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civildog
03-25-2005, 01:22 PM
I know some may have seen my treatise on anither thread but I thought we could explore my thesis more fully on it's own. Mainly because the other thread started getting off track and too serious.

I see really three basic reasons why the Germans would never win. No doubt this will cause a storm and
flurry of rants but so be it, someone around here needs to have the ******
to tell the truth.

1) The Germans had a lousy soundtrack.

You just can't fight a war and win listening to the WW2 era equivalent of
Goth. Lili Marlene is nice, especially with the long-legged Blue Angel
singing it to you while wearing stiletto-heeled jackboots and smoking a
black cheroot in some dark cabaret, but it's a pretty depressing song
really. The Wagnerian bluster works only while you are strafing Poles
fleeing from your Stuka otherwise it's just distracting. Same with all
those spiffy marching songs: the Panzerlied works only while your chasing
Frenchmen across the Maginot Line or rolling across North Africa until some
skinny guy in a tommypot holding a cane pops up and spoils the party.

And by the time the Germans were trying to unfreeze their posteriors from
the mud around Stalingrad all the poor guys had to listen to were the nasal
shriekings of a twisted little gnome in Berlin telling all the world what a
great Christmas the troops were having that year defeating the untermensch.
Yeah, that must have really caused some dissonance in the poor guys.

On the Allies side we had the boogie-woogie sounds of big time swing. Any
corn-fed farmboy from Iowa, scrappy stickball tough guy from Brooklyn, or
Cockney brawler from the Thames could really kick some serious Jerry rear
up one side of France and down the other knowing they the Andrews Sisters to
go home to. And Glenn Miller's "American Patrol" coming out of your
headphones would be enough to make any propjockey a Chuck Yeager. Even the
Russians had some serious heavyweight tunes in the form of al those
"Workers-Kill-the -Fascists!" songs. And the weepy gypsy music was perfect
background for partisans everywhere.

2) The Germans always shot all the good generals.

Everytime the Germans found some really gret general too whoop the Allies in
a last ditch battle the poor guy is hamstrung by politics and then fails.
The evil guy in the leather trenchcoat and fedora then steps in and says
with a knowing sneer, "You haff failed der Fuerher for der last time, Herr
Oberstleutnant!", which only tells the audience that it was all a setup
anyway.

Just look what they did to Rommel. And Robert DeNiro in "The Eagle has
Landed"!

Eventually the snake ate it's tale and that was that.

3) Too many wacky schemes gone wrong.

The Germans couldn't pull off a secret mission to save their bratwurst from
a blind dachshund. Other than rescuing Mussolini the German commando was
useless. They were always getting throw away in cockamamie schemes to
kidnap Churchill or find the Holy Grail. And they always failed for the
same reasons the general who planned the operation would then get shot for
later.

Look how the Allies did it! You want to kill some Nazi general or wipe out
his entire command? Just round up a dozen psychopaths from Death Row to
airdrop behind enemy lines and turn them lose with enough firepower to level
a South American weekend government and more pardons than the Nixon
Administration for the survivors. Do it again in a couple sequels and round
it off with some assorted misfits to blow up various guns, bridges, and
ships and the war is over before you can say "Gott im Himmel!" It didn't
matter if Charles Bronson looked like everything the Nazis tried to wipe
out, stick him in an SS uniform and drop him behind enemy lines and it's
just crazy enough to work!


So there is my thesis. I dare any of you to dispute it. I have an entire
DVD and video collection of references that say I right so anything else is
twaddle.

Iron-Works
03-25-2005, 01:24 PM
I agree 100%....I see you have done your homework. There is no disputing these facts.

Capt.England
03-25-2005, 01:42 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/353.gif
Iron-Works, Is that Frank the dog out of Men in Black?

