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con20or
08-02-2005, 01:16 PM
Can anyone recommend a really good,modern flight sim? I mean jet planes, the speed of sound etc.

Fish40
08-02-2005, 01:50 PM
All of my flight sims are WWII era, with IL2 FB, and Pacific Fighters at the top of the list. I hear that Lock ON Modern Air Combat is supposed to be pretty top notch as far as modern sims go. Mabey someone who has the sim will reply to give you the heads up.

Flakwalker
08-02-2005, 01:54 PM
Lomac is the most modern I know and have. But I also preffer WW2 ones.

con20or
08-02-2005, 01:58 PM
yeh i like ww2 sims too.i have il2,but could never decide whether to get pacific fighters.reading the box it just seems to be missions,no campaign?is that right?saw it for 30euro the other day.

Flakwalker
08-02-2005, 02:01 PM
PF comes with campaings for USAF, USN, USMC, IJA, IJN, RAF and RN.
With the latest patch you got Dutch campaing and G4M1 Betty campaign.

blue_76
08-02-2005, 02:02 PM
Falcon 4.0 comes with a beautiful manual.. the best i've seen so far that covers most aspects of the sim in excellent detail. but if you want better graphics and more realism, i'd suggest an addon to falcon 4.0 such as Allied Force. here's a good review of it: http://www.simhq.com/_air5/air_160a.html

aaronblood
08-02-2005, 02:02 PM
Funny you should mention it...

I was researching the same thing last week and picked up Lock On Modern Air Combat just this weekend.

Popped it in and flew around a bit, looks top notch. Excellent details in the aircraft models, terrain looks good, flight physics, sound, etc. all look good so far. From what I've read it's the one to have... and at $19.99 it's a bargain. Some might also point to the latest Falcon.

LOMAC has only two flyable US aircraft, F15c and the A10a. It has like 4 or 5 Soviet craft, and hey look even a German Mig29! With a cockpit 'Betty' that will speak German if you want. Just for us SHIII fanatics I s'pose. I think I'm inclined to start my career in one of the Sukhoi's but haven't got that far yet.

On a side note... I was looking at 2 UBI products. Lock-On and Pacific Fighters... I saw the loathsome Starforce warning on the PF box and just set it back down with a sigh.

I did read on some of the flight sim forums about another flight sim that's in development that sounds pretty good. But it sounds like it's pretty far off and the first incarnation of it will only include trainers... Intended I guess as a super realistic sim where you actually go thru Air Force training first.

con20or
08-02-2005, 02:51 PM
ok,thanks for the advice everyone.

by the way aaronblood,if you have played silent hunter,than havent you already got starforce on your pc?so any games with it now wouldnt make a difference surely?

aaronblood
08-02-2005, 03:24 PM
Originally posted by con20or:
ok,thanks for the advice everyone.

by the way aaronblood,if you have played silent hunter,than havent you already got starforce on your pc?so any games with it now wouldnt make a difference surely?

Well... actually... It's possible to D/L a version w/o starforce. Nothing pirated mind you, it's a legal version available for purchase. I would feel a bit victimized to have to buy it twice.

Admittedly I haven't done that yet. I'm waiting to see what (if anything) comes of this UBI starforce investigation. ...and also waiting to see if they can tell me how to fix my now dysfunctional combo drive.

If I hear back nothing in the next month or so I'm gonna take the steps necessary to remove SF even though it may involve reformat etc. At that point if I want to keep playing SH3 (and I probably will) I'll have to buy the D/L version.

I'm hopeful something will/might happen in the near future with UBI and they'll be able to help me thru my drive issues.

In the meantime, I'm not going to risk buying anything else with SF attached to it. I might look around and see if there's a D/L version of PF though.

Billy_BigBoy
08-02-2005, 04:23 PM
Originally posted by aaronblood:
On a side note... I was looking at 2 UBI products. Lock-On and Pacific Fighters... I saw the loathsome Starforce warning on the PF box and just set it back down with a sigh.


There is no such thing as Starforce in Pacific Fighters. I run a merged install with Forgotten Battles, Aces Extention Pack and Pacific Fighters with no problem, even with an "official" no*disk thingy. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif (all payed for btw!)

