "unheard of in modern times" I was reading where some 270,000 were killed in the early seventies,in china in a big quake (but not as big as this one) so using that as a comparison this is "minor" and I think of the 70s as being "modern" enough.

fabianfred
12-27-2004, 04:43 PM
I live in the north of thailand and have been watching the news for 2 days...
we felt the shock in chiangmai...
feel sorry for the local people in ****et who lost their homes businesses and without any tourists coming for a year, no jobs or places of work... no money to re-build their lives..

srilanka, india, indonesia were worse hit than thailand though..

5th largest shock in recorded history..

PBNA-Boosher
12-27-2004, 05:12 PM
There is nothing worse than the death of thousands when we have barely enough to prevent it.

My condolences to all those involved.

F19_Gazoo
12-27-2004, 05:47 PM
Just got a word from a friend who was on vacation in ****et. Thank god he´s alright!
My thought go to the people who have been affected to this disaster. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Udidtoo
12-27-2004, 06:06 PM
Like someone else said...makes my probs pale in comparison. As I have been the beneficiary of many prayers today its only fitting to pay it forward. May God watch over the children.

SkyChimp
12-27-2004, 06:25 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LStarosta:
Over 23,000 killed. That is unheard of in modern times for so many lives to be lost nearly all at once. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The real tragedy is that 23,000 probably only scratches the surface.

woofiedog
12-27-2004, 06:29 PM
I'm Sorry for Saying this... But Because of the Tragic Event of so Many People.
But I truely Hope This Thread Does Not Turn Into A Whine or Etc Thread.
May We All Do Something That Help's In some Way For These People That Have Loss So Much. Leo

PF_Rory_O_Moore
12-27-2004, 06:40 PM
S! All

I posted a list of Relief Organization Webstes that are taking donations for the people in South East Asia.
PF Tragedy Thread (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=400102&f=26310365&m=7911060752)

I hope no one minds....

Taylortony
12-27-2004, 06:42 PM
We are with you all, seeing the tourist plight on the news I thought, yeah, but you can hop a plane home and leave it all behind, My heart goes out to those who have lost their lives and their families, both locals and tourists..... having not gone through anything like this I cannot begin to fathom it and i feel for you all...
may all I know and have met on the web and in real life be safe and well http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/cry.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/cry.gif

NegativeGee
12-27-2004, 07:11 PM
A developing article on the devastating Indian Ocean earthquake (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Indian_Ocean_earthquake) that occured yesterday, with many useful links.

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

JG301_nils
12-27-2004, 07:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SkyChimp:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LStarosta:
Over 23,000 killed. That is unheard of in modern times for so many lives to be lost nearly all at once. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The real tragedy is that 23,000 probably only scratches the surface. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry to say Chimp, but I think you are right.
-nils-

Nanuk66
12-27-2004, 10:45 PM
'It isn't impossible to measure tectonic activity or even ocean swelling with deep sea buoys'

Afaik you could be on a boat in deep water and the wave could go underneath you and you would not notice anything on the surface of the water. If only begins to turn into a wave when it gets to shallow water, hence if you live on the coast of one of these pacific islands which has a small shelf area then a drop off to extremely deep water you wouldnt have alot of time to give out a warning.
In fact i think the only real warning some of these people could have got was seeing the coastline completely drain of water moments before the wave actually hitting. And if it occurs at night then...ur buggered.


Tis a bad tragedy but, unfortuneately, the worst period of a natural disaster like this is now and the coming months.

darkhorizon11
12-27-2004, 11:17 PM
Sorry for the misinformation, you are right that orbit and rotation are two completely different things.

Tsunamis are predictable but only by predicting the quakes that cause them. A deepwater quake pretty much guarantees a tsunami. But, you could be in a boat way out at sea and theres a good chance you won't even notice a tsunami go by. You're only warning sign is when your on the shoreline and the water suddenly retracts back and rises in the distance. Of course by that point its to late since they ussually travel around 400mph.

Either way 23000 innocent lives are gone and here we are to pick up the pieces. The problem is that as with 9/11 and many other disasters it takes a tragedy to really change the way we look at things to prevent further tragedies.