CivilDog, You also forgot that most of the evil German generals were British actors posted in postions of the German army before the war. Also was the fact that Herr Hitler looks too much like Mr Bean with a dodgy tash. I think they must be related!

woofiedog
03-25-2005, 02:09 PM
Why did the Allies Win. Because we [the Allies] had these in our Hanging Around to Play with!

http://home.aol.com/nukeinfo2/GrandSlamAmazonorSampson22kbombs3.jpg http://home.aol.com/nukeinfo2/t12onnose.jpg

As we can see in IL-2 the Germans only had these.

http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/images/lrg0152.jpg
http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/images/lrg0154.jpg

p1ngu666
03-25-2005, 02:35 PM
lol http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

ploughman
03-25-2005, 03:07 PM
Sweet Jesus, a bomb that weighed 43,500 lbs! Perhaps a P-47 could've handled it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

stathem
03-25-2005, 03:11 PM
If thats the one I'm thinking of, A B-29 tried to lift it, and couldn't get more than 10 feet off the ground. Or did they use rocket assist?

Messaschnitzel
03-25-2005, 03:34 PM
Hey CivilDog, You forgot to mention that we had Indian Jones to confound the natzies at every turn before the war! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Woofiedog, don't let the cat outta the bag. Keep the rest of the world wondering why American troops never wear Bermuda shorts! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Capt.LoneRanger
03-25-2005, 03:41 PM
I'm still convinced Germany lost the war, because the good actors are always US or British, while the Germans are lousy actors with some kind of accent that some people think is German. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

ploughman
03-25-2005, 04:08 PM
If the Jerries had actors of the calibre of James Mason and George C Scott they'd've cleaned up no problem. It's clear that the U-Boat campaign was only as successful as it was due to Wolfgang Peterson's direction.

SkyChimp
03-25-2005, 08:37 PM
The Germans didn't have any snow-cone machines, either. Men fight longer and harder after a good snow-cone.

civildog
03-25-2005, 08:58 PM
The Germans did have James Mason in Cross of Iron. That was one example of the "Peterson Intervention", were the Germans were able to make headway because of competent leadership characterization not being eliminated, no wacky scheme to go awry, and a halfway decent soundtrack.

In fact, having the ability to fight in slow motion in Cross of Iron was a technological triumph similar to the initial Me-262. It allowed the German troops to kill vast numbers of the enemy while taking far less casualties than they otherwise would.

Similar to "Bullet Time", but unfortunatley not as advanced so it could only be sustained for brief periods. Between which the Russians would capitalise on the normal time to advance.

Possibly the rivalry common to the German secret weapon projects mean't this was a case of deliberate sabotage. That would follow the logic of the 3rd and 2nd rule and is why the Germans were still defeated in the final battle.

The "Underdog Effect" was also in play (an integral part of the Peterson Intervention) to a large degree and that would explain why the Germans were able to have what level of success they did in spite of the faulty early Bullet-time technique. This is most evident in "Das Boot", were it draws off of sympathetic and empathic emotions to impart strength and resolve to main characters.

Unfortunately the largest part of the Underdog Effect is the formula:

Good Guys' weakness is reduced by the inverse proportion of the Bad Guys' badness (in small increments over time) + the Good Guys' strength is ALSO increased (dramatically, usually at the last minute and triggered by some emotional event) in direct proportion with the amount of the Bad Guys' badness.

So you can see, in spite of the Peterson Intervention the 3 rules above + the Underdog Effect mean't the Germans never had a chance.

SpartanHoplite
03-25-2005, 10:34 PM
You forgot:

4) German fashion sense.

The Germans voluntarily adopted uniforms that cross-culturally must be considered the uniforms of the badguys - blacks and greys with dashes of red, skull motifs, bold lightning bolts. Its like they WANTED to be the badguys!

And the good guys always win in the end. Or at least when things like the colour of your uniform actually makes a difference.

