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WWSensei
11-11-2006, 03:06 PM
That's called the CFS series or the MSFS series. You can tweak offline to your heart's content.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

--------------------------------------
"A lady came up to me on the street, pointed to my leather flight jacket and said, "Don't you know a cow was murdered for that jacket?" I replied menacingly, "I didn't know I left witnesses. Now, I'll have to kill you too."

ruby_monkey
11-11-2006, 04:04 PM
All? Hardly.

Capt.LoneRanger
11-11-2006, 04:07 PM
All? Hardly.

Indeed. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

greets
Capt.LoneRanger

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v411/Arcadiac/Lone1copy.png

Chuck_Older
11-11-2006, 04:14 PM
I have a simple rule, Hirth-

Please don't speak for me when I can speak for myself http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I regretfully disagree that having a modable FM offline is a good thing.

I'll tell you a quick story: I am working on something, a campaign for the community. It's actually a re-work of something that I did before, but now I can finally make it the way I had originally intended

Long story short- if you could just change the FM in the planes I wnt you to fly, all my careful preparation, all my playtesting, and all my effort concerning how why and when planes arrive at various places and do what they do is up in smoke. All wasted effort, and I have oh, about 500 hours into this thing between research, playtesting, mission building and skinning. I vastly prefer that everyone use the same version of all the planes, so i can plan out what might happen, so the player can see some action and do things as outlined in my briefings http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif . Can you imagine having the player's plane travelling at speeds I didn't count on, and then having a mission goal timeout announce "mission failed"? I can http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/Chuck_Older/Jimmychamp.jpg
Flower of Scotland, will we see your like again?

LEXX_Luthor
11-12-2006, 09:11 PM
MOH::
this desire ... only 10%+/-
If 10% is what everybody desires, its probably not needed, because its only 10%. Then everybody wants 20%. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

The sim does not need FM/DM/WM modding by players to maintain customer interest in their purchase, as Oleg has shown he can make a (more or less) passable FM/DM/WM that works. The next sim does need everything else moddable or it will be another Online dogfight fps market flop...unless Oleg and <b style="color:black;background-color:#a0ffff">UBI[/b] can make Pay-To-Play work for BoB And Beyond as a profitable business.

Now, if we wish to talk modding airfields, clouds, sky colours, sun glare, dynamic campaign engines, Air Warfare environment effects such as bombed oil refinery smoke/fire that should be visible a hundred kilometers away, ship skins, The Dots if they are used, AI behavior, ReArm/ReFuel, complete full size 3rd Party maps, etc..., then the (Offline) paying customers are wanting to have deep discussions on modding these for the Offline version of the next sim. The Offline customers must be made very happy next time, as one (1) rare honest Online player poasted at teh simhq...


If not for the Offline base, we'd all be paying 12$ a month to fly.

~ http://www.simhq.com/simhq3/sims/boards/bbs/ultimatebb.php?ubb=forum;f=144


http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Furthermore, I'm thinking that any modding tools should not be sold for money as the modded creations will create extended customer interest in their purchased products which leads to larger numbers of new customers as word of sustained success spreads. That is how offering free modding tools pay the developer and publisher.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

__________________
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif Flyable Swedish "Gladiator" listed as J8A...in FB Gold...and...Aces Expansion Pack

"You will still have FB, you will lose nothing" ~WUAF_Badsight
"I had actually pre ordered CFS3 and I couldnt wait..." ~Bearcat99
"At the altitudes this community flies at, diving is not an option." ~Stiglr
"Gladiator and Falco, elegant weapons of a more civilized age" ~ElAurens
"109Z flew briefly, after being hit by a bomb. Go-229 also saw combat, when the factory was overrun." ~pingu666
:
"Where you did read about Spitfire made from a wood?
Close this book forever and don't open anymore!" ~Oleg_Maddox http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

LEBillfish
11-13-2006, 12:17 AM
I'd be against it as some pathetic can't handle it as it is clever boy would find a way to app;y it online......Naturally releasing it to brag, then another clever boy finding a way to tweak it further.....

In the end, 40 gunned I-16's that are as fast and climb as Me-163's, that turn like J8's, never blackout, and carry the bombload and have the range of a B-52....

yea...fun... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

<span class="ev_code_BLACK">"Does this make my Hien look big?"
"I love my Ha-40's"
"She loves teh Swallow"
"Don't call me cho-cho san"
</span>

Te_Vigo
11-13-2006, 12:35 AM
gee whizzzzz....they don't give up http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif do they???<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/onlinephoto/Screen_Shot_JPEG_flip.jpg

LEXX_Luthor
11-13-2006, 05:41 PM
<span class="ev_code_yellow">Contradiction Alert!</span>

LEBillfish::
I'd be against it as some pathetic can't handle it as it is clever boy would find a way to app;y it online.....
The players wanting to "cheat" Online are all -- Online players -- every one of them. This does not apply to Offline players The MOH is poasting about, thus we have a Contradiction.


