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Sokol__1
06-30-2009, 08:22 PM
Picture from chinese page of prototype (or 3D render) of new HOTAS from Saitek (not officially announced).

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/523/saitekx65f.jpg

Optitional modules, like PRO Flight (civilian) line.

Babelfish from chinese page:


The pure metal strength back coupling X65F rocking bar estimated that in December goes on the market Post the By:2009-6-29 17:49: 03

It is estimated that in December issues the pure metal strength back coupling X65F flight controller.
The X65F flight controller has used the entire Hall's magnetic induction potentiometer, is in the flight rocking bar top product, the rocking bar and the throttle valve simultaneously has the unique strength induction to install the system as well as the double throttle valve control, may edit 608 pressed keys, is throughout history the function most PC flight rocking bar. All metallic construction is the authenticity and durable ultimate realizes the way. The unique strength induction rocking bar, all input signal is decided completely by you the strength which exerts to the rocking bar, or the F - 22 fighter aircrafts is the same on likelihood F - 16. The rocking bar has the strength induction characteristic lies in: He will adjust and demonstrates each direction separately through the rocking bar induction installment the displacement. May also aim at the XY axis different direction the different dynamics careful adjustment. Simultaneously increased the extension expansion design, for instance may join the match titanium guest's aircraft instrument.
This model of product estimate selling price about 5000 Yuan.

Explains the inside several special places:
1st, first this time strength back coupling is induces the mechanism, is higher than the former strength back coupling far. For instance accelerator, if you used the mouse to move in game's accelerator, then on your X65F accelerator along with will also move, he was the interaction. Is also the so-called linkage. This is in the present flight controller's origination.

2nd, some people ask my this dynamics to be able not to adapt very greatly. I said like this to you that he is the strength back coupling, therefore dynamics is completely defines. You may let his spot not have dynamics, may also let he very great dynamics. Moreover he also changed the former strength back coupling size adjustment is the adjustment unified size. But this time is you may aim at all around four direction establishment different dynamics, before for instance the establishment, pushes 10 dynamics, latter pulls 15 dynamics, left pressure 8 dynamics, right pressure 10 dynamics. Moreover you may also establish three sets of such dynamics to save in advance, when momentarily you replace the airplane, you thought when needs to trade one kind of other dynamics, so long as moves the knob switch then.

3rd, this funds' product has provided rich external connection matching, may product mixes and so on aircraft instrument which goes on the market with the present match titanium guest, and provided has matched the support related.

Why actually does the match titanium guest leave the metal the product, actually the match titanium guest had already replaced the product mentality, is similar to the commercial aviation pole is the same, match titanium guest this model of product for the ultimate product, the match titanium guest hoped that the user can unfailing use it, is not uses several years to trade other equipment, but is hopes you through the unceasing promotion perfect equipment. That is the match titanium guest in its peripheral many equipment, will be similar to the commercial aviation equipment is the same, measuring appliance, flight kneading board and so on, will realize a hypothesized cabin's environment finally. About face buys a new equipment, old equipment on useless aspect.



Sokol1

jannaspookie
06-30-2009, 10:09 PM
Holy sh!t, Saitek's answer to the G940 already?! I'd love to see a review on this because it looks way cool. I wonder if it would come with pedals though...

WTE_Ibis
06-30-2009, 10:29 PM
A nice clear and precise description of the products capabilities. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif


.

Tully__
07-01-2009, 01:10 AM
It's hard to tell from that whether it claiming there's adjustable force feedback or adjustable spring tension, and on which axes the adjustment will be available (if at all). On the other hand it seems to suggest that there will be extensive axis response profiling available.

Urufu_Shinjiro
07-01-2009, 05:50 AM
If this is real I'm going to guess FFB, the stick does not have saiteks usual spring and cone setup. Looks like it would almost have to rely on FFB for center forces looking at the pics.

Bearcat99
07-01-2009, 07:41 AM
Ooooooo Now that looks interesting too.. and the good thing about that s I have Saitek pedals already. 5000 yaun is @$730

Urufu_Shinjiro
07-01-2009, 12:26 PM
Hmm, all metal, all hall sensors, hmmmm....will wait for an anouncement in english.

