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View Full Version : Oleg:: make...Ancient Naval Med sim



XyZspineZyX
12-01-2003, 08:05 PM
Oleg must make a "Med" sim about ancient navies and it would be ~very~ visual and you begin at long range yet maneuver to get advantage before coming face to face with your enemy.

Maneuver, Ramming, or raking enemy oars could appeal to the FB turn fighters. Grapple and Boarding using heavy ships armed with soldiers could appeal to others. Onboard bow~n~arrow Archers. "Fire pots."

Pure sailing transport ships too as well as oared warships. Most modern sounding was the huge battle off Sicily in the First Punic WAR between Carthage and Rome. The Romans were escorting pure sail transports for an invasion of Africa and were intercepted by Carthaginians. Using very advanced tactics that took advantage of their ship designs, the Roman war fleet under Admiral Regulus protected their transports and drove off the Carthage interceptors. Something like 300 warships involved in the battle, not counting transports.

On long mission in oared warship you stay near the coast and land at night to find food, water, and sleep, as the warships were stuffed with rowers, soldiers, and weapons with little supplies of food and water. Best surprise tactic was catching enemy fleet beached having dinner or sleeping. Vulching is an ancient tactic. Some night battles, and many amazing stories of combats resulting in bands of soldiers stranded or blockaded on Med islands...closest thing ever to Pacific World War 2. And the skins of these ancient warships could put the skins of any WW2 aircraft to shame.

Also they often capture abandoned ships after battle. Possibly half the combat losses were captured. Although to be honest the majority of losses overall seemed to be from bad weather. Back then the Admirals consulted religious types to predict the weather--and usually regretted doing so. I think some of the better more seasoned sailors predicted their own weather and survived alot better. But like today, the heights of command never listen to the lowly experienced veteran. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif Some things never change.

Command a ship only or lead a squadron or entire fleet? If you get shot down...er...sunk and if you drown (ancient Admirals often wore heavy decorative clothing I think) do you come back to a campaign re~incarnated as rear gunner *I mean* oar rower as punishment? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Ancient warship slave rowers is a USA Hollywood invention, as the rowers had to be pampered and fed the best food (and drink!) until their "everything" was needed in battle. However, the thought of whipping and beating the AI rear gunners in FB gives particular pleasure.




Message Edited on 12/01/03 07:17PM by LEXX_Luthor

Message Edited on 12/01/0307:26PM by LEXX_Luthor

XyZspineZyX
12-01-2003, 08:05 PM
Oleg must make a "Med" sim about ancient navies and it would be ~very~ visual and you begin at long range yet maneuver to get advantage before coming face to face with your enemy.

Maneuver, Ramming, or raking enemy oars could appeal to the FB turn fighters. Grapple and Boarding using heavy ships armed with soldiers could appeal to others. Onboard bow~n~arrow Archers. "Fire pots."

Pure sailing transport ships too as well as oared warships. Most modern sounding was the huge battle off Sicily in the First Punic WAR between Carthage and Rome. The Romans were escorting pure sail transports for an invasion of Africa and were intercepted by Carthaginians. Using very advanced tactics that took advantage of their ship designs, the Roman war fleet under Admiral Regulus protected their transports and drove off the Carthage interceptors. Something like 300 warships involved in the battle, not counting transports.

On long mission in oared warship you stay near the coast and land at night to find food, water, and sleep, as the warships were stuffed with rowers, soldiers, and weapons with little supplies of food and water. Best surprise tactic was catching enemy fleet beached having dinner or sleeping. Vulching is an ancient tactic. Some night battles, and many amazing stories of combats resulting in bands of soldiers stranded or blockaded on Med islands...closest thing ever to Pacific World War 2. And the skins of these ancient warships could put the skins of any WW2 aircraft to shame.

Also they often capture abandoned ships after battle. Possibly half the combat losses were captured. Although to be honest the majority of losses overall seemed to be from bad weather. Back then the Admirals consulted religious types to predict the weather--and usually regretted doing so. I think some of the better more seasoned sailors predicted their own weather and survived alot better. But like today, the heights of command never listen to the lowly experienced veteran. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif Some things never change.

