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Enofinu
02-26-2005, 01:25 PM
could it be possible to get realistic speed of sound in this game, or no sound at all outside own cockpit, exept really near AA explosions, own engine and weapons, and receiving hits. cos, i bet
engines which produce over 1000HP with over 2000rpm makes REALLY LOUD noise, and that source of noice is right front of the pilot, there isnt any "sound insulation" between pilot and engine, only "fireboard" and thats all.. right? anyone ever drived old WW beetle car?? it has quite loud engine sound inside it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
then try to hear other car engine next to u. yea, this is old thread and this is only for Dear Oleg to as remind.

Chuck_Older
02-26-2005, 01:34 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

There's more than just a chunk of aluminum sheeting and an instrument panel between the pilot and engine. Usually stuff like a fuel tank...


You may be right, and you may be wrong, about noise levels

The car example...is very poor, in my opinion, for two reasons:

One, the original Beetle didn't have the engine mounted in front of the driver, and Two, I drive an old car myself, with a 462 cubic inch engine (that's just over 7.5 liters) that makes over 400 horsepower, much more powerful than that Beetle engine, and is much louder, beleive me...and I can hear things going on outside the car just fine

Anyway, it's not the engine itself, per se, it's the exhaust that makes most of the noise

VFA195-MaxPower
02-26-2005, 04:53 PM
take off the muffler and rev it to the redline. How much do you think you could hear outside of teh car then?

RedNeckerson
02-26-2005, 07:49 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VFA195-MaxPower:
take off the muffler and rev it to the redline. How much do you think you could hear outside of teh car then? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Reminds me of the car I had in high school http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

ElAurens
02-26-2005, 11:23 PM
I have flown in a real B25 and I will tell you that unless you are wearing hearing protection you would go deaf after repeated exposure. While you can hear things like the gear deploying, there is no way you would ever hear another aircraft anywhere near you.

Be sure!

Chuck_Older
02-27-2005, 12:01 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VFA195-MaxPower:
take off the muffler and rev it to the redline. How much do you think you could hear outside of teh car then? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Are you suggesting that the car engine example is a good one to use to illustrate what happens in an aircraft?

Let me tell you, if you think a 1,700 hp V16 or an 18 cylinder 2,000 hp radial can be compared to an automotive engine in terms of noise production, you haven't a clue as to what you're talking about

You think I'm saying that you can hear things well in the airplane, don't you? Go read my post again. The car example, particularly the Beetle, is a poor example.


Why don't you tell me what I can hear if I remove the mufflers from my engine Max? I'd be fascinated to read it...

VFA195-MaxPower
02-27-2005, 03:20 AM
Do you feel put upon? If I am agreeing with you, accept it.

EJGr.Ost_chamel
02-27-2005, 07:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Enofinu:

engines which produce over 1000HP with over 2000rpm makes REALLY LOUD noise, and that source of noice is right front of the pilot, there isnt any "sound insulation" between pilot and engine, only "fireboard" and thats all.. right? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I am not sure, whether your point is right. Your arguments are clear and seem obvious at first look. But I think, many people tend to underestimate the ability of the human ear and brain to analyze the frequncies of a perceived sound and find "unusual" elements even in a big noise. Let me show my point in two ways.

1. Common sense approach: I think we all agree, that a combat pilot knows the sound of his planes engine very well, as he is surely always checking it for unusual frequencies indicating any mechanical problem. Thus he will realize the sound of a different engine type (enemy engine type!!) even if it is very very much less loud then his own engine. Having a very loud sound around does NOT mean, that your ear and brain are not able to perceive other much less loud sounds at the same time!

2. Numerical approach (Very quick shot. I don't know much about accoustics, so plz check it and don't be rude, if this approach is faulty http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ! ): A quick search with google gave me a link that stated, that the human ear has a dynamic range (depending on age of the person) from 60 to 120 dB. I think, candidates for pilot training were also tested for their hearing abilities, so it should be safe to assume that the ears of any man found capable as a combat pilot have a dynamic range of at least 100 dB. This means, that these ears can theoretically perceive a sound which has an amplitude which is 10^10=10.000.000.000 times lower than the surrounding noise! The amplitude of sound decreases with the square of distance. If I assume, that the own engine is at a distance of 1 m, this means, that theoretically (!) without damping(!!) a pilot should be able to hear another engine which is
squareroot(10^10) * 1 m = 10^5 m = 100.000 m = 100 km
away ! Obviously (!!) this is a very theoretical approach http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif , and surely someone else here with better knowledge of accoustics can refine this calculation and bring up a credible result.
But I think it shows my point clearly: Don't underestimate the system of human ear and brain!! Simply saying, that the pilot is in a very noisy environment and therefore can't hear anything else but his own engine is not a valid argument.

I have to admit though, that I have never ever flown in a WWII era aiircraft http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif .

Regards
Chamel

ElAurens
02-27-2005, 08:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EJGr.Ost_chamel:
that theoretically without damping a pilot should be able to hear another engine which is
100 km away ! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Nonsense. People sitting next to each other in the waist gunner position of a B25 @ 200mph true can barely hear the other person speaking if they shout at one another. And in that position you are farther away from the engines than the aircrew in the cockpit.

WW2 military aircraft are deafeningly loud inside. Someone I know that has flown in a P51 compared it to being in a tin box in a ball bearing storm.

EJGr.Ost_chamel
02-27-2005, 09:04 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ElAurens:

Nonsense. People sitting _next_ to each other in the waist gunner position of a B25 @ 200mph true can barely hear the other person speaking if they shout at one another. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, another planes engine might be further away than someone sitting beside you - but it is also waaay louder (as loud as your own engine!). So what you are telling is definitely not an argument against my attempts to make a numerical approach to the problem!

Chamel

WWMaxGunz
02-27-2005, 09:09 AM
Every prop plane I've been in, it's the prop that makes the most racket.

Bremspropeller
02-27-2005, 09:49 AM
Chamel, ElAurens is right.

I've flown in somewhat less powered a/c (I was equipped with headphones since it was still pretty loud in there).
You can certainly not hear anything else than the roar of your own engine.

And don't forget that the noise of the wind streaming along the a/c's fuselage also creates a certain noise-backgrund.
(when you're aboard an airliner for the next time, try to recognize that the sound of the "wind" suddenly starts to built up dramaticly at ~250kts)

So let's sum it up:

you've got the roar of your engine, the sound-damping effect of your headphones and the sound of the air.

Chuck_Older
02-27-2005, 09:50 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VFA195-MaxPower:
Do you feel put upon? If I am agreeing with you, accept it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Take it to PM

EJGr.Ost_chamel
02-27-2005, 10:10 AM
I don't know whether enofinu and ElAurens are right or not. I am just trying to find a more "scientific" approach to the subject than just saying "Hey Oleg, you is wrong and everybody can see it easily!" http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif . Bcos if i was Oleg, I would not change anything if someone only said:"Oleg, trust me!" without giving any further arguments.
No offence intended!

Chamel

Chuck_Older
02-27-2005, 10:23 AM
That's (usually) the way it works anyways

Platypus_1.JaVA
02-27-2005, 02:41 PM
In the past, there where many whines about that, Oleg fixed it partially. But really, do you like a flightsim wich lets you only hear the sound of your own engine and the occasional thunb from the AAA?

WB_Outlaw
02-27-2005, 07:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Platypus_1.JaVA:
In the past, there where many whines about that, Oleg fixed it partially. But really, do you like a flightsim wich lets you only hear the sound of your own engine and the occasional thunb from the AAA? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Add your own weapons to that comment and the answer is ABSOLUTELY. Currently it is not possible to make a suprise attack on anyone unless your overtake speed borders on ludicrous, which is just total and complete BS and right on the verge of being a game killer for me.

If I enable sound extensions I can hear aircraft engines over 20km away and gunfire anywhere on the map. Even with the gimpy sound settings I run I can't be suprised unless I'm firing or talking on the radio. It is so totally screwed up it's not even funny.

You can't hear anything outside a warbird while in flight. I know it, Oleg knows it, the whole dev. team knows it, anyone who has ever been in one in flight knows it (that's how I know it). I can't understand why they have chosen to model the sound the way they have. Only the teamwork/fun aspect of online play has kept me purchasing upgrades and expansions.

Obviously Oleg doesn't see this as a problem worth fixing since it has been there from the beginning and I'm not gonna keep hammering it. However, if Oleg wants me to lay out any $$ for BoB, it will have to be fixed.

-Outlaw.

PB0_Roll
02-28-2005, 08:57 AM
4 years later and still supporting the idea: please let us remove arcade sound, at least as a difficulty option (host controlled).

Punkfriday
02-28-2005, 12:39 PM
i kinda wish we had more of the metal peeling back like on one of the il2 models. that would make 700mph+ flight quite interesting...

Atomic_Marten
02-28-2005, 01:02 PM
About noise in game, I have discovered that when I fire 6 Corsair MGs with closed cockpit I get the same noise with open cockpit.(I presume the same with all airplanes in game with openable pits). Also in Jug, engine noise stopped immediatelly after I fire MGs, another words I can't hear anything other than MGs sometimes (was mentioned few times on this forums).. and stuff.

tolwyn.com
02-28-2005, 01:05 PM
You know what I hate?
Playing Counterstrike for hours and hours, and my avatar guy NEVER has to pee.

How unrealistic is that?

Blackdog5555
03-04-2005, 11:45 PM
Maybe he has a diaper!!!

Blackdog5555
03-04-2005, 11:51 PM
Ok, I used to listen to the V12 Allison engines used in speed boats in the ole days. They are firfiggin loud. LOUD. VRRRRRRRRRRRROOOOOMMMMMMM...LOUD. I also heard that the firing of the MG. P38 or the 8 50s in the 47 was ear deafening!!!. SO ITS NOT THE GAMe. JUST BUY A CONCERT SOUND SYSTEM AND HOOK UP TO YOUR COMPUTER AND PUT 20 15 INCH WOOFER IN YOUR ROOM AND TURN IT UP FULL BLAST. I DID IT AND IT SOUNDS GREAT. sorry for shouting! Im going deaf. LOL BTW.. no mufflers on a/c. hheeee