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View Full Version : In this corner Il-2 & in the other corner Battle of Britain WoV



jamesdietz
01-07-2006, 04:36 PM
At the risk of being rather old news , I did this side by side,sort of comparison of Il-2 forgotten Battles & Battle of Britain Wings of Valor.I know it is a sort of apples & oranges comparison but it is interesting to see the graphic differences;I tried to do similar subjects from similar views( & got close a couple of times!)..Note BoB woV has been much improved by all the patches currently available
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/1.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/2.jpg Bf-109 cockpits withan interesting addition on the WoV example http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/3.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/4.jpg Bf-109's in flight http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/5.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/6.jpg 110's I personally think the WoV 110 is the weakest modeled in the simhttp://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/7.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/8.jpg Nice Hurricaneshttp://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/9.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/10.jpg Several views of the Spitfires in the 1940 cammo...of course the FB has later cannon equipped wings http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/11.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/12.jpg Stukas...note here and in other images the differences in water.WoV is pretty but FB's just shineshttp://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/13.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/14.jpg Ju-88s,hereas in the game BoB offers some really impressive formation size but gives us this at the expense of clarity in the middle & far distance & a real hit in FPS!http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/15.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/16.jpg He-111s Formation size vs.clarity againhttp://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/17.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/18.jpg Views inside from He-111,of course here FB really has the edge..you can even fly the plane & have your choice of all the positions,but in Wov you do get to see alot more of your kind.http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/19.jpg Do-17's here in WoV how come they've never made it even to Ai in FB??
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/20.jpg But here's a beauty from Fb 4 different skinned 109s in the same flight.This is a real nifty feature of FB isn't it?
there ya go.I didn't promise anything scientific,and this leaves out much of the differing pros & cons of each sim( which I really couldn't demonstrate anyway&gthttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Hope you've had a pleasant trip!
( Thanks Wiley for translating my screenshots into something useable!)

jamesdietz
01-07-2006, 04:36 PM
At the risk of being rather old news , I did this side by side,sort of comparison of Il-2 forgotten Battles & Battle of Britain Wings of Valor.I know it is a sort of apples & oranges comparison but it is interesting to see the graphic differences;I tried to do similar subjects from similar views( & got close a couple of times!)..Note BoB woV has been much improved by all the patches currently available
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/1.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/2.jpg Bf-109 cockpits withan interesting addition on the WoV example http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/3.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/4.jpg Bf-109's in flight http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/5.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/6.jpg 110's I personally think the WoV 110 is the weakest modeled in the simhttp://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/7.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/8.jpg Nice Hurricaneshttp://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/9.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/10.jpg Several views of the Spitfires in the 1940 cammo...of course the FB has later cannon equipped wings http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/11.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/12.jpg Stukas...note here and in other images the differences in water.WoV is pretty but FB's just shineshttp://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/13.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/14.jpg Ju-88s,hereas in the game BoB offers some really impressive formation size but gives us this at the expense of clarity in the middle & far distance & a real hit in FPS!http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/15.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/16.jpg He-111s Formation size vs.clarity againhttp://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/17.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/18.jpg Views inside from He-111,of course here FB really has the edge..you can even fly the plane & have your choice of all the positions,but in Wov you do get to see alot more of your kind.http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/19.jpg Do-17's here in WoV how come they've never made it even to Ai in FB??
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/20.jpg But here's a beauty from Fb 4 different skinned 109s in the same flight.This is a real nifty feature of FB isn't it?
there ya go.I didn't promise anything scientific,and this leaves out much of the differing pros & cons of each sim( which I really couldn't demonstrate anyway&gthttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Hope you've had a pleasant trip!
( Thanks Wiley for translating my screenshots into something useable!)

jamesdietz
01-07-2006, 04:44 PM
These were the two shot somehow out...sorry about that...l http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/4.jpg
( the 109 comparison ) http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/20.jpg the last shot showing a line up of differnt 109s..

jamesdietz
01-07-2006, 04:45 PM
Hmmm still didn't get them working...hey Wiley ...Help!!!

slkcrab
01-07-2006, 04:45 PM
If the landing/takeoff modelling wasn't so ridiculously hard I'd fly BOBII more. Nothing more frustrating than having a successful albeit whiteknuckled, dogfight only to flip on landing. Happens no matter what speed. Nope, no thanks.