SH

woofiedog
03-26-2005, 06:11 AM
Messaschnitzel... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gifYou might say... judging by the Bomb's in that picture. Well Hung! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

woofiedog
03-26-2005, 06:28 AM
stathem...

http://home.aol.com/nukeinfo2/wb29GrandSlam.jpg
<span class="ev_code_YELLOW">Boeing Wichita modified B-29A loaded with a single Grand Slam bomb. This same photograph was also used in Boeing publicity releases to illustrate the single 42,000 lb T-12 installation. A check at the Boeing Archives has confirmed that this photograph depicts a B-29 loaded with a Grand Slam Thien Collection of the Kansas Aviation Museum via Deborah Livengood</span>

Early summer 1945, three Boeing B-29s were modified to carry a 22,000 lb Grand Slam on external bomb racks under each wing between the inboard engine and fuselage. After experiments at Eglin AAF in Florida, an order for fifty modified aircraft was placed. If the war hadn€t ended with the dropping of the atom bombs, dual Grand Slam B-29s might have been available to see action over Japan by the first week of September. Postwar publicity photographs never show more than three of the dual bomb modified B-29s flying in a formation. That may have been all that were built. Another B-29 was modified so that the lower part of the double bomb bay section would permit the semi external carriage of one large bomb (Tallboy, Grand Slam or T-12?). 20

http://home.aol.com/nukeinfo2/B29withdualTallboyinstallationdetail2.jpg
<span class="ev_code_YELLOW">Detail of a B-29 carrying two Tallboys on pylons located near the wing root. At least three B-29s were converted to carry Tallboys or Grand Slams in this configuration. USAF</span>

SUPERAEREO
03-26-2005, 06:30 AM
CivilDog, I think you really hit the nail on the head this time, and historical research on WW2 will be forever changed by your discoveries!!!

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

I salute you!!!

S!

FlatSpinMan
03-26-2005, 08:22 AM
While these are all valid points, Civildog, I feel it necessary to mention that in addition to the poorly characterised leadership,inadequate soundtracking and overabundance of crafty schemes, the fact that the vast majority of Wehrmacht and SS infantry underwent marksmanship training at the Bad Guys' Shooting Academy was also a significant, if not crucial, element in their undoing.

Further examples of Bad Guys' Shooting Academy attendees include the Soviet infantry in Afghanistan, as depicted in the gritty, hard-hitting documentary "Rambo II".

Even long , long ago, in a galaxy far, far away one may easily observe all the hallmarks of the BGSA in the weapons handling of the Imperial Stormtroopers who were utterly unable to resist, let alone counter, the attentions of a race of giant hamsters in close-quarter jungle warfare, despite their outstanding successes some 30 years earlier against the Trade Federation's large, mobile, technologically sophisticated droid army.

One also feels that a singular lack of "pluck" and "cool", as was displayed by the British and American troops respectively, may have been another contributing factor to the demise of the Thousand Year Reich some 988 years ahead of schedule.



================================================

BuzzU
03-26-2005, 09:40 AM
They all had bad knees from goosestepping too. You can't fight a war with bad knees.

Monty_Thrud
03-26-2005, 10:39 AM
And all that dodgy saluting...they kept poking their generals eyes out...so with bad knees and half blind generals...they were bound to lose http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

PBNA-Boosher
03-26-2005, 12:43 PM
P-51 won the war.

civildog
03-26-2005, 02:05 PM
Pluck and Cool...exactly, as best exhibited by the British in nearly every campaign. Even the infamous Bridge too Far operation which has the Germans winning a Pyhrric victory over the coolest British commander under fire in any battle. Anyone who will walk out on a brideg with a hunting bugle and face a Panzergrenadier unit with nothing but a cane is pretty cool.

In the face of that the initial German counter attack was thouroughly demoalized and failed. Later the Germans were reduced to leveling the area with heavy artillery in order to overcome the lasting effects of the above mentioned Bad Guy Shooting Academy (most excellent point FlatSpinMan - it's a constant mystery as to why they learn to shoot that way but it helps explain why there are always so many more Bad Guys than Good Guys most of the time!) and because their rank troops were clearly demoralized in the face of the ultimate plcuk under fire.

