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ElAurens
05-25-2009, 02:42 PM
Currently I am running a ViewSonic G90f 19" CRT.

Great colors, fast response times, 85hz refresh rate. You know the drill for CRTs.

I am thinking about an LCD for a couple reasons.

A. Most new games support wide screen, and should look and play great on them.

B. LCDs should be easier on my eyes, which are getting a bit on the old side if you know what I mean.

So...

'46 does not support wide screens. How is it going to look on one?

LCDs require Vsync to be turned on, thus limiting frame rates to monitor refresh rate. I'm used to getting 80 to 120+ fps, is 60fps going to be a killer for me playing online in regards to gunnery?

I know about the need for a fast response time spec on LCDs. Are the numbers given by manufacturers trust worthy? The last thing I want is the ghosting I've seen on some LCDs.

Looking at a Samsung SW2333 soon. Has good online reviews. Is it ok for gaming?

Sorry about the thousand question routine, but I am out of my depth when it comes to LCD monitors, and don't want to waste my hard earned dollars on something that won't work well.

Thanks.

VMF-214_HaVoK
05-25-2009, 03:00 PM
I totally recommend moving to a wide screen LCD and Samsung is a excellent choice. I own a Samsung 20" wide screen and love it. Had it for several years now and still going strong.

With a little tweaking IL2 looks magnificent on a wide screen LCD. I use the config.ini tweak and the widescreen mod. There is also a new tool out called San's_IL2FOV which works wonders.

I use vertical sync and personally would not have it any other way. I used it even when I had a CRT. In my opinion its a must if you care about quality. Turning Tripple Buffering on helps out with performance. If your rig is averaging 50fps+ or so then 60fps cap is plenty and is actually what todays games are built to operate at.

So IMHO I would definitely go with the Samsung and make the leap to eye candy bliss! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

S!

eindecker
05-25-2009, 03:05 PM
Originally posted by ElAurens:
Currently I am running a ViewSonic G90f 19" CRT.

Great colors, fast response times, 85hz refresh rate. You know the drill for CRTs.

I am thinking about an LCD for a couple reasons.

A. Most new games support wide screen, and should look and play great on them.

B. LCDs should be easier on my eyes, which are getting a bit on the old side if you know what I mean.

So...

'46 does not support wide screens. How is it going to look on one?

LCDs require Vsync to be turned on, thus limiting frame rates to monitor refresh rate. I'm used to getting 80 to 120+ fps, is 60fps going to be a killer for me playing online in regards to gunnery?

I know about the need for a fast response time spec on LCDs. Are the numbers given by manufacturers trust worthy? The last thing I want is the ghosting I've seen on some LCDs.

Looking at a Samsung SW2333 soon. Has good online reviews. Is it ok for gaming?

Sorry about the thousand question routine, but I am out of my depth when it comes to LCD monitors, and don't want to waste my hard earned dollars on something that won't work well.

Thanks.

LCD monitors do not require Vsync.
I like the large widescreen monitors from HP.
HP W2558hc is an excellent 25.5" widescreen 1920x1200 res
monitor for under US $500.
Samsung monitors are also excellent.

Samsung is releasing a new generation of LED TV's and monitors.
Yes, LED not LCD. They are all things
better than both LED and Plasma.
I saw LED TV recently at Best Buy. This will change EVERYTHING.
But for the moment LED will do everything better than any old CRT.
Oh and YES, 1946 can be made to force the widescreen issue, it works fine!

Eindecker

Pyrres
05-25-2009, 03:05 PM
Well every game that I have plays nicely with my 22" AG Neovo, 32" HD Ready Mirai, and 37" Full HD Panasonic. No tearing and my eyes can rest after looking at CRT at work. Response times are 3-5ms. And if possible try to get to see the display before buying. There are some better and some worse LCD makers in the market, If I were you IŽd thrust the ones with good reputation between gamers. But still, if possible, look for yourself and thrust your eyes.

Sillius_Sodus
05-25-2009, 03:21 PM
I have a 22" Samsung 2253BW, 2ms response time and 8000:1 dynamic contrast ratio and I am very happy with it.

