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Afromike1
06-10-2008, 04:21 PM
For an effective BnZ in a bf109...

- what altitude should I start diving from? and at what speeds? and what engine power setting should I put it on (ie. 60%, 80%, 110%). I find that I end up breaking up lol when Im diving at 110% at 6500 feet.

- how should I line up my target

- how is it possible to see what planes are friendly or foe at such a high altitudes(with name icons enabled). I end up wasting a lot of my time doing a BnZ to a friendly.

ImMoreBetter
06-10-2008, 04:37 PM
The altitude should depend on your opponents altitiude. I don't keep track of my altitude much, I'd guess fly at 10000 ft at least, for dogfight servers. Learn your aircraft and note what speed the controls become stiff and when you start loosing parts.

Zooming on friendlies is a problem, but you're just going to have to deal with it. Treat every dot as a bandit until proven otherwise.

I usually keep my engine at 100% or above.

If you dive from too far up, kick and hold the rudder. It'll slow down the acceleration.

Ideally, you should land on your opponents 6. Though it's not always possible. This is where the skill in BnZ comes in; hitting at silly angles.

WTE_Googly
06-10-2008, 05:04 PM
3500 ft is a bit low... I always try to get to (at the very least) around 10,000 feet (just over ~3000m) before I start hunting.

First things first I look for aircraft near my own altitude and attack them first. If there aren't any and everyone is flying around ground level, I'll loose a bit of altitude to maybe 1500 or 2000m, and go from there, but always keep an eye out above - the lower you are the more vulnerable you are.

Quite often I will move my throttle to around 10-20% when diving to try and keep my speed below 750km/h.

When BnZ-ing wait until the last minute to open fire, you rely on suprising the enemy so it's best not to fire early and warn him as you many of your shots will miss. From these ranges you should be able to identify the type of aeroplane so shouldn't have any problems shooting down friendlies. When attacking I try to get below and behind them to stay out of sight.

Once you have got your kill, or he is aware of your presence and it's too dangerous to continue attacking run like the wind towards your lines, regain hight, rinse and repeat.

Everyone wastes their time following friendlies, it's impossible to distinguish whether they are friendly until they are close by - for this reason I like to find scraps and fly above and indentify from tracer colour (red machine guns = enemy)

ImMoreBetter
06-10-2008, 05:08 PM
Whoops, my bad. I accidentally converted 1000m instead of 3000.

Afromike1
06-10-2008, 06:20 PM
oops sorry, instead of feet I meant meters... So... I was 6500 meteres in the air.

According to your stats I seem to be REALLY high up there lol.

WTE_Googly
06-10-2008, 06:59 PM
The more altitude the better, it's harder to get jumped from above that way. Try to stay below the altitude where you start developing a vapour trail though.

A few people wander about that high, in fact its probably a good thing because pilots at ~5000m are most likely paying more attention to whats below them that above them.

It's just that there are more aircraft under 3000m, which are difficult to see/reach from 6000m.

toogame
06-10-2008, 11:07 PM
Its important to find your targets direct they are flying. When diving pull back on the throdle and keep an eye on your speed. Rule of thumb stay under 700kmph in the dive. Best angle for attack is from behind so dive and pullup behind target at high speed. you'll need to learn lead shooting and to be able to shoot a burst upon target (search forum for lead shooting) as soon as you shoot or pass head back up. Their is alot more with it.
Best is to join a squad to learn and the best Ive seen that specialise in this is DeltaChevron.

Manu-6S
06-11-2008, 01:07 AM
To recognize the enemy remember that the 90% of the times the Red is chasing the Blue... if you see a plane extending be sure that the one behind it is your enemy (this until P51s and Tempest).

Another important thing is to attack the enemy from below (after the dive) so you can hit him in more vulnerable parts and you can zoom behind him and not passing on his front.

And shoot at 100-50m... one shot one kill.

every time you have to boom look at your altitude for other enemies... at the apex of the zoom you are a lot vulnerable.

ytareh
06-11-2008, 01:36 AM
Learn your favourite planes break up speeds (or close enough to them -no point in giving loads of margin for error)Id estimate some as 109G2 800kmh...190A4 820kmh...190D9 930-950kmh...P47(all)1010kmh...P51D20 950kmh(but dont go yankin'stick at much over 550/600-recent thread suggests biggest risk when using pitch AND roll at same time)....F6F 880kmh...P38L 880kmh (be aware you have dive brakes on this plane and dont try the same in P38J (700kmh?)

