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View Full Version : is hawx will be another blazing angels



johna713
06-18-2008, 11:24 AM
i watched the videos, i listened to the interviews... i stopped and think

"is this game will end up like blazing angels"


as you watch the video people
did you all think that the game will end up like blazing angels?????



well people you tell me

RawKryptonite
06-18-2008, 11:37 AM
That's exactly what I'm thinking too.
I rented BA recently to get a feel for what this game will be like. I couldn't stand it, horrible gameplay and simply not fun.
I hope I'm wrong though.

PaganSilverwolf
06-18-2008, 12:44 PM
That has been my biggest fear since day one, Although knowing thr it is going to support the Ace Edge flightstick gives me some hope that the controls won't be as crappy. I am still waiting on the demo to see if this is going to be a game that I will buy.

guitarplaya350
06-20-2008, 08:19 AM
Tell u the truth, I thought blazing angels wasn't a bad game. Sure, it couldve been better, but it had great graphics and good displays. If this is going to be another blazing angels, it will easily be better because instead of using slow and un-manouverable prop planes u will use modern, fast, and manouverable jets. A game with jets will be better also because you have more dogfights and missles. If the game is a modern blazing angels, it should be good.

Tomcatter61
06-20-2008, 10:33 AM
Originally posted by guitarplaya350:
Tell u the truth, I thought blazing angels wasn't a bad game. Sure, it couldve been better, but it had great graphics and good displays. If this is going to be another blazing angels, it will easily be better because instead of using slow and un-manouverable prop planes u will use modern, fast, and manouverable jets. A game with jets will be better also because you have more dogfights and missles. If the game is a modern blazing angels, it should be good.

I agree that Blazing Angels was a good game - basic, and lots of fun to play, especially online with a good group of people. I prefer number 1 over number 2 for the most part - firstly, a better selection of aircraft (2 US planes in BA2? Come on, people!) and secondly, no queer "defensive weapons." I say if you're getting shot down, you take it like a man and die - none of this, "oh I threw out my engine-clogging smoke screen" or "ha ha, I used my magnetic pulse weapon to disable your flight controls" (which is completely stupid since there are exactly 0 (zero) electronic components in the cable and pulley flight controls on WWII prop aircraft).

I disagree that a jet game using the same format would be "better." I think the only reason BA works as well as it does, is because it's a WWII flying game with guns as the main weapon. You still have to close the distance and get into a pretty good position to get a shot. If you had missiles much of the range and aspect problems are solved - you don't have to maneuver for firing position as much. I think it would make the game too easy and it'd get old quick.

(Also, prop fighters are highly maneuverable relative to jets - jets have a speed advantage, but with speed comes increased turn radius. A WWII fighter could easily turn a circle inside a modern day jet fighter (excepting perhaps something with thrust vectoring - and even then, if the prop fighter threw some flaps out, it'd probably turn standing still relative to a jet). The Spitfire was designed to withstand a pull of 9G's, that's the same as an F-16. The Spit pulling 9G's at a speed much less than the F-16 would get a much tighter circle. I'm sure some prop fighters have roll rates to rival the more agile jet fighters, at least rolling in one direction due to the torque of a big prop on the front end.)

sniper_five
06-20-2008, 11:24 AM
posted by RawKryptonite:
That's exactly what I'm thinking too.
I rented BA recently to get a feel for what this game will be like. I couldn't stand it, horrible gameplay and simply not fun.
I hope I'm wrong though.

Ya, I broke out the Nintendo and played Top Gun so I too could get the feel for how this game will play. Come on people. There is no way IMO that you can compare BA to this. BA was WWII aircraft with limited speed and mobility. It was based on that era. This game will be based on aircraft from this era and in the near future. With that said, the flying capabilites will be greatly/vastly different from a prop plane vs a jet engine.

I don't know, maybe go play Asteroids or Galaga. That might also help you in your decision making process on how this game will be. There is a Space Shuttle landing sim at the science museum where I live that should aid me in the landing process as well. All this judging the perverbail book before opening the cover is getting ******ed.

I am sorry, I just can not for the life of me see how you can compare what you THINK this might be like to BA. Two totally different eras. It's like comparing COD4 all other COD's or Medal of honor games. O.k. so you want to compare it AC, well that sold over 10 million copies for the series. For all your negatives there is 10 positives, thats who they are marketing towards. Get over yourselves.

