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View Full Version : Which Planes are not porked in this game?



accpps
09-28-2006, 11:29 PM
After reading the p51 fw190 and e-retention threads.

I was wondering if there are any planes in the game that the community can agree is not porked or overmodeled and flies like it did in reality?

Im looking to settle down with a ride instead of flying a new plane everyday but don't want to waste months on a inaccurate plane when I could be flying one that performs true to reality.

JtD
09-28-2006, 11:39 PM
The game engine itself has limits, making all planes somewhat different to fly than the real thing. However, a lot of things works pretty well.

There will always be complaints about certain aspects of certain planes, no way around that. But most of these complaints are exaggerated.

If you really feel you want to limit yourself to just one plane, find one you like and get used to it.

Daiichidoku
09-28-2006, 11:47 PM
100% accurate:

G-11

leitmotiv
09-29-2006, 12:24 AM
None. Oleg Maddox is delusional.

Targ
09-29-2006, 12:33 AM
It's the man not the machine.

accpps
09-29-2006, 12:36 AM
Originally posted by Targ:
It's the man not the machine.

la5fns prevent this statement from being true.

FritzGryphon
09-29-2006, 12:38 AM
Only thing that's porked are the players, with their undermodeled kill/whine ratio.

R_Target
09-29-2006, 12:40 AM
TBF-1C.

Treetop64
09-29-2006, 01:39 AM
Well, the TBD Devastator is definitely undermodelled. So is the F7F and the F8F; those two need a lot of work.

alert_1
09-29-2006, 01:45 AM
I185 M71, be sure!

Gumtree
09-29-2006, 01:55 AM
Any plane that shoots me down when I am in my favourite ride is obviously porked or overmodeled.
You can often trawl through these forums and find these planes, or better still go into Warclouds or Spits v 109s and just read the chat they will soon let you know which planes are not realistic.

Just the other day I zoomed down on a Spit (who was flying straight and level at about 350 kph) from above at about 700 kph in my D-9, just as I was about to fire he saw me and turned real hard so I did the normal thing as you do and tried to turn with him.
Some how his porked flight model out turned me and he shot me down when I didnt retain my speed advantage (not sure how ,obviously the d-9 is porked,probably underpowered or over weight more than likely both I'd say)

So I did what any self respecting fair minded individual would do. I typed on the chat just how much off a nOOb the guy in the Spit was and told him to fly a plane that was a challenge. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

tigertalon
09-29-2006, 03:14 AM
Originally posted by Targ:
It's the man not the machine.

Next time online I'll invite you to a duel, I'll take a Ki-84-1C and you an F6F or even F4U. Then let 'the man' win!

OD_79
09-29-2006, 03:19 AM
Sptifire MkIX 25lb boost! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

MEGILE
09-29-2006, 03:31 AM
FW-190A8

-HH-Quazi
09-29-2006, 03:38 AM
Originally posted by tigertalon:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Targ:
It's the man not the machine.

Next time online I'll invite you to a duel, I'll take a Ki-84-1C and you an F6F or even F4U. Then let 'the man' win! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I eat Ki-84's for a snack in a F6F or a F4U! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif NOT!!

Kuna_
09-29-2006, 04:52 AM
Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
100% accurate:

G-11 lol... but no! FM may be correct, but DM ain't correct that's for sure.
Try shooting at the dam thing with small caliber it explodes every time. I shot at it and it exploded 5/5 times. In row.

Someone at ORR suggested that it carries ammunition for partisans, but still... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Originally posted by tigertalon:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Targ:
It's the man not the machine.

Next time online I'll invite you to a duel, I'll take a Ki-84-1C and you an F6F or even F4U. Then let 'the man' win! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>What do you need Ki-84 for? Take the A6M3... And best of all you'll still beat the **** out of F4U and F4F. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/touche.gif
The best joke about this game is when someone says "it's da man not da machine". IRL perhaps without going into extremes, but in FB? Nooooooooo... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

Originally posted by accpps:
I was wondering if there are any planes in the game that the community can agree is not porked or overmodeled and flies like it did in reality? Learn to fly either P-47D, Mustang III or preferably FW-190D. And rarely anyone will be able to beat you online.