We must also give a nod to the beleaguered Poles who also exhibited pluck and cool in the face of overwhelming odds fighting the Grrrmans in that battle (the Polish pronounciation according at that time, possibly was an attempt by the counterintel wienies to add authenticity and throw off any German spies who wouldn't know who the heck Hackman was talking about).

Obviously the Germans failed once again to learn the lessons from their thorough spanking at the hands of a few British pilots led by Michael Caine (and his dog) in the Battle of Britain.

civildog
03-26-2005, 02:23 PM
SpartanHoplite has also hit on an important subconcious effort on Bad Guys everywhere.

When you dress up like your in some S&M slave's fever dream you have to expect to take it in the shorts.

All that black leather and clothing seems to create a gravitational well which appears to be magnified to a focus point centering on those peaked officer hats (again favored by Bad Gus down through time) thus creating a bullet magnet attracting all manner of sporadic casual shots by the Good Guys.

That might help explain why the Good Guys never seem to miss (and have a disproportionate number of headshots) even though they rarely need to take aim and have smaller, fewer weapons. A Good Guy only needs to fire in the general direction of a Bad Guy and the Uniform Black Hole Effect takes over from there to the detriment of the Bad Guy.

This would aslo explain why the Imperial Stormtroopers wore white armor. They failed, however because the effect was reversed dur to everythig around them being the usual black...Vader, interiors of their ships and At-At's, even the under clothes of the armor. That caused a validation of the Black Hole-White Hole Wormhole Theory. The shots by the Good Guys would be attracted to the Black and then the rounds would be drawn through the tunneling effect of the wormhole to reappear at the brightest (whitest), densest point in the area....the White Hole. Unfortunately for the Stormtroopers this would be their closely packed mass attack groups since their was always more of them than of the Good Guys.

FlatSpinMan
03-26-2005, 06:04 PM
Well, seems like that is case closed. I can't see anyone being able to refute any of the excellent hypotheses put forth in this topic.
Yet another example of the sterling intellects on display here on the GD boards.

Messaschnitzel
03-26-2005, 11:41 PM
And all along I always thought that the bad guy's poor marksmanship was due to a USAAF colonel named Hogan. This brave man, along with his brave band of heroes managed to infiltrate every pistol, rifle and machine gun factory in occupied territory with the mission to slightly bend all of the barrels of said weapons. The Germans, not noticing the damaged barrels passed them onto the great war machine. This explains the trouble with the German machine guns in the IL2 game. I hope that everyone realizes that its not the ammo that is the problem...it's the bent barrels! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Monson74
03-27-2005, 04:26 AM
The battle of Hoth was lost because the rebels didn't have enough harpoons - as most military experts know - the snow speeder could only fire one unit per sortie & therefore they failed to disable the AT-ATs. It had nothing to do with the weather conditions.

PraetorHonoris
03-27-2005, 06:01 AM
I hope you don't believe, Oberst Klink and Feldwebel Schultz did not knew about Hogan's activities - they did!

They were the most effective German resistance fighters against Hitler, who masterly pretended to be incompetend towards Hogan, so even if Hogan's organisation would have been infiltrated, there was no danger to Klink's and Schultz' activities.
On the other hand they could present a shining statistic (no POW ever escaped!) and nobody in the Gestapo had any Idea how dangerous Klink and Schultz were.

Consequently they could effectively protect and support Hogan and finally defeated the nazi regime.

SpartanHoplite
03-27-2005, 11:31 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CivilDog:
SpartanHoplite has also hit on an important subconcious effort on Bad Guys everywhere.

When you dress up like your in some S&M slave's fever dream you have to expect to take it in the shorts.

All that black leather and clothing seems to create a gravitational well which appears to be magnified to a focus point centering on those peaked officer hats (again favored by Bad Gus down through time) thus creating a bullet magnet attracting all manner of sporadic casual shots by the Good Guys.

That might help explain why the Good Guys never seem to miss (and have a disproportionate number of headshots) even though they rarely need to take aim and have smaller, fewer weapons. A Good Guy only needs to fire in the general direction of a Bad Guy and the Uniform Black Hole Effect takes over from there to the detriment of the Bad Guy.