Oh and here is just one of many links detailing the number of copies sold.

http://www.thatvideogameblog.com/2008/04/21/ace-combat-...ion-sales-worldwide/ (http://www.thatvideogameblog.com/2008/04/21/ace-combat-series-surpasses-10-million-sales-worldwide/)

heres another one just for fun.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/ace-combat-series-sells-10m-worldwide

sniper_five
06-20-2008, 11:27 AM
Originally posted by sniper_five:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">posted by RawKryptonite:
That's exactly what I'm thinking too.
I rented BA recently to get a feel for what this game will be like. I couldn't stand it, horrible gameplay and simply not fun.
I hope I'm wrong though.

Ya, I broke out the Nintendo and played Top Gun so I too could get the feel for how this game will play. Come on people. There is no way IMO that you can compare BA to this. BA was WWII aircraft with limited speed and mobility. It was based on that era. This game will be based on aircraft from this era and in the near future. With that said, the flying capabilites will be greatly/vastly different from a prop plane vs a jet engine.

I don't know, maybe go play Asteroids or Galaga. That might also help you in your decision making process on how this game will be. There is a Space Shuttle landing sim at the science museum where I live that should aid me in the landing process as well. All this judging the perverbial book before opening the cover is getting ******ed.

I am sorry, I just can not for the life of me see how you can compare what you THINK this might be like to BA. Two totally different eras. It's like comparing COD4 all other COD's or Medal of honor games. O.k. so you want to compare it AC, well that sold over 10 million copies for the series. For all your negatives there is 10 positives, thats who they are marketing towards. Get over yourselves.

Oh and here is just one of many links detailing the number of copies sold.

http://www.thatvideogameblog.com/2008/04/21/ace-combat-...ion-sales-worldwide/ (http://www.thatvideogameblog.com/2008/04/21/ace-combat-series-surpasses-10-million-sales-worldwide/)

heres another one just for fun.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/ace-combat-series-sells-10m-worldwide </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

MPSSC
06-20-2008, 08:42 PM
until now,i can't find 'any' element that HAWX can be superior to AC,let alone totally transcending it.

people would play unrealistic air combat game already have a excellent choice:AC.they don't need to wait a clone because they can't be sure whether it is fun or not.(especially when this clone's demo looks worse than AC)

so who are the majority waiting for HAWX?apparently they are people care more about realistic settings(but hot totally hardcore).they can't put up with 100 missiles for a jet fighter,they can't tolerate the flight envelope doesn't match the real plane,they can't tolerate a missile can destory both air and ground target,etc.
and right now if they want to play a air combat game with more realistic elements and more next generation fighters,HAWX obviously is the 'only one' choicethat's who they have a lot of expectations about this game.

Mig-29
06-20-2008, 09:50 PM
Originally posted by MPSSC:
until now,i can't find 'any' element that HAWX can be superior to AC,let alone totally transcending it.

people would play unrealistic air combat game already have a excellent choice:AC.they don't need to wait a clone because they can't be sure whether it is fun or not.(especially when this clone's demo looks worse than AC)

so who are the majority waiting for HAWX?apparently they are people care more about realistic settings(but hot totally hardcore).they can't put up with 100 missiles for a jet fighter,they can't tolerate the flight envelope doesn't match the real plane,they can't tolerate a missile can destory both air and ground target,etc.
and right now if they want to play a air combat game with more realistic elements and more next generation fighters,HAWX obviously is the 'only one' choicethat's who they have a lot of expectations about this game.

There is no Ace combat for PC.
And what about Lo-Mac, thats for PC and that has been released.

MPSSC
06-20-2008, 11:20 PM
Originally posted by Mig-29:

There is no Ace combat for PC.
And what about Lo-Mac, thats for PC and that has been released.

more and more people get sick of upgrading their pc too often for new pc games.that's why
more and more people who really want to play new game purchase new platforms like XBOX360 or PS3.

and since there are already more than 10 millions XBOX360/PS3(but pc we aren't sure about how many players have the best PCs),pc market is less important compared to XBOX360/PS3.

and one more thing,most flight game really care about realistic elements are always pc games
(LO-MAC,Filght simulator,Falcon 4.0)but they didn't have PS2/XBOX versions,why??
because most people who would play flight games on TV GAME platforms are not hardcore flight game fans.they usually don't care about realistic elements,they just want to have fun.
that's why they usually don't want to purchase a joystick 'just' for a flight game,but most pc flight game fans would do.
(that's why OGF is a more realistic opinion for those players,but it is failed.)

therefore,for TV game players,they are already have AC serious,how HAWX guarantee that in can be better than AC??

you should say:
"there is no another OGF for PC"

LO-MAC?are there 'any' next generation fighters like F-22/Rafale/TYPHOON,or JAS-39 in this game???

