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View Full Version : Poll: Instead of new flyables PLEASE fix notorious bugs



tigertalon
02-22-2005, 09:29 AM

VW-IceFire
02-22-2005, 09:34 AM
I'm content to have both old bugs fixed, new bugs implemented and new aircraft to boot http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

LEXX_Luthor
02-22-2005, 09:48 AM
Other flight simmers/simmerettes may Choose to fly planes that you don't want in their sim.

Selfish Slogan:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Also ask yourself one question: What's the percentage of flyables that you fly regularely? Higher that 5%? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

tigertalon
02-22-2005, 10:02 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:
Other flight simmers/simmerettes may Choose to fly planes that _you_ don't want in their sim.

Selfish Slogan:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Also ask yourself one question: What's the percentage of flyables that you fly regularely? Higher that 5%? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry, my English is too poor to understand this (my 3rd language). What exactly is selfish here? I'm not trying to improve something FOR ME, but for everybody. Also, you have the possibility of voting... It's a question whether you prefer quality over quantity or vice versa.

Honestly, I have no selfish intentions with this.

F19_Olli72
02-22-2005, 10:53 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
Sorry, my English is too poor to understand this (my 3rd language). What exactly is selfish here? I'm not trying to improve something FOR ME, but for everybody. Also, you have the possibility of voting... It's a question whether you prefer quality over quantity or vice versa.

Honestly, I have no selfish intentions with this. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

What Lexx means is that even if you dont care about new planes theres ppl who look forward to see their favorite planes in FB. For example you can look at the frontpage poll; 43% out of 900 votes look forward to the Mosquito (me included). Im with Icefire, id rather have the planes AND any bugs fixed http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

crazyivan1970
02-22-2005, 11:21 AM
How many topics on the same issue are we planning to create? Now we start poll about it too?

fherathras
02-22-2005, 03:20 PM
¸l e godt

F19_Orheim
02-22-2005, 04:00 PM
akkurat

Longjocks
02-22-2005, 04:55 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by F19_Olli72:
What Lexx means is that even if you dont care about new planes theres ppl who look forward to see _their_ favorite planes in FB. For example you can look at the frontpage poll; 43% out of 900 votes look forward to the Mosquito (me included). Im with Icefire, id rather have the planes AND any bugs fixed http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
So, the issue is that the poll should have a third option? Isn't it easier to just say that?

My personal opinion is that the current content should be worked on first. Get it as flawless as possible then add more.

I have another personal opinion to add - if IL-2 et al doesn't have a plane you want... stiff sh*t. Sorry, but stiff sh*t. I could have said that in a nicer way, but when in Rome...

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
How many topics on the same issue are we planning to create? Now we start poll about it too? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
If only someone had the power to close or merge threads about the same topic. Know anyone like that? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

Gato__Loco
02-22-2005, 05:17 PM
Why everything should be a "this or that" choice? BOB OR more PF stuff? Fix old bugs OR add new planes? Chocolate OR vainilla? I don't get it. There are some bugs, sure. Fix them. And put those new planes on the sim too!!

Medvedya
02-22-2005, 05:20 PM
The wording of the poll options is completely and utterly loaded. Worthless.

p1ngu666
02-22-2005, 05:37 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VW-IceFire:
I'm content to have both old bugs fixed, new bugs implemented and new aircraft to boot http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

yes new bugs, always something to look forward too in new software http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

tigertalon
02-22-2005, 05:57 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VW-IceFire:
I'm content to have both old bugs fixed, new bugs implemented and new aircraft to boot http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is exactly what is offered in choice no.1! You have to decide whether you want the new patch with all the flyables, or you want the same patch plus bugs resolved one month later (because, obviously, you need some time to resolve bugs).

tigertalon
02-22-2005, 05:59 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gato__Loco:
Why everything should be a "this or that" choice? BOB OR more PF stuff? Fix old bugs OR add new planes? Chocolate OR vainilla? I don't get it. There are some bugs, sure. Fix them. And put those new planes on the sim too!! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, too many times up to now we ended up with a patch, which added new planes and maybe toned up or down some objects in game, while bugs stayed in game. So, like I answered to IceFire, your choice is no.1?

LEXX_Luthor
02-22-2005, 10:20 PM
IceFire was the only Expert here to notice the last Patch gave us Butterfly Flap grafix.

Thanks Oleg! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif Aussom Fix

gkll
02-22-2005, 11:37 PM
I'm currently whining about a 'bug' myself but nevertheless emphasis has got to go on new birds for me. I've been waiting for the spit xiv for some now.... im curious and nervous about how the sustained turn might be and hoping the extra power will more than offset the weight - anyhow never mind that, mossies etc theres a lot of planes were pretty influential and still aren't in the game.

