PDA

View Full Version : Don't overheat your 109 !!



XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 11:26 AM
Before like a lot of 109 pilots I would run my plane till it overheated, and then just let it keep running. Then after awhile I would reduce power, and let it cool.

I've found that every time the overheat appears on the 109 it degrades the engine performance. The solution? Don't let the 109 overheat. I run 90% throttle, and closed radiator, and I never overheat. If I'm flying right I never have a need for more power either. If I do a quick shot to 110% for just a few moments will do. Followed by reducing power to 80% afterwards.

I've been flying the F2's in the VEF for a little while now and I never overheat my engine anymore. Then when I get in a bad situation I can dive to the deck at 90% throttle with closed radiators, and run. With no overheating and no current VVS aircraft can dream of catching me. Aside from flinging laser gun beams at me for a short time.

Once clear I'm free to climb back up to altitude, and re-engage into the fight at an advantage.

Just something I picked up I thought I'd share for other new players who fly OKL planes. I think if all the new OKL pilots learn to properly fly the 109's we can turn the war around.

As when I find 2 or 3 other OKL pilots like myself flying one big BnZ circle. We massacre the VVS aircraft leaving them only poor shots, and forcing them into dangerous positions.

The beauty of the 109 is that it gives you the ability if flown right to disengage and re-engage at will.

Every take-off is optional, but every landing is mandatory!

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 11:26 AM
Before like a lot of 109 pilots I would run my plane till it overheated, and then just let it keep running. Then after awhile I would reduce power, and let it cool.

I've found that every time the overheat appears on the 109 it degrades the engine performance. The solution? Don't let the 109 overheat. I run 90% throttle, and closed radiator, and I never overheat. If I'm flying right I never have a need for more power either. If I do a quick shot to 110% for just a few moments will do. Followed by reducing power to 80% afterwards.

I've been flying the F2's in the VEF for a little while now and I never overheat my engine anymore. Then when I get in a bad situation I can dive to the deck at 90% throttle with closed radiators, and run. With no overheating and no current VVS aircraft can dream of catching me. Aside from flinging laser gun beams at me for a short time.

Once clear I'm free to climb back up to altitude, and re-engage into the fight at an advantage.

Just something I picked up I thought I'd share for other new players who fly OKL planes. I think if all the new OKL pilots learn to properly fly the 109's we can turn the war around.

As when I find 2 or 3 other OKL pilots like myself flying one big BnZ circle. We massacre the VVS aircraft leaving them only poor shots, and forcing them into dangerous positions.

The beauty of the 109 is that it gives you the ability if flown right to disengage and re-engage at will.

Every take-off is optional, but every landing is mandatory!

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 11:50 AM
It is not Allways that simple.. Like VVS-pilots who know how to take advantage of their overmodelled planes in some areas.. such as Lagg3, F-2 is faster IF YOU are running engine cool, but however Eventually Lagg3 '41 will catch you on level flight, because Lagg3 can run 110% throttle and radioator closed.. Whereas F-2 will overheat on 100% throttle and rad closed.. Though you have much better chances at high altitudes to run away (diving )

Sure it is easy when you master it, but truth is it is very hard to be successfull with F-2.. Your weapons simply do not have that big of impact compared to the ones on I-16 or Lagg3..

____________________________________



<center>http://koti.mbnet.fi/vipez/sig3.jpg </center>

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 12:38 PM
Like vipez said ,it dosen´t work allways ( very rarely infact ). You have to get low sometimes and then the I16´s own your a$$.
I also think that the automatic prop pitch should be an advantage not a disadvantage like it is currently.

Well I´m placing my hopes in the comming pach.

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 02:26 PM
what is closed radiator???? is this a selection you can choose? help in speed? is this why whenever i run the 109k it feels like a dog eventhou it was one of the fastest planes in ww2?