Discussion? Yes? No?

-----------------



LEBillfish::
In the end, 40 gunned I-16's that are as fast and climb as Me-163's,
Oleg did that himself in FB 1.0, where I-16s outclimed the Bf-109K at sea level (but then Oleg's FB 1.0 Bf-109E also outclimbed the K). For the first 4 months of Forgotten Battles, the sim and campaigns were unplayable for the 1941 era, unless the player deleted I-16s from missions by converting them to I-153s for example (I-16 DM also could not be destroyed). Mainstream software titles such as this sim depend on the first few months business sales to become a mainstream success.

Most Offline players want to "tweak" the FM's so they are more realistic, at least in their eyes as the paying customers, and its a Hobby for some of them. Granted, I don't think tweaking FM's will be needed for Oleg's BoB And Beyond, except in a Total Disaster scenario as happened with Oleg's I-16 -- it took at least 4 months to fix that. Lets assume this won't happen again. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

MOH, set aside for the moment the tiny number of hostile and bitter "old timer" shooter gamers here who are stepping on your thread and who do not represent the paying customers (we may deal with these hostile poasters later) -- we really don't need FM, DM, or WM tweaking for the reason I poasted above. Also, Chuck has an interesting point to explore about tweaking missions based on flight performance (although that does not cover tweaking DM and WM).

We disagree MOH, but the one and only reason is because I don't think this type of tweaking is needed for the Offline players to enjoy their sim, and to keep enjoying it (provided another "I-16 Incident" style of event does not happen again). Don't let this very bitter, hostile, and insultingly sloganistic and very tiny minority sub-community who do not represent paying customers get you down. Notice, they use the same insults every time, like a clock, and use the same hostile slogans against the combat flight sim community every time, like a watch.


http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Furthermore, Online play is irrelevant, unless Oleg can make Pay-To-Play work for BoB And Beyond ...um... or maintain Offline players' interest in their sim over time so the Online players can continue to play for free.

Discussion? Yes? No?<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

__________________
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif Flyable Swedish "Gladiator" listed as J8A...in FB Gold...and...Aces Expansion Pack

"You will still have FB, you will lose nothing" ~WUAF_Badsight
"I had actually pre ordered CFS3 and I couldnt wait..." ~Bearcat99
"At the altitudes this community flies at, diving is not an option." ~Stiglr
"Gladiator and Falco, elegant weapons of a more civilized age" ~ElAurens
"109Z flew briefly, after being hit by a bomb. Go-229 also saw combat, when the factory was overrun." ~pingu666
:
"Where you did read about Spitfire made from a wood?
Close this book forever and don't open anymore!" ~Oleg_Maddox http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

Chuck_Older
11-13-2006, 05:58 PM
Jeez Lexx! You really don't know what the word 'contradiction' means, do you?

Contradictions do not occur just because you disagree with somebody's comments. In order for LE to have contradicted herself, she'd have had to say two things that are at odds with each other. If she had said, "online players are the only ones who would want this" and then later said "offliners would find a way to use it online", then it would be contradiction.

What you're pointing out is NOT contradiction. You are supplying half of the equation, Lexx! In order for it to be contradiction, she'd have to say something contradictory- and she hasn't

What you have here is a point you'd like to make, not an example of a contradictory remark. For the love of baby Jesus, please learn what the word contradiction means and recognise the conditions in which there is a contradiction. You may as well call her comments a Ham Sandwhich. In order for her to contradict herself, she would have had to make two points, each mutually exclusive to each other. She has not! The passage you quoted of hers may be a bit of a stretch for you to accept, but there is precisely Zero contradiction present. You have to have two conflicting statements to make a contradiction. What you have pointed out is a flaw in her logic, not a contradiction!<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/Chuck_Older/Jimmychamp.jpg
Flower of Scotland, will we see your like again?

LEXX_Luthor
11-13-2006, 06:13 PM
He/She contradicts (for lack of a better word perhaps?) what we all know but never discuss -- Online cheaters are all Online players and not the Offline players MOH is poasting about.


