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View Full Version : Vista or not Vista that is the question



J.M.LLOYD
09-16-2007, 12:24 AM
I know an awful lot has been said about this operating sysem, but every day on this forum people are still posting in to say that they are having no end of problems either loading or running 46, and I wonder if we all may have problems when the time comes to load and run "Storm of War, Battle of Britain"? I still find it hard to believe that this vast empire which is Microsoft cannot accommdate perhaps the largest flight simm fraturnity on the planet, with all the time and money spent on it, it still seems a hit or miss affair. So is it still a case, that we all live in hope that a patch will be released by Microsoft and all our troubles will be over? But saying all that, could it still be a good option, DirectX10 will allow us to see games such as"CRYSIS" in all its glory which is soon to be released[Nov07].

So what shall I do? fit XP into my new rig later this year or bite the bullet and go for "Vista"....I live in hope.

Jeff.Morgan.Lloyd

Jediteo
09-16-2007, 05:55 AM
I bought a laptop a few days ago with vista on it. I am pretty happy with it, but the FPS on 46 is pretty terrible. I have a intel duo 1.5 GHZ and 2 GB of RAM, with a GF 8400. Not the best rig, but I should have more than 30 FPS on the okinawa QMB with 1 f4f on it. I would recommend having a dual boot setup, as you would get direct x 10 support with vista (crysis will look INCREDIBLE with dx10) and you will have the better FPS and stability of XP.

The problem is how to set this up, can anyone tell us how to do this?. I have an old XP disk, and the HP recovery disk and vista is already installed.

but I have to say vista has boths its pros and cons, it looks amazing, especially with Aero on, and its very user friendly. It has some stability issues, and it is a memory hog, but so was XP when it came out. XP is for the moment the most stable OS.

XyZspineZyX
09-16-2007, 06:01 AM
I have no problems with Vista 32

Now, at least. When I first got the PC with it, it was nothing but trouble. It's very similar to XP of course, in many ways, but I had to do a fair bit of on-line research just to separate rumor from fact concerning Vista, and then I had to do even more to get it to run the way I wanted

Vista is outperformed by XP for gaming by a small but noticeable margin right now. That said, this machine I'm on right now vastly outperforms my old machine- as it should, actually. But I can also upgrade this machine much much more

I'd say that Vista is not the headache that even I thought it would be, but there's a steep learning curve with it concerning how to wring out best performance, for the average user. I still despise several things about Vista, but I do not think that MS will change those things

XyZspineZyX
09-16-2007, 06:05 AM
Originally posted by Jediteo:
I bought a laptop a few days ago with vista on it. I am pretty happy with it, but the FPS on 46 is pretty terrible. I have a intel duo 1.5 GHZ and 2 GB of RAM, with a GF 8400. Not the best rig, but I should have more than 30 FPS on the okinawa QMB with 1 f4f on it. I would recommend having a dual boot setup, as you would get direct x 10 support with vista (crysis will look INCREDIBLE with dx10) and you will have the better FPS and stability of XP.

The problem is how to set this up, can anyone tell us how to do this?. I have an old XP disk, and the HP recovery disk and vista is already installed.

but I have to say vista has boths its pros and cons, it looks amazing, especially with Aero on, and its very user friendly. It has some stability issues, and it is a memory hog, but so was XP when it came out. XP is for the moment the most stable OS.

Vista sucks up more RAM than is easily believable. I didn't get good performance with my Vista 32, 64x2 AMD, GeForce8600 rig until I got the 3 GB ram. It's not like XP. Vista will use a much greater percentage of memory resources, and it's a variable percentage it seems. It's one of the things I don;t like. I suggest that you get more Ram, pronto

You also should disable Aero if you're gaming. That uses a lot of resources

capt_frank
09-16-2007, 06:08 AM
I've got a dual boot system with XP Media Edition 32 bit on one hard drive and Vista Home Premium 64 bit on another. I'm running a 6600 dual processor, 4 GB ram and dual 7900Gs's in SLI. IL246 just screams on the XP side.

