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Hawgdog
07-23-2003, 07:45 PM
Hmm, seems chivalry has died, a year and a half ago, it was "!S!" this, "~S~" that, "S sir", "GK -S-" and the other thing.
Heck I got shot down after getting crippled on takeoff and still gave a ~S~. No response...
I shoot someone down and give 'em a "Nice work-S-" and I get a "screw you" reply!
Maybe when we all have TrackIR and the patch and the add-on we'll start feeling the love again

<center></script>IDC
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Hawgdog
07-23-2003, 07:45 PM
Hmm, seems chivalry has died, a year and a half ago, it was "!S!" this, "~S~" that, "S sir", "GK -S-" and the other thing.
Heck I got shot down after getting crippled on takeoff and still gave a ~S~. No response...
I shoot someone down and give 'em a "Nice work-S-" and I get a "screw you" reply!
Maybe when we all have TrackIR and the patch and the add-on we'll start feeling the love again

<center></script>IDC
Completely disorganized,and coming to a base near you
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.adelphia.net/~hawgdog/assets/images/sharkdog.gif

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 07:58 PM
"Saluting" always struck me as being a little silly.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:01 PM
Hawgdog wrote:




Hmm, seems chivalry has died, a year and a half ago, it was "!S!" this, "~S~" that, "S sir", "GK -S-" and the other thing.
Heck I got shot down after getting crippled on takeoff and still gave a ~S~. No response...
I shoot someone down and give 'em a "Nice work-S-" and I get a "screw you" reply!
Maybe when we all have TrackIR and the patch and the add-on we'll start feeling the love again



This is a very important observation that I`ve noticed as well.
S! First started off as a signal between friend and enemy pilots as a chivalrous acknowledgement of a well fought battle or a "Well done sir you got me" and "I got you but you fought very well" /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif . Also it was NOT used every time.

Somehow, along the way it was either abused (used to make someone feel like an idiot) or the other person took the meaning the wrong way (felt like an idiot for losing and took it personal).

I think what`s happened is now you get `snidy` S!s. Especially when you are taxing to take off and someone comes and kills you on the ground, which happens, but then he says `S!` When used like that it becomes an insult, not praise.
That`s when S! lost it`s gentleness. Now it`s very hard to use it right. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

I stopped using S! when I realised that people were beginning to see it as an offence and now only use it if S! is offered first or after a particularly godd fight between me and another - or Squadron m8s.


Sad but true. Between honourable pilots it would be fine, but there are few who know the meaning of the word these days.

Hawgdog
07-23-2003, 08:05 PM
One of the finest pilots I know, IDC_Pointhore uses the "W" as his symbol of pilot skills and recognition.

Maybe W should replace S. Used as needed to acknowledge superior skills either on your 6 or under your nose.

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When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
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XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:06 PM
That's good. People abuse S! so I say EFFF UUU CEEE KEEEY S!. Salute this and salute that, F**K YOU and your god damn salutes. Salute should ONLY be used in RARE situations. It p1ssed me off whenever someone shot me down 2 seconds after I got off the runway it was "S!". NO, F**K YOU, OK?

Salute should only be used if a pilot has accomplished something that took great skill, or simply out of respect depending on the situation.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:07 PM
Maybe you haven't figured out that typing "S" is rude? I mean, how can you abbreviate a sign of respect? You are abbreviating it for crying out loud! What's next? going to church on Sunday for 1 minute?

I remember in the good old days of combat flight simming when salute/s actually meant something. Now people just toss it around like bird seed. (as common as "lol")

It's no surprise it's lost it's value. In fact, it's almost anti-value. If someone "S" me, I say "S yourself" One of my pet peaves is people who salute too much.

And besides, the whole notion of "saluting" is queer when you are playing a video game. Just makes me think of Gomer Pyle.
<img src=http://i.imdb.com/Photos/Mptv/1063/3456-0012.jpg>
As you can see, thats me on the right side of the picture. People who salute are on the left side of the picture.

