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View Full Version : Aren't you worried about damaging your disc ?



rijnton1944
12-13-2004, 02:11 PM
Having paid a handsome amount for Pacific Fighters (Forgotten Battles was a bargain), I am a little worried about damaging the disc, having to put it in the cd-player everytime, which is apparently necessary to use the new exe.
I already tried to make a backup copy, but that seems to be impossible, at least with my knowledge and the utilities I have. I understand of course the reasons, although as far as I know it should be permitted by law (at least in Holland) to make a backup copy of software you bought/own.

DangerForward
12-13-2004, 02:14 PM
Not really, I bought two copies of the game.

tjaika1910
12-13-2004, 02:29 PM
I have played IL2 for quite some time, allways without the cd, but since summer I have changed to play it with. I have a cd-drive that is used for this purpose only. For the record; I have the original CD from Il2-Sturmovik to PF. I quess there is a lot of utdated cdroms out there that can be used likewise.

Otherwise I must say that it is annoying to have to play the game with cd, and that it is not possible to install the game with ghostdrives. I say so because it is worst for those who actually pay for the game, not those who dont. I heard numbers that more than 50% played pirated versions of PF, also in the west. I I find that hard to belive with such a devoted community. But if it count with those who bought the game and use nocd for convenience it is more probable.

steve_v
12-13-2004, 03:05 PM
I am fortunate in that I have two drives, cd-rom and cd-rw. The disc stays in the rom drive 24/7. Having a SATA hard drive opens up more possiblities with the IDE channels (PATA) and optical drives. If I didn't have a cramped mid-tower, I'd get a dvd drive from magnum-pc.

I'm not worried about damaging the disc.

crazyivan1970
12-13-2004, 03:09 PM
Got two copies as well, one for me and one for me HOST http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

1.JaVA_Hornet
12-13-2004, 03:26 PM
I am also worried!!

Tooz_69GIAP
12-13-2004, 03:44 PM
Careful Tooz...... folks have been banned for that.... the precedent has been set and in the intrests of fairness whether or not I agree with it...... get my drift.... talk about it elsewhere Pls.

J_Weaver
12-13-2004, 04:24 PM
Yea, I only have 512, but Lord willing by the first of the year I'll have 2gig http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

fabianfred
12-13-2004, 05:15 PM
yes, I'm worried too...
I live in Thailand and had to get my copy posted here from the Ubi shop as Amazon will not post outside Europe... their postal charges are very high and as they used Fedex it automatically got opened by customs here and I had customs duty to pay too...

altogether i paid 80 pounds for mine.... cant pop round the local to get a new one...

there must be better ways to protect illegal use than having to have the cD in.... that only punishes those who got a real one, not the pirates

BuzzU
12-13-2004, 05:24 PM
Some of my CD's are 5 years old. Be careful, and use a quality CDRom.

MOH_SKID.
12-13-2004, 06:27 PM
Damaging the CD? How? It never leaves the drive. I have another old game I like to play that requires the CD to play. I bought a second CDRW so it would have a home too. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

S~
Skid

knightflyte
12-13-2004, 06:54 PM
I understand the frustration of not wanting to be forced to use a CD to play PF. I don't like it any more than the next honest player.

BUT. What would you do as a game company? I'm sure in the future a way to protect the interest of gamers AND game companies will come.
For now we are forced into CD use because of MORONS who insist that it is PERFECTLY LEGAL TO STEAL. I don't blame the game companies at all.

Instead of being mad at them... be mad at the asshats who don't give a **** about YOU... ME...OLEG...UBI....

I was on a sight for the modeling of IL2 FB cockpits. This was in support of 3rd party modelors. It was concerning the new german mid range bomber (JU 88) that's coming out soon. The amount of work and detail that goes into these things is AMAZING.

The poster said he was working on this cockpit for 2 years. (obviously not full time) He spent money on (at my count from the picture) 25 books so he could maintain accuracy. He also had pictures out the wazuuu....3d scematics...and visited air museums.

ALL THIS FOR ONE COCKPIT. Multiply that by all the varients of planes we have in IL2/PF PLUS incorporating aircraft AND flight models, ground textures AND anything else I missed, and you can see the amount of work is staggering.

ALL THIS FOR A FORTY DOLLAR GAME.

Now imagine 10,000 games pirated x $40 = $400,000. IL2 is a NICHE market. How many games worlswide will it sell. How much of that $400,00 would go back into developement of BOB. (OR HELL.... EVEN TO MAKE SURE THE DEVELOPER GET HIS FAIR SHARE.)

So instead of being mad at UBI, VALVE, ID, or any other game company, express your frustration at those who abuse the system to get their own childish way. It's the fault of the PIRATORS that you have to use the CD...NOT UBI.

