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View Full Version : New Clouds Please...



santiagojames
05-10-2004, 04:45 AM
Please,Please can we have some more work done in this area....personaly i find it incredible that with all the computer games available-Ghost Recon for example-which have an INCREDIBLE "ambience" that the flight sims fall rather "flat" in actually convincing you of the realism of anything that is not "flight related".When,for example will we be able to see DYNAMIC WEATHER!!!
Lomac has gone further than most as far as turbulences,clouds,mist,sunsets and sunrises.I'm going to buy this game-don't worry about that,but SOME DAY can we have more work done on weather,clouds etc.
By the way love the new work in progress shots of the "Kate".Brilliant work.

santiagojames
05-10-2004, 04:45 AM
Please,Please can we have some more work done in this area....personaly i find it incredible that with all the computer games available-Ghost Recon for example-which have an INCREDIBLE "ambience" that the flight sims fall rather "flat" in actually convincing you of the realism of anything that is not "flight related".When,for example will we be able to see DYNAMIC WEATHER!!!
Lomac has gone further than most as far as turbulences,clouds,mist,sunsets and sunrises.I'm going to buy this game-don't worry about that,but SOME DAY can we have more work done on weather,clouds etc.
By the way love the new work in progress shots of the "Kate".Brilliant work.

DONB3397
05-10-2004, 03:37 PM
What's your point? Are the clouds, which in this game are fixed objects, not billowy enough? Or do you want changeable weather?

I've spent a few hundred hours airborne, and I find the appearance of the clouds in IL2:FB to be remarkably realistic. I'd like to see more turbulence and wind, but the visual effects seem more accurate than, say, CFS3 with it's 'billowy' and opaque clouds. Just an opinion.

http://us.f2.yahoofs.com/bc/3fe77b7e_1812a/bc/Images/Sig---1.jpg?BCtS7nABSevELZQo
"And now I see with eye serene/The very pulse of the machine;
A being breathing thoughtful breath,/A Traveller between life and death." -- Wordsworth

necrobaron
05-10-2004, 04:21 PM
I believe Luthier said a while back that we could expect better and more convincing cloud cover. Unfortunately the "overcast" look evidently can't be achieved with the FB engine.

"Not all who wander are lost."

VW-IceFire
05-10-2004, 04:34 PM
Thing is that Ghost Recon and similar games do it from a limited perspective of the weather being under the clouds and affected in a particular way by the weather.

For flight sims you've got (in PF/FB case) about 10,000 meters worth of variation...so to do it convincingly its a much more interesting undertaking. I do agree however...we need to see some more work from all flight sims on what they do with the weather and how that visually affects the sim as well as in gameplay.

http://home.cogeco.ca/~cczerneda/sigs/tmv-sig1.jpg
RCAF 412 Falcon Squadron - "Swift to Avenge"

LEXX_Luthor
05-10-2004, 05:00 PM
Luthier1 hinted that he was going to do something about clouds.

My "simple" idea is to just vastly increase the number of classic FB clouds on FP maps to approximate at least partial overcast--with a corresponding increase of cloud shadowing on the surface. My old Savage motherboard video didn't even notice Detailed FB clouds and my current ATI 9200 is far faster than that. Such new usage of FB clouds or additional new cloud types are needed to help in extending the life of the sim and the newer video cards can do it easily.


Granted these clouds below are far larger than FB clouds which are small fair weather cumulus.

http://www.chitambo.com/clouds/cloudsimages/low/cb_cal_wusa_sep98.jpg



The contrail shadow on the overcast pictured below would be interesting to see in a flight sim...but I can live without this for now.

http://www.chitambo.com/clouds/cloudsimages/high/ci_av_baffin_jul99.jpg

pics lifted from ---> http://www.chitambo.com/clouds/cloudshtml/calvus.html#Anchorcal1


Real life pilots know that FB represents a tiny fraction of cloud types and sizes that pilots see. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

sugaki
05-10-2004, 05:58 PM
I didn't mind the clouds in FB, but if it's so the same low-alittitude smattering of clouds that'd be disappointing (looks that away with the last screens posted), especially since CFS2 and 3 had better clouds IMHO.

Dynamic weather would be nice, but even before that we need clouds, stratus, cumulus, etc. More bluish sky would be nice too http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

-Aki

heywooood
05-10-2004, 06:04 PM
Lexx - the cloud campaign has gathered 'steam' ???