Billy_BigBoy
07-01-2009, 01:19 PM
Originally posted by Bearcat99:
Ooooooo Now that looks interesting too.. and the good thing about that s I have Saitek pedals already. 5000 yaun is @$730

Uhhh... did I hear you say $730,- http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

Hmmm, lot's of work to do on the girlfriend to get an approval.

ytareh
07-01-2009, 05:11 PM
Floppy /limp/weak spring like all their other products?

Sokol__1
07-01-2009, 08:54 PM
Babelfish "strength back" ~ Force Feedback http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Sokol1

Bearcat99
07-01-2009, 09:32 PM
Originally posted by Billy_BigBoy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bearcat99:
Ooooooo Now that looks interesting too.. and the good thing about that s I have Saitek pedals already. 5000 yaun is @$730

Uhhh... did I hear you say $730,- http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

Hmmm, lot's of work to do on the girlfriend to get an approval. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah but thats the US equivalent of what they would pay in China.. I bet it will go for $140-$200 here in the US... It looks like it has 3 rotaries on the throttle as well... two on the right throttle and one on the left..

T_O_A_D
07-28-2009, 03:14 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Now to wait and see.

BRASSTURTLE
07-28-2009, 03:41 PM
Sounds like they have been snooping around the Thrustmaster Cougar FSSB conversion info on Realsimulator.com.

They replace the pots & gimbals with programmable strain gauges. Costs about the same as a kidney, though. Looking forward to the X65.

Cyph3r111
07-28-2009, 04:15 PM
it looks pretty crap and toy-ish.

and after my X52, i'll never be getting another saitek product again.

especially now that they're run by mad catz ____

BillyTheKid_22
07-28-2009, 04:20 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Urufu_Shinjiro
07-28-2009, 04:35 PM
Originally posted by Cyph3r111:
it looks pretty crap and toy-ish.

and after my X52, i'll never be getting another saitek product again.

especially now that they're run by mad catz ____

Actually, if I recall correctly the info on the chinese site states they are all metal.

triad773
07-28-2009, 09:31 PM
Hmmmm..... it looks really interesting, and maybe really expensive. Recessions are not the best time to come out with Cadillac eqt. I'd think.

One to look out for certainly.

Thanks for posting the info.

Triad

EdStraker
07-31-2009, 09:07 AM
Yep....I for one will be sticking to my Cougar,it's metal,has a spring that will give you a forearm like Popeye and it does the business,lol.

Bearcat99
07-31-2009, 02:14 PM
I like the Logitech better so far.. (I can't believe I am saying that.. )

Mr_Zooly
07-31-2009, 03:23 PM
good but in the UK the cost might just be prohibitively high http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

Sokol__1
09-05-2009, 10:24 AM
Stay tuned:

http://www.saitek.com/force/

Sokol1

Bearcat99
09-05-2009, 07:52 PM
Heh heh heh... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif


Would you (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/3401016855?r=3401016855#3401016855)? Follow up (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/4241044265?r=4241044265#4241044265)...

MD_Titus
09-06-2009, 01:49 AM
Originally posted by ytareh:
Floppy /limp/weak spring like all their other products?
x52 pro has a far nicer spring. not floppy at all, and you dont' need to be a weight lifter to move it.

MD_Titus
09-06-2009, 02:03 AM
Originally posted by Mr_Zooly:
good but in the UK the cost might just be prohibitively high http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

i reckon you can get by eating every other day.

Sokol__1
09-06-2009, 10:42 AM
More renders from chinese guy:

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/7273/x65f1.jpg

http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/1618/x65f2.jpg

Sokol1

doraemil
09-07-2009, 04:26 AM
ohhh, they took frankin potato idea and with rotaries on the trottle.

I like the design, its less anime / space age than their current flagship.

has buttons enough. anyone mentioned the customization software / set up?

The ppl reviewing the logitech haven't mentioned the customization software either . . .

squareusr
09-07-2009, 01:27 PM
[Saitek link] so it's real... i wonder if they both buy from the same manufacturer, the similarities in throttle layout, the sudden, near-synchronous revival of FFB...

"so we have these plans for a new impressive FFB HOTAS system that would be really cost-efficient to manufacture in large enough number. If we sell it under our own brand we will utterly fail. But two of our customers are established names in the flight stick business, let's ask them if they are interested in designing their touch of corporate identity around the given frame." - sounds too far-fetched?

