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paulhager
08-27-2011, 05:09 AM
I’m in Patrol 2 of the USS Torsk (SS-423), a Tench class. Departing from Guam on 1 April 1945, I was a leisurely six day cruise from the ambush point for the TF centered on the IJN Battleship Yamato. (For some reason, RSRD delays the sinking of the Yamato by one day – the 8th instead of the 7th.)

In transit, radar picked up an approaching ship. It turned out to be a merchant. I decided to try out my twin deck guns. Each gun required a crew of 5 and I had a stable of excellent gunners available, including an officer with the “Tin Can Crossover” specialty. I submerged the boat so as to pop up without warning at 4,400 yards and commence the attack. At that range I managed at least 30% hits. When the return fire started to splash near by, I submerged the boat and closed in at 7 knots. The merchant had already sustained heavy damage and was traveling slow with a starboard list.

I surfaced again at 1,600 yards and resumed the attack. One of my first shots took out the merchant’s forward gun. Round after round struck the merchant, concentrating on the waterline. I don’t think there was a single miss. In a couple of minutes it was all over. A very impressive show.

This little engagement entailed less than an hour delay. By late on the 6th, I was in position. I spent all day of the 7th floating passively as the winds freshened and the sea became choppy. This would simplify the attack.

Radar contact was made at 0522 8 April. Two ships were ringed by eight escorts. I was positioned some distance southeast of the track. I went to flank and began plotting the target’s course and speed: it was 291° at 18 knots. My intent was to attack from between 5,600 and 5,400 yards off the track before the TF reached the shallows of a nearby island.

Enemy radar set off the detector – I went to 28’ (decks awash – mode 1). At this depth, the diesels can still breathe. The escorts chose this moment to explode outward from the Yamato (and it’s attending light cruiser) in expanded search patterns. The leader circled back and the gray ship sunk symbol appeared. It had been struck by the Yamato. Suddenly, the TF was down by one ship.


A radar solution gave 14,500 yards to the lead target, which I knew to be the Yamato. I was now cruising at 2 knots, depth 33’ (decks awash – mode 2). At this depth, I can always get off a contact report to HQ before attacking. (At 32’ or 33’ I can also make night surface attacks.)

By 0620 I was able to refine the radar solution with a visual one. Here is a shot of the tactical map.

http://i1084.photobucket.com/albums/j408/paulhager/01_04-08-45_0621_PM02.jpg


A minute later I was able to file a contact report. I immediately submerged, raised the night scope (even though it was close to sunrise) and the radar antenna.

At 0622, I got my response from HQ.

http://i1084.photobucket.com/albums/j408/paulhager/02_04-08-45_0622_PM02.jpg


I did one more quick tweak to the solution. The time was now 0623.

http://i1084.photobucket.com/albums/j408/paulhager/03_04-08-45_0623_PM02.jpg


All bow torpedoes were Mark 16s – I set to 30’ and impact.

One more minute and I fired the salvo, then ordered dive to 400’. There were no surprises. The sub crossed the thermal before the first torpedo hit – I secured from silent running and increased speed to 7 knots.

All six torpedoes hit. Following is a screen shot of the second hit.

http://i1084.photobucket.com/albums/j408/paulhager/04_04-08-45_0627_PM02.jpg


The gray sunk ship icon appeared when #4 hit.

No escorts pursued. By 0730 I had surfaced and was on my way to the Sea of Okhotsk and my initial objective.

I’ve reached the stage where the late war attack on the Yamato (with Mark 16s) is a mechanical exercise. Which is as it should be. Japan was beaten and its technology hadn’t appreciably advanced as the war progressed. The US, in contrast, was hitting its stride in both production and R&D.

This same attack on the Yamato is rather more challenging when undertaken with a mix of Mark 14s and Mark 18s. I’ve done it before successfully. The main difference is that one has to get in about 2,000 yards closer and empty both bow and stern tubes into her.

WernherVonTrapp
08-27-2011, 05:21 AM
Sinking the Yamato is like milking the cow
Psssst, http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif don't tell that to the cow.

http://i1045.photobucket.com/albums/b456/archangel501/SS%20Comps/precision.jpg
SUNK!
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

MWolfe1963
08-27-2011, 05:51 PM
Great report and attack Paul. Hadn't played in awhile and your reports always get my interest up to get back in the fight.

paulhager
08-27-2011, 11:20 PM
Originally posted by MWolfe1963:
Great report and attack Paul. Hadn't played in awhile and your reports always get my interest up to get back in the fight.

