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james_ander
01-12-2005, 05:10 AM
Since PF I have noticed that when flying head to head against AI, they never shoot backin a head onpass. It used to be flying head on toward AI was a coin toss as to who would survive (if anybody). Now it's pretty clear they don't shoot back.

What happened? Anyone else noticed this?

SeaFireLIV
01-12-2005, 05:34 AM
It might depend on the difficulty level. But I have been doing a lot of head-on passes versus 109s in the Eastern Front Campaign (3.03) and, yep, they`re not shooting back so far, but I have collided twice with them.

JG53Frankyboy
01-12-2005, 05:44 AM
yes, depends on AI level, dodnt make headon with a Veteran AI http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif - not to speak of an Ace http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Atomic_Marten
01-12-2005, 12:22 PM
Yeah.. Franky's right. In QMB you can test that out. I have practiced head-ons versus ace LA's for quite some time.. and for sure if you don't aim good you wont have second chance. They will hit you. Always.(I's say some 95% cases http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif) Usually they kill you and your a/c is still flyable (sometimes not even badly damaged. Happened a lot to me..

So, if you don't disrupt their aiming by accurate burst from 0.80 (I'd say that's the last chance) you are as good as dead. Nothing helps at that distance, rolls, banking turning.. they will hit you in most of the cases.

But if you manage to give 'em accurate cannon burst from distance they will usually give up - they break from attack (although in small number of cases they persist in their attempts to fill your ride with lead, and there's nothing you can do about it except being lucky enough to survive http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif).

horseback
01-12-2005, 12:59 PM
What Marten said.

When Forgotten Battles first came out, QMB was simply unplayable, even against Rookie level AI if you didn't come in barrel rolling or wildly dive and jink before they came within 600m. No matter what you were flying, they'd take out your engine (at a minimum) on the first pass, every time, all the time.

After a couple of hours, I put the game back on the shelf and only tried it for a few minutes after each patch. It was patch 1.2 or so before I felt it was acceptable & took it up full time over the original Il-2 Sturmovik.

Even so, RL aces rarely fired from ranges over 400m, and it sometimes looks to me as though the AI has the ability to vary their convergences in flight, especially when they're shooting at me.

cheers

horseback

Atomic_Marten
01-12-2005, 01:06 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by horseback:
and it sometimes looks to me as though the AI has the ability to vary their convergences in flight, especially when they're shooting at me. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is a good question..

FoolTrottel
01-12-2005, 02:09 PM
If it's a good question, and you want to know:
Why not ask Oleg then?

SeaFireLIV
01-12-2005, 02:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Atomic_Marten:

But if you manage to give 'em accurate cannon burst from distance they will usually give up - they break from attack (although in small number of cases they persist in their attempts to fill your ride with lead, and there's nothing you can do about it except being lucky enough to survive http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif). <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is good. At least there IS a level of Human unpredictability to head-ons, just like online. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

james_ander
01-12-2005, 02:51 PM
I play off-line only with the exception of co-ops with a friend using the original IL2.

I find AI has improved with PF, most particularly, dog fights seem to be more in the verticle plane than just horizontal turning.

I find though that flying head on, the enemy usually doesn't fire. I will have to test out certain pilot skill levels.

BTW, I find the AI in the original IL2 much easier. I think AI was one of the biggest improvements in going from IL2 to FB.

Atomic_Marten
01-12-2005, 04:45 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by FoolTrottel:
If it's a good question, and you want to know:
Why not ask Oleg then? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think he's too busy.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>SeaFireLIV:
This is good. At least there IS a level of Human unpredictability to head-ons, just like online. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yup. You never know when it's gonna hit you.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

La-5FAN
01-18-2005, 01:23 AM
Whenever I do head-to-heads, for some reason the Zeroes always peel away at about 0.40 without firing and the Ki-61s don't fire at all. Every other plane either never gets a second pass or collides with me. Mostly the former (thank goodness the Hellcat can take a beating!).

CKY_86
01-18-2005, 05:06 AM
as some1 previouslly said verteran & higher up ai u want to stay away from
http://img131.exs.cx/img131/8905/bf110sig1yb.jpg

MGBurrows
01-20-2005, 11:25 AM
I only make head-on attacks when facing an aircraft I have no hope of maneuvering with. Head-on too easily proves to be mutually suicidal. In the PTO, in fact, is the only place you'll see me doing it consistently when flying as DL Moffett (USN F4F), MG Burrows (USAAF P-40/39) or TD Kinser (USMC F4F) when confronting A6M's since maneuver is tricky at best against them. I get very aggressive in head-ons against Reisens and Ki's since that's my best chance of crippling them. It's particularly important when flying Wildcats since their so cleanly out-performed in every category (Save for diving, but then; there's only so far you can go down before either becoming - as someone else put it so amusingly - a lawn dart or a very peculiar new type of mini sub...) by A6M's. At least when you're USAAF you can out-run the little filii canae in your P-40's or P-39's.
Otherwise, I dodge head-on attacks. Trick is, though, fire early and fire a lot ... it seems to take the fight out of them.

SeaFireLIV
01-20-2005, 12:05 PM
Well it can change. Earlier I said they all broke away or collided. In this case, I had a bogey fire straight into me. I fired at him as well. We both broke away, he came round at me soonest (while smoking very lightly) and shot me down! Also, the way he shot me down was at an angle- I`m sure a deflection shot from my 8 oc lowish.

I play in Campaign and I guess in this particular mission I must have drawn the short straw and bumped into an Veteran or even Ace. I think what catches me out is I`m just expecting the same `break-off` reaction and when it doesn`t happen that`s when I get shot down. Silly me.

MGBurrows
01-21-2005, 01:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
Well it can change. Earlier I said they all broke away or collided. In this case, I had a bogey fire straight into me. I fired at him as well. We both broke away, he came round at me soonest (while smoking very lightly) and shot me down! Also, the way he shot me down was at an angle- I`m sure a deflection shot from my 8 oc lowish.

I play in Campaign and I guess in this particular mission I must have drawn the short straw and bumped into an Veteran or even Ace. I think what catches me out is I`m just expecting the same `break-off` reaction and when it doesn`t happen that`s when I get shot down. Silly me. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I always go up into an Immelmann after a head-on pass, especially if my opponent is more maneuverable than I am - and in the PTO that's always the case since I don't fly for the Japanese. It allows me to keep an eye on the little bugger and should the AI pilot pull into a horizontal turn no matter how much tighter his turn radius is than mine I still cut into his turn radius and onto his tail. Of course, occasionally they screw me up by going up too...