Chuck_Older
01-07-2006, 04:49 PM
Actually, I think you showed a lot of pros and cons

WoV wisely decided not to try to beat FB at it's strong points, it seems to me, but rather relied on it's own strong points

I think that those screenshots just convinced me to get it. Christina Applegate's bum is kinda flabby in that photo, though http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

SeaFireLIV
01-07-2006, 04:58 PM
Interesting that you bought this up. i was just in Virgin today and saw that they`ve released BOBII Wov again!

This time it`s in a BIGGER package, so I really get the feeling that you get the Manual and large Key card/map too!

BOBwov is good, but no IL2 beater.
BOBwov`s good for an immersion Campaign offline and for tons of aircraft, flak exploding, realistic sounds that make you jump it`s quite breath taking.

Unfortunately, little things take away from it at times. Fly as leader in formation with wingmen Spits or Hurris and they fly exactly in time with you with an annoying `jitter`.

Fly in formation in IL2, and everything has that wonderful `realistic` feel. AI wingmen fly individually with that gentle bounce around as if riding air currents.

I went after a 110 in combat in IL2. A great smooth fight of clarity. Can`t fault it, except for gunner accuracy maybe.

I went after a 110 in BOBwov, quite good, but sometimes the 110 acts slightly strange, even `lagging` when flying low... Gunner accuracy? Useless, they are no threat in BOBwov.

Still BOBwov is good for what`s it for, just don`t fly it thinking `IL2` or you will be dissapppointed.

p.s The individual use of AI skins on every plane per mission is also a masterstroke. It gives the AI a bit of individuality. Something BOBwov & CFS3 simply never bothered with.

neural_dream
01-07-2006, 05:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
Christina Applegate's bum is kinda flabby in that photo, though http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Christina Applegate wasn't alive in WW2 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif. No historical accuracy whatsoever http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif in this WoV. No thanks, I'll stick with IL-2 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif.

SeaFireLIV
01-07-2006, 05:01 PM
To be fair to BOBwov, the ability to place pics in the cockpit would be excellent, if they`d just explain how to. Wish it was in IL2.

jamesdietz
01-08-2006, 11:01 AM
Here are the other images of 109s & spitfires that didn't seem to work in my first ,second ,& third post) Hopefully one of these will...I've never tried this before...
Direct Link: http://freefilehosting.net/bin/?id=qtD1l6nQ
HTML Code: &lt;img src="http://freefilehosting.net/file/?id=qtD1l6nQ"&gt;
Forum Link: http://freefilehosting.net/bin/?id=qtD1l6nQ


Direct Link: http://freefilehosting.net/bin/?id=qtD1l6nc
HTML Code: &lt;img src="http://freefilehosting.net/file/?id=qtD1l6nc"&gt;
Forum Link: http://freefilehosting.net/bin/?id=qtD1l6nc


Direct Link: http://freefilehosting.net/bin/?id=qtD1l6rY
HTML Code: &lt;img src="http://freefilehosting.net/file/?id=qtD1l6rY"&gt;
Forum Link: http://freefilehosting.net/bin/?id=qtD1l6rY


Direct Link: http://freefilehosting.net/bin/?id=qtD1l6vZ
HTML Code: &lt;img src="http://freefilehosting.net/file/?id=qtD1l6vZ"&gt;
Forum Link: http://freefilehosting.net/bin/?id=qtD1l6vZ

trumper
01-08-2006, 11:07 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Lovely screen shots,i have both games on my H/D and love them both.People who take sides and won't try anything else because it's not F/B are missing out.
Ok you cant compare them together too much,they are both different but great fun,thats the main part.FUN FUN FUN.

Hurricane_320
01-08-2006, 11:14 AM
Il2 Rulesz!

Except for in the cockpit addon. . .