This would aslo explain why the Imperial Stormtroopers wore white armor. They failed, however because the effect was reversed dur to everythig around them being the usual black...Vader, interiors of their ships and At-At's, even the under clothes of the armor. That caused a validation of the Black Hole-White Hole Wormhole Theory. The shots by the Good Guys would be attracted to the Black and then the rounds would be drawn through the tunneling effect of the wormhole to reappear at the brightest (whitest), densest point in the area....the White Hole. Unfortunately for the Stormtroopers this would be their closely packed mass attack groups since their was always more of them than of the Good Guys. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well said!

However, I believe there is another fashion element that must be explored more closely that adds to your Wormhole theory - the uniformness of the uniform. This helps explain WW2, the Cold War and also the Stormtrooper syndrom referenced above.

Bullets, projectiles and the like are attracted to sameness and uniformity. Badguys, for reasons that escape me - perhaps realizing they are, in fact, the badguys, or perhaps out of some sense of masochism - are compelled to dress with a high degree of uniformity. Witness:

WW2
Germans - blacks and greys. Crisp. Clean. Knee high black boots. No individuality in their uniforms.

Allies - greens and tans. Rumpled. Dirty. Often sporting personal markings, such as religious symbols, informal crests. Large parts of the uniform seem, in fact, optional.

Star Wars
Stormtroopers - completely uniform.
Rebels - dirty and haphazard. Sometimes, no uniform at all.

Cold War
Now, here, I believe is what truly validates the theory. In WW2, the Soviets neatly fit into the above noted "allies" description - their uniforms were browns, dirty and personalized with odd nick-nacks, straps, random helmets and berets and caps, and soviet medals. With the end of WW2 and the beginning of the Cold War, the Soviets suddenly become entirely uniform - long coats and shapka furry hats, horizontal stripped t-shirts, etc. No individuality. The Soviets are immediately transformed from "goodguys" to "badguys".

For your consideration.

SH

horseback
03-27-2005, 06:13 PM
And let's not forget "big hat syndrome", the tendency for totalitarians in general to costume themselves in military headgear that Douglas MacArthur would have found excessive, i.e., those hats with the swooping peaks, a fancy crest, tons of braid and a patent leather brim.

Still very popular with South American militaries, Mideastern despotisms, Red China and North Korea. A reliable indicator of scumbag governments to this day.

cheers

horseback

tank_hunter
03-27-2005, 07:49 PM
Quite an amazing link, truly the best to ever appear in these forums. Civildog, you are, as if Leonardo DiCaprio himself couldn't have said it better, the "king of the world".

Loki-PF
03-27-2005, 08:06 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SkyChimp:
The Germans didn't have any snow-cone machines, either. Men fight longer and harder after a good snow-cone. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Snow Cones?! I thought it was Hot-Dogs chimp?

civildog
03-27-2005, 11:40 PM
You know, I think the Uniform Theory of Conformity that Academician SpartanHoplite has brought up may have some merit.

It meshes with the earlier observation about the goose-stepping. The Germans goose-stepped, wore big hats, and liked big rallies....the Soviets liked big hats, they goose-stepped (at least the ceremonial guards did), and liked big rallies and parades...the Italians did the same thing, the Chinese, North Koreans.....well, they are still doing it.

On and on. What's really amazing is that none of these groups ever clue in on this phenomenon. It seems to be universal yet it happens again and again. It must tap into an archetype lurking in the mass subconcious. Perhaps it's a subconcious self-destructive impulse similar to the lemmings.

A dictator gets in power....all the giant statues, big hats, and manuals of arms (from the Bad Guy Shooting Academy) are ordered out of some Banana Repubulic Weekend Government Catalog, and the country goes mad.

So I see the general populace must bring this self-destructive archetype to the fore of the mass subconcious and they all goosestep off the cliffs of war in big hats and shiny boots!

