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DrHerb
05-20-2009, 10:06 PM
Just as the title suggests, which A/C had the highest K/D ratio? I havent come across a question like this in the UBI forums yet. I heard the B-17 had the highest K/D out of all planes in WW2. Its very possible I'm wrong though.

Buzzsaw-
05-20-2009, 10:39 PM
Originally posted by DrHerb:
Just as the title suggests, which A/C had the highest K/D ratio? I havent come across a question like this in the UBI forums yet. I heard the B-17 had the highest K/D out of all planes in WW2. Its very possible I'm wrong though.

B-17 gunner's air to air claims were highly optimistic... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Probably the 109's had the highest air to air kill ratio. All those Russkis...

Best British aircraft was the Tempest. Best American was the Hellcat.

ImpStarDuece
05-20-2009, 11:36 PM
Probably the FM-2, which claimed a kill ratio of something like 33:1.

WTE_Galway
05-20-2009, 11:49 PM
My understanding is the F6F was the top scorer at about 19:1

The Corsair got more like 12:1 as did the Finnish 109G's against the Russians.

33:1 for the FM-2 sounds impressive ... where do those figures come from ??

Tooz_69GIAP
05-20-2009, 11:52 PM
Well, it depends on what you are measuring in the K/D ratio. Are you measuring air to air kills, or are you measuring human casualties/deaths per aircraft, or collateral damage, or what?

I would say that the highest ratio if looking at human cost would have to be one of the bomber types, probably the Lancaster, due to the RAF's area bombing poilicy, but I don't know the figures.

Tully__
05-21-2009, 06:06 AM
If I recall correctly, the Finnish B-239's had a very impressive kill ratio during the winter and continuation wars. I think the 33:1 figure ImpStarDuece attributes to the FM-2 actually belongs to the Finnish flown Brewsters.

Metatron_123
05-21-2009, 07:31 AM
That seems excessively high, but I can't disprove it right now.

The Hellcat and Finnish 109s must be among the highest.

Pyrres
05-21-2009, 07:48 AM
If the facts have not changed or the source is wrong it was just as you said, the finnish Brewsters had the highest score in own lost planes vs shot down enemy planes.

orville07
05-21-2009, 08:13 AM
Yeah, tully. I think that info on the Finnish B239 was in the aircraft description of the plane itself from within the game, if I'm not mistaken. Not sure of the source or accuracy of this though, but I have heard it said elsewhere too.

horseback
05-21-2009, 04:18 PM
The FM-2 did have a ludicrously high victories to loss ratio, but it was essentially a late war fighter flown by very well trained pilots against what was almost always atrociously inept opposition, including a high percentage of bombers & attack planes in the kamikaze role.

At medium alts and below, though, it was considered a pretty good match even for a veteran Zero driver. Grumman had the design ready before they handed off the Wildcat production to General Motors; it was the continued need for the higher alt performance F4F-4/FM-1s until enough Corsairs and Hellcats were available that kept the switchover from being made immediately.

cheers

horseback

eindecker
05-21-2009, 05:28 PM
The GM built FM2 Wildcat had a 4000+ fpm climb and a 330 mph top speed. it could
out climb most Japanese planes including all
service models of the A6M Zero Sen.
Yes, a real FM2 could easily out climb any version of the Hellcat at under 10,000' altitude.
Any Japanese pilot mistaking a FM2 for a F4F-4 was in for a rude lesson.
As a result of a far more powerful engine and a lightened airframe
it could do nearly anything better than a Zero.
FM2 was powered by a Wright R-1820 of over 1350 hp.
Also the engine gear ratio and prop were optimised for short take-off and climb.
I can not find the KD ratio of the FM-2 but it was very high for many good reasons listed above.
But it was mostly used as a short range fighter bomber.

Eindecker

neural_dream
05-21-2009, 06:09 PM
The B-239 of course.

R_Target
05-21-2009, 06:48 PM
If you do it by subtype, it's the FM-2 followed by the B-239.