Salute is what people in rank do to each other, not for people playing games. If you want to show respect, say good kill. If you shoot somebody down, don't salute them. It's rude to do that. It's rude to say things to people when you kill them.

<img src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/repository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

Message Edited on 07/23/0303:16PM by RayBanJockey

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:14 PM
Said RBJ!

You are on form today.....

I think 'nice kill', 'nice shot' etc is far more meaningful, after all it does display a level of keyboarding skills. Especially when you are on their 6 just before you take them down!

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:17 PM
Actually, I was exagerating a bit. Saluting is not necessarily a crime. But excessive saluting is.

<img src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/repository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:18 PM
Hawgdog wrote:
- Hmm, seems chivalry has died, a year and a half ago,
- it was "!S!" this, "~S~" that, "S sir", "GK -S-" and
- the other thing.
- Heck I got shot down after getting crippled on
- takeoff and still gave a ~S~. No response...
-
- I shoot someone down and give 'em a "Nice work-S-"
- and I get a "screw you" reply!
- Maybe when we all have TrackIR and the patch and the
- add-on we'll start feeling the love again



First off, typing salute is only rude if the knucklehead who receives one takes it that way. A little self-centered in your view aren't you RBJ? I have received a "WTF is that supposed to mean" after typing ~S~. Turns out at 4:00 a.m. not everyone flying online knows what that means.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

I give a ~S~ after a good fight. Or if I'm vulched I'll give one of these (/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif ) to show I'm ok with it (it's part of war). If I kill someone who is chasing someone else I see that as an opportunity killing and I don't salute unless the other person salutes me.

I figure this is a war game and we should play it like it's a war game but the people in the chat bar are still people and should be treated respectfully.



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XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:24 PM
Basically DON`T use S! unless you have a good dogfight with one other guy for a minute or so.

NO S!s after vulching, surprise kills or anything where other guy never really had a chance to fight.

If not sure just don`t use it.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:33 PM
I still remember the first time I played in a game (CFS1) where people were "S"ing.

I thought they were worshipping the devil. (S being the sign of the snake)

You killed me! I killed you! S! S!

<img src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/repository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

Message Edited on 07/23/0303:34PM by RayBanJockey

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:45 PM
Waddaya guys think about an S! for the Host when joining a server? That always seemed like common courtesy to me, but rarely see it done.

SKULLS_LZ aka The Management

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 08:56 PM
Yeah, it's called

Hey,

Hello,

Sup.

.................................................. .

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 09:02 PM
RayBanJockey wrote:
- I still remember the first time I played in a game
- (CFS1) where people were "S"ing.
-
- I thought they were worshipping the devil. (S being
- the sign of the snake)
-
- You killed me! I killed you! S! S!



LMAO funniest thing you ever wrote!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif



BTW RBJ changed my POV about saluting.Now I give S! only when the fight was very good.


"degustibus non disputandum"

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<center>"Weder Tod noch Teufel!"</font>[/B]</center> (http://www.jzg23.de>[B]<font)

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 09:19 PM
*bah* I thought it was kinda elitist, given the arcade nature of the internet dogfighting and how it has nothing to do with World War 2 air warfare. Don't get me wrong, FB as detailed civilian flight sim of old aircraft is fine. Now, bringing air warfare sim to the pubic masses, beyond 1 vs 1 dogfighting, about all FB is capable of, now that is another story indeed.

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 10:58 PM
ok i agree that the general attatude of online players is lodged firmly in the crapper.

I have givn up for playing online. last night i tryed it to see if it has changed. i started pmy take off roll and sent out a hello to everyone and nothin. it was almost complete radio silence. after a long tangle with another pilot that lasted about 3 mins of turning and jinking he got off a golden shot. bam he got me i sent out a S~ and recieved a bite me!

this was a scripted server and the idea of teams was lost on people. I flew out with a fellow pilot and told him that id cover his 6 from up high. he responded with back off and find your own meat, Kill thief! I unfortunatly dropped to his level and responded with a "lick me where I pee" and then left the server.

ps this was a full real server
where is the honer and fun in playing on line? where do i need to go to avoid these bozos who want full real but play like its a fps? there is a reason people fly in formation and have a wingman!