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 03:10 PM
MGallun wrote:
- what is closed radiator???? is this a selection you
- can choose? help in speed? is this why whenever i
- run the 109k it feels like a dog eventhou it was one
- of the fastest planes in ww2?


use the "R" key. Closed radiators mean the door that lets the air run thru it are shut. If you look at a rear view of the 109 you will see what looks like little flap doors at the wing root. These are the radiator exhaust doors. The more open they are the more drag they make and the slower is you top speed. Some have an auto setting that allows more cooling when needed and not have to done by the pilot.
-
-



http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid79/p9141f290fa1c1c59a2dc382c77af21f3/fb1a8321.jpg


Lead Whiner for the P-47D-40, M and N and Hvars

Message Edited on 10/08/0302:12PM by Sniper762x51

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 03:22 PM
hmmm, i had them things wide open all the time.. i never new about that, are they only for the 109 or 190 too?

is that why i have been chased down and cant catch anything? do you press R again to open radiator?

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 03:27 PM
Hey, MGallun,

This is a little bit out of topic.

If you are on the ground attack mission in IL-2 plane, do not forget to close radiator it will actually decrease possibility of being hit by fire from the ground. Then open it full right away after you started climbing.

Regards,

Taras

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 03:47 PM
MGallun wrote:
- hmmm, i had them things wide open all the time.. i
- never new about that, are they only for the 109 or
- 190 too?
-
- is that why i have been chased down and cant catch
- anything? do you press R again to open radiator?
-
-

To make the radiators open/close option work, you must engage "Complex engine management" in the difficulty menu.
Then, through the "R" key you can cycle between the following positions: Closed, 2, 4, 6, 8, Open, Automatic (only on some LW aircrafts). The more they're open, the more the engine gets cooled, but the more the drag.
Anyway, the effect is not macroscopic: they can affect the speed by, let's say, a 5-10%, and the engine cooling by increasing about 30-50% the time you can run 110% throttle.
Enjoy! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif



<center>http://www.uploadit.org/files/170903-G55_Firma.jpg </center>

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 04:07 PM
I find I can run at various settings by opening the rad to stage 2 and moving the throttle between 85% and 110%. I rarely run at full power unless im climbing or if I need the speed in combat.

I've used this technique a few times...if you have altitude...and the Russians are up with you at the same level, dive for the ground and start a gradual pullout. If they follow...its likely that their planes will start loosing critical components on the way down.

I got two guys off my tail the other day doing that...it was hilarious http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/icefire/icefire_tempest.jpg
"Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few." - Winston Churchill

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 04:09 PM
I absolutely love the way the radiator flaps (I know the Emil's is slightly different) open and close on the 109.

-----
In memory of 'The Few'
<img src=http://www.lima1.co.uk/Sharkey/spitfire.jpg>
The Tangmere Pilots - http://www.tangmerepilots-raf.co.uk/
Know your enemy and know yourself; in a hundred battles, you will never be defeated.

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 04:26 PM
Again offtopic a bit , but nobody answered me in my own topic.

Is there a way to get F2 run 640km/h at 5100m ?

I have doned all kinda voodoo stuff , tryed manual pitch, manual radiator, but there is no way I can get F2 to run 640km/h at 5000m like indicated in the object viewer. The best has been about 420 IAS which is roughly 550 TAS.

Any help here or is the object viewer wrong.

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 04:33 PM
alarmer wrote:
- Again offtopic a bit , but nobody answered me in my
- own topic.
-
- Is there a way to get F2 run 640km/h at 5100m ?
-
- I have doned all kinda voodoo stuff , tryed manual
- pitch, manual radiator, but there is no way I can
- get F2 to run 640km/h at 5000m like indicated in the
- object viewer. The best has been about 420 IAS which
- is roughly 550 TAS.
-
- Any help here or is the object viewer wrong.



Join the club. The 47 dons't match it's decription either in max speed, max rpm, supercharger, or gun ability



http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid79/p9141f290fa1c1c59a2dc382c77af21f3/fb1a8321.jpg


Lead Whiner for the P-47D-40, M and N and Hvars

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 04:41 PM
Well Alarmer, I have found that few planes will reach their claimed "object veiwer" top speed. The P-40E is a shining example, as it too is way short of it's rated top speed as posted on this website and in the object veiwer info, at all altitudes . So I'm not surprised that any of the various 109s are similarly afflicted. Oleg and his crew does not seem to care and worse yet, most of the legions of FB players don't seem to give a crap either, so it's unlikely to get any better in the top speed realm. I don't expect any plane to reach the absolute top, but it should be within 1 to 3% IMHO.