Ba5tard5word
05-25-2009, 03:25 PM
I have a Samsung SyncMaster 204BW (20"), I got it for free with my old computer. It's been pretty good so far.

a)Il-2 does work with widescreen monitors, in that at least for me the screen is displayed as a proper rectangle at 1650 x 1050. I know there's some argument with some games with whether widescreen is properly supported but I've never understood it and never seen a problem with those games.

b) you can turn vsync off in most games, but then you get tearing so I generally leave it on, 60fps is fine with me.

c) Flatscreen monitors do help with an issue many people have with eyestrain from the refresh rates of CRT monitors--you don't get the flickering that you might catch out of the corner of your eyes with a CRT. However they do put out a lot of light and I find that an LCD causes me eye strain after not very long--my right eye starts to ache and get blurry. I got glare screens for my monitors and the problem went away, and it makes the screen a lot clearer and crisper and improves the contrast between different things on the screen, it's like bumping up the resolution a bunch. They're expensive though.

Lurch1962
05-25-2009, 04:05 PM
The thing to bear in mind regarding widescreen operation with IL-2 is that the FOV is always based on the horizontal dimension of the display. Even after tweaking conf.ini so as to fill the full screen (no black bars at the left/right sides), for any FOV setting in-game, a widescreen display will result in loss of field along both the top and bottom edges.

This should make sense, as you're chopping a 4:3 (i.e., 12:9) aspect ratio to get 16:9. Personally, I do find this a bit of a disadvantage, and in no small way has this made me reluctant to get a widescreen dsplay. For more docile flying this is no problem whatsoever. But in combat, a large vertical field angle is just as important as the horizontal because of the common situation of chasing a bandit when you have your lift vector pointing toward him.

The loss of vertical FOV can be compensated for with a mod that allows to set a larger value than the currently widest FOV of 90 degrees. Moreover, with head tracking (which I do use), a smaller vertical view angle is easily overcome with a little more head motion.

VMF-214_HaVoK
05-25-2009, 04:12 PM
The thing to bear in mind regarding widescreen operation with IL-2 is that the FOV is always based on the horizontal dimension of the display. Even after tweaking conf.ini so as to fill the full screen (no black bars at the left/right sides), for any FOV setting in-game, a widescreen display will result in loss of field along both the top and bottom edges.

San's_IL2FOV http://forums.ubi.com/eve/foru...9310655/m/4991066657 (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/49310655/m/4991066657)

S!

P.FunkAdelic
05-25-2009, 04:56 PM
Originally posted by ElAurens: I'm used to getting 80 to 120+ fps, is 60fps going to be a killer for me playing online in regards to gunnery?
It shouldn't be a problem sinec A as someone else said you aren't necessarily limited to 60 FPS, and B the human eye cannot perceive more than 33 frames per second I believe so anything after that is just candy. :P

EDIT. Or maybe not.
http://forums.overclockers.com...wthread.php?t=207135 (http://forums.overclockers.com.au/showthread.php?t=207135)

I guess we can see more than 33, but 60 is still good and you just have to choose between the tearing or the stable 60.

eindecker
05-25-2009, 05:07 PM
Originally posted by P.FunkAdelic:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ElAurens: I'm used to getting 80 to 120+ fps, is 60fps going to be a killer for me playing online in regards to gunnery?
It shouldn't be a problem sinec A as someone else said you aren't necessarily limited to 60 FPS, and B the human eye cannot perceive more than 33 frames per second I believe so anything after that is just candy. :P

EDIT. Or maybe not.
http://forums.overclockers.com...wthread.php?t=207135 (http://forums.overclockers.com.au/showthread.php?t=207135)

I guess we can see more than 33, but 60 is still good and you just have to choose between the tearing or the stable 60. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That varys person to person, I can "see" over 40 fps and still see steps.

Eindecker

WTE_Galway
05-25-2009, 05:26 PM
Originally posted by Lurch1962:

The loss of vertical FOV can be compensated for with a mod that allows to set a larger value than the currently widest FOV of 90 degrees.



Interesting.

I had a friend that was world class on Quake servers a few years back and he used a 360 degree FOV. It looked like a fishbowl and made most people feel like throwing up but he completely owned when using it.

Mods like this could give you a substantial edge if used correctly.

VW-IceFire
05-25-2009, 05:46 PM
Originally posted by ElAurens:
Currently I am running a ViewSonic G90f 19" CRT.

Great colors, fast response times, 85hz refresh rate. You know the drill for CRTs.