CzechTexan
05-22-2009, 11:08 AM
I always thought it was the F6F Hellcat but I could be wrong. Never heard anything about kill ratios of B-239. I do know that the F6F shot down more enemy planes than any other U.S. type. I think it's responsible for the destruction of over 5,000 Japanese planes.

JuHa-
05-22-2009, 12:28 PM
B-239 (Brewsters) had a kill rate of 32:1 when flown by Finns against Soviet Union. Me109G2&G6 variants had a ratio of only 25:1 at the same front.

Reason for these rations (according to the Finnish Air Force) was the quality of the pilot training.

Source: Heikki Nikunen, Commander of FAF(retired)

CzechTexan
05-22-2009, 12:41 PM
Very interesting. I did not know that. But it is believable because the Finn pilots are held in high regard. Makes me more interested in the Continuation War and the Finland maps.

R_Target
05-22-2009, 01:14 PM
Originally posted by CzechTexan:
I do know that the F6F shot down more enemy planes than any other U.S. type. I think it's responsible for the destruction of over 5,000 Japanese planes.

Correct.

Ba5tard5word
05-22-2009, 01:39 PM
To be fair the Finns got somewhat lucky in that the Russians expected to win easily and sent in untrained pilots. But the Finns definitely took full advantage of the 239 and formulated very effective strategies to use it against a much larger enemy air force. It's interesting considering the poor reputation of the Buffalo held by the RAF, USAAF and other users. The 239 was lighter (but a bit slower) than the Buffalo, but pilot skill was surely the main factor in the Finns' success rate with it.

Pyrres
05-22-2009, 01:58 PM
Originally posted by Ba5tard5word:
To be fair the Finns got somewhat lucky in that the Russians expected to win easily and sent in untrained pilots. But the Finns definitely took full advantage of the 239 and formulated very effective strategies to use it against a much larger enemy air force. It's interesting considering the poor reputation of the Buffalo held by the RAF, USAAF and other users. The 239 was lighter (but a bit slower) than the Buffalo, but pilot skill was surely the main factor in the Finns' success rate with it.

I actually think that it was good that Americans sent the planes incomplete. Because it ment that we could make the planes suite our enviroment and conditions much better. Advanced and and unprejudiced tactics coupled with good pilot training and target rich enviroment ment that we could do what we did.

No41Sqn_Banks
05-22-2009, 02:01 PM
Probably not the highest, but might be interesting.

According to Christopher Shores "2nd Tactical Air Force, Vol. 4":
Tempest V vs. single engined fighter: 6:1
Spitfire XVI vs. single engined fighter: 14:1

DKoor
05-22-2009, 02:11 PM
Originally posted by Tully__:
If I recall correctly, the Finnish B-239's had a very impressive kill ratio during the winter and continuation wars. I think the 33:1 figure ImpStarDuece attributes to the FM-2 actually belongs to the Finnish flown Brewsters. Yeah, I was actually quite surprised when I read that for the first time.

Frequent_Flyer
05-22-2009, 03:14 PM
An American engineered aircraft armed with .50 Browning machine guns has the highest K/D ratio of WW II. In addition several US aircraft are in the top 5, in this statistical analysis.

I beleive the P-47 has the distinction of shooting down most " aces " compared to any other model aircraft.

M_Gunz
05-22-2009, 03:59 PM
Of course it was the planes and especially the guns that made the difference, right?

CzechTexan
05-22-2009, 04:35 PM
We all know it's not the machine but the pilot that makes the ultimate difference. Sure, machines help to give an advantage but it's up to the pilot to be able to master the machine.
The Finns deserve some respect for their achievements while fighting in obsolete planes. My hat's off to 'em. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Frequent_Flyer
05-22-2009, 05:26 PM
Originally posted by M_Gunz:
Of course it was the planes and especially the guns that made the difference, right?

