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View Full Version : Possible breakthrough on wobble issue...



VW-IceFire
11-05-2005, 01:02 PM

VW-IceFire
11-05-2005, 01:02 PM

HeinzBar
11-05-2005, 01:15 PM
S!,
I have to give full credit to Oldman for discovering this little trick. Oldman removed his 'il2_corep4.dll and discovered that the wobbling ceased for him. I followed the same procedure and I have seen a dramatic change in the FM. While I still have some wobble, it's not extreme, nor do I believe it to be out of line like the excessive yawing/counter-yawing I was experiencing prior to corep4.dll removal.

HB


Oh, I defragged after removing the .ddl too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

danjama
11-05-2005, 01:17 PM
Well the poll isnt conclusive so far, but this may be going somewhere. Great idea http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

FluffyBunnies
11-05-2005, 01:19 PM
Heinz...how's the bears in your yard... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

One question from an ex squad m8 to you, do you mean totally remove the il2_corep4.dll without replacing it?

Curtiss_P-6E
11-05-2005, 01:24 PM
I have this one only;

- Tap lightly the rudder and the aircraft will sway back and forth for 3-4 seconds again varrying by about 20-30 degrees

I have a Dell
DIMENSION DIMXPS
P4 - 2.80 GHz
1G Ram
Windows XP
ATI 9800 Video

HeinzBar
11-05-2005, 01:39 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FluffyBunnies:
Heinz...how's the bears in your yard... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

One question from an ex squad m8 to you, do you mean totally remove the il2_corep4.dll without replacing it? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

S!,
We just had our yearly hunt. The bears are just fine http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Now, if I could just keep the deer from bounding out in front of me while I'm driving.... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

What I did was to follow Oldman's suggestion. I back upped my il2_coreP4.dll to a 'junk folder'. I then completely deleted the il2_coreP4.dll from the PF directory. I wouldn't do this if you're running an Intel chip. I had nothing to lose by removing it since I'm using an ATI chip.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted from the 4.02m patch readme:
If you have a computer with a Pentium 4 processor, you may occasionally encounter game lock-ups or crashes to desktop. In order to solve that, copy your il2_core.dll into the il2_corep4.dll (for example, with the following command: "copy il2_core.dll il2_corep4.dll"; or, in Windows Explorer, navigate to your sim installation directory, delete the existing il2_corep4.dll, make a copy of the il2_core.dll, and rename the copy to il2_corep4.dll) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This .dll maybe the trouble for some, like myself, but it may not be a complete cure for others. At least, it's another option for those w/ the wobbles. I don't understand how this .dll would cause such problems, but there is definitely a huge change in the pitch/yaw wobble for me.

Sincerely,
HB

Retrofish
11-05-2005, 01:40 PM
Couldn't this easily be confirmed by recording a test track ( a TRK not ntrk) and play it back with and without the P4 core file?

Edit: erm I mean if in doubt...yeah that's what I meant

Curtiss_P-6E
11-05-2005, 01:51 PM
I have a P4 Processor. If I delete P4core, PF will not load or run. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

neural_dream
11-05-2005, 02:13 PM
D@mn, i just bought GT legends. Couldn't you find that a little l8r http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif?

I renamed the il2_corep4.dll and (i'm sorry for that) reset the stick settings to the default ones before giving it a try.

I only flew a '43 Corsair and the F4U1c and they were both gr8 (all stick default: 10 20 ...), both dogfighting and ground attack. It seems to me that the wobble-free FM of 4.02 makes sense. Before i wasn't sure.

I have an AMD and a "twisted" http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif Evo.

TX-EcoDragon
11-05-2005, 02:33 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Curtiss_P-6E:
I have a P4 Processor. If I delete P4core, PF will not load or run. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Or you could do what it says to do in the 4.02 Readme:

". . .copy your il2_core.dll into the il2_corep4.dll (for example, with the following command: "copy il2_core.dll il2_corep4.dll"; or, in Windows Explorer, navigate to your sim installation directory, delete the existing il2_corep4.dll, make a copy of the il2_core.dll, and rename the copy to il2_corep4.dll)"

carguy_
11-05-2005, 02:44 PM
Drastic change in handling after removal of IL2corep4 file.


AMD CPU.