I am thinking about an LCD for a couple reasons.

A. Most new games support wide screen, and should look and play great on them.

B. LCDs should be easier on my eyes, which are getting a bit on the old side if you know what I mean.

So...

'46 does not support wide screens. How is it going to look on one?

Not official support but its easy enough to make changes to the config.ini to make it look just fine!



LCDs require Vsync to be turned on, thus limiting frame rates to monitor refresh rate. I'm used to getting 80 to 120+ fps, is 60fps going to be a killer for me playing online in regards to gunnery?

Not sure where you heard that. VSYNC on or off...it works. Recently I've turned it on and focused on maintaining 60fps as much as possible rather than getting super high fps rates.



I know about the need for a fast response time spec on LCDs. Are the numbers given by manufacturers trust worthy? The last thing I want is the ghosting I've seen on some LCDs.

Sometimes you have to read the reviews. Most screens are now 2ms grey to grey...usually its a good idea to try and find out what the white to black rating is and see how quick that is. A screen can be made to be fast grey to grey and still be slow in more radical changes. That said...most good quality LCD's don't have the same sort of ghosting problem of 6-7 years ago.



Looking at a Samsung SW2333 soon. Has good online reviews. Is it ok for gaming?

A brief glance at the specs and it looks good. Read the reviews...try and find a few reviews that are gaming or video oriented.



Sorry about the thousand question routine, but I am out of my depth when it comes to LCD monitors, and don't want to waste my hard earned dollars on something that won't work well.

Thanks.
Always good to ask informed questions. Its clear you've been reading and you've asked some great questions. Good luck with the purchase!

striker-85
05-25-2009, 06:07 PM
Originally posted by WTE_Galway:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Lurch1962:

The loss of vertical FOV can be compensated for with a mod that allows to set a larger value than the currently widest FOV of 90 degrees.



Mods like this could give you a substantial edge if used correctly. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Probably referring to this: http://forums.ubi.com/eve/foru...9310655/m/4991066657 (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/49310655/m/4991066657)

ElAurens
05-25-2009, 06:36 PM
Well, I went to Best Buy and pestered a salesman for about 40 minutes.

I just saved myself a lot of money.

Not one LCD I saw holds a candle to my CRT. Not one. And the salesman, who is a gamer himself, said as much.

The colors are washed out, the blacks aren't black at all, and they all lack a fineness of acuity, that's the only word I have for it.

This was actually fairly disappointing, but my eyes are not lying to me. I wish I could bring two or three home and try them in my space, as that would be the real test. But with what I saw this evening, I'm not very impressed.

*SIGH*

Being a Luddite is a hard row to hoe.

P.FunkAdelic
05-25-2009, 06:38 PM
Originally posted by eindecker:

That varys person to person, I can "see" over 40 fps and still see steps.

Eindecker
Well now that I learned something new and have been doing some reading it seems we're capable of over 200 FPS. The reason films could render at 24 fps and seem smooth is because of the motion blur caught in the frame while computers render perfect images which don't blur so in order to absorb a perfect seamless frame transition we need more of them. So the 24 fps is really an illusion because it creates the blur we'd associate with higher FPS.

Here's a great link explaining it.
http://amo.net/NT/02-21-01FPS.html

It gets into cones and rods in our eyes and how they pick up light and colour wavelengths. I already knew that part a bit actually, reading about special forces missions and one guy saying that you look at things with your peripheral vision at night to get better night vision because the rods focused on your periphery are more light sensitive.

Amazing what you learn when someone asks a simple question like 'help me buy an LCD monitor'. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

EDIT:

Not one LCD I saw holds a candle to my CRT. Not one. And the salesman, who is a gamer himself, said as much.

The colors are washed out, the blacks aren't black at all, and they all lack a fineness of acuity, that's the only word I have for it.

This was actually fairly disappointing, but my eyes are not lying to me. I wish I could bring two or three home and try them in my space, as that would be the real test. But with what I saw this evening, I'm not very impressed.

Its a fact that you will not find LCDs with as good colour reproduction as CRTs for any price below probably $600 at least. Thats a reality. You can get excellent colour reproduction without the washing out if you wanna drop the cash.

