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Enthor1
05-15-2005, 12:16 PM
That is what I paid for and that is what I got, plus some bombers and some boats.

You know, the amount of "It does not have this...." and "It does not have that...." on these forums is proof positive of one fact: Many of the denizens of this place have excellent lives.

I mean, if things are going so well that all I have to do is get and stay upset about things not in a computer game or how long I have to wait for free add ons to it, things must be going very well indeed!

I do not post much but have been interested in IL2 since the BlueByte blue board days and have been playing IL2 since Mr Maddox was kind enough to put me on the first IL2 Beta team.

My first impression on launching the IL2 Beta?

The same as it is today after all the free and paid for stuff Maddox Games has provided: This is the best WWII airplane sim/game I have ever owned!

Oh, I have had a moment of frustration, the version that made my IL2 ILL comes to mind, but I cannot fathom the amount of complaining going on around here without reaching the conclusion stated above, "things must be going very well indeed.

It is not: "The Entire Pacific War On The Sea And In The Air And On The Land With Most, If Not All, Of The Ships, Planes And Vehicles Of All The Combatant Nations Sailing, Flying Or Toolin' Through The Palm Trees Just As They Did Fifty To Sixty Years Ago"

It is simply:
"Pacific Fighters"

And it is good, Thanks Oleg and Crew.

TROOPER117
05-15-2005, 12:22 PM
Well said!! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Saunders1953
05-15-2005, 01:15 PM
Roger that!

sammy4657
05-15-2005, 01:18 PM
hip hip hurray!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

F4U_Flyer
05-15-2005, 01:28 PM
It is not: "The Entire Pacific War On The Sea And In The Air And On The Land With Most, If Not All, Of The Ships, Planes And Vehicles Of All The Combatant Nations Sailing, Flying Or Toolin' Through The Palm Trees Just As They Did Fifty To Sixty Years Ago"

But unfortunatly for the pacific fighters fan the majority of pacific fighters took place in the coral sea area which is not in the game. I agree its a great yet very incomplete game and just hope the future of this game is not a bleak as it appears!

FoolTrottel
05-15-2005, 04:30 PM
Well, let's have a look at the Original IL2, is that complete? Is Forgotten Battles complete?
No, they aren't ... just like PF isn't ...

I will now keep my thoughts on how and why I think it all got so very negative regarding the future to myself, as not to get myself and others into trouble, but boy, (...)

However, all three of 'm are still heaps of fun!

So, cheers to Enthor1, he got the message http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif
and, even more admirably, he's passing that message on!

Have Fun!

VBF-83_Hawk
05-15-2005, 05:00 PM
But unfortunatly for the pacific fighters fan the majority of pacific fighters took place in the coral sea area which is not in the game. I agree its a great yet very incomplete game and just hope the future of this game is not a bleak as it appears!

That looks correct. If...and a BIG IF, you can find a server with Pacific Planes sets, most of the time it includes planes that seldom saw action compared to the "Coral Sea" era! All you see is Ki-84-C this and Ki-84-C that as well as F4U-C http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

danger13
05-15-2005, 05:30 PM
Originally posted by Enthor1:
That is what I paid for and that is what I got, plus some bombers and some boats.

You know, the amount of "It does not have this...." Palm Trees Just As They Did Fifty To Sixty Years Ago"

It is simply:
"Pacific Fighters"

And it is good, Thanks Oleg and Crew.

ahhhh, young padwan, you will soon learn the ways of the pf forum user...... lol
if someone said they would give you $10, you would expect to see $10 in your hand.....

Freelancer-1
05-15-2005, 05:52 PM
And to think I thought I was the only patch non-whiner left.

Good on ya, folks!

Hunter82
05-15-2005, 06:06 PM
hang on I just checked my box PF came....yep I do not believe it said every freakin inch of the Pacific modelled


carry on http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

jarink
05-15-2005, 06:19 PM
Originally posted by danger13:
if someone said they would give you $10, you would expect to see $10 in your hand.....

That depends. Is it $10US or $10Cdn? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

AerialTarget
05-15-2005, 08:00 PM
It's really too bad that the game doesn't model stalls.

I hear you all drawing sharp breaths. Before reaching for your keyboard to angrily reply, go do some very basic research on what a stall is. It's not a spin.

Chuck_Older
05-15-2005, 08:26 PM
I agree, but the name "Pacific Fighters" doesn't give license to the idea that bombers shouldn't be expected in the sim. It's just a name. Il2 Forgotten Battles didn't contain every forgotten air battle, and Il2 wasn't just about the Il2. It was a name, and more than that shouldn't be read into the title

sapre
05-16-2005, 12:14 AM
All I want is a descent AI that doesn't fly in circles 100m from ground chasing damaged enemy plane forever and not fighting a TnB fight against a Zero in a P38, and 1 IJN Cruiser and 1 Battleship, 1 US Battleship and a bug-free campaign with some more maps.
Is that SO MUCH to ask?