I hope after the patch the kids will go back to playing doom



http://www.seanruppert.com/josh/porcopine.jpg

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 11:13 PM
When I give a S!, I try to add some sort of comment to show that I put more thought into it than hitting a hotkey. For example:

S!, nice drag and bag.
S!, nice reversal (disadvantage/advantage)
S!, nice bounce.

I see a pattern forming here, but I can't quite figure out what it is... /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

I don't always send a salute first (usually due to being busy), but I do try to always send one in response if the situation merits it (since I have plenty of time while drifting down in my 'chute).


Porcupine: There's always another server to join somewhere else. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif



------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Orville Wright, 1917

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 11:19 PM
porcupine1 wrote:


************************************************** ******

"ok i agree that the general attatude of online players is lodged firmly in the crapper.

I have givn up for playing online. last night i tryed it to see if it has changed. i started pmy take off roll and sent out a hello to everyone and nothin. it was almost complete radio silence. after a long tangle with another pilot that lasted about 3 mins of turning and jinking he got off a golden shot. bam he got me i sent out a S~ and recieved a bite me!

this was a scripted server and the idea of teams was lost on people. I flew out with a fellow pilot and told him that id cover his 6 from up high. he responded with back off and find your own meat, Kill thief! I unfortunatly dropped to his level and responded with a "lick me where I pee" and then left the server.

ps this was a full real server
where is the honer and fun in playing on line? where do i need to go to avoid these bozos who want full real but play like its a fps? there is a reason people fly in formation and have a wingman!

I hope after the patch the kids will go back to playing doom "

************************************************** ******

Damn! porcupine1, this is almost EXACTLY my experience too! Something has gone wrong with the online flying community.

I appear on the server, "Hello."- Nothing!
Ok maybe they`re too busy fighting, don`t know language, etc. But I see planes flying not involved in fighting. I repeat Hello again- nothing! Someone else joins says Hello. I`m the only one to respond- What gives?

Now I`m very much a `work as a team man`. So (on a scripted server) I say I`ll back some guy up- nothing. I back up anyway. He takes on 3 bogeys I join in, take enemy off his back, shoot one down. He gets a kill too. I get jumped by 2nd enemy. I look, the guy I covered`s running back to base to get his precious points for a kill- And I KNOW he`s not outta ammo!

This sort of selfishness is happening more frequently. I lose points, lose height to help someone- favour ignored. Then left on my own.

To be fair I have met some guys who gratefully accept backup or politely decline but they are becoming rare. It`s sad. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

At least I have my Squadron or the offline Campaign to fall back on.



Message Edited on 07/23/0310:24PM by SeaFireLIV

fluke39
07-23-2003, 11:27 PM
i only ever really salute if i have had a real battle of skills with someone thats has lasted for around 5/10 minutes or so (- not that i put a time limit on it) and even then i will do more than just S! -perhaps complement on skills or whatever. basically i salute if someone has earned my respect by staving off my best efforts - regardless of outcome - like has been said it loses all its meaning when it is chucked about like water.