Link: http://www.pchardwarehelp.com/.../lcd-panel-types.php (http://www.pchardwarehelp.com/guides/lcd-panel-types.php)

That said, you also cant trust the look of them in the store 100%. Most monitors come from the manufacturer with a blue bias. They need to be calibrated and if you pick a popular and quality one then you can easily google around to find some good colour profiles.

Do some research, read reviews, google the crap out of a few brands and models. Fact is you can't trust the sales people in electronics stores because they don't know jack most of the time. They're jsut people hired to push product and most of them don't know the nitty gritty details a good consumer does. You sound like you found a nice one but still, the end users are the ones to ask about this stuff.

Its hard work being a good consumer, but if you research then you can find a good LCD that will be enough to keep your eyes happy. It is true that they aren't perfect but a decent colour profile on a decent LCD can be great. I have a Samsung T220HD. Its a TN panel so not necessarily the best but it has relative to TNs a very good colour representation if you calibrate it and the default profiles even have a pretty good one. Don't give up yet. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Urufu_Shinjiro
05-25-2009, 06:59 PM
Originally posted by ElAurens:
Well, I went to Best Buy and pestered a salesman for about 40 minutes.

I just saved myself a lot of money.

Not one LCD I saw holds a candle to my CRT. Not one. And the salesman, who is a gamer himself, said as much.

The colors are washed out, the blacks aren't black at all, and they all lack a fineness of acuity, that's the only word I have for it.

This was actually fairly disappointing, but my eyes are not lying to me. I wish I could bring two or three home and try them in my space, as that would be the real test. But with what I saw this evening, I'm not very impressed.

*SIGH*

Being a Luddite is a hard row to hoe.

Looking in the store is not always the best test. Most stores that have multiple monitors on display will split a VGA (analog) signal on a splitter to all the monitors so you can really be seeing a bad source signal, digital will be better and anything that is split too many times looks like poo. Also any monitor will need some adjusting of contrast, brightness, color etc. If your really looking to get something that comes close to a CRT then you need to ignore all the thousands of LCDs with TN panels and look for a S-PVA panel. They can be more expensive but th3e viewing angle and color reproduction are far superior to TN.

Research: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TFT_LCD

Stiletto-
05-25-2009, 11:11 PM
I just bought a 52" LCD, a very high end model btw and besides watching HD Movies with it, I am also going to hook up my PC to it. If you are planning on getting a new tv soon this might be a viable and cost effective option, not that you have to get something as big as 52", you could get something smaller that easily moves to your "flght sim" area.

I currently have a 24" widescreen HP A7217A CRT, and it still looks magnificent in games, though I will be retiring it for the HDTV. If a high quality LCD is out of your price range there are some excellent deals around to be had on the later gen CRT's. I think I paid less than 300 dollars for my 24" CRT 4 years ago.

RAF_OldBuzzard
05-26-2009, 01:56 AM
@ElAurens

I know what you mean. That is why I'm still using a Sony FW900 24"WS CRT. They CAN still he had, but they aren't cheap, and they take up a LOT of room on your desk. They are also HEAVY at 98 lbs.

You can find one here:
http://www.accurateit.com/home.asp

I have one of the "Grade B" ones, and other than a scuff or two on the enclosure it's perfect. I don't care about them, as the screen is perfect and that all I look at anyway.

You can get a 'perfect' one for $999.00, but the "Grade B" one at $399.00 was good enough for me.

I have yet to see ANY LCD at ANY size or PRICE that I'd trade my FW900 for.

http://www.accurateit.com/pricelist.asp

I've done business with AccurateIT, and they are a good reputable company. Since I live close to Columus, I went there and picked mine up rather than having it shipped. I've been in their warehouse, watched their techs at work, and they are a class organization.

BillSwagger
05-26-2009, 02:00 AM
on the topic of monitors, im using a driver that allows for the adjustment of contrast/color/measure/ and gamma.

The gamma has the option of being split into red, green, and blue settings.
Anyway, i recommend lowering the blue gamma which gives the game a slight yellow hue. You might adjust the green or red if looks too green or red. It seems to bring out the natural sunlight in the game.

Its very subtle but it really makes the colors in the game seem less cartoony and more lifelike.

You can try it with the monitor you have now. Might take a few tries to adjust it if it looks too green or the hue is too heavy.



In regards to your question on frame rates, anything above 50fps is good. 60fps would be fine and not effect your gunnery as much as ping might playing online.

