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View Full Version : Saitek X52: Oh why does it have to look like this?



StudUK
01-13-2005, 02:06 AM
I have been reviewing this and it does sound great.

But for the love of God why does it look its something you brought from 'Toys r Us'???

or is it just me?? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Chivas
01-13-2005, 02:57 AM
I'm with you on this. Its ok for a star wars pilot, but in a WW2 prop sim it sure is ugly. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

JG52Uther
01-13-2005, 03:39 AM
Yes the looks of the thing are one of the main reasons i dont think i'll get one

Orfson
01-13-2005, 03:46 AM
...I agree totally!

F16_Neo
01-13-2005, 04:59 AM
Turing off the LED's help some. Nice stick tho.
Kinda love-hate the looks http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

flyingscampi
01-13-2005, 05:36 AM
Because kids are only interested in what something looks like and they represent a sizeable chunk of the market I guess.

It's a shame they can't do a more conservative looking model for the adults http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

StudUK
01-13-2005, 05:59 AM
"..Nice stick tho"

agreed does sound like a great stick. I'm in my thirties, I have a mature setup I dont want something on my desk that resembles a joystick that Buzz lightyear would use http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I would be embarrassed to use it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Orfson
01-13-2005, 06:26 AM
...I don't think kids are - anymore - interested in joysticks. That's the reason why MS stopped the Sidewinder production... and that's the reason here in Italy I can't see any stick in the shops.

HansKnappstick
01-13-2005, 06:28 AM
Well, I am in my thirties, and my kids are _not_ going to even touch my X52.

Switching the LEDs off helps. But leaving them on looks cool at night, when I return from a lengthy bomb run. Even my Wife appreciates that...



Disclaimer: X52 is a trade mark or so of the Saitek Corporation or something like that, etc and so on.

BaldieJr
01-13-2005, 10:29 AM
Allow me to point out the obvious:

A 30-something man who calls himself "Stud" doesn't want an X52 because it may not match his "mature setup".

Another poster claims that "kids" only care about the looks of a product, and then expresses his desire for an "adult version" of said product.

And lastly, another participant in this thread claims the stick is for "star wars pilots".

Would all star wars pilots please PT me ASAP? I've some business I'd like to settle on mars but I need a ride.


http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

crazyivan1970
01-13-2005, 10:48 AM
I think it looks allright

USAflyer
01-13-2005, 11:16 AM
Just buy it and pretend you are in the first star wars movie the next time you do a ground attack mission. STAY ON TARGET.

VMF-451_Yankee
01-13-2005, 11:28 AM
i think shes a beaut... cant wait to get my hands on her this summer...

FatBoyHK
01-13-2005, 12:46 PM
I think it look cool!!.... but I will stay with my cougar http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

georgeo76
01-13-2005, 02:17 PM
I used to think that fixation on appearances, and defining yourself by your belongings was a sign of immaturity. Thanks for setting me straight.

DuxCorvan
01-13-2005, 02:42 PM
I don't look the joystick while I play. They use to shoot at me then. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Daiichidoku
01-13-2005, 02:55 PM
I have a keyboard for buttons....I'll "stick" with my mspp2, thank you

LW_Icarus
01-13-2005, 03:58 PM
Hmm, I like it. it looks just like the best stick Ive ever owned.

It looks like a stick that feels great in my hands.

I like the Blue LEDs too. matches my blue backlit computer, and my blue backlit keyboard as well.

Im not a child, or a star wars pilot.nor do I define my machismo by the appearance of my joystick or other belongings.

If the best tool for the job is fuscia,with bright orange lettering and green LEDs, than thats the tool I want.

capt_frank
01-13-2005, 04:35 PM
i too really like it, great progamability and it's got a good feel to it. best stick setup i've ever had, liteyears ahead of the x45.

flockzap
01-13-2005, 04:41 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by DuxCorvan:
I don't look the joystick while I play. They use to shoot at me then. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Priceless!!!!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

Flockzap

DuxCorvan
01-13-2005, 04:55 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by flockzap:
Dux what´s the name again of the Guy you use as signature <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Marty Feldman. NOW he was priceless.

http://premium1.uploadit.org/DuxCorvan/yf-igorbags.wav

http://www.maroschi.com/marty.jpg

KGr.HH-Sunburst
01-13-2005, 05:10 PM
it looks fricken awesome ,and i want one.

civildog
01-14-2005, 12:03 AM
Who cares what it looks like? It works, is reasonably priced, and for God's sake!, we are playing a game that how many of us would brag about at work?