<center><img src=http://mysite.freeserve.com/Angel_one_five/flukelogo.jpg>

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 11:41 PM
SeaFireLIV wrote:
- porcupine1 wrote:
-
-
-
-
-
- **************************************************
- ******
-
-
- "ok i agree that the general attatude of online
- players is lodged firmly in the crapper.
-
- I have givn up for playing online. last night i
- tryed it to see if it has changed. i started pmy
- take off roll and sent out a hello to everyone and
- nothin. it was almost complete radio silence. after
- a long tangle with another pilot that lasted about 3
- mins of turning and jinking he got off a golden
- shot. bam he got me i sent out a S~ and recieved a
- bite me!
-
- this was a scripted server and the idea of teams was
- lost on people. I flew out with a fellow pilot and
- told him that id cover his 6 from up high. he
- responded with back off and find your own meat, Kill
- thief! I unfortunatly dropped to his level and
- responded with a "lick me where I pee" and then left
- the server.
-
- ps this was a full real server
- where is the honer and fun in playing on line? where
- do i need to go to avoid these bozos who want full
- real but play like its a fps? there is a reason
- people fly in formation and have a wingman!
-
- I hope after the patch the kids will go back to
- playing doom "
-
- **************************************************
- ******
-
- Damn! porcupine1, this is almost EXACTLY my
- experience too! Something has gone wrong with the
- online flying community.
-
- I appear on the server, "Hello."- Nothing!
- Ok maybe they`re too busy fighting, don`t know
- language, etc. But I see planes flying not involved
- in fighting. I repeat Hello again- nothing! Someone
- else joins says Hello. I`m the only one to
- respond- What gives?
-
- Now I`m very much a `work as a team man`. So (on a
- scripted server) I say I`ll back some guy up-
- nothing. I back up anyway. He takes on 3 bogeys I
- join in, take enemy off his back, shoot one down. He
- gets a kill too. I get jumped by 2nd enemy. I look,
- the guy I covered`s running back to base to get his
- precious points for a kill- And I KNOW he`s not
- outta ammo!
-
- This sort of selfishness is happening more
- frequently. I lose points, lose height to help
- someone- favour ignored. Then left on my own.
-
- To be fair I have met some guys who gratefully
- accept backup or politely decline but they are
- becoming rare. It`s sad. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif
-
- At least I have my Squadron or the offline Campaign
- to fall back on.
-
-
-
- Message Edited on 07/23/03 10:24PM by
- SeaFireLIV

you guys should come join into a CPS room on Ubi. I know Ubi has less players than HL, but we try to keep our rooms very friendly and fun. We will actually greet you when you come in and maybe even joke here and there /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif



CPS_Dragonaire
http://il2_cps.tripod.com

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 11:45 PM
i keep my chat-bar pushed all the way up because i don't give a crap about what anyone says.

i especially don't like salutes, since i'm not a friggen officer!!!!!

<font face="Courier New">

_____ | _____
_\__(o)__/_
./ \.

</font>

XyZspineZyX
07-23-2003, 11:46 PM
Saluting has dropped a lot.

I believe saluting is very important. My squad members will allways salute whether they shoot down or get shot down.

IMHO it takes balls to salute an oponent who wins the fight.

The 169th have allways saluted their oponents and shown respect.

My pet hate is a player who salutes when they get as kill but say nothing when killed themselves.

food for thought..



http://panthers.kicks-***.net/sigs/sigpic169_1.jpg (http://panthers.kicks-***.net)
Play Hard - Play Fair
Commander Ice
169th Panthers

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 12:16 AM
Author: BaldieJr wrote rather foolishly:




"i keep my chat-bar pushed all the way up because i don't give a crap about what anyone says. "



Well where`s the fun in that? To blinker yourself like a race horse. You must be the guy who I wrote "Check Your SIX!" Totally ignored me and got blown to pieces!


"i especially don't like salutes, since i'm not a friggen officer!!!!! "

Great attitude- You`re not an officer (thankfully), It`s just politeness. You would be polite to someone face to face would you not. Just cos it`s the net and you can`t see them is no reason to be rude, They`re still there- still human!


This is the problem. Kids who can`t empathize,






Message Edited on 07/23/03 11:16PM by SeaFireLIV

Message Edited on 07/23/0311:19PM by SeaFireLIV

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 12:22 AM
OMFG, I think this is the first time I have ever agreed with RBJ /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 01:37 AM
I used to salute all the time but I have found it is pointless. I will usually return an S! but I never initiat it anymore.

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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 01:42 AM
I find that a lot of pilots I fly around are really good, so often now I don't bother saluting since I'd rather give a "great fight!", "nice flying" or "good kill" to the odd exceptional guy that deserves it instead. I consider it a sign of higher-than-usual respect, not the 'norm' for every kill.

Besides, why S! some phucknut that rams me and then gives me a "S! lol"... I friggen hate that.