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin - 1755

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 04:42 PM
so set me straight, i never adjusted the radiator stuff...

if i was at 1000m with rad wide open at 90 per i would be doing 250 or so i think

if i had rad closed at 1000m at 90 per how much more speed would i get...

what about in a climb, i always thought the k was a great climber, but barely get around 210kph at 10-15 deg up angle, i would figure it would climb at a faster rate... i did notice i could run at 110 per a while with them open, but would the plane be faster if i had them closed and ran at 90-95 per?

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 04:46 PM
ya, and the russian planes seem to get close to their top speed, i have flown some and can get them withing 50kph of the speed listed on webpage... so i see my favortism here... i dont care of the 109k can play in the slow turn fights, i just want the real speed its supposed to have so i can dive down, take some shots and turn away and climb and do it again, not come down at only 600kph shoot miss(iam new so bad shot) and turn up with full power at a amazing 230kph and have some yak, la7 climb 100more kph and shot me down, thats not realistic...its not like iam pointing straight up, just a decent climb... but the 109 seems to feel gutless compared to russian planes

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 04:51 PM
i think someone may have said speed was from dive, then what plane could continue to go along at
eg dive, speed 600, and it bleeds away to 500 and stays there
and without dive u may get say 450
i use rad alot/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
i like to have rad open on way to combat, should give me more closed rad time/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
i dont play online tho

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 04:53 PM
MGallun wrote:
- so set me straight, i never adjusted the radiator
- stuff...
-
- if i was at 1000m with rad wide open at 90 per i
- would be doing 250 or so i think
-
- if i had rad closed at 1000m at 90 per how much more
- speed would i get...

Maybe 270...


- what about in a climb, i always thought the k was a
- great climber, but barely get around 210kph at 10-15
- deg up angle, i would figure it would climb at a
- faster rate... i did notice i could run at 110 per a
- while with them open, but would the plane be faster
- if i had them closed and ran at 90-95 per?

For a given a/c there's an ideal IAS that allows the best climb rate, which is roughy around 250-300 km/h (but changes with each a/c and with altitude). I would suggest to keep the radiators open while climbing, since they won't affect too much the speed (due to the low IAS = lower drag effect) but they would allow a better cooling of the engine.
That sounds in theory (and RL), and it seems to work in FB as well.



<center>http://www.uploadit.org/files/170903-G55_Firma.jpg </center>

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 04:55 PM
The fact you are having problems in early war online war games shows how insanely borked some of the planes got in the last patch.

Many of the early war russian birds got "uberized" for no good reason (just for the hell of it with no facts to back their performance up) and 109's were turned into overheating coffins of death (basically giving the real weaknesses of early russian crates to early german planes).

The magical never overheating lagg is just a cheap plane now in early war servers. People fly around using it like a fw, high speed attacks and then run off, get some distance, turn around and repeat attack.

It was always a crap plane ever since original IL2. What the hell suddenly makes it so damn good now?

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 05:13 PM
Like I just posted in another thread. The Bf109E4B, runs flat out on full throttle for hours with "no" overheat. In the v1.00, it overheated if I just looked at it. Arrggg.

Bruno Weiss

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 05:15 PM
The #1 tip I can give you to not get shot outta the air by La7's is to stay on the ground, wait for the patch and fly something else in the mean time.