Thanks. Incidentally, I milked the cow a second time before heading back to base.

MWolfe1963
08-28-2011, 12:04 AM
Originally posted by paulhager:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MWolfe1963:
Great report and attack Paul. Hadn't played in awhile and your reports always get my interest up to get back in the fight.

Thanks. Incidentally, I milked the cow a second time before heading back to base. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Gotta milk it 3 times to really impress me.

WernherVonTrapp
08-28-2011, 05:16 AM
Originally posted by MWolfe1963:
Great report and attack Paul. Hadn't played in awhile and your reports always get my interest up to get back in the fight. Yes, I agree wholeheartedly. Though I can be quite the annoying jokester sometimes http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/halo.gif, well OK, maybe more than just sometimes, hmmmmmm, oh alrighthttp://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-ashamed005.gif , most of the time; hmmm, where was I? Oh yeah http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif, I do thoroughly enjoy your <STRIKE>debriefings</STRIKE>, stories. Wolferz would've made fun of me again if I didn't strike that out.http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-fc/whistling.gif

paulhager
08-28-2011, 06:24 AM
Originally posted by MWolfe1963:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by paulhager:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MWolfe1963:
Great report and attack Paul. Hadn't played in awhile and your reports always get my interest up to get back in the fight.

Thanks. Incidentally, I milked the cow a second time before heading back to base. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Gotta milk it 3 times to really impress me. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Fair enough. If I'd hung around the entrance to the Bungo Strait, another Yamato group would have materialized. I still had 6 Mark 16's remaining...piece of cake. It would have been rather like shooting the proverbial fish a barrel, though. One doesn't want to overmilk the cow... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

paulhager
08-28-2011, 03:50 PM
Addendum: I ended this career in Patrol 3. I had just completed an attack on a small Yamato TF (2 DDs, the Y, and the Agano), hitting the big boy with 4 Mark 16s and 2 Mark 18s. The latter were magnetic keel shots, the former impact at 30'. The Yamato was damaged (running on two props) and making about 10 knots afterwards.

I got away from the escorts and began my pursuit of the Yamato. While surfaced and running at 20 knots about 19,000 yards away, it disappeared from the screen. I was frustrated enough by this I just deleted all the saves.

Of course, I could have hit the Yamato with 6 Mark 16s for a guaranteed kill but I thought I'd try to conserve torpedoes. It was a real pain in the tuchis.

For the record, other than the idiotic erasure of the Yamato while I was closing in for the coup, I enjoyed playing the Tench, especially using the twin deck guns on merchants.

MWolfe1963
08-28-2011, 05:42 PM
Yea, it should be easilty done with M16's. I was going for four Y's and was down to 4 M16's. Wasn't using any saves and trying to score 300K in one patrol, so I sunk a carrier instead of 4th Y and took out 13 merchants with the dg and 40 bofars, still didn't break 300K, sure someone has, but it eludes me.

Those M16's are rather a cheat, but I do take a entire load when they become available.

paulhager
08-28-2011, 06:00 PM
Originally posted by MWolfe1963:
Yea, it should be easilty done with M16's. I was going for four Y's and was down to 4 M16's. Wasn't using any saves and trying to score 300K in one patrol, so I sunk a carrier instead of 4th Y and took out 13 merchants with the dg and 40 bofars, still didn't break 300K, sure someone has, but it eludes me.

Those M16's are rather a cheat, but I do take a entire load when they become available.

Well, if you use a Tench and a full load of Mark 16s, you'll have 28. That's plenty of margin for 4 in one patrol. A Yamato TF seems to spawn every night starting sometime in late April of '45 coming out of the Bungo.

If one used salvos of 5, was very accurate and, further, if slightly more than 1/2 the time 5 was sufficient to get a kill, there's an outside chance of getting 5 Yamatos with a Tench. That's got to be the limit, though.

MWolfe1963
08-31-2011, 11:53 AM
Yea, one mistake lurker made with RSRD with the late war Yamato, it respawns every 24 hours, but only supposed to spawn once, but I long corrected that.

I think four would be the limit if you tried. I would've went for 4, but had a few misses, that's the problem, you can't miss with one torp or maybe one miss in all your attacks.

The only time I think you can go for 4 Yamato's would be leyte, in fact you would have 8 chances to attack it if you stayed at Brunei Oct-Nov 44.

I'm sure several have had a 300K patrol, done a lot before mods, not sure lately, so far out of my reach.