Yes, hindsight is indeed, 20/20. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

h009291
12-28-2004, 12:37 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Hans, there ARE warning systems. The effect of an earthquake at sea is NOT instantaneous in terms of Tsunamis. Travelling at around 1200kmh or so still leaves a LOT of time to sound an alarm, provided a system detects abnormalities. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well ... in some of these countries I doubt everyone is down on the beach listening to their transistors catching the latest breaking news. C'mon man ... some of these places are 3rd world countries that have never even seen a radio or TV set http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

LLv26_Morko
12-28-2004, 02:33 AM
What a tragedy...so many dead..and so many still missing..
there are over 100 finnish people still missing too... 2 of them friends of mine..hope they are allright

TheGozr
12-28-2004, 02:49 AM
Aweful http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

tigertalon
12-28-2004, 02:52 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by darkhorizon11:

Scientists are worried that the quake was so powerful it may have shifted the earth's orbit around the sun, go figure...

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is impossible.



Deepest condolences to everyone involved.

Raptor_20thFG
12-28-2004, 04:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by T_O_A_D:
Yes quite a shame in todays time, and technology.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

My heart goes out to the familes. Mother Nature can be truly deadly sometimes even with the technology

MO_JOJO
12-28-2004, 05:45 AM
h009291...I just saw on Fox News, a Sri Lankan man who lives in the US. He somehow heard about an earthquake in the Pacific and immediately called his family in Sri Lanka, and they were able to evacuate before the wave hit their area. Now, If he did that, wouldn't those countries at least be able to obtain info from whatever agencies monitor seismic activities and sound a loud siren or something when a quake is detected?

This is a good time for prayers and for sending a few bucks to the Red Cross or something. They say 40,000 dead, but they fear disease may add to the toll.

Give your kids an extra-long hug today and give thanks.

Aaron_GT
12-28-2004, 06:10 AM
Skychimp: I wouldn't be surprised to hear that the death toll tops 100,000. I still haven't heard from a colleague whose family lives in Sri Lanka. I hope his family are ok.

For UK readers if you donate via the Red Cross they can automatically get the tax back, so a 50 donation actually gives them 64.10

With regard to Somalia I doubt the government realised that a tsunami by Indonesia was a threat until it hit Sri Lanka. That probably left them about 3 hours to meet, make a decision, work out which villages were at threat, work out if they had any telecommunications with those villages. I was surprised when I heard that the waves got as far as Somalia so if I'd been on the beach with a transistor I wouldn't have known to move. I wish they had acted sooner and got a warning out and saved those lives, though.

Early warning is possible for tsunamis. The governments in the Indian Ocean were looking at implementing one over the next 10 years. Since this sort of event happens about twice a millenium it had been given low priority for funding. It's Sod's Law that it happened now, not in 15 years' time.

One of the things that susprises me is that Diego Garcia was apparently not too badly affected. I am susprised the place still exists.

Aaron_GT
12-28-2004, 06:14 AM
" Now, If he did that, wouldn't those countries at least be able to obtain info from whatever agencies monitor seismic activities and sound a loud siren or something when a quake is detected?"

If you have to evacuate an area then doing that (which presumes you have sirens there to guard against an event that happens maybe once every 500 years) you might just create panic which could clog up the roads and prevent anyone escaping. You have to evacuate in an organised way. It's a bit like the length of time it takes to evacuate coastal areas in the USA when a hurricane comes calling: it isn't instant, although perhaps the distance you need to travel inland in the case of the tsunami is very much less, which helps. This is why civil defence is such a nightmare: moving large numbers of people efficiently is hard work.

73GIAP_Milan
12-28-2004, 07:17 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif a sad day...

Nature can be even more cruel then terrorists... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

All the best of luck to all who have someone they know in SE Asia http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Aero_Shodanjo
12-28-2004, 08:43 AM
S! and thank you all.

I live in Indonesia where the deep sea earthquake occured around 65 miles off the coast of the northern part of Sumatra island.