There is NO EXCUSE FOR PIRACY. YOU ARE A THIEF, PURE AND SIMPLE.

Chuck_Older
12-13-2004, 07:05 PM
I guess I am in the minority in that I have CDs and CDROMS that are used often and they don't get damaged. You can take the CDROM out of the drive, and put it back in the case, it's quite simple. Pick it up with your fingers, not a pair of scissors or pliers, and pay attention to what you're doing.

I mean, seriously, what do you folks do to your CDs that screws them up so badly? Treat the thing like a fragile piece of plastic and you should be fine. This isn't rocket science here.

Bearcat99
12-13-2004, 07:33 PM
Chuck... you are usd to LPs so this CD stuff is a no brainer to you http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif. I have original copies of Wes Montomery,Sinatra,Bennett,Cole,Jimmy Smith,Ellington Nancy Wilson, Striesand,Sergio Mendes and more that I got from my mom.. no pops no scratches. Well they didnt the last time I played them.. my turntable has since dies and I havent gotten another one.

F19_Orheim
12-13-2004, 07:34 PM
Couldn't have said it better Chuck..... Sounds like you guys do everything with the CD except what it is made for. Do you use it as a screwdriver? In my life as a PC user with lots and lots of games I have never wrecked a CD... not even close... just treat it like any other stuff you have bought.... take care of it.. if you break it get a new.

knightflyte
12-13-2004, 07:50 PM
You know..... Bearcat brings up an interesting point about music and care for fragile LP vynal (SP) discs. (RECORDS)

How many listen to CD's? You gotta play THAT in a player ALL the time. Ooooooops... I want to listen to another artist. I have to change discs, I better be careful not to scratch it. Or my CD player might break from over use. I've seen Cd's on car seats in blazing sun.

Sorry, but Bearcat really made me see the sillyness of complaining about playing with a CD in your drive. (perchance a virtual drive gives better performance I can understand the opposition to mandatory CD playing)

Oh, and before records were made of plastic, they were made of a WAX. VERY FRAGILE!!!!!!!!

regards,
Robert

Once you go Track.... you never go back.

ginger_cat
12-13-2004, 10:51 PM
I hate having to use the CD - I am one of those messy buggers who always leaves a disc in the tray only to hurriedly toss it aside when I need to use another disc.

I have bought all Il-2 incarnations and PF is the only one that WILL NOT allow me to play with the disc in the tray, for reasons which I believe (from reading various forums) are to do with CD writing software installed. I refuse to uninstall legitimate software which I use for legitimate reasons. I have considered setting up a second hard drive for PF but this really shouldn't be neccessary.

I read in other forums that the mechanism which prevents me from playing the game with the disc in the tray will not prevent me from making a copy of said disc!

I agree with all but the final two paragraphs of knightflyte's post. I AM NOT a thief. I cannot play the game with the disc in the tray because of other legitimate software on my system and the disc can still be copied! I don't have the answer to piracy, but this certainly ain't it!

TAGERT.
12-13-2004, 11:25 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rijnton1944:
Having paid a handsome amount for Pacific Fighters (Forgotten Battles was a bargain), I am a little worried about damaging the disc, having to put it in the cd-player everytime, which is apparently necessary to use the new exe.
I already tried to make a backup copy, but that seems to be impossible, at least with my knowledge and the utilities I have. I understand of course the reasons, although as far as I know it should be permitted by law (at least in Holland) to make a backup copy of software you bought/own. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>No reason to worry, in that if you do damage it you can send it in for a replacment.. unless you dont have an orginal copy, then I have no pitty for you anyways!

knightflyte
12-13-2004, 11:57 PM
I understand what you mean Ginger Cat.

I agree that the answer isn't there yet. I think any game company would agree that the best solution hasn't been found yet.

All the manufacturers are trying to do is save their investment. If people didn't steal then there would be no issue. But humans being what they are, some will stoop to stealing.

I understand your situation, and I sympathize with your plight... also you didn't copy with the malicous intent to steal, but to get a working version of a game you ALREADY purchased.

I also own copying material that allows me to author DVDs that I edit. (Roxio) I currently don't have it installed as I use my video editing application for that. I'd be POed if I had to uninstall a program I need for work. But again the game manufacturers are just protecting their work.

It may only just be an INDUSTRY PERCEPTION, but most people who own copying software have it to avoid paying. I've never used my CD copying program to copy CDs.

A few bad apples doesn't make EVERY apple bad. But they sure ruin it for the good ones.

