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XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 10:41 AM
Setting aside its awesome looks, the way that Focke-Wulf succeeded in fitting the engine into the airframe so perfectly without major redesign. The way the pilots praised its performance. Especially its climb and level speed.

Fw 190D-9 pilot Lt.Karl Heinz Ossenkop about his aircraft compared to the opponents.

Spitfire: The D-9 was better in level flight, climb and dive. It was slightly inferior in turns.

Tempest: almost equal in level flight, a lengthy persuit was fruitless. The D-9 climbed and turned better, but was inferior in a dive.

Mustang: the two aircraft were about equal in normal combat maneuvers, which was an advantage to us compared to the A-8. The Mustang was rather faster in a dive.

Thunderbolt: The D-9 had advantages in level flight, climb and turn. We were hopelessly inferior in a dive. Never try to dive away from a Thunderbolt!

The D-12, the best performing Fw 190.

Due to the radiator being designed to small, the cooling gills had to be opened 15% at topspeeds. this resulted in a speed loss of 20km/h. Topspeed was however still 740-750km/h. With the introduction of the Jumo 213EB engine this limtitation would be eliminated. The Jumo 213EB was to be fitted in June 1945.
With this engine the D-12 had a calculated topspeed of over 770 km/h at 9500m!

I urge everyone with the slightest interest in the Dora family to buy this book,,

"FOCKE_WULF, Fw 190 "Long Nose", An Illustrated History of the Fw 190 D series" by Dietmar Hermann,

ISBN: 0-7643-1876-4





http://www.iownjoo.com/freeimghost/robban75/MiG29.JPG


'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 10:41 AM
Setting aside its awesome looks, the way that Focke-Wulf succeeded in fitting the engine into the airframe so perfectly without major redesign. The way the pilots praised its performance. Especially its climb and level speed.

Fw 190D-9 pilot Lt.Karl Heinz Ossenkop about his aircraft compared to the opponents.

Spitfire: The D-9 was better in level flight, climb and dive. It was slightly inferior in turns.

Tempest: almost equal in level flight, a lengthy persuit was fruitless. The D-9 climbed and turned better, but was inferior in a dive.

Mustang: the two aircraft were about equal in normal combat maneuvers, which was an advantage to us compared to the A-8. The Mustang was rather faster in a dive.

Thunderbolt: The D-9 had advantages in level flight, climb and turn. We were hopelessly inferior in a dive. Never try to dive away from a Thunderbolt!

The D-12, the best performing Fw 190.

Due to the radiator being designed to small, the cooling gills had to be opened 15% at topspeeds. this resulted in a speed loss of 20km/h. Topspeed was however still 740-750km/h. With the introduction of the Jumo 213EB engine this limtitation would be eliminated. The Jumo 213EB was to be fitted in June 1945.
With this engine the D-12 had a calculated topspeed of over 770 km/h at 9500m!

I urge everyone with the slightest interest in the Dora family to buy this book,,

"FOCKE_WULF, Fw 190 "Long Nose", An Illustrated History of the Fw 190 D series" by Dietmar Hermann,

ISBN: 0-7643-1876-4





http://www.iownjoo.com/freeimghost/robban75/MiG29.JPG


'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 12:57 PM
cool; a great plane for sure!

You should check out Hammerd's skin on il2skins.com; the one I'm thinking of is a real work of art and authentic, being a copy of a plane surrendered to Allies in March 45 I think. Sorry don't have further info. to hand.

But it is great to fly, and slashing through ranks of b17s will be a lot of fun.

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 01:27 PM
robban75 wrote:
-
-
- Due to the radiator being designed to small, the
- cooling gills had to be opened 15% at topspeeds.
- this resulted in a speed loss of 20km/h. Topspeed
- was however still 740-750km/h. With the introduction
- of the Jumo 213EB engine this limtitation would be
- eliminated. The Jumo 213EB was to be fitted in June
- 1945.
- With this engine the D-12 had a calculated topspeed
- of over 770 km/h at 9500m!
-
-

Is this speed of 740-750kph for the D-9? If so, it does not agree with Bury's web page (BBury is an expert on the D-9) which has 705kph with Sonder - Notleistung (C3)/Special Emergency at 5.5km as the highest speed achieved.

