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Pirschjaeger
08-06-2006, 12:48 AM
I hope the mods will not mind me posting this. I think it's important for people who want to teach overseas to see the possibilities and dangers.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060805/ap_on_re_as/china_schoolhouse_sweatshops

I have experienced the same sort of abuse upon arriving in China 6 years ago. I even received death threats on my second day here. I have also received emails from people being held against their will in various parts of China.

If anyone is planning to teach abroad you are all welcome to pm me for advice.

Fritz

Daiichidoku
08-06-2006, 01:06 AM
wimmin never learn thier lessons

ImpStarDuece
08-06-2006, 01:22 AM
On the other hand, I spent 14 months teaching English in Japan and can't recommend the experience highly enough. I consider it the single best year or so of my life. I made friends, both Japanese and gaijin, that I consider some of my closest and dearest.

One of my greatest regrets was coming back home to take up another job (even if it was in aviation). I should of renewed my contract and stayed a full 5 years!

liveforflying
08-06-2006, 02:23 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gifI am sorry to hear about that,Pirschjaeger. Would you mind telling me which province have you been to while you were in China?

Badsight-
08-06-2006, 02:44 AM
pirschjager , this guy from the town im working has just come back to NZ from china - he was teaching english over there in a city called ping (spl?)

corrupt , polluted , mad money rush were his biggest impressions . spent the last 2 years there

Monty_Thrud
08-06-2006, 05:11 AM
I'm very much against Chinas growth, i believe it will cause great problems for us in the future...

...too late was the cry.

CHDT
08-06-2006, 05:34 AM
And during this time, the little Europe keeps its "open doors", "everybody from the third-world welcome" policy!

Civilisational suicide!

Just look what Great-Britain is becoming! Sad.

carguy_
08-06-2006, 05:53 AM
Originally posted by Monty_Thrud:
I'm very much against Chinas growth, i believe it will cause great problems for us in the future...

...too late was the cry.


Guess who is helping them,Einstein. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Monty_Thrud
08-06-2006, 05:58 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gifStrange response...but i didnt say we were not helping them on their way, just that i'm against it...do you understand that?

bazzaah2
08-06-2006, 06:01 AM
Originally posted by CHDT:
And during this time, the little Europe keeps its "open doors", "everybody from the third-world welcome" policy!

Civilisational suicide!

Just look what Great-Britain is becoming! Sad.

too true.

No surprise that emigration is at a record level. If it weren't for my girlfriend's complex family issues, we'd be off like a shot.

CHDT
08-06-2006, 06:16 AM
More precisely, my last trip to Great Britain was done in 1987 and last month, I spent two weeks there, at first in Londen and then in my beloved Scotland.

I was simply shocked by the changes in big cities, but even in the smaller towns the deconstruction of the country was clearly visible.



"If it weren't for my girlfriend's complex family issues, we'd be off like a shot."

I read that more and more British citizen are trying to escape this "experiment". In my area, we begin to see some middle-upper class couples trying to settle down.

I don't want to say much more about this subject, because I fear I would say too much, but it's sad. And extremely worrying for the future.

Feathered_IV
08-06-2006, 06:30 AM
Originally posted by Monty_Thrud:
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gifStrange response...but i didnt say we were not helping them on their way, just that i'm against it...do you understand that?

Wouldn't deliberately trying to keep a nation down also breed all manner of unpleasantness later on though?

joeap
08-06-2006, 06:33 AM
Err don' the Chinese have the right to develop their country? Or is it only us here in the West who have the right to fridges and two cars?

dazza9806482
08-06-2006, 06:34 AM
I'm not really getting where you guys are coming from re. GB immigration.

well i think i might be...

immigration is one of the most poorly understood and media mauled of modern british issues.

To be honest the vast majority of people both economic migrants and asylum seekers simply come here for a better life and to have their kids educated.

Glasgow is a good example, since it has a large proportion of asylum seekers, the vast majority integrate fully, contribute to society but maintain their identity.

granted there are some issues, in particular certain cultural segregation by nationalities such as somalis, who seem to rank low on those nationalities attempting to integrate. but these issues are blown out of all proportion by the media giving people some kind of sense that we are being over run. we arent.

remember that the malcontents behind the london bombings were often 2nd or 3rd generation. These people were not recent immigrants from 3rd world nations.

all of this is an inevitable consequence of globalisation.

the vast majority of asylum seekers i have met, probably around 400-500 people, are overjoyed to see their kids get a good education, learn english, and contribute new skills to society.

in contrast i would say scottish society for example is more at risk from the vast swathe of alcoholic, drug addicted, violent, benefit leeching, white families.

Capt.England
08-06-2006, 06:43 AM
Hopefully in 5 years time I should be moving to Turkey. I went up town last night and felt that I was already living abroad. To meet someone in Leicester who's native English is getting very rare. Still, Polish girls are very pretty! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

dazza9806482
08-06-2006, 06:44 AM
Originally posted by Capt.England Still, Polish girls are very pretty! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

exactly!

im all for the cultural diversity

CHDT
08-06-2006, 06:45 AM
dazza9806482, very good resume of the most tired clichés about the deconstruction of our nations, which are supposed to be transformed, by careful social engineering, in some kind of international airport areas. And we are even supposed to find this process positive and funny, without any right to say anything to protect our heritage, our identity. At least, American natives didn't surrender their lands without a fight!

Not really important to discuss this subject, soon reality will hit back at the door.

Btw, people are already voting about this subject with their feet, with the "white flight" more and more noticeable every year.

CHDT
08-06-2006, 06:49 AM
"remember that the malcontents behind the london bombings were often 2nd or 3rd generation. These people were not recent immigrants from 3rd world nations."

The best example to show that nationality is more than a simple piece of administrative paper.

dazza9806482
08-06-2006, 06:50 AM
Originally posted by CHDT:
dazza9806482, very good resume of the most tired clichés about the deconstruction of our nations, which are supposed to be transformed, by careful social engineering, in some kind of international airport areas. And we are even supposed to find this process positive and funny, without any right to say anything to protect our heritage, our identity. At least, American natives didn't surrender their lands without a fight!