And I wonder and guess that Oleg+co are not wasting this work. I mean IL2 is so good I bet BOB is more of the same with significant enhancements to everything but similar overall architecture. So when he builds the (eg) xiv for this sim it is pretty much all usable in BOB, so maybe the next generation of BOB addons can come fast and cheap...

my 2c build the planes and tinker with the bugs

Longjocks
02-23-2005, 03:19 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Medvedya:
The wording of the poll options is completely and utterly loaded. Worthless. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Much like voting in Western democracy. Unlike politics, choosing not to vote here doesn't alter people's lives in any significant way.

But a poll with only five total votes speaks just as loud as a poll with five hundred. Silence is a strong voice.

Medvedya
02-23-2005, 11:34 AM
Hey, the guy wanted people to report bugs - and that was a big one. Heh heh.

In addition, I'm guessing it does have a big impact on people's lives due the way some obsess over dreary statistical data that you last saw (and loathed) at school.

Silence and voter apathy is...just that. Not to mention the fact that the uber-geeks completely dominate these forums. Time for some cries of dissent methinks!

Bearcat99
02-23-2005, 03:36 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif There are notorious bugs in here??!!??!!

Oh My!!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

Medvedya
02-23-2005, 04:05 PM
Yes, they're a genetically modified mutation of infamous mites.

Longjocks
02-23-2005, 04:30 PM
The mites do it not because it is easy, but because it is hard.

NorrisMcWhirter
02-23-2005, 06:59 PM
Hi,

Very interesting poll. Not a massive sample, admittedly, but clear evidence that people don't need to be satisifed with new planes in every patch especially if it means some new issues arise out of it.

So: bugs fixed first, please..then allow time for some proper testing via through people with a fair respresentation of interests.

Cheers,
Norris

JR_Greenhorn
02-24-2005, 01:19 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
Very interesting poll. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Not really.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Not a massive sample, admittedly, but clear evidence that people don't need to be satisifed with new planes in every patch especially if it means some new issues arise out of it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Not clear evidence at all. The poll is flawed, because there is no middle ground. It's a case of "either you're with us, or you're against us." The sample size is aritificially small because the position of people like myself is not represented in the poll options, and as a result, those people abstain from voting.



This whole thread is a reflection of the selfish desires of the original poster:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
3. "Rufe" central float bug. You can land only on small outter floats if you lost the big one. And you loose the big one after a SINGLE 0.50 hit. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Do you think a person like Jagdmailer cares about minor problems with a Japanese seaplane after being mislead into buying PF with the "promise" of seven Ju 88 variants?

What makes what you want in the next patch any more imprortant that what he wants?
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
Yak3 3D bug: it's wheels stick out of wings until it was first implemented into this sim...
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Do you think that any person that has been waiting for the Tempest for years now really is that bothered by tire problems on a Yak?
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
I'm affraid this sim is loosing it's credibility with bugs like that not resolved... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It is?
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
...while a bunch of new flyables are added every few months. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>They are?
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
New flyables make money... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>DO they? Even when released in patches and add-ons with free content ?
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
...credibility counts for something, doesn't it?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Apparently not in this thread.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
I personally would sacrifice 20 new flyables for BUGS to be resolved, not just one. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Maybe so, but which twenty? I guarantee each plane you select will upset somebody that really wanted to fly that plane. Perhaps they don't even fly any of the planes that you found bugs in. Where does that leave such a person?
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
That's why I ask devs to sacrifice a little tiny proportion of time intended for new flyables and dedicate it to fix the bugs. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>What would be so wrong with sacrificing a little tiny proportion of time intended for fixing minor bugs and dedicating it to finishing and releasing long-awaited flyables?
I could certainly wait, especially if I had some new flyables to learn in the mean time.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
Also ask yourself one question: What's the percentage of flyables that you fly regularely? Higher that 5%? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Without a doubt, I fly much more than 5% of the flyables regularly.

tigertalon
02-24-2005, 01:22 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JR_Greenhorn:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
Very interesting poll. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Not really.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It is his opinion... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Not a massive sample, admittedly, but clear evidence that people don't need to be satisifed with new planes in every patch especially if it means some new issues arise out of it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Not clear evidence at all. The poll is flawed, because there is no middle ground. It's a case of "either you're with us, or you're against us." The sample size is aritificially small because the position of people like myself is not represented in the poll options, and as a result, those people abstain from voting. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well for sure it is clear evidence that at least I am not satisfied with only new Flyables added. And, BTW, last time I checked, the poll result was 81% in favour.

Middle ground? Like what? €" resolve only half of the bugs?? Is it like being dead, alive and something in between?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
This whole thread is a reflection of the selfish desires of the original poster:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
3. "Rufe" central float bug. You can land only on small outter floats if you lost the big one. And you loose the big one after a SINGLE 0.50 hit. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Do you think a person like Jagdmailer cares about minor problems with a Japanese seaplane after being mislead into buying PF with the "promise" of seven Ju 88 variants? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Do you think many simmers, flying only Japanese planes, really care about getting Ju88s while this bug stays in game? How, do you think, would Jagdmailer feel like, if Ju88, which will be added, would have terrible fuel leak bug, which would almost always make Ju88 run out of fuel two or three minutes after being hit just with a few .303 bullets?