The game is absolute worth a try. You can find both Forgotten Battles and Aces Extention Pack for just a few box. On line (very addictive I must say) you will need Pacific Fighters too, and a couple of patches, but that's something you submariners already are used to. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

badaboom.1
08-02-2005, 04:36 PM
^I second what Billy said+the imersion factor is..... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif....... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

GT182
08-02-2005, 05:34 PM
I too agree with what Billy_BigBoy says... there is NO StarForce in Pacific Fighters. I have IL2FB/AEP/PF installed and it's not in there at all. As for addictive.... yep, it certainly is Ollie.

aaronblood
08-02-2005, 07:21 PM
Now the PF box I looked at in CompUSA this weekend clearly had the little yellow warning label in the system requirements section (same as SHIII) that says, and I quote:

"Notice: This game contains technology intended to prevent copying that may conflict with some CD-RW, DVD-RW, and virtual drives."

You're tellin me that's not a starforce warning??? Are you all sure about that? I'd love to buy it but I'm very wary.

Hiriyu
08-02-2005, 08:04 PM
aaronblood, the gents above are all correct. PF uses 'SecuRom' protection, not Starforce. SecuRom is a different system which simply makes sure that your cd is in the drive, and that cloned drives are not currently active. Both distributions use the same generic warning label.

Ubi actually hosts an PF/FB fix file for those [paying customers] with issues related to SecuRom. Pick up IL2/FB/AEP/PF by all means available and you will not be sorry http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Experten_87
08-02-2005, 08:07 PM
It really depends on what you want in your flight sim, Con20or. If you are looking for the most realism, definintely go with Faclon 4.0 or Allied Force. I have Falcon 4.0 with numerous patches that not only update the graphics, but various realism settings as well. With these, I'm able to conduct a mission almost entirely like a real F-16 pilot would (Full engine startup, radar operations, etc.) However, there is an extremely steep learning curve to the game. In some ways, Falcon 4.0 reminds me A LOT like Silent Hunter III, because both are highly detailed (and addicting) sims who still recieve support in the community through mods, fixes, etc.

If, on the other hand, you are looking for a quick "take off and kill anything in sight" style of gameplay, I'd go with Lock On. It's not as detailed as Falcon 4.0, and IMO it's a bit too arcadish, but it's still fun nonetheless and the graphics are superb. I guess it just comes down to matter of taste.

As for Pacific Fighters having Starforce, I'm looking at my box right now and I also see the yellow tag warning of conflicts with the 'technology' used to prevent copying with CD/DVD Roms. Knowing Ubi, I'm pretty sure this IS Starforce, but I'm not 100% certain.

Salute~!
and even when you find a good flight sim, DON'T let it pull you away from SH3 Herr Kaleun!!!

Happy Hunting :-)

Experten

Experten_87
08-02-2005, 08:11 PM
oops I guess I wasn't correct in thinking it was Starfoce :-p Thanks hiriyu!

CannonFodda_99
08-02-2005, 10:15 PM
Quick question, can you still buy "Forgotten Battles"?

Cannon

Hiriyu
08-02-2005, 10:53 PM
My local mom'n'pop game store still does (in the bargain bin no less). Or if you can't find it locally there's always this, which does not require cd checks http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://www.direct2drive.com/21/product/Buy-IL-2-Sturmovik:-Forgotten-Battles-Download

For the original poster, LOMAC seems to be a competant 'modern' flight sim, but requires fairly high system specs to run at decent detail and frame rate. There is also a new(er) expansion for LOMAC available called "Flaming Cliffs".

I own the original LOMAC, but haven't really gotten in to it, due to lasting infatuation with IL2 and SHIII http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

bogusheadbox
08-03-2005, 06:44 AM
I have to agree with the Forgotten battles, ace expansion and pacific fighters.

I have been playing these since the original IL2 Sturmovik came out. It is more than worth the money.

And to state what others have said. Forgotten battles series DO NOT HAVE STARFORCE.

Though i am one of the lucky ones that has not had a problem with starforce for SH3. Mainly due to my computer is brand new.

Still hate the Fooking thing being on my computer though.

P.s. Ubi, please officially add the fricken rest of the content you promissed into SH3 you pack of bast4rds

;-)

aaronblood
08-03-2005, 07:11 AM
Originally posted by Hiriyu:
aaronblood, the gents above are all correct. PF uses 'SecuRom' protection, not Starforce. SecuRom is a different system which simply makes sure that your cd is in the drive, and that cloned drives are not currently active. Both distributions use the same generic warning label.

Ubi actually hosts an PF/FB fix file for those [paying customers] with issues related to SecuRom. Pick up IL2/FB/AEP/PF by all means available and you will not be sorry http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

I knew IL2 didn't have SF... I'm glad to hear same is true for PF. OK then, I'll put those top in the cue for the next round of acquisitions. At the moment I still find it hard to take time away from SHIII to even begin looking at Lock-On... much less 2 or 3 other new titles.

