PDA

View Full Version : Warship the Iowa



Gibbage1
04-12-2005, 11:02 PM
Aaaaaaaa. The Iowa class BB....

http://web.umr.edu/~rogersda/military_service/USS%20Missouri-firing%20gun%20from%20astern.jpg

No Ivan. This is not another "Worship" thread. Its a War Ship thread. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif

T_O_A_D
04-12-2005, 11:09 PM
Hey I'm from Iowa, http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif before me Gibbage http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

ploughman
04-13-2005, 01:53 AM
Looks like it's just had a curry.

PlaneEater
04-13-2005, 01:58 AM
That thing will get curry on your *** so hard, by the time you wake up again, your haircut will be out of style.

ploughman
04-13-2005, 02:14 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> That thing will get curry on your *** so hard, by the time you wake up again, your haircut will be out of style. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't like sentances with *** and hard located so closely in them, especially when I don't understand what it is you're trying to say. Is it a threat or a come-on, or just a warning about being served curry by Iowa class battleships?

MEGILE
04-13-2005, 05:03 AM
See, this proves the old muzzle flashes were correct.

Jasko76
04-13-2005, 05:12 AM
She's a lady!

How long will she serve?

Cajun76
04-13-2005, 05:18 AM
I recently went to Hawaii and saw Mighty Mo. Lots of shots of her secondary guns....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v30/Cajun76/P1010043.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v30/Cajun76/P1010072.jpg

The Arizona Memorial sits just off the bow....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v30/Cajun76/P1010108.jpg

And here is a shot of the primary weapon....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v30/Cajun76/P1010048.jpg

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

Skinwehr
04-13-2005, 05:35 AM
I was on board the USS IOWA while it was "stricken, pending destruction" in the Philadelphia navy yard. The Iowa, Wisconsin and Guatalcanal were there, waiting to be destroyed. The ships were closed to the public but I was there taking some firefighting classes during Army boot camp and some Colonel got us on board.

There wasn't much to see. The Iowa and Wisconsin had most of the ordinance removed and the hatches welded shut.

Now the Iowa is tied up to the carriers Saratoga and Forrestal up in Newport, RI. All are pending destruction.

SnapdLikeAMutha
04-13-2005, 05:37 AM
Some good photos there, Cajun76 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

It's such a shame that we failed to preserve Renown, Warspite, KGV or any of our veteran capital ships once they finished their careers http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif The biggest thing we have is HMS Belfast (which is still an impressive ship although about 1/5 the size of an Iowa class BB

ploughman
04-13-2005, 06:56 AM
Great shots, I would so like HMS Nelson to be in Portsmouth. She'd made a good side kick to HMS Victory, alas she's long gone to the knackers yard.

Please tell me that single .50 is decommissioned (it's a little odd, but a part of me would be OK if it wasn't).

ForkTailedDevil
04-13-2005, 07:55 AM
Thanks for the Iowa pic it is my new wallpaper.

mynameisroland
04-13-2005, 07:59 AM
Iowa the best Battlecruiser ever built - though not the best ever designed.

It always amazed me she only had 12.1 inches of belt armour.

SnapdLikeAMutha
04-13-2005, 08:14 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mynameisroland:
Iowa the best Battlecruiser ever built - though not the best ever designed.

It always amazed me she only had 12.1 inches of belt armour. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Because for the type of fighting for which she was designed, belt armour was not really a factor. Basically the idea was that she would blow an opponent out the water before the enemy's shells even had a chance to hit her belt. The complete antithesis to this was of course the Tirpitz class whose design was optimised for a close-range slugfest, with HV guns and armoured turtledeck.

goshikisen
04-13-2005, 08:14 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Skinwehr:
Now the Iowa is tied up to the carriers Saratoga and Forrestal up in Newport, RI. All are pending destruction. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The Iowa was moved to the inactive ship facility at Susian Bay, Benicia California on April 2001. There is an organization called "Historic Ships Memorial at Pacific Square" (HSMPC) that is looking to have her permanently moored at Pier 35 in San Francisco as a museum ship, much like her 3 sisters. Her long term future looks good.

Too bad the USS Enterprise couldn't have proved useful postwar... if any WW2 USN ship should have been held onto and made into a museum it was her.

Regards, Goshikisen.

mynameisroland
04-13-2005, 08:52 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SnapdLikeAMutha:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mynameisroland:
Iowa the best Battlecruiser ever built - though not the best ever designed.

It always amazed me she only had 12.1 inches of belt armour. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Because for the type of fighting for which she was designed, belt armour was not really a factor. Basically the idea was that she would blow an opponent out the water before the enemy's shells even had a chance to hit her belt. The complete antithesis to this was of course the Tirpitz class whose design was optimised for a close-range slugfest, with HV guns and armoured turtledeck. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree, the Tirpitz was designed for an encounter in the North Sea where visibility was down to 20,000 yards or so. She was very effective for this. Think about the Bismarcks destruction how many shells she took.