For sure, the D-9 is a great a/c./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif It was this a/c that got me interested in Kurt Tank's a/c. The only other a/c that that I have any interest in are the Tempest and F4U Corsair. All 3 a/c just ooze with leathality.


http://www.stenbergaa.com/stenberg/west-battleline.jpg



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 01:33 PM
bazzaah2 wrote:
- cool; a great plane for sure!
-
- You should check out Hammerd's skin on il2skins.com;
- the one I'm thinking of is a real work of art and
- authentic, being a copy of a plane surrendered to
- Allies in March 45 I think. Sorry don't have further
- info. to hand.
-
- But it is great to fly, and slashing through ranks
- of b17s will be a lot of fun.

Ah, you mean "Black 12"! I got it, aswell as Hammerd's amazing "Black 8"! The finest D-9 skins avaliable. But there are some seriously good looking D-9 skins made by other talanted skinners aswell!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

http://www.iownjoo.com/freeimghost/robban75/MiG29.JPG


'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'



Message Edited on 10/07/0312:44PM by robban75

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 01:38 PM
yep exactly what I meant!

I feel real mean when I use that skin.

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 01:42 PM
MiloMorai wrote:
- Is this speed of 740-750kph for the D-9? If so, it
- does not agree with Bury's web page (BBury is an
- expert on the D-9) which has 705kph with Sonder -
- Notleistung (C3)/Special Emergency at 5.5km as the
- highest speed achieved.


The 750km/h is for the Dora-12. According to the book the D-9's topspeed at 5500m was 685km/h (702km/h with MW50). At sealevel topspeed was 572km/h (612km/h with MW50). AFAIK these numbers are from before they started sealing the cowling jointlines with rubber which increased topspeed by 17km/h./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

http://www.iownjoo.com/freeimghost/robban75/MiG29.JPG


'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 01:44 PM
robban75 wrote:
- Setting aside its awesome looks,

You what? The FWs are as ugly as they come.. They look bloody awful! Like the bastard son of a rhino and a micro-wave oven.

Cast your eye over a spitfire mk.VIII for a true vision of aesthetic perfection. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 01:47 PM
nixon-fiend wrote:
- robban75 wrote:
-- Setting aside its awesome looks,
-
- You what? The FWs are as ugly as they come.. They
- look bloody awful! Like the bastard son of a rhino
- and a micro-wave oven.
-
- Cast your eye over a spitfire mk.VIII for a true
- vision of aesthetic perfection.

He he! The Spitfire is no doubt the best looking of all the WW2 birds. It lacks however the sinister beauty of the Fw 190D family! IMHO of course!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://www.iownjoo.com/freeimghost/robban75/MiG29.JPG


'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 01:48 PM
Thanks for the clarification robban./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif



http://www.stenbergaa.com/stenberg/west-battleline.jpg



"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 01:51 PM
nixon-fiend wrote:
- robban75 wrote:
-- Setting aside its awesome looks,
-
- You what? The FWs are as ugly as they come.. They
- look bloody awful!

Indeed, but they show so clearly which end is the wrong end to be in.
_
/Bjorn.

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 03:25 PM
i was flying the A8 A9 last night and they turn awful, does the D9 turn better, i love the 190s, but find my self sticking with 109s as they are easier to fly (iam a newbie)... A9s would just lose it, and i was barely pulling on stick....

152 turn better than D?

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 04:24 PM
Turn fighting in any Fw 190 is a losing game I'm afraid. However the D-9 was a better turner than the A-8 at least if we are to believe the pilots who flew them. The D-9 was the best performing Fw 190. Except from having a higher topspeed its climbrate reached 22.5m/sec. The Fw 190A-9 is probably a better choice in FB if you want to kill anything, it's fast, rugged and packs a mighty punch!

Just remember, stay fast and don't get lured into slow speed turning fights and you should be ok!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

As far as the TA 152H goes, that thing will turn as good as a La-7. It will be tough cookie to beat!

http://www.iownjoo.com/freeimghost/robban75/MiG29.JPG


'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 04:35 PM
For utility purposes I usually like to take up an A model, but when I am up there just to have fun I always go back to the most beautiful plane in the game/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


"Ich bin ein Wuergerwhiner"

"The future battle on the ground will be preceded by battle in the air. This will determine which of the contestants has to suffer operational and tactical disadvantages and be forced throughout the battle into adoption compromise solutions." --Erwin Rommel

http://lbhskier37.freeservers.com/Mesig.jpg
--NJG26_Killa--

Buzz_25th
10-07-2003, 05:53 PM
Maybe you love it, because it's easy to fly.