Has it been long enuf for IL2 to hit the bargain bins? What's it goin for these days?

dagamecat
08-03-2005, 07:25 AM
Originally posted by aaronblood:
Has it been long enuf for IL2 to hit the bargain bins? What's it goin for these days?


absolutely!

I've been flying IL-2 since the first one came out, and that one is now available on Amazon for about 1-2. You can probably pick up Forgotten Battles for about 20 or less.

If you're just going to buy one of them, I'd go for Forgotten Battles. Pacific Fighters is good, but the maps aren't very interesting. However with just FB, you won't get to fly any spitfires. I have FB + the Ace Expansion Pack + Pacific Fighters, way too many planes to choose from. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

viciii3
08-03-2005, 07:33 AM
I am still looking for a replacement for Jane's Navy Fighters...I miss my Tomcat!!! It seems, however, that "modern" US naval aviation and carrier landings have fallen out of favor with game dev's. Yes, I realize that the F-14's are de-commissioned now (REALLY stupid move...even a Super-Rhino doesn't come close to pure firepower for air-to-air CAP's, and nothing is really flying off carriers that compares to a Tomcat) but Jane's was a great simulation, at the time. I would love a new version, taking advantage of today's faster computer systems and graphics.

Hawggy
08-03-2005, 10:11 AM
Right-O!!! Jane's used to be the par for military sims. Now, all we've got is 1C's powerhouse of a WWII sim, a re-incarnation of Falcon 4.0, and LOMAC: Flaming Cliffs. Not to say it was from a lack of effort, but it's a purty shabby group compared to the sim list ten years ago: No tank sims period, no matter what era, and NO chopper sims are even being discussed by any devs I know of.

WhiteKnight77
08-03-2005, 12:54 PM
If you are wanting the iL2 series, go with IL 2 Sturmovik: Forgotten Battles Gold Pack (http://www.gogamer.com/cgi-bin/GoGamer.storefront/42f1127503a2f460273fd0fedee20714/Product/View/001IL2FG) and Pacific Fighters (http://www.gogamer.com/cgi-bin/GoGamer.storefront/SESSIONID/Product/View/001PACF) together.

With some luck, you could find it at CompUSA or maybe Wal-Mart for cheap. Lo-Mac is like $16 at GoGamer.

aaronblood
08-03-2005, 01:05 PM
I still remember the old school days.

Used to have so much fun with the MicroProse stuff. Then the Amiga came out! F-18 Intercepter... Bob Dinnerman... that was so much fun. ...and so (relatively speaking) simple to play.

Good times.


I'll have to revisit the flight sims now and see if they haven't totally mucked em up with over-the-top realism settings. My last foray into Janes F-18 a few years back left me impressed with the graphics and irritated by such simple things as pointing a laser guided bomb, or heaven forbid I should actually need to refuel in midair.

So far, looks like Lock-On might be decent and playable. Still going to have to read a bit though...

GT182
08-03-2005, 01:07 PM
Hiriyu, thanks. I couldn't remember what it was as my PF box is put away. I did know tho it wasn't StarForce.

And as Hiriyu and WhiteKnight say, IL2FB/AEP/PF is an awesome combination for a flight sim. All merged together make one of the best around and will make it hard for anyone to beat, for years to come. The only one that ever came close was Jane's WWII Fighters, in MHO.

con20or
08-03-2005, 01:10 PM
refueling in mid air,thats probably the hardest thing i have ever had to do in a game.and i only managed it ONCE. and that was just because i practically crashed into the refueller.

So let me get this straight,im getting a big thumbs up for pacific fighters? what are the expansion packs that people are talking about?are these one you get in the shop or are they downloaded patches? plus i dont see how people have il2 forgotten battles,pacific fighters and an expansion pack,all working as the one game.


Obviously they must be designed to be played like that.il look around the shops 2mrw see what i can see.


and the best jet plane game is falcon 4.0?


thanks everyone for the help.

conor.

WhiteKnight77
08-03-2005, 02:26 PM
iL2: Forgotten Battles started as an add-on for iL2 Sturmovik, but Oleg got ahead of himself with it and it ended up being a full game instead. The Aces Expansion Pack was the first add-on for FB. It will not run without FB installed, hence getting the FB Gold Pack. you get both. Pacific Fighters can be used as a stand-alone game or as an expansion to FB/AEP.

There are patches that add content (aircraft and maps) to the games. There are some payware, but I hear one is from X1, the same people who are ripping off modders in SHIII so I would be leary about them. There are many skins available for download and you may find user made missions too. There is a full mission editor that you can design your own missions or campaigns if you want.