The Iowa's concept was unproven - it would have relied on radar to range out the guns to 30,000 - 40,000 yardsand hitting consistently at this range may prove difficult. The longest hit recorded was by HMS Warspite against Vittorio ( or another ship of class ) at 26,700 yards if i recall correctly.

My personal fav ships never even got built - the N3 and G3 class monsters which had decks of 10 / 12 inches over magazines and were one of the origional exponents of sloped armour. Of the ships that got built Nelson and Rodney were closest to their design. Imagine a G3 class - 9 x 16 inch guns and 31 knot speed in 1927 ish that would be something. My other favs are Vangaurd, KGV class and South Dakota.

rgr

ploughman
04-13-2005, 09:14 AM
Well the Bismarck got totalled in a a completely inefficient and emotional blasting party by the RN. Plunging fire kills battle ships, but when the RN caught up with Bismarck they just wanted to plaster the hell out of the ship that'd destroyed the beloved Hood from short range. Torpedoes provided the kill, the rest of it was plain vengeance that would have left her a ruined floating hulk, but floating nevertheless. Does go to show how tough the Bismark and the Tirpitz were though.

SnapdLikeAMutha
04-13-2005, 09:23 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mynameisroland:
The longest hit recorded was by HMS Warspite against Vittorio ( or another ship of class ) at 26,700 yards if i recall correctly.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yep, at Calabria in July 1940, the hit was actually against Guilio Cesare

mynameisroland
04-13-2005, 09:28 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SnapdLikeAMutha:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mynameisroland:
The longest hit recorded was by HMS Warspite against Vittorio ( or another ship of class ) at 26,700 yards if i recall correctly.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yep, at Calabria in July 1940, the hit was actually against Guilio Cesare <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

thanks you're right. Dont have my info to hand.

rgr

ploughman
04-13-2005, 09:36 AM
"During the Battle of Punta Stilo, (aka Calabria) on July 9, 1940, Giulio Cesare was hit by a 15 inch (381 mm) shell as HMS Warspite set the record for naval gunnery against a moving target at well over 24,000 meters (26,000 yards)."

Further googling suggests the actual range to be eithr 26,400 or 26,600 yards which is 15 miles. The Giulio Cesare, which also predate WWI survived, the rest of her career is interesting if a little macabre.

"Following Italy's surrender in 1943, Giulio Cesare was transferred to Allied control, and in February 1949 she was transferred to the Soviet Union as reparations under terms set at the Teheran Conference in 1945. Renamed Novorossisk (for the Black Sea port) and rearmed with 12-inch guns, she was the most heavily armed ship in the Soviet Navy. Anchored in Sevastopol on October 29, 1955, at 0130 the ship was wracked by an explosion just forward of "A" turret. Nearly three hours later, she turned turtle and sank, taking with her 600 of her 1,600 crew. The sinking itself remained a closely guarded secret until 1988, and the actual cause of the twentieth century's worst peacetime naval disaster has never been determined. The four possibilities most often citedâ€"ťnone of them especially compellingâ€"ťare that a mine laid during World War II came loose and struck the hull; that the ship was sabotaged by KGB agents seeking to discredit Commander in Chief Admiral Nikolai G. Kuznetsov; that the ship was mined by the Italians prior to the ship's transfer to the Soviet Union; or that Italian neofascist commandos under Junio Valerio Borghese, "The Black Prince," mined the ship where she lay."

Cajun76
04-13-2005, 03:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ploughman:
Great shots, I would so like HMS Nelson to be in Portsmouth. She'd made a good side kick to HMS Victory, alas she's long gone to the knackers yard.

Please tell me that single .50 is decommissioned (it's a little odd, but a part of me would be OK if it wasn't). <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, it's unservicable and the belt is dummies with no powder and wired to the ammo box.

Btw, the shots were taken at 2304 X 1728 if anyone wanted a bigger one.

For those who don't know, the Missouri was where the Japanese signed the surrender in Tokyo Bay.

Lucius_Esox
04-13-2005, 04:36 PM
Talking about ships that should have been saved from the knackers yard scrapping Warspite was criminal. The ship was at Jutland and fought in the thick of it. She actually had her steering gear damaged and did a complete circle in front the chasing German high seas fleet, and survived! The Queen Elizabeths were the best of their time and were a very battlworthy design as evidenced by their service in the 2WW. Warspite was hit and damaged by a glider bomb off Salerno, the first hit on a warship by a guided weapon I believe, and, as the story goes, when being towed to the knackers yard the steering gear repaired after Jutland all those years before, broke! and she grounded herself!!
Ghosts!! Tis a shame she was not saved although the later ships to bear her name were far deadlier then her.