I think with 16's, DG and two bofars it could be done, just take some time picking larger ships. I think I could've done it that patrol, but I sunk too many smaller merchants with the surface guns duing the surface attack during the storm.

400K...impossible

cgkstealth
08-31-2011, 12:17 PM
Originally posted by MWolfe1963:
400K...impossible

Not with sub-nuclear DG shells http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif


... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Playing the game realistically though I have to agree it would be impossible.

green_abobo
09-03-2011, 01:29 AM
mark 14s seem to run about 10' deeper than you actually set them.

so for that yamato (aka congo look alike) i set them to run about 26 feet, which equals the 36' you need to hit just under the keel w/ the magnetic pistol setting.

mark 10s and 18s..not too familiar w/ them, how do they run as opposed to what you actually set them to?

what you do dive deep and run fast to get passed the escort/cruiser screens that usually surround it? its always protected by something it seems.

the most ive hit one w/ were 4, always from the bow.

i can never seem to set up a stern shot by the time the escorts are looking for me, so theres no way i can get back up to periscope depth to try and unload them too before its out of range.

edit=


Originally posted by paulhager:
A Mark 14 running deep happens when you select high speed. (This presumes dud torpedoes is selected.) I haven't seen torpedoes run deep on low speed. Dud rates are high before August or September of 1943, especially at the high speed setting. Although it may be ahistorical, I ALWAYS use the low speed setting for the Mark 14 precisely to minimize the dud rate. My experience is that at low speed the dud rate is probably between 67% and 75%. At high speed it is significantly worse.

"pnwdom" is essentially correct - you need to position the sub so as to fire salvos simultaneously from bow and stern. I don't use parallel - it's usually between 20 and 30 degrees off parallel. I often approach at 120 degree relative and then turn. Recall that I almost always make a report to HQ before attacking. Approaching so as to minimize the visual/radar cross section is key. It is rare that I am unable to report. Actually, it's more a matter that if I don't get the icon at a certain point (which depends on the environmentals) I dive. I doubt it happens more that 5% of the time, probably less.

i usually use an okane style attack (i prefer to shoot as close to 90 degrees AOB as possible) so i dont have to mess around w/ the stupid stadiometer.

so if i plan to use both bow and stern tubes for one target (like it sounds as if i must do) i should position my boat in a more horizontal (270,90, relative to the contact) position? my boat therefore should be running on a parallel course as the target correct?

generally speaking, what is the AOB in that set up? i know it depends on if its presenting the port or the starboard side, but what angle should i use exactly?

i guess im just having trouble visualizing what the intercept plot on that sort of set up would look like.

also in general, i just started playing again after a long liberty pass.

playing stock, 1.5 gold SH4. before i get too involved in another campaign that will produce more bad saves than good, i have just been doing war patrols and quick missions.

not only do you get to practice firing on convoys and warships, (more than just the sitting duck single merchants) but it also forces you to use a wider variety of fleet boats, each w/ their own different torpedo configurations.

basically, i'm used to the mark 14's. i know how to set the depth on those. as i said, i usually set them 10' past the draft of the ship (according to the recognition manual) for magnetic shots. that usually is fairly accurate.

my question is how deep should i set the depth on the other torp. types (like the mark 10's, 16's, and 18's) compared to the draft of whatever it is i intend to fire at?

i know the mark 14's can be set to slow or fast, and other types like the mark 10 can only be set @ slow.

thanks.

pnwdom
09-03-2011, 08:18 AM
If you position yourself parallel to the Yamato (Bearing 270 or 90) you can fire both the bow and stern tubes without having to reposition the boat.

paulhager
09-03-2011, 02:54 PM
A Mark 14 running deep happens when you select high speed. (This presumes dud torpedoes is selected.) I haven't seen torpedoes run deep on low speed. Dud rates are high before August or September of 1943, especially at the high speed setting. Although it may be ahistorical, I ALWAYS use the low speed setting for the Mark 14 precisely to minimize the dud rate. My experience is that at low speed the dud rate is probably between 67% and 75%. At high speed it is significantly worse.

"pnwdom" is essentially correct - you need to position the sub so as to fire salvos simultaneously from bow and stern. I don't use parallel - it's usually between 20 and 30 degrees off parallel. I often approach at 120 degree relative and then turn. Recall that I almost always make a report to HQ before attacking. Approaching so as to minimize the visual/radar cross section is key. It is rare that I am unable to report. Actually, it's more a matter that if I don't get the icon at a certain point (which depends on the environmentals) I dive. I doubt it happens more that 5% of the time, probably less.