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View Full Version : Impressions of a IL2 n00b



StuManUSA
10-10-2008, 01:21 AM
Hi dudes, just in case anyone cares, here is my impression of the game.

First a little bit about me. I have always been fascinated with WWII planes and own many books and am generally well read on the subject. I play video games a little bit, 5 hours a week generally. I'm in my 30s.

IL2 is definitely the most realistic game involving WWII combat that has ever been made up to this point, and I've played most of them.

I don't have a lot of time to invest in playing games, so while I took the time to read the nuggets guide and installed the 3.8 and 3.9beta patches. Beyond that I got confused on what to install and how, so try to simply that if you could. I don't really have time for the mods and all the extensive stuff you guys are into, but good on 'ya for being such grognards about it.

After playing a few missions and some multiplayer practices where I can take off and last as well as many many "quick scenarios" I have even more respect for the men who flew these machines. Not only was it difficult just to land and take off without dying, but turning in combat itself is a dangerous task. That's before you even get within range of an enemy to hit, which is itself the biggest challenge of the game. The sheer vastness of the sky makes a fighter pilot's job very hard.

I didn't make the mistake of firing too soon, I generally tried to wait till I got within 100m of an enemy before firing, and at this range it's hard not to hit.

For fighters vs fighters combat it can take easily 5 or 10 minutes to get this close, and generally by this time, we're 500 meters off the ground, looping around at low speeds until one of us gets a shot or crashes into the ground during a slow turn.

At this range (100m) it's also easy to get chewed up by a bomber's defensive guns, so it's best to make fast passes at a bomber (generally from the front) to put in short bursts. Creeping up on a bomber from behind is a good way to get your engine or head shot off before you can actually even hit the thing.

I was disappointed with the game in a few ways.

A lot of pieces fly off a plane. I can pump all my ammo into a bomber at 100m and see all these pieces flying all over, for 4, 5, 6 seconds straight. Just a shower of pieces. Did this really happen? I mean did all those pieces fly off? From the footage I have seen not that many pieces broke off a plane -- and if parts are flying off a plane the plane is pretty much going down. Not so in IL2.

I also thing one of the main things about the war, that you hear many aces speak of, is how it's important to sight the enemy first, and sneak up on him. With a 19" monitor, it's pretty hard to simulate this kind of thing. And that was pretty much one of the most important things a fighter pilot could do other than land successfully. As I turn around the sky, I use my little "hat" on the joystick to look for the enemy, but that's no substitute for the real experience of turning your head, the hat -- it's clunky and slow. I found this part of the simulation frustrating. I wished I had monitors all around my head (I'm sure some of you rich dudes do!) and I fantasized about that for a moment, then got a soda and watched TV.

But all in all, new to this community, I'm impressed with what you guys have done with this game. You are really into it. I wish I had more time or energy for this type of stuff, but the game in some ways just doesn't grab me. I suppose I wouldn't have made a very good fighter pilot in real life, but it is fun to try my hand at shooting down a bogey once in a while.

Bogustogus
10-10-2008, 02:39 AM
What u need is Track IR, the infra red tracking device that registers and amplifies head movement, translates it to the game giving you what you say you need: freedom to look around. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Most people here started the way you did, however they are grabbed by flying online (versus offline), you should try it, its great! Not everyone agrees maybe, because flying agains humans is far more difficult than against the AI.

Also remember, to become an ace in this game you need many hours at the joystick. Don't give up too soon m8 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

P.FunkAdelic
10-10-2008, 03:12 AM
You also gotta remember. This game is old. Its like 7 years old, the engine stretched to the limit of its usefulness.

The same guy that fathered IL-2 is working on its successor. Storm of War: Battle of Britain should likely address all the details you're bothered by and a TrackIR would solve the other one. There is a free alternative to TrackIR as well that costs you more in the range of 30 to $40 max instead of over $100.

This game gets under your skin. I'm just a month and some into it but I'm already planning what I'm buying next.

Erkki_M
10-10-2008, 03:42 AM
If you dont want to buy a trackIR, try this:

open the conf.ini file in the game's folder,and find line

[HookViewConfig]
Speed=XXXX

and put a higher value to make the pilot's head turn quicker (handy if you're using joystick's hat to look around).


