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peter_919
05-01-2005, 04:28 AM
Just bought IL-2 yesterday.
Had a quick glance last night.
Looks very promising.
But since I don't have a joystick, it was rather difficult pursuing enemy aircraft and eventually trying to shoot them down.
What type of joystick should I buy ??
Any recommendations...

Thanks in advance

Peter

ImpStarDuece
05-01-2005, 04:49 AM
For a basic stick for the game you want a set up something like this; 4 button stick (trigger, 2,3,4) with a twist rudder, 8-way HAT switch and hopefully 2-6 additional buttons and at least one slider (usually mapped to throttle)

Your best bet if you are just starting out is to get something like a Cyborg EVO. Its fairly cheap, has a twist rudder, reasonably well built and has enough buttons it to let you map some of the controls.

The next step up are the Saitek X-45 or X-52, depending on what you want to spend. Both come with a HOTAS (Hands On Throttle And Stick), twist rudder, rotaries, slider(s) and multiple stick buttons. You can set up either so that you never have to touch the keyboard again in flight. Prices vary but I think they go from about $US60-80

The next step up are CH products. CH are pretty much cream of the crop. If money is not object a CH set up is the BEST way to go. Their sticks are solid reliable and very smooth. A full CH set up will cost in the region of US$400 brand new, but I bet you can cut 25% off this looking around the net. A full CH set up consists of A CH Fighterstick (or similar) CH Throttle and CH rudder pedals.

Personally I use a (very) old Microsoft Sidewinder Precision 2; Twist rudder, 8 buttons, throttle, 8-way hat.

For my money,if you really want to enjoy your flying go the Saitek option. While there are a few known quality issues they should see you at least a year or too while you save money for a CH stick.

Personally, if CH made a stick with a twist rudder I would buy it as quick as a flash. I'd probably pair it up with the throttle from either a x-52 or x-45 set up and i'd be happy as a P-47 on the bounce!

ImpStarDuece
05-01-2005, 04:53 AM
The Saitek site is (Cyborg EVO, X-45, X-52) HERE (http://www.saitek.com/uk/prod/joysticks.htm)

and the CH products sticks are HERE (http://www.chproducts.com/retail_flash/index.html)

Atomic_Marten
05-01-2005, 04:58 AM
Originally posted by ImpStarDuece:
Personally, if CH made a stick with a twist rudder I would buy it as quick as a flash. I'd probably pair it up with the throttle from either a x-52 or x-45 set up and i'd be happy as a P-47 on the bounce!

Please m8, tell me something about this EVO stick.. I have X45 and it's good except for rudder control -- it is so bad that it is unusable (taht is on default rudder, so I had to change it -- I have map it on rotary switch 1) completely in combat IMO.
Is the rudder control on EVO better? I mean that twist rudder control on EVO; is it better than cr@ppy X45 one?

ImpStarDuece
05-01-2005, 05:04 AM
Originally posted by Atomic_Marten:

Please m8, tell me something about this EVO stick.. I have X45 and it's good except for rudder control -- it is so bad that it is unusable completely in combat IMO.
Is the rudder control on EVO better? I mean that twist rudder control on EVO; is it better than cr@ppy X45 one?

Actually, i have only used the EVO a few times at a mates place and wasn't massively impressed, but its still a reasnoable stick and a good place to start if the money is tight. I haven't used a X-45 much at all, maybe once or twice at a computing store. I actually like the M$ sticks, I just wish they hadn't stopped making them. It figures though,I finally find a product that I like and have no trouble with and they stop making them! Seems almost karmic to me.

My M$ stick has a pretty good twisty rudder, solid, quite precise with good resistance and 'feel', even if it is getting long in the tooth.

Taylortony
05-01-2005, 05:14 AM
Originally posted by peter_919:
Just bought IL-2 yesterday.
Had a quick glance last night.
Looks very promising.
But since I don't have a joystick, it was rather difficult pursuing enemy aircraft and eventually trying to shoot them down.
What type of joystick should I buy ??
Any recommendations...

Thanks in advance

Peter



Did you but IL2 the first one or IL2 forgotten battles? of the pacific fighters one... the first one was a bit long in the tooth and you get a lot more planes with the later ones, BUT your aircraft fly better ( pre wingers input) and the sound is better in my opinion... which ever version you have, get the patches as you will get more planes etc.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Atomic_Marten
05-01-2005, 05:30 AM
Originally posted by ImpStarDuece:
Actually, i have only used the EVO a few times at a mates place and wasn't massively impressed, but its still a reasnoable stick and a good place to start if the money is tight. I haven't used a X-45 much at all, maybe once or twice at a computing store. I actually like the M$ sticks, I just wish they hadn't stopped making them. It figures though,I finally find a product that I like and have no trouble with and they stop making them! Seems almost karmic to me.