Stability is better than in 4.01 now,great job guys! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

neural_dream
11-05-2005, 03:15 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by carguy_:
...Stability is better than in 4.01 now,great job guys... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Either that or we learned some new skills this week http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif
http://www.pacpubserver.com/new/enter/images/rodeo-bullride.jpg
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif
As for the developers

http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:s1VvyJqHz4AJ:http://iarinha.com/images/Sleeping%2520figure%2520Kathy.png

Chuck_Older
11-05-2005, 03:23 PM
Glad some folks have solved this

Heinz, I included the info about defrag in my own poll because that's *all* I did to prepare for 4.02 and I had nothing out of the ordinary concerning wobble. So excuse me for trying to help out your sorry *ss. Not too many other people were, but I tried. So shame on me. Kinda odd that you weren't able to solve it on your own, seeing as you're so smart though, huh?

Go read the *whole* thread in which I mention defrag again, assuming you're capable, because you sure's hell didn't bother to read it before.

Feathered_IV
11-05-2005, 03:52 PM
Interesting. At the same time 4.02 came out I swapped my .dll's for the ones that Bearcat was offering up for test. I do not have the wobble issue, only a 10-15 degree swing when I use the rudder that lasts no more than 2-3 seconds.

Curtiss_P-6E
11-05-2005, 04:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TX-EcoDragon:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Curtiss_P-6E:
I have a P4 Processor. If I delete P4core, PF will not load or run. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Or you could do what it says to do in the 4.02 Readme:

". . .copy your il2_core.dll into the il2_corep4.dll (for example, with the following command: "copy il2_core.dll il2_corep4.dll"; or, in Windows Explorer, navigate to your sim installation directory, delete the existing il2_corep4.dll, make a copy of the il2_core.dll, and rename the copy to il2_corep4.dll)" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I missed that in the read-me.

I will give it a try

Curtiss_P-6E
11-05-2005, 04:39 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
Interesting. At the same time 4.02 came out I swapped my .dll's for the ones that Bearcat was offering up for test. I do not have the wobble issue, only a 10-15 degree swing when I use the rudder that lasts no more than 2-3 seconds. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is the wobble.

SnailRunner
11-05-2005, 05:11 PM
I owe you a beer....not gone, but GREATLY reduced..this is a darn nice find..

AMD user here

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gifhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

VW-IceFire
11-05-2005, 05:40 PM
Please note folks that all aircraft in the game will wobble regardless...what were talking about is excessive uncontrollable wobble/nose bobbing.

There is a pattern to the stats there...I think we may have a few people who think they have wobble and don't and that may explain it.

We'll see if, as more people post their responses, we see a trend emerge. Its far to early to say...ideally a sample size of 1000 is best http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

p1ngu666
11-05-2005, 05:47 PM
gonna remove it right now http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Curtiss_P-6E
11-05-2005, 06:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TX-EcoDragon:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Curtiss_P-6E:
I have a P4 Processor. If I delete P4core, PF will not load or run. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Or you could do what it says to do in the 4.02 Readme:

". . .copy your il2_core.dll into the il2_corep4.dll (for example, with the following command: "copy il2_core.dll il2_corep4.dll"; or, in Windows Explorer, navigate to your sim installation directory, delete the existing il2_corep4.dll, make a copy of the il2_core.dll, and rename the copy to il2_corep4.dll)" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Just did that and nothing different.

Thanks for the try though!!

HeinzBar
11-05-2005, 06:23 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
Glad some folks have solved this

Heinz, I included the info about defrag in my own poll because that's *all* I did to prepare for 4.02 and I had nothing out of the ordinary concerning wobble. So excuse me for trying to help out your sorry *ss. Not too many other people were, but I tried. So shame on me. Kinda odd that you weren't able to solve it on your own, seeing as you're so smart though, huh?

Go read the *whole* thread in which I mention defrag again, assuming you're capable, because you sure's hell didn't bother to read it before. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Chuck,
Take a friggin chill pill man. The defrag comment wasn't for your sorry *ss, it was meant as a joke since the discussion got outta hand. Your silly little poll wasn't the first discussion about defraggin, DA. Your suggestions did not help one bit, it was Oldman's find that solved the problem for me, and possible others. So don't think you helped in anyway especially with that piss poor attitude of your's. Perhaps, you should use some of your own advice and read what others posted before yourself, ie Billfish.

HB

T_O_A_D
11-05-2005, 06:33 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I have this one only; and the file fix made it go away.

- Tap lightly the rudder and the aircraft will sway back and forth for 3-4 seconds again varrying by about 20-30 degrees </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

2.4 P4 800 HT
1 gig 3200 Corsair
Asus P4P800 deluxe mobo
Ati 9800 pro
Audigy 2

OldMan____
11-05-2005, 06:48 PM
Just be careful people. Don´t know if it wil sove problems of all. Don ´t think is a nice Idea to remove the dll if you are using a P4.. but anyone that wants to try...

Lets just all calm down and not be overconfident. Each one does its test and see what happens. But make backup copy of the dll please.