When you wish to talk to the community about this "contradiction" or "logical flaw," we are willing to talk.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

__________________
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif Flyable Swedish "Gladiator" listed as J8A...in FB Gold...and...Aces Expansion Pack

"You will still have FB, you will lose nothing" ~WUAF_Badsight
"I had actually pre ordered CFS3 and I couldnt wait..." ~Bearcat99
"At the altitudes this community flies at, diving is not an option." ~Stiglr
"Gladiator and Falco, elegant weapons of a more civilized age" ~ElAurens
"109Z flew briefly, after being hit by a bomb. Go-229 also saw combat, when the factory was overrun." ~pingu666
:
"Where you did read about Spitfire made from a wood?
Close this book forever and don't open anymore!" ~Oleg_Maddox http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

Philipscdrw
11-13-2006, 08:52 PM
It's a fruitless topic anyway - 1C have made the most accurate models they can make, so why would they spend time making a method for you to make their models less accurate?

Think for a minute of the amount of coding it would take to implement this suggestion! It is not remotely realistic. 1C staff have spent a lot of time to make the simulations as authentic as they can make them, so why should they even consider making a mechanism for you to alter their optimal work?<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

------------------------------------------------------------
PhilipsCDRw

The "Il-2 Sturmovik: 1946" DVD will contain EVERYTHING since FB, including all the new addons and Pe-2.

ElAurens
11-13-2006, 09:38 PM
Lexx, any way you cut it, if it is implemented for offline it will find it's way online, and those of us who play an honest game (most of the community by a long shot BTW), will suffer.

If you don't stop beating this dead horse I'm calling the ASPCA.

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

_____________________________

http://www.blitzpigs.com/photos/ELsKi.jpg

"To explain the lure of speed you would have to explain human nature" - T.E. Lawrence

LEXX_Luthor
11-13-2006, 10:38 PM
ElAurens::
Lexx, any way you cut it, if it is implemented for offline it will find it's way online, and those of us who play an honest game (most of the community by a long shot BTW), will suffer.
Nobody in this thread knows how Oleg can or will offer seperate sim versions so we can't say "it will" happen -- but we do know that "cheating" is the greatest fear in some online players mind and that causes you and others to make these kinds of false statements. We also know that most customers of this sim play Offline. Granted a very large number of Offline players have abandoned this sim, leaving a higher percentage of Online players, but a far lower number of paying customers.

If you play "honest" online, than you need to start a thread and discuss with the Online players who cheat you online, or who want to cheat you, and not the paying customers. Now, have you noticed that I agree with you and others here on the subject of this topic -- its not needed for the sim's success? You probably missed that, and I assume because it seems my reasons are "not correct" for online play, as I am simply not concerned with being cheated offline.

..okay, the AI may cheat but that's another thread. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

__________________
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif Flyable Swedish "Gladiator" listed as J8A...in FB Gold...and...Aces Expansion Pack

"You will still have FB, you will lose nothing" ~WUAF_Badsight
"I had actually pre ordered CFS3 and I couldnt wait..." ~Bearcat99
"At the altitudes this community flies at, diving is not an option." ~Stiglr
"Gladiator and Falco, elegant weapons of a more civilized age" ~ElAurens
"109Z flew briefly, after being hit by a bomb. Go-229 also saw combat, when the factory was overrun." ~pingu666
:
"Where you did read about Spitfire made from a wood?
Close this book forever and don't open anymore!" ~Oleg_Maddox http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

FritzGryphon
11-14-2006, 01:36 AM
Better yet, sell a tool where people can cheat online. With ever more expensive versions that allow more and more cheating.

This would be a great source of revenue for MG, and would validate all the noobs with the victim complexes.

LEXX_Luthor
11-14-2006, 02:55 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif Fritz! Then they can sell addons or Patches that prevent the Online cheat tools from working, then sell new "upgraded" cheat tools, then sell "enhanced" anti-cheat tools...the business cycle. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/inlove.gif




Electronic Arts Invests in Cheats
Can't be 'em

By Nick Farrell: Tuesday 14 November 2006, 07:44

EA Games is so miffed that outside companies are making money out of providing cheats for its games, it has decided to do the job itself.

Chip Lange, Vice President of Online Commerce at EA, says that the outfit will provide its consumers with "a choice." This choice means that players will be allowed to instantly unlock something rather than put 40-50 hours into the game.

According to Xbox 360 the choice will result in EA actually charging for cheat codes that might have ended up free on various sites. It will also see EA removing cheat codes from the from current-gen games and charging for them.

However, Lange said that while there are places where cheat codes are free but those are on websites and those websites are making money by selling advertising. EA seems to be hoping that it will make a fortune based around hint guides and cheats.

It says, here. ??

~> http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=35718
<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

__________________
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif Flyable Swedish "Gladiator" listed as J8A...in FB Gold...and...Aces Expansion Pack

"You will still have FB, you will lose nothing" ~WUAF_Badsight
"I had actually pre ordered CFS3 and I couldnt wait..." ~Bearcat99
"At the altitudes this community flies at, diving is not an option." ~Stiglr
"Gladiator and Falco, elegant weapons of a more civilized age" ~ElAurens
"109Z flew briefly, after being hit by a bomb. Go-229 also saw combat, when the factory was overrun." ~pingu666
:
"Where you did read about Spitfire made from a wood?
Close this book forever and don't open anymore!" ~Oleg_Maddox http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

ElAurens
11-14-2006, 05:35 AM
Lexx, your reply to me is baffling, as always.

