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TS_Sancho
05-31-2010, 09:59 AM
Can someone provide me with an informative source regarding the SU-7/17/22 family?

Specifically I am looking for the absolute ceiling of the Peruvian exported SU-22 M4.

Is there any possible condition that would allow the SU-22 to climb to 60k in controlled flight?

Is the cockpit partially pressurized like modern high performance jets? If so is the pressurization system capable of maintaining a habitable atmosphere at 60K?

Would the SU-22 have the equipment to support an atmosphere suit?

My question is in regards to an article sourced to a Peruvian pilot who claims to have been doing the disco duck with an "UFO" at 60K which I believe to be impossible in the situation described due to aircraft performance and pilot physiology.

Please go easy on me, I know I'm asking for it posting this nonsense here. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

The text of the "encounter" is as follows...


Comandante Huerta's full statement follows:

"I am Oscar Santa Maria Huerta, official pilot of the Peruvian Air Force, currently retired.

On April 11, 1980, at 7:15 in the morning, 1800 men were in formation at the Air Base of La Joya, Arequipa.

They all observed a stationary object in the sky, which looked like a balloon, at about three miles distance, and approximately 1,800 feet altitude. It was luminous because it reflected the sun.

My unit commander ordered me to takeoff in my Sukhoi 22 jet to shoot down the spherical object. It was in restricted airspace, without clearance, and we were concerned about espionage.

I approached the object and strafed sixty-four 30 mm. shells at it. Some projectiles went towards the ground, and others hit the object fully, but they had no effect at all. The projectiles didn't bounce off; probably they were absorbed. The cone-shaped "wall of fire" that I sent out would normally obliterate anything in its path.

The object then began to ascend, and move farther away from the base. When I was at about 36,000 ft., it made a sudden stop, forcing me to veer to the side since I was only 1500 feet away. I flew up higher to attack It from above, but just as I had locked on to the target and was ready to shoot, the object made a straight vertical climb evading the attack.

Two more times, I had the object on target, when the object was stationary. Each time, it moved away at the very last minute, when I was just about to fire, always eluding my attack.

I decided to climb at full thrust to get above the object, bit began to ascend almost parallel to my plane, and when I reached 63,000 ft., it stopped.

At this point, I came within about 300 feet of the UFO. It was about 30 feet in diameter. It was an enameled, cream-colored dome, with a wide, circular, metallic base. It had no engines, no exhausts, no windows, no wings or antennae. It lacked all the typical aircraft components, with no visible propulsion system.

It was at that moment that I realized that this was no spying device, but that it was a UFO, something totally unknown. I was almost out of fuel, so I couldn't attack or maneuver my plane, or make a high speed escape. I was afraid. I thought I might be finished.

When I had calmed down, I radioed for another plane to come and have a look, trying to hide my fear. They said no, it's too high, just come back. I had to glide part way down due to lack of fuel, zigzagging to make my plane harder to hit, always with my eyes on the rearview mirrors, hoping it wouldn't chase me. It didn't.

I spent 22 minutes maneuvering with this object. After I landed, the object remained stationary in the sky for two more hours, for everyone at the base to see.

A US Department of Defense document titled 'UFO Sighted in Peru' described the incident, stating that the vehicle's origin remains unknown.

It still gives me chills to think



Link (http://www.ufodigest.com/news/1107/ufoconference5.html)

Bremspropeller
05-31-2010, 12:37 PM
Usually, modern fighters are limited to 50k due to there not being any support for pressure-suits.
The 50k-ceiling is imposed for safety-reasons in case of the cabin decompressing, there wouldn't be much (if any) TUC for the pilot to react.

Generally, russian fighters of those performance-figures should be able to reach these altitudes without much of a problem.
I'm quite sure there's also a provision for a pressure-suit.

TS_Sancho
05-31-2010, 12:43 PM
Ty Brems. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

jarink
05-31-2010, 03:14 PM
Originally posted by TS_Sancho:
It was about 30 feet in diameter. It was an enameled, cream-colored dome, with a wide, circular, metallic base. It had no engines, no exhausts, no windows, no wings or antennae. It lacked all the typical aircraft components, with no visible propulsion system.

It was at that moment that I realized that this was no spying device, but that it was a...

Weather Balloon! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

TS_Sancho
05-31-2010, 03:59 PM
Originally posted by jarink:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TS_Sancho:
It was about 30 feet in diameter. It was an enameled, cream-colored dome, with a wide, circular, metallic base. It had no engines, no exhausts, no windows, no wings or antennae. It lacked all the typical aircraft components, with no visible propulsion system.

It was at that moment that I realized that this was no spying device, but that it was a...

Weather Balloon! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Exactly http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

TinyTim
05-31-2010, 04:10 PM
And what exactly was it that prevented that fighter pilot, who saw the thing, from recognizing it as a weather balloon?

WTE_Galway
05-31-2010, 05:27 PM
No idea on an operational su22 but a Mig 25M (Mikoyan Gurevitch Ye-266M) flown by Alexandr Fedotov on 31 August 1977 set the current non rocket plane absolute altitude record of 123,524 ft.

mortoma
05-31-2010, 05:38 PM
Originally posted by WTE_Galway:
No idea on an operational su22 but a Mig 25M (Mikoyan Gurevitch Ye-266M) flown by Alexandr Fedotov on 31 August 1977 set the current non rocket plane absolute altitude record of 123,524 ft. He set the record only because the SR-71's record height was classified and still is. The SR-71 was non-rocket too but most likely could climb much higher or else the Soviets could have shot it down with the same aircraft. SR-71 pilots must get a nice chuckle from that soviet so-called record.

TS_Sancho
05-31-2010, 05:54 PM
Originally posted by WTE_Galway:
No idea on an operational su22 but a Mig 25M (Mikoyan Gurevitch Ye-266M) flown by Alexandr Fedotov on 31 August 1977 set the current non rocket plane absolute altitude record of 123,524 ft.

I would'nt blink at the claim if it were a foxbat, however a third generation export model mud mover?

I,ve found numerous references listing the service ceiling between 46-49k. I am suspicious of an operational claim of 20% over a service ceiling that I am guessing was a figure derived from an cleaner and lighter SU-17 as the same numbers are quoted for the entire SU-7 family.

Although I hold Brems opinion in high regard I was hoping someone would have a source with some substance?

I actually emailed the question to Sukhoi on absolute ceiling on the SU-22M4. I wonder if I will get a response?

Uzunov
06-03-2010, 02:19 PM
Originally posted by mortoma:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by WTE_Galway:
No idea on an operational su22 but a Mig 25M (Mikoyan Gurevitch Ye-266M) flown by Alexandr Fedotov on 31 August 1977 set the current non rocket plane absolute altitude record of 123,524 ft. He set the record only because the SR-71's record height was classified and still is. The SR-71 was non-rocket too but most likely could climb much higher or else the Soviets could have shot it down with the same aircraft. SR-71 pilots must get a nice chuckle from that soviet so-called record. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just for argument sake, the reason SR-71's record is classified may not be what you are implying but exactly the opposite http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Your reasoning doesn't make complete sense to me for another reason. An interceptor, in order to fire a missile at an intruder, must not only climb up but also to catch up. At the vast spaces of the Soviet, now Russian, border and the multi-mach speeds of these great planes that is a great challenge.

Just saying ...