PDA

View Full Version : Spitfires wings held on with duck tape?



Freiwillige
08-13-2009, 01:55 PM
Just built a mission where a Single 109E scrambles against Spitfire I's coming in low over your field.

3 out of 3 Spitfire lost a wing to my cannons after the first salvo.

20mm+Spitfire=no wing!

Seems a bit flimsy and not quite historical

The_Stealth_Owl
08-13-2009, 01:59 PM
Oh boy, here comes a bunch of pages. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/compsmash.gif

general_kalle
08-13-2009, 02:05 PM
IBTMP (In Before the many pages) http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

DuxCorvan
08-13-2009, 02:06 PM
20mm HE + anything = big mess

Xiolablu3
08-13-2009, 02:10 PM
The Spit had very very thin wings, even compared to later planes.

Its one of the things that made it fast, even with such large wings and low wing loading.

They had real problems fitting cannon in there at first.

Dont be surprised if they are shot off easily. The Bf109 is weak too, so its not alone. AT least compared to the Fw190, Hellcat or P47. Zero is even worse.

I seem to remember that the Spitfire has very weak structural values in the game engine. Slightly weaker than the Bf109? (Thats if I read the table correctly!)

BillSwagger
08-13-2009, 02:39 PM
could be worse, other sims actually model excess load on the wings (for other planes as well), which snaps them if you turn too hard at high speed.
Also reverse aileron roll at high speed, because the Spitfire wings are so thin.

major_setback
08-13-2009, 03:41 PM
Duck tape, or duct tape?
I never used tape on a duck..only on my duct :-)

AllorNothing117
08-13-2009, 04:17 PM
In before the great walls of Text!

dangerlaef
08-13-2009, 05:07 PM
Originally posted by major_setback:
Duck tape, or duct tape?
I never used tape on a duck..only on my duct :-)

"Etymology

The origin of the term "duct tape" is the subject of some disagreement.

One view[14] is that it was called "duck tape" by WWII soldiers either because it resembled strips of cotton duck or because the waterproof quality of the tape contributed to the name, by analogy to the water-shedding quality of a duck's plumage. Under this view, soldiers returning home from the war found uses for duck tape around the house, where tents were forgotten and ductwork needed sealing, not ammunition cases. Other proponents of this view point to older references to non-adhesive cotton duck tape used in Venetian blinds, suggesting that the name was carried over to the adhesive product. The Oxford English Dictionary says that perhaps "duct tape" was originally "duck tape." This view is summarized most notably in a New York Times article by etymologist William Safire in March 2003. Safire cites use of the term "cotton duck tape" in a 1945 advertisement for surplus government property.[15] The Oxford English Dictionary gives a 1902 quotation for "100,000 yards of cotton duck tape" being used to protect the cables of the Brooklyn Bridge.[16] Thus a fabric duck tape was available to which an adhesive could have been added.

The other view is that "duct tape" is the original term, since there are many documented uses of that term which pre-date all documented uses of the term "duck tape" for the adhesive-backed product, and that there is no written evidence supporting the WWII story.[17] Some proponents of this view accept the idea that there was an earlier non-adhesive "duck tape", but claim that people have just confused the similar pronunciation of two similar but unrelated products through the process of elision, and that the rest of the "duck" etymology is folklore or fabrication. This view was summarized most notably in a Boston Globe article by etymologist Jan Freeman, also in March 2003.[18]

In any case, whether it is an error or a preservation of the original usage, the term "duck tape" is sometimes used for the product today.[19] Duck Tape is also a brand name for this product in some countries."

Wikipedia, source of all that is apocryphal.

R_Target
08-13-2009, 05:17 PM
Originally posted by major_setback:
Duck tape, or duct tape?
I never used tape on a duck..

It depends how loud he quacks. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

stalkervision
08-13-2009, 06:51 PM
uber spitfire "de-wing-er" http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif Sometimes i take off both wings just to be really bad.. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/2305/shot274.jpg

http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/1111/shot408.jpg

I have shot off both wings and half an elevator and rudder at times. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif I quit doing that because then all the fun is over as the spit dives into oblivion. Now i just shot them up and fill them full of fine german lead.