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> </div></BLOCKQUOTE> http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Saunders1953
01-08-2006, 11:43 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I think that those screenshots just convinced me to get it. Christina Applegate's bum is kinda flabby in that photo, though </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You young whippersnappers...I'm 52, and there is nothing wrong with that bum! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

vocatx
01-08-2006, 12:29 PM
A friend of mine got BOB WoV recently. I had been thinking about possibly buying it, so I asked him his opinion. He said that FB/PF beat BOB on all counts except the flight model. My friend has actually taken a P-51 "around the patch" before, and he said that in his opinion, BoB probably got the difficulty for take offs and landing fairly close. I have always been disappointed in just how easy it is to take off and land aircraft in this sim. Some of these aircraft were notorious for their bad handling characteristics. Original Il-2 had a more difficult flight model.

After discussing the pros and cons of FB and BoB WoV with him, I think I'll just save my cash 'til Oleg's BoB comes out. In the mean time, I've got OFF up and running on my hard drive...

Nigel_Woodman
01-08-2006, 12:35 PM
I own both but I don't play BoBWoV very much. Here are the reasons why:

WoV takes way too long to load. In the time it takes to load, I can have completed three missions in IL-2. Who wants to sit staring at a picture of the English Channel while software loads up?

WoV takeoffs and landings are beyond realistic in their difficulty. The game designers have lost sight of the fact that too much realism destroys the sensation of reality.

The WoV campaign mode is like a big knotty puzzle, enjoyable mostly by the people who designed it, inaccessable to most others. It's a totally different genre of game from flight simulation. On the other hand, IL-2's full mission builder is easy and fun.

WoV's flight dynamics are screwed up. Planes jitter through the sky, move sideways, and behave like a school of minnows darting back and forth totally unrealistically.

As far as the photos submitted here are concerned, I mostly prefer the look if IL-2 (with the exception of the Spit cockpit)

Chivas
01-08-2006, 12:46 PM
I have both on my harddrive and prefer IL-2 but BOB WOV has some very good moments. Its a hard game to start enjoying, just when you start having fun the game will crash or reset all your joystick settings. This has been improved in the last patch. I found throwing in another gig of ram also helped.

Last night I was flying a campaign mission in a hurricane fighting the hun over Dover. I was having alot fun and thinking I should fly this sim more often. I made the mistake of getting low and slow finishing off a 109 and picked up at least four 109s on my six. I took them thru the smoke over Dover hoping some AAA would help clear my six. Not sure if the AAA detered them or not but I did manage to get my speed up and get a safe distance from my pursuers.

Keeping my speed up I was able to make some quick shots helping to clear squad m8's sixs. After a few minutes we starting to get the upper hand and I could see only a couple of 109's in the area. As I banked in to help with the last two, half my right wing came off and I quickly spiralled in. I was pissed, not knowing what got me. I'm almost sure that there was no 109 still on my six, so it could have been friendly AAA fire. Trouble is the game just ends. Thats realistic but it still pissed me off. I'm just used to switching to another view in IL-2 as the game carries on and you can usually figure out what happened.

The game has potential and will definitely need modders to help make it a better sim.

I do like the smoke effects coming from the hit ground targets. Its more emmersive than FB. The sounds in the sim are good and immersive, but hearing seagulls, screams, bullet hits on your target, arn't very realistic but fun. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

The FM is well done. Their is a problem with the aircraft your dogfighting jumping sideways 10 meters at times. I suspect they jump forward and back too as I feel they will suddenly extend at times like they have kicked in their afterburners. The dogfighting will be alot smoother and more fun when this bug is fixed. I believe they are making progress and may have this bug fixed soon.

Another pet peeve in FB and BoB WOV is the persistance of enemy aircraft that you've damaged and started smoking badly will still stay in the fight. GO HOME d*mmit. Leave me to fight the next guy.

Landing and takeoffs are difficult at the start but much easier with practice. I'm not sure if they made it easier with the patches.

Crash landings and ditchings are very poorly done and hope this can be addressed in future patches or mods.

Ground attacks are fun although I would like someone to tone down the dirt thrown up my machine gun hits. The dirt flys up 30 to 40 feet where 3 to 5 feet will due. Its an immersion killer for me.

The DM isn't bad but could be improved.

I could live with the terrain graphics if someone to could smooth out the transition from the cliffs, beach, and ocean.