IL2 has "dots" - semi-transparent ball-like thingies over planes at further distances to counter the problem with small screens(actually, its WAY EASIER to see planes with a, say, 19" screen at 1024 x 960 than 22" at 1650 x 1050!). If you still have trouble with it, find value

MeshDetail=X

in the conf and change it to 0 or 1 (from 2, which should be the default) - you will see dots better at medium - almost extreme ranges though indentifying them will be thougher.

And lastly about the pieces falling off bombers and not going down... Try searching for some German guncams against the heavies - you can see LOTS of pieces getting blown away by the 20mm fire but still no fire, no wings teared, nothing...

StuManUSA
10-18-2008, 07:21 PM
Hi guys, thanks for the responses. I've played the game now for about 50 hours. That's about as much time as some rookie pilots got before they were sent to the front.

I have to say I'm just not sold on the game the way you guys are. I can't tell what the hell is going on 90% of the time, and it is not fun for me. I tried these modifications and with no positive results, I still find myself pausing the game just so I can click F2 and switch around. As fun (and rare) as it is to get a plane in your sights and blow it up, the game play frustrates me to an extent that I don't want to play it.

While think this is a great and realistic game, the game is more about the limitations of computer gaming in general than about IL2's shortcomings. In fact IL2 is so realistic and good that it transcends the capabilities of computers to provide a good game experience. I look forward to the day when we have a game like this on hologram, and you can immerse yourself in the cockpit and glance around to see the world out the windscreen.

SeaFireLIV
10-18-2008, 08:32 PM
Originally posted by StuManUSA:
Hi guys, thanks for the responses. I've played the game now for about 50 hours. That's about as much time as some rookie pilots got before they were sent to the front.

I have to say I'm just not sold on the game the way you guys are. I can't tell what the hell is going on 90% of the time, and it is not fun for me. I tried these modifications and with no positive results, I still find myself pausing the game just so I can click F2 and switch around. As fun (and rare) as it is to get a plane in your sights and blow it up, the game play frustrates me to an extent that I don't want to play it.

While think this is a great and realistic game, the game is more about the limitations of computer gaming in general than about IL2's shortcomings. In fact IL2 is so realistic and good that it transcends the capabilities of computers to provide a good game experience. I look forward to the day when we have a game like this on hologram, and you can immerse yourself in the cockpit and glance around to see the world out the windscreen.

OK. First thing. It will take time. It`s a realistic game so if you expect to be an ACe instantly, forget it. This will be even more obvious to you if you go online. Just like in the real thing you need to know your aircraft.

1.Pick one aircraft you like and stay with it. Learn it. At least for a couple of months. Spits, Hurris, LA5fns are good turners. Depends on your pref.

2. Situational awareness. several possibilities. When I first started I used the hatswitch. Like you, I found it wasn`t good enough when dealing with more than one bogey. You could try the Mouse in one hand instead, that worked for me for a long while. Keep the Mouse speed lowish, about 2-4 (in IL2 options) until you get used to it. You could get TIR, but it`s expensive and a little advanced if you don`t know if you`re going to stick with it yet.

Note: Situational awareness takes a little time to learn. You are right, there`s a massive amount of sky above you and around, but here`s the trick. Look at your bogey and see which way his NOSE is pointed when he`s moving out of your line of sight. He can only move in certain directions once out of view. You can often predict his next course since momentum and energy can only carry him a certain way. So think what his most logical direction will be and try to follow that.

If you lose him, take your time and look around. If you look too fast you`ll miss him. check above and always check your six as he will be trying to get on that.

3. As for debris, I`ve watched the guncam and the debris amount looks just about right to me. It depends of course what footage you`ve been watching. Are watching aircraft with high power weapons hitting weak aircraft? If you`re going to watch footage and compare then you need to make sure you watch footage from the same aircraft as you are flying versus very similar aircraft being shot at!

For instance a Hurricane IIb will pick away at a 109 forever, due to its lighter guns especially if you just keep hitting the fuselage (body) of the plane. A Hurricane IIC will chop it down almost immediately cos the Russians gave that version cannons!

Don`t bother with the body since all you`re doing is filling it with bullets and hitting nothing vital. You`ll just see debris of skin, wood and metal fall, especially with bombers. Go for the wings, the cockpit, the engine and you`ll get kills.