As a general rule the Japanese and Russian planes are inferior divers -just stay high and wait up above for the enemy after they dive ...
Also you get used to the buffeting/bumping as you speed up giving a signal as to when bits start flying off plane.When getting near break up speed open rads for (minor)slowing effect.(and massive cooling not surprisingly)

ytareh
06-11-2008, 01:38 AM
Oh and make sure to turn VERY slowly if going at very high speeds-terminal black out due to G Force common ...

DKoor
06-11-2008, 05:40 AM
Originally posted by Afromike1:
For an effective BnZ in a bf109...

- what altitude should I start diving from? and at what speeds? and what engine power setting should I put it on (ie. 60%, 80%, 110%). I find that I end up breaking up lol when Im diving at 110% at 6500 feet.

- how should I line up my target

- how is it possible to see what planes are friendly or foe at such a high altitudes(with name icons enabled). I end up wasting a lot of my time doing a BnZ to a friendly. I'm sorry but Bf-109 isn't exactly the best employed aircraft in that role within the game... best BnZers are those whose controls wont lock up on extreme speeds; such aircraft are P-51, FW-190, Tempest and few others.

With Bf-109 you can have success with more shallow approach otherwise you must severely reduce your speed.

You can check out my .50cal track in sig, you will see a classic BnZ there.

Manu-6S
06-11-2008, 06:40 AM
Originally posted by ytareh:
Oh and make sure to turn VERY slowly if going at very high speeds-terminal black out due to G Force common ...

Its better to take a good position before the boom... snap shots aren't so easy with planes not named FW190.

If you have advantage use it to calculate enemy's path. So you haven't to turn.

LovroSL
06-11-2008, 07:52 AM
about 1200m higher does it nicely for me

For me personaly the best way to do it is a parabolic curve at 585 kmh IAS which flattens about 300 - 250m behind your target.
This way there are several benifits- the little keyhole FW190 sight and high bar dont cause problems because there is ne deflection. Because you are flying level and dead behing your taget you will know if he has spoted you before the last moment because nobody stays level if they think someone is behind. Target cant see you or shot at you. At this speed Bf109 doest lock up so badly and you are behind long enough to unleash enough lead to nock down whatever you want.
For late war just use higher speed and altitude. For bombers 35? dive about 30? angle off from the rear (AI gunners- pesky little buggers).
Rinse, repeat.

ps. figures are there just by feel and are probaly off (you cant describe approach with words,... or with nubmers http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif)

of course the real skill comes in knowing when and how to dive so that you meet these criteria when you arrive to target, when you start to dive it's too late to correct anything major, the more you throw the stick around the bigger the chanche you will end up in a low speed dogfight in a 190 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/touche.gif . Thats why people BnZ in a bf109 - so you have a backup plan (of course you will get killed by crashing because of the elevator more times than it will save you in a dogfight http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif)

Billy_DeLyon
06-11-2008, 06:35 PM
With 109, strategy depends on the opponent: generally in an early-war scenario, with your enemy slower and better-turning than you, you'll be looking to B-n-Z; while later on the shoe is on the other foot and you'll often be trying to draw them into a turn-fight (unless it's a spit!)

That's one reason I like the 109, you have to assess the enemy and adapt. And it's a pretty adaptable airplane.

Col.BBQ
06-11-2008, 10:55 PM
Originally posted by DKoor:]I'm sorry but Bf-109 isn't exactly the best employed aircraft in that role within the game... best BnZers are those whose controls wont lock up on extreme speeds; such aircraft are P-51, FW-190, Tempest and few others.

With Bf-109 you can have success with more shallow approach otherwise you must severely reduce your speed.

You can check out my .50cal track in sig, you will see a classic BnZ there.

Late 1944 and later Bf-109 models may be poor at required high speeds but for the early 1941 to early 1944, they are the BnZ kings.

I wouldn't go full throttle if possible. You'll heat up your engine fast and force the radiators to open up to get more air into the the coils. The other reason is trying to hit a plane with a 300 kph speed differential is difficult and may end up in a crash.