My M$ stick has a pretty good twisty rudder, solid, quite precise with good resistance and 'feel', even if it is getting long in the tooth.

Thanks. What I really meant to say is; is rudder on EVO usable in combat? It is stupid question I know. But let me explain.

For example I will explain head on scenario on X45. You see fighter closing in on you. And you try to correct your aim with rudder (there is no much chance to succeed in head on without rudder).
OK. You can squeeze the rudder control once, but if you need to correct it a little (left or right) it is almost impossible due to *fact* that the rudder on X45 is very unprecise.

So I wonder if EVO got it better (more precise) or.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

SeaNorris
05-01-2005, 05:55 AM
I'd go for Saitek http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Jumoschwanz
05-01-2005, 07:02 AM
Go on ebay and get a Microsoft Precision 2 in good shape. Fairly often there are even new ones on sale there.

This stick has the best quality, ergonomics, and control of anything you can find. S!
Jumoschwanz

RedNeckerson
05-01-2005, 11:44 AM
I would strogly discourage you from getting a Logitech stick.

My Logitech Extreme 3D was great from the standpoint of ergonomics and design. However, I soon started getting input spikes coupled with input loss in other areas. Nothing fixed it, including fresh installs, calibrations, and even downloading profiles from their website.

The more I researched the problem, the more I found that a lot of people were having the same (or similar) problems that I was having - also with no success.

For a good/affordable stick I am very pleased with my <span class="ev_code_YELLOW">Saitek Cyborg EVO</span>, it works smooth, is easily calibrated and has plenty of button options.

I'm sure the Saitek X52s are great if you don't mind spending $100+.

IcarusXP
05-01-2005, 12:18 PM
I whent the Saitek X-52 route. It does enhance gameing expieriance but it is not nesisarry. I used my MS Sidewinder presision pro for a long time with no problem.

Bearcat99
05-01-2005, 01:11 PM
Originally posted by Atomic_Marten:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ImpStarDuece:
Personally, if CH made a stick with a twist rudder I would buy it as quick as a flash. I'd probably pair it up with the throttle from either a x-52 or x-45 set up and i'd be happy as a P-47 on the bounce!

Please m8, tell me something about this EVO stick.. I have X45 and it's good except for rudder control -- it is so bad that it is unusable (taht is on default rudder, so I had to change it -- I have map it on rotary switch 1) completely in combat IMO.
Is the rudder control on EVO better? I mean that twist rudder control on EVO; is it better than cr@ppy X45 one? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Marten do yourself a favor and get a set of CH pedals..... you wont be sorry.

peter..... I suggest you try here (http://store.yahoo.com/saitekusa/recprod.html) for an X-45 first. If none are acailable there then decide what you want as a rudder solution... if you plan to get rudder pedals in the future by all means get the X-45 ($80 retail) If you prefer a twist handle rudder and have no intention at the moment of getting pedals then you could go with the X-52 ($130 retail) or.... if you have abit more time and just want a good basic stick to tide you over.. I recomend the Saitek EVO FFB stick.

DRAGON_2_GO
05-01-2005, 02:31 PM
How about force-feedback?
Like ta know what my plane does.
You just get a better sense of your plane by feeling. Wat is there that has got a force feedback, and is also good in your eyes?

FeiHu
05-02-2005, 07:55 PM
I had same problem that RedNeckerson had with the Logitech Extreme 3D.I bought 2(one for me,one for my son)and both of them get input loss. I now use a Saitek x45 with CH Pro Pedals.My first joystick(and still my fav)is the Microsoft Sidewinder.You may find a Sidewinder on ebay.Welcome to the game! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Freelancer-1
05-02-2005, 08:30 PM
I think if you are just starting out, the last thing you need is a whole lot of peripherals to try and balance.

A simple joystick with a twist handle is all you really need to decide if you are going to like the game long term or not. Against the advice of most people on the boards, I am partial to the logitech line. I find the grip comfortable and the controls well placed. I have used an Extreme 3D for years and had no problems with its reliabilty.