I will continue to use XP as my gaming platform until Vista comes around.

But it's good to have both, like having my cake and eating it too... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

JG6_Oddball
09-16-2007, 07:50 AM
go with XP , they have worked out all the bugs and there are alot more people who know about XP than FISTA, you can always upgrade later http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

as for the HP recovery disk and the old XP disk I think your flat out of luck, I dont think FISTA will let you install XP on dual boot....I might be wrong though.


S!

mortoma
09-16-2007, 08:08 AM
If you have a few extra bucks to spend, get both!! I have used Kingwin mobile racks with extra hard drives for years. All you do is slide in XP in the rack and boot up. The racks mount in an empty CD drive bay. If you later feel like messing with Vista, power down, slide in a rack with another hard drive with Vista on it and away you go.

This is far, far, far, far better than dual booting. Since if you get a virus or crashed hard drive, it would not affect the other/s. Also not a bad idea to have more than one install of XP or for Vista, depends on how many HDs you can afford. The ultimate in luxury, convenience and practicality, since nothing can bring down your PC except a hardware issue.

mortoma
09-16-2007, 08:13 AM
Originally posted by Jediteo:
I bought a laptop a few days ago with vista on it. I am pretty happy with it, but the FPS on 46 is pretty terrible. I have a intel duo 1.5 GHZ and 2 GB of RAM, with a GF 8400. Not the best rig, but I should have more than 30 FPS on the okinawa QMB with 1 f4f on it. I would recommend having a dual boot setup, as you would get direct x 10 support with vista (crysis will look INCREDIBLE with dx10) and you will have the better FPS and stability of XP.

The problem is how to set this up, can anyone tell us how to do this?. I have an old XP disk, and the HP recovery disk and vista is already installed.

but I have to say vista has boths its pros and cons, it looks amazing, especially with Aero on, and its very user friendly. It has some stability issues, and it is a memory hog, but so was XP when it came out. XP is for the moment the most stable OS. I don't recommend dual booting, if you have a crash or bad malware, it will affect the other OS or OSs.
Do what I do, use different hard drives with a Kingwin mobile rack system. Vastly superior.

Da_Godfatha
09-16-2007, 08:48 AM
Correct me if I am wrong, but I think alot of older games have problems with the newer Duo core machines.

Vista just takes a little tweaking and it runs more stable than XP ever did. Anyway, by the end of next year, most new games will ONLY run on Vista. So say some of the European Game companies.

One good thing is, I will be able to play against my grandson and his XBox. I already have "borrowed" his XBox controller for my Race sims. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/metal.gif

Bewolf
09-16-2007, 09:06 AM
Got Vista (home premium x64)a couple of days ago. Initially had great problems with IL2 frameratewise, until I switched over to Direct3D. Works much better now.

The problem obviously is that Open GL and Vista do not like each other at all. That aside everything else runs fine. All in all I have the impression Vista runs much more stable then XP ever did. I am not overly happy, but content with Vista so far.

georgeo76
09-16-2007, 09:16 AM
Haven't they got DX10 running on XP already?

In any case I've upgraded to Vista 64 Home Premium and it sucks. Mostly because of 3rd party driver support. Otherwise Vista runs stable and fast. Unfortunately, much of what Vista is 'running' isn't for the end user, it's for the content companies. Did you know that Vista checks thirty times a second to make sure your not stealing HD content? I spend 90% of my time on Ubuntu these days. Only keep Vista on the dual-boot for gaming.

verbaska
09-16-2007, 12:16 PM
whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The sling and arrows of outrageous fortune
Ot to take arms against the sea of troubles...