AerialTarget
05-16-2005, 02:53 AM
All I want is a flight model that accurately portrays the most basic fundamentals of flight, like stalls!

HotelBushranger
05-16-2005, 05:41 AM
In the difficulties box, it has Stalls and Spins. How do you get into a spin, I never really have? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Well done though Enthor, lets kill the whiners!!!

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

danger13
05-16-2005, 10:28 AM
Originally posted by AerialTarget:
It's really too bad that the game doesn't model stalls.

I hear you all drawing sharp breaths. Before reaching for your keyboard to angrily reply, go do some very basic research on what a stall is. It's not a spin.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif whats a stall again.....?????
ohh, is it when the air speed is too low for the wings to produce lift,by any chance lol
And YES it does model STALLS in the game.
go to 100 mtr , hold straight and level, reduce throttle to 10%,full flaps and TRY to hold alt.
what happenes next i wonder....????? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
you S T A L L... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

DRAGON_2_GO
05-16-2005, 10:53 AM
Originally posted by danger13:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AerialTarget:
It's really too bad that the game doesn't model stalls.

I hear you all drawing sharp breaths. Before reaching for your keyboard to angrily reply, go do some very basic research on what a stall is. It's not a spin.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif whats a stall again.....?????
ohh, is it when the air speed is too low for the wings to produce lift,by any chance lol
And YES it does model STALLS in the game.
go to 100 mtr , hold straight and level, reduce throttle to 10%,full flaps and TRY to hold alt.
what happenes next i wonder....????? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
you S T A L L... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>



well said, except a stall doesn't just occour when you're to slow, but everytime you angle of attack, meaning the difference between where you're going and where your wing is pointing, is to big. Of course, when you're flying slow, you wings won't produce that much lift, and you'll rise your aircraft's nose higher and higher, and then you'll stall, but that's <span class="ev_code_RED">NOT</span> because of the airspeed, but of the angle explained above.

greetz, Dragon

LEBillfish
05-16-2005, 11:02 AM
Well I want ArielTargets version of PF.....All I do is stall...well besides crash, burn, get headshot, etc....Even those nasty high speed stalls.....Mannnnn I got jipped!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

DuxCorvan
05-16-2005, 11:49 AM
Well, the game has stalls, it's true. The sad thing is that not every high speed stall should end in a spin -like in most aircraft- or vicious barrels -like in 190s. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

And yes, I love the game. But it's hard to make any historical campaign without missing something important, and that's a bit sad. It's not only Pearl Harbour without BBs, it's Pearl Harbour without torpedoing. It's not only Midway without many capital vessels, it's Midway without the first attack of TBDs. Not to talk about missing the true New Guinea ops, a Nederlands option that seems to be there for nothing, or a Chinese H.81 5000 miles away from its base, chasing the Zeros he rarely saw.

Like the scattered pieces of an immense puzzle that is unlikely to be ever complete. Wouldn't it be better to have made a smaller, yet more complete puzzle? I think excessive ambition, a too busy agenda or/and lack of a proper project management are to be blamed for this. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Anyway, FB/AEP/PF is the only extant sim that makes justice to WW2 era air combat and those incredible machines I've loved all my life, and the only one that gives an oportunity to use the less famed stuff, planes that we have always wanted to ride but no one thought they were popular enough to deserve it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif

Besides, I have big hopes for the patch -though I feel a bit worried about the ability of the AI to manage realistic FMs- so PF will remain in my HD until something better comes... and that is very very very hard to get. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

BfHeFwMe
05-16-2005, 12:54 PM
Now, now, Dux. Get back in your Betty bomber and go fly that. At least you had that one included, box says so, you should be grateful. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Dunkelgrun
05-16-2005, 02:36 PM
Luthier got VERY upset on these boards when I suggested that the game was called Pacific FIGHTERS for a very good reason, which was IMO that was what it mainly consisted of.

I haven't changed my mind yet either - we fly Japanese in the TAC online war and the Zero carries as much bombload as any (read the ONLY) flyable Japanese bomber in the game. Needless to say I'm waiting for the Betty and hoping that I don't die of old age before I see it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

Cheers!

AerialTarget
05-16-2005, 10:19 PM
Originally posted by AerialTarget:
go do some very basic research on what a stall is. It's not a spin.


Originally posted by danger13:
ohh, is it when the air speed is too low for the wings to produce lift,by any chance lol
And YES it does model STALLS in the game.
go to 100 mtr , hold straight and level, reduce throttle to 10%,full flaps and TRY to hold alt.
what happenes next i wonder....????? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
you S T A L L...

I'm glad you are able to read. Next time, read my post before replying, okay?