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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 01:48 AM
RayBanJockey wrote:

- It's no surprise it's lost it's value. In fact,
- it's almost anti-value. If someone "S" me, I say "S
- yourself"



*cough*...potential clue...*cough cough*

"degustibus non disputandum"

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<center>"Weder Tod noch Teufel!"</font>[/B]</center> (http://www.jzg23.de>[B]<font)

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 02:06 AM
When I shoot someone down, I type "IL2 manager save his statistics!"

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<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 02:23 AM
I don't type when I fly. So don't expect anything from me.

Da Buzz
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 07:47 AM
Salutes are dumbest thing that came to flight sims. It was originated in airwarrior then the squads who moved to cfs copied it. I really do not know how it stuck and I will never salute anyone in a game. Respect is earned not by typing a letter

<img src=http://www.geocities.com/aceholefb/acehole.txt>

Hawgdog
07-24-2003, 07:53 AM
BuzzU wrote:
- I don't type when I fly. So don't expect anything
- from me.
-
- Da Buzz


I dont

http://www.andrew.cmu.edu/~gsa/thegradtimes/winter99/images/doubleu.gif

No more ~S~ from me, its W all the way
And RayBanJockey...where on earth do you formulate your thoughts? The S is the symbol for snakes?!?!
And am I the only one who notices Ace.hole and RBJ post time after time within minutes of each other? Jeez,RBJ its pretty obvious the games you play.

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When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.adelphia.net/~hawgdog/assets/images/sharkdog.gif

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 08:42 AM
The most polite guy I ever met online was the one who type "Achtung Thunderbolt!" just a second before he pull triggers of his 8 mgs....

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 08:54 AM
What the hell is "W" ?

Is that like when asian people type "^^" ?


ACE.HOLE wrote:
- Salutes are dumbest thing that came to flight sims.
- It was originated in airwarrior then the squads who
- moved to cfs copied it. I really do not know how it
- stuck and I will never salute anyone in a game.
- Respect is earned not by typing a letter

Well said!



<img src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/repository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

Hawgdog
07-24-2003, 08:58 AM
RayBanJockey wrote:
- What the hell is "W" ?

You crack me up. Not really.
Whats really funny is how you dont remember what you post from a month ago.
I got the idea from you ya ****

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When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
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XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:00 AM
nt = No Text

S!

M0NS



"Blow up the outside world"

http://www.flugwerk.de/images/01k.jpg
My garage!

XyZspineZyX
07-24-2003, 09:01 AM
Hawgdog wrote:
-
- RayBanJockey wrote:
-- What the hell is "W" ?
-
- You crack me up. Not really.
- Whats really funny is how you dont remember what you
- post from a month ago.
- I got the idea from you ya ****


Well, please refresh my memory.

I am the type of guy who watches Star Trek and does not memorize whats going on, so I can watch an episode years later like it was still new.

<img src=http://lafayettefederation.com/screenshots/repository/turo/tn-Numbaone.jpg>
"The Force is strong with this one." -What an ace said of RayBanJockey during a fight when he was still a newbie.
<a href=http://www.theinformationminister.com/press.php?ID=612109283>news update</a>

Hawgdog
07-24-2003, 09:04 AM
RayBanJockey wrote:

- I am the type of guy who watches Star Trek and does
- not memorize whats going on, so I can watch an
- episode years later like it was still new.


LOL, now thats a truthful statement if I ever heard one.
Just like a duck, you wake up in a new world every day


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Completely disorganized,and coming to a base near you
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
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fluke39
07-24-2003, 10:15 AM
CPS_Dragonaire wrote:

a whole load of stuff from other people who were whinging
and then:

- you guys should come join into a CPS room on Ubi. I
- know Ubi has less players than HL, but we try to
- keep our rooms very friendly and fun. We will
- actually greet you when you come in and maybe even
- joke here and there /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

hmm yes i like CPS Servers on ubi - probably not everyones cup of tea as not full real - but definitely great place for a game with externals - everyone really friendly - probably my first choice with externals if theres one running - nice work guys /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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