I haven't tried Falcon 4.0, but hear it's great. I still like Jane's USAF (yes, in-flight refueling in that is a bear too).

Hawggy
08-04-2005, 07:56 AM
Falcon 4.0 was always great, sans the extreme bugs, and USAF was a nice title too, with an ATF-upgraded feel. I would recommend trying that one as well. As far as immersion though, Falcon has a campaign that whoops up on all the competition. And when you throw in MP aspects, the new Allied Force Falcon is the way to go - it's just unattractive compared to LOMAC. LOMAC lacks expansive play, especially in the name of multiplayer.

rls669
08-04-2005, 01:59 PM
Originally posted by Hawggy:
No tank sims period, no matter what era, and NO chopper sims are even being discussed by any devs I know of.

There's a new tank sim: T-72 (http://www.battlefront.com/products/t72/)

Amazingly for a sim of this detail, SimHQ reported the game to be completely and utterly bug-free. <SH3 players scratch head, muttering "bug-free? The words make sense individually, but put them together and they have no meaning!"> http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

aaronblood
08-04-2005, 02:57 PM
Originally posted by rls669:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hawggy:
No tank sims period, no matter what era, and NO chopper sims are even being discussed by any devs I know of.

There's a new tank sim: T-72 (http://www.battlefront.com/products/t72/)

Amazingly for a sim of this detail, SimHQ reported the game to be completely and utterly bug-free. <SH3 players scratch head, muttering "bug-free? The words make sense individually, but put them together and they have no meaning!"> http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Instead of the subtitle "Balkans on Fire" they should've called it "My Tank's on Fire" or maybe "Hellfire Magnet".

Alright, if I must, I s'pose I could drive a T-72. I guess that sounds like fun... maybe?

aaronblood
08-04-2005, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by WhiteKnight77:
If you are wanting the iL2 series, go with IL 2 Sturmovik: Forgotten Battles Gold Pack (http://www.gogamer.com/cgi-bin/GoGamer.storefront/42f1127503a2f460273fd0fedee20714/Product/View/001IL2FG) and Pacific Fighters (http://www.gogamer.com/cgi-bin/GoGamer.storefront/SESSIONID/Product/View/001PACF) together.

With some luck, you could find it at CompUSA or maybe Wal-Mart for cheap. Lo-Mac is like $16 at GoGamer.

Aha!! Yes, good call. Those are the ones I'll be looking for then. I probably would've just blindly bought IL2 and not even known about FB.

Thanks!

rls669
08-04-2005, 04:12 PM
Since when did anyone use Hellfires in the Balkans? The opposition also uses Russian equipment.

Hawggy
08-04-2005, 04:25 PM
Originally posted by aaronblood:
Alright, if I must, I s'pose I could drive a T-72. I guess that sounds like fun... maybe?

Haven't you ever seen "The Beast"? Of course it sounds like fun!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

aaronblood
08-05-2005, 11:25 AM
Originally posted by rls669:
Since when did anyone use Hellfires in the Balkans? The opposition also uses Russian equipment.

Yeah... I know, I know... I'm familiar with the Balkans conflict.

Was just pokin fun. Guess I'd rather drive an Abrams... that is... if I had to drive a tank at all.

I do recall playing a few different tank sims years back (anyone remember the name of that Abrams simulator game? might've been from Microprose, but I don't recall). It was boring then, probably be boring now. Was always more fun to drive Apaches (I know, not applicable to Balkans, but I'm just talking about tank gameplay in general) and hunt em rather than be on the receiving end, but if you like tanks, I dunno I guess it would be fun.

You guys buy it and play for awhile and let me know, I doubt it's one I'll be rush'n to own. But who knows, if I see some decent reviews, I might be tempted.

con20or
08-06-2005, 09:41 AM
ok,just went and got me some.i got lock on,forgotten battles and a helicopter game called Fair strike for 30euro.i also got pacific fighters for 20euro.gonna give them a shot now.wish me luck!

con20or
08-06-2005, 10:21 AM
i forgot the poxy "aces expansion pack". now i cant install the three together.

im terribly,terribly vexed.

Dremond
08-06-2005, 12:30 PM
Originally posted by aaronblood:
I do recall playing a few different tank sims years back (anyone remember the name of that Abrams simulator game? might've been from Microprose, but I don't recall).

I enjoyed Microprose's M1 Tank Platoon. Had a great dynamic campaign, and the (then) novel abilty to pop into any position within your four-tank platoon, or play strategically from the top-down map.