Warrington_Wolf
09-07-2009, 01:51 PM
I hope that Saitek don't do what did with both the X-45 and X-52, make a throttle unit that is extremely good (the throttle on the X-45 is better than the CH Pro Throttle IMHO) but make a stick that is mediocre at best.

Hawkbug
09-08-2009, 10:52 AM
Originally posted by Sokol__1:
More renders from chinese guy:

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/7273/x65f1.jpg

http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/1618/x65f2.jpg

Sokol1

What do all these button labels mean?

Urufu_Shinjiro
09-08-2009, 12:24 PM
Originally posted by Hawkbug:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sokol__1:
More renders from chinese guy:

Sokol1

What do all these button labels mean? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

They read clockwise from the top:

"Awesome, WIN, Rulez, Hey check this out, another twiddly bit, a whole group of twiddly bits, and Total Awesomsauce"

MD_Titus
09-08-2009, 01:17 PM
you forgot the "win now" button

AndyJWest
09-08-2009, 02:05 PM
Will they do a left-handed stick for awkward b*****s like me? (Not that I'm ever likely to be able to afford one anyway...)

Jabout
09-08-2009, 02:08 PM
Originally posted by Urufu_Shinjiro:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hawkbug:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sokol__1:
More renders from chinese guy:

Sokol1

What do all these button labels mean? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

They read clockwise from the top:

"Awesome, WIN, Rulez, Hey check this out, another twiddly bit, a whole group of twiddly bits, and Total Awesomsauce" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Fehler
09-12-2009, 02:08 AM
The pure metal strength back coupling X65F rocking bar estimated that in December goes on the market Post the By:2009-6-29 17:49: 03

It is estimated that in December issues the pure metal strength back coupling X65F flight controller.
The X65F flight controller has used the entire Hall's magnetic induction potentiometer, is in the flight rocking bar top product, the rocking bar and the throttle valve simultaneously has the unique strength induction to install the system as well as the double throttle valve control, may edit 608 pressed keys, is throughout history the function most PC flight rocking bar. All metallic construction is the authenticity and durable ultimate realizes the way. The unique strength induction rocking bar, all input signal is decided completely by you the strength which exerts to the rocking bar, or the F - 22 fighter aircrafts is the same on likelihood F - 16. The rocking bar has the strength induction characteristic lies in: He will adjust and demonstrates each direction separately through the rocking bar induction installment the displacement. May also aim at the XY axis different direction the different dynamics careful adjustment. Simultaneously increased the extension expansion design, for instance may join the match titanium guest's aircraft instrument.
This model of product estimate selling price about 5000 Yuan.

Explains the inside several special places:
1st, first this time strength back coupling is induces the mechanism, is higher than the former strength back coupling far. For instance accelerator, if you used the mouse to move in game's accelerator, then on your X65F accelerator along with will also move, he was the interaction. Is also the so-called linkage. This is in the present flight controller's origination.

2nd, some people ask my this dynamics to be able not to adapt very greatly. I said like this to you that he is the strength back coupling, therefore dynamics is completely defines. You may let his spot not have dynamics, may also let he very great dynamics. Moreover he also changed the former strength back coupling size adjustment is the adjustment unified size. But this time is you may aim at all around four direction establishment different dynamics, before for instance the establishment, pushes 10 dynamics, latter pulls 15 dynamics, left pressure 8 dynamics, right pressure 10 dynamics. Moreover you may also establish three sets of such dynamics to save in advance, when momentarily you replace the airplane, you thought when needs to trade one kind of other dynamics, so long as moves the knob switch then.

3rd, this funds' product has provided rich external connection matching, may product mixes and so on aircraft instrument which goes on the market with the present match titanium guest, and provided has matched the support related.

Why actually does the match titanium guest leave the metal the product, actually the match titanium guest had already replaced the product mentality, is similar to the commercial aviation pole is the same, match titanium guest this model of product for the ultimate product, the match titanium guest hoped that the user can unfailing use it, is not uses several years to trade other equipment, but is hopes you through the unceasing promotion perfect equipment. That is the match titanium guest in its peripheral many equipment, will be similar to the commercial aviation equipment is the same, measuring appliance, flight kneading board and so on, will realize a hypothesized cabin's environment finally. About face buys a new equipment, old equipment on useless aspect.