Mig-29
06-21-2008, 09:01 AM
Originally posted by MPSSC:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Mig-29:

There is no Ace combat for PC.
And what about Lo-Mac, thats for PC and that has been released.

more and more people get sick of upgrading their pc too often for new pc games.that's why
more and more people who really want to play new game purchase new platforms like XBOX360 or PS3.

and since there are already more than 10 millions XBOX360/PS3(but pc we aren't sure about how many players have the best PCs),pc market is less important compared to XBOX360/PS3.

and one more thing,most flight game really care about realistic elements are always pc games
(LO-MAC,Filght simulator,Falcon 4.0)but they didn't have PS2/XBOX versions,why??
because most people who would play flight games on TV GAME platforms are not hardcore flight game fans.they usually don't care about realistic elements,they just want to have fun.
that's why they usually don't want to purchase a joystick 'just' for a flight game,but most pc flight game fans would do.
(that's why OGF is a more realistic opinion for those players,but it is failed.) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It might of occurred to you that some individuals such as me do not have any interest in consoles yet retain an interest in flight combat games such as ace combat that use arcadish mechanics. Just because ace combat-like games are arcadish, it should automatically be console only? The PC has no right to have any Arcadish games that resemble ace combat?

I don't get you.


Originally posted by MPSSC:
they usually don't care about realistic elements,they just want to have fun.
Are u saying that sims are not fun? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif


Originally posted by MPSSC:
you should say:
"there is no another OGF for PC"

Why would I say that, there is Lo-mac, falcon 4.0.


Originally posted by MPSSC:
therefore,for TV game players,they are already have AC serious,how HAWX guarantee that in can be better than AC??
You fail to take into account those who have PC like me. Its not only for consoles, even if it wont be better than ace combat at least it will be for pc.


Originally posted by MPSSC:
LO-MAC?are there 'any' next generation fighters like F-22/Rafale/TYPHOON,or JAS-39 in this game???
But it still is what you are looking for right?

MPSSC
06-21-2008, 09:38 AM
Originally posted by Mig-29:

It might of occurred to you that some individuals such as me do not have any interest in consoles yet retain an interest in flight combat games such as ace combat that use arcadish mechanics. Just because ace combat-like games are arcadish, it should automatically be console only? The PC has no right to have any Arcadish games that resemble ace combat?

I don't get you.


it is decided by the market.
there are already more than 10 million XBOX360/PS3 player,but they don't know how many pc players have the best pc right now.

so the choice is simple:the number of TV game players is large enough and ascertained,so game designers decided to meet most of their favor.but i think unless they can make it much better than AC,they won't wait HAWX,let alone expecting for it.

since most people who are really willing to play Arcadish flight games have already bought xbox360/PS3 and AC,pc Arcadish flight games players are much less.


Originally posted by Mig-29:
Are u saying that sims are not fun? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif


it depends.
if game designers can make a perfect balance between sim and arcade,of course sims can be fun.
but most of the games can't control the balance very well,and most AC players won't have patience learning complicated realistic systems and controls in the hardcore sim flight games.

that's why I say they don't care of realistic elements.


Originally posted by Mig-29:
Why would I say that, there is Lo-mac, falcon 4.0.

Lo-mac/Falcon4 have the fifth generation fighters like F-22/F-35/Ralafe in the game??and these fighters are flyable??


Originally posted by Mig-29:
You fail to take into account those who have PC like me. Its not only for consoles, even if it wont be better than ace combat at least it will be for pc.


market like you is relative small,sorry.
for pc player,players care about sims are more.


Originally posted by Mig-29:
But it still is what you are looking for right?

sorry,that's because this is 'the only' choice right now.

RawKryptonite
06-21-2008, 03:33 PM
Originally posted by sniper_five:

I am sorry, I just can not for the life of me see how you can compare what you THINK this might be like to BA. Two totally different eras.

Had nothing to do with the eras, it had to do with the gameplay, camera angles and out of body experience flying the plane. Felt like an r/c plane game, not a flight game. That's how I see HAWX, unless they give us the cockpit view with ability to look around and turn off assists.

Keplager
06-21-2008, 10:39 PM
sorry, in L0-MAC and Falcon 4.0 AF, there are no fifth generation planes because they are pure sims. Being a pure sim, they cannot correctly compile an accurate flight model of such planes as the F-22A, EF2K, Rafale, JAS-39A/C, because most of their systems and flight envelopes are still classified. If you start guessing at a plane, the game no longer becomes a sim, but instead a simulcade. that is a sim with a lot of realistic elements, but arcadish flight mechanics. E.G. OGF was a simulcade as LO-MAC is a proper sim.