I don't like being put in a situation where I have to suffer because of someone who steals. But that's what happens in society. Why should I HAVE to lock my door at night? ... or my car?
Why should I have to be submitted for roadblocks for DUI? I have to because there is an element that WON'T take responsability for themselves and act accordingly.

regards,
Robert


Once you go Track... you never go back

Swivet
12-14-2004, 12:07 AM
Stop eating greasy french fries and the like and handling your cd-roms. Cleanliness is godliness. Dont be a clumsy *** and drop the disk. Dont blame it on the dog that mistakenly ate your homework as well. Hold it by the edges and gently place it in the drive. Tho i like the no-cd ability, but it aint really a big deal at all, unless of course you just bought the cd, then your screwed, lol

ginger_cat
12-14-2004, 12:43 AM
In reply to knightflyte:

If only it were as simple as an effective road block, but that ain't the case!

These measures do not stop the big pirates.

Consider my plight again:

Assume that I really do want the software that is already installed on my hard drive and that I haven't got the resources to run a 'two pc solution'. That leaves me three options

1)Use the 'unmentionable' file
2)Use a pirated copy, stripped of 'anti-piracy' software,
OR
3) Don't buy or use the product.

If I choose the third option, will this stop the thieves?

Being as I've already bought the game, the only person losing out is me. All fair to protect the rights of the producers but at this cost to the legitimate end-consumer is very much not fair and ultimately counter-productive.

Anyway - I have to rush to work now, so cyall.

Udidtoo
12-14-2004, 04:03 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
I guess I am in the minority in that I have CDs and CDROMS that are used often and they don't get damaged. You can take the CDROM out of the drive, and put it back in the case, it's quite simple. Pick it up with your fingers, not a pair of scissors or pliers, and pay attention to what you're doing.

I mean, seriously, what do you folks do to your CDs that screws them up so badly? Treat the thing like a fragile piece of plastic and you should be fine. This isn't rocket science here. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Chuck, I can't tell you how many times I have wondered that very thing. If you read thru a number of past postings on this subject you begin to picture people trying to change a disc with brillo pads glued to their fingers and then teaching their pittbulls to snag the cd's midair like a frisbee.

I just have 0 empathy for anyone so utterly lazy that they can't be bothered with the approximitly 3 and 1/2 seconds of carefulness required to change out a disc.

rijnton1944
12-14-2004, 05:50 AM
Oooh, I hadn't expected that my question would stir up so much interest.
For the record (sic): I am also from the LP era, although I have sold all my LP's in the meantime. When I sold them, they were however still almost like brandnew. I treat my cd's (music, game) like I treated my LP's.
But the PF cd's are in ONE keepcase and unless I use a separate case for the cd to play the game, I have to press it on the spindle of the original case against the other cd and have to use some force to get it off again. All these acts are not very healthful for the cd.
Please don't misunderstand me. It is not a very big deal for me, I was just wondering how you think about it.

NorrisMcWhirter
12-14-2004, 06:23 AM
Hi,

Simple - keep your disc in the box like I do by making a hard-disk based copy for yourself using some ISO maker than mounting it with daemon tools.

I'd be more worried about damaging my DVD ROM combo (by punching it in frustration) if I had the disk it because some DVD-ROM combos are notoriously bad with copy protection after the game has been played once in a Windows session (makes HL & co-ops tricky).

I suppose I could use my original PF on the basis that UBI will send me (one day) the freebie copy they promised but I won't be holding my breath on that one.

Cheers,
Norris

S 8
12-14-2004, 06:32 AM
No.

tsisqua
12-14-2004, 07:38 AM
When a program looks for a disk in the drive of my machine, as in the case of IL2M(erged), it spins the disk in the tray, and I can hear it, and after awhile, I can see it in the fine little lines that begin to appear on the disk. There is also heat in there, and I know that this does affect the disk. My first copy of CFS2 finally got to where it wouldn't work anymore, so I started using my first crack, although: Not having to dig, and shuffle my cd's around is the main reason that I would use a file like this. I hope that I don't get into trouble for saying this, because I am NOT a thief, but I would rather not have to trouble myself with the cd.

Does anyone remember that one of the early FB patches disabled the cd check? It was a nice surprise, and was a welcome one, as far as I am concerned. Do an underground search, and you will find that this type of protection does nothing to prevent piracy. I am cooperating, and using the cd at the moment, but I really don't see how this will stop piracy . . . the pirates know how to get around pretty much all the protection.

Solution: Find them, and <span class="ev_code_RED">PROSECUTE</span> them. My copy of CoD had two different activation codes on the boxed up jewel case, and one of them worked, but one didn't. It wasn't cheap when I bought it, and the extra trouble involved in getting it to install only pissed me off.