OldMan____
11-05-2005, 06:50 PM
BTW.. is athlon processor please state if it is a 32 bit one or 64 bit (since the 64 and FX one may be recognized as P4 by several common tests used to check this kind of stuff (but I don´t know how is done in PF)

neural_dream
11-05-2005, 06:59 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by OldMan____:
BTW.. is athlon processor please state if it is a 32 bit one or 64 bit (since the 64 and FX one may be recognized as P4 by several common tests used to check this kind of stuff (but I don´t know how is done in PF) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I thought about that one, but mine is a 32 AMD.

Kuna15
11-05-2005, 07:08 PM
When I right click on "My Computer" it says AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 3200+.

Now as far as wobble thing goes without track we can know nothing for sure.

btw IceFire do you still have wobbles?
Please look at my F4U track (.nrtk) and say do you think I have wobbles or not. Everyone is welcome to comment it.

wobbletest_feat_F4U (http://free-vk.t-com.hr/domagoj/tracks/402wobbletest02_feat_F4U.rar)

neural_dream
11-05-2005, 07:20 PM
Kuna, didn't deleting the file work for you http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif? It should.

Kuna15
11-05-2005, 07:47 PM
Here is another one.

wobbletest_feat_p51d (http://free-vk.t-com.hr/domagoj/tracks/402wobbletest03_feat_p51.rar)

Also worth to see.

Small note;
I tried to use rudder as soft as possible applying it hard only for snap shot when in close range.
My joystick settings:

[rts_joystick]
X=0 1 4 9 16 25 36 49 64 81 100 0
Y=0 1 4 9 16 25 36 49 64 81 100 0
Z=0 10 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100
RZ=0 10 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100 0
FF=0
U=0 10 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100 0
V=0 10 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100 0

1X=0 54 60 68 75 80 85 90 94 96 100 30
1Y=0 54 64 71 76 80 84 88 91 94 100 30
1Z=0 1 4 9 16 25 36 49 64 81 100 0
1RZ=0 56 63 68 74 78 84 89 94 97 100 30
1RX=0 1 4 9 16 25 36 49 64 81 100 0
1V=0 1 4 9 16 25 36 49 64 81 100 0

ps. I would really like to see any other P-51 or F4U "turkey shot" tracks, something similar to tracks I posted above.

Feathered_IV
11-05-2005, 08:19 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">quote:
Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
Interesting. At the same time 4.02 came out I swapped my .dll's for the ones that Bearcat was offering up for test. I do not have the wobble issue, only a 10-15 degree swing when I use the rudder that lasts no more than 2-3 seconds.


That is the wobble. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


I don't believe so. The symptoms described by other usere are much, much worse than that. This feels like the kind of swing/yaw effect that one would expect.

han freak solo
11-05-2005, 09:45 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Kuna15:
When I right click on "My Computer" it says AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 3200+.

Now as far as wobble thing goes without track we can know nothing for sure.

btw IceFire do you still have wobbles?
Please look at my F4U track (.nrtk) and say do you think I have wobbles or not. Everyone is welcome to comment it.

wobbletest_feat_F4U (http://free-vk.t-com.hr/domagoj/tracks/402wobbletest02_feat_F4U.rar) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Kuna, I watched your track and compared to my game, all else being equal, you have some wobbles going on there that I don't. Your track started off in a "zoom in" view that made the wobbles very noticeable. I normally don't aim zoomed in that close, so any sway I get is not as pronounced. Visually, that is.

I just tried the dll swap-a-roo as sugested here and it didn't change anything on my rig. This isn't gloating, just a fact for the troubleshooting record.

Chuck_Older
11-05-2005, 11:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HeinzBar:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
Glad some folks have solved this

Heinz, I included the info about defrag in my own poll because that's *all* I did to prepare for 4.02 and I had nothing out of the ordinary concerning wobble. So excuse me for trying to help out your sorry *ss. Not too many other people were, but I tried. So shame on me. Kinda odd that you weren't able to solve it on your own, seeing as you're so smart though, huh?

Go read the *whole* thread in which I mention defrag again, assuming you're capable, because you sure's hell didn't bother to read it before. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Chuck,
Take a friggin chill pill man. The defrag comment wasn't for your sorry *ss, it was meant as a joke since the discussion got outta hand. Your silly little poll wasn't the first discussion about defraggin, DA. Your suggestions did not help one bit, it was Oldman's find that solved the problem for me, and possible others. So don't think you helped in anyway especially with that piss poor attitude of your's. Perhaps, you should use some of your own advice and read what others posted before yourself, ie Billfish.