Well, ok, I do...but that's only because a bunch of us at work form our squadron and if anyone laughs at me about my tales of virtual daring-do they need to remember that I'm armed. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

And my awesome Thrustmaster HOTAS finally wore out. R.I.P.

MO_JOJO
01-14-2005, 12:10 AM
You can always spray paint the thing in zinc-chromate!

Dux, that picture IS great. Mine will be up someday.

But, Capt_Frank...who is your picture of? Wonder Woman's mom? I am somehow always noticing your posts before all others, except for maybe A. Starosta. Thanks in advance.

Orfson
01-14-2005, 01:56 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

capt_frank
01-14-2005, 05:09 AM
mo_jojo,

it's "shirtless girl" from http://www.bobandtom.com

she's quite the adventurarian...

MO_JOJO
01-14-2005, 05:34 AM
Thanks, Capt. I am familiar with their show, but don't tune in often enough to know of her.

Like I said earlier, I know of at least 2 reasons I'm glad you post. Salute to you, sir!

Codex1971
01-21-2005, 01:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by StudUK:
"..Nice stick tho"

agreed does sound like a great stick. I'm in my thirties, I have a mature setup I dont want something on my desk that resembles a joystick that Buzz lightyear would use http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I would be embarrassed to use it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well I'm 34 and just got it....116+ programble functions....who cares how it looks.\\Laptop\shareddocs\My Pictures\DSC01147.JPG

Hristo_
01-21-2005, 01:23 AM
How does one compare to a CH Fighterstick ?

I own a Fighterstick and am very pleased with it, but X52 looks cool to me. As for looks, it kind of fits into a Fw 190, I'd say http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Salfordian
01-21-2005, 08:04 AM
Does look kind of futuristic-y, but who cares. Like the TM Cougar thingy, smart stick and I'd get one if I could afford it, but how many F16-style hotas setups do you see in a WW2 fighter plane, yet many people still have it.

BlitzPig_DDT
01-21-2005, 08:27 AM
It's a toy, so it's look reflects that. It's for semi-serious people with low cash flows to get a HOTAS for their games.

Nothing wrong with that, and I'd like to have one for Wing Commander and other space games. But for aircraft, there is only one HOTAS -
http://cougar.frugalsworld.com/images/cougar/duo1.jpg

Yes, as pointed out, it is a replica of an F-16 set up, but, this stick moves, unlike an F-16's.

After using cold metal, all plastic sticks are toys. Not even to mention it's raw hardware capabilities or progammability (it has it's own language, and Foxy kicks a$$). And the community and mods available for it are simply astounding.

It's the sports car of HOTAS's. And let's be honest, who buys a (probably expensive, but certainly not cheap) performance car and leaves it alone? Only poseurs. Doesn't matter of a C6 Z06 will cost in the $70G area, people who buy them will still be spending more money modifiying them. This is no different. So don't expect it to be a Volvo.

I can't justify spending more than $30 on a toy-stick, though I need one. And for the B5 sim, I need HOTAS functionality. I'm hoping to score an X-45 for cheap. Even the $70 I've seen them going for is just more than it's worth.

Stanger_361st
01-21-2005, 09:30 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by georgeo76:
I used to think that fixation on appearances, and defining yourself by your belongings was a sign of immaturity. Thanks for setting me straight. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif
My manhood is not threaten using X-52.
Had to get use to the easier throw. Needed to remap sliders in game. I did not realise how much I was ham fisting the old x-45.

Hristo_
01-21-2005, 09:37 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BlitzPig_DDT:
It's a toy, so it's look reflects that. It's for semi-serious people with low cash flows to get a HOTAS for their games.