RickRuski
05-26-2009, 04:14 AM
I have a Samsung 931BW 19" wide screen with 2ms response G2G and am delighted with it, don't know where you heard that vert/sync must be "on". I certainly run mine "off", no need to have it on unless you are getting "tearing". As billswagger says a lot of monitors have adjustments for Contrast etc. My colour is rich with good blacks and whites and no ghosting. Certainly if you run the highest resolution that your monitor will handle this will affect your frame rates some, but most monitors will have a range of resolutions you can try.

Gadje
05-26-2009, 06:10 AM
Originally posted by ElAurens:
Not one LCD I saw holds a candle to my CRT. Not one. And the salesman, who is a gamer himself, said as much.

The colors are washed out, the blacks aren't black at all, and they all lack a fineness of acuity, that's the only word I have for it.



I just changed from the same 6 year old CRT as yours to a 24'' LCD.
Regarding colour its down to the type of panel. The normal fast TN panels used by gamers are a bit washed out normally. Better colour comes from IPS and M/PVA panels but most have bad ghosting as response time isn't good enough for fast action games. But you can find them, mine, an about to be discontinued BenQ ,has no ghosting is a fast S-PVA panel and once the brightness was reduced to 30ish (default way bright) the CRT just doesn't compare. The LCD just blows it away. Blacks are deep, its viewable from side angles(not that it matters)and colours are rich. My M8's TN panel looks washed out in comparison.

But these things don't really matter that much in a fighthttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif. What does is visibility and the CRT was easier to spot targets with. I used a res of 1024x768, my LCD can do this res but it looks best at 1920x1200 and dots are very small. But I'm getting better at spotting them and the game looks bloody brilliant!.
You would be looking at TN panels which usually need set up brightness and colour wise to look best and most shops don't bother.
If colour definition is truly important, get one of the fast IPS, MVA, PVA types I mentioned. They are more expensive but I got mine at TN prices by shopping around.

The Viewsonic is staying in the attic. I returned one LCD I bought 1-2 years ago which wasn't as good as the Viewsonic but this flatscreen is so-so much better I couldn't go back (and not just because My lower back couldn't take the strain.....that crt is HEAVY!. .)

ps another feature I wanted was 1:1 pixel mapping so I could run it at 4:3 at 1600x1200 but it looks so good in WS I didn't bother. I didnt find any drawback with losing a bit of vertical height but I use Trackir so thats maybe why.

Bearcat99
05-26-2009, 08:04 AM
Originally posted by ElAurens:
Well, I went to Best Buy and pestered a salesman for about 40 minutes.
I just saved myself a lot of money.
Not one LCD I saw holds a candle to my CRT. Not one. And the salesman, who is a gamer himself, said as much.
The colors are washed out, the blacks aren't black at all, and they all lack a fineness of acuity, that's the only word I have for it.
This was actually fairly disappointing, but my eyes are not lying to me. I wish I could bring two or three home and try them in my space, as that would be the real test. But with what I saw this evening, I'm not very impressed.
*SIGH*
Being a Luddite is a hard row to hoe.

Like Urufu said.... the in store displays are not the best. It would appear you have changed your mind.. but you should reconsider. IMO an LCD is much easier on the eyes and the electric bill.. not to mention desk real estate.. and whatever trade offs there are in color etc... A)Can be adjusted using various software to get a better look and B)Given the other benefits will be barely noticeable once you get the monitor home and hooked up to YOUR pc.. regardless to how it looks in the store. I suggest that you:

* Not get anything under 24"
* Get something with a high contrast ratio (most lcds out now.. even the cheaper ones are at least 1000:1)
* Get something with a low response time (most lcds out now, even the cheaper ones have response times of 6 or less).

The prices have come down considerably, and while Samsung makes a good product.. my 24"Acer X241W that I got on sale @2 years ago for $300 is still looking very good. Very good. So is the 22"Sceptre monitor I got for my wife on Black Friday last year for $119 @ Microcenter.

I suggest that you buy one.. take it home and try it for a week.. most stores have a 14 day return policy... stay within that frame... You can get a decent lcd monitor that is 22-28" $200-$660.

Running 46 without any additional settings or tweaks other than the config file will cost you some slight viewing space as some of the pics indicate.. but A)There are fixes for that now available and B)If you use a TIR even that will not be a major issue as your head should be constantly moving anyway.

My 2 cents...

For me getting an LCD was a great move.

R_Target
05-26-2009, 08:26 AM
Originally posted by ElAurens:
Well, I went to Best Buy and pestered a salesman for about 40 minutes.

I just saved myself a lot of money.

Not one LCD I saw holds a candle to my CRT. Not one. And the salesman, who is a gamer himself, said as much.

The colors are washed out, the blacks aren't black at all, and they all lack a fineness of acuity, that's the only word I have for it.

This was actually fairly disappointing, but my eyes are not lying to me. I wish I could bring two or three home and try them in my space, as that would be the real test. But with what I saw this evening, I'm not very impressed.

*SIGH*

Being a Luddite is a hard row to hoe.

I was right there with you last year. You can't tell anything in the store though; you have to get it home and set it up. Once I got mine reasonably calibrated, I put away my LaCie 22" Electron Blue and my Mitsubishi Diamondtron 22" and haven't messed with them since. Most of what you see at BB are TN panels, so you'll get a fast response time but so-so color and terrible viewing angle. The better panel types are usually only found online or at retailers in large cities.

One thing that I rarely see people talk about is the poor quality backlighting on cheaper LCDs. All seem to have a dark to light vertical gradient and/or bright corners. I have a 22" Samsung 2232bw+ that I took back to BB four times until I got one that I could deal with; I also have an HP w2207 that I returned twice.

The low refresh rate is not so bad with triple buffering enabled, but it can't compare to an 85Hz CRT.

Supposedly they're coming out with better LED style backlighting and higher refresh rates this year (some TVs already have 120Hz), but they will be pricey, be sure.

ElAurens
05-26-2009, 10:48 AM
I've been pouring over specifications and the stuff the manufacturers put out never tells what the panel technology is. (TN, PVA, etc...)

I have no clue what models to even look for.

I don't have time or impetus to do several installs/returns either. Why is this so hard?

Isn't there a simple list of good monitors out there somewhere?

What a minefield.

p-11.cAce
05-26-2009, 11:11 AM
I've been playing on a 32" Ilo for three years and really have no complaints. Many of the issues that ppl bring up regarding tearing, response rates, and color depth are problems that have not really existed since 2007 or so.

Ba5tard5word
05-26-2009, 11:41 AM
Do you have any friends/relatives with a flatscreen that you could check out?

I do think a CRT is better for low resolutions like 800 x 600, but an LCD is good at higher resolutions.

If you have a nice CRT and are happy with it, maybe just stick with it. CRT's are heavy and LCD's are cheap these days so I'm happy to use an LCD, again mine was free though.

Worf101
05-26-2009, 11:59 AM
I just upgraded to a DELL 2709WFP 27" LCD flat Panel Monitor. Took me a while to get the color, "as I like it" but it's big and fast and I can see things on it (like enemy planes at a distance) that I couldn't see before. I got it as an open box on the bay and couldn't be happier.

Da Worfster

TheFamilyMan
05-26-2009, 12:26 PM
Here's some cnet review info (http://reviews.cnet.com/computer-monitors-projectors/?sa=1000036&filter=500140_16795949_&tag=mncol;dir2) that may be helpful. Just remember that finding the absolute 'best' can drive one crazy. Some compromises can be made and over time they will probably not really matter. Good Luck, S!

BTW over 3 years ago my first LCD (19" Samsung) barely survived its first week without being returned, but now I think it's fine.

triad773
05-26-2009, 12:57 PM
Hi El- I can understand why you have such a discriminating eye since you mentioned your profession in another thread. Yeah I consider going LCD like going from LPs to CDs- it's a change that one can get used to over time (now the CD technology has advanced enough to fill in some of the richness that was originally missing from earlier generations).

From an eye problem that developed last year I now have to use a 32" LCD as a monitor for work. Since I work at home now it doubles as my IL-2 monitor. But, if I could have forstalled the demise of my 19" Komodo CRT, I might have waited as long as I could when OLED technology is supposed to supplant LCD, and Plasma technology. Organic Light Emitting Diodes have rich blacks as well as vivid colours, and require no back lighting like with LCDs. This decreases heat and energy use through use of the more efficient technology.