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/722/shot496.jpg

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

danjama
08-13-2009, 07:07 PM
Originally posted by general_kalle:
IBTMP (In Before the many pages) http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

haha theres a new one

VMF-214_HaVoK
08-13-2009, 07:16 PM
Originally posted by BillSwagger:
could be worse, other sims actually model excess load on the wings (for other planes as well), which snaps them if you turn too hard at high speed.
Also reverse aileron roll at high speed, because the Spitfire wings are so thin.

You can snap a wing off in IL-2 as well due to high G load.

S!

Choctaw111
08-13-2009, 07:28 PM
I fly Spits a great deal. Sometimes I think they are tough and other times not.
The tape used to hold the wings on is more like the stuff I use to wrap presents with.

megalopsuche
08-13-2009, 07:29 PM
Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BillSwagger:
could be worse, other sims actually model excess load on the wings (for other planes as well), which snaps them if you turn too hard at high speed.
Also reverse aileron roll at high speed, because the Spitfire wings are so thin.

You can snap a wing off in IL-2 as well due to high G load.

S! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've never been able to do it. Can you tell me how to repeat the self-dewinging?

AnaK774
08-13-2009, 09:10 PM
Try something with good elevator authority at high speeds...

ElAurens
08-13-2009, 09:21 PM
Originally posted by megalopsuche:


I've never been able to do it. Can you tell me how to repeat the self-dewinging?

P51D, indicated air speed in excess of 400mph, pull back smartly on stick, presto! No wings.

Of course this can be done at lower speeds sometimes even with careful stick work, but that is another 20+ page discussion.

stalkervision
08-13-2009, 09:40 PM
I have a problem di-winging my own plane unless i dive it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blush.gif

then i demolish it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

JtD
08-14-2009, 12:12 AM
You need to pull 15G in order to get rid of the wings in this game. Afaik, it is the same for all aircraft.

To produce 15g, you can dive and trim the aircraft all the way up, then pull back the stick.

horseback
08-14-2009, 03:01 PM
I think the original poster is defaming duct tape, which is the strongest means of connecting dissimilar surfaces known to man. As the saying goes, it's like the Force in that it has a Dark Side and a Light Side, and it holds the Universe together.

It is however, my understanding that the Spitfire's wings were pretty sturdy. As I recall, the main spar itself "was formed of square section tubes telescoped together so that the narrowest and longest extended to the tip of the wing, the number of concentric tubes forming the spar decreased from root to tip." (Bill Sweetman, Spitfire, 1980)

There was a kind of 'torsion box' created with the wing's leading edge, which provided even greater strength to the wings.

It took some serious persuasion to separate a Spit from its wings (but even more if the bond was reinforced with Duct Tape. Unbeliever.).

cheers

horseback

PanzerAce
08-15-2009, 03:28 AM
Originally posted by ElAurens:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by megalopsuche:


I've never been able to do it. Can you tell me how to repeat the self-dewinging?

P51D, indicated air speed in excess of 400mph, pull back smartly on stick, presto! No wings.

Of course this can be done at lower speeds sometimes even with careful stick work, but that is another 20+ page discussion. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've discovered the hard way that 110s can also loose wings with too much stick work....

Hurri-Khan
08-15-2009, 07:54 AM
Likely it's posted before.. and it's a 30mm, but the wing pretty much behaves like duct tape :-)
No aeromystic forces involved in this case tho..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZZGaEEi8Ek


>>>-H-K--->

major_setback
08-15-2009, 04:11 PM
It should be called wing tape -http://blog.mobissimo.com/uploads/duct_tape.jpg

Video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...ture=player_embedded (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3srEUzISC0&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fblog%2Emobissimo%2Ecom%2Farchive s%2F392%2DAir%2DDeccan%2DFinds%2DNew%2DUses%2DFor% 2DTape%2DAirplane%2DWing%2DRepair%2Ehtml&feature=player_embedded)


Well, it's not strictly duct tape:

"The patch materials were aluminum alloy sheet and aramid fibre reinforced composite prepreg. A cold curing acrylic based adhesive was used for bonding. Specimens with simulated patch repairs were subjected to both constant amplitude and flight simulation fatigue testing under various environmental conditions. The results indicated that bonded patches are potentially very good repairs for areas weakened by corrosion and its removal."

ibeagle
08-15-2009, 09:13 PM
Looks like Rowan's BoB to me Stalkervision.

Btw, is that a 100mil smiley? lol