Siwarrior
03-28-2005, 02:10 AM
Think about it,
how could one win a war when we cross 2 armies in front of each other? (Stalingrad)

NorrisMcWhirter
03-28-2005, 03:24 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by horseback:
And let's not forget "big hat syndrome", the tendency for totalitarians in general to costume themselves in military headgear that Douglas MacArthur would have found excessive, i.e., those hats with the swooping peaks, a fancy crest, tons of braid and a patent leather brim.

Still very popular with South American militaries, Mideastern despotisms, Red China and North Korea. A reliable indicator of scumbag governments to this day.

cheers

horseback <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So, the premise is that large fancy hats = evil dictator

....would you classify a 10-gallon hat as large and fancy? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Cheers,
Norris

Artic_Wulf
03-28-2005, 04:31 AM
You could put forward a hundred hypothetical ideas as to why.

We are just men (and Women)
Despite all our accomplishments and our Wisdom,
we are born we grow old and die, and return to dust and ashes blowing in the wind.
(usualy well within 100 years of the day we where born)

Mind you, we have the Wisdom of hindsight, and that does help us to understand some things,over the history of our kind and the planet we live on.

God gives power to whom ever he pleases in the Kingdom of men!

You could be excused for doubting the wisdom of giving the Nazis such power!
Until you look back with the wisdom of hindsight.
The Nazis where never going to win, they where given their short time in power, they served their purpose in the greater scheme of things.

Truly world events occured on a Biblical Scale, Global War Fare, and oppression of millions of people, including the attempt by the Nazis to exterminate the Jews as a race amongst men.

Yes indeed the Satanic plan !
After all if there are no Jews left then how can the Nation of Israel be reborn as fore told in the Bible!

Still the Nation of Israel was reborn only a few years after hostilities ended, in 1948.

So we can hypothsize all we like, or we can take a look at History, the only thing we can say for certain is that 100 years from now, anybody reading this post now, will be dust or ashes blowing in the wind.

ericson
03-28-2005, 06:27 AM
Things could have gone the Axis way on the music front. There was that terrible disaster in the desert in 1933. "The Desert song". Also according to Spike Milligan. If the British army had not posted lookouts that Woman singing."Wish me luck as you wave me goodbye". Could have lost the Desert war for us.

SpartanHoplite
03-28-2005, 07:13 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CivilDog:
You know, I think the Uniform Theory of Conformity that Academician SpartanHoplite has brought up may have some merit.

It meshes with the earlier observation about the goose-stepping. The Germans goose-stepped, wore big hats, and liked big rallies....the Soviets liked big hats, they goose-stepped (at least the ceremonial guards did), and liked big rallies and parades...the Italians did the same thing, the Chinese, North Koreans.....well, they are still doing it.

On and on. What's really amazing is that none of these groups ever clue in on this phenomenon. It seems to be universal yet it happens again and again. It must tap into an archetype lurking in the mass subconcious. Perhaps it's a subconcious self-destructive impulse similar to the lemmings.

A dictator gets in power....all the giant statues, big hats, and manuals of arms (from the Bad Guy Shooting Academy) are ordered out of some Banana Repubulic Weekend Government Catalog, and the country goes mad.

So I see the general populace must bring this self-destructive archetype to the fore of the mass subconcious and they all goosestep off the cliffs of war in big hats and shiny boots! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Indeed.

And, if G.I. JOE taught me anything when I was a kid, it was that there was a bullet out there with your name on it. The rest were marked "To Whom It May Concern."

Now, far be it for me to argue with the collective experiences of SnakeEyes, Stalker, Rock N' Roll and the like, but perhaps it is more accurate to suggest that all those bullets (or laser blasts, as the case may be) out there with no name on them are actually marked "Anonynous".

As such, bullets tend to seek out anonymnity - best exemplified in carbon-copy Nazis (and their fascist allies), Stormtroopers, Soviets (and their communist comrades) and members of Cobra. Hence the relative easy that the so-called "good guys" are able to snap shoot their enemies in the head from the hip while at a full sprint, as an example.

And G.I. JOE should know, as knowing is half the battle.