This discussion is not about map modding or the ability to create non flyable content. The original poster specifically asked for the ability to change FMs. This idea must be quashed at every turn. Even you agree with that.

So why step in here and hijack the thread, and browbeat the online players for what is a totally legitmate concern?<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

_____________________________

http://www.blitzpigs.com/photos/ELsKi.jpg

"To explain the lure of speed you would have to explain human nature" - T.E. Lawrence

AKA_TAGERT
11-14-2006, 07:09 AM
Originally posted by MOH_Hirth:
All have this desire: play with FM, power of guns, dives, turns, roll rate, only 10%+/- ... is only for off line fly. Pfffffffft!<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

************************************************** **
IF WAR IS NOT THE ANSWER.. THAN WHAT THE H IS YOUR QUESTION?
************************************************** **

LEXX_Luthor
11-14-2006, 07:30 AM
ElAurens::
So why step in here and hijack the thread, and browbeat the online players for what is a totally legitmate concern?
Totally Legitimate is a customer asking for a feature for "OFF-LINE" gameplay only that will have no effect on Online gameplay, even if we don't agree with a need for the requested feature or tool. If you don't like it in here, or you remain Baffled, you are free to start your own thread with the word "ON-LINE" in your thread title. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

__________________
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif Flyable Swedish "Gladiator" listed as J8A...in FB Gold...and...Aces Expansion Pack

"You will still have FB, you will lose nothing" ~WUAF_Badsight
"I had actually pre ordered CFS3 and I couldnt wait..." ~Bearcat99
"At the altitudes this community flies at, diving is not an option." ~Stiglr
"Gladiator and Falco, elegant weapons of a more civilized age" ~ElAurens
"109Z flew briefly, after being hit by a bomb. Go-229 also saw combat, when the factory was overrun." ~pingu666
:
"Where you did read about Spitfire made from a wood?
Close this book forever and don't open anymore!" ~Oleg_Maddox http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

LEBillfish
11-14-2006, 08:13 AM
Actually Lexx...."your" first and second statements/posts are contradictory, not my one....

In any case......We are talking "Online" play in that what can be done "offline" is done to the very same sim that is used "online". It is quite simply impractical to have two different simulations to grant what you ask for, so in the end, what it does is open up the book (based on the original request to change FMs) on how to do so, grant the ability......

So then all that's left is to determine how to get around cheat protection which quite often turns out to be the easiest part........In the end therefore, offline affects online....So you end up with exactly what I stated above....

Now, I'd be more then thrilled if Oleg added the ability to have "Objects/Maps" added and/or altered by the players.....As a matter of fact, in RB3d that aspect made for some stunning additions by the players. Naturally over the course of time, that eventually translates into cracking the code, so then FMs can be tweaked, planes can be altered/added, and naturally eventually the cheats begin......

Yet so what, by that time the series will be so long past obsolete it does not matter.

So as to the original post to have a utility to alter fm/dm/etc. aspects of the sim, I vote no....To alter the sim in general (as in breaking out aircraft aspects from objects/maps/weather) or what have you so new objects could be added/retextured/maps etc.....Well then yes, that I would be interested very much in seeing......Yet know that will also mean a "sure" end for the series being fair online......Though it being far enough off at that point it not mattering.

Very, very different options of the two...The first would spoil the sim for all quickly.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

<span class="ev_code_BLACK">"Does this make my Hien look big?"
"I love my Ha-40's"
"She loves teh Swallow"
"Don't call me cho-cho san"
</span>

Esel1964
11-16-2006, 12:04 AM
I came across a 'big-time' sim setup on ebay (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Personal-Flight-Simulator-ATC-510_W0QQitemZ300049427466QQihZ020QQcategoryZ63677Q QrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) ,and noticed something familiar about the rudder "yoke".It's a very nice layout,and I like the rudder pedals,but,does anyone else see a 'child's tricycle handlebars' as the yoke of the rudder?

Great idea for pit builders. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i314/DMFesel/2020-20badge20Neubauten20copie.jpg

Lyrics from Naked Raygun's "Rat Patrol".
"What we need to take control,we could use the Rat Patrol.What's that coming over the dune?...
Chasing the halftracks across the sandflats,got a nice pine box,for that desert fox,machine guns blaring,and Arabs staring wondering why,the Westerners are there.It's the same old story,and it'll happen again."