Nothing wrong with that, and I'd like to have one for Wing Commander and other space games. But for aircraft, there is only one HOTAS -
http://cougar.frugalsworld.com/images/cougar/duo1.jpg

Yes, as pointed out, it is a replica of an F-16 set up, but, this stick moves, unlike an F-16's.

After using cold metal, all plastic sticks are toys. Not even to mention it's raw hardware capabilities or progammability (it has it's own language, and Foxy kicks a$$). And the community and mods available for it are simply astounding.

It's the sports car of HOTAS's. And let's be honest, who buys a (probably expensive, but certainly not cheap) performance car and leaves it alone? Only poseurs. Doesn't matter of a C6 Z06 will cost in the $70G area, people who buy them will still be spending more money modifiying them. This is no different. So don't expect it to be a Volvo.

I can't justify spending more than $30 on a toy-stick, though I need one. And for the B5 sim, I need HOTAS functionality. I'm hoping to score an X-45 for cheap. Even the $70 I've seen them going for is just more than it's worth. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That thing is still selling ?! I mean, it costs 250$+ and you need to invest just as much money after you buy it to get it working like other sticks. NOT recommended.

Had one myself, after owning F22 (digital upgrade) and was disapointed in lack of precision near the center and spiking/jitter after couple of months.

Sold it for 50$ and bought myself a nice CH setup. Never looked back.

IMHO, I'd take CH over TM any day.

BlitzPig_DDT
01-21-2005, 10:16 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hristo_:
That thing is still selling ?! I mean, it costs 250$+ and you need to invest just as much money after you buy it to get it working like other sticks. NOT recommended.

Had one myself, after owning F22 (digital upgrade) and was disapointed in lack of precision near the center and spiking/jitter after couple of months.

Sold it for 50$ and bought myself a nice CH setup. Never looked back.

IMHO, I'd take CH over TM any day. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's because you didn't know what you were getting into when you bought it. You had unrealistic expectations.

1. You DO NOT need to spend ANY money on it after purchasing. This is a total FALLACY.

2. This is a hobby unto itself. It is only for people interested in tinkering (and who want the ultimate in programability). You will WANT to spend money on it, but that's not even close to the same thing.

If you never want to tinker with or mod your rig, then you are not ready for a Cougar.

Don't buy a PC expecting a Mac. Don't buy a PC flight sim expecting a console arcade game. Don't by an advanced level gas powered RC helo expecting a pre-assembled beginner electric. And most importantly, do not tell someone they should not buy something because of your own personal disappointment caused by unrealistic expectations.

Hristo_
01-21-2005, 10:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BlitzPig_DDT:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hristo_:
That thing is still selling ?! I mean, it costs 250$+ and you need to invest just as much money after you buy it to get it working like other sticks. NOT recommended.

Had one myself, after owning F22 (digital upgrade) and was disapointed in lack of precision near the center and spiking/jitter after couple of months.

Sold it for 50$ and bought myself a nice CH setup. Never looked back.

IMHO, I'd take CH over TM any day. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's because you didn't know what you were getting into when you bought it. You had unrealistic expectations.

1. You DO NOT need to spend ANY money on it after purchasing. This is a total FALLACY.

2. This is a hobby unto itself. It is only for people interested in tinkering (and who want the ultimate in programability). You will WANT to spend money on it, but that's not even close to the same thing.

If you never want to tinker with or mod your rig, then you are not ready for a Cougar.

Don't buy a PC expecting a Mac. Don't buy a PC flight sim expecting a console arcade game. Don't by an advanced level gas powered RC helo expecting a pre-assembled beginner electric. And most importantly, do not tell someone they should not buy something because of your own personal disappointment caused by unrealistic expectations. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Here's my take on it. You pay for a stick which is advertised as end all be all stick of them all.

What you get is clunky metal garbage with only superficial quality. When you open it you can admire at the el cheapo potentiometers TM decided to put in. Fallacy ? Open your stick and check. After a month or two, you can check the increasing center play due to "superb metal construction" wear. Fallacy ? Don't tell me your stick has no center play.

The thing inevitably spikes and loses precision. Without exception.

So you need HAL mod (something X52 already has out of the box, to my knowledge). How much is that ? 180$ last I checked.