For many of us the sim grew on us as, over time, it revealed more and more amazing things, this was WITHOUT all the mods, so you don`t even need to start on mods and you`ll still discover amazing stuff if you stick with it. This is an incredibly well made piece of software and why it has weathered 7 years so well.

steiner562
10-18-2008, 09:37 PM
StuManUSA you just got hooked/injected on the best ww2 combat flight sim on the market,early signs of the disease is denial/posting on the games forum that its "not a great experience",soon you will start spending money to feed your habit(a smalll upgrade you will plead to the wife)stick with it matehttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Friendly_flyer
10-19-2008, 01:41 AM
Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
You could try the Mouse in one hand instead, that worked for me for a long while. Keep the Mouse speed lowish, about 2-4 (in IL2 options) until you get used to it.

Hi StuManUSA, and welcome to the forums!

In addition to what SeaFire wrote, you can bind your throttle to the mouses scroll wheel. That way you have a more fine grained throttle, and you can fly with the left hand on the throttle and look around at the same time, without having to switch hand every now and then. It becomes instinctive in rather short time.

P.FunkAdelic
10-19-2008, 03:10 AM
If he can muster the time he should try the free Joint Ops online school. Those guys really make you understand and appreciate the complexity of the game.

Uufflakke
10-19-2008, 04:27 AM
If I where you I should play the game without any mods for the time being and start adding the mods later on. So in that way you will keep amazed about the game and be surprised by all the extra possibilities it has to offer.

I don't know anything about your PC specs but I was satisfied about the graphics untill I saw some vids at YouTube and was very surprised to see the difference which made me decide to give my PC a boost by some extra RAM and a better videocard.
So take a look at YouTube to see some nice tracks over there if you haven't done that already.

Another usefull and almost indispensable product (besides TrackIR or alternatives) to purchase is a set of rudder pedals, Saitek or CH Pro. That will improve your manoeuvrability a lot. Every user here can tell you that.

There are several interesting sites about IL2 where you get info about tweaking the graphic setup, explanation of certain terms like Pitch control, Supercharger, etc. or learning dogfight techniques.

http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/index.htm (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/%7Echapman/il2guide/index.htm)

http://www.mission4today.com/index.php?name=Knowledge_B...=show&kid=249&page=2 (http://www.mission4today.com/index.php?name=Knowledge_Base&op=show&kid=249&page=2)

Just take a look at the forums here and you will get dazzled by all the info, links, tips and tricks. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

At least you have a goal of how to spend your money. You got IL2 probably for a few pennies recently but then you want to have a better PC, wide screen, TrackIR, rudder pedals. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif

Have fun.

VW-IceFire
10-19-2008, 09:00 PM
Originally posted by StuManUSA:
Hi guys, thanks for the responses. I've played the game now for about 50 hours. That's about as much time as some rookie pilots got before they were sent to the front.

I have to say I'm just not sold on the game the way you guys are. I can't tell what the hell is going on 90% of the time, and it is not fun for me. I tried these modifications and with no positive results, I still find myself pausing the game just so I can click F2 and switch around. As fun (and rare) as it is to get a plane in your sights and blow it up, the game play frustrates me to an extent that I don't want to play it.

While think this is a great and realistic game, the game is more about the limitations of computer gaming in general than about IL2's shortcomings. In fact IL2 is so realistic and good that it transcends the capabilities of computers to provide a good game experience. I look forward to the day when we have a game like this on hologram, and you can immerse yourself in the cockpit and glance around to see the world out the windscreen.
You're definitely right...we're at what the limits of the medium can provide us when it comes to a proper simulation game. The flat and comparatively low resolution screen just doesn't have what it takes...

The game does have means of compensation that don't sit well with the purists but they include external views, padlocking (in cockpit and from external), icons, maps with precise locations, and even map icons to show you where everyone is.

If you're feeling a bit overwhelmed make use of the tools provided. These are definitely more in line with the medium of a video game on a computer screen rather than with them off which is a "truer" setup but in some ways even harder on yourself than the real pilots had.

Try and see what works for you. The game can be hours and hours of fun. You'll become accustomed to it if you like it as much as I do.

WTE_Galway
10-19-2008, 09:26 PM
Originally posted by StuManUSA:


A lot of pieces fly off a plane. I can pump all my ammo into a bomber at 100m and see all these pieces flying all over, for 4, 5, 6 seconds straight. Just a shower of pieces. Did this really happen? I mean did all those pieces fly off? From the footage I have seen not that many pieces broke off a plane -- and if parts are flying off a plane the plane is pretty much going down. Not so in IL2.


I have a photo in a book near my desk I really must scan one day of a he111 that made it back to France before running out of fuel and crash landed in a french farmer's field.

The captions states the crew counted over 200 bullet holes in the plane.