SH

horseback
03-28-2005, 09:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by horseback:
And let's not forget "big hat syndrome", the tendency for totalitarians in general to costume themselves in military headgear that Douglas MacArthur would have found excessive, i.e., those hats with the swooping peaks, a fancy crest, tons of braid and a patent leather brim.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So, the premise is that large fancy hats = evil dictator

....would you classify a 10-gallon hat as large and fancy? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Cheers,
Norris <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not without making it out of patent leather, adding a silly brass crest and a half ton of gold or silver braid.

I've lived in the Southwest most of my life, and have a full appreciation of the value of the traditional 'cowboy hat'; they keep you warmer and dryer in the winter, and provide shade and protection from the sun's rays for those of us still skeptical about the value of rub-on sunblock. The design is so obviously utilitarian that the Aussies stole it and tried to disguise their theft by pinning up the brim on one side.

All in all, far superior to a beret, a tam, or even the Great American Baseball Cap, and far less pretentious than a bearskin shako.

cheers

horseback

Iron-Works
03-28-2005, 09:56 AM
Ya'll go easy on NorrisMcWhirter. I know him personally. He's assistant manager at the Mcdonalds in France. You know the one right under that big tower thing.....

Engrs
03-28-2005, 10:47 AM
The Germans lost WW2 thanks to the Greeks. Barbarossa was delayed by six weeks when the Germans had to divert troops to back up the Italians in Greece.

Those wasted six weeks would have had the German army fighting in the Streets of Moscow. A battle that would have made Stalingrad seem like a side show. Long before the winter kicked in.

ploughman
03-28-2005, 11:45 AM
That guy?

BSS_Goat
03-28-2005, 11:50 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ploughman:
That guy? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's him!

NorrisMcWhirter
03-28-2005, 12:20 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Iron-Works:
Ya'll go easy on NorrisMcWhirter. I know him personally. He's assistant manager at the Mcdonalds in France. You know the one right under that big tower thing..... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry..the only time I step into that particular establishment is for a McNumbertwos as it's often the only place you can find semi-clean bogs on the continent.

And that's only if the pubs are closed.

Norris

civildog
03-28-2005, 12:33 PM
That guy all right.

blakduk
03-28-2005, 04:37 PM
You very nearly had the answer to the question why the Axis lost WW2- its actually the accents and bad subtitles.
Every time the Nazis tried to give orders to each other their accented English was so incomprehensible that it led utter confusion in the ranks. Alas, anytime they tried to overcome the confusion by using subtitles they were invariably written in white font in front of white dress-uniform or snow covered landscape.
The only time this didnt occur was when the German navy was locked in a dark and dirty submarine (Das Boot) and they could clearly understand each other.
If only they had used a dark font in Stalingrad they might have had a chance to understand that their commander was actually saying 'B***er me its getting cold, the beers frozen so it must be time to f**k off home!!!'

TheStriker_p51d
03-28-2005, 08:48 PM
P51D. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

triggerhappyfin
03-29-2005, 02:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by horseback:
And let's not forget "big hat syndrome", the tendency for totalitarians in general to <span class="ev_code_RED">costume themselves in military headgear that Douglas MacArthur would have found excessive,</span> i.e., those hats with the swooping peaks, a fancy crest, tons of braid and a patent leather brim.

orseback <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thougt Macarthur was the "pull-your -trousers-up your-armpits" kind of a hero http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

His success was due to japanese laughin there selves to death on sight of him...they had to commit harakiri in order to stop laughin http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

ploughman
03-29-2005, 02:53 AM
I think we've all overlooked the "incompetent sentry" angle. Let's face it, if you're an Axis sentry you're not going to be able to get life insurance at reasonable rates. There are several methods of exiting this vale of tears for the Axis sentry:

1. Gets knifed in the kidney whilst admiring the view.

2. Gets knifed in the kidney whilst lighting a cigarette.

3. Gets knifed in the kidney whilst investigating a strange grating noise that seems to be coming from behind that truck.