HB </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif Save your breath, your opinion doesn't interest me. Take your petulant whine to PM, I trust you don't need help to do that, too

SnailRunner
11-06-2005, 01:21 AM
before i had wobble like a car with bad suspension...after the dll fix 80% is gone...

BTW i have a amd 64

sean_penns_ass
11-06-2005, 04:41 AM
I thought 4.01 was more wobblier than 4.02 to be honest but after flying some lately and browsing the forum I noticed that my plane had a constant rudder input. I looked at my joystick sets in the game and the red and green squares were off by at least a square for the rudder. I could not seem to calibrate it out - in windows or within the game. My joystic is a pretty old Microsoft FB Sidewinder and its showing its age so maybe its simply down to that. Anyways.. I removed the aforementioned .ddl file talked about and now all seems to be fine with the joystick. I only suspected I had the wobble problem when my gunnery has been pretty bad lately and from reading the vine. Tend to just compensate most other times when flying but as I said i thought 4.01 was wobblier than the current and I am no expert on these things. I don't know whether to believe having that offset in the rudder would be enough to throw me off or if taking that file out did some other things. Early days but it looks promising.

Thanks for this tip on the .dll patch by the way

jugent
11-06-2005, 06:20 AM
I took away the il2_corep4.dll and after a while my game frooze so badly that I have to hit the reboot-button.
This happends when I look-back-* and the sound seems to sample in an infinit loop.

Jaras
11-06-2005, 06:24 AM
Another placebo.
I've removed that P4 dll.
There's no change at all.
I have AMD CPU.

I've watched this track http://free-vk.t-com.hr/domagoj/tracks/402wobbletest02_feat_F4U.rar
That's exactly what I have. Because of that my aiming is like of some drunken bastard. I think it is time to reinstall the game back to 4.01m

Maybe most of you call 4.02m flight model realistic. I never flew a WW2 plane, and never will.
I just don't like it the way it is now, it's unplayable for me.

chaikanut
11-06-2005, 06:50 AM
Wow, what can I say! I run an AMD 64 and though it wasnt unplayable previously, it is now much steadier at coordinated flight. Thanks to whoever came up with this, I wonder how many other ''issues'' are similar to this http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif Also, for how long has this been with us?

Grey_Mouser67
11-06-2005, 07:00 AM
So far, I haven't seen a 4.02 track of an aircraft that didn't wobble...the wobble is so pronounced that I can see planes online wobbling through the sky at times.

I think some folks are tolerant of it...some aren't. Anyone considered the possiblity that the aircraft are wobbling like Oleg programmed them to? Maybe all this hub bub is just a difference in opinion and taste in flight models?

Kuna15
11-06-2005, 07:53 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Grey_Mouser67:
So far, I haven't seen a 4.02 track of an aircraft that didn't wobble...the wobble is so pronounced that I can see planes online wobbling through the sky at times.

I think some folks are tolerant of it...some aren't. Anyone considered the possiblity that the aircraft are wobbling like Oleg programmed them to? Maybe all this hub bub is just a difference in opinion and taste in flight models? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I just want to point out that after several days of serious investigating the "wobbling" issue I have not seen any user serious enough to post a track of non "wobbling" aircraft behaviour.

And I wont be seeing it since we all share exactly same flight model http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif. If anyone care to say I am wrong and that he/she has somehow 'cured' FB of "wobble" issue please, please post a track. Please say: "This was before and this is current "wobble" free FB state."

Otherwise any further talk about issue is just wasting of time http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif.

ps. I am not on either side; neither on those who said they have wobbles neither on those who said that they don't have wobbles, simply because except for a few community members no one cared that much about issue to even post a track.

Archangel2980
11-06-2005, 07:54 AM
I have a P4 I'm afraid to mess around with that.

p1ngu666
11-06-2005, 08:08 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Archangel2980:
I have a P4 I'm afraid to mess around with that. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

if u have a AMD processor, goto your IL2/FB folder, find "il2_coreP4.dll", select it and rightclick &gt; cut, then make a new folder called wobblefix, and paste the file in there. this has reduced the wobble for alot of people...

for P4, do the same, THEN find "il2_core.dll" copy and paste it (in the same folder, it will be called copy of il2_core.dll or similer) and rename it il2_coreP4.dll.

maybe that description will help u, maybe it wont..

Kuna15
11-06-2005, 08:19 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Curtiss_P-6E:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
Interesting. At the same time 4.02 came out I swapped my .dll's for the ones that Bearcat was offering up for test. I do not have the wobble issue, only a 10-15 degree swing when I use the rudder that lasts no more than 2-3 seconds. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


That is the wobble. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


I don't believe so. The symptoms described by other usere are much, much worse than that. This feels like the kind of swing/yaw effect that one would expect. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You see that is the big problem by itself. Someone says I have this and this and you picture the problem in your head like all community members. But who really knows what he/she ment?