Avto.C
06-22-2008, 05:59 AM
The game is made by the same studio, what do you think this is blazing angels with next-gen fighters.

sniper_five
06-23-2008, 12:00 PM
Originally posted by RawKryptonite:
Had nothing to do with the eras, it had to do with the gameplay, camera angles and out of body experience flying the plane. Felt like an r/c plane game, not a flight game. That's how I see HAWX, unless they give us the cockpit view with ability to look around and turn off assists.

Well I guess the way I viewed the video was such that the view can be altered while in flight. Depending on the view you had, it appeared the view was from the tail of the plane and the player was altering the view with his right analog stick or something to get a better idea as to wear things coming at him or things he was after were. A similar type look or view that could be accomplished in other game types similar to this.

I take nothing from the early release video's because I have yet to see a game's early video even remotely resemble the game at release. Even though this is actual gameplay, I am sure they intended the view to be such that you could see more than just a cockpit view.

Not sure how exited people would get about a game preview video by just have the straight foward cockpit view.

Mig-29
06-23-2008, 10:23 PM
Originally posted by MPSSC:
it is decided by the market.
there are already more than 10 million XBOX360/PS3 player,but they don't know how many pc players have the best pc right now.

so the choice is simple:the number of TV game players is large enough and ascertained,so game designers decided to meet most of their favor.but i think unless they can make it much better than AC,they won't wait HAWX,let alone expecting for it.

since most people who are really willing to play Arcadish flight games have already bought xbox360/PS3 and AC,pc Arcadish flight games players are much less.


But that doesn't mean that hawx cant attract an audience on pc. how can you be so sure that it wont. You need to be very convincing here.


Originally posted by MPSSC:
Lo-mac/Falcon4 have the fifth generation fighters like F-22/F-35/Ralafe in the game??and these fighters are flyable??


I still don't understand how you are using this as an excuse for hawx to be a sim. I can say the same about arcadish flight games that have been released for pc. blazing angels didn't have fifth generation fighters. crimson skies didn't have fifth generation fighters.

what about jetfighter 4 and 5? and what about total air war, and NovaLogic f-22 raptor and f-22 lighting III.


Originally posted by MPSSC:
market like you is relative small,sorry.
for pc player,players care about sims are more.


how can you be so sure. there are many arcadish games for pc that have been successful. are you that confident that the pc has completely sold itself off to sims? and why was blazing angels released for pc then.


Originally posted by MPSSC:
sorry,that's because this is 'the only' choice right now.

but it exists, its what you're looking for already and thats that. unless you're saying that the only reason why lo-mac hasn't satisfied you is because it doesn't have any fifth generation fighters i can again say that blazing angels doesn't have any fifth generation fighters also.

we can go and on. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

why are you so against arcade flight games for pc. i've compromised by saying that hawx should have certain elements of realism such as a not too exaggerated loudout and runway landings that require taxing, and that two seater lantirn idea for mp. Why Cant you take any of my needs into account. the best you can do is say "sorry your market is too small". Try to be a bit flexible.

MPSSC
06-24-2008, 07:03 AM
Originally posted by Mig-29:
But that doesn't mean that hawx cant attract an audience on pc. how can you be so sure that it wont. You need to be very convincing here.



it's not the question about whether HAWX can attract arcadish flight game players on pc.
the question is:how many arcadish flight game players on pc??how to estimate??can arcadish flight game players be as more as these on 360/ps3???


Originally posted by Mig-29:
I still don't understand how you are using this as an excuse for hawx to be a sim. I can say the same about arcadish flight games that have been released for pc. blazing angels didn't have fifth generation fighters. crimson skies didn't have fifth generation fighters.

what about jetfighter 4 and 5? and what about total air war, and NovaLogic f-22 raptor and f-22 lighting III.

how can you be so sure. there are many arcadish games for pc that have been successful. are you that confident that the pc has completely sold itself off to sims? and why was blazing angels released for pc then.


why i mentioned about the fifth gengeration fighters??because there 'no' sim flight game contains almost all of the fifth generation fighters around the world in it
(not only having these kinds,but also specific and correct flight model/cockpit/weapon data,etc.some of the data is not classfied,game designers can make the 'approximate' sim,no need to be very precisely.)
since there is no such a game,HAWX can be the 'only' choice.
(especially there are already too many arcadish games.)

you also wrong about two things:
1.why there is AC the only arcadish flight game title that can last right now??didn't it mean that others were not success??
2.total air war is arcadish game??I am not pretty sure about that you don't know about flight game.