So much for porked vs. unporked.

SeaFireLIV
09-29-2006, 04:59 AM
Originally posted by accpps:
After reading the p51 fw190 and e-retention threads.

I was wondering if there are any planes in the game that the community can agree is not porked or overmodeled and flies like it did in reality?

Im looking to settle down with a ride instead of flying a new plane everyday but don't want to waste months on a inaccurate plane when I could be flying one that performs true to reality.

Yawn, do you believe everything you read here? Cos if you do, you WON`T be flying ANY aircraft at all. Use you your mind and try the aircraft for yourself.

Half the whines here about aircraft performance are biased and sour grapes.

stansdds
09-29-2006, 05:19 AM
It's a desktop computer simulation and it's far from perfect, but to date, there has not been a perfect simulation. There are limits as to what can be done with a sim and frankly, I'm surprised that the IL2 game engine has been so adaptable, but I think it's limits have been reached. Enjoy it for what it is.

Gumtree
09-29-2006, 07:03 AM
Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:

Yawn, do you believe everything you read here? Cos if you do, you WON`T be flying ANY aircraft at all. Use you your mind and try the aircraft for yourself.

Half the whines here about aircraft performance are biased and sour grapes.
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif

Feathered_IV
09-29-2006, 07:30 AM
+1 for the Vickers Vegan

triad773
09-29-2006, 07:32 AM
How about the Convair Carnivor?

BBB_Hyperion
09-29-2006, 07:36 AM
This one http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
http://www.cessna.org/home/images/172.jpg

PBNA-Boosher
09-29-2006, 07:51 AM
Take yourself a P-40. While it's engine is a bit more vulnerable than I'd like it to be (1 7.62mm bullet can freeze it more often than not) it takes a swell amount of damage and holds togther nicely. Furthermore, if you come upon enemy formations and you have the alt advantage (with wingmen, the P-40 is a TEAM airplane) Dive down on them and raise almighty hell. Those 6 guns, whether they're 4 .30's and 2 .50's or 6 .50's, coming from multiple planes, is not something an enemy pilot wants to be climbing up into.

After that initial pass, unless you're encountering an unescorted bomber formation, extend away. If you're fighting Zekes or Oscars you may be able to extend far away enough to make a second pass. If you're fighting anything else that's faster than the P-40, run away before they can pick up speed to follow you.

You may not get as many kills as you would if you flew a Ki-84-Ic, but it's SO AWESOME to hear people screaming that the P-40 is overmodeled that you just want to go up and rake them again!

I'm also a HUGE fan of early-war Yaks because people don't expect them to be that competetive of a fighter. They really don't like it when I can pull around on their six, fire snapshots and disable them very quickly.

Haigotron
09-29-2006, 08:39 AM
ask hayateAce, he'll tell you how much he loves the true to life representation of the 109 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Xiolablu3
09-29-2006, 08:44 AM
You got all this from the E retenti0on thread which actually concluded (from anyone that actually bothered to test and not just whine) that things are in fact quite (just LA5FN which is a little too good) accurate? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif Read JTDs flight tests on E retention http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif


Very pooor effort,


Make ANOTHER new account and try again!

F6_Ace
09-29-2006, 08:50 AM
Perhaps you ought to ask 'what is there that flies that isn't porked in this game?'

My response would be: "Parachutes"

Xiolablu3
09-29-2006, 08:54 AM
Originally posted by Gumtree:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:

Yawn, do you believe everything you read here? Cos if you do, you WON`T be flying ANY aircraft at all. Use you your mind and try the aircraft for yourself.

Half the whines here about aircraft performance are biased and sour grapes.
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif

waffen-79
09-29-2006, 09:36 AM
not porked?

hmmm...

ANY plane cleared by HayateAce, just ask him

Da_Godfatha
09-29-2006, 11:36 AM
Porked-planes, all a matter of opinion. And opinions are like butt-holes, "everyone has one, and they usually stink."

BTW, the La-5FN is a great plane. Not like the n00bified La-7's http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

accpps
09-29-2006, 02:50 PM
BTW, the La-5FN is a great plane. Not like the n00bified La-7's http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Sorry no. The La5fn is so overmodeled its embarrassing.