Forget using the wep at 110 or even 103 lol the germans were told to never use it for fear of burning out the engines lickedy split. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Unless your one of those guys that flys around the base for 10 minutes gaining alt at 90 throttle with a full fuel tank... then with hieght the 109 is alrightish. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

<a>http://www.talonsoft.com/images/hiddenanddangerous/hiddenanddangerous-eyes.jpg</a>

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 05:24 PM
you also need to fly late war 109s in manual to be competitive against la7s and yaks theres such a huge performance increase from auto which is fixed in 1.2

http://www.freewebs.com/leadspitter/lead.txt
Good dogfighters bring ammo home, Great ones don't. (c) Leadspitter

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 05:44 PM
LeadSpitter wrote: you also need to fly late war 109s in manual to be competitive against la7s and yaks....

Wrong, wrong, wrong. La is a tough A/C with a sponge-like ability to absorb hits but just slow it down and it's ownable. Same with Yak-x.





Lixma,

Blitzpig.

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 06:00 PM
Slow it down how, exactly Lix? Surely you aren't suggesting turn fighting with them, are you?

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 06:14 PM
Who, me ? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif



Damn right i'll turn fight with them !



Lixma,

Blitzpig.


Message Edited on 10/08/0306:15PM by Lixma

Buzz_25th
10-08-2003, 06:24 PM
You can't leave the radiator closed until it overheats. Then you'll struggle for the rest of the flight. Every chance you get open the radiator, then close it when you need extra speed, but open it as soon as possible. I'm playing with the radiator as much as the prop pitch during combat. Keep it as cool as possible all the time, and then when you need power you have more temp to play with.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
25th_Buzz
<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 07:44 PM
I like ME 109 a lot and I've recently discovered some very od things concerning K-4 The plane had to really be crappy since I menage to damage it's engine with 100-110% no matter if it's cool or not. Try the same with La series, or should I say magic boxes? Whatever. Another funny thing I noticed, well not that funny, is this: I fly K-4 in like 4-5000 m and there's a little guy, let's call him I-16, behind me. So I decide to get rid off him and climb, then after a few moments I look back and he's still there, he's loosing slightly (like 100m per 5 minutes) and we're in 6000. This is not a slight glitch in the game engine, this is @##$*@)#@ !!!!. The same with F-2,4 G-2 against JU-87, sometimes JU is able to catch you in climb, really funny. Well speaking of overheat and really useless manual pitch, time is simply against LF fighters. I think that Me was mostly made of paper and like a tone of black thick oil since no matter where I get shot, nose area, 90% my engine is crippled and I can see sh*t in an instant. My heart bleeds.

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 08:03 PM
So what you are saying is that F2 should indeed get 640km/h in straight flight at altitude of 5100 or so like it says in the object viewer.

Correct me if iam wrong but I wouldnt call missing a 100km/h from top speed as a "minor" handicap.

I just took a Rata on a spin which we face at the VEF now, it too gets only slightly slower speed at 5100m in straight flight.

And we are supposed to "leave the early VVS planes to dust" while disengaging from the battle :/ !! (yes the diving works but iam talking about flying straight here)
(


Message Edited on 10/08/0309:04PM by alarmer

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 08:06 PM
LeadSpitter_ wrote:
- you also need to fly late war 109s in manual to be
- competitive against la7s and yaks theres such a huge
- performance increase from auto which is fixed in 1.2
-
-
-
- http://www.freewebs.com/leadspitter/lead.txt
- Good dogfighters bring ammo home, Great ones don't.
- (c) Leadspitter
-
-



Leadspitter or anyone, what angles and pitches settings sould i be using in climbing/dogfighting/chasing?? I have always used auto pitch but if there is a huge difference im there if someone tells me how and when...

"I am a hunter. When I have shot down an Englishman my hunter's passion is satisfied for a quater of an hour."
-Manfred Von Richtoffen

" I fear no over heat 'till the needle on both guages hits the nine...Then it's too late."
-Me


Me to the Smithsonian; "Wanna sell your 190D??"

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 08:43 PM
Lixma wrote:
- Who, me ? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif
-
-
-
-
- Damn right i'll turn fight with them !
-
-
-
- Lixma,
-
- Blitzpig.

/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif


How? Spill it! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

XyZspineZyX
10-08-2003, 10:41 PM
Please don't start calling it 'proper use', there's no historical connection here..................