Originally posted by Mig-29:


why are you so against arcade flight games for pc. i've compromised by saying that hawx should have certain elements of realism such as a not too exaggerated loudout and runway landings that require taxing, and that two seater lantirn idea for mp. Why Cant you take any of my needs into account. the best you can do is say "sorry your market is too small". Try to be a bit flexible.

you again mixed up my opinions.
(i doubt you did it on purpose.)
I didn't against arcade flight games for pc,I mentioned that just making a clone of AC won't guarantee the game be successful.

not too exaggerated loudout??'only' 20 missiles also means exaggeration.
a missile which can destory both ground and air target still means exaggeration.
why??
it's not challenging.you don't have to worry too much about running out your weapons when you are in hot zone.
(don't forget that you have wingmen,their planes also have 20 missiles~~~~~~)
and 20 missiles can be used for all targets,that means you don't need to worry about AA/AG weapon loadout balance.

since GRAW series still limits weapon capacities and capabilities,you still have to consider weapon balance that you carry.
but GRAW seies is still fun,isn't it?
why HAWX can't have such the setting?
I've already talked about this.

you can dream of playing another AC,that's your dream,not mine,nor others who wants more sim elements.

DarkzeroPrime
06-25-2008, 12:59 AM
Jane's USAF, a survey sim, had the F-22A. Too bad can no longer run that game on a modern OS without trouble.

GodsNightmare21
12-13-2008, 01:46 AM
Originally posted by MPSSC:
until now,i can't find 'any' element that HAWX can be superior to AC,let alone totally transcending it.

people would play unrealistic air combat game already have a excellent choice:AC.they don't need to wait a clone because they can't be sure whether it is fun or not.(especially when this clone's demo looks worse than AC)

so who are the majority waiting for HAWX?apparently they are people care more about realistic settings(but hot totally hardcore).they can't put up with 100 missiles for a jet fighter,they can't tolerate the flight envelope doesn't match the real plane,they can't tolerate a missile can destory both air and ground target,etc.
and right now if they want to play a air combat game with more realistic elements and more next generation fighters,HAWX obviously is the 'only one' choicethat's who they have a lot of expectations about this game.

HAWX will be better than AC Combat because its made by Tom Clancy and evrything by Tom Clancy is amazing. Honestly, people like you r really starting to **** me off. If you dont like the game,dont buy it and get on with your life. You dont need to go around informing others that the game sucks, and frankly, i highly dought that anyone here even cares about your opinion.

NmDSolitarioS
12-13-2008, 09:53 AM
I dont understand why people that enjoy more realistic flight sims cant enjoy this game too,they will after all have the cockpit view to use,loads of good grapichs,but they wont have limited weaponry and the other stuff.Other than that this game will be fun for arcade lovers and realistic flight sim lovers

Mig-29
12-13-2008, 01:40 PM
Originally posted by NmDSolitarioS:
I dont understand why people that enjoy more realistic flight sims cant enjoy this game too,they will after all have the cockpit view to use,loads of good grapichs,but they wont have limited weaponry and the other stuff.Other than that this game will be fun for arcade lovers and realistic flight sim lovers

I'm sure that there are people who enjoy real flight sims and enjoy simplified action oriented sims like Ace Combat.

They're both two different types of product.

Some people however think that just because it has Tom Clancy pasted on it, its needs to be realistic with all of the realistic values. To them its an abomination. They take it very personally. Its almost like a crime for them.

Others believe that this game is a failure because it is arcade like Ace Combat. They know that this game was designed as an arcade game from the start and they simply can't bear it. Its too much pain for them and it drives them crazy.

MrRandom004
12-13-2008, 02:18 PM
Originally posted by Mig-29:
Some people however think that just because it has Tom Clancy pasted on it, its needs to be realistic with all of the realistic values. To them its an abomination. They take it very personally. Its almost like a crime for them.

You have to remember that recently Tom Clancy games have had a decrease in the level of realism, so when EndWar and HAWX show up they (TC veterans) come to the conclusion that Ubisoft have reduced Tom Clancy's gaming to the sole purpose of money.
And while having Tom Clancy in the title does mean you have to meet certain obligations I personally think that since Tom Clancy has sold his name completely to Ubisoft and that this isn't an original Clancy franchise the developers can be more liberal with realism

NmDSolitarioS
12-13-2008, 02:37 PM
I have always been COD franchise fan,but now im looking into to have fun with flight sim games whether they are realistic or arcadish.Just ordered my self: Lock on:Modern combat and Falcon 4.0 from ebay,got them both for no more than 14$ including shipping,but I dont think that i will let go the oportunity to play HAWX when it comes out,I'm preordering it as a matter of fact.