Some aircraft in game have particular vulnerabilities like the ju88 pilot is easy to kill.

But generally you will need to focus on engines and wing roots to have any effect.

Alternatively fly the fw190a8 with a pair of wing mounted 30mm mk108's. The pieces that fall off then are the size of a wing http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

VMF-214_HaVoK
10-19-2008, 09:33 PM
Not everyone agrees maybe, because flying agains humans is far more difficult than against the AI.

I doubt that is the reason why some people do not fly online. I personally only fly online and have been doing so since 2001. In my experience I would guess 30% or so of those flying online are more skilled then the AI. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

VMF-214_HaVoK
10-19-2008, 09:35 PM
You should download and use FB View Plus if your not going to get TIR. FB View allows you to pan smoothly as if you was using your mouse. It allows you to have a center view key and allows the sensitivity to be adjusted to the desired speed. Must have IMO.

S!

Whirlin_merlin
10-20-2008, 12:30 AM
Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
A Hurricane IIC will chop it down almost immediately cos the <span class="ev_code_RED">Russians</span> gave that version cannons!



Mr Hurricane pedant says exsqeese me very much!

Cheekyness aside you pretty much nail it in your post.

Fehler
10-22-2008, 02:36 AM
Is it possible??? Can there actually be someone that is immune to crack? Wow!

HayateAce
10-22-2008, 06:40 AM
If I hear you correctly, you are frustrated with all the flying around trying to set up your shots, but have fun when it's time to shoot?

Fire up the QMB Quick Mission Builder and set some friendly or enemy opponents to take target practice on. If you are firing off your ammo load and only seeing the little sprite-sprockets, then you are essentially missing.

If you are trying to use P51s, P38s, P47s, don't. These require expert gunnery and airmanship to score kills with. Switch over to a 190 or 109 with cannons. The trajectory of these guns is laser flat, perfect for a beginner.

My guess is you'll be around this time next year, flying online against peeps and loving it.

M_Gunz
10-22-2008, 07:27 AM
Originally posted by StuManUSA:
Hi guys, thanks for the responses. I've played the game now for about 50 hours. That's about as much time as some rookie pilots got before they were sent to the front.

50 total air hours after ground school including flying with instructor who helped put things
you practice as right as possible and then solo before moving to advanced trainer before some
hours in actual combat planes? The 10-hours in type boys sent up in the BoB had over a year
in schooling before getting those 10 hours in type.
They knew how to fly more than half-fast (say it quick) before getting time in any war plane
and STILL once into combat they were confused and had all they could do just following their
leader. If they survived enough missions like that then they'd be on their way to being
effectives. Even the USAAF trained guys with 150 hours in type got to the action as rookies
where they they then only started to learn "the game".

How much ground school learning do you have?
How many hours have you spent just practicing BCM's and ACM's?
If the answer is diddle then no you have nothing like what even the rawest RL newb started with.



I have to say I'm just not sold on the game the way you guys are. I can't tell what the hell is going on 90% of the time, and it is not fun for me.

That's Realism.


While think this is a great and realistic game, the game is more about the limitations of computer gaming in general than about IL2's shortcomings. In fact IL2 is so realistic and good that it transcends the capabilities of computers to provide a good game experience. I look forward to the day when we have a game like this on hologram, and you can immerse yourself in the cockpit and glance around to see the world out the windscreen.

Have you got a webcam? This will help. (http://www.cachya.com/esight/overview.php)

You might try a less steep track into IL2 and learn to fly right before taking the whole load.
It's really a pleasure just to fly and if not perfect then get good at the maneuvers you need
to put together to fly decent tactics, to position yourself for shots and dodge attacks with.

Otherwise you end up losing against anything but other don't wanna learn, just wanna shoot
noobs on some BnZ-banned externals-if-not-WW-view-enabled kiddie-pool server building up a
huge kill count with at least as many deaths and thinking you're hot. You can spend years
in that rut or you can spend weeks to months learning to outfly anyone in that rut.

As to following a target around for minutes trying to get and stay within 100m while spraying
shots around and into him... learn to shoot deflection and the pain is over quicker though the
learning of that is more weeks to get started, be sure. The saddle up and ride route limits
your tactical options and plane choices *severely* since you have to fly co-speed to do it.
Don't expect to fly an FW-190 against a Spit V and win doing that and please don't complain
the the FW should win if you do -- the FW's tore up those Spits using other techniques.

It's best to learn to swim before playing water polo.