Then you get to fight center wobble and stiff springs. Combined, they present you an effective center detent. No precision here, your gunnery goes down the toilet. To fix it, you need anywhere from 200$ to 500$ last I checked. Kudos to guys who came up with fixes though.

So, let me get it straigh. I didn't know what I was getting myself into when I bought it ?

You are absolutely right.

The most expensive stick of the market which needs about 500$ more to make it work as advertised. So, I need to invest roughly 800$ and pretend my stick is somehow superior, even though it doesn't do anything better than other sticks for 1/5 of the price ? Sorry, not me.

The only great part of the Cougar is done by James Hallows and it is its programability. But don't think it is the best and hardly ultimate. Recent CH Manager versions by Bob Church are just as powerful.

I base my opinions on 3 years of TM F22/TQS/Elites use, 1 year of Cougar use and 2 years of CH FIghterstick/USB throttle/simpeds use.

What do you base your opinions on, BlitzPig ? Just curious.

BlitzPig_DDT
01-21-2005, 11:15 AM
Even though you seem to lack the power of observation necessary to discern name from squad, you quoted me, and are obviously pi$$ed off for being called on your BS, so must be talking to me.

You continue to prove you didn't know what you were getting yourself into. You didn't do your homework before hand. You blindly did something, and so naturally, it must be the objects fault. And in further typical fashion, you threw a hissy fit and spread lies and insist everyone stay away. The lack of knowledge is so apparent it's not even funny.

BTW, just FYI - I've had a Cougar since AEP came out. I have spent next to nothing on it. I've never had a problem with it. I have no centerplay. I do intend to spend money and time on it and work with the community that has come up with some truly awesome mods. If I ever lost mine, I'd buy another and not fly until I had it.

I've used CH, I've used Saitek, I've used M$, I've used Logitech. Fine toys and perfect for arcade games. If it's all someone can afford, go for it. If they are too physically weak to deal with some spring resistance (as you must be based on your emotional outburst), then by all means, get the plastic stuff. If they just want something to function as a basic stick and never want to spend 1 dime or 1 minute on the internals, go with the others. Unlike you, I won't insist people stay away from something I don't like. But then, also unlike you I'm not prone to such menstrual outbursts from buying something I didn't like, because I find out what I'm getting into before I commit.

Little analogy for ya - "The C6 Z06 is advertised as the be all end all sports car. But if you want it to be that, you have to spend thousands of dollars on it after already spending more than $60,000 to buy it. What a rip off!"

You are responsible for any false impressions you get about something.

Hristo_
01-21-2005, 11:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BlitzPig_DDT:
Even though you seem to lack the power of observation necessary to discern name from squad, you quoted me, and are obviously pi$$ed off for being called on your BS, so must be talking to me.

You continue to prove you didn't know what you were getting yourself into. You didn't do your homework before hand. You blindly did something, and so naturally, it must be the objects fault. And in further typical fashion, you threw a hissy fit and spread lies and insist everyone stay away. The lack of knowledge is so apparent it's not even funny.

BTW, just FYI - I've had a Cougar since AEP came out. I have spent next to nothing on it. I've never had a problem with it. I have no centerplay. I do intend to spend money and time on it and work with the community that has come up with some truly awesome mods. If I ever lost mine, I'd buy another and not fly until I had it.

I've used CH, I've used Saitek, I've used M$, I've used Logitech. Fine toys and perfect for arcade games. If it's all someone can afford, go for it. If they are too physically weak to deal with some spring resistance (as you must be based on your emotional outburst), then by all means, get the plastic stuff. If they just want something to function as a basic stick and never want to spend 1 dime or 1 minute on the internals, go with the others. Unlike you, I won't insist people stay away from something I don't like. But then, also unlike you I'm not prone to such menstrual outbursts from buying something I didn't like, because I find out what I'm getting into before I commit.

Little analogy for ya - "The C6 Z06 is advertised as the be all end all sports car. But if you want it to be that, you have to spend thousands of dollars on it after already spending more than $60,000 to buy it. What a rip off!"