The death toll in that area alone - according to the news - is around 19000 deaths but a government official feared that it could be as much as 6000 more. One example, in a town called Meulaboh, from around ten thousand inhabitants, only 15% reported survive.

I also read a testimony of a police chief where he witnessed that many of the people didnt run for their life when they saw the tide coming. As if they couldnt move at all.

Up until this evening, from the tv news, I still see the bodies in the street almost everywhere. And that there's still not enough manpower yet to give them proper burial. Thankfully international aid is on the way there.

But it's feared that disease will follow soon after the disaster.

All in all, it's a tragedy indeed. And not only for Indonesia. But also for Thailand, Bangladesh, India, Madagascar and some other countries.

Anyway, again, thank you all for your kind words and prayer. May God help us all.

Regards.

JG52Uther
12-28-2004, 09:39 AM
Over 55000 dead now, and that figure will rise. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

Aaron_GT
12-28-2004, 04:41 PM
On the Somilia aspect it turns out that Somalia has only had a government since the 11th December. Not really much of a government to warn them :-(

55,000 and counting sadly :-(

Airmail109
12-28-2004, 05:12 PM
I was left speachless by this, it really didnt make my day http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif. Let it be a warning to us...look after the planet it may just bite us one day.

LeadSpitter_
12-28-2004, 06:39 PM
god bless them all, and I hope the US helps out all the families rebuild.

huggy87
12-29-2004, 12:58 AM
My condolonces for the victims and survivors.

Here is a cheery little site to put our fragile little existence into perspective.

http://www.geocities.com/dtmcbride/hist/disasters-war.html

I had never heard of the 1976 earthquake in china- 255,000 killed.

Monson74
12-29-2004, 08:08 AM
Number of casualties is now more than 100.000 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Heard they are working on some sort of warning system - that's interesting.

Aaron_GT
12-29-2004, 08:33 AM
They have a system for the pacific. One was offered to the respective Indian Ocean governments around a year ago, apparently. Even if they had said yes it still wouldn't be in place now, though, so it wouldn't have made much difference this time round. The tsunami are so rare in the Indian Ocean we won't expect to see another one like this for another 400 years. Small comfort to those who have had their lives taken away or otherwise destroyed this time round :-(

tsisqua
12-29-2004, 09:44 AM
Another scary thought. I and my family vacation in Florida. Don't think it could happen there?

Look at this. (http://www.riverdeep.net/current/2000/06/front.060600.tsunamis.jhtml)

Tsisqua

huggy87
12-29-2004, 10:25 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tsisqua:
Another scary thought. I and my family vacation in Florida. Don't think it could happen there?

http://www.riverdeep.net/current/2000/06/front.060600.tsunamis.jhtml

Tsisqua <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

My family in cresent city, california lost a beachfront store in that tsunami.

clint-ruin
12-29-2004, 11:24 AM
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/39/2004_Indonesia_Tsunami.gif

clint-ruin
12-30-2004, 02:33 AM
Argh.

Looked at this again and realised my link only came up as the picture.

Wiki is as always on top of things.

Go here (http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Tsunami_Help) for a list of regional contact numbers and charities who are currently giving relief. Australian Red Cross is probably still the best bet for australians who want to help out directly.

Go here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Indian_Ocean_earthquake) for a complete rundown on which nations are affected.

The Indonesian government is now reporting 80,000 possible deaths around Aceh alone [ source (http://www.thisislondon.com/news/articles/15630695?source=Evening%20Standard&ct=5) ], as if that place hasn't seen enough death over the last few years. Wish I'd been able to go there last time I was in the country [they do some lovely er .. herbs and the diving is apparently amazing] but it was just too dangerous.

clint-ruin
12-30-2004, 02:50 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tsisqua:
Another scary thought. I and my family vacation in Florida. Don't think it could happen there?

http://www.riverdeep.net/current/2000/06/front.060600.tsunamis.jhtml

Tsisqua <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Same deal for Aussies and New Zealanders. Turns out we avoided a similar quake and resulting wave in this 'un (http://earthquake.usgs.gov/eqinthenews/2004/ussjal/) due to the plates slipping by each other rather than buckling. That's a little close.