Not really important to discuss this subject, soon reality will hit back at the door.

Btw, people are already voting about this subject with their feet, with the "white flight" more and more noticeable every year.

sure. i accept your opinion, thats the beauty of this country. and i do have concerns.

cliched perhaps, but i do speak from working with asylum seekers for the last 4 years. and from a government perspective. still we all know how many scandals have rocked that particular department recent

regards mate. no barney intended

DuxCorvan
08-06-2006, 06:52 AM
Unfortunately, Western humanist philosophy that built our present culture of human rights and individual freedom has this internal contradiction: that the acts of strength needed to keep it safe are against its moral principles, but the keeping of these principles will in the end provoke their destruction in the hands of other civilizations which give a damn about them.

So our civilization is doomed: whether we destroy it by betraying its most intimate principles, or it is destroyed by the action of its enemies, or it simply fades away because of progressive aculturation.

StG2_Schlachter
08-06-2006, 06:54 AM
Originally posted by joeap:
Err don' the Chinese have the right to develop their country? Or is it only us here in the West who have the right to fridges and two cars?

Sure, but economic growth in China is largely dependent on investment from the "West". They swept over western markets with cheap products while receiving top technology from western nations. One example is the German magnet rail train "Transrapid". Some Chinese company copied very much of that design and is know building its own magrail, claiming it was all build on Chinese technology.

Chinas growth is a farce. The big eastern cities like Shanghai are "prospering" while people in the larger, western areas are poor, sick from all kinds of pollution and have an education not worth mentioning.

Chinas economy holds great potential but the population is much too large to create a functioning capitalist society.

Never could 1.2 billion poeple live on western standards. There are not enough ressources.

CHDT
08-06-2006, 07:02 AM
"cliched perhaps, but i do speak from working with asylum seekers for the last 4 years. and from a government perspective."


So from a "government perspective", you will perhaps take some interest in these articles:

http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/breakingnew...tion--name_page.html (http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/breakingnews/tm_objectid=17476326%26method=full%26siteid=50061% 26headline=birkenhead-mp-calls-for-end-to-mass-immigration--name_page.html)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/new...Module&icc=NEWS&ct=5 (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=398232&in_page_id=1770&ico=Homepage&icl=TabModule&icc=NEWS&ct=5)



Btw, about Brits leaving their homeland:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/5237236.stm

Apparently, in the same time third-world immigrant come to England for a "better life", native Brits are thinking of searching a "better life" abroad. Coincidence?

CHDT
08-06-2006, 07:10 AM
"So our civilization is doomed: whether we destroy it by betraying its most intimate principles, or it is destroyed by the action of its enemies, or it simply fades away because of progressive aculturation."


Very cleverly said.

In the end, when the situation takes the path of simple survival, it will be obvious that the people is more important than the abstract principles of civilization.

Because if the people survives, it's always possible to build again civilization. But if the people dies, it's all over, because it's the people that build the civilization and not the opposite.

Those who will survive as a civilisational construction are those who can accept this fact.

Those who can't accept this fact can already enlist themselves on the memorial of the disappeared peoples.

liveforflying
08-06-2006, 07:55 AM
Originally posted by StG2_Schlachter:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by joeap:
Err don' the Chinese have the right to develop their country? Or is it only us here in the West who have the right to fridges and two cars?

Sure, but economic growth in China is largely dependent on investment from the "West". They swept over western markets with cheap products while receiving top technology from western nations. One example is the German magnet rail train "Transrapid". Some Chinese company copied very much of that design and is know building its own magrail, claiming it was all build on Chinese technology.

Chinas growth is a farce. The big eastern cities like Shanghai are "prospering" while people in the larger, western areas are poor, sick from all kinds of pollution and have an education not worth mentioning.

Chinas economy holds great potential but the population is much too large to create a functioning capitalist society.

Never could 1.2 billion poeple live on western standards. There are not enough ressources. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, Schlachter, I have to disgree with u on some points.

Firstly, I don't know it is true or not that the Chinese engineers had "stolen" the Transrapid technology, what I heard is that later this had been verified false. But who knows? I won't make a conclusion so fast. What I know is that the principle of magnetic suspension railway is unprotected and has no german patent.

The Chinese are selling cheap things now, but it is not "dumping", the goods are cheap because the materials and labour in China are much cheaper than here in Europe. But go to the computer store, if you compare the prices of the hardwares, you will find they are much higher than in the Chinese market. Well, I dare not mention the prices of softwares, http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

And even as Chinese I don't know the economic growth of China is a farce or not. Of course, I hope not, but yes China economy now still has numerous problems to confront, it's far from as the same standard as Western Europe. But I don't believe we cannot catch up with you guys in the future because we have no ressources, just look at Japanese, what kind of ressources do they have? On their islands, they are also crowed. But I won't say the population is the big hinderance to create a functioning capitalist society. Only time will tell.

liveforflying
08-06-2006, 08:02 AM
And Chinese will threaten the existence of Europe? How? I have no idea, this is just out of my imagination. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

DuxCorvan
08-06-2006, 08:14 AM
Originally posted by liveforflying:
And Chinese will threaten the existence of Europe? How? I have no idea, this is just out of my imagination.

Ten to one. A balanced situation only while technology and power is in our side to compensate the odds. After that... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Pirschjaeger
08-06-2006, 09:19 AM
Wow, this thread went down fast enough to earn some sort of recognition.

Some of the posts I've read in here seem like the same mentality I was warning you guys about.

Teaching abroad can be very rewarding, just as Imp-Star pointed out. It's quite a unique experience and you learn a lot about yourself and where you come from. Some of you guys need to get out more often.

The thing is it can be dangerous if you don't check into it first. As was mentioned in the news report, Dave's ESL Cafe is about the biggest ESL site available. Before jumping into a teaching contract, do the research. If you are going to a place like China then you'll have to be extra cautious. My best advice would be to go to the biggest and most modern cites such as Beijing and Shanghai.