Seeing a track + posting joystick settings will be definite proof.

OldMan____
11-06-2005, 08:35 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Kuna15:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Grey_Mouser67:
So far, I haven't seen a 4.02 track of an aircraft that didn't wobble...the wobble is so pronounced that I can see planes online wobbling through the sky at times.

I think some folks are tolerant of it...some aren't. Anyone considered the possiblity that the aircraft are wobbling like Oleg programmed them to? Maybe all this hub bub is just a difference in opinion and taste in flight models? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I just want to point out that after several days of serious investigating the "wobbling" issue I have not seen any user serious enough to post a track of non "wobbling" aircraft behaviour.

And I wont be seeing it since we all share exactly same flight model http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif. If anyone care to say I am wrong and that he/she has somehow 'cured' FB of "wobble" issue please, please post a track. Please say: "This was before and this is current "wobble" free FB state."

Otherwise any further talk about issue is just wasting of time http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif.

ps. I am not on either side; neither on those who said they have wobbles neither on those who said that they don't have wobbles, simply because except for a few community members no one cared that much about issue to even post a track. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you care to read all threds you will see there are several problems around. I serached for a cure to a problem other than the wooble. The FAKE input (or physics bahaving like there was that fake input), where your controls receive fake HUGE input even when you are doing nothing, even without joystick.

Some people are having different kind of problems. The wooble gone with this dll thing was a SIDE effect that some here experienced. Wanna try, do it, daon´t anna try.. don´t do it.

I myself don ´t beleive a track recorded in one PC will behave exactly same in other... so I don ´t think a track is a proof.

han freak solo
11-06-2005, 08:36 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Kuna15:
I just want to point out that after several days of serious investigating the "wobbling" issue I have not seen any user serious enough to post a track of non "wobbling" aircraft behaviour. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I was going to post this last night, but I thought a better "pilot" would beat me to it.

This is what I consider not wobbling. If I'm wrong, so be it. Do not mistake my poor "piloting" skills for a wobble. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif P-51 wobble? (http://www.lssdigital.com/P-51%204.02m%20test%20track.ntrk)

P.S. here's my stick and pedals settings:
1X=0 3 8 15 23 32 41 52 65 81 100 60
1Y=0 3 8 15 23 32 41 52 65 81 100 60
1RZ=0 0 2 5 7 14 28 42 65 85 100 60

EDIT: After playing the track back, I noticed that there is no representation of me using the rudder. I specifically used this P-51 because of the ball on the gunsight. It plays like I don't have pedals. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif Why would the game and the track play back show two different representations?

neural_dream
11-06-2005, 08:55 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by han freak solo:
This is what I consider not wobbling. If I'm wrong, so be it. Do not mistake my poor "piloting" skills for a wobble. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif P-51 wobble? (http://www.lssdigital.com/P-51%204.02m%20test%20track.ntrk) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I think that's fine or at least that's what I have now that I deleted the file and reset the stick settings to default (unfortunately i did both at the same time and don't know which one did it; i assume the first one). Before it was what Lebillfish described but not as extreme.

PBNA-Boosher
11-06-2005, 08:57 AM
A VERY noticable improvement in handling for me. I have not tested combat and guns yet, but I assume they'll be steadier as well.

Before this I didn't even know I had wobbling. But after, OMG it's really improved.

lowfighter
11-06-2005, 08:59 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by OldMan____:
The FAKE input (or physics bahaving like there was that fake input), where your controls receive fake HUGE input even when you are doing nothing, even without joystick.

/QUOTE]

Yes Oldman you put the finger on it.
And thanks for your finding, replacing that dll seems to have solved me too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Kuna15
11-06-2005, 09:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by OldMan____:
I myself don ´t beleive a track recorded in one PC will behave exactly same in other... so I don ´t think a track is a proof. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Generally I agree with you but offline -- .nrtk is a quite hard proof IMO. Because it will handle on all computers the same way, unlike .trk files. That is why I specifically said .nrtk.
And if user gets huge control inputs even if he/she dows not apply it that should be on track as well. Of course we can not see what user actually is doing with controller, unless he/she told us so.

PF_Coastie
11-06-2005, 10:15 AM
If you guys will notice something else also.

In Kuna's test, he is trying to line up behind SLOW bombers in an aircraft that is meant to fly at much higher speeds. Of course the P51 is going to be less stable at those speeds and this is a result of the new FM.