You are responsible for any false impressions you get about something. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


No need to go to insults, as I won't lower myself to that level. My apologies to possible squad/name confusion, but I still don't know which is which in your case. I never tried to offend you in any way though.

Personal things aside, I can understand the unwillingness to admit that something one has payed so dearly actually isn't working as advertised.

You say I had unrealistic expectations ? So, stability and smoothness are unrealistic of a 250$+ stick ?

Well, I got what I expected from a CH Fighterstick. Cougar failed to deliver.

If your Cougar doesn't have the faults mentioned, consider yourself lucky. Check at www.frugalsworld.com (http://www.frugalsworld.com) how even some die hard TM fans ditched the Cougar. One of them is surfing this very board, so he might join the discussion. I believe he had 4 Cougars prior to his CH combo.

And what if your expectations are less than realistic ? If something can function as an effective doorstop, it doesn't mean it is a good joystick.

"it can't be bad - it's a Cougar !" mindset is the only thing Cougar has going for it. Such irrationality won't make your stick better though.

My homework, you say ? Well, I was one of the first to sign the petition to TM to start producing another HOTAS after F22 was discontinued. Along with suggestions to go HAL instead of pots. I was the one to upgrade my F22 to digital to make it better. Even did Cowboy Wilson's bypass in to fix the jitter.

My Cougar arrived with broken throttle lever. No big deal, I fixed it and gave it a fair chance. I did fix the wear with an user mod, which lasted for a while. After that it wore out more and center play returned.

I even considered to go HAL, but after examining alternatives, I found out it just wasn't worth it. Instead, I dumped the Cougar. A much healthier proposal.

I dumped the metal fetish you seem to be obsessed with and went plastic. For the weak, you know http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

Please don't go about physical abilities or weakness/strength, as you are unlikey to ever meet me in person. And even if you would, let me tell you that I am probably fairly stronger than you might imagine.

Cougar stiffness is the last thing that would bother me.

Stiff springs were actually to my taste, you know, as it suits E style flying more.

BlitzPig_DDT
01-21-2005, 12:55 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hristo_:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BlitzPig_DDT:
Even though you seem to lack the power of observation necessary to discern name from squad, you quoted me, and are obviously pi$$ed off for being called on your BS, so must be talking to me.

You continue to prove you didn't know what you were getting yourself into. You didn't do your homework before hand. You blindly did something, and so naturally, it must be the objects fault. And in further typical fashion, you threw a hissy fit and spread lies and insist everyone stay away. The lack of knowledge is so apparent it's not even funny.

BTW, just FYI - I've had a Cougar since AEP came out. I have spent next to nothing on it. I've never had a problem with it. I have no centerplay. I do intend to spend money and time on it and work with the community that has come up with some truly awesome mods. If I ever lost mine, I'd buy another and not fly until I had it.

I've used CH, I've used Saitek, I've used M$, I've used Logitech. Fine toys and perfect for arcade games. If it's all someone can afford, go for it. If they are too physically weak to deal with some spring resistance (as you must be based on your emotional outburst), then by all means, get the plastic stuff. If they just want something to function as a basic stick and never want to spend 1 dime or 1 minute on the internals, go with the others. Unlike you, I won't insist people stay away from something I don't like. But then, also unlike you I'm not prone to such menstrual outbursts from buying something I didn't like, because I find out what I'm getting into before I commit.

Little analogy for ya - "The C6 Z06 is advertised as the be all end all sports car. But if you want it to be that, you have to spend thousands of dollars on it after already spending more than $60,000 to buy it. What a rip off!"

You are responsible for any false impressions you get about something. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


No need to go to insults, as I won't lower myself to that level. My apologies to possible squad/name confusion, but I still don't know which is which in your case. I never tried to offend you in any way though.

Personal things aside, I can understand the unwillingness to admit that something one has payed so dearly actually isn't working as advertised.

You say I had unrealistic expectations ? So, stability and smoothness are unrealistic of a 250$+ stick ?

Well, I got what I expected from a CH Fighterstick. Cougar failed to deliver.