This topic is 'clouded' with doubt?..

LEXX_Luthor
05-10-2004, 08:18 PM
Yes, there is much condensed water vapour in these threads now, releacing latent heat upon Luthier1.

heywooood
05-10-2004, 08:24 PM
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

LEXX_Luthor
05-10-2004, 08:48 PM
Wozop with the http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif when water vapour condenses to liquid water droplets enormous heat is releaced, more than any condensing liquid and that pushes up the moist air higher into cooler air making more condensed water releacing more heat in a process that continues until Luthier1 does something and then calm returns once again until two weeks before the Next Patch.

heywooood
05-10-2004, 09:13 PM
err ... sorry umm http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif ..
is that good? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

sugaki
05-11-2004, 01:08 AM
I think heywoood should make a new poll asking if clouds should be the next dev update http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

VF-10_Snacky
05-11-2004, 04:06 AM
I think the weather and clouds in FB right now are great.
Sure I would love to see huge nimbus clouds, but honestly not at the cost of killing my FPS. In FB when I fly through a cloud I actually feel like Im in a cloud and not a group of textures.
There are so many other "Wish list" things to consider. Clouds,IMO, is way down on the list.

"Son of a B**ch! that's gonna hurt!"

LEXX_Luthor
05-11-2004, 04:37 AM
FB clouds are great, I would love an Option to turn the number up.

Seawolf_195th:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>love to see huge nimbus clouds, but honestly not at the cost of killing my FPS.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

With my history of low end grafix, I would agree, but have you tried this...?

My old Savage motherboard video didn't even notice Detailed FB clouds and my current ATI 9200 is far faster than that. Such new usage of FB clouds or additional new cloud types are needed to help in extending the life of the sim and the newer video cards can do it easily.

We could increase the number of our current FB clouds by 5 times and my ATI 9200 would run it. ATI 9800 Ultra or whatever could run 50 times the number of our current FB clouds creating a true overcast. FB clouds are like 2-3 years old now. Or they could make clouds much larger without increasing the detail, but it doesn't matter because today's video cards are far beyond what FB clouds were designed for.

In real air combat the environment you fight in is often full of clouds. Imagine a tank sim with no hills, no trees, no roads, no towns. That is the environment you fight in. The reason so many pilots get bounced in real life is because looking at the sky is not natural, one must be trained to do it or have Extreme motivation like staying alive in a combat zone.

Cpt_Jack
05-12-2004, 06:21 AM
There is nothing wrong with FB clouds - I think it's the weather options that need to be changed. In CFS 2, the weather options were based on amount of cloud cover (light, moderate, heavy). In FB, like the old WW2 Fighters, the options are based on haze/visibility distance. The "Thunder" option would be good in PF for flying into a rain squall, but could it be localized on the map so you could fly around or through the rain to clear skies? So far, the only other option in FB is the stationary cottonball clouds that hug the ground at about 2-3,000 ft. Which is nice, for one weather option. But I hope we get other choices of amount of cloud cover. Since weather played such an integral role in the air war in the PTO (like anywhere else), I think the weather options are a very important aspect of a realistic sim. And since rain squalls and storms were constantly developing in that area, usually in a very short time, the weather effects in the game need to be improved. Those little cotton balls just aren't going to cut it for the typical scenario.

santiagojames
05-20-2004, 09:18 AM
Well at least some people are in agreement with me,ice-fire ypu're right about games like ghost recon-i hadn't thought about it from that point of view.I am NOT in agreement though that the clouds in FB are realistic-when i go pottering around in my sailplane FB clouds,weather etc. has NO "feeling" with what i see.As for framerates i beleive that the majority of players are solo players at home and NOT on the internet so would this cause a great loss of framerates?Also LOMAC has vastly better effects than FB (I know,it's a newer game-but PF will be newer still)FB with Lomac style weather effects would be wonderful.I'm surprised that this aspect-so important to flying has been so relatively left out-the tactical situation enjoyed could be huge fun with better effects....thats all,i'm not whining really just that lighting and weather is just as important as high res skins,and,i beleive possible with modern systems....

cheers all

LEXX_Luthor
05-20-2004, 06:31 PM
Online you can turn off clouds. Also, I believe cloud calculations are on home computer and not sent across internet.

LOMAC overcast clouds are broken. Nobody can play with them. LOMAC "cumulus" haha clouds are even fewer and smaller than FB clouds.