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-16-2007, 03:00 PM
Due to pressure from developers and publishers Microsoft has said that they will be allowing DirectX 10 to run on Windows XP. It seems their plan to con users into buying Vista for the oh so special DX10 has failed and blown up in their faces. They also tried to use the whole Vista Live thing like their Xbox, but why would long time PC users want to pay for a service that we have being getting for free for well over a decade. So we can get points? lol. Its also pretty common knowledge that you typical loose 10% performance with Vista over XP. Spend a few hours googling Vista reviews before you decide to make the leap. In my very honest opinion I would stay away from Vista for as long as you possibly can and ask yourself do I really need it.

S!

staticline1
09-16-2007, 03:15 PM
Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
Due to pressure from developers and publishers Microsoft has said that they will be allowing DirectX 10 to run on Windows XP. It seems their plan to con users into buying Vista for the oh so special DX10 has failed and blown up in their faces. They also tried to use the whole Vista Live thing like their Xbox, but why would long time PC users want to pay for a service that we have being getting for free for well over a decade. So we can get points? lol. Its also pretty common knowledge that you typical loose 10% performance with Vista over XP. Spend a few hours googling Vista reviews before you decide to make the leap. In my very honest opinion I would stay away from Vista for as long as you possibly can and ask yourself do I really need it.

S!

Where did you get the information that M$ will allow DX10 to run on XP? Its good news but just want to verify that its true.

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-16-2007, 03:26 PM
Originally posted by staticline1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
Due to pressure from developers and publishers Microsoft has said that they will be allowing DirectX 10 to run on Windows XP. It seems their plan to con users into buying Vista for the oh so special DX10 has failed and blown up in their faces. They also tried to use the whole Vista Live thing like their Xbox, but why would long time PC users want to pay for a service that we have being getting for free for well over a decade. So we can get points? lol. Its also pretty common knowledge that you typical loose 10% performance with Vista over XP. Spend a few hours googling Vista reviews before you decide to make the leap. In my very honest opinion I would stay away from Vista for as long as you possibly can and ask yourself do I really need it.

S!

Where did you get the information that M$ will allow DX10 to run on XP? Its good news but just want to verify that its true. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

MS certainly has not confirmed it in an official statement. I have been reading this for quite some time in hardware forums. After a little googling there is much discussion about it and some say its rumors and some say it will be done by 3rd party. Here are a few links.

http://www.technospot.net/blogs/download-directx-10-for...p-from-alky-project/ (http://www.technospot.net/blogs/download-directx-10-for-windows-xp-from-alky-project/)

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=35110

http://news.softpedia.com/news/DirectX-10-Available-Out...ws-Vista-53066.shtml (http://news.softpedia.com/news/DirectX-10-Available-Outside-of-Windows-Vista-53066.shtml)

Its a very hot subject and Vista sales are low from what I gather and since the new big thing is DX10 powered games what good they going to do with there is nobody to buy them? Why should devs put some much time into them and why would pubs want to loose money? Google a bit and you will see that you can read on the subject for days. In the end who really knows. What I do know is Olegs Storm of War along with any of his sims to follow in the series which probably includes the Korean sim will be in OpenGL. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

DrHerb
09-16-2007, 06:54 PM
the sh1t sandwich is this, people who buy pc's have next to no choice but to have vista installed, I know 2 people who had to pay EXTRA to have XP installed.... My girlfriend's laptop has vista home professional, the boot times are 3x the amount my xp machine boots, (mind you im tryin to convince her to get more ram, 1gig is definately not enough)

mortoma
09-16-2007, 07:11 PM
Why do so many people comment about Vista being much more stable than XP, when XP never had a stability problem to begin with. For crying' out loud XP is far more stable than Win98 was and I have run Win98 for days straight with no problems!!!!! You just have to know the secret of Win98. I still use Win98 to run 4.05m, until I get a new PC this fall or winter. I have used XP for years though and have it on my laptop. Never have had a stability problem with it. I have a good deal of experience with building PCs for people that we put XP on and again, no major trouble..............I am very familiar with XP and I love it.