The cockpits are atleast on standard with FB except when I zoom out and I get the same glittery textures as some portions of the terrain. Stickman has a mod that fixes glittering textures with some building at the airbases. The terrain problems will probably be fixed when there is a tool for the fartiles.

I would recommend trying it out...you may just love it. I definitely keep it on my harddrive and look forward to future patches and mods.

SeaFireLIV
01-08-2006, 01:20 PM
yea. It stays on my Hard drive too.

Bakelit
01-08-2006, 04:41 PM
I have both sims since they came out repectively, had the older Rowans BoB from day 1 too.

I think they complement each other on my HD.

Points I like with WoV are the communications menu and its possibilities, the view system including its padlocks(after getting used too it which I concur might take a while) and the new interactive cockpits are very nice, at least IMHO.

There is also the feeling of being there, can't really describe it better.

What I don't like is getting kicked out when killed etc, the somewhat simple DM and the jumpiness/fakery of the AI which sometimes gets close to ridiculous.

On the other hand WoV simulates the broader picture better than FB and seems to make concessions to that effect.

A battle of britain campaign in FB might have bombers shooting down dozens of Hurris and Spits and with all fighter engagements lasting to the bitter end after two weeks campaign might end with close to annihilation of both parties.

So I think FBAPF is the better dogfight sim, WoV is the better air battle sim. At least until Oleg shows his new sim.

My pit:
http://www.kleinekerlchen.de/bilder/wovpit.jpg

zombiewolf92553
01-08-2006, 07:15 PM
cool I ordered this new years while I was Toasted(bombed).
when I sobered up I thought maybe I made a mistake but reading theses threads has been a little uplifting.I gues I'll have to wait and see. UPS says 3 to 4 more days

Doolittle81
01-08-2006, 07:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jamesdietz:
Hmmm still didn't get them working...hey Wiley ...Help!!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Fixed!!! Sorry I was out all day and just now saw your post asking for help.
<span class="ev_code_Red">Wiley</span>

jamesdietz
01-09-2006, 10:00 AM
Ok Wiley will try these 3 images again ( you see I tried to do this myself thru Imageshack but somehow screwed it up.Here they are with my fingers crossed
First is the 109 comparison:
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/3.jpg
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/4.jpg

And third & fourth are the 2 completely left out at the end of the post;The beautiful ( unless you were on the receiving end) formation of Do-17's: http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/19.jpg An aircraft we probably won't see from Oleg until his BoB( I guess I really don't mind since we will have a flyable Ju-88,e-ventually ...

And the rather neat finger 4 formation of 109s seen in first screenie but from a different viewpoint,showing the wonderful skinning possibilities that FB offers on an easy to access method( isn't that first one a beauty?)
http://members.cox.net/wingmanlead/BofBPics/20.jpg

My parting words on this ; I really enjoy "flying " solo in BoB WoV more ...it truly is a more immersive sim with better sound & Track IR Vector support & in some ways a "painterly "beauty to the background sky & earth ( esp with improvement patches) I find it a far more difficult sim to actually dogfight in( maybe by design , or maybe because of the limitations of myset-up.)Over & over I find myself in long pursuits of an enemy only to find that the last 200 yds I close so rapidly that it is difficult to accurately line up a shot & no, cutting the throttle doesn't help , nor ripping off the flaps.Tracers & damage is a bit weaker than IL-2 as well.Part of this is the reduced FPS needed in the large formations shown & wonderfully loud flak.Il-2 shines in its images in the middle distance & overall smoothness of play..I prefer is FM too, but this may be because I've gotten used to it.I can't really speak to the AI , but I have a feeling from reading postings that people have found differnt faults with AI in both sims( those gunneres in Il-2 can sure shoot...thats all I know!) It was fun doing the screenshots , but not really an honest view of either game ...for that you have to play them & go thru all the fun & frustration of installing , patching & buying all the who-knows-what to make them play to their optimum,then go thru the learning curveof getting the best from them.Worthwhile I'd say & probably exactly what we will be doing ( & grousing abou) when Oleg finally releases his Battle Of Britain,,,

jamesdietz
01-09-2006, 10:28 AM
oooops - I hadn't noticed that Wiley had fixed my first post...whata guy!Oh well comments still apply!