PDA

View Full Version : ME262 VS YP80



XyZspineZyX
12-17-2005, 10:27 PM
Wondering how these 2 jets compare, ingame the AI YP80 seems to have better speed,climbing ability & manouverabilty when compared to the 262.

What tactics should be used when flying against the YP80 when flying 262 bar going head on were the 30mm cannon cause havoc?

Kuna15
12-17-2005, 10:34 PM
I think P-80 have the edge... Go-229 is close but I think P-80 is really unmatched. For sure in fights vs. ME-262.
However I didn't fly them much in 402. They all have nasty throttle behaviour (some of them are set alight some just cut their engines).

About ME-262 going headon vs. P-80 that is not really good tactic for ME-262. Sure if both players persists and place their hits ME-262 wins in most cases but not without damage. Also P-80 can open accurate fire at greater range due to weapon balistics, soo...
P-80 should manouver on ME-262 tail (I outmanouvered Bf-109 with P-80 in 304 - that says it all).

For ME-262 I really can't think of any specific tactic vs. P-80 apart from greater initial E - universal winner tactic.

JG52Karaya-X
12-18-2005, 04:15 AM
I think the Volksj√¬§ger He162 is the best jet ingame - it's faster than the Schwalbe, climbs better and is by far more manoeuvrable! In fact it can actually outturn many of the piston engined late war fighters ingame owing to its very low weight of just ~2500kg http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

And 2xMG151/20 is enough to take care of any fighter that you might have to face in the air...

Badsight.
12-18-2005, 05:38 AM
the Volksjager is a dog - worst turning jet of the lot

the P-80 has what it takes to beat them all

before v4.02 the Me-262 had a speed advantage over the P-80 that it could work in to survive , now that advantage was cut back in v4.02 & the P-80 is much closer in out-right speed as well as being better in all types of manouverability

the Go-229 has outstanding turn ability but is slow , low-powered in acceleration terms , overheats easy , & lacks climb power - & is an unstable gun platform for its slow ROF cannon

Von_Rat
12-18-2005, 07:16 AM
he162 is a very manoeuvrable plane. just gotta fly it right.

p-11.cAce
12-18-2005, 07:24 AM
Originally posted by Badsight:
the Volksjager is a dog - worst turning jet of the lot

We cannot be flying the same sim! I love the '162 and find it to be one of the most enjoyable planes to fly in the game - its manuverable as **** and its throttle seems to be open to a bit more abuse than the others.

Kurfurst__
12-18-2005, 07:29 AM
The YP-80 is really a joke with no connection to physics.

It doesnt stall...it doesnt loose E in turn...it doesnt stall no matter what you do with the stick...it turns on a dime. It's supposed to be a good plane, but not one with anti gravity drives, 1000% tolerance to just about any pilot mistake.

Makes me think it's 'flight modell' is really based on nothing but the whining of it's fans. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Quite true for the other what-if jets, too, they seem to have more like an ad-hoc FM based on oral stories rather than physics.

neural_dream
12-18-2005, 07:36 AM
Originally posted by dasriech:
Wondering how these 2 jets compare, ingame the AI YP80 seems to have better speed,climbing ability & manouverabilty when compared to the 262. What tactics should be used when flying against the YP80 when flying 262 bar going head on were the 30mm cannon cause havoc?
Who's faster among the two depends on the altitude (varies a lot, but I don't remember which one where - I have a short sketching of their differences and flying tips in my aircraft reference guide, under my sig).

The most important thing you have to remember is that the Me262 isn't a fighter. It's an interceptor, frequently also used as a light bomber etc. The YP80 is a pure fighter.
So, it doesn't make sense to compare them in the field of expertise of the latter.


Originally posted by Kurfurst__:
Makes me think it's 'flight modell' is really based on nothing but the whining of it's fans. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
Do you really think Oleg follows the whinefests? The guy's busy m8.

BSS_CUDA
12-18-2005, 07:39 AM
heh sounds like they used the 109 FM http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Kurfurst__
12-18-2005, 07:51 AM
Originally posted by neural_dream:
Do you really think Oleg follows the whinefests? The guy's busy m8.


kh-hmmm! *caugh* P-38 'late' *caugh-caugh*

Low_Flyer_MkII
12-18-2005, 09:01 AM
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y231/Low_Flyer/Spotted.jpg

Daiichidoku
12-18-2005, 09:33 AM
Originally posted by Badsight.:
the Go-229 has outstanding turn ability but is slow , low-powered in acceleration terms , overheats easy , & lacks climb power - & is an unstable gun platform for its slow ROF cannon

the goth will eat ANY monoplane type, but must be careful around oscars and early zeros, the only monoplane types with better turn than goth

goth

turn~ yes, outstanding
slow~ only compared to YP 80 at LOW altitudes
accel~ not very slow, but most ppl keep the nose to high in the goth, too great AoA to get good accel from it
overheat~ no worse than any other jet, again, a case of not knowing powersettings and flying with too much AoA
climb~ not stellar, but actually not bad at all, once speed is achieved, and one keeps that nose down!
unstable gun plat. etc~ flown correctly, as a gun platform the goth is AMAZING!
dont shoot from 6 oclock, as one would with any other type, a properly flown goth should easily get inside enemies turn, get close.....a a single, 1 second burst (or about one visible set of tracer) is all that is ever needed to totally destroy target, in most cases

goth ammo loadout should be good for 10 kills, when used correctly

the only way YP 80s or He 162s can survive goth is by running, and only at lower altitudes, otherwise they's toast!


as far as YP 80 vs 262?

not much of a contest, 262s only hope are its wings being slightly more resistant to snapping off at high speed than the YP 80

mortoma
12-18-2005, 11:08 AM
I'm an american and I think the P-80 is over-modeled a good bit. It flies like it has no weight to it, as if it's an over-powered paper airplane. Like all early jets, I'm sure it had an under-powered and heavy feeling to it. But that just an educated guess as I have never flown one.
But it sure doesn't seem right, flies more like a rocket plane than a jet. But I bet Gibbage is happy with it's FM........

ploughman
12-18-2005, 02:16 PM
I'm an american and I think the P-80 is over-modeled...

Gosh, I thought I was in an AA meeting when I read that.

Kurfurst__
12-18-2005, 02:31 PM
Geez that..... pinguin(?) is just getting even more uglier..

Have you ever thought about a carreer in modern art ? You certainly have a talent of creating abberant, utterly repulsive objects that lack any kind of admirable beauty. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Low_Flyer_MkII
12-18-2005, 02:34 PM
Oh I'm going to enjoy the reply to that one.
(Pulls up chair and waits with big bag of Dorito's)
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

ploughman
12-18-2005, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by Kurfurst__:
Geez that..... pinguin(?) is just getting even more uglier..

Have you ever thought about a carreer in modern art ? You certainly have a talent of creating abberant, utterly repulsive objects that lack any kind of admirable beauty. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

It's no spring chicken. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

By the way, you're closer to the truth than you could possibly imagine. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Abbuzze
12-18-2005, 02:35 PM
I think you should use teamtactic. The P80 is the better fighter. For real live, the 262 is a 44 combat plane while the P80 is a 45 sightseeing plane. Nearly two years difference, a long time in war. He162 and P80 is the closer match historical and in performance. Eric Brown found a lot of nice words about the He.

Flakwalker
12-18-2005, 02:39 PM
I‚¬īm also on the side of He-162, with an optional armament of two MK-108 with 60rpg would be excelent.
The Go-229 is also a very good one, a lot better than the YP-80 at least for me, but somewhat unestable on Y-axis.

But since the thread is about YP-80 vs Me-262, I select the Me-262 because of firepower and strenght, most of the YP-80 I got was on frontal pass.

AKA_TAGERT
12-18-2005, 03:06 PM
Originally posted by BSS_CUDA:
heh sounds like they used the 109 FM http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif ROTFL!

BuzzU
12-18-2005, 03:28 PM
The P-80 won the war.

Or was it the P-51?

P-47?

I know it was one of those.

Willey
12-18-2005, 04:31 PM
C'mon, the P-80 has 287kg/m‚¬≤, but it turns like a Yak-3... http://home.arcor.de/eldur/smilies/hammer2.gif

Badsight.
12-18-2005, 08:30 PM
Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
accel~ not very slow, but most ppl keep the nose to high in the goth, too great AoA to get good accel from it
overheat~ no worse than any other jet, again, a case of not knowing powersettings and flying with too much AoA
climb~ not stellar, but actually not bad at all, once speed is achieved, and one keeps that nose down!
unstable gun plat. etc~ flown correctly, as a gun platform the goth is AMAZING! i agree 100% on the 229's handeling , but the speed of the Gotha is slowest of all the jets , as well as its climb

& yes because it picks speed up so slowly is a big deal to a Jet , Props dont have OH limitations on full power that the Jets do , & the Gotha HAS to be accellerated slowly or you get mas OH , & its climb is appaling untill you have loads of speed

yes i love the Mk-103 most of all compared to any other gun in FB . Period

its the only weapon that still enables me to make 1K hits - id take the slow ROF Mk-103 over any other weapon every time if i had the option , but even tho the gotha has these excellent weapons its not a good gun platform.

its totally fine in a full elevator turn where your slowly gaining angle on your bandit , but when you are trying to lead slightly or when your are manouvering around trying to pull a snap shot its rubbish , basically it wanders the nose around so easy - for standoff shooting its about the worst gun platform in the whole game

the P-80 is the most dominant Jet in the game

& BuzzU - very funny http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Gibbage1
12-18-2005, 10:04 PM
Originally posted by Kurfurst__:

kh-hmmm! *caugh* P-38 'late' *caugh-caugh*

Caugh - Go-229 - Caugh...

Hay Kurf. Still think the B-35 never existed?

hobnail
12-19-2005, 01:09 AM
YB, EB, XB or B?

Genie-
12-19-2005, 01:42 AM
well it would be an interesting match if YP-80 would be modeled in the game.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Kurfurst__
12-19-2005, 04:00 AM
Originally posted by Gibbage1:
Caugh - Go-229 - Caugh...?

Well that's your sh*t, too, you modelled it because you wanted an excuse to put another uberyank fighter in the game, from the '2beatalldaluftwaffa' series. So don't shovel your sh*t to my yard. I ain't touching that thing... flew like... once to see what's the cocpit like? LOL. Who needs jets when we have even a low-boosted 109K. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif


Hay Kurf. Still think the B-35 never existed?

I am quite sure. I cannot find any aircraft designated 'B-35' in USAAF service.

Jerry Baughter says : "None of the series production B-35A were ever built. "
Gee that sounds like it was a description for the the P-38 'late', too. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

http://home.att.net/~jbaugher2/b35.html

msalama
12-19-2005, 04:05 AM
The Sturmovik won the war.

luftluuver
12-19-2005, 04:19 AM
Originally posted by Kurfurst__:
So don't shovel your sh*t to my yard.

Be sure, there is no more room for your yard is already full and overflowing. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

John_Wayne_
12-19-2005, 04:26 AM
If that guy's a lawyer I really did win the war.

http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/research/bombers/b3-66.htm

http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/research/bombers/b3-67.htm

Hoarmurath
12-19-2005, 04:40 AM
Same discussion again?


Me 262 volume 4, by J.Richard Smith and Eddie J.Creek, Classic Publications, pg 855

On 17 May 1946, the last remaining flyable Me 262 at Wright Field, FE-4012, was flown to Patterson Field for comparison trials with the prototype Lockheed XP-80, prototype of America's first operationnal jet fighter, probably FE-111, by the Hugues Aircraft Corporation in Culver City. Eight trials were flown by the aircraft against the XP-80, carried out by Colonels Al Boyd and Hal Watson. The tests were to prove an eye opener for the later :
"There was no comparison as far as i'm concerned between the operationnal capability of the Me 262 and the P-80. There was nothing comparable with the Me 262 in Brittain or the US. It was another couple of years before the P-80 began to approach it."
When Boyd reported the results of these trials and the earlier ones with T2-711 (Fay's aircraft) to his superiors he was cautioned not to release his findings. The conclusions of the official report on the tests were also censored. They stated :
"Despite a difference in gross weight of nearly 2000 lbs (907 kg) the Me 262 T2-711 was superior to the average P-80A in acceleration, speed, and approximately the same in climb performance... The Me 262 apparently has a higher critical Mach number, from a drag standpoint, than any other current air force fighter."

After completion of the trials the aircraft was returned to the Hugues company for a more extensive refurbishment. It eventually emerged at the end of February 1948 with all structural gaps filled, the gun ports faired over and several coats of high gloss paint applied. Spurious German markings were applied and its earlier "FE" (Foreign Equipment) number replaced by T2-4012. The intention was to enter the aircraft in the Bendix Thompson Jet Trophy Races, in wich only Americans P-80 were due to compete but, as Watson was to record, this plan was stopped by General Arnold to prevent a potential - and predicted - source of embarrassment for the fledgling Air Force.

Kurfurst__
12-19-2005, 06:01 AM
Don't bother yourself with these facts Hoarmurath... the only thing some people interested in is how it should have been, not how it was.

BTW, I recall reading something from Chuck Yeager himself, afaik he was able to fly both the final P-80 and the Me 262, he said that there was not much to choose between the two, except the 262 having greater firepower. I trust him and your facts above anyone's opionion on a forum.. and I really wonder what weight the YP-80 is modelled at, it really feels as if it would have no weight at all, just thrust and aerodynamics in the FM.

Dunno, maybe Gibbage and co sell some BS to Oleg about the specs, like they did when they made up the P38 'late'. It's said that a few zealots can ruin the historical value of this simulation.