FI_Willie
04-13-2005, 05:14 PM
Another proud ship that went to the breakers. She didn't see any WWII action but she fought in Korea and did an AWESOME job in 'Nam.

I saw her on the "gun line" a few times when I was there in '72.

Even though her guns were not a big as the BB's(battleship), her rapid fire guns could put more ammo on the target than a BB could!!

She was known as "the grey ghost of the east coast" The USS NEWPORT NEWS, CA-148
http://www.navsource.org/archives/04/04148.htm

SnapdLikeAMutha
04-13-2005, 06:01 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Lucius_Esox:
Talking about ships that should have been saved from the knackers yard scrapping Warspite was criminal. The ship was at Jutland and fought in the thick of it. She actually had her steering gear damaged and did a complete circle in front the chasing German high seas fleet, and survived! The Queen Elizabeths were the best of their time and were a very battlworthy design as evidenced by their service in the 2WW. Warspite was hit and damaged by a glider bomb off Salerno, the first hit on a warship by a guided weapon I believe, and, as the story goes, when being towed to the knackers yard the steering gear repaired after Jutland all those years before, broke! and she grounded herself!!
Ghosts!! Tis a shame she was not saved although the later ships to bear her name were far deadlier then her. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yep the fact is NO other ships in the world at the time could have withstood the pounding the QEs took at Jutland, whilst returning the favours as potently as they did, all the while pelting about the Skaggerak at 24 kts. If there's one ship that epitomises tenacity and fighting spirit then it is this one
http://www.interet-general.info/IMG/warspite.jpg

It takes 3 years to build a ship, 300 years to build a tradition...but when they built Warspite they built a legend http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

TriggerHappy57
04-13-2005, 08:02 PM
I just love these pictures of the lady:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v601/TriggerHappy57/USSIowa1984gunsinet.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v601/TriggerHappy57/bb91-pc.jpg

FI_Willie
04-13-2005, 08:47 PM
ftp://68.189.216.86/UBER%20TRAIN/wiscon.bmp

BOOM!!!

USS WISCONSIN

Lucius_Esox
04-14-2005, 01:04 AM
Looking at the effect of the main armourment on the water in your shots Willie, awesome! I remember reading somewhere that a large factor in fully enclosing the secondary armourment in armour on BB's was protection against the blast effects of the ships main guns!!!

I went to Normandy about this time last year and saw above the invasion beaches what the power of the big gun can do. There were some casements on top of the cliffs which had been involved in a duel with some cruisers and a BB on D day, Jeez. There were chunks of concrete the size of buses just randomly thrown around as if by a giant, staggering!

woofiedog
04-14-2005, 02:05 AM
Cajun76 ... Great Photo's of the USS Missouri. You must of had a Blast.
Thank's for Sharing!

Vipez-
04-14-2005, 10:18 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ploughman:
Well the Bismarck got totalled in a a completely inefficient and emotional blasting party by the RN. Plunging fire kills battle ships, but when the RN caught up with Bismarck they just wanted to plaster the hell out of the ship that'd destroyed the beloved Hood from short range. Torpedoes provided the kill, the rest of it was plain vengeance that would have left her a ruined floating hulk, but floating nevertheless. Does go to show how tough the Bismark and the Tirpitz were though. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


hmm, well according to James Cameron (Expedition: Bismarck ), Bismarck was not SUNK by torpedoes or shells from British ships, but the crew blew it from the inside to avoid beeing captured.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Think this tells something about Bismarck's durability

ploughman
04-14-2005, 12:08 PM
This was the perceived wisdom, I'm not familiar with Cameron's expedition or that it backed them up but a recent survy of the wreck by submersibles, that also located and surveyed the wreck of the Hood determined that damage caused by RN torpedo fire from HMS Dorsetshire was what caused the Bismarck to sink, and not scuttling.

Link to the site that features this survey (http://www.channel4.com/history/microsites/H/hood/index.html)

Andrewsdad
04-14-2005, 01:01 PM
My dad was aboard USS BILOXI when this photo was taken.
BILOXI earned nine battle stars for her service in the Pacific.

Salute !!
AD



http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-4/986086/Biloxi.jpg

SnapdLikeAMutha
04-14-2005, 01:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Vipez-:

hmm, well according to James Cameron (Expedition: Bismarck ), Bismarck was not SUNK by torpedoes or shells from British ships, but the crew blew it from the inside to avoid beeing captured.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Think this tells something about Bismarck's durability <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

...because James Cameron, aside from being a mediocre filmmaker is also an expert on explosives, ballistics and naval architecture... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

There's no evidence to suggest that Bismarck was scuttled, or that scuttling charges were even in place, and there's certainly nothing to suggest that these hypothetical explosives did much to hasten her sinking. In fact the only real evidence there is consists of ~50000t of scrap metal lying at the bottom of the Atlantic full of shell holes http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Vipez-
04-14-2005, 01:26 PM
well looking at the holes of explosion of the bismark ( at the document) it SURE looked like the explosions were from inside, thus explosives charged set by the crew.. and this is what Cameron believed too. And according to the research team, plus few alive veterans alive from Bismarck, they said the same thing.. torpedos sure did some minor damage, but still did not give the final blow to sink the beast.. but the explosives did.