Holy crap! Who translated that? This guy?

http://saysomethingfunny.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/yoda.jpg

irR4tiOn4L
09-21-2009, 04:06 AM
Anyone else's X52 get stuck at various deflections on occassion and require the stick cable to be re-plugged before itll work?

Find it hard buy a $700 joystick from a company that couldnt even get its previous products to calibrate properly

Sokol__1
09-23-2009, 07:35 PM
Pre-order 329.99

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/4389/x65f.jpg

http://www.flightstore.co.uk/p...AIX65F/DEPT-FSIM/Y3/ (http://www.flightstore.co.uk/prod/SAIX65F/DEPT-FSIM/Y3/)

Sokol1

Urufu_Shinjiro
09-24-2009, 11:08 AM
OMG!



Top of the range flight stick and throttle featuring unique force-sensing mechanism, dual throttle control and the most functions ever found on a PC flight stick

* Metal construction for the ultimate in realism and durability
* Unique force sensing stick all input is detected from how hard you push on the stick, just like in real modern day jet fighters
* Features on-the-fly adjustment of the force settings for the stick including separate adjustments for each axis of the stick for the ultimate in stick response configuration Dual throttle for finer control over twin engine jets, or lock the two throttles together for single engine fighters
* Force-sensing twist rudder control
* Controls featured across both the stick and throttle: 8 x 8-way hats, 8 x buttons, 2 x rotaries, 1 x mouse hat, 1 x 2 way switch, 1 x scroll selector, 1 x 4 position mode switch thats a potential total of 608 commands possible without ever moving your hands from the controls!

I can't wait to read more about this "force sensing" stuff. They say it's used in real jets, does anyone have info on this input method? And all metal to boot!

Urufu_Shinjiro
09-25-2009, 06:15 AM
Bump, seriously, no one else is excited about the new info?

Jabout
09-25-2009, 06:42 AM
Prop sim pilots want Force Feedback, Force Sensing only really works with a couple of jet sims.

JarheadEd
09-25-2009, 06:58 AM
I'm diggin it. Unfortunately, I don't have the money to put into that, when my X-52 is chugging along quite happily.
As for the force sensing. Lord Vader had it installed in his Tie fight....wait,...wrong one.
The force sensing twist rudder sounds like the small throw controller used in an F-16. A strain gauge. It may only move 1/16th an inch, but will still allow for full throw inputs by force application. But if this is a force feedback stick,..how will that work? Force feedback could induce uncommanded rudder inputs on a twisty rudder. Maybe something is getting lost in translation.
This controller looks and sounds like the bees knees. If I get a chance,or win a few hundred bucks..will buy.

funkster319
09-25-2009, 08:22 AM
This looks really good - the winner for me over the Logitech is the trim being on the throttle not the stick!

I use all CH stuff at the moment Fighterstick,pedals and pro throttle - Any one know if this could work with the CH pedals or would I need to get Saitek as well?

Could be seeling all my CH stuff soon lol

doraemil
09-25-2009, 09:27 AM
looks interesting. I'm sad I just invested in a CH set up, but at the same I'm happy as CH is working just great. Sweet and sour, http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I don't like that twist. Every joystick I've had the twist eventually carries over to non twist functions, such as ailerons or elevator. So anytime you get those two movements you get a good dose of rudder. Logitech is notorious for this. And its worse b/c I fly 100% sensitivity on the joystick and in IL-2.

However the coolest moves can be pulled off by rolling and the 3D force extreme puts in full rudder. Great for airshow, mimicking AI fighters, and getting out of spins training but bad for combat as experten fill my booty with lead and LOL, silly noob, tricks are for AI's.


But with Logitech n Saitek both cranking something out, wonder what CH will come up with?

ibeagle
09-25-2009, 09:48 AM
Twist stick rudder.

Urufu_Shinjiro
09-25-2009, 11:22 AM
X52 was a twist stick as well, but I never used it, it has a lock to lock it in place and I use my rudder pedals. Anyone willing to throw down this much cash will or at least should have rudder pedals, so I can hardly fault the company for using a twist rudder. If they didn't have a twist rudder then they would be blasted for that too, "what, you mean on top of all this money I have to buy pedals too?"...

Bearcat99
09-25-2009, 09:01 PM
Originally posted by ibeagle:
Twist stick rudder.

Yeah but if you have pedals you can band that twist axis and turn it into a switch for rudder trim.