Once again . . . I am cooperating . . . Oleg and team deserve way more than what they are making from their hard work on this beautiful game/sim, but I don't see how cd check is helping, IMHO.

Tsisqua

oddlegs
12-14-2004, 07:39 AM
Knightflyte is right when he states that PF is a niche market. Therefore consider for a moment... how many of those scoundrels using a cheap/free pirate copy would have bothered buying one if piracy were impossible? I believe not many if any. As the pirate users would not have bought PF - little or no sales loss to UBI. The new FPS games are a different matter as they are more popular/desireable and need their copy protection. Did PF really need copy protection in order to protect it from people who would not have bought one anyway?

Tully__
12-14-2004, 08:23 AM
No worries here. I've yet to damage a disk due to using carefully on any game or software (or even audio).

|CoB|_Spectre
12-14-2004, 09:19 AM
I'm always amused at people who, just because it hasn't happened to them, figure it can't be so. Good thing that attitude doesn't govern weightlessness. Like other posters, I'm from the vinyl record era and I know of no one that's any more careful in handling storage media than myself. I always handle it like I do photographs, by the edges with clean hands. That being said, the #2 disk of my Janes World War II Fighters became scratched and unplayable and I was, and still am, at a loss as to how it could've happened. I was the only person in my household that used it. Over the years I've seen CD-ROMs do some weird things and others I've talked to have said the same thing. Consider yourself lucky if it's never happened to you and I hope it doesn't. However, just because you do not understand something does not mean it can't be so.

269GA-Maxmars
12-14-2004, 09:33 AM
I have two copies in two different cities.. Should cover most natural disasters..

knightflyte
12-14-2004, 09:38 AM
I KNOW I built a model of the IL2 when I was a kid. It has a distinctive look to it. But I forgot ALL about it.

Flash forward 30ish years and I find this flight sim on the shelf called IL2. What's an IL2? Looks cool. I'll buy it. So I do and forever since have had a love affair flying planes I've loved and dreamed of as a child. Laying in bed at night as a child holding my Folke Wolfs pretending to fly.


Yes.... IL2 is a niche market. Because it is a niche market only certain types of people are going to buy it. I wouls imagine the same would apply to those who would pirate it. My interests in gaming lie in Sims. (no not THE SIMS) If I WERE to pirate ,it would be along THOSE lines... NOT quake or half breed....er...um... half life.

So to think that those who WOULD pirate IL2 are people who don't have interest in flight sims... that they are just generic software *****s... is rediculous. You generally steal what you covet. I'm sure there is a small percentage who would pirate ANYTHING.

And so what if it DOESN'T effect profits because they WOULDN'T buy a game?.... It's still stealing.

regards,
Robert

once you go Track...you never go back.

sithgod
12-14-2004, 10:49 AM
I am worried about it. You pay your cash and if anything happens to the cd then its over. Some companies do have a good replacement policy if a cd gets damaged and you send them the original. I don't know what Ubi is like. Doesn't matter how careful you might be accidents can happen thats why they are accidents.

people shouldn't have to buy two copies of the same game to protect their investment.

There has to be a better form of copy protection that can protect the company and not be annoying for the legit users who do pay for the game. The pirates are laughing at us because the only ones having to jump through any hoops are the legit users and not the smeghead pirates.

RobertNighthawk
12-14-2004, 11:01 AM
My last(3rd time) fused disc cost me over $20,000 in about 6 hours.

These plastic ones are relatively cheap. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

georgeo76
12-14-2004, 11:20 AM
It's become a fact of life that honest ppl pay for the sins of thieves. Every time you buy anything, you pay a little extra to offset the stores shoplifting losses or their security costs. (a small part of your purchase of PF no doubt went to Safedisk) I've accepted that I will be responsible for theft when I buy a game. It's annoying, but remember to put the blame where it belongs.

CD checks are symptoms of the same illness.

As far as worrying about damaged CDs, I don't.

carguy_
12-14-2004, 12:07 PM
Uuum will slowing my cdrw down to say 24x speed make the cd more safe?I broke 3 game cds in a LG 52x cdrom drive,so everytime I put in a cd I`m affraid it to be turned into few pieces.

knightflyte
12-14-2004, 04:11 PM
Auto insurance is high because of many fake claims. In Massachusetts one lady was killed and her child injured while she was trying to FAKE an accident so she could report a false claim. (There was a rash of such behaviour in a local city)
I don't know what posessed her to be that desperate. It's a shame, really.
Anyway, the fact of the matter is the innocent pay for the crimes of the guilty. And as frustrating as it may be there are a LOT more things to get your undies in a bundle about.


regards,
Robert

Once you go Track... you never go back