Of course not that would be illogical. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gifonly a the uneducated, revisionist would subscribe to such nonsense. However,it is worth noting the same pilots also flew the fokker D. XXI, with only 2 X 8mm machine guns ( improved with the 825hp Wasp Junior, in 1941). These aircraft did not enjoy the same K/D ratio.Obviously these aircraft flew only against the " skilled " Russian pilots.
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

waffen-79
05-22-2009, 05:26 PM
I always liked the B-239, it was the first plane I decided to master, in fact it is also the ride I teached to fly other mates I introduced to the SIM

and also my first custom skin http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p32/Waffen-79/staffel2.jpg

and I didn't know that K/D ratio figures http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

R_Target
05-22-2009, 08:14 PM
Originally posted by CzechTexan:
The Finns deserve some respect for their achievements while fighting in obsolete planes. My hat's off to 'em. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

A tough bunch, be sure.

coturnix
05-23-2009, 03:14 AM
Finnish kill/death ratios of winter and continuation war:

Morane 406 MS 5:1
Fokker D XXI 16:1
Curtis Hawk 23:1
Fiat G 50 29:1
Messerschmitt 109 G 25:1
Brewster Buffalo 32:1

GH_Klingstroem
05-23-2009, 04:21 AM
Im from Sweden, I can assure that the finns are a tough bunch! Thats why we, their neighbours, lov.... errr... hate them!!

Pyrres
05-23-2009, 07:57 AM
Originally posted by coturnix:
Finnish kill/death ratios of winter and continuation war:

Morane 406 MS 5:1
Fokker D XXI 16:1
Curtis Hawk 23:1
Fiat G 50 29:1
Messerschmitt 109 G 25:1
Brewster Buffalo 32:1

Thanks for the numbers, all I can say is that those pilots were a pretty tough bunch, I mean some of those planes barely could catch many of the enemy planes in dives.

uppurrz
05-23-2009, 08:05 AM
Originally posted by Pyrres:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by coturnix:
Finnish kill/death ratios of winter and continuation war:

Morane 406 MS 5:1
Fokker D XXI 16:1
Curtis Hawk 23:1
Fiat G 50 29:1
Messerschmitt 109 G 25:1
Brewster Buffalo 32:1

Thanks for the numbers, all I can say is that those pilots were a pretty tough bunch, I mean some of those planes barely could catch many of the enemy planes in dives. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What was the Russian opposition?

JG53Frankyboy
05-23-2009, 08:11 AM
Originally posted by uppurrz:


What was the Russian opposition?

-> http://www.warbirdforum.com/scores.htm

Pyrres
05-23-2009, 08:36 AM
Originally posted by uppurrz:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pyrres:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by coturnix:
Finnish kill/death ratios of winter and continuation war:

Morane 406 MS 5:1
Fokker D XXI 16:1
Curtis Hawk 23:1
Fiat G 50 29:1
Messerschmitt 109 G 25:1
Brewster Buffalo 32:1

Thanks for the numbers, all I can say is that those pilots were a pretty tough bunch, I mean some of those planes barely could catch many of the enemy planes in dives. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What was the Russian opposition? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

In the winter war mainly the leftovers from other fronts, I-15bis I-16, mainly as fighters, and for bombers mainly SB-2 and DB-3. Later there vere Laggs, Migs and many other models, but still mainly types that werent in bad need in other fronts.

eindecker
05-23-2009, 11:31 AM
P-61 has the best kill loss ratio to air to air enemy fire in WWII.
No P-61 was ever shot down by the enemy in air to air comat.
Only one P-61 was ever hit by an enemy Aircraft (A Bf-110).
There were losses to a British Mosquito, other P-61s and exploding V-1s.
P-61 crews accounted for 127 confirmed victories, including 18 V-1s
In searching Joe Baughers serial number records I found two MIAs that might have been lost to combat.
No confirmation there.
Most P-61s were lost to the scrap man.

127:0 Not a bad ratio.

Eindecker

Ba5tard5word
05-23-2009, 02:56 PM
Damn, you'd have to have a brass pair to take down a La-5 in a Buffalo...if that's what "LaG 5" means in that list of kills.