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25th_Buzz
<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 06:35 PM
190d's easy to fly? Much more difficult in manual which you need to use to make the plane competitive then any russian plane.

http://www.freewebs.com/leadspitter/lead.txt
Good dogfighters bring ammo home, Great ones don't. (c) Leadspitter

Buzz_25th
10-07-2003, 06:42 PM
The D9 is easier than the A9.

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25th_Buzz
<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 08:35 PM
while talking about fws, whats the difference between doras of 1944 and 1945?

yay!

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 09:19 PM
Buzz_25th wrote:
- Maybe you love it, because it's easy to fly.


Maybe this was the major aspect why the 190 earned so much respect of the allied test-pilots.

http://franz.lampl.bei.t-online.de/toryusig.jpg (http://www.virtual-jabog32.de)

http://franz.lampl.bei.t-online.de/toryusig2.jpg (http://www.jg68.de.vu)

When once you have tasted flight,
you will always walk the earth
with your eyes turned skyward;
to where you have been
and to where you always want to return.

Buzz_25th
10-07-2003, 09:22 PM
Maybe.

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25th_Buzz
<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 09:25 PM
yay1 wrote:
- while talking about fws, whats the difference
- between doras of 1944 and 1945?


Different boosting. The first D-9's became operational in the beginning of October 1944. As MW50 wasn't introduced until December the boost pressure was increased on the Jumo allowing the engine to develop 1900hp. With MW50 output rose to 2240hp.

The 1900hp Dora had a maximum climbrate of 18.7m/sec, whereas the MW50 boosted D-9 could climb 22.5m/sec.

As for the difference between the Dora's in FB I'm not sure but before the latest patch the 1944 Dora was always a better performer than the 1945 one, which is erroneous. I haven't tested the 44 Dora in the newest patch so I can't comment on it yet.

http://www.iownjoo.com/freeimghost/robban75/MiG29.JPG


'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 09:48 PM
from the book "top guns of the luftwaffe JG 26" "the D9 did not roll or turn as well as our A8s, but the D9 climbed and dove better"

every pilot account I have read says the samething. the D9 did not roll or turn as well as an A8, but its climb, dive, and high altitude performance was well above that of the A8.

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 09:51 PM
I thought, D-9 was somewhat inferior to later A's in terms of turn and roll rates but faster and better climber?.
Anyway, great looking plane.

AKA_Bogun

---------------
The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense.

- Tom Clancy

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 10:08 PM
Leutnant Karl Heinz Ossenkop went from the A-8 to the D-9 and his impression were as follows.

"Handling characteristics on the ground and in the air were much better than those of the A-8. Takeoff and climb were better and it was possible to make tighter turns before the onset of airflow separation. In a dive the D-9 was far superior to the A-8."

http://www.iownjoo.com/freeimghost/robban75/MiG29.JPG


'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'

Buzz_25th
10-07-2003, 10:13 PM
What about the A9? I think it's the best 190 in FB,as does other 190 pilots like MajDeath.

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25th_Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 10:52 PM
still turns like poop, i took a A9 for a ride and handled no where near the D9, the D turned alot better than the A9... havent flown any other A series but i will give them a try, A9 didnt seem all that fast either, while flying 109G-6AS was able to track one down in a dive and easily kept up with it in turns before knocking it out...

Buzz_25th
10-07-2003, 10:55 PM
Your turn fighting a Fw190?

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25th_Buzz
<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 11:02 PM
no sure if that sarcasim but the dude flying it kept going into tight turns, it really didnt seem to bother me but a few times his play would kinda flip over and look to stall or something... he never did try to just out run me...

Buzz_25th
10-07-2003, 11:08 PM
Not sure what your talking about. You talk about the A9 not turning good, so I assume your turn fighting.

No good Fw190 pilot ever turn fights, so it doesn't matter if it turns good. The A9 is fast and has great armament. That's the recipe for a good B&Z plane. Exactly what the Fw190 is.

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25th_Buzz
<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 11:14 PM
Buzz_25th wrote:
- Maybe you love it, because it's easy to fly.
-



LOL EZ TO FLY LOL

O buzz its not that eazy its real snapy has high speed stalls the guns are semi week unless you find the bogies sweet spot its a terror if flown right but EZ is not the word id be using for the Dora.