Go to three hundred feet, hold straight and level, chop the throttle, extend flaps and try to hold your altitude. What happens next, I wonder?

You spin.

You have failed ground school! Get out of the classroom.

I challenge anyone to show me a single video of a fighter stalling in IL-2 Sturmovik: Forgotten Battles. It simply cannot be done, accelerated or not, clean or dirty. I played the game for well over a year, and never stalled or saw anyone stall. I saw and experienced thousands and thousands of spins, but nary a stall! No, hammerheads do not count.

I'm very surprised at the lack of informed flight simmers. Stalls are just about the most basic part of flight. In real life, you learn how to stall a plane before you even learn how to land. Why, most of the United States Army training videos for warbirds, available on the internet for free (and which should be prerequisites to flight simulation), show warbirds such as the P-38, P-47, P-51, and F-4U stalling. Yet few people here are aware of what a stall is. You think that stall is synonymous with spin. Indeed, Dux Corvan is the only person in this thread who has gotten it right.

Chuck_Older
05-17-2005, 10:40 AM
Originally posted by AerialTarget:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AerialTarget:
go do some very basic research on what a stall is. It's not a spin.


Originally posted by danger13:
ohh, is it when the air speed is too low for the wings to produce lift,by any chance lol
And YES it does model STALLS in the game.
go to 100 mtr , hold straight and level, reduce throttle to 10%,full flaps and TRY to hold alt.
what happenes next i wonder....????? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
you S T A L L...

I'm glad you are able to read. Next time, read my post before replying, okay?

Go to three hundred feet, hold straight and level, chop the throttle, extend flaps and try to hold your altitude. What happens next, I wonder?

You spin.

You have failed ground school! Get out of the classroom.

I challenge anyone to show me a single video of a fighter stalling in IL-2 Sturmovik: Forgotten Battles. It simply cannot be done, accelerated or not, clean or dirty. I played the game for well over a year, and never stalled or saw anyone stall. I saw and experienced thousands and thousands of spins, but nary a stall! No, hammerheads do not count.

I'm very surprised at the lack of informed flight simmers. Stalls are just about the most basic part of flight. In real life, you learn how to stall a plane before you even learn how to land. Why, most of the United States Army training videos for warbirds, available on the internet for free (and which should be prerequisites to flight simulation), show warbirds such as the P-38, P-47, P-51, and F-4U stalling. Yet few people here are aware of what a stall is. You think that stall is synonymous with spin. Indeed, Dux Corvan is the only person in this thread who has gotten it right. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Gotta say it:

Spins are stalls. Stalls are not all aggravated into spins of course, but I know what a stall is, and that's all I have to say about that

AerialTarget
05-17-2005, 02:04 PM
You are, obviously, technically correct in that a spin is a type of stall (one wing stalls). However, a when the word "spin" is used with and opposed to the word "stall," it is equally obvious which meaning the word "stall" has - not the generic, but the specific (both wings lose lift). When aviators want to differentiate between a spin and a stall, they say "spin" or "stall," with the "stall" meaning that both wings lose lift. They don't call both stalls without ever making a distinction. A spin is a stall, but a stall is not a spin!

I'd really you'd rather not get into semantics in an effort to draw attention away from the fact that the game is very unrealistic in this regard. If you like, I could provide a few links which prove me right, regardless of whether or not I am using the correct terminology (which I am, though you feel that the words are synonyms).

Oh, and stalls in IL-2 are not all "aggravated into spins." They don't all end in spins, which would be unrealistic enough. The fact is that the stall simply isn't present, and the game jumps right into the spin. This is unrealistic even for the very few planes that should spin upon stall (the Corsair tends to, although it doesn't always, but even when it does, it's not instantaneous). And it's simply a joke for the planes that don't usually spin when stalled (the majority of the planes in game).

Of course, any plane will spin if you stall it wrong. Spins should be in the game. But stalls are even more important. Lock On: Modern Air Combat has it right (if rather scripted in behavior).

Chuck_Older
05-17-2005, 07:21 PM
Uh...I thought I was pretty clear. Let myself...quote myself:

Chuck said, quote:
"Stalls are not all aggravated into spins of course"

Uh, yup, I posted that. So hooray, we both agree that not all stalls are spins. We have that covered.

Onward and upward...


Aerial Target said, quote:
"Oh, and stalls in IL-2 are not all "aggravated into spins." They don't all end in spins, which would be unrealistic enough."

Right. Thank God that I never said that in Il-2 that this was the case, eh?

I had a point to make, and I made it. I'm glad to see that you have agreed with my every statement. Good night, now. I'm off to sleep, where I am a Viking.

Brass_Monkey
05-17-2005, 09:47 PM
S! All I've gotten my $30 worth of fun with PF "as is" I don't understand what all of the complaining is about.