The new Falcon 4.0:Allied Forces is the way to go for a modern air sim. Five years of a dedicated user mod group's efforts have combined to take an abandoned piece of bugware and turn it into a near-rock-solid chunk of code. Updated Dx9 graphics, the best dynamic, real-time campaign ever invented, and significantly upgraded enemy and friendly AI all combine to make this title the "bomb" (so to speak).

The "over-the-top" realism may set some people off, though. The ondisk manual is 650 pages long (longer than the now-legendary original!) and there over 20 interactive tutorial missions, but you'll need every page, and every mission to keep your Lawn Dart from living up to it's name ...

Frumpkis
08-06-2005, 05:08 PM
I've been playing Pacific Fighters off and on, along with SHIII and a couple other games. I'm a longtime flight simulator fan; I have all the HOTAS and rudder pedals hardware etc. I have to say I'm a little underwhelmed with PF. The graphics are great, the dogfights are moderately challenging, and I love the carrier landings. But the campaign left me cold, and without a great campaign I don't tend to stick with these things for very long. It basically just strings together a series of randomly generated missions from a very small pool of mission types, so it gets boring and repetitive (for me, anyway) very quickly. After a while I quit trying the campaigns and just started setting up quick custom dogfights as a "coffee break" game.

I'm not ready to take PF off the hard drive yet, because there are no other flight sims out there that look very attractive to me right now. I'm not a huge fan of modern air combat other than helo sims, which I do enjoy very much.... but that's been a real dry period lately. I don't think there's been a serious helo sim since Enemy Engaged, unless I missed something. Enemy Engaged was pretty good, but it suffered from poor, almost tactically useless terrain modeling. A new helo sim using the current generation of graphics cards and CPU's, with great low-level terrain for hide and seek combat, would be wonderful. But I haven't heard about anything on the horizon.

Hoatee
08-07-2005, 05:40 AM
Just want to chip in and say a good word for LoMac - it really is a good jet sim. I've also still got Falcon 4.0 (Mac version) and it was great when it was released but LoMac is to Falcon what IL2/FB/AEP/PF is to WarbirdsIII.

Stick to version 1.02 for Lomac - and upgrade to the newer version if you want the TV guidance system of the SU25.

Hawggy
08-07-2005, 07:20 AM
Originally posted by Hoatee:...LoMac is to Falcon what IL2/FB/AEP/PF is to WarbirdsIII.


Maybe graphically, but LOMAC cannot even dream of touching Falcon's campaign engine. What good is all that snaz and pizazz if you can't play an ongoing campaign, let alone multiplayer? Single-mission after single-mission errodes motivation, whereas campaigns like Falcon 4.0 inject a sense of completion - neither IL2/AEP/PF or LOMAC have a campaign to write home about, and honestly, it is their major short-coming.

Best case scenario; Buy them all. You won't be disappointed.

joeap
08-07-2005, 09:00 AM
Anyone looking for a good alternative to the lackluster IL2/FB/PF built in dynamic campaign should look up some of the various nice scripted campaigns out there, or the following off and online campaign generator:

Better dynamic campaign (http://www.lowengrin.com./news.php)

Great stuff and it's free with great support from Paul Lowengrin.

FlatTax
08-07-2005, 07:17 PM
Can PF be flown with the mouse, ala x-plane?

I hate being tied to a joystick...

Hawggy
08-07-2005, 10:08 PM
Hop over here (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/ubb.x?a=frm&s=400102&f=26310365) and find out.

Hoatee
08-10-2005, 07:24 AM
Originally posted by Hawggy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hoatee:...LoMac is to Falcon what IL2/FB/AEP/PF is to WarbirdsIII.


Maybe graphically, but LOMAC cannot even dream of touching Falcon's campaign engine. What good is all that snaz and pizazz if you can't play an ongoing campaign, let alone multiplayer? Single-mission after single-mission errodes motivation, whereas campaigns like Falcon 4.0 inject a sense of completion - neither IL2/AEP/PF or LOMAC have a campaign to write home about, and honestly, it is their major short-coming.

Best case scenario; Buy them all. You won't be disappointed. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree with you as far as the campaign generator for Falcon 4.0 is concerned (Mac version had a 3 day bug though). That is really awesome (I hope something like that is possible in BoB - hint - hint - hint).

Hawggy
08-10-2005, 08:49 AM
Wouldn't it be awesome if Oleg & team really woke up to that fact - just look at the campaign Rowan's BoB II is boasting; But, from what I understand, it has NO multiplayer. How useless, indeed. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif