Atzebrueck

01-09-2005, 11:37 AM

I'm just copying my text from another thread, because I want to discuss the flightmodel of the 110 a bit. In my opinion there is a lot that has to be corrected.

About it's turnrate

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Bf 110 G-2: 2*1475 PS; 38,37 mâÂ²:

empty (5094 kg): 133 kg/mâÂ² - 1,73 kg/PS

take-off (7300 kg): 190 kg/mâÂ² - 2,47 kg/PS

max (9390 kg): 245 kg/mâÂ² - 3,18 kg/PS

P-38 J: 2*1425 PS; 30,42 mâÂ²:

empty (5797 kg): 191 kg/mâÂ² (+44%) - 2,03 kg/PS (+17%)

take-off (7936 kg): 261 kg/mâÂ² (+37%) - 2,78 kg/PS (+13%)

max (9798 kg): 322 kg/mâÂ² (+31%) - 3,44 kg/PS (+8%)

As you can see the Lightning has a wingloading that is ~37% higher and a powerloading which is ~13% higher than that of the 110 (the performance of the Bf 110 seen as 100%). There is no way, it should be able to outturn a 110.

Yet, in game I get a different impression.

I made a short test:

Krim, sealevel, 110% throttle, 100% fuel, 3*360â? with constant speed and alt:

Bf 110 G-2 needs ~30 seconds for a 360â? turn

P-38 J needs ~24 seconds for a 360â? turn

30 seconds with that wing-/powerloading is way too long. Additionally, the planes in FB tend to turn faster than during real life tests.

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max. allowed dive-speed:

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http://vow-hq.com/files/jg51_atze/brett.jpg

The sign at the middle of the panel shows a security value. It's strange, that in FB parts start to come off at exact this 700 km/h IAS.

To compare that with the P51D:

On the left side of its cockpit, there is a sign, indicating 440kt (815 km/h) below 5000ft (1524m) as the max. allowed dive-speed. While I tested it, I achieved 524kt (970km/h) IAS at 2395 ft (730m) without damage.

That's ~20% above the limit.

Now, back to the 110: 120% of 700km/h IAS would be 840km/h IAS. I guess 800-825 km/h should be used as the limit.

Other 2mots of FB I tested:

speed in IAS, at which control surfaces start be ripped off (beginning at 5km, diving at ~80â?):

A20: ~740 km/h

B25: ~720 km/h

Beaufighter: ~760 km/h

He111: ~720 km/h

Me110: ~710 km/h

A heavy fighter/destroyer is worse than bombers. That doesn't make sense.

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In FB the 110's topspeed, climbrate, turning ability, roll, acceleration, high-alt performance, elevator effectiveness etc. are among the worst of all planes.

As far as I have heard/read, in reality only the stick forces and rollrate have been reported as bad.

In my opinion at least its turnrate, acceleration and dive speed limit should be a lot better than they are at the moment.

Additionally the high altitude performance should be checked.

About it's turnrate

----------------------------------------

Bf 110 G-2: 2*1475 PS; 38,37 mâÂ²:

empty (5094 kg): 133 kg/mâÂ² - 1,73 kg/PS

take-off (7300 kg): 190 kg/mâÂ² - 2,47 kg/PS

max (9390 kg): 245 kg/mâÂ² - 3,18 kg/PS

P-38 J: 2*1425 PS; 30,42 mâÂ²:

empty (5797 kg): 191 kg/mâÂ² (+44%) - 2,03 kg/PS (+17%)

take-off (7936 kg): 261 kg/mâÂ² (+37%) - 2,78 kg/PS (+13%)

max (9798 kg): 322 kg/mâÂ² (+31%) - 3,44 kg/PS (+8%)

As you can see the Lightning has a wingloading that is ~37% higher and a powerloading which is ~13% higher than that of the 110 (the performance of the Bf 110 seen as 100%). There is no way, it should be able to outturn a 110.

Yet, in game I get a different impression.

I made a short test:

Krim, sealevel, 110% throttle, 100% fuel, 3*360â? with constant speed and alt:

Bf 110 G-2 needs ~30 seconds for a 360â? turn

P-38 J needs ~24 seconds for a 360â? turn

30 seconds with that wing-/powerloading is way too long. Additionally, the planes in FB tend to turn faster than during real life tests.

----------------------------------------

max. allowed dive-speed:

----------------------------------------

http://vow-hq.com/files/jg51_atze/brett.jpg

The sign at the middle of the panel shows a security value. It's strange, that in FB parts start to come off at exact this 700 km/h IAS.

To compare that with the P51D:

On the left side of its cockpit, there is a sign, indicating 440kt (815 km/h) below 5000ft (1524m) as the max. allowed dive-speed. While I tested it, I achieved 524kt (970km/h) IAS at 2395 ft (730m) without damage.

That's ~20% above the limit.

Now, back to the 110: 120% of 700km/h IAS would be 840km/h IAS. I guess 800-825 km/h should be used as the limit.

Other 2mots of FB I tested:

speed in IAS, at which control surfaces start be ripped off (beginning at 5km, diving at ~80â?):

A20: ~740 km/h

B25: ~720 km/h

Beaufighter: ~760 km/h

He111: ~720 km/h

Me110: ~710 km/h

A heavy fighter/destroyer is worse than bombers. That doesn't make sense.

----------------------------------------

In FB the 110's topspeed, climbrate, turning ability, roll, acceleration, high-alt performance, elevator effectiveness etc. are among the worst of all planes.

As far as I have heard/read, in reality only the stick forces and rollrate have been reported as bad.

In my opinion at least its turnrate, acceleration and dive speed limit should be a lot better than they are at the moment.

Additionally the high altitude performance should be checked.