Its lookin like Im going to stick to the early war era with plane choice. There just isnt the paraody in the late war planes. In late war it seems you will always have to deal with overmodeled LAs, underperforming BnZ planes, etc.

The planes don't have to be 100% accurate as I know that isnt possible. I just want to put myself through realistic missions and go through what the real pilots went through ie plane matchups, squad matchups etc etc. When planes like la5fn are in the mix it makes my goal of playing historically accurate missions impossible.

VW-IceFire
09-29-2006, 03:36 PM
La-5FN performs to late 1944 performance levels. Thats it. Its a fairly easy target from the cockpit of a FW190D-9.

Every plane is porked...take it or leave it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

There are problems with everything...truly...and we complain sometimes and some of us complain all of the time. But try and just enjoy the game and stop worrying about whats porked and whats uber and all that stuff. I took stock in that once...now I fly whatever I damn well want to fly.

The point of all of this (the expensive computer, joysticks, and game) is to be entertained. That means fun. So I want to have fun. Whatever brings me the most fun is what I'm going to do.

Cheers!

accpps
09-29-2006, 05:17 PM
Very pooor effort,
Make ANOTHER new account and try again!

Whom are you trying to impress with comments like these? This isn't the ign vault network.

Kuna_
09-29-2006, 05:35 PM
People. Aircraft that can turn better than other isn't always the better aircraft. Unlike popular belief.

Fortunately this simulation truly represents one thing (among others) from real life combat and that is speed is life.

Got speed? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f193/Kuna_/fb/hav-la5fn-vs-bf109g2.gif
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f193/Kuna_/fb/hav-la5fn-vs-bf109g6as.gif
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f193/Kuna_/fb/hav-la5fn-vs-fw190a6.gif
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f193/Kuna_/fb/hav-la5fn-vs-fw190d944.gif
Hardball may be slightly off mark with some figures, but see on just how that monster can be beaten.
Dora 9 outmatches LA-5FN so that it isn't even laughable, and if you left out the deck fights so is Bf-109G6AS. Others are a good match too if you don't do stupid moves.

So where's the fire with this LA-5FN type?

Xiolablu3
09-29-2006, 07:24 PM
I agree the La5FN can be beaten with good flying, but its sure not a 1943 plane. (Map makers take note.

Look at the time to 5000m between the La5FN and the 109G6 A/S, is that correct?

I always thought the 109G6 A/S was a superb climber , but looking at the comparison, its poor vs the La5FN.

La5FN climb to 5100m = 4.6minutes
109G6 A/S = 6.7 minutes?

Is this correct with history?

Xiolablu3
09-29-2006, 07:28 PM
Originally posted by accpps:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">BTW, the La-5FN is a great plane. Not like the n00bified La-7's http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Sorry no. The La5fn is so overmodeled its embarrassing.

Its lookin like Im going to stick to the early war era with plane choice. There just isnt the paraody in the late war planes. In late war it seems you will always have to deal with overmodeled LAs, underperforming BnZ planes, etc.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Which are the 'underperforming B&Z planes' exactly?

FW190D9/FW190A4/P47/Hellcat/Tempest/FW190A6 are all wonderful planes and the enemy has no chance of catching you if you fly smart.


The only planes I really fear late war (1943-45) are other B&Z planes as they are so dangerous, P47/P51/Tempest if I am Blue and FW190 if I am red.


I honestly believe that this whole 'energy management is wrong' thing is a load of cr*p, last night I flew energy fighters all night and wasnt shot down once, left the server with 2600 points. Flew FW190/P47/Tempest/Hellcat almost all night.

http://www.il2hq.com/scstats2/il2sc_stat/index.php?navi.../allair/1/index.html (http://www.il2hq.com/scstats2/il2sc_stat/index.php?navigation=pilots/507/allair/1/index.html)

I died 3 times, all from me colliding with the enemy on the attack. (doh!) The enemy could never catch me, never mind shoot me down. I am definitely not the worlds best pilot, so the planes MUST be good for me to survive all night.

BiscuitKnight
09-29-2006, 08:25 PM
He-162A isn't porked, and it's flyable on all servers, be sure.

BBB_Hyperion
09-29-2006, 08:38 PM
Originally posted by Xiolablu3:
I agree the La5FN can be beaten with good flying, but its sure not a 1943 plane. (Map makers take note.

Look at the time to 5000m between the La5FN and the 109G6 A/S, is that correct?

I always thought the 109G6 A/S was a superb climber , but looking at the comparison, its poor vs the La5FN.

La5FN climb to 5100m = 4.6minutes
109G6 A/S = 6.7 minutes?

Is this correct with history?

LA5FN Climb max WEP = WITH OPEN RAD 10 Minutes LIMIT
WEP should not be used in CLIMB (Cylinder Problem).
G6 ASM Climb is to 6100 m not 5100 m.

Data from IL2Compare.

Estimated WEP Climb G6ASM (26 m/s +22,5 m/s) /2 Average Climb from 0 to 5000 = 24,25 m/s

206 s = 3 minutes 26 seconds

5100 about 3:30

Estimated Combat Power G6ASM (17,5 m/s + 15 m/s) / 2 = Average Climb 0 to 5000= 16,25 m/s


307 s = 5 minutes 7 seconds

To Compare
Estimated Combat Power G6ASM (17,5 m/s + 14.5 m/s) / 2 = Average Climb 0 to 6100=
16 m/s

381 s = 6 minutes 21 s

So roundabout it seems on a quick estimate it is climb at combat power shown not wep !

Dont have time to test climbtime ingame now maybe someone else can do .)
Quicktest not best climb always i think.
WEP 110 % 5100 3:44
WEP 110 % 6100 4:39

ElAurens
09-29-2006, 11:15 PM
The Yak 9 and Yak 9D are fairly well modeled.

CUJO_1970
09-30-2006, 12:27 AM
Actually, I think the early Yaks are the most realistic flight models(for a particular airplane) in the entire sim.

Kuna_
09-30-2006, 02:54 AM
Originally posted by Xiolablu3:
I agree the La5FN can be beaten with good flying, but its sure not a 1943 plane. (Map makers take note.

Look at the time to 5000m between the La5FN and the 109G6 A/S, is that correct?

I always thought the 109G6 A/S was a superb climber , but looking at the comparison, its poor vs the La5FN.

La5FN climb to 5100m = 4.6minutes
109G6 A/S = 6.7 minutes?

Is this correct with history? Hey Xi you're correct map makers should take note about that LA-5FN is more '44 plane... has the chars of a '44 plane according to many serious guys around here.

About climb I've noticed thing:

LA-5FN
POWER: 1850hp
WEIGHT (take off): 3283kg
POWER/WEIGHT ratio: 0,56hp/kg

Bf-109G6AS
POWER: 1300hp with BOOST: 1800hp
WEIGHT (take off): 3372kg
POWER/WEIGHT ratio: 0,39hp/kg (with BOOST 0,53hp/kg)

LA-5FN has slightly better power to weight ratio, and Bf-109G is slightly heavier on take off.
Also one thing that should be considered and isn't mentioned in Hardball's AV is the best climbing speed of both fighters.
So it is quite possible that you can make separation between LA-5FN *if* that fighter has lower best climbing speed than Bf-109G.

Hyperion posted interesting stuff. I will check out relative climb of both fighters from deck to 5k as I find it most interesting.

Kuna_
09-30-2006, 09:44 AM
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
alt LA-5FN Bf-109G6AS FW-190A6
RL FB RL FB RL FB
1k 1:17 1:16 1:38
2k 1:55 1:55 2:32
3k 2:46 2:37 3:33
4k 3:45 3:21 4:40
5k 4:49 4:07 5:47
</pre>

Crimea, default weapons, 75% fuel, with take off up to 5k.

Xiolablu3
09-30-2006, 11:11 AM
Ahh thanks guys, I misread the climb to 5100/6100 being different. Also I didnt think about the combat/military power.

So in fact the 109G6A/S does climb better than the La5FN to 3000m with MW50 and full power.

I thought the contemporary BF109 should do, being one of the best climbers in WW2!