Regardless of what CNN, BBC, ABC, or CCTV tells you, China is technically not one country. The central government lacks nationwide control and therefore the laws in most places can not be reinforced.

As for the immigrant issue, I'm sure most of you come from immigrant families. In the last 500 years my family has immigrated from Norway to Sweden to Germany and to Canada. I immigrated to Europe.

Don't blame immigrants for your social problems. Blame your governments for poor immigration and integration policies. Then you can blame those who voted for your governments.

Fritz

liveforflying
08-06-2006, 09:41 AM
Yeah, Pirschjaeger is right, my advice is also that if you went to China to be a teacher, try to stay in city areas, there people are more educated and have high awareness of laws.

heywooood
08-06-2006, 10:26 AM
Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
Wow, this thread went down fast enough to earn some sort of recognition.

Some of the posts I've read in here seem like the same mentality I was warning you guys about.

Teaching abroad can be very rewarding, just as Imp-Star pointed out. It's quite a unique experience and you learn a lot about yourself and where you come from. Some of you guys need to get out more often.

The thing is it can be dangerous if you don't check into it first. As was mentioned in the news report, Dave's ESL Cafe is about the biggest ESL site available. Before jumping into a teaching contract, do the research. If you are going to a place like China then you'll have to be extra cautious. My best advice would be to go to the biggest and most modern cites such as Beijing and Shanghai.

Regardless of what CNN, BBC, ABC, or CCTV tells you, China is technically not one country. The central government lacks nationwide control and therefore the laws in most places can not be reinforced.

As for the immigrant issue, I'm sure most of you come from immigrant families. In the last 500 years my family has immigrated from Norway to Sweden to Germany and to Canada. I immigrated to Europe.

Don't blame immigrants for your social problems. Blame your governments for poor immigration and integration policies. Then you can blame those who voted for your governments.

Fritz

Absolutely agree 100%

Stop fighting it everyone - we will all eventually be one race - monochromatic transgenderal and identical...thats the grand plan. Thats if we make it that far.
Migration and integration is a natural course of our evolution. It just takes a really long time to accomplish it all - first you need to develop the technology to be able to transport people rapidly to all corners of the world - then you have to break down cultural and psychological barriers enough to allow cross breeding (takes the longest to do this part) - fortunately the females are prone to acceptance ..." you're from Where?!! ooo I love your accent!" After that its just a question of time and then down come the borders and the rest of the barriers between us and you get your millenium of peace and quiet on earth.

Pirschjaeger
08-06-2006, 10:34 AM
Originally posted by heywooood:
we will all eventually be one race - monochromatic .

Who you callin monogrammatic? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Jokes aside, we shouldn't fear change. If it wasn't for change, we couldn't play "heads or tails". Sorry, couldn't resist. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

If it wasn't for change we'd still be eating termites and whatever else we could fit into our mouths. We might even be limited to Atari Asteroids.

Fritz

CHDT
08-06-2006, 11:18 AM
Stop fighting it everyone - we will all eventually be one race - monochromatic transgenderal and identical...thats the grand plan. Thats if we make it that far.

If it's The plan, it will fail.

Simply because the Asiatic and the Africain countries have the human numbers to stay as they always are, contrary to the European countries.

So in 500 or 1000 years, there will always be African or Chinese peoples, but probably no more recognizable Europeans. Just a question of numbers and past wrong politics. Yep, just like the Mohicans. On a personal point of view, I'm not so enthusiastic to be a 21st century Mohican! Of course, I know there are people not caring at all for what will happen in the future, with no sense of distance in the time.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/racism/Story/0,,363777,00.html


"Migration and integration is a natural course of our evolution. "

Another common wrong idea, for Europe at least.

For the past 3000 years, migrations in Europe have always been inter-european migrations (mongol and arabic conquests in Europe have just had a minor impact on the ethnic point of view), with the celtic expansion as the last big one.

What we experience now is on the contrary a totally inedite story.

So, as "something" is really happening and as we are supposed (or obliged) to do nothing about it, at least don't insult our intelligence by telling us that nothing is happening http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Btw, in spite of having tried hard, I never found one single valid reason which would explain why a people should peacefully accept to become a minority on its own land.

Also I find somehow funny to have a pic of "The few of the few" and praising open borders for everybody wishing to come, as "The few of the few" precisely fought for defending a border, their border.

I just hope too that nobody will come with the "you racist" guilt tricks, as if it's OK, mainstream, politically correct, for a Tibetan citizen to fight against the "chinesification" of his country, I couldn't understand why the same idea would be forbidden for a European citizen. To say the truth, if I hate something in this world, it's the double standard attitude that I really hate!

CHDT
08-06-2006, 11:23 AM
"Jokes aside, we shouldn't fear change. If it wasn't for change, we couldn't play "heads or tails". Sorry, couldn't resist."



"My attitude toward progress has passed from antagonism to boredom. I have long ceased to argue with people who prefer Thursday to Wednesday because it is Thursday. (G.K.Chesterton)"

Sorry, couldn't resist too :-)

SeaFireLIV
08-06-2006, 11:27 AM
Originally posted by CHDT:
"remember that the malcontents behind the london bombings were often 2nd or 3rd generation. These people were not recent immigrants from 3rd world nations."

The best example to show that nationality is more than a simple piece of administrative paper.

THIS is dangerous talk, as it implies that it is not enough to be 2nd or 3rd generation asian British or Jamaican british or generally just Black British. If our lneage doesn`t go back to the middle ages or even further then we`re all now `terrorists`. Right?

And this, "I`d move if I could, " or "I am moving from those areas ." doesn`t help either, because all you`re doing is creating segregation that will create an even worse situation of `them` and `us` down the line.

I`m really sick of this kind of talk, lumping the whole of the black or asian race into one group when we`re all individuals. Dammit, I know this country backwards and I was born here among white folk and most of my best m8s are white and yet when I hear **** like this, it just makes me shake my head in dissappointment.

We feel, see, hear and perceive just as you do, and have worries too. We aren`t all terrorists waiting to blow up something.

But what`s the point. I get this **** everyday. I just walk down the street behind a white woman and she`s wetting herself cos she thinks I`m gonna mug her - stupid thing is, I`d be the one to HELP her if she was attacked by someone.

Yes, and if you guys haven`t worked it out yet, I`m BLACK and ENGLISH and PROUD TO BE!!! Even with jerks like you around.

CHDT
08-06-2006, 11:44 AM
"THIS is dangerous talk, as it implies that it is not enough to be 2nd or 3rd generation asian British or Jamaican british or generally just Black British. If our lneage doesn`t go back to the middle ages or even further then we`re all now `terrorists`. Right?"

Sorry, but reality doesn't care of what we think of the reality:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2092-2300423_1,00.html

In fact, the diversity has always been a factor of weakness, on a civilisational point of view, and we are simply following in Europe the path of the Roman Empire.

I know that the Jamaicans are perfectly integrated within the British society, it's not the problem. The problem is for instance when you are a cypriot citizen and when you realize that your island have now more than twice the number of illegals on its soil than all your police forces. It simply can't continue this way.

CHDT
08-06-2006, 11:53 AM
Btw, what is especially sad with this matter, it's that this is not a problem of individual persons, as the individuals, on all continents, in every peoples, are in the biggest majority good people, with similar feeling and peaceful personal ambitions.

No, the problem is that you cannot play easily the little social engineer with the peoples on a global point of view, without causing big civilisational damages, which will bring only trouble to these good individuals who asked nothing, except having a normal and quiet life.

joeap
08-06-2006, 12:11 PM
Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
But what`s the point. I get this **** everyday. I just walk down the street behind a white woman and she`s wetting herself cos she thinks I`m gonna mug her - stupid thing is, I`d be the one to HELP her if she was attacked by someone.

Yes, and if you guys haven`t worked it out yet, I`m BLACK and ENGLISH and PROUD TO BE!!! Even with jerks like you around.
Didn't know, don't care, you always come across as the quintessential English gentleman Seafire. Sad some react like those women you mention. Truly would be more scared of white chavs or soccer holligans than just a regular black or asian guy. I am a son of immigrants too.

heywooood
08-06-2006, 12:14 PM
ok - lets just kill all the sociopaths.

DuxCorvan
08-06-2006, 12:27 PM
The issue has nothing to do with stupid racial "problems". There's only one human breed: human breed. For all those that may think this has to do with some kind of 'superiority', my most angry frown. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gif

It's a cultural issue. We live in a huge world where thousands of peoples have developed cultures to profit and understand the world around them. Having grown separately, all of them have their own history, and have strong similarities -based on human nature- and sheer differences -based in their own dialectic development.

When cultures meet, there's a -intentional or not- race for resources and dominion. That's the realm of war. When cultures developed enough to meet one each other, there was a stalemate for centuries, even thousands of years. Finally, the scientific method, technological warfare and philosophical humanist thinking -beyond the boundaries of religion and belief- gave a marginal edge to Western civilization. It's not a question of deserving, nor arrogance. But it's a fact that ALL the crucial development of modern civilization in the last four centuries -medicine, technology, politics, philosophy and human rights- belong to Western -yet world spreaded- civilization.

While almost all other cultures have been more or less 'aculturated' by the irresistible impact of Western material culture -technology, dressing, etc.- it does not always happen the same with the non-material conquers of Western civilization: democracy, law, equality of rights, social justice, woman rights, etc.

Until now, when immigrants came in search for a better life, they were willing to get integrated, and their children sure got immersed in the Western social and mental structures.

The problem arises when culturally strange peoples immigrate in massive numbers. They can't be 'aculturated', since naturally join in ghettos trying to seek safety, familiar uses and traditions and emotional comfort. If the host society is weak in numbers, is unable to integrate them, and the guests end imposing their culture to their hosts.

Nothing bad really, except if it means I can't drink beer in public or woo a woman without being beaten by a mob. Admit it or not, the loss of Western culture may mean a drawback in the history of mankind. A loss for all, occidentals or not.

CHDT
08-06-2006, 12:40 PM
Originally posted by heywooood:
ok - lets just kill all the sociopaths.

So, you'll have to kill a lot of people, as this opinion is perhaps not mainstream, but the majority.

Look at the comments of this article:

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/broward/sfl-ccen...ug04,0,2122776.story (http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/broward/sfl-ccensus04aug04,0,2122776.story)

http://www.topix.net/forum/source/south-florida-sun-sentinel/T0AAGOBJMLJJTE000

Just this post:

"Remember this country was built by immigrants, South Florida is a beautiful melting pot of all races, and will continue to be,"

First, this country wasn't "built by immigrants." The country was actually founded and built by the British colonists who became the first Americans. Massive immigration didn't happen to the United States until the late 1880s. By that point in time the United States was already a continental power. Secondly, if you think South Florida is a "beautiful melting pot of all races" you have got to be kidding yourself. There are historic tensions between the black and white Americans. Tensions between the white Americans and the Hispanics. Tensions between the black Americans and the Hispanics. Tensions between the black immigrants from the Caribbean and the black Americans. Tensions between the various Hispanic nationalities. Tensions between the Jews and Muslims. South Florida is a classic example of Balkanization and everything that is wrong with "diversity."

If it's possible to avoid what is described here, this "Balkanization", why not avoid it?

Ok, I'm out, as there's no point to discuss this matter.

heywooood
08-06-2006, 01:58 PM
joking pal, take it easy - we're having a discourse and sometimes I throw an irreverent remark out there - to get the pulse of the people.

Knuckle draggers response to a problem is to kill or attack the cause...witness our current administration for proof.

WWMaxGunz
08-06-2006, 03:32 PM
I got your joke Heywood.

Here CHDT. If you 'kill all the sociopaths' then you'd have to be... awwww forget it!

SeaFireLIV
08-06-2006, 04:55 PM
Originally posted by CHDT:

Ok, I'm out, as there's no point to discuss this matter.

Yes. There isn`t because it`s pretty obvious to see where rock solid views aren`t going to move. It`s a pity since I hate going on about race and much prefer to just focus on the main subject at hand - aircraft, WWII stuff, etc...

Usually I always avoid, but I guess when you get to 40, you just have to vent at least once in your life to try and show people that things are not as black and white as some would love to think (if you pardon the pun).

This is my last on this.

WWMaxGunz
08-06-2006, 11:28 PM
There are many Chinese here that know both languages.
How many are willing to go there and teach English, even if they have teaching degrees?
I had friends from Hong Kong who said they could make more money in HK but won't go back,
and they were not teachers at all.

Any place that pays the bigger bucks, there are reasons.

Pirschjaeger
08-07-2006, 09:30 AM
Actually, being Chinese and speaking perfect English will not get you a job here. Quite the opposite in fact. I'll give you two examples.

First, Frank. Frank was born in China but moved to Taiwan at an early age. Then, when he was around ten he moved to the US. He grew up in N.C. and studied psycology in uni. After uni he studied to be a teacher. When he came to my office a month ago looking for a job, I knew there'd be trouble. Regardless, after his interview I agreed to hire him based on his attitude alone.

The owner of my school was angry and we had a shouting match. He, like many Chinese, are racist against Chinese. He tried to explain that no Chinese will pay money to learn from another. I wouldn't back down and like always, he had to accept my decision.

Within two weeks, the compliments from students were coming in. Chinese are only racist by habit. Ten minutes after meeting a non-white, they usually accept them.

Today was worse. Last week I had to dismiss a white American teacher because of his poor teaching quality. This was the first time I had met him and within the first minute I knew I wouldn't have hired him in the first place. Obviously my boss hired him because he was white, nothing more.

Since this teacher was responsible for a big paying contract, it was an emergency to find a teacher before today's afternoon. I found a gentleman from London who was perfect. He studied at Oxford and was highly qualified. He had a great attitude and was experienced in teaching English in the IT industry. I hired him.

My racist half-witted boss saw that he was half Chinese and decided to pull a white Canadian off of another important contract. He made big promises. When the Chinese/German from London came in I introduced him to the Chinese staff. It was so embarrassing. They acted as though he was a polio patient. To make a long story short, the Canadian said he'd never work for my school again and the Chinese/German said he'd finish the two week contract and never work for us again also.

Even more interesting, he went to teach the students at their offices, and they loved him. They said he was perfect.

In the end, there's a lot of unhappy and disappointed people in my school. It will take me months to get this nonsense smoothed out. I gave the owner hell and he's been moping around and avoiding me. TBH, I wanted to knock his racist block off. This was all because two very good people had Asian backgrounds.

Trust me, Chinese that live abroad or were born abroad get nothing but disappointment when they return to China.

As I mentioned, Chinese are extremely racist people but I also said it was by habit. The reason I say habit is because most can drop their racist views within minutes of meeting those they were previously racist about.

I have been repeatedly compared to a monkey due to the hair on my arms. I must point out that it's only Chinese men that do this. I can handle these half-wits in the blink of an eye. I point out to them that Chinese women have more hair on their arms than Chinese men do. This is a fact. Then I point out to them that Chinese women do not have as much hair on their arms as white men because Chinese women are feminine. This is where the Chinese men don't want to discuss it any further. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

It's all about ignorance and education.

Fritz

Fork-N-spoon
08-07-2006, 01:00 PM
I quite agree with the dangers of teaching abroad. A few years ago I taught English as a second language in Mexico. I had no idea that Mexican women would be fawning all over me and chasing me down the street in order to get a date with me. It was life threatening because there was so little time and so many cute Mexican women...

joeap
08-07-2006, 02:24 PM
Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:

I have been repeatedly compared to a monkey due to the hair on my arms. I must point out that it's only Chinese men that do this. I can handle these half-wits in the blink of an eye. I point out to them that Chinese women have more hair on their arms than Chinese men do. This is a fact. Then I point out to them that Chinese women do not have as much hair on their arms as white men because Chinese women are feminine. This is where the Chinese men don't want to discuss it any further. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

It's all about ignorance and education.

Fritz

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

That's a good one, cripes, if they say that about a Northern European like yourself what would they think about me and my Greek hairy genes? Well I had a Chinese roommate in Res when I did my diplome...and he did joke about my hairy arms. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Nice guy though changed a lot of his attitudes during his stay in Europe, even went with me to see the Dalai Lama when he came to Geneva.

horseback
08-07-2006, 09:59 PM
Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by CHDT:

Ok, I'm out, as there's no point to discuss this matter.

Yes. There isn`t because it`s pretty obvious to see where rock solid views aren`t going to move. It`s a pity since I hate going on about race and much prefer to just focus on the main subject at hand - aircraft, WWII stuff, etc...

Usually I always avoid, but I guess when you get to 40, you just have to vent at least once in your life to try and show people that things are not as black and white as some would love to think (if you pardon the pun).

This is my last on this. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>It looks to me as though you two were talking across each other. You're both unhappy about the same thing, but from different perspectives, and certain 'buzzwords' seem to trigger an automatic response.

Seafire, as a victim of racial stereotyping, you may not appreciate the fact that while there are lots of people like you, of various races who came to Europe, Australia, and North America many years ago and have embraced and adopted the language, culture and customs of their new homes, there has been a more recent, and much larger wave of immigration by people who have NOT come to find a new way of life.

In reality, many, if not most, of the new immigrants from the Third World seem to have only come to get the goodies that Western Civilization offers. They want no part of the culture or responsibilities of citizenship, but they demand that their 'hosts' respect their cultures and allow them to perpetuate the very practices that turned their homelands into cesspits and drove them to leave for the West in the first place.

For some reason, the native & long term naturalized citizens of the affected countries often resent this, even though the elected officials and (even more so,) unelected bureaucrats in their respective governments think that they can build new political coalitions by calling the majority of their citizens racists or nativists instead of admitting that they made a mistake by letting these nitwits into the country in the first place and not tossing them out when they broke the rules.

I cannot speak for British citizens, but I'd like to think that most Americans with half a brain (okay, that may not constitute a majority, but it does constitute a fair sized start) take the time to see how a man carries himself, hear how he speaks and the ideals he respects, before they make a judgement about him. Most of us intellectually accept that those things are more important than race, but we also know that they are not as obvious.

Obviously, the second thing people notice about each other is their skin color (gender is always first), and any difference leads to an instinctual caution. It wasn't so long ago that someone who looked different was either someone who wanted to trade (not always a bad thing, but outsiders will take advantage of you), wanted to invade or conquer, or just wanted to loot, rape and pillage, and then go home. Weren't a lot of tourists before the 1800s rolled around, you know?

It is very hard to overcome thousands of years of culture, history, and hell, maybe even DNA, and just accept anyone who shows up in your vicinity, even when he doesn't look like everyone else in your circle of friends.

It's going to take years if not generations, and it's going to be harder for you and your kids than it will be for me and mine (although mine are half Chinese, they look a lot closer to the norm around here). Your job is harder, but it is far more important to society than my part is. Not fair, but like Bearcat says about the Mustang's FM, it is what it is.

Hang in there, my friend.

cheers

horseback

sukebeboy
08-07-2006, 10:21 PM
I've been doing the ESL gig in various countries for the last decade. This article is a typical, sensationalist fear mongering piece that passes for journalism these days. True, there are some shady schools out there (I worked for one in South Korea for 9 months) but if you use some common sense like refusing to hand over your passport to them when they say they need it for "safekeeping", you'll get by just fine.

Pirschjaeger
08-07-2006, 10:55 PM
We've been doing this for a while and we know what to do and what not to do. To add, Korea is a cakewalk compared to the sort of trouble you can get into in China. If you are in the major cities in China it is relatively easy and safe, but when you co into the countryside it's a different game.

Most of the problems come from the recruiters. It's hard to tell what is real and not. Most times you cannot know until you've arrived at your destination.

I've met many who have taught in Korea and seems to be the same as Taiwan. Of course you can have troubles there but nothing compared to what you can end up with in China.

My first experience was a rough one. Common sense told me to contact a teacher from the school. I did this and she(an American) glorified the school. In the end she was part of the scam. When I sent warnings back to TESOL she also sent warning saying that I was nothing more than a trouble maker and had embarrassed the Chinese. Funny though, I spoke to no one once I realized my situation and I wasn't the one making death threats against my life. Common sense isn't always enough.

Fritz

Pirschjaeger
08-07-2006, 11:43 PM
Sukebeboy, I decided to backup what I said since you seem to know little about the ESL world in China. The guy that brought me here is named Dr. Yakup. If he's so bad as I claim, it should be easy to find something with a quick google search right?

http://www.esljobfind.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=181&sid...1724d96f75a3e323635b (http://www.esljobfind.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=181&sid=7cd4b54fe28c1724d96f75a3e323635b)

http://www.bearcanada.com/esl/bl01.html

http://www.eslteachersboard.com/cgi-bin/review/index.pl?noframes;read=3915

This one is the most interesting.

http://www.eslteachersboard.com/cgi-bin/china-info/index.pl?noframes;read=438

China is not Korea. Dr. Yakup is just one of many. Do you really think the news has sensationalized this?

Dr Yakup is the one who threatened to have me killed. He reminded me that I was trapped in China and that no one cares about a dead foreignor. He backed off when I asked him what would keep me from killing him there and then. He knew I was serious and I knew I was about to do it. If someone's gonna take me out, I'm taking someone with me.

You will never have this sort of problems in Korea or most other countries. China is special.

Fritz

Breeze147
08-08-2006, 05:50 AM
I taught a broad how to swim.

sukebeboy
08-08-2006, 07:01 AM
I'm not saying there aren't problems. I'm saying that the seriously major ones are rare. Spent 10 months teaching in Kunming, Yunan. I had problems with them trying to schedule extra, unpaid classes, arguments over working Saturdays, dress code, me teaching private lessons, having people over to the apartment and the like but that's par for the course in most of Asia.

Had to say, I really didn't care for China. Next to Korea, it's been the worst country for me to live and work in.

Dtools4fools
08-08-2006, 08:30 AM
One element that complicates things further is the I'm out of money but don't wanna go home after my backpacking' sort of teachers. Sort of as they often are not native English teachers, don't have certificates and are not qulified, etc.

They then end up a dodgy schools (as they wouldn't be able to get a job in a good school) and the drama begins...

A large number of 'teachers' I've met (mostly in Bangkok) are this way, backpackers turned teachers chasing their female students until they can go on another cheap backpacking trip during school holiday...

How many of them are still around after 5 years or more?
Very few, as what most wanted was a cheap holiday.
This of course makes them vulerable...

Then there is the other breed of teachers, often having been around many, many moons.

And yes, Asian's often are quite racist. The higher up the social ladder the more they do. Not only in China...
*****

Pirschjaeger
08-08-2006, 11:17 AM
Originally posted by sukebeboy:
I'm not saying there aren't problems. I'm saying that the seriously major ones are rare. Spent 10 months teaching in Kunming, Yunan. I had problems with them trying to schedule extra, unpaid classes, arguments over working Saturdays, dress code, me teaching private lessons, having people over to the apartment and the like but that's par for the course in most of Asia.

Had to say, I really didn't care for China. Next to Korea, it's been the worst country for me to live and work in.

I have to apologize for coming across so aggresively. I am sorry. I have been in the wrong situation in China and I feel for those who have had to endure what I have. Having been a sailor in the north Atlantic for several years, I have realised my mortality. But I know those who haven't seen what I have will be terrified by what can happen. I have absolutely no fear of death, but I am sensitive to others who face dangers. I'm sorry, it's really hard to explain. Fear is relative.

Kunming is, in my opinion, a relatively safe spot. I say this because the people there have been exposed to "Laowai" (foreignors) and therefore act accordingly. I must admit, I envy you. From what I've heard, Kunming is a paradise on earth, especially regarding the NaXi women. Dude, pm me with the details. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

95% of the community is, at this point, googling "naxi women". Danjama, Lstar, and Megile(5%) are still trying to pronounce it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

Really though, rural China can be extremely dangerous. It's hundreds of years behind and many times lawless. They often have no concept of "the world" and feel civilization is millions of miles away.

I had all but forgotten of Dr. Yakup but after doing a quick google search and finding the stories of how he's gone as far as raping a woman, I have thought of nothing but murdering him today. His new office is not far from my home. I can justify killing him by thinking that he won't hurt anyone else. We are all capable of premeditated murder. This kinda tells you the intensity of what I went through, 6 years ago. Because of this waste of organic fertilizer(Dr. Yakup) I was arrested and sentenced to 3 months in a Chinese prison. I'm thankful that my connections were able to not only set me free before I served time but also punished those who arrested me.

You guyz, and I mean those who have never left home, take your luxurious safe lives for granted. I am in no way blaming you either. I would and used to do the same. I wouldn't claim that you'd have the same experiences as I have since it is my personality that gets me in trouble. basically you can say I'm very friendly but I have an extremely stubborn side that likes to challenge anything. What my purpose was of this thread is to warn those who want to work abroad of the possible dangers, especially in China.

If you read the links you'll find that Dr. Yakup is located in Beijing(that is until I catch up with him) but he sends people into rural China. Never accept any invitation into rural China unless it's from the Central Government. Even then, make sure your embassy knows your every move. If you accept a post in a place like Beijing or ShangHai, you'll have the experience of a lifetime.

Fritz

WWMaxGunz
08-08-2006, 12:34 PM
Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
Most of the problems come from the recruiters. It's hard to tell what is real and not. Most times you cannot know until you've arrived at your destination.

$#!+ you just flashed me back to basic training!

I really should get you for that....

WWMaxGunz
08-08-2006, 12:44 PM
Originally posted by sukebeboy:
Had to say, I really didn't care for China. Next to Korea, it's been the worst country for me to live and work in.

Pretty sure there's openings in and around Iraq.

sukebeboy
08-08-2006, 06:33 PM
I never really paid much attention to the Naxi or Mosou "culture" thing. I saw them once or twice when they were trotted out in their dancing kit for some festival or other and I always thought they looked like Napoleonic Hussars with high cheekbones and bad dental work. Other than that, I never paid much attention. I was there in the late 90s when the cops would still follow you home and kick down your door if they thought you had a local girl in there with you. As my supervisor told me "Chinese women are don't touch! You go to Ruilli for Bangladesh woman!" Man, Ruilli was a scary place. Opium merchants,gem smugglers, white slavers and paedos as far as the eye could see.

Pirschjaeger
08-08-2006, 07:48 PM
I met a German guy that came here almost 20 years ago. The police kicked his door in and arrested him and his girlfriend. The next day he had a Chinese style "shotgun wedding".

Imagine, all the guests at your wedding being uniformed Chinese police. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

I met an American woman that was here with her husband, about 20 years ago. She and her husband had a feeling their room was "bugged" so they agree to speak different languages everyday. IFRC, she said they both spoke 3 languages. After about a week or so, the police showed up at the door and ordered them to speak English only. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Last year a German friend of mine called me to tell me my phone was "bugged". I asked him how he knew this and he told me the police had called him and told him that his and all his friends were being monitored. Chinese intellegence? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Up until about 7 years ago, every national holiday was the time when the police would go early in the morning and take all the foreignors they could find and march them up and down the street, many in their pajamas. This was to boost national pride. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

A lot has changed in the last 5 years, at least in Beijing. The smaller foreignors can still have troubles with the jealous locals if they are seen with a Chinese girl, especially if a couple of Chinese guys have had a half a beer or more.

Fritz

raaaid
08-09-2006, 05:01 AM
i live in spain but when my fathers are gone im intending to move to the states and become a teacher

i will have a diploma on english filology and another on engineering

do you think theres any posibility for me to become a teacher there?

what worries me the most is that i smoke weed once in a while as many of you have suspected already do you think this can get me in jail in the states?

for those who wonder why i want to move the reason is simple i dont wanna stay alone but i live in the place of earth with the lowest natality after the vatican

this is no surprise i just made the calculation and i was asked out by girls 70 times more in the states that here in spain so being a shy guy i have 70 times more posibilities to have a family in the states than here

im so pissed off at my land everybody keeps saying me i look foreign like english while i trully can trace my roots at leats 600 years ago here what means that the foreign ones are the ones wh say i look foreign

out of ten girls here i just like 1 while in still kelt regions happens the opositte and just dislike 1 so when my parents are gone ill certainly move which i dont know is if to move to ireland or to the states

what do you recomend me?

Pirschjaeger
08-09-2006, 08:19 AM
Well Raaaid, in all honesty, in China, your education is not so important to the students/customers. To the Chinese, the most important thing is that you must be a native speaker. As a manager of a school, your education is important to me but attitude and personality are number one in my book. Some of my best teachers have had no previous teaching experience. Teachers are born, not made.

I'm guessing that you are Spanish? There's a fairly large market in Europe for teachers. Spain needs teachers. If you are a European then your EU passport will be a great help to you. Even as a non-native English speaker you still have chances of teaching the very lowest levels simply because you'll speak the student's native tongue.

My advice, besides teaching where your native language is official, is to try Eastern Europe or even Turkey.

Google "Dave's ESL Cafe" and look at the job boards. This will help you learn a little about the industry and possibilities. If you are serious and start applying for positions, send me a pm and I'll try to guide you as best I can.

Fritz

Ernst_Rohr
08-09-2006, 08:23 AM
Getting certified to teach in the US varies state from state. In Texas (where I live) if you have a degree and previous certifications, you can apply to teach, and they will place you in a mentoring program with a senior teacher. It a probationary period, so if you do well and the senior teacher signs off on it, you can be certified in about a year.

The other way is to go back to school once your here and get certifed. The mentoring approach is a lot easier. Several other states are easier, some just require a college degree (they are desperate).

As far as meeting girls, its always a case of the grass being greener on the other side. I got hit on a lot while I was in Europe, which is completely opposite of what I get here in the States. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Dtools4fools
08-09-2006, 08:38 AM
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre"> Kunming is a paradise on earth, especially regarding the NaXi women. Dude, pm me with the details. Veryhappy </pre>

So the pretty ones all migrated from Lijiang to Kunming? That's why there were only old ones left up there...
Or maybe I have to google too, missed something somewhere?

If that Mr. Yakup is the pain in the butt he seems to be, is there no way to get rid of him then, especially via the Central Government? Doubt they would appreciate his doing and the image it gives...

Like you stubborn side there...sometimes one has to have a line!
****

Pirschjaeger
08-09-2006, 08:46 AM
Originally posted by Dtools4fools:
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre"> Kunming is a paradise on earth, especially regarding the NaXi women. Dude, pm me with the details. Veryhappy </pre>

So the pretty ones all migrated from Lijiang to Kunming? That's why there were only old ones left up there...
Or maybe I have to google too, missed something somewhere?

If that Mr. Yakup is the pain in the butt he seems to be, is there no way to get rid of him then, especially via the Central Government? Doubt they would appreciate his doing and the image it gives...

Like you stubborn side there...sometimes one has to have a line!
****

As long as you keep the right people in your pocket, you'll remain untouchable here. Obviously Yakup is paying someone to keep him free, and that person need not to be anything more than a small potato cop with a cousin who's responsible for Yakup's district.

As for Naxi women, it is their culture and tradition not to marry. The women in the community are the leadership. The women can choose and sleep with any and as many men as they wish. The woman's mother keeps tabs in case the daughter gets pregnant. The raising of the children is the responsibility of the childs' mothers' brothers.

For a single guy with a year's supply of condoms, what could be better? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

Fritz

raaaid
08-09-2006, 09:04 AM
maybe teaching is not the best idea i can make use of my nautics engineering to work for an american company and then apply for the nationality

whats for sure is that i got to hate the place where i live

my only reason for staying is my parents whom i wouldnt abandoned but my sad destiny is to end up living alone unless i move, having the lowest natality of the world is a good indicative of the kind of people around, people dont want to have children because you only see bastards around

but i liked the states a lot during a whole year i want to live there and die there

people is much better in the states that where i live i dont know why but thats a fact for me

here i even dislike my friends, the only persons i like are my parents and my niece but when they are gone ill hate everybody because even my niece wont be a child anymore having been educated in despicable values of racism and hatred by this society

god how i hate people of my classroom all racist and most dark skinned to make it even funny and pathetic

they say foreigns out, dark skinned people should be exterminated, jesus if you got what you wanted you would be the first to go look yourself in the mirror

nazis are alive and well they are my class companions and teachers

why the f*ck do i have to stand a guy saying that you know what indians are because they are the same color than gypsies and a beautiful girl laughing at his joke

leitmotiv
08-09-2006, 09:24 AM
I was knocked out cold by a gigantic high school lineman when I threw him out of my class for indiscipline. I had a near race riot another day. The teacher who was my supervisor for student teaching went out at lunchtime to a nearby bar for a couple stiff ones to endure the constant commotion in the class. This was in California between 1977 and 1981. One day the little darlings smashed the windows of teachers' cars. I felt like a combat infantryman without a gun facing a human wave assault.

Dtools4fools
08-10-2006, 08:06 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Dtools4fools:

Kunming is a paradise on earth, especially regarding the NaXi women. Dude, pm me with the details. Veryhappy



So the pretty ones all migrated from Lijiang to Kunming? That's why there were only old ones left up there...
Or maybe I have to google too, missed something somewhere?

If that Mr. Yakup is the pain in the butt he seems to be, is there no way to get rid of him then, especially via the Central Government? Doubt they would appreciate his doing and the image it gives...

Like you stubborn side there...sometimes one has to have a line!
****



As long as you keep the right people in your pocket, you'll remain untouchable here. Obviously Yakup is paying someone to keep him free, and that person need not to be anything more than a small potato cop with a cousin who's responsible for Yakup's district.

As for Naxi women, it is their culture and tradition not to marry. The women in the community are the leadership. The women can choose and sleep with any and as many men as they wish. The woman's mother keeps tabs in case the daughter gets pregnant. The raising of the children is the responsibility of the childs' mothers' brothers.

For a single guy with a year's supply of condoms, what could be better?


Sounds like the Mosuo, a sub-branch of the Naxi living around the Lugu Lake.
If they all moved to Kunming (or the Naxi from Lijiang took up that practice again and moved to Kunming as well) then let me know and I will include a stop in Kunming on my next trip to Yunnan... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I'm aware that having the right buddies in the right positions gives certain powers to certain individuals there.
However you opposed him (the Yakup dude) already and got away with it; a Chinese would probably not have...
And if things are getting hot the protector might drop his hot potato. It depends where the power comes from.
I remember the police chief of a town in the Philippines giving me a hard time - just because I happened to be there in the same place where he and his buddies were gettting drunk and he wanted to show off what big shot he was...
A little small talk involving a 'friend of mine' who business card I had with me settled all troubles. Said frined was an Air Force Colonel, today involved in politics and business.

The higher up you go to complain the more the chances that you are able to reach the goal.
And maybe better do it if you are about to leave as Mr. Fakup might get angry...

****

Pirschjaeger
08-10-2006, 11:49 AM
Mr Fackup is not your regular Chinese. He isn't even genetically Chinese. He comes from Xin Jiang and is of Turkisch decent, called "Wei Er zu", commonly pronounced "vee ger zoo". In China, dead a "Wei Er" has the same value as a dead Mongolian. Nobody cares.

I don't know why no one has taken him out yet. The best I can figure is that he only deals with noobies. Anyone that's been here a while knows that Fackup's life has zero value here. I'm curious to his reaction apon seeing me. Since he is Wei er, he won't have relationships that go too high.

Fritz