Command a ship only or lead a squadron or entire fleet? If you get shot down...er...sunk and if you drown (ancient Admirals often wore heavy decorative clothing I think) do you come back to a campaign re~incarnated as rear gunner *I mean* oar rower as punishment? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Ancient warship slave rowers is a USA Hollywood invention, as the rowers had to be pampered and fed the best food (and drink!) until their "everything" was needed in battle. However, the thought of whipping and beating the AI rear gunners in FB gives particular pleasure.




Message Edited on 12/01/03 07:17PM by LEXX_Luthor

Message Edited on 12/01/0307:26PM by LEXX_Luthor

XyZspineZyX
12-01-2003, 08:20 PM
First Pubic War Luthor????

Try the First Punic War./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif



LEXX_Luthor wrote:
-
-
- Pure sailing transport ships too as well as oared
- warships. Most modern sounding was the huge battle
- off Sicily in the First Pubic WAR between Carthage
- and Rome. The Romans were escorting pure sail
- transports for an invasion of Africa and were
- intercepted by Carthaginians. Using very advanced
- tactics that took advantage of their ship designs,
- the Roman war fleet under Admiral Regulus - protected their transports and drove off the
- Carthage interceptors. Something like 300 warships
- involved in the battle, not counting transports.
-
-


http://www.thundercycle.com/photos/dropdead2.gif



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
12-01-2003, 08:29 PM
Wow! I got it Milo! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif Thanks. You have uber-eyesight like the people the ancient navies hired for long range spotting.

XyZspineZyX
12-01-2003, 08:49 PM
When I saw that I wundered at the age of the participants./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Sounds like a good idea for a sim./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


http://www.thundercycle.com/photos/dropdead2.gif



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
12-01-2003, 09:21 PM
Or, an Age of Sail naval game.

Those are so incredibly rare, it would be the only game on the shelves. Galleons, frigates, blockade runners...different types of guns you could install on ships, then maintain your crew. Pay wages to keep them happy, gain experience over time...


For those of ye olde folks who have played the New Horizons game (for the SNES, if I recall), a 3d version of that would kick so much arse.

But I think you'd have to have some sort of continuity between battles for that type of game, as instead of just a single pilot in a each aircraft, its a hundred or more men on each ship, and so the ability of each ship is almost entirely dependant upon the skill of the crew, as well as their health, happiness, and so forth. Sure, the captain ordered tactics, but without a crew to make the ship move properly, all the tactics in the world won't help you.


Oleg, make the game! I'll buy it! =D

XyZspineZyX
12-02-2003, 06:04 AM
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00004U8K0/qid=1070341389/sr=1-2/ref=sr_1_2_etk-vg/102-1298917-9989735?v=glance&s=videogames&n=468642

Whutz wrong with this one?

XyZspineZyX
12-02-2003, 06:35 AM
Hey, that looks silly. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

The short distance between islands and coasts of the Med in ancient Phonecian, Greek, Roman, Rhodian, and Egyptian times will make a more fun landscape. The oar makes tactics vary from extremes of Greek maneuver and ram to the opposite extreme of Roman grapple and board tactics. The ancient equivelant of the Lufberry Circle is lashing warships together to form defensive floating fortress--sometimes it worked, sometimes it failed.

Even more fun could be the use of oar warships as infantry siege devices against coastal cities. Ancient seige warfare competes with any modern form of WAR in complexity and sheer number of ideas thought of. Catapults were used by shore defense and included burning payload against wooden ship--but the "Ben Hur" movie was a little over the top cos ship to ship combat never really could use heavy catapults but they did throw fire and embers for a very short distance. Mostly they depended on "missiles" (arrows) and boarding with sword or, for the lighter ships with armoured bows, ramming. Archimedes' wonder weapons defending the port city of Syracruse would be the equivalent of Gibbage's German FB jets coming soon in the addon CD--never enough of them.

Age of Oar. The paint jobs these Med ships had...these would make Awsum skins!

XyZspineZyX
12-02-2003, 03:19 PM
I can just imagine the whining about how the Persian sail can esape the Athennian trirema, the damage model of the Roman pentera being flawed since it doesn't burn in a right way... Also AI would be uber because it could do longer without anchoring.

What about difficulty settings? If you play cockpit on only, can you see something right in front of the ship (from the rudderer's point)?

XyZspineZyX
12-02-2003, 06:42 PM
-- whining about how the Persian sail can esape the Athennian trirema,

If they forget to turn on Wind and Water Turbulence.

And the Persian Whining when the Athenian rowers don't overheat.