In Hans test, he is making full power on passes at the bombers which is more to the P51's liking. Therefore, you see less yaw. I would say that if you BnZ those bombers making very high speed passes, it would be even more stable. So, These 2 tracks both show nothing extreme. Only some changes(that make sense) to the FM.

That said, I am not saying that some do not have an extreme problem. Some may have some strange glitch. However, the visual evidence here with the tracks tells a much different story.

PF_Coastie
11-06-2005, 10:20 AM
One other thing, If anyone can show a track of a P51 trying to line up behind slow bombers in zoom view that do not have this Yaw affect. Please post it here or PM me and I will give you my email address and I will post it for you.

I bet I dont get any emails or PM's! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

Kuna15
11-06-2005, 10:37 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PF_Coastie:
If you guys will notice something else also.

In Kuna's test, he is trying to line up behind SLOW bombers in an aircraft that is meant to fly at much higher speeds. Of course the P51 is going to be less stable at those speeds and this is a result of the new FM.

In Hans test, he is making full power on passes at the bombers which is more to the P51's liking. Therefore, you see less yaw. I would say that if you BnZ those bombers making very high speed passes, it would be even more stable. So, These 2 tracks both show nothing extreme. Only some changes(that make sense) to the FM.

That said, I am not saying that some do not have an extreme problem. Some may have some strange glitch. However, the visual evidence here with the tracks tells a much different story. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Agree 100%.
My track is not about flying I am trying to show other users how the P-51 (rudder) handles on my FB version 402. You are absolutely right that is 100% wrong way of flying the Mustang. Track is intended for comparison only.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PF_Coastie:
One other thing, If anyone can show a track of a P51 trying to line up behind slow bombers in zoom view that do not have this Yaw affect. Please post it here or PM me and I will give you my email address and I will post it for you.

I bet I dont get any emails or PM's! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I invite everyone with different experiences to please PM and send me a track I will (like PF_Coastie) host it for them and post a link in thread, so we can finally see what is the problem. Please send offline .nrtk's only.

ps. my F4U and P-51D tracks are the new FM not the "wobble" bug.

Antonios
11-06-2005, 12:37 PM
I have an AMD64 3000+ and was experiencing this terrible swaying of the aircraft with or without rudder input, either soft or hard pulling and with ease or instant recentering of inputs.
Had tried reinstalling in evey order imaginable and d/l all the patches from every server available...
So far deleting this "gore" dll has brought my inputs to acceptable reactions again!
Thanks to the guy who brought it up and shame to the devs who kept silent as a fish although Mr Maddox and staff will always have my greatest respect for making the Game of the games!!!

NorrisMcWhirter
11-06-2005, 12:46 PM
AMD here. Moved P4 dll and game loads but no difference noted.

Ta,
Norris

bluesman69uk
11-06-2005, 01:06 PM
Tried deleting the P4core file too.

NO LUCK http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

I have a AMD set up. I am sure we will get this sorted out!

Maybe in the next patch http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

Cheers

Blues http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

HeinzBar
11-06-2005, 03:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chuck_Older:
Take your petulant whine to PM, I trust you don't need help to do that, too </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Whoa, that means alot to me coming from someone who started slinging the BS because he didn't understand post and now doesn't have the guts to admit it. Take a look at my post DA. No where in it did it mention your name or anything you posted. You read into the post what you wanted. You have a very high opinion of yourself if you can gather what I originally posted was meant for you. Knowing after the short time you've been in this forum, and from your previous posts, you're not the type to admit being wrong, nor can I expect an apology in public. However, as you posted, a private apology will suffice to save you face.

HB

neural_dream
11-06-2005, 04:14 PM
http://www.dvdg.nl/images/films%202005/strange2.jpg



Gentlemen,

you can't fight in here!

This is the Wobble Room!

Curtiss_P-6E
11-06-2005, 04:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">han freak solo </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

****Edited***

Disregard the following. I just watched one of my tracks and noticed that the track will not recognize the "ball".


I watched your video and it looks good.....however, I also noticed that you dont use rudder in your turns...or at least you do not use enough rudder to make a coordinated turn. When you make a turn, use the rudder to keep the "ball" centered in the turn and bank indicator. Try this and you just might get a little more wobble. Then again, you might not. Anyhow, give it a try and repost the video.