4. Gets knifed in the kidney just as he turns around after walking the entire length of a railway bridge.

5. Get's lured into thinking the man with the mid-Western accent dressed as a Wehrmacht officer is in fact an Wehrmacht officer and then gets knifed in the kidney by the Wehrmacht officer's side-kick who can't speak German because he's actually from Brooklyn.

6. Gets knifed in the kidney by someone coming at him from a totally diferrent direction to where he thinks he just may have heard something.

BSS_Goat
03-29-2005, 05:45 AM
D@MN MY KIDNEYS HURT!

Grendel-B
03-29-2005, 06:27 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TheStriker_p51d:
P51D. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Interesting. So the collapse of eastern front doesn't have any meaning in your opinion? One single plane type, whose task was already handled by other types, was responsible for the total collapse of Nazi Germany's military might? How many P-51s fought at Russian Air Force's ranks? What effect P-51 had in the battle of Stalingrad, which turned the tide of the war?

Might it be that the war had already been won by the *Russians* before P-51D came into front line service?

BSS_Goat
03-29-2005, 06:56 AM
Grendel-B <----------- "THAT GUY"

BSS_Goat
03-29-2005, 06:58 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by triggerhappyfin:
Thougt Macarthur was the "pull-your -trousers-up your-armpits" kind of a hero http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif
QUOTE]

That was to keep his nuts from dragging the ground....

ImpStarDuece
03-29-2005, 07:40 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BSS_Goat:
Grendel-B <----------- "THAT GUY" <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You found him! Now, track him down and beat him severly about the head with the Encyclopedia Brittanica and a thesauraus!

ploughman
03-29-2005, 08:24 AM
Now if the Jerries had had access to a thesaurus it would've improved their diction to the point that they wouldn't have had to rely on cliches when engaged in dialogue with Allied soldiers.

The importance of word power in combat cannot be underestimated.

For example:

"For you ze var iz ova."

Would become.

"It seems it's back to the locker room for a martini, old chap. Don't look so glum, as soon as we've wrapped this little lot up I'm sure there'll be another scrap we can all get stuck into."

Faced with superior dialogue of this nature the Allied armies would surely have crumbled.

bolillo_loco
03-29-2005, 01:08 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by woofiedog:
Why did the Allies Win. Because we [the Allies] had these in our Hanging Around to Play with!

http://home.aol.com/nukeinfo2/GrandSlamAmazonorSampson22kbombs3.jpg http://home.aol.com/nukeinfo2/t12onnose.jpg

As we can see in IL-2 the Germans only had these.

http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/images/lrg0152.jpg
http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/images/lrg0154.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

OMG woofiedog stop with those pics :O they are too funny.........woofiedog :O

horseback
03-29-2005, 04:45 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Grendel-B:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TheStriker_p51d:
P51D. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Interesting. So the collapse of eastern front doesn't have any meaning in your opinion? One single plane type, whose task was already handled by other types, was responsible for the total collapse of Nazi Germany's military might? How many P-51s fought at Russian Air Force's ranks? What effect P-51 had in the battle of Stalingrad, which turned the tide of the war?

Might it be that the war had already been won by the *Russians* before P-51D came into front line service? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ya know, if we all chip in, we could get this poor guy a sense of humor transplant.

cheers

horseback

rnzoli
03-30-2005, 06:35 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by horseback:

Ya know, if we all chip in, we could get this poor guy a sense of humor transplant.

cheers

horseback <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

FWIW, it's not so obvious for the non-native English speakers, that this is a humorous thread.

I nearly posted something about better access to natural and human resources, when I realized my misunderstanding.

FlatSpinMan
03-30-2005, 07:03 AM
rnzoli, that is a fair point, I suppose.I'm an english teacher so you'd think I would be aware of such things http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

ploughman
03-30-2005, 09:46 AM
Aha! Allied stealth humour thwarts Axis funny bones. Jokes leave Jerries humourless.
"I'm not getting it," said 'that guy' earlier today.

In other news...