Altho the dora is great the P47D10 can eat it alive @ altitude altho the dora can runaway if it wants.


<CENTER> http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/ah_109_1065290873.jpg </center>

Buzz_25th
10-07-2003, 11:16 PM
You don't think the Dora is easier to fly than the A9? Your senses are numb if you do.

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25th_Buzz
<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg


Message Edited on 10/07/0306:07PM by Buzz_25th

ZG77_Nagual
10-07-2003, 11:17 PM
There are exceptions to the 'no-turning rule' I fly the a9 mostly online - a5 too - get above 550k or so and she'll outturn anything - so if you are in a diving engagement vs an la7s say - where you are not losing speed - you can cut corners and have your way with the la - or if the la is on your six in a dive - wait till you get up around 600 k and go vertical - if he's close he won't be able to follow you and you'll still have good speed - it's precise though. Likewise the instantaneous turn can be used for snap shots (very fruitful with 108s in the a9) without much loss of speed - just have to watch the high speed stall. I don't have the patience for really extended bnz - which I sometimes see people who want to be safe do - 5 or ten minutes between passes - yech. I like to find ways to keep it interesting. Basically the 190s are the best in the simm at high speeds - except of course the 262.

http://pws.chartermi.net/~cmorey/pics/whiner.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 11:20 PM
explain buzz and zoom... is it running up on enemy taking a few shots and they turn away? explain how this tactic is done...

Buzz_25th
10-07-2003, 11:24 PM
Buzz & Zoom. I like it. It's really Boom & Zoom. It's done from a higher altitude than the enemy. You dive down on them, take a quick shot (boom), and then climb (zoom) back up and repeat.

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25th_Buzz
<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-07-2003, 11:36 PM
Buzz_25th wrote:
- You don't think the Dora is easier to fly than the
- A9? Your sensations are numb if you do.
-


OOps didnt know you were comparing it too the A9...

Well bolth are not EZ as in YAK EZ LOL

but yes the Dora has faster acceleration seems to turn a lil better but I prefer the A9 Hitting power of the Default guns....



<CENTER> http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/ah_109_1065290873.jpg </center>

Buzz_25th
10-07-2003, 11:56 PM
That's what you get for not reading all the posts../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

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25th_Buzz
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http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 12:09 AM
the Dora rocks.

Bit slow in the turn maybe but overall quick and lethal.

And a great blend of lethality and good looks,

As it says in the description, any fighter pilot's dream.



http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 12:43 AM
robban75 wrote:
- I urge everyone with the slightest interest in the
- Dora family to buy this book,,
-
- "FOCKE_WULF, Fw 190 "Long Nose", An Illustrated
- History of the Fw 190 D series" by Dietmar Hermann,
-
- ISBN: 0-7643-1876-4

Argh I hate you!!!!

Nic

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 12:48 AM
why?

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 01:00 AM
Cause I'll have to pay around 50$ to buy that book.

Nic

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 01:19 AM
BTW Robban did you finish your model kit? I didn't check the forum as often lately, so I must have missed it if you posted about it.

Nic

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 02:03 AM
That is a good book. I bought it a month or so ago. Highly recommended.

http://www.aeroplanebooks.com/longnose.jpg


Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/NAA_logo.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 03:00 AM
You love it because it was one of the best planes in WW2.........../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

<CENTER>http://www.world-wide-net.com/tuskegeeairmen/ta-1943.jpg <marquee><FONT COLOR="RED"><FONT SIZE="+1">"Straighten up.......Fly right..~S~"<FONT SIZE> </marquee> http://www.geocities.com/rt_bearcat

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XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 06:19 AM
nicolas10 wrote:
- BTW Robban did you finish your model kit? I didn't
- check the forum as often lately, so I must have
- missed it if you posted about it.
-
- Nic

Unfortunately no, I haven't been able to do any modelling at all for quite some time! Too much at work and there are some other projects that needs to go first I'm afraid./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

However, when it's done I'll let you guy's know about it!/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

And by the way, about the Dora book, I had to cough up nearly 80 bucks for it! But it was well worth it!!

http://www.iownjoo.com/freeimghost/robban75/MiG29.JPG


'When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!'