Guess we never for sure, but in the end it sure looks like for me, that eventually Bismarck's fate was it's own crew.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

In the end, it's national pride between germans and british, who eventually sank the ship.. germans or british http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Fortunalety i am not british or german :P

Lucius_Esox
04-14-2005, 01:51 PM
Amazing really the myths that surround the Bismarck. She was a fine ship but in reality she was a re-worked Baden class from the first world war. Seeing massive explosion damage from the inside out isn't that suprising really whe you consider the damage a magazine would do when it exploded. We have seen the pictures of the most Battlworthy Ships to float in the 2WW earlier in the post, i.e. the Iowa class. I say to float because but for the Washington treaty the G3 class of which Nelson and Rodney were the cut down (in half!!) versions would have surpasses anything previously built.

SnapdLikeAMutha
04-14-2005, 02:04 PM
Torpedos did more than minor damage, they crippled the ship's sterring!

Bear in mind there are some pretty impressive forces at work when such a large object takes a plunge to the sea bed from 15500 feet, it would be a hellish task to differentiate battle damage from implosion damage, or damage caused when the thing knocked into the Atlantic floor.

Ultimately she was going down one way or another

ploughman
04-15-2005, 05:08 AM
Vipez, I had a trawl through that site I posted. I'd been on it before when the TV show came on TV and it had some images of damage to the Bismarck that showed that terminal torpedo damaged had been inflicted, as well as an awesome shot of 15 inch shell damage where the shell had ploughed a trench out of the deck armour and shattered a turret ring. Those images don't seem to be there now which is too bad.

I get what you mean about this being emotive, the Germans have a tradition of scuttling to deny capture and I've no doubt they considered the nature of the gunnery attack launched by the RN ships as being one designed to disable her ability to resist boarding. I rather fancy the truth is the Bismarck would have sunk from torpedo damage if she hadn't been scuttled and she'd've succumbed to scuttling if she hadn't sunk from torpedo damage. As for us Brits, we'd just lost a load of ships evacuating Commonwealth troops from Suda Bay in Crete following yet another Axis victory and needed a morale boost. This is where the "it takes 3 years to build a ship, 300 years to build a tradition," quote comes from. The admiral in charge had been told the navy had done all that could be expected in getting off as many troops as it had already done, he responded with that quote and sent his ships back to get more men. The RN lost a small fleet of crusiers and lesser ships to German air attack but got off 18,000 troops that would have otherwise ended up as PoWs. The notion that the Germans had denied the RN the Bismarck kill by scuttling wasn't all that welcome at the time and time is like concrete when it comes to opinions.

Slickun
04-15-2005, 08:29 AM
The US had the "Montanna" class of BB's already planned out and ready to be built when VJ day came. Sort of a combination of the stubby, very capable ships of the class the "Alabama" was in (can't remember the class name off hand) and the Iowa's. They were to have 12 of the 16 inch guns the Iowas had, in 4 triple turrets, massive arnor, and be of the 28 knots speed class.


An even larger class was being planned.

SnapdLikeAMutha
04-15-2005, 08:35 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slickun:
The US had the "Montanna" class of BB's already planned out and ready to be built when VJ day came. Sort of a combination of the stubby, very capable ships of the class the "Alabama" was in (can't remember the class name off hand) and the Iowa's. They were to have 12 of the 16 inch guns the Iowas had, in 4 triple turrets, massive arnor, and be of the 28 knots speed class.


An even larger class was being planned. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Alabama was the final unit of the South Dakota class

lkemling
04-15-2005, 11:06 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SnapdLikeAMutha:
Some good photos there, Cajun76 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

It's such a shame that we failed to preserve Renown, Warspite, KGV or any of our veteran capital ships once they finished their careers http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif The biggest thing we have is HMS Belfast (which is still an impressive ship although about 1/5 the size of an Iowa class BB <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

IMHO It was just criminal that the British gov. scrapped HMS Warspite,with her record of service she should have been tied up in a place of honor such as near the Victory.

Slickun
04-15-2005, 04:43 PM
Alabama was the final unit of the South Dakota class[/QUOTE]

Thanks. That's it.

Anybody going through Mobile on I-10 can pull off and visit the Alabama, sitting alongside a dock in Mobile Bay. A great military park, full of planes, ships, subs, and a B-52.

Seeing a Battlewagon up close is an amazing experience.