Once you decide to really get into the game (and you will!), it's easy to drop a lot of cash for stuff. I now have an X-45, Track IR3, CH Pro Pedals, Plantronics USB headset and I am constantly upgrading my system. But start simple and work your way up is, I think, the best way to go.

Best of luck, Freelancer

heywooood
05-02-2005, 09:07 PM
I agree with Freelancer - keep it simple with your first joystick - get a good one though 'cause a bad stick will give you a bad experience and might frustrate you for no reason.

Get the Saitek from the site Bearcat suggests - one with a twist rudder control, you need rudder control but you dont need rudder pedals to futz with right off the bat.

Funny we're seeing all these joystick threads all of a sudden, no?....and my Sidewinder pro 2 just decided to get a buggy rudder-centerline reading...a disc defrag and a re-connect of the stick seems to have solved it for now though.

DRAGON_2_GO
05-03-2005, 05:52 AM
I think you got me wrong. I am an expirienced simmer. I started with CFS 1 (offline untill now http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif) I have got now:
1x Sidewinder force feedback 2
1x Track IR 3 Pro

However I was thinking about getting another jostick system. Something like the Saiteks that seem to be favored here. But I got somewhat used to actually "feelig" my plane. Also I'd like to try Rudder pedals, but I'm not sure if this will be possible, if I don't use an all CH system. And last but not least, I'm still a pupil and haven't got that much money http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

Dragon

Urufu_Shinjiro
05-03-2005, 07:51 AM
Actually dragon, you got it wrong, when they were speaking about a beginner stick they were speaking to the original poster of this thread. While an on topic question within someone elses post is general ok expecting everyone to answer your question instead of the original posters is a thread hijack and considered pretty rude. You might want to start your own thread about ffb sticks, I'm sure youd get alot of good replies.

Ketalar
05-03-2005, 03:51 PM
peter_919:
If you can find a Microsoft ForceFeedback2 I'd go for that. I've got one (and a spare) and it's an amazing feling to get feedback from your plane, you'll be able to feel a stall coming and also judge how fast you're flying based on the stiffness of the controls. I have basically only heard good stuff about it and I'm really pleased with mine. I just can't believe why Microsoft decided to quit making them... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

The most imortant two pieces of advice I think you can get when buying a stick though are these:
1) Decide what your price range is, and then try to land right at (or above) your upper limit.
2) Touch/hold/feel the stick in the store. Does it feel like good quality? Does it feel cheap and like it's going to fall apart? Does it move smoothly and with enough resistance (obviously not applicable to a FFB-stick that isn't connected...)? And last but definitely not least: Does it fit your hand? If it's not comforatble then using it will be a pain in the...hand. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Welcome to the club! Listen to what everyone has to tell you, but then make up your own mind as to whom to believe.




Originally posted by DRAGON_2_GO:
... Also I'd like to try Rudder pedals, but I'm not sure if this will be possible, if I don't use an all CH system. ...


Dragon:
Sure it'll work. I started out with a
Microsoft ForceFeedback2 just like yours and had a blast. Then I bought a
TrackIR v1 and realized that this was what I'd been missing. After a while I went ahead and got a pair of
CH Pro Pedals, and boy, did that make the immersion increase! It took flying to the next level. Recently I picked up a
CH Pro Throttle so now I don't have to reach for the keyboard except when typing and at take off and landing (gear, hook, chock).

I've added stuff over the last 2.5 years. Sure sum it all up and it's a lot of money, but spread it over time and the added enjoyment and it's worth every cent/penny/pfennig/penni/├┬Âre. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Everything works fine, all I had to do was plug the new stuff in and go to Controls in FB, then go crazy with the new controls (when you buy pedals, just scroll down to HOTAS and select rudder, then kick the pedals and you're ready to go!). So my recommendation is that you save whatever you can every now and then and then go ahead and add stuff to your virtual cockpit when you've got enough. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Bearcat99
05-07-2005, 02:00 PM
Originally posted by DRAGON_2_GO:
I think you got me wrong. I am an expirienced simmer. I started with CFS 1 (offline untill now http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif) I have got now:
1x Sidewinder force feedback 2
1x Track IR 3 Pro

However I was thinking about getting another jostick system. Something like the Saiteks that seem to be favored here. But I got somewhat used to actually "feelig" my plane. Also I'd like to try Rudder pedals, but I'm not sure if this will be possible, if I don't use an all CH system. And last but not least, I'm still a pupil and haven't got that much money http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

Dragon

With your setup an X-45and some pedals would bring it to it's full potential. I have the same rig except I have TIR2.... and an X-45...