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View Full Version : Regarding level of detail (LOD) models...



Lurch1962
05-28-2008, 04:37 PM
As some of you know, I've arranged my "'pit" so that my face is 1 foot from my 19" CRT running at 1600 x 1200, in order to get that you're-in-the-cockpit immersive feeling. (I wear 3.5 diopter reading glasses to get comfortable focus.)

Since doing this for the better part of a year now, I've been seeing rather noticeably the size differences between some aircraft and ground object LOD models when they switch based on their apparent size. (That is, when line of sight distance varies or the FOV "zoom" level changes.) Note that I'm referring here to the 3-D polygonal construct, and not the texture mapped skin.

One of the more notable examples is the Bf-109 LOD model. When approaching a 109 at high aspect, i.e. when its planform is well displayed, the LOD size when going from low detail to moderate detail (or is it moderate to high?) actually becomes smaller in area. Obviously, back in the "early days" this was desirable because of the generally lower resolutions players used, and hence the somewhat larger LOD at greater distances would have helped just that extra little bit to ascertain the bandit's attitude.

With the now commonplace high resolutions many folks play at, it's apparent that LODs need to be of more similar size. And if not a resource hit, perhaps also of greater number. What do we have now... 4? Maybe 6 would be better?

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An even worse sin is the behavior of models for the heavies. Take the B-17. When it transitions from the "dot" to the crudest LOD at 6km, the wingspan instantaneously jumps from the 2x2 dot width to the appropriate 15 pixel width (with 1600 pixel display). Too bad the LOD wasn't drawn at beyond-6km distances; then the "dicke autos" would be seen more properly and distances could be better gauged based on apparent size.

Or is there a way to make the LODs be drawn at farther distances?

Choctaw111
05-28-2008, 04:58 PM
I have noticed this as well. You can watch the planes/objects "jump" from one detail level to the next as you get closer.
I do not believe that there is any way to change the settings for those, only the LOD for the terrain.

Tully__
05-29-2008, 03:57 AM
And if not a resource hit, perhaps also of greater number. What do we have now... 4? Maybe 6 would be better?
We already have 6, though the 2 coursest aren't much more than dots. In fact the last one IS a dot.

As for the 109 numbers 3 & 4 models, there were comments about their size disparity right from the original IL2 Sturmovik, specifically in relation to how easy it made them to spot in comparison to other aircraft at the ranges those LOD models are displayed.

SlickStick
05-29-2008, 07:50 AM
Unfortunately, this is one area of the sim that has had issues for a long time and sadly, will most likely never be fixed. Some of the other notable LOD issues are Seafires losing one or both wings at different LODs and the Mk. VIII losing one wing.

One thing though, the wings missing sure make it easy to pick out a specific target in a furball. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

TinyTim
05-29-2008, 08:01 AM
Originally posted by SlickStick:
One thing though, the wings missing sure make it easy to pick out a specific target in a furball. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

What good is the ability to recognise your foe by missing wings, when it is way harder to see it in first place because of exactly the same reason?

Anyway, I always thought that's a graphic card / driver issue.

Ratsack
05-29-2008, 08:08 AM
No, it's a bug.

BTW, I agree with you about the difficulty of seeing the no-winged Seafire. The bastages just disappear against the background.

Ratsack

SlickStick
05-29-2008, 08:10 AM
Originally posted by TinyTim:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SlickStick:
One thing though, the wings missing sure make it easy to pick out a specific target in a furball. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

What good is the ability to recognise your foe by missing wings, when it is way harder to see it in first place because of exactly the same reason?

Anyway, I always thought that's a graphic card / driver issue. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Because seeing the wing(s) missing makes it stand out more as an enemy for blue in a furball and helps with quicker ID to setup the attack. The wing(s) missing actually make it the "sore thumb" of the planes in the area, especially when you can zoom in/out with the gunsight view and make the wing disappear/reappear. Granted, it's only a few planes with issues, but every little bit helps. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

It's most definitely a code issue with the LODs though. They've been talked about for years on these forums.

TinyTim
05-29-2008, 08:24 AM
Originally posted by SlickStick:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TinyTim:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SlickStick:
One thing though, the wings missing sure make it easy to pick out a specific target in a furball. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

What good is the ability to recognise your foe by missing wings, when it is way harder to see it in first place because of exactly the same reason?

Anyway, I always thought that's a graphic card / driver issue. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Because seeing the wing(s) missing makes it stand out more as an enemy for blue in a furball and helps with quicker ID to setup the attack. The wing(s) missing actually make it the "sore thumb" of the planes in the area, especially when you can zoom in/out with the gunsight view and make the wing disappear/reappear. Granted, it's only a few planes with issues, but every little bit helps. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Then it's probably just me about this... There were instances when I overlooked the spit exactly because his wings were missing, and I didn't notice the "flying pencil" with my peripheral vision... I noticed that later when reviewing the track (wondering - where the hell did he go) - I would have never missed a full winged fighter, especially not a spit with its huge wings (I assume wings dissapear on track as well). It's a two sided coin, that's all I am saying. Easier recognisable indeed but harder to see in first place.

SlickStick
05-29-2008, 08:47 AM
Originally posted by TinyTim:
Easier recognisable indeed but harder to see in first place.

Agreed. The closer you get, the easier it becomes to pick out those LOD issue planes, but I agree it can make it extremely difficult to spot them at long distances in the first place.