And BTW, when flying japanese planes, I fly solely Ki61s now...

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
What makes what you want in the next patch any more imprortant that what he wants?
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
Yak3 3D bug: it's wheels stick out of wings until it was first implemented into this sim...
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Do you think that any person that has been waiting for the Tempest for years now really is that bothered by tire problems on a Yak?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I posted those 3 bugs only as an example! I personally don't really care about the Rufe central float no more as I do about other bugs (because, like I said, I don't fly Rufe (now at least)), nevertheless, altough I fly Fw190s often, I care about fuel-leak bug just as much as I do for Rufe - bug.

I asked community to post any bug they know about. Of course Mg151 bug is IMO much more important than cosmetics on Yak3... Anyway, since we have a merged sim now, and since there are no more patches for FB+AEPonly, yes, IMO western jockeys SHOULD care about bugs from pacific theatre as well. It's like saying: "I don't care if M16 has bug, I use only MP5" in Ghost recon or sth. So, again, who exactly is selfish here?
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
I'm affraid this sim is loosing it's credibility with bugs like that not resolved... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It is?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
IMO, yes.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
...while a bunch of new flyables are added every few months. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>They are?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Ok, I exaggerated, I admit. I wanted to stress out the difference between time that has in past been dedicated to new flyables compared to the one dedicated to the bugs.<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
New flyables make money... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>DO they? Even when released in patches and add-ons with free content ? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
For sure there are some ppl who don't care about pacific theatre and PF and didn't buy it, but they wait eagerly for new european flyables, and since those will be only for combo FB/AEP/PF, a lot of ppl will actually buy it. Many people bought Lo-Mac just because A-10A, they never touched anything else in this sim. Like, as you said, Jagdmailer, who bought PF because he wants Ju88 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif. I'm sure there are some people, who don't even have AEP, and they will buy it together with PF if they will get their desired mount in the patch. So, yes.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
...credibility counts for something, doesn't it?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Apparently not in this thread.
I respect your oppinion, yet mine is different.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
I personally would sacrifice 20 new flyables for BUGS to be resolved, not just one. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Maybe so, but which twenty? I guarantee each plane you select will upset somebody that really wanted to fly that plane. Perhaps they don't even fly any of the planes that you found bugs in. Where does that leave such a person?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Like I said before, it is a combo sim. I don't care if CFS3 is buggy as long as PF is ok. But since we have one gigantic simulation, I want it to be as bugless as possible. So, if I get you right, you are accusing Oleg for merging all this in one big sim?
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
That's why I ask devs to sacrifice a little tiny proportion of time intended for new flyables and dedicate it to fix the bugs. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>What would be so wrong with sacrificing a little tiny proportion of time intended for fixing minor bugs and dedicating it to finishing and releasing long-awaited flyables?
I could certainly wait, especially if I had some new flyables to learn in the mean time.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I completely agree with you. As long as there is a patch with bug-fixes on the way, I'm happy. But I'm just affraid, we will just get some new flyables, while all other flaws of game remain...

Minor bugs? You obviously never fly planes armed with Mg151/20, or against them. 190 flyers for sure don't call fuel bug a minor bug. And there is a lot of 190 drivers, would be even more without this bug. You know what is a minor bug, or better said inaccuracy, for me? Fw190A8 and D9 early having bulged cockpit hood! They had old, flat one. Only later versions had bulged.

So, once again, I want the quality of game overal to increase also by removing flaws, inacuracies, bugs, not only adding... I get my @ss kicked in my yak9 many times now, and if they fix Mg151, it will be even worse for me. But that's how it should be... Also when in 190 putting a solid burst into La7, and nothing happens, I wish cannons would be fixed.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tigertalon:
Also ask yourself one question: What's the percentage of flyables that you fly regularely? Higher that 5%? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Without a doubt, I fly much more than 5% of the flyables regularly. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Whoa, that's something! Much more? Regularly?? Let me assume much more means not 5 but 10%, and that regulary means one hour per week. (it is one mission, maybe two short ones) There are currently 174 flyables in the sim (FB/PF combo) - correct me if I'm wrong. So, you are flying two hours and a half on average every single day, switching planes roughly every hour. You must have a lot of spare time in your life and you must be one hell of a marksman!

Salute!

And, btw, nice sig. Love those early russian jets.

NorrisMcWhirter
02-24-2005, 02:40 PM
Hi talon,

Your response to JR was precisely what mine would have been - ta.

As to cannons - it appears there will be no fix as I doubt we have many patches left before BoB and it will take time to convince Oleg to change the ammo belt. No surprises, there...so those that don't buy BoB will forever be stuck with a crock where the 151/20 is clearly the poor relation of the other cannons...

Perhaps "they" think it's a sure fire way of getting disgruntled-with-PF LW fliers to buy BoB ? Smart move http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Unless it backfires, of course, and they just download it, instead http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Cheers,
Norris