But money's not what is used to be so if you don't like what's out there you can only benefit from waiting http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Cheers

Triad

Choctaw111
05-26-2009, 03:39 PM
Wide screen is very good. Once to get a decent one you will be very pleased.

ElAurens
05-26-2009, 03:53 PM
Wow.

I am actually overwhelmed at all the responses.

Thank you all very much for your input.

Triad, I did look at some LED HDTVs for a grin and they are very good looking, but I think they need some dev time for monitor duty. At typical monitor viewing distances they definitely had a "screen door" effect(matrix lines plainly visible). The colors were really good though. While there is nothing wrong with my CRT, I am starting to experience some eye strain. (Getting old is no fun, well sometimes anyway). I'm going t try to hold out a bit longer and see what new developments are on the near horizon.

Still a year from SOW:BoB, so I suppose I can wait a bit more.

And thanks again to all of you.

I know we don't always agree on things, but it's nice to see so many helpful replys in spite of it all.

S!

Urufu_Shinjiro
05-26-2009, 04:30 PM
I totally agree that it is ridiculously hard to find out what type of panel is in a given model of LCD monitor. I just googled a lot until I found what I was looking for and a great deal to boot. Holding off may be a good idea if you can but eye strain is nothing to laugh at either. OLED looks good but there is also SED (http://www.oled-display.net/canon-still-working-on-sed-tv-filed-two-new-patents), which is basically the same concept as CRT where electons are shot at a phospor to emit light, except it's on a nano scale with multiple electron emiters per each pixel. They will have the same small size as LCDs but will use less eneregy and have the amazing display abilities of CRT. And since each pixel is individually addressable there will be no scanning issues and over 200hz refresh rates. Supposedly these will be on the same price level as current LCDs.

Ba5tard5word
05-26-2009, 05:06 PM
While there is nothing wrong with my CRT, I am starting to experience some eye strain.

Again, get a glare screen for it if you don't have one, it should help and will improve the image quality.

WhiteKnight77
05-26-2009, 05:52 PM
I recently picked up the ASUS VK222H 22" LCD Monitor (http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=9075671&type=product&id=1218016141003) just recently and it is great. Colors look good and even when a game is running at 20FPS (FS9 or FSX), one does not notice a thing. Ghost Recon runs at a steady 60FPS with everything on high and no flutter. I tried the UT3 demo that came with my PC and got 200+FPS (dunno why as everything else gets 60 or less. The FEAR 2 demo ran at around 35 and suffered no jittering either.

There are even 3 ways to connect to it, D-Sub, DVI and HDMI.

Bearcat99
05-26-2009, 06:49 PM
Originally posted by R_Target:
One thing that I rarely see people talk about is the poor quality backlighting on cheaper LCDs. All seem to have a dark to light vertical gradient and/or bright corners. I have a 22" Samsung 2232bw+ that I took back to BB four times until I got one that I could deal with; I also have an HP w2207 that I returned twice.

The low refresh rate is not so bad with triple buffering enabled, but it can't compare to an 85Hz CRT.

Supposedly they're coming out with better LED style backlighting and higher refresh rates this year (some TVs already have 120Hz), but they will be pricey, be sure.

Yeah... see this thread from a while back.. (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/3771059314?r=3771059314#3771059314) (I think that was Feb of 08..)

OLEDs will do to LCDs what LCDs did to CRTs.. I feel your frustration El.. and maybe because my eyes are starting ( http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif) to show some sings of middle age.. I dont see what you see.. but for me after coming from a 19"Samsung Synchmaster, which wasnt a bad monitor... I prefer the Acer LCD ... it is clearer... bigger.. brighter... and just plain better. I look forward to the OLED stuff.... that is probably why the prices on the LCDs are dropping so ........

Gadje
05-28-2009, 05:03 AM
Good Monitor info sites


<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre"> www.prad.de/en/monitore/reviews.html (http://www.prad.de/en/monitore/reviews.html) </pre>
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre"> www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews.htm (http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews.htm) </pre>
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre"> http://www.digitalversus.com/article-357.html </pre>
<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre"> http://www.hardforum.com/forum...10f37a1e4c6535c&f=78 (http://www.hardforum.com/forumdisplay.php?s=b3d3f4c92eac2d47710f37a1e4c6535 c&f=78) </pre>