RickRuski
09-16-2007, 07:33 PM
I seem to remember smilar complaints about 6yrs ago when XP first hit the market, but now every body is being advised to stick with it. Most of the problems we are experiencing with "Vista" may relate to three areas that I have found.

(1) not enough CPU power
(2) Not enough Ram
(3) Installing games into " Program File" ( this is a no no with "Vista" )

This is my new rig:-
6600 core 2 duo
2Gig Ram
XFX 8600GT Graphics

I am running 1946 on perfect settings, but do not fly with cockpit on ( to me it is tunnel vision ). I run the Nvidia settings on balanced which gives me good graphics with very good frame rates. ( average 80--90 fps ). I am extemely happy with "Vista" and would not go back to "XP". Support for OPS earlier than XP will soon not exsist so if you are going to get a new rig my advise is get "Vista" and learn the way it operates, the same as we had to with "XP".

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-16-2007, 07:36 PM
I think I have had XP since 2000 or early 2001 and I have had not one single problem that would be considered OS related. Now 98 would be a different story.

S!

VonGrantoven
09-17-2007, 05:28 AM
XP has been extremely stable on both my desktop and laptop. It runs everything I want with no problems.
Except for the DX10 issue, I see absolutely no reason to change.
And if they do give DX10 support to XP, I am definitely sticking with what I have.

I don't even like the name 'Vista' - sounds like public broadcasting TV show or a cheap mexican moped.

mortoma
09-17-2007, 05:45 AM
Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
I think I have had XP since 2000 or early 2001 and I have had not one single problem that would be considered OS related. Now 98 would be a different story.

S! The rig I play this sim on now I built in 2001. I already had a copy of 98 so I used that instead of buying XP for mucho dinero.
Well, I have been stuck with this rig for a while now and it runs 4.05m very well. It would play my copy of '46 ok but the copy protection is a problem with Win98. But I did try XP for a while once by installing a copy of my brother's XP on a separate hard drive. I used fraps to test between the two and got better frames in Win98 than I did XP. Mind you, this was back about the end or IL2 original or early FB. Can't remember for sure but I stuck with 98 and have had no problems with stability that a quick reboot won't fix. I only use the rig to play the game on and it does really well with 98.

K_Freddie
09-17-2007, 05:52 AM
What's the price of Vista on your side..?

It's way too expensive here, to warrant any installations on my machine. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Bewolf
09-17-2007, 06:21 AM
Get the OEM or System Bulder Version if you want to have it. Home Premium cost me 109€. I can live with that.

Vista is not a new invention of the wheel. If you run happy with XP, stay with it for the time beeing. I only got it because I am still kinda a tech geek and wanted to exprience directx10 with Bioshock. I have no complains whatsoever over Vista yet, on the other hand there is nothing spectaculary better with it over XP.

Da_Godfatha
09-17-2007, 03:10 PM
Havok, those links were intresting to read. But is does not seem official. No word from MS on that. I would not put too much faith in what they are saying. It seems they are trying to make a DX10 wrapper. It may or may not work.

Beside, the Borg does not have to fear anybody. Heck, the told the EU to feck off when they tried to make them pay the larges fine ever. They still are in the courts over that. They will just buy out the software companies who try to resist.

Swivet
09-17-2007, 04:55 PM
Ummm a big NO! (http://www.brightcove.tv/title.jsp?title=741891990) http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Bewolf
09-17-2007, 11:16 PM
Originally posted by Da_Godfatha:
Havok, those links were intresting to read. But is does not seem official. No word from MS on that. I would not put too much faith in what they are saying. It seems they are trying to make a DX10 wrapper. It may or may not work.

Beside, the Borg does not have to fear anybody. Heck, the told the EU to feck off when they tried to make them pay the larges fine ever. They still are in the courts over that. They will just buy out the software companies who try to resist.

The case was concluded yesterday. Microsoft lost. They have to pay.