Sokol__1
10-07-2009, 05:41 PM
On Saitek product page:

http://www.saitekusa.com/prod/x65f.htm

Not Force Feedback, Force Sense like F-16... 2kg-10kg load.

Sokol1

DD_crash
10-08-2009, 02:20 PM
I think that they have missed the boat with force sensing http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif One guy on SimHQ thinks it isnt suitable for us or even FSX.

TheFamilyMan
10-08-2009, 02:44 PM
Has everyone read the above link? Here's the nasty meat of it:


X65F Pro Flight System

Rule the skies with the latest Saitek X series controller the Pro Flight X65F Control System. Custom engineered from high grade metal castings, this is a system that is built to withstand many combat engagements. The number of controls available will cater for any pilots needs, but the true innovation resides within the stick itself Force Sensing technology.

What is Force Sensing?

In a world first for a manufactured simulation controller, the X65Fs stick does not move; instead, like those found in real modern fighter jets, it responds to pressure that you exert on the handle, resulting in a fast, accurate and realistic response that will make you the ace in your squadron. With no moving parts and a shaft that is made from high grade steel, this provides incredible reliability and longevity. WHOA, this _is_ bunk!!! A joystick THAT DOES NOT MOVE! Sorry Saitek, I guess my X52 Pro will be fine for now...and all that joy lost on a FFB HOTAS...

DD_crash
10-08-2009, 03:27 PM
There is always the Logi G940 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Hawkbug
10-08-2009, 03:44 PM
What is Force Sensing?

In a world first for a manufactured simulation controller, the X65Fs stick does not move; instead, like those found in real modern fighter jets, it responds to pressure that you exert on the handle

I thought I read somewhere that the Air Force gave up on the idea of a stick that didn't move because the pilots didn't like it.

Tully__
10-09-2009, 10:49 PM
Originally posted by Hawkbug:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">What is Force Sensing?

In a world first for a manufactured simulation controller, the X65Fs stick does not move; instead, like those found in real modern fighter jets, it responds to pressure that you exert on the handle

I thought I read somewhere that the Air Force gave up on the idea of a stick that didn't move because the pilots didn't like it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

As far as I'm aware, these days they still use force sensing but the stick does give a bit when you push on it. Not a lot, only a bit - maybe +/- 5-10 degrees.

squareusr
10-10-2009, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by Tully__:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hawkbug:
I thought I read somewhere that the Air Force gave up on the idea of a stick that didn't move because the pilots didn't like it.

As far as I'm aware, these days they still use force sensing but the stick does give a bit when you push on it. Not a lot, only a bit - maybe +/- 5-10 degrees. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

And that sounds so much better than admitting that the base of those shiny expensive high tech toys wears out over time!

(j/k, really could not resist http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif)

Black_Ops7
10-10-2009, 02:12 PM
I want to see a new stick and pedals from CH....
Why are they taking so long to answer the saitek X65 and logitech G940 competition.

Blottogg
10-12-2009, 04:39 AM
I don't know how Saitek has arranged their stick, but Tully is right, at least as far as the F-16 goes. The original (Block 1? Block 5?) control sticks were bolted to the cockpit, and didn't move. From what I remember, guys were straining their forearms trying not to overcontrol the aircraft, so General Dynamics built a little bit of movement into the later versions. Basically, they installed rubber washers, so the stick would move a little. Full input was about 25 lb. of force (you'll probably want to screw the X65 to the desk if it's in the same range), and that moved the top of the stick maybe an inch in any direction.

I'm not real keen on the twist rudder either, and would hope you could lock out the twist axis and use pedals, like previous Saitek rigs. As far as the force sensors go, it should be a non-issue to adapt. I remember being really worried about getting used to it after graduating from T-38's. With a few sim flights under my belt, my first flight in the jet was no problem (at least as far as the flight controls were concerned). The F-16 version of force sensing doesn't have any force feedback either, but I never missed it when flying. Force input was very intuitive, again as long as there was at least a little actual movement of the stick. Of course, the F-16 didn't buffet either.

Urufu_Shinjiro
10-12-2009, 04:41 PM
Well, I do like the all metal construction, and it has a TON of hat switches. But two rotaries is too little. Maybe I'll get it if it comes out in reviews that the force sensing is super accurate and improves play etc., but for now it looks like the G940 is going under my xmas tree.