If your Cougar doesn't have the faults mentioned, consider yourself lucky. Check at http://www.frugalsworld.com how even some die hard TM fans ditched the Cougar. One of them is surfing this very board, so he might join the discussion. I believe he had 4 Cougars prior to his CH combo.

And what if your expectations are less than realistic ? If something can function as an effective doorstop, it doesn't mean it is a good joystick.

"it can't be bad - it's a Cougar !" mindset is the only thing Cougar has going for it. Such irrationality won't make your stick better though.

My homework, you say ? Well, I was one of the first to sign the petition to TM to start producing another HOTAS after F22 was discontinued. Along with suggestions to go HAL instead of pots. I was the one to upgrade my F22 to digital to make it better. Even did Cowboy Wilson's bypass in to fix the jitter.

My Cougar arrived with broken throttle lever. No big deal, I fixed it and gave it a fair chance. I did fix the wear with an user mod, which lasted for a while. After that it wore out more and center play returned.

I even considered to go HAL, but after examining alternatives, I found out it just wasn't worth it. Instead, I dumped the Cougar. A much healthier proposal.

I dumped the metal fetish you seem to be obsessed with and went plastic. For the weak, you know http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

Please don't go about physical abilities or weakness/strength, as you are unlikey to ever meet me in person. And even if you would, let me tell you that I am probably fairly stronger than you might imagine.

Cougar stiffness is the last thing that would bother me.

Stiff springs were actually to my taste, you know, as it suits E style flying more. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You can't figure out which is which? While I might be the only BlitzPig to post under the full title (for a username), the others mention it in their sigs. I've seen your name around for awhile, so I find it suspect that you don't know about the BlitzPigs. Even if we have mostly abandonded this place as of a few years ago.

You were the one that brought up the stiffness. In the first place, it's not that stiff. But since you complained about it, what else is one to think? And there are many who do, bitterly, complain about the spring tension on the TM products. They prefer the almost non-existant feel of the Saitek X series. Which is fine. But they should not castigate the Cougar because of it, or try to tell others to stay away from it.

I paid $270 for mine. Got them very soon after they came out. From Amazon with free shipping.

I spend a fair amount of time at Cougar world. You however, either have not, OR, take away only what you want to take away. Another typical human trait BTW.

Point of logic, you had an impression of a product that is more than what is actually advertised (thanks to the intentional vague-ness of the campaign, but marketers are slimy like that). You were disappointed with what you got. Since your expectations were not met by reality, you therefore did not do enough research to understand what you were getting into. Take it as an insult if you wish, but it's true, nevertheless.

For example, 2 people I know personally have bought Cougars and not regretted it. Why? Well, because for one thing, the problems are not as overblown as you intentionally imply. For another, there was no disappointment for them because I carefully explained to them the reality of what they were getting into. And most importantly, after using mine, they tried to bring themselves to settle for an X45 due to finances, but couldn't do it and held out for a Cougar (and as mentioned, never looked back).

You bring up another tired, trite, and totally bogus idea. That because I paid $270, it must be the best thing ever created. I don't know what you do for a living, but I work in IT. I am saddled with nightmarish "solutions" that I have to maintain because management is throwing good money after bad. It's not because they feel "it must be good" after the expense, but rather they can't admit a mistake and cut their losses because it would mean a firing. I know full well the results of throwing good money after bad and I hate it. How would it make sense, for someone who is broke, to spend a large amount on something, only to talk themselves into liking it to justify the expenditure already made, as well as that amount yet again fixing it when $70 could acquire something better? It doesn't. So obviously, the alternative isn't better for the person in question. (here's something for ya, some people shouldn't buy the Cougar because it's too big for them. I can't buy the X45 for full time use because my hand is too big for that funky D shaped stick (the pinky button crushes my fingers if I force them in). Yeah, beleive it or not the X45 *isn't* inherently better for everyone)

I'd prefer to spend much less. Always. But economics is pretty simple and hard to get around. Likewise I'd also like to see higher quality materiels used in everything I buy. Why does a $45,000 C6 have plastic in it's interior? Aluminum, magnesium, wood, and leather are so much nicer, and the argument you are using is, "for that money, they should have done better". Well, unfortunately, if they had "done better", it would have cost more. So we live with it.