Curtiss_P-6E
11-06-2005, 04:35 PM
Here is my track. Notice that I am not hard on the rudder. This is fine unless you get into a dogfight or try to line up on a straffing run, or spray a bomber from wingtip to wing tip (just for fun). Also I am not using tailwheel lock. I try to keep the "ball" centered at all times which means using the rudder peds. Sorry for the bad landing. I will try to make another one where I am dogfighting.....if Kuna will post that one too http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

http://free-vk.t-com.hr/domagoj/tracks/214Hawk5.zip

Kuna15
11-06-2005, 04:39 PM
Send it to me I'll host it and post a link as soon as I get myself free time. Going to bed now http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.

Slechtvalk
11-06-2005, 05:07 PM
Deleted that file and after a few quick missions all my problems went away! so much more easy now. It felt so wrong this FM, thanks for finding this bug. How in earth did you found out?

thanks! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

voyager_663rd
11-06-2005, 09:05 PM
Add my contribution. Can't host a track but I have:

AMD xp2400 (32 bit I believe)
saitek x52

In order to play under the current 4.02m patch, I had to set my controls thus:

X=0 55 63 68 72 76 80 84 89 94 100 0
Y=0 50 60 65 72 76 80 84 89 94 100 0
Z=0 50 60 65 70 76 80 84 87 91 100

I then deleted the il2p4 dll file, reset my
controls to:

X=0 10 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100 0
Y=0 10 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100 0
Z=0 10 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100

and played some offline quickies.

The play was normal now (I might even say smoother than under the "adjusted" parameters).

To my untrained hand, the deletion of the dll file eliminated the wobbles for me.

THank you for such an unexpected find/solution.

WOLFMondo
11-07-2005, 02:30 AM
I've got an AMD 64bit 3500. I got the wobble. I removed the P4 dll and the wobble has cleared up!

Kuna15
11-07-2005, 03:06 AM
@ Curtiss_P6-E I have hosted two tracks only (I haven't got space for more)
402WT F4UCurtiss (http://free-vk.t-com.hr/domagoj/tracks/402WT-Curtiss_P6-E_feat_F4U.zip)

blackpulpit1970
11-07-2005, 06:00 AM
Oldman i just wanted to say a big thank you for finding the solution(for me anyways)for the wobble problem i had. I have a amd fx-55 and i removed the dllp4 file and all is well now, my p-51 flies great and and is very steady compared to before when it bounced all over the place. Its great to have good people still on these forums who can listen to a problem and trully try to help out the situation rather than whine that because they dont have one there must not be one and its all us doing something wrong. Thanks for the great find.

stathem
11-07-2005, 07:37 AM
Just for the sake of data, in case anyone is collating this infomation,

I have a P4 @ 2.6Mhz. Using the P4 .dll.

I would consider that I don't have wobbles (although I do have heavy filter on my X-52 rudder axis)

Lord_Rhah
11-07-2005, 09:26 AM
I have an AMD64 3000, and definitly have (what i percieve to be) the wobbles.
i tried deleting the p4.dll, and didnt notice any difference. Took a 43' spit up in QMB, still wobbled.

what i did notice is that when i went on to Uk dedicated server, i actually managed to get a couple of kills (first since 4.02!) so maybe the wobble has cleared up a bit, or i'm getting used to the new FM.
Either way, thanks to all involved in finding this possible fix.

jimDG
11-07-2005, 10:05 AM
moved the p4 dll in another folder, jumped into a yak-3p in the quick mission builder and WOW no wobble what so ever! flew for a while until dawned on me.. I forgot to set 25% fuel (was 100%). I went out, set 25% fuel, tried the yak again..and yes.. theres the wobble.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

(I got Athlon 64 3200) I really dont think the p4.dll is used at all by il2. its there to be renamed and used "if needed". moving it cant possibly change things.

Are YOU sure you set 25% fuel when testing? (if you normally fly with 25% fuel online)?
&lt;points a finger at the reader and closes one eye&gt;

OldMan___
11-07-2005, 10:52 AM
I don 't think it will be running on all cases. But as I stated I discovered it was being used when the game was launched from HL by using a profiller tool. Also as I stated I was using the "new dlls". Really don 't know why it was happening.. and for sure it should not.. but it seems somehow for some people it helped.

Again.. I do n't even calimed it was a fix for the Wooble!! It just corrected a completely different problem I was having.

I am almost sure that the dll is NOT the issue. There must be something very subtle that we fail to see.

neural_dream
11-07-2005, 10:58 AM
That is so weird. Which one is this profiler tool? Maybe those with "the wobbles" can use it too and see.

Werre_Fsck
11-07-2005, 11:45 AM
P4 here. P51 wobbles, as do some others, but not as noticeably as in the track. Must be stick settings or something.
Tried both DLLs, no difference whatsoever. It works fine as it is.