I knew going in that long term hard use (read - abuse) will cause play to develop. And I HATE center play. With a passion. But I saw how easy it was to mod, and how active the community was, and decided it was acceptable.

I repeat, it's a hobby in it's own right.

Do you drive a Honda Civic or some such? Just curious. I own 2 Pontiacs. My toy is a 2002 WS6 Trans Am. The baddest thing this side of a Corvette. Z06 at that.

[BPs reading this, I apologize in advance, this is not a shot at you or slam against you -] I know some people that drive Honda's that rag on me about my choice of cars. The same issues you are on about with sticks are what they are on about with cars - total required maintenance, cost of purchase, TCO, and long term reliability (as well as some others). Will my car be more expensive to maintain over it's lifetime (higher TCO)? Unquestionably. Is an Accord, or Civic, or Integra cheaper to buy? Yes. Does this mean I have talked myself into likeing it more to justify the expense? Hardly. And I have already spend nearly $900 on a car that cost me $26,000. Why? Why should I have to spend money to improve something that costs so much and is supposed to be such a great performer out of the box? Because it's there! Because I want to! Out of the box my car looks far better than any Honda, and will blow the doors off any Honda (even an NSX) in just about any type of racing you care to mention. And I'm spending money to take it even higher. And I will be in quite a lot by the time I'm done.

By your argument, I'm wasting money, and just fooling myself.

Sticks are no different. The Cougar is a sports car. You WILL (almost certainly) spend money on it after you buy it. It will have a higer TCO than a sedate counterpart. Its just the way it is. And if you don't want that, fine, it's not for you, you aren't ready for it. But if you are going to tell anyone else to stay away because of this, then STFU. Seriously.


(not to exclude the CH stuff.... The Cougar is seen as 1 device by Windows. The CH suite is not. Stick+Throttle+pedals is 3 devices. Some games will have problems with this arrangement. Not so with the cougar. Furthermore, tactile quality is extremely important. Let's take another analogy real quick - Good keyboards are hard to find. And they tend to not have Windows keys on them, which is a drawback because I use those shortcuts a lot. So, I could spend lots of time and potentially money searching for a good keyboard that is likely to be fussy, or, I could spend $5 on a modern cheap plastic keyboard with no tactile response. Not me. That mushy **** sucks. I want a solid keyboard with positive tactile response, even if it is a little more "expensive" and can be argued as not as good as something else (lack of Windows key). Well, ditto the CH Fighterstick. Light, flimsy, and cheap feeling. Even the buttons. Totally unpleasant and unacceptable. Reminiscent of Ford actually. Total "mush" everywhere (steering, brakes, gear change, even the igition) and absolutely unacceptable - to me)

Kasdeya
01-21-2005, 03:11 PM
I think its over now, you guys can come back and post about the X52. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif


Hristo_ and DDT, Its a **** joystick, not your own moms, so... take it easy. each his own and stuff.

steiner562
01-21-2005, 04:03 PM
HI guys,I have had the x-52 for the last week and a half, and for the most part really pleased with it,lots of buttons/dials/slider to play with as you would expect, plus the saitek smart technology software is excellent for configuring different planesets/games,its not as heavy as I expected,that is probably
the only complaint I have at the moment,its durability we will see,my last stick was a saitek cyborg Gold which still works perfectly nearly 5 years on.Dont care how it looks,was never a consideration when purchasinghttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
regards stein

Hristo_
01-21-2005, 04:46 PM
Kasdeya, you're right, it is just a stick. To each his own http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

CH is recognized as one unit if you use CH manager, the so called control manager device.

BlitzPig_DDT, sorry, but I really didn't know about your squad. I've seen your posts and remember your sig from way back though.

P.S.
I drive a BMW in real life. What else do you expect from a Fw 190 type ? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Petrosky
01-21-2005, 10:02 PM
im 54 and bought one for second puter. Son who is 31 got one and he says its the best hes owned more things to program than a micowave oven! I havent used mine yet but have watched him fly with his its got all kinds of sliders and things i have no idea what! but he bombs and dfs very well with it.my humble opinion.