VW-IceFire
11-07-2005, 06:30 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Werre_Fsck:
P4 here. P51 wobbles, as do some others, but not as noticeably as in the track. Must be stick settings or something.
Tried both DLLs, no difference whatsoever. It works fine as it is. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
All aircraft wobble a bit... Those with the "broken" patch have excessive wobble.

I think we see a slight trend that fewer intel uses have problems with wobble than AMD users. However, that may be a matter of what CPU's are popular in this crowd...its a difficult thing to see. Its not the stark contrast I was hoping for...but it may shed some light.

FluffyBunnies
11-08-2005, 03:04 AM
AMD here, After several hours testing I think this has helped my wobble problem(a lot) which was also lessened with a re-install and re-patch.
BTW FoolTrottels wonderful controller editing tool can be found here:

http://www.airwarfare.com/Sims/FB/fb_essential_files.htm#087

Do yourselves a big favour and d/l it now http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

OldMan____
11-08-2005, 05:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by neural_dream:
That is so weird. Which one is this profiler tool? Maybe those with "the wobbles" can use it too and see. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You could try with intel profiller, but I used a " home made" (as in made in the company I work on for internal use only)

shotdownski
11-08-2005, 05:51 AM
I changed the name of il2_corep4.dll to il2_corep4dll.org, restarted the sim, and the flight model was fixed. Huge difference, again feels like it did in 4.01. It's a joy to fly again.

Thanks a million!
AMD64 3200 Venice

BBloke
11-08-2005, 06:55 AM
Hi All,

Well I managed to get to page 3 which is a major step for me.

I would like to post my comments and feelings regarding this. I'm taking no side as other have also stated but I do believe that differential proof is required from one or more members who are willing to post AVI footage of before and after.

That is. Use fraps and capture the footage. Compress it and post. Hell I'll even give you 80mb of my webspace to host as many as I can. If anybody wants instruction or help let me know privately.

It has also been stated that perception by definition can be deceiving. One mans rubbish is another mans Gold.

I have a P4 and I dont believe I have an issue but I do see what I call motion inertia.

What I have experienced from v304m to v401m and v402m is a large change in FM.

I used to fly with an Evo Force stick and X45 Throttle and from v304 to v401 I had to stop. The stick was not giving the same feel for the game with the same input.. turns were loose and trying to move the stick just a fraction to increase turn time would result in a complete spin out at any speed regardless of how soft my hands were.

After changing to the X45 with the same settings as previous the joystick response improved beyond expectation and the game return to a playable level.

Just my two cents. I havent and wont be doing the file swap as I dont see it making a difference. As Coastie has posted, the plane will handle differently at speeds and it sounds good to me.

Its great that there has been so much input on an issue that has been raised by so many. If only PC's were simple!

S!

Trajce102nd
11-09-2005, 08:38 AM
Here's my situation.
Like BBloke says, I feel motion inertia much more than in 4.01, but I was also have that wooble effect. Together, they did'n let me fly like in 4.01.

I have AMD 2200+ BOX (Thoroughbread B) and Cyborg Evo joy.

So, I removed il2_coreP4.dll in some backup folder and nothong changed in game. Then, I copied il2_core.dll to il2_coreP4.dll and... THAT SOLVED MY PROBLEM!!! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif)))))))))

Actualy, the problem is solved for some 70-80% (maybe even more) but the rest of wobbling is now present only in really, REALLY precize shooting. I suppose that is because new FM.
I also still have inertia (bigger then in 4.01) but now with removed wobble problem, It's somehow more logical and it's not botthering me.
I was forced to lower the inputs on my stick. Pitch was (before)- 3,6,12,22,32,42,53,64,75,84 without filtering, and now is 3,6,12,22,32,42,53,64,70,80 with 40% filtering. That was made because now plane going into stall much earlier, but now I don't have wobbling effect so I don't matter.

Trajce102nd
11-09-2005, 08:40 AM
One thing is going thorought my mind all day (I'm on job write now http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ). What if we change il2_core.dll and il2_coreP4.dll COMPLETELY with the same files from 4.01 patch. I'll try this evening at home and lett post results.

StellarRat
11-09-2005, 11:37 AM
That might work, but you might also lose some of the flight model from 4.02. Then you wouldn't really be flying the same game as everyone else. DLL files are program code that is called by other programs or DLLs. Using the wrong ones can undo patches, cause inaccurate results and might even be cheating in some cases.

Maulkin
11-09-2005, 12:16 PM
Or worse you will probably run into compatibility errors when you try to join an online server...

RED_BEAR8
11-19-2005, 07:30 PM
I have a AMD processor i remove the p4 dll and the wobbles were gone http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif no anymore.

I think is pretty clear that the problem is this file. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif