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SA Snake
02-12-2010, 01:47 PM
http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/articles/106/1068934p1.html

New preview, writer tries to describe it from a stealth and splinter cell fan perspective.

Maxy239
02-12-2010, 01:56 PM
that's reassuring coming from somebody like that. i'm pumped for the gamehttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

good findhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

FrankieSatt
02-12-2010, 02:02 PM
Just another person who doesn't know what "Stealth" really is.

There is more to "Stealth" than hiding in the shadows. Just because the screen turns Black and White doesn't mean you are stealthy... especially when people are firing guns at you and calling out your name.

Another disappointing preview by someone who really doesn't know what Splinter Cell is if he thinks that what he played was "Stealth.

Maxy239
02-12-2010, 02:06 PM
just another person sulking because the game isn't exactly what he wants it to be. the game looks great and i'm pretty sure you could ghost most of the game anyway.

Mr.E.Bear
02-12-2010, 02:21 PM
Find it kind of sad that the stealth focussed pre view is only a page long and barely mentions stealth at all.

Kind of got the hint the guy was going to go South when I read the "U CAN POP HEADSHOTS FROM COVER!!1!" thing.

H.A.R.M.s
02-12-2010, 02:26 PM
I won't lie; it's a little rough to play Conviction at the outset. The design goes against everything I've experienced in stealth games for the past decade

I wonder why? Maybe because it isn't? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

From cover, you're nearly invincible. Headshots come easily, you won't get hit if you stay low and you can quickly grab and take down any enemy that gets too close. That's because Sam Fisher is a bad ***. Even if you're only moderately skilled, if you stick to cover and stay in the shadows, you're going to end up looking like a trained killer.

Read: AI is completely dumbed down so NPC's don't take cover and keep shooting at ghost Sam while player's headshooting world plus dog.

oO_ShadowFox_Oo
02-12-2010, 02:50 PM
For a real Splinter Cell fan, he doesn't really give much detail or pay any attention to the stealth in the game.

yerffejk
02-12-2010, 02:55 PM
Originally posted by FrankieSatt:
Just another person who doesn't know what "Stealth" really is.

There is more to "Stealth" than hiding in the shadows. Just because the screen turns Black and White doesn't mean you are stealthy... especially when people are firing guns at you and calling out your name.

Another disappointing preview by someone who really doesn't know what Splinter Cell is if he thinks that what he played was "Stealth.

You people are hilarious. If I had a nickel for every time I heard you say something similar. Grow up and move on.

Joshua Morrison
02-12-2010, 03:43 PM
Yeah he sounds more like he was reading the marketing campaign script... Sam is a bad.... and it's a new kind of stealth. As far as forgetting everything we knew about Splinter Cell, whats that all about they should of started a new franchise.

Rea1SamF1sher
02-12-2010, 03:58 PM
He says at least five times that it is now easier to play Splinter Cell. I could start up a topic about that. Films, Games, TV programs are making us stupid. Had an conversation with my mum. She said she is getting annoyed of the "new" TV shows and programs explaining a scene or something at least two times so idiots can understand this too.

More attention to AI and Gameplay please. Not Hollywood and Graphics. And I think on the PC this game is even easier (at least on Normal Mode, what we have seen).

AGENTxxxxx47
02-12-2010, 04:03 PM
This guy sounds like a shill , no offense but that review sounds like it was from a kid who loves UT.

sammyboy1981
02-12-2010, 04:05 PM
Yikes, this is a "preview" from a longtime SC fan? She (I presume from the author) mentions words like headshots, firefights...and since when is Sam considered a "trained killer"?

She doesn't mention anything even remotely "stealthy", outside of the "taking-cover" system (you have to HOLD down the trigger at all times??? WTF?)

Is she's such a fan, what's her SC forum username???

mattduck69
02-12-2010, 04:07 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by sammyboy1981:
Yikes, this is a "preview" from a longtime SC fan? She (I presume from the author) mentions words like headshots, firefights...and since when is Sam considered a "trained killer"?

yer i know aye wen they kept on saying trained killer i was thinking they got sam mixed up with agent 47

sammyboy1981
02-12-2010, 04:14 PM
Related to IGN, they got a new article up concerning the "best 10 of Microsoft X10", COnviction is nowhere to be found.

For crying out loud, Perfect Dark on XBL Arcade made the list, but not SC:C?!?!?

IGN - Top 10 of X10 (http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/106/1068940p1.html)

SA Snake
02-12-2010, 04:18 PM
Originally posted by sammyboy1981:
Yikes, this is a "preview" from a longtime SC fan? She (I presume from the author) mentions words like headshots, firefights...and since when is Sam considered a "trained killer"?

She doesn't mention anything even remotely "stealthy", outside of the "taking-cover" system (you have to HOLD down the trigger at all times??? WTF?)

Is she's such a fan, what's her SC forum username???

Hilary Goldstein is a he. Also, im starting to wonder, for all those people hating on the game heres a question..if this game wasent called Splinter Cell or related to it, would you think this game looked good?

FrankieSatt
02-12-2010, 04:22 PM
Originally posted by Pacer1988:Hilary Goldstein is a he. Also, im starting to wonder, for all those people hating on the game heres a question..if this game wasent called Splinter Cell or related to it, would you think this game looked good?

And NOW you have finally hit on the problem with this game. It is SUPPOSED to be a Splinter Cell game, it isn't. THAT is the problem. We want a TRUE Splinter Cell sequel, not a Run N Gun action shooter with the Splinter Cell Name and story line tacked on it.

If this wasn't a Splinter Cell game I wouldn't be here complaining about what a disaster it is.

AGENTxxxxx47
02-12-2010, 04:26 PM
True ....

stealth gamers are running out of options

I guess were not allowed to have a pure stealth game.

It's against geneva conventions or something.

Hitman 2010 please God , don't make it an action game with lasers

Stealth scares most gamers , they sleep with night lights on too. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

sammyboy1981
02-12-2010, 04:27 PM
Originally posted by Pacer1988:

Hilary Goldstein is a he. Also, im starting to wonder, for all those people hating on the game heres a question..if this game wasent called Splinter Cell or related to it, would you think this game looked good?

Honestly...no. The animation looks too "jumpy" to me. It doesn't look smooth when Sam transitions from crouching to jumping to climbing, etc. There are better games coming out that I would rather spend my money on anyways. Also, what they've shown from "co-op multiplayer" doesn't particularly thrill me (did they even show any competitive multiplayer on last night's GTTV...I can't tell anymore).

Also, sorry, Hilary (hehe).

edit: AgentXXXXX47...I wouldn't expect Hitman 5 this year...just the announcement. It'll proabbly be 2011 (maybe 2012). Same for Thief 4. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif

H.A.R.M.s
02-12-2010, 04:32 PM
Originally posted by Pacer1988:
Hilary Goldstein is a he. Also, im starting to wonder, for all those people hating on the game heres a question..if this game wasent called Splinter Cell or related to it, would you think this game looked good? Conviction's Splinter Cell like Halo Wars is Halo.

oO_ShadowFox_Oo
02-12-2010, 04:51 PM
Originally posted by Pacer1988:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sammyboy1981:
Yikes, this is a "preview" from a longtime SC fan? She (I presume from the author) mentions words like headshots, firefights...and since when is Sam considered a "trained killer"?

She doesn't mention anything even remotely "stealthy", outside of the "taking-cover" system (you have to HOLD down the trigger at all times??? WTF?)

Is she's such a fan, what's her SC forum username???

Hilary Goldstein is a he. Also, im starting to wonder, for all those people hating on the game heres a question..if this game wasent called Splinter Cell or related to it, would you think this game looked good? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd think it looks reasonably good for an action shooter that has some basic stealth elements in it. To be honest, the game is full of too many gimicks and not enough substance to actually impress me in it's core gameplay.

But as a Splinter Cell game? It completely misses the point. This team have their heads up their rear ends if they believe they've made a Splinter Cell game.


Originally posted by H.A.R.M.s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pacer1988:
Hilary Goldstein is a he. Also, im starting to wonder, for all those people hating on the game heres a question..if this game wasent called Splinter Cell or related to it, would you think this game looked good? Conviction's Splinter Cell like Halo Wars is Halo. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not really. Halo Wars was definitively NOT trying to be another Halo Master Chief FPS game.

Halo was originally conceived as a RTS game and Halo Wars is the final imagining of that concept.

It's a fantastic game and fully deserves to be in the Halo Universe, IMO.

Splinter Cell Conviction on the other hand is in the same direct style of gaming as the previous Splinter Cell games, but is completely off base on a whole range of things.

S.V.
02-12-2010, 05:01 PM
Originally posted by FrankieSatt:
Just another person who doesn't know what "Stealth" really is.

There is more to "Stealth" than hiding in the shadows. Just because the screen turns Black and White doesn't mean you are stealthy... especially when people are firing guns at you and calling out your name.

Another disappointing preview by someone who really doesn't know what Splinter Cell is if he thinks that what he played was "Stealth.

Things evolve.

sammyboy1981
02-12-2010, 05:03 PM
Originally posted by oO_ShadowFox_Oo:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H.A.R.M.s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pacer1988:
Hilary Goldstein is a he. Also, im starting to wonder, for all those people hating on the game heres a question..if this game wasent called Splinter Cell or related to it, would you think this game looked good? Conviction's Splinter Cell like Halo Wars is Halo. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not really. Halo Wars was definitively NOT trying to be another Halo Master Chief FPS game.

Halo was originally conceived as a RTS game and Halo Wars is the final imagining of that concept.

It's a fantastic game and fully deserves to be in the Halo Universe, IMO.

Splinter Cell Conviction on the other hand is in the same direct style of gaming as the previous Splinter Cell games, but is completely off base on a whole range of things. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, he's right in that Halo Wars is a top-down RTS to Halo's masterful FPS...and COnviction is a 3rd Person Shooter to Splinter Cell's stealth focus. They're two different games, that share a universe.

Halo Wars gets the OK because it was meant to be different, while Conviction tried to mix it up gameplay wise and they inadvertently rewrote the series.

Mr.E.Bear
02-12-2010, 05:07 PM
Originally posted by S.V.:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FrankieSatt:
Just another person who doesn't know what "Stealth" really is.

There is more to "Stealth" than hiding in the shadows. Just because the screen turns Black and White doesn't mean you are stealthy... especially when people are firing guns at you and calling out your name.

Another disappointing preview by someone who really doesn't know what Splinter Cell is if he thinks that what he played was "Stealth.

Things evolve. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Things devolve too.

Which I think is what upsets those of us who look to SC for the next step in the stealth genre.

It simply isn't here, if anything, it's a step back.

sammyboy1981
02-12-2010, 05:17 PM
Originally posted by Mr.E.Bear:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by S.V.:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FrankieSatt:
Just another person who doesn't know what "Stealth" really is.

There is more to "Stealth" than hiding in the shadows. Just because the screen turns Black and White doesn't mean you are stealthy... especially when people are firing guns at you and calling out your name.

Another disappointing preview by someone who really doesn't know what Splinter Cell is if he thinks that what he played was "Stealth.

Things evolve. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Things devolve too.

Which I think is what upsets those of us who look to SC for the next step in the stealth genre.

It simply isn't here, if anything, it's a step back. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

A leap back more like it. WHat's a shame is that this generation of console has been here long enough that Convcition could have really been the next phase of stealth gaming. Hitman:Blood Money was great, but it was really just a straight up sequel. Who knows what Ubi could have done with open-world/crowd/L&S stealth together.

Instead we get an action game, soon to be forgotten, and grouped together with the likes of Just Cause/Rogue Warrior/Infamous/etc/etc/etc...

FrankieSatt
02-13-2010, 08:14 PM
Originally posted by S.V.:Things evolve.

So the evolution of Stealth is no Stealth?

RaulO4
02-13-2010, 08:20 PM
Originally posted by FrankieSatt:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by S.V.:Things evolve.

So the evolution of Stealth is no Stealth? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
yes........lol http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

S.V.
02-13-2010, 08:24 PM
"no stealth"... Should be. And shouldn't be.

When I'll finish the game I'm gonna tell you if there isn't stealth anyway

AirborneRedneck
02-13-2010, 08:56 PM
Originally posted by AGENTxxxxx47:
True ....

stealth gamers are running out of options

I guess were not allowed to have a pure stealth game.

It's against geneva conventions or something.

Hitman 2010 please God , don't make it an action game with lasers

Stealth scares most gamers , they sleep with night lights on too. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Don't worry, Io Interactive won't screw us over. I have faith in them... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

Joshua Morrison
02-13-2010, 08:59 PM
Originally posted by AirborneRedneck:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AGENTxxxxx47:
True ....

stealth gamers are running out of options

I guess were not allowed to have a pure stealth game.

It's against geneva conventions or something.

Hitman 2010 please God , don't make it an action game with lasers

Stealth scares most gamers , they sleep with night lights on too. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Don't worry, Io Interactive won't screw us over. I have faith in them... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Didn't they go under? I think they sold the rights to Hitman to square enix.

AirborneRedneck
02-13-2010, 09:01 PM
Originally posted by JoshuaMorrison:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AirborneRedneck:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AGENTxxxxx47:
True ....

stealth gamers are running out of options

I guess were not allowed to have a pure stealth game.

It's against geneva conventions or something.

Hitman 2010 please God , don't make it an action game with lasers

Stealth scares most gamers , they sleep with night lights on too. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Don't worry, Io Interactive won't screw us over. I have faith in them... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Didn't they go under? I think they sold the rights to Hitman to square enix. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No Io Interactive is still around, Edios was bought by Square Enix, but it's still being made by Io Interactive, last I heard. So no worries. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

RaulO4
02-13-2010, 09:41 PM
hitman 5....47 is back and hes **** off!!


he was sold out by the same Company he work for....now hes back for ravage!!!
(explosion in the background)

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif
uhuhuhuh * not my hitman too XD

savior2006
02-13-2010, 09:51 PM
Originally posted by AirborneRedneck:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AGENTxxxxx47:
True ....

stealth gamers are running out of options

I guess were not allowed to have a pure stealth game.

It's against geneva conventions or something.

Hitman 2010 please God , don't make it an action game with lasers

Stealth scares most gamers , they sleep with night lights on too. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Don't worry, Io Interactive won't screw us over. I have faith in them... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Just hope they don't have a Beland in their midst as well, who was frustrated by having to be a "silent assasin".
To answer that one light-sider's question, I think Beland Boy's have made a wonderful sequel to the Jason Bourne game. Running around making as much noise as possible and ganking bad guys, near perfect aim regardless of whether Sam is hanging from a ****ing pole, scaling up one story of a building in a single bound, ghosts everywhere, the game aims for you, etc,.
And what do light siders have in their defense? That Redding failed to kill two guys on seperate occassions who were right in front of him? That "you don't have to use Mark and Execute if you don't want"? Pathetic.

H.A.R.M.s
02-14-2010, 02:29 AM
Originally posted by savior2006:
Just hope they don't have a Beland in their midst as well, who was frustrated by having to be a "silent assasin".
Q: Tell us, what are the biggest changes in game and what were the reasons for you making them?

A: You know, when we looked previous titles, we couldn't not to see 47's resemblance with f***ing limo driver.

Also, we find slow paced assassination gameplay frustrating. I mean, 47's world's greatest assassin, why would he have to slowly eliminationg his targets.

That's why we are now using new system, Mark and Assassinate. When player steps in new level, he has to locate targets using sonar goggles, Mark them and press A button to Assassinate.

Q: Wow, it's super cool. You know, I'm old school Hitman fan, but this looks amazing. It has words "Hollywood blockbuster" screaming from every scene in the game. Pew pew pew.

A: Glad to hear it, that's the effect we wanted to cause. Especially with M&A, when you press Assassinate button, you can relax, sit peacefully in your chair and watch 47 eliminating his targets. There's no longer need for player to be on his toes while planning his assassination, exploring possible routes and ways for assassinate, and be frustrated when NPCs discover him.

Q: Will there be demo?

A: There's no need for it. This game is so awesome, super sexy, and solely based on that players should buy it. It is still a Hitman game, you can see it in the title.

Q: Yes it is, I, thrustworthy reporter/old Hitman fan, can confirm it. Thanks for your time.

A: Don't mention it.

NeonXXV
02-14-2010, 02:41 AM
^
That's some EPIC WIN right there http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Though if IO really does it..... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif

logik1911
02-14-2010, 06:40 PM
Originally posted by H.A.R.M.s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by savior2006:
Just hope they don't have a Beland in their midst as well, who was frustrated by having to be a "silent assasin".
Q: Tell us, what are the biggest changes in game and what were the reasons for you making them?

A: You know, when we looked previous titles, we couldn't not to see 47's resemblance with f***ing limo driver.

Also, we find slow paced assassination gameplay frustrating. I mean, 47's world's greatest assassin, why would he have to slowly eliminationg his targets.

That's why we are now using new system, Mark and Assassinate. When player steps in new level, he has to locate targets using sonar goggles, Mark them and press A button to Assassinate.

Q: Wow, it's super cool. You know, I'm old school Hitman fan, but this looks amazing. It has words "Hollywood blockbuster" screaming from every scene in the game. Pew pew pew.

A: Glad to hear it, that's the effect we wanted to cause. Especially with M&A, when you press Assassinate button, you can relax, sit peacefully in your chair and watch 47 eliminating his targets. There's no longer need for player to be on his toes while planning his assassination, exploring possible routes and ways for assassinate, and be frustrated when NPCs discover him.

Q: Will there be demo?

A: There's no need for it. This game is so awesome, super sexy, and solely based on that players should buy it. It is still a Hitman game, you can see it in the title.

Q: Yes it is, I, thrustworthy reporter/old Hitman fan, can confirm it. Thanks for your time.

A: Don't mention it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>



I'm in tears from reading this, lol

Hilarious!

Dephkt
02-14-2010, 07:02 PM
Originally posted by H.A.R.M.s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by savior2006:
Just hope they don't have a Beland in their midst as well, who was frustrated by having to be a "silent assasin".
Q: Tell us, what are the biggest changes in game and what were the reasons for you making them?

A: You know, when we looked previous titles, we couldn't not to see 47's resemblance with f***ing limo driver.

Also, we find slow paced assassination gameplay frustrating. I mean, 47's world's greatest assassin, why would he have to slowly eliminationg his targets.

That's why we are now using new system, Mark and Assassinate. When player steps in new level, he has to locate targets using sonar goggles, Mark them and press A button to Assassinate.

Q: Wow, it's super cool. You know, I'm old school Hitman fan, but this looks amazing. It has words "Hollywood blockbuster" screaming from every scene in the game. Pew pew pew.

A: Glad to hear it, that's the effect we wanted to cause. Especially with M&A, when you press Assassinate button, you can relax, sit peacefully in your chair and watch 47 eliminating his targets. There's no longer need for player to be on his toes while planning his assassination, exploring possible routes and ways for assassinate, and be frustrated when NPCs discover him.

Q: Will there be demo?

A: There's no need for it. This game is so awesome, super sexy, and solely based on that players should buy it. It is still a Hitman game, you can see it in the title.

Q: Yes it is, I, thrustworthy reporter/old Hitman fan, can confirm it. Thanks for your time.

A: Don't mention it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sir you've made my day - this is exactly what the game is, an interactive Bourne movie.

When a game is designed to make the player feel "badass" then you know there's a problem. Maybe it's that the new generation of gamers don't care whether or not they need to work for a goal anymore, they just want to look good achieving it. Call me stereotypical, but it's a trend that I see even in many of my friends.

What happened to bragging about beating a game? I remember those days when I spent countless hours just trying to beat a section of a game, but now most games just beg you to complete them.

savior2006
02-14-2010, 08:23 PM
Originally posted by H.A.R.M.s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by savior2006:
Just hope they don't have a Beland in their midst as well, who was frustrated by having to be a "silent assasin".
Jamesdreng: Tell us, what are the biggest changes in game and what were the reasons for you making them?

Yabob/Beland: You know, when we looked previous titles, we couldn't not to see 47's resemblance with f***ing limo driver. That's why we gave him a comfortable pink sweater.

Also, we find slow paced assassination gameplay frustrating. I mean, 47's world's greatest assassin, why would he have to slowly eliminationg his targets.
That's why we are now using new system, Mark and Assassinate. When player steps in new level, he has to locate targets using sonar goggles, Mark them and press A button to Assassinate.

Jamesdreng: Wow, it's super cool. You know, I'm old school Hitman fan, but this looks amazing. It has words "Hollywood blockbuster" screaming from every scene in the game. Pew pew pew.

Yabob/Beland: Glad to hear it, that's the effect we wanted to cause. Especially with M&A, when you press Assassinate button, you can relax, sit peacefully in your chair and watch 47 eliminating his targets. There's no longer need for player to be on his toes while planning his assassination, exploring possible routes and ways for assassinate, and be frustrated when NPCs discover him.
As an added plus, players won't have to worry about slow-paced things like conserving ammo, because I personally gave all the weapons unlimited ammo. I mean "so what" right?

Jamesdreng: [giggles like a pixie] Right! Will there be a demo?

Yabob/Beland: There's no need for it. This game is so awesome, super sexy, and solely based on that players should buy it. It is still a Hitman game, you can see it in the title.

Jamesdreng: Yes it is, I, thrustworthy reporter/old Hitman fan, can confirm it. Thanks for your time-
[the door breaks open. Jamesdreng and Yabob/Beland turn to see IO's version of Tom Clancy standing with Chuck Norris. Norris cracks his knuckles].
IO Tom Clancy: They're the ones Chuck!
Chuck: I'm about to show you *******s how to waterboard somebody without any pants on.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Fixed.

Joshua Morrison
02-15-2010, 12:25 AM
Thats really funny and completely depressing at the same time.... as Splinter Cell was my favorite series ever. I would wish someone would ruin his favorite game ever (Rainbow Six) but.... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif he all ready did...IMO

stavros_27
02-15-2010, 01:54 AM
Just hope they don't have a Beland in their midst as well, who was frustrated by having to be a "silent assasin".

Or they were frustrated by the decrease in sales of a well established "silent assasin" game, and the fact that a low percentage of players were even completing the story missions.

ggghhh123451
02-15-2010, 02:07 AM
lol. i knew it. its just like when people tried to boycott l4d2. half the people who did it ended up buying it when it didnt work. i saw this coming a mile away.

savior2006
02-15-2010, 06:24 AM
I must've missed that somewhere in here. Who said anything about a boycott in this thread?

H.A.R.M.s
02-15-2010, 06:28 AM
Originally posted by NeonXXV:
Though if IO really does it..... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif Well, last Blood Money's mission isn't promising... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif


Originally posted by Dephkt:
What happened to bragging about beating a game? I remember those days when I spent countless hours just trying to beat a section of a game, but now most games just beg you to complete them. I tried to beat last part of PT's last mission with CQC kills.

These days it's all about QTE's and other "cool stuff" that are completly ruining gaming. I remeber old games, puzzles were mind breaking, now it's limited to "press A" to advance.


Originally posted by scottjames7296:
lol. i knew it. its just like when people tried to boycott l4d2. half the people who did it ended up buying it when it didnt work. i saw this coming a mile away. It's completely different situation here. L4D and L4D2 are almost the same game. The boycott was about preventing community ruining, not about game went in opposite direction.

FrankieSatt
02-15-2010, 06:31 AM
Originally posted by stavros_27:Or they were frustrated by the decrease in sales of a well established "silent assasin" game, and the fact that a low percentage of players were even completing the story missions.

No, you must not have listened to the interviews. Beland himself said he was "Frustrated" after playing previous Splinter Cell games. The only reason to be "Frustrated" would be because of the stealth aspect and the fact that being stealthy takes too long for someone like him.

savior2006
02-15-2010, 09:41 AM
The only thing that frustrated me was when I didn't save for a while and then died. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif
Like I said, with Chaos Theory I've done assault runs on normal and hard. I've even tripped alarms and gone guns blazing. I took damage, I died sometimes, but in the end I won. I understand the thing about the shooting mechanics, but this new generation's increased desire towards easy/shallow games has gotten on my nerves for far too long.

stavros_27
02-15-2010, 12:59 PM
No, you must not have listened to the interviews. Beland himself said he was "Frustrated" after playing previous Splinter Cell games. The only reason to be "Frustrated" would be because of the stealth aspect and the fact that being stealthy takes too long for someone like him


Wait...so sales had not decreased? And they lied about the % of people completing the game? I guess you got me.

newhenpal
02-15-2010, 01:14 PM
Originally posted by stavros_27:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">No, you must not have listened to the interviews. Beland himself said he was "Frustrated" after playing previous Splinter Cell games. The only reason to be "Frustrated" would be because of the stealth aspect and the fact that being stealthy takes too long for someone like him


Wait...so sales had not decreased? And they lied about the % of people completing the game? I guess you got me. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think I recall what interview you're referring to. Did it have to do with Double Agent? I'm still stumped on how they figured out how many people completed the game.

stavros_27
02-15-2010, 01:33 PM
There must have been a way to monitor how many levels we completed through our XBL connection.

As for the sales...they rank like this:

Splinter Cell
Splinter Cell PT
Splinter Cell DA
Splinter Cell CT

So at the end of the day, the best rated game was by far the worst selling one. It was clear by the sales that people were frustrated with the gameplay of the first 2 games and it turned them away from playing CT. I believe that this was the real reason that Ubi wanted to change directions when UBI Montreal wanted to make the original Conviction build with hobo sam, which was so different than the previous games.

And their decision not to release Conviction on PS3 could be attributed directly to the horrible sales of the PS versions compared to the xbox versions. Double Agent sold just 170,000 copies on the PS3, compared to 1,160,000 on the 360 according to this link.

http://www.vgchartz.com/games/...egion=All&alphasort= (http://www.vgchartz.com/games/index.php?&results=50&name=splinter%20cell&console=&keyword=&publisher=&genre=&order=Sales&boxart=Both&showdeleted=&region=All&alphasort=)


The 2 biggest issues 'fans' have with Conviction can be blamed on the fans.

1. The PS3 isn't seeing Conviction because Ubi realized the risk would by far outweigh the reward after DA was a sales disaster on the PS3.

2. People want Chaos Theory 2.0 because everyone loved Chaos Theory....except people weren't lining up to buy buy Chaos Theory. And this game had the luxury of being released after the XBox was well established with the most consoles out there at its time of release.

newhenpal
02-15-2010, 02:20 PM
Originally posted by stavros_27:
There must have been a way to monitor how many levels we completed through our XBL connection.

Well there you have it; you don't know, you're just making assumptions.

VGChartz also makes assumptions as well, they base they figures on rough guesses.

stavros_27
02-15-2010, 02:50 PM
Well there you have it; you don't know, you're just making assumptions.

lol..how would I know the exact process of that? I know that Rockstar knew what radio station players listened to most in GTA IV, and added tracks to that station in its first dlc pack. Does it means that it's not true because I don't know how they figured it out?

We heard right from a dev that they knew what % of players finished the story. If that isn't good enough proof for you, then I don't know what to tell you.

As for VGchartz's numbers are concerned...can you post a more reliable source? Or are you just going to cover your eyes and say the numbers aren't real?

Chaos Theory sold poorly compared to the first 2 games. Whether the numbers are 100% accurate or 90 % accurate, it is plain as day to see. It makes sense that Ubisoft decided to change the SC series following the disappointing sales of Chaos Theory. Their stealth game formula was failing.

Mr.E.Bear
02-15-2010, 03:18 PM
Originally posted by newhenpal:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by stavros_27:
There must have been a way to monitor how many levels we completed through our XBL connection.

Well there you have it; you don't know, you're just making assumptions.

VGChartz also makes assumptions as well, they base they figures on rough guesses. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Pretty sure they just looked at the Achievements of the XBL users with DA.

AGENTxxxxx47
02-15-2010, 03:42 PM
Originally posted by stavros_27:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Well there you have it; you don't know, you're just making assumptions.

lol..how would I know the exact process of that? I know that Rockstar knew what radio station players listened to most in GTA IV, and added tracks to that station in its first dlc pack. Does it means that it's not true because I don't know how they figured it out?

We heard right from a dev that they knew what % of players finished the story. If that isn't good enough proof for you, then I don't know what to tell you.

As for VGchartz's numbers are concerned...can you post a more reliable source? Or are you just going to cover your eyes and say the numbers aren't real?

Chaos Theory sold poorly compared to the first 2 games. Whether the numbers are 100% accurate or 90 % accurate, it is plain as day to see. It makes sense that Ubisoft decided to change the SC series following the disappointing sales of Chaos Theory. Their stealth game formula was failing. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Or maybe they need to go back to the heavier stealth focus of the 1st 2 games.

As good as Chaos Theory was/is , the fantastic MP spys vs. mercs , I thought the SP direction to wards more action spelled the demise of evolving stealth features in the series.

People often romanticize CT , forgetting that Chaos Theory SP added "assault" load outs and removed the 3 alarms rule. While CT improved stealth AI finding bodies it also removed stealth punishments.


I remember loading up CT the day it was released and thinking to myself , "this direction to wards assault features" will probably lead to future games removing even more core stealth features.

If what you say is true then they need to go back to deeper core stealth features since the 1st 2 games had punishing results for any stealth failures.

PT had alarms and it was "game over" if stealth failed and the 1st game had "absolute stealth only" missions.

So your right they should go back to the 1st 2 games hardcore stealth elements if they do indeed have the best sales overall.

If those truly are the best selling games then go back to the hardcore stealth formula.

Chaos Theory introduced the "less punishment for stealth failed" and added completely non-stealth options like "assault" and the "no mission failure if stealth is broken" feature.

I for one liked the alarms because as a stealth player never needed or cared for the alarms because I never tripped them, so the 3 alarm rule never affected my gameplay at all. I just liked it because it was a meter for how stealthy I was , it is afterall a video game , I just liked anything that adds to the stealth formula.

Once you start removing "stealth fail punishment" then it no longer is a stealth game. There is no longer tension based on keeping stealth since losing stealth now is a reward , LKP.

Countless brats whined and moaned about the alarms because they likely approached the game with an "assault" mindset, so CT added assault and removed the alarm rules to appease the "stealth fail" crowd.

I think it should be mission over if stealth is failed , I think there should be only stealth options.
With a market flooded with action games there are very few with "stealth only" as an option.

Like you said the 1st two games sold the best and they had the "hardcore" stealth features.

Chaos Theory is awesome for Spys vs. Mercs but it also introduced less stealth fail restrictions which I didn't like and I was worried at the time future splinter cells would include perhaps an entire game based upon a "assault" mindset.

Well Cue Conviction and call me Nostradamus


Also in regards to the % of players that finish games, how do they account for offline players without live subscriptions or internet at all.

AGENTxxxxx47
02-15-2010, 04:09 PM
Conviction 2 :Sam is REALLY mad now


http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/8095/th123416163734.gif (http://img186.imageshack.us/i/th123416163734.gif/)

Si1entDark
02-15-2010, 04:12 PM
Originally posted by AGENTxxxxx47:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H.A.R.M.s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by savior2006:
Just hope they don't have a Beland in their midst as well, who was frustrated by having to be a "silent assasin".
Q: Tell us, what are the biggest changes in game and what were the reasons for you making them?

A: You know, when we looked previous titles, we couldn't not to see 47's resemblance with f***ing limo driver.

Also, we find slow paced assassination gameplay frustrating. I mean, 47's world's greatest assassin, why would he have to slowly eliminationg his targets.

That's why we are now using new system, Mark and Assassinate. When player steps in new level, he has to locate targets using sonar goggles, Mark them and press A button to Assassinate.

Q: Wow, it's super cool. You know, I'm old school Hitman fan, but this looks amazing. It has words "Hollywood blockbuster" screaming from every scene in the game. Pew pew pew.

A: Glad to hear it, that's the effect we wanted to cause. Especially with M&A, when you press Assassinate button, you can relax, sit peacefully in your chair and watch 47 eliminating his targets. There's no longer need for player to be on his toes while planning his assassination, exploring possible routes and ways for assassinate, and be frustrated when NPCs discover him.

Q: Will there be demo?

A: There's no need for it. This game is so awesome, super sexy, and solely based on that players should buy it. It is still a Hitman game, you can see it in the title.

Q: Yes it is, I, thrustworthy reporter/old Hitman fan, can confirm it. Thanks for your time.

A: Don't mention it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/7996/00081275.gif (http://img40.imageshack.us/i/00081275.gif/) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

"I'm trapped in a glass case of emotion!"

ggghhh123451
02-15-2010, 04:15 PM
Originally posted by savior2006:
I must've missed that somewhere in here. Who said anything about a boycott in this thread?

people arent going to buy the new splinter cell conviction because they dont like the direction... HMMMMM

stavros_27
02-15-2010, 04:22 PM
So your right they should go back to the 1st 2 games hardcore stealth elements if they do indeed have the best sales overall.

I actually disagree with that. The original SC sold the best, by far. After that, the sales started a steady decline until DA sold a bit more than CT. I think the style of SC1 and PT slowly pushed fans away from the series. Chaos Theory was by far the best of the 4 games. I think it didn't sell well because people who played the first or both games before it were overly frustrated by its pacing and consequences for being detected. PT introduced a multiplayer component to the series, which I think attributed to the game still selling well despite having the same singleplayer emphasis on stealth and shadows.

The SC series lost a lot of customers between SC and DA. Continuing to focus on pure stealth gameplay like the first 2 games would lead to the demise of the series. Conviction is their way of trying to get those fans plus even more casual fans back. People that didn't even like the first SC games or never played them are excited about Conviction. You can't say the same thing about Chaos Theory. Ultimately, the sales of this game will determine if it really was the right decision to broaden it and go in the direction they went with it.

I think the current game has a much better chance to sell well over a game that continued from the Chaos Theory mold, or even that followed the first 2 SC stealth styles.

ggghhh123451
02-15-2010, 04:24 PM
It's completely different situation here. L4D and L4D2 are almost the same game. The boycott was about preventing community ruining, not about game went in opposite direction.

the fact is people arent buying it because they dont like whats happening. thats the same thing that happened for left 4 dead. and people still bought it.

savior2006
02-15-2010, 04:34 PM
Originally posted by scottjames7296:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by savior2006:
I must've missed that somewhere in here. Who said anything about a boycott in this thread?

people arent going to buy the new splinter cell conviction because they dont like the direction... HMMMMM </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
That ain't a boycott. That's just people not buying the game.
Edit: Scott, someone today already pointed out the difference between L4D and Splinter Cell Conviction.

AGENTxxxxx47
02-15-2010, 04:43 PM
Originally posted by stavros_27:
There must have been a way to monitor how many levels we completed through our XBL connection.

As for the sales...they rank like this:

Splinter Cell
Splinter Cell PT
Splinter Cell DA
Splinter Cell CT

So at the end of the day, the best rated game was by far the worst selling one. It was clear by the sales that people were frustrated with the gameplay of the first 2 games and it turned them away from playing CT. I believe that this was the real reason that Ubi wanted to change directions when UBI Montreal wanted to make the original Conviction build with hobo sam, which was so different than the previous games.

And their decision not to release Conviction on PS3 could be attributed directly to the horrible sales of the PS versions compared to the xbox versions. Double Agent sold just 170,000 copies on the PS3, compared to 1,160,000 on the 360 according to this link.

http://www.vgchartz.com/games/...egion=All&alphasort= (http://www.vgchartz.com/games/index.php?&results=50&name=splinter%20cell&console=&keyword=&publisher=&genre=&order=Sales&boxart=Both&showdeleted=&region=All&alphasort=)


The 2 biggest issues 'fans' have with Conviction can be blamed on the fans.

1. The PS3 isn't seeing Conviction because Ubi realized the risk would by far outweigh the reward after DA was a sales disaster on the PS3.

2. People want Chaos Theory 2.0 because everyone loved Chaos Theory....except people weren't lining up to buy buy Chaos Theory. And this game had the luxury of being released after the XBox was well established with the most consoles out there at its time of release.

what's up with that chart?

They list Double Agent on XBOX-1 as having ZERO sales , am I reading that right?

ggghhh123451
02-15-2010, 04:47 PM
Originally posted by savior2006:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by scottjames7296:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by savior2006:
I must've missed that somewhere in here. Who said anything about a boycott in this thread?

people arent going to buy the new splinter cell conviction because they dont like the direction... HMMMMM </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
That ain't a boycott. That's just people not buying the game.
Edit: Scott, someone today already pointed out the difference between L4D and Splinter Cell Conviction. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

all that matters is that people arent buying the game because they dont like what they get. in my original post it might have sounded like i ment this was a boycott. but i didnt mean it like that. i know this isnt a boycott.

yerffejk
02-15-2010, 04:48 PM
This is more directed towards that agentx whatever guy than anyone else, although there are quite a few people that whine about the most inane crap here.

Somehow, you bemoan a CHOICE given to you in taking things with a more direct approach in the most well rounded of the SC games. I can't fathom how this is justifiable as a complaint. They never force these things on you, and you have the option to play the entire game as stealthily as you please, ratings and all to really up that stealth nerd ***** for you. Are you honestly going to sit there and say that they should have just kept making the same game over and over with minor tweaks till the franchise rotted? I'd rather SC didn't end up like Dynasty Warriors, guy. Chaos Theory was the pinnacle of the series, and partly because of that choice it gave you.

It wasn't and neither is the franchise some Tactical rpg that has strict rules to which real life doesn't apply. It's stealth action, not stealth alone. Given no choice, it feels antiquated. I can understand a lot of people's frustrations with the changes to the newest addition. What i can't understand, is how it's lingered. This happens and you move on. This isn't last gen, where games cost significantly less to make. To appeal to the most wide demo, they are going to dumb it down to make that money. I think after hearing from so many people, they might realize they need to at least add the choice back of key elements in the sequel, such as body carrying and ability to turn off certain things like black and white indicator.

Agent's accusations of the series selling less and less has little to do with the action they implemented, I'm sure. I'm baffled as to how this guy thinks that stuff would fly nowadays and somehow gain followers. You know, what every franchise hopes to do? Get off the hardcore high horse, guy. Your reasoning is flawed. I don't like the lack of a true way to stealth my way through the new game, but you don;t see me jumping to out there conclusions. Any idiot who dropped CT, as you seem to claim because they didn't like the choices they gave you which only improved the formula are just that, idiots.

logik1911
02-15-2010, 05:04 PM
I'm both a casual gamer AND fan of the SC series (but not necessarily a stealth purist)-so you can say I'm one of the consumers Ubisoft has is looking to lock in.

Well, there's something to it, because Conviction is my most anticipated game of 2010 (right above Alan Wake, Spec Ops: The Line, and True Crime 3).

I've since joined these forums, pre-ordered the Collector's Edition and the strategy guide, I'm re-subscribing to xbox live just to get a crack at the co-op, and I'm ordering the European collector's edition to get their bonus content as well. Seems like a mission accomplished for Ubi, if they can get a casual gamer such as me this excited for a release. This game will move copies and the word of mouth will accelerate it among the casual set. I expect it to sell along the lines of an Assassin's Creed.

Quite honestly, from the gameplay footage I've seen, there is still no other game quite like it on the market. It's NOT a generic shooter like Stranglehold or Gears of War. You have alot more options with the CQC, stealth, close range tactics, Light and Shadows, and yes, shooting, lol. Something like Gears of War, which is basically run and gun and cover, gets repetitive fairly easily. You have to implement more gameplay variety, and Conviction does it better than most from what I've seen.

My only peeve about Conviction is the removal of SVM. That would have made this game just about perfect. But from a market driven strategy point, this game will succeed in bringing people back. Perhaps the developers can tweak future iterations (dragging bodies), to give you more of a pure stealth experience and less of a hybrid. More options are always better than fewer.

AGENTxxxxx47
02-15-2010, 05:11 PM
Originally posted by yerffejk:
This is more directed towards that agentx whatever guy than anyone else, although there are quite a few people that whine about the most inane crap here.

Somehow, you bemoan a CHOICE given to you in taking things with a more direct approach in the most well rounded of the SC games. I can't fathom how this is justifiable as a complaint. They never force these things on you, and you have the option to play the entire game as stealthily as you please, ratings and all to really up that stealth nerd ***** for you. Are you honestly going to sit there and say that they should have just kept making the same game over and over with minor tweaks till the franchise rotted? I'd rather SC didn't end up like Dynasty Warriors, guy. Chaos Theory was the pinnacle of the series, and partly because of that choice it gave you.

It wasn't and neither is the franchise some Tactical rpg that has strict rules to which real life doesn't apply. It's stealth action, not stealth alone. Given no choice, it feels antiquated. I can understand a lot of people's frustrations with the changes to the newest addition. What i can't understand, is how it's lingered. This happens and you move on. This isn't last gen, where games cost significantly less to make. To appeal to the most wide demo, they are going to dumb it down to make that money. I think after hearing from so many people, they might realize they need to at least add the choice back of key elements in the sequel, such as body carrying and ability to turn off certain things like black and white indicator.

Agent's accusations of the series selling less and less has little to do with the action they implemented, I'm sure. I'm baffled as to how this guy thinks that stuff would fly nowadays and somehow gain followers. You know, what every franchise hopes to do? Get off the hardcore high horse, guy. Your reasoning is flawed. I don't like the lack of a true way to stealth my way through the new game, but you don;t see me jumping to out there conclusions. Any idiot who dropped CT, as you seem to claim because they didn't like the choices they gave you which only improved the formula are just that, idiots.

wrong person I didn't post sales stats and all that

stavros_27
02-15-2010, 05:19 PM
LOGIK1911, what are your thoughts on the first 4 games of the SC series? Curious to hear the view of a more casual fan.

yerffejk
02-15-2010, 05:21 PM
No, you didn't. My bad. Just consider it a grouping then of both of your guys' complaints. In the long run, they don't add up. Not for the continuation of the franchise. I understand not liking change when you think it's fine as is, but without growing to appeal to a wider audience, that stagnation just spells death.

CT only added to the stealth elements, it didn't hinder things. The three alarm rule uprooted an archaic way of punishment. If it's supposed to immerse you in any way, or even try, as far as putting you in the boots of a spec ops type guy. You're gonna role with the punches should things go south. To have a mission fail come up because you were spotted is just an old school train of thought in line with things like the lack of save anywherespots. there's no benefit. Only frustration.

AGENTxxxxx47
02-15-2010, 05:38 PM
Originally posted by yerffejk:
No, you didn't. My bad. Just consider it a grouping then of both of your guys' complaints. In the long run, they don't add up. Not for the continuation of the franchise. I understand not liking change when you think it's fine as is, but without growing to appeal to a wider audience, that stagnation just spells death.

CT only added to the stealth elements, it didn't hinder things. The three alarm rule uprooted an archaic way of punishment. If it's supposed to immerse you in any way, or even try, as far as putting you in the boots of a spec ops type guy. You're gonna role with the punches should things go south. To have a mission fail come up because you were spotted is just an old school train of thought in line with things like the lack of save anywherespots. there's no benefit. Only frustration.

If you play the game stealthily then alarms will never bother you .

Splinter Cell was never about frustration to me I enjoyed the stealth aspects.

But when developers say things like " I got allot frustrated"

maybe they weren't playing the game as intended

You don't go out onto a football field and say "hey I wanna win the game without the football"

And then get mad because you find out the only way to play is with the football and then say you were frustrated you can't win a football game without using a football.

So you complain and moan about football having a football in it and ask for the rules to be changed.

yerffejk
02-15-2010, 05:49 PM
So you're saying you'd play a brand new SC with the same setup, punishment and all , just with a new story? No need for improvement. If you're honest with yourself, you'd readily admit SC had problems itself. It makes absolutely no sense to have your protagonist supposedly be a special agent who's so horrible at getting out of a jam, that it's almost comical.

You're football analogy doesn't work either, because you're implying that the game was only ever about stealth. It wasn't. What does it say under the very first Splinter Cell for XBOX 1? It doesn't say stealth redefined. It says stealth action. If you wanted nothing but stealth, with a possibility of no encounters, what's the point of a gun? They gave you the option in the first two to use action as your way out as well. The only problem is that up until Conviction, the action part has been laughable. The series never sailed under the banner of strictly stealth, as all the "purists" would have you believe. As fun as it would be for a few, it would turn off the many potential buyers out there.

I agree Conviction isn't like the older ones, but a sequel with this good of an engine could easily put back things you liked about previous ones to satisfy your stealth needs. Nothing says you can't have both.

stavros_27
02-15-2010, 05:51 PM
But when developers say things like " I got allot frustrated"

I think they were trying to figure out why they weren't retaining customers, instead of losing them in bunches after each game was released. They realized that a lot of the gameplay elements in those games were frustrating the average player and casual gamer.

How do you fix those issues and gain the lost customer's trust back? You show them that you got rid of/improved the things that turned them away from the series in the first place.

Max's comments about the slow gameplay, 3 alarms, being screwed when you're detected, and eveyrthing else was a big Marketing ploy to convince previous customers and new potential customers that this game is in fact different from the other ones.

The 2-3 million players who bought Splinter Cell but ditched the series by the time Chaos Theory was out will now consider getting Conviction, rather than ignoring another Splinter Cell game that focuses on stealth similar to the first 3 games, which forced them away from the series in the first place.

When millions of people stop buying your product, you have no choice but to make changes. Or they can keep rehashing the same type of game and lose more customers with each edition. It had to be done.

logik1911
02-15-2010, 05:51 PM
@Stavros_27:

I should disclose that my favorite video games are tactical shooters and military types (With Assassin's creed series being an exception). So right off the bat I prefer the GRAWs and RSVs and MW2s.

Splinter Cell...I have this ranked as one of the best I've ever played. It was the most innovative game I'd seen up to that point. And I love tom clancy techno thrillers (i've read them all), so the game was a perfect fit. Although it wasn't an action packed extravaganza, what got me was the TENSION-it delivered in spades. Breaking into CIA headquarters is an experience few other games will emulate, and I was sweating while playing.

PT and CT were also fun. I did have to use strategy guides to beat both, though. I didn't really have the time to sit and study a game inside and and never really cared about 100% stealth ratings, so I pretty much just got to sit back and enjoy the story and gameplay. And SVM is the best MP ever, hands down. It's why I seriously question over and over why they left it out-this feature alone would have won the hardcore purists and probably doubled sales!

Never played DA. At some point I will, but I must admit, I was lured by the "blockbuster" titles that were released over the past couple of years and I didn't really care for the premise (John Brown Army?)

I like the look of conviction because it seems new and innovative, and combines most of what I WANT TO SEE in games. It's not just a generic stop and pop running shooter. The stuff Sam can do now is impressive: kick down doors, throw people out of windows, beautifully effective CQC (the best I've seen in a game of this type and it's not flashy),combat rolls, sliding into cover, breaking down doors with NPCs...I like how resourceful and efficient they've made him in case the stuff hits the fan and it's all up to you how you use it. I'm also a fan of the projected text/movies and LKP (for tactical advantage). I just don't see this being as boring as a generic shooter with all of the abilities they give you, and I think you can maintain the level of tension I enjoyed about the first game. Check out the video where Sam sneaks into 3E...it's ALL stealth and looks great.

http://www.gametrailers.com/vi...-splinter-cell/61828 (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-third-splinter-cell/61828)

FrankieSatt
02-15-2010, 06:28 PM
Originally posted by LOGIK1911:Check out the video where Sam sneaks into 3E...it's ALL stealth and looks great.

http://www.gametrailers.com/vi...-splinter-cell/61828 (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-third-splinter-cell/61828)

It doesn't look great because you have the crappy black/white desaturation when you are "Stealthy". Also, avoiding detection in one small area doesn't equal stealthy. Avoiding dectection during the whole level when the enemy doesn't know you are there is stealthy.

I'll give props to this video as so far it's the ONLY ONE that shows ANYTHING stealthy.

AGENTxxxxx47
02-15-2010, 06:35 PM
Originally posted by yerffejk:
So you're saying you'd play a brand new SC with the same setup, punishment and all , just with a new story? No need for improvement. If you're honest with yourself, you'd readily admit SC had problems itself. It makes absolutely no sense to have your protagonist supposedly be a special agent who's so horrible at getting out of a jam, that it's almost comical.

You're football analogy doesn't work either, because you're implying that the game was only ever about stealth. It wasn't. What does it say under the very first Splinter Cell for XBOX 1? It doesn't say stealth redefined. It says stealth action. If you wanted nothing but stealth, with a possibility of no encounters, what's the point of a gun? They gave you the option in the first two to use action as your way out as well. The only problem is that up until Conviction, the action part has been laughable. The series never sailed under the banner of strictly stealth, as all the "purists" would have you believe. As fun as it would be for a few, it would turn off the many potential buyers out there.

I agree Conviction isn't like the older ones, but a sequel with this good of an engine could easily put back things you liked about previous ones to satisfy your stealth needs. Nothing says you can't have both.

No ..I'm saying add all the action you want , but not at the sake of ruining the experience for the core stealth fan.

I don't think an evolved feature is aim-bot mark and execute or last known casper, to me those do not represent evolution but de-evolution of the series.

It's a win button designed to entice the casual gamer , Beland said he wanted gamers to finish his game and he gives them win buttons to do just that.

With so many action games on the market what's wrong with evolving stealth towards a deeper compelling direction past hiding in shadows.

Action gamers have plenty of choice , but stealth gamers are seeing their series hi-jacked for the sake of the action/casual gamer.

Sure let them into our party but don't remove our fun too.

Make LKP, M/E toggle off , but they can't because these are the pillars of the foundation , these features they are the game's standing foundation.

It's hard to just say "don't use them"

I will try my best.


But I could play another 100 levels based upon the 1st gameplays mechanics re-skinned , better enemy AI.


I liked the slow gameplay , the tension, the stress , that was fun and it was different than the fast paced pew pew pew action of many games of that era and this era.

The 1st splinter cell is relevant today just as it was back then.

It represented a different approach to gameplay a thinking mans approach.

Now its flank ,grab somebody ,earn your execute, mark and execute rinse repeat. You see everyone through walls tag everything you can , grab one guy and then pew pew the rest.

You could add much more to the older gamestyle than just re-hashing it.

Never once did I say "hey I feel like grandma in a bat-suit" this game is horrible I need aim-bot and casper to help me out.

The 1st game sold well because it was different from the twitch action crowd. Now I fear Conviction joins that crowd.

Someone here said "you can't have stealth without accountability" and its true you shouldn't reward stealth fail.
There needs to be accountability in stealth games, you don't earn the title stealth/action by failing stealth and rewarding stealth fail.

If you fail at killing a boss enemy , your likely to be sent to the restart screen, if you fail stealth in a stealth game you should be sent to restart screen because you failed at the game mechanic. You shouldn't be mad for failing at the game mechanic and being punished for doing so, it's counterintuitive.

what's next? Games with just one button controllers?

"OMG I HAVE TO PRESS THE BUTTON AGHAGHA" I hate one-button I feel like grandpa

newhenpal
02-15-2010, 07:10 PM
Originally posted by stavros_27:


As for VGchartz's numbers are concerned...can you post a more reliable source?



You got it all backwards. You're the one that wanted to prove the wanning sales of the series, so it's you that has to post a reliable source.

Doesn't matter though. Sales will never be a good justification for the devolution of a series.



Or are you just going to cover your eyes and say the numbers aren't real?

Who's covering their eyes? It's a known fact that VGChartz is equivalent to a horoscope in accuracy.



Chaos Theory sold poorly compared to the first 2 games.

Are we going by the Xbox sales here? Because CT sold, according to VG, .31 million less than PT. I wouldn't really call it "poorly" in comparison.



Whether the numbers are 100% accurate or 90 % accurate, it is plain as day to see.

Try 40 to 25%. Yes, their predictions are usually THAT OFF before the NPD reports go online.



It makes sense that Ubisoft decided to change the SC series following the disappointing sales of Chaos Theory. Their stealth game formula was failing.

By your logic, it doesn't. It was Chaos Theory that introduced the more liberal approach to accomplishing missions, along with a new modified version of the Unreal engine, among other things.

Double Agent, another change to the series, didn't fair much better either. Especially the 6th gen version, which sold 0 copies apparently.

stavros_27
02-15-2010, 07:37 PM
No..you have it all wrong. I posted a source to prove my point. You claimed that it wasn't credible..yet you have no proof of that, and you didn't have any other sources.

"Sales will never be a good justification for the devolution of a series."

Okay. So Halo sells 10 million copies, and Halo 2 uses the same formula and sells 2 million copies. Are you saying that Halo 3 should keep the same exact formula despite losing 8 million customers since sales will NEVER be a good justification to make significant changes to a series?

You wouldn't consider the pinnacle of the SC series selling LESS than the previous game, and 3.43 million copies less than the first SC to be poor?

It's simple. The original SC concept and gameplay was NOT keeping the attention of gamers. A large portion of players did not like it or got sick of it, as seen by its large decrease after SC. You apparently want another CT clone to come out, and don't care how well it sells as long as you get that game. Meanwhile, Ubisoft would be out of business if it left its decisions up to you.

FrankieSatt
02-15-2010, 08:08 PM
Originally posted by stavros_27:
No..you have it all wrong. I posted a source to prove my point. You claimed that it wasn't credible..yet you have no proof of that, and you didn't have any other sources.

"Sales will never be a good justification for the devolution of a series."

Okay. So Halo sells 10 million copies, and Halo 2 uses the same formula and sells 2 million copies. Are you saying that Halo 3 should keep the same exact formula despite losing 8 million customers since sales will NEVER be a good justification to make significant changes to a series?

You wouldn't consider the pinnacle of the SC series selling LESS than the previous game, and 3.43 million copies less than the first SC to be poor?

It's simple. The original SC concept and gameplay was NOT keeping the attention of gamers. A large portion of players did not like it or got sick of it, as seen by its large decrease after SC. You apparently want another CT clone to come out, and don't care how well it sells as long as you get that game. Meanwhile, Ubisoft would be out of business if it left its decisions up to you.

No one has said they want a Chaos Theory clone, we want a Splinter Cell game that focuses on Stealth. You can have a game that focues on Stealth AND have enough action to bring in the casual game players. What you need is a dev team that WANTS to have Stealth, this dev team doesn't.

Aveelo
02-15-2010, 08:22 PM
Originally posted by FrankieSatt:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by stavros_27:
No..you have it all wrong. I posted a source to prove my point. You claimed that it wasn't credible..yet you have no proof of that, and you didn't have any other sources.

"Sales will never be a good justification for the devolution of a series."

Okay. So Halo sells 10 million copies, and Halo 2 uses the same formula and sells 2 million copies. Are you saying that Halo 3 should keep the same exact formula despite losing 8 million customers since sales will NEVER be a good justification to make significant changes to a series?

You wouldn't consider the pinnacle of the SC series selling LESS than the previous game, and 3.43 million copies less than the first SC to be poor?

It's simple. The original SC concept and gameplay was NOT keeping the attention of gamers. A large portion of players did not like it or got sick of it, as seen by its large decrease after SC. You apparently want another CT clone to come out, and don't care how well it sells as long as you get that game. Meanwhile, Ubisoft would be out of business if it left its decisions up to you.

No one has said they want a Chaos Theory clone, we want a Splinter Cell game that focuses on Stealth. You can have a game that focues on Stealth AND have enough action to bring in the casual game players. What you need is a dev team that WANTS to have Stealth, this dev team doesn't. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Stealth In Game Now Stop Complaining

newhenpal
02-15-2010, 08:24 PM
Originally posted by stavros_27:
No..you have it all wrong. I posted a source to prove my point. You claimed that it wasn't credible..yet you have no proof of that, and you didn't have any other sources.



I thought the PC versions of the series and 6th gen DA selling 0 copies were good indicators of their unreliable figures, but whatever. Here: http://www.wired.com/gamelife/.../06/why-we-dont-ref/ (http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2008/06/why-we-dont-ref/)



"Sales will never be a good justification for the devolution of a series."

Okay. So Halo sells 10 million copies, and Halo 2 uses the same formula and sells 2 million copies. Are you saying that Halo 3 should keep the same exact formula despite losing 8 million customers since sales will NEVER be a good justification to make significant changes to a series?

Making changes to a series because of sales can be justified. Devolving it can't.



You wouldn't consider the pinnacle of the SC series selling LESS than the previous game
Poor? No. Dissapointing? Sure.



and 3.43 million copies less than the first SC to be poor?

Tragic.

But this is all assuming that VGChartz is on target with their flimsy predictions, of course.



You apparently want another CT clone to come out, and don't care how well it sells as long as you get that game.

My sig. But I guess you read that before, and put this in your post in order to spite me, you rebel, you.



It's simple. The original SC concept and gameplay was NOT keeping the attention of gamers. A large portion of players did not like it or got sick of it, as seen by its large decrease after SC...Meanwhile, Ubisoft would be out of business if it left its decisions up to you.

Splinter Cell isn't for everyone; it caters to a niche market. I think we all know this.

In the heat of all of this, I think I forgot to ask this: why does this matter? I believe everyone was arguing about the quality and faithfulness of the game to the series, not how this approach to making a sequel is good because it will put some extra cash in the wallets of Ubisoft stockholders and executives.

FrankieSatt
02-15-2010, 08:26 PM
Originally posted by Aveelo:Stealth In Game Now Stop Complaining

I've seen 1 minute of it and even that was clipped together and not a whole video. I won't stop complaining, I will continue to voice my concerns and displeasure with what I see in the topics that allow me to.

You don't like my posts, don't read them. Your choice.

AGENTxxxxx47
02-15-2010, 08:31 PM
Originally posted by FrankieSatt:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Aveelo:Stealth In Game Now Stop Complaining

I've seen 1 minute of it and even that was clipped together and not a whole video. I won't stop complaining, I will continue to voice my concerns and displeasure with what I see in the topics that allow me to.

You don't like my posts, don't read them. Your choice. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

yeah I was being nice about the vid , did you notice he goes from the pipe right into the air-duct , quick edit there, I bet he just killed 3 guys to get to that duct,the video jumps at that point if you watch it, then it cycles back outside with another edit , not continuous like so many other gameplay videos

with some creativity I can make UT look stealthy

looks like an edit job to me

Aveelo
02-15-2010, 08:52 PM
Originally posted by FrankieSatt:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Aveelo:Stealth In Game Now Stop Complaining

I've seen 1 minute of it and even that was clipped together and not a whole video. I won't stop complaining, I will continue to voice my concerns and displeasure with what I see in the topics that allow me to.

You don't like my posts, don't read them. Your choice. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

LOl You Complaining On Best Game In World Hmm You Are OK ? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

stavros_27
02-15-2010, 08:55 PM
A 2 year old post is supposed to make the sales numbers for SC that I posted irrelevant?

Anyways.. having the same core gameplay elements and story from the first 3 games in a new SC game would mean the end of the SC series. If you want the SC series to die, then so be it. I don't.

Makempay
02-15-2010, 09:25 PM
Originally posted by LOGIK1911:
@Stavros_27:

Check out the video where Sam sneaks into 3E...it's ALL stealth and looks great.

http://www.gametrailers.com/vi...-splinter-cell/61828 (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-third-splinter-cell/61828)

It looks almost as great as this vid (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-mansion-splinter-cell/61830) where Sam throws an NPC out a 2nd story window that lands a few feet from another NPC that doesn't react at all to the thump of the body that just fell from the sky.

Or this vid (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-mansion-splinter-cell/61832) where the NPCs shoot at (and one even sprints to) the silhouette of a man jumping out of a window (who they apparently they think is suspended in mid-air). This game could have been special but right now it falls into the Transformers 2 category of all flash and very little substance.

Fortunately deniable ops can get away with that so that's what I'll look forward to.

oO_ShadowFox_Oo
02-15-2010, 10:30 PM
Originally posted by stavros_27:
Ultimately, the sales of this game will determine if it really was the right decision to broaden it and go in the direction they went with it.

I think the current game has a much better chance to sell well over a game that continued from the Chaos Theory mold, or even that followed the first 2 SC stealth styles.

Ultimately the sales will determine if this game managed to attract a more action orientated audience to the game.

You can Hollywood action pimp ANY game and I can almost guarantee you that sales will increase.

Is that the right thing to do for a franchise? IMO, not at all. Hollywood action has it's place, sure, but its not in one of the very FEW non mainstream titles whose entire existence was conceived around NOT being a Hollywood action blockbuster.

But you're right, this game has a much better chance to sell than the previous games, because it's sucking on the teety of the mainstream, but it will most definitely not be a Splinter Cell game with the approach it has outlined for itself since the E3 revelation.

sammyboy1981
02-15-2010, 11:47 PM
Originally posted by oO_ShadowFox_Oo:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by stavros_27:
Ultimately, the sales of this game will determine if it really was the right decision to broaden it and go in the direction they went with it.

I think the current game has a much better chance to sell well over a game that continued from the Chaos Theory mold, or even that followed the first 2 SC stealth styles.

Ultimately the sales will determine if this game managed to attract a more action orientated audience to the game.

You can Hollywood action pimp ANY game and I can almost guarantee you that sales will increase.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Wow...so sales = creative success, huh?

I guess this makes Avatar the greatest movie ever filmed...Thriller the greatest song ever sung...The Da Vinci Code the greatest book ever written, and BeJeweled the greatest game ever produced!!!

Don't worry, Shadow, the lack of a legit multiplayer mode means this game will dive from the charts fast...and I doubt that "GR:Future Soldier" beta will attract very many (especially with HALO REACH beta up on May 1st)

ggghhh123451
02-16-2010, 12:32 AM
Now its flank ,grab somebody ,earn your execute, mark and execute rinse repeat. You see everyone through walls tag everything you can , grab one guy and then pew pew the rest.

what? do you have the game? how about the review. this guy CLAIMS to be a real splinter cell fan. dont you have some faith in someone who has ALSO loved the splinter cell franchise since the beginning?


I won't lie; it's a little rough to play Conviction at the outset. The design goes against everything I've experienced in stealth games for the past decade. If you can't shake off the ghosts of stealth games past, you're going to have a lot of trouble surviving in Conviction. But after a few rough minutes, I managed to catch on and tackle a very different kind of stealth game.

doesnt this sound like what everyones problem is?

Mr.E.Bear
02-16-2010, 01:30 AM
Originally posted by scottjames7296:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Now its flank ,grab somebody ,earn your execute, mark and execute rinse repeat. You see everyone through walls tag everything you can , grab one guy and then pew pew the rest.

what? do you have the game? how about the review. this guy CLAIMS to be a real splinter cell fan. dont you have some faith in someone who has ALSO loved the splinter cell franchise since the beginning?


I won't lie; it's a little rough to play Conviction at the outset. The design goes against everything I've experienced in stealth games for the past decade. If you can't shake off the ghosts of stealth games past, you're going to have a lot of trouble surviving in Conviction. But after a few rough minutes, I managed to catch on and tackle a very different kind of stealth game.

doesnt this sound like what everyones problem is? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Funny thing is, he doesn't sound like a fan.

Notice how all this second wave PR is focussed on telling us how the game is still the same? We have Redding telling us that he loves sneaking up on people and using non lethals (though he is awful at it)and then we have paid Journos sprouting claims that it's the same before... this is Hilary Goldstein we're on about, the man puts thw IGN into ignorant.

stavros_27
02-16-2010, 01:59 AM
Wow...so sales = creative success, huh?

I don't think anyone implied that. I implied that sales is one (of many) measures of a game's success.

SC is one of the most unique and exciting series' that I have ever played. But I am not going to ignore the obvious reasons that changes were made to the series.

With that said, as a big fan of all 4 main SC games, I am very excited to get my hands on Conviction when it comes out.

H.A.R.M.s
02-16-2010, 02:12 AM
Originally posted by scottjames7296:
the fact is people arent buying it because they dont like whats happening. thats the same thing that happened for left 4 dead. and people still bought it. L4D players like L4D2, because they like L4D. They threatened to boycott game, not because they wouldn't like gameplay, rather than they thought that it will divide community and that they would lost everything they gained in MP.

Conviction is nothing like previous SC, and many old school fans don't like it and, in contrast to L4D2 case, don't feel appeal to play it. If someone say "used or bargain bin" it's bound to happen. MP is uncharted teritory, and gameplay is far from they used to in series (again, difference between L4D2 and SC:C).

newhenpal
02-16-2010, 08:36 AM
Originally posted by stavros_27:
A 2 year old post is supposed to make the sales numbers for SC that I posted irrelevant?



Yes. Or are you seriously under the impression that the PC and GC version sold 0 copies?



Anyways.. having the same core gameplay elements and story from the first 3 games in a new SC game would mean the end of the SC series. If you want the SC series to die, then so be it. I don't.

What's the point of keeping it alive if it doesn't resemble what it once was? You'd just be getting a zombie; a rotting shell of its former self.

Rea1SamF1sher
02-16-2010, 09:54 AM
Actually we had such a sale list a few months ago:

SC - About 6 million
SCCT - About 5.5 million
SCPT - About 3-4 million
SCDA - About 3-4 million

Though the numbers are not important...

oO_ShadowFox_Oo
02-16-2010, 09:56 AM
Originally posted by Andre202:
Actually we had such a sale list a few months ago:

SC - About 6 million
SCCT - About 5.5 million
SCPT - About 3-4 million
SCDA - About 3-4 million

Though the numbers are not important...

LOL - they kind of are because they blow stavros's case out of the water http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

stavros_27
02-16-2010, 11:00 AM
"Yes. Or are you seriously under the impression that the PC and GC version sold 0 copies?"

No, I am under the impression that they probably do not have the sales figures for those 2 games. You really aren't a fan of logic, are you?

As for those sales numbers...can I see a link for those?

sykosquirrel08
02-16-2010, 11:29 AM
Hey...due to the developers of Gears of War say they're also going in a different gameplay direction, maybe these titles will switch roles. Ya see...Splinter Cell used to be a great stealth based title, and now it's mindless auto-pilot run and gun. Gears of War has always been a mindless run and gun. Maybe the new GoW will be a good stealth game.

(There's sarcasm hidden in there somewhere)

But on a serious note, this game will be forgotten about within two months of its release. I played Mass Effect 2 once and I probably won't play it again until just before the release of the third one. I actually forgot I had it until just now. It's a shame to see one of my favorite franchises(Splinter Cell) on life-support.

newhenpal
02-16-2010, 02:35 PM
Originally posted by stavros_27:
"Yes. Or are you seriously under the impression that the PC and GC version sold 0 copies?"

No, I am under the impression that they probably do not have the sales figures for those 2 games. You really aren't a fan of logic, are you?

As for those sales numbers...can I see a link for those?

Logic would deem that, if they can get figures for the obscure DS version of Chaos Theory, they could get some figures for over half of the retail games they listed.

sgt_brent
02-16-2010, 02:45 PM
Originally posted by sykosquirrel08:
..this game will be forgotten about within two months of its release...It's a shame to see [Splinter Cell] on life-support.

I feel like a lot of games receive hype hype hype before they're release; Then after - It seems to die off completely.. Modern Warfare 2 had more hype than anything I can think of off the top of my head.. That was released on November 10th? Here we are 3 months after release, and there isn't much of anything MW2 anymore.. Online play, sure - For the fans who want to play it.. What about the folk who bought it, played it for a couple weeks, then forgot about it? Like me!

Conviction will be released, and a couple months seems reasonable; It will die off - But the people who will continue to play it will be fans.. And since it seems to have a bit more of a R6 feel to it than I originally thought, I can see current R6 MPs maybe picking up SCC to play it, as well as the average joe who goes out to get it, who likes it..

To point a finger at Conviction and say it will be forgotten about after 2 months, r that it's on life support - I dunno, man.. Cause that just seems pretty normal for ANY game anymore?

Rea1SamF1sher
02-16-2010, 02:49 PM
I have no link for this numbers. I only know from some news that SC sold more then 6 million copies and SCCT more the 5.5 million copies. The other two have to be between 3-4 million copies because the whole series was sold more then 19 million times. You don't have to believe it but the titles from Original Dev Team of SC have sold more then the titles from Shanghai, although SCPT wasn't bad at all.

oO_ShadowFox_Oo
02-16-2010, 03:47 PM
Originally posted by sgt_brent:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sykosquirrel08:
..this game will be forgotten about within two months of its release...It's a shame to see [Splinter Cell] on life-support.

I feel like a lot of games receive hype hype hype before they're release; Then after - It seems to die off completely.. Modern Warfare 2 had more hype than anything I can think of off the top of my head.. That was released on November 10th? Here we are 3 months after release, and there isn't much of anything MW2 anymore.. Online play, sure - For the fans who want to play it.. What about the folk who bought it, played it for a couple weeks, then forgot about it? Like me!

Conviction will be released, and a couple months seems reasonable; It will die off - But the people who will continue to play it will be fans.. And since it seems to have a bit more of a R6 feel to it than I originally thought, I can see current R6 MPs maybe picking up SCC to play it, as well as the average joe who goes out to get it, who likes it..

To point a finger at Conviction and say it will be forgotten about after 2 months, r that it's on life support - I dunno, man.. Cause that just seems pretty normal for ANY game anymore? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

MW 2 forgotten?

Sorry but there will be more people playing MW 2 regularly online for the next 2 years than most games will even fathom to achieve in total sales.

THAT is the power of a strong online multiplayer and what the game was designed to deliver.

Just because you've stopped playing it and are no longer subjected to the pre-release marketing onslaught does not mean that the game is forgotten. The numbers still actively playing it are HUGE.

sgt_brent
02-16-2010, 04:44 PM
Originally posted by oO_ShadowFox_Oo:
The numbers still actively playing it are HUGE.

Yes they are.. You make me laugh http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

sammyboy1981
02-16-2010, 05:43 PM
Originally posted by stavros_27:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Wow...so sales = creative success, huh?

I don't think anyone implied that. I implied that sales is one (of many) measures of a game's success.

SC is one of the most unique and exciting series' that I have ever played. But I am not going to ignore the obvious reasons that changes were made to the series.

With that said, as a big fan of all 4 main SC games, I am very excited to get my hands on Conviction when it comes out. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

YOU "implied" that good sales would suggest that the direction they went with the game was the correct one...read your own statements carefully.

stavros_27
02-16-2010, 07:34 PM
That doesn't mean I think creative success = sales. Their decision will end up being a good one if it sells well, and outsells the recent SC editions.

It doesn't mean the idea/direction was more creative than the previous SC games, but it will make a strong case that it was the right decision to make with the series.

I don't think there is much more to say at this point. Unless the sales numbers that Andre mentioned are accurate, then I can admit my points are not valid.

TheZerby
02-16-2010, 08:38 PM
This is like what happened to the RE series really. When RE4 came around a whole slew of new "fans" came too and said it was the best just cause it was the first one they played and it was more action. It's exactly what's happening with SCC since it's changing the formula from the true fans to be accessible to the new "fans" and since it's their first they say it's the best... Then the entire series will end but being as so...

kidmosey
04-14-2010, 08:36 PM
Originally posted by TheZerby:
This is like what happened to the RE series really. When RE4 came around a whole slew of new "fans" came too and said it was the best just cause it was the first one they played and it was more action. It's exactly what's happening with SCC since it's changing the formula from the true fans to be accessible to the new "fans" and since it's their first they say it's the best... Then the entire series will end but being as so...

You have to admit the original RE games were far from perfect.

Every game has room for improvement. Saying any of the previous SC games were perfection incarnate is like saying there is nothing wrong with Convictions.

And along the same lines, saying a game is not part of the same series because it doesn't share the same poor game mechanics/animations as its predecessors is just as naive.

CaptainROE
04-14-2010, 11:27 PM
Originally posted by Andre202:
He says at least five times that it is now easier to play Splinter Cell. I could start up a topic about that. Films, Games, TV programs are making us stupid. Had an conversation with my mum. She said she is getting annoyed of the "new" TV shows and programs explaining a scene or something at least two times so idiots can understand this too.

More attention to AI and Gameplay please. Not Hollywood and Graphics. And I think on the PC this game is even easier (at least on Normal Mode, what we have seen).

That's cute, you had a conversation with your mom about the deeper things in life.

Rod_Borza
04-14-2010, 11:45 PM
Originally posted by AGENTxxxxx47:
True ....

stealth gamers are running out of options

I guess were not allowed to have a pure stealth game.

It's against geneva conventions or something.

Hitman 2010 please God , don't make it an action game with lasers

Stealth scares most gamers , they sleep with night lights on too. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Agreed! That's the problem with the franchise right now. Splinter Cell WAS the go to place to high-tech, high-stakes, think-your-way-through spy adventure. Now, that's gone... We ran out of options...sadly.
And the funny part is that the problem is not whithin the game. The game is great, only it should have been called '24' or Jason Bourne's new adventure.
And the way I see it, with Ubi not backing down from their decision, I posted a thread suggesting what could be done to help the franchise, for old AND new players.
http://forums.ubi.com/eve/foru...1091065/m/2611099258 (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/5271091065/m/2611099258)
Hope it helps someone at UBI to listen to us, older fans.
It is it or doing like the Need For Speed franchise that created an arcadey game and started a new franchise to please the hardcore fans. Or..*sigh*...abandoning the SC series for good...

RaulO4
04-14-2010, 11:46 PM
see this (http://www.youtube.com/user/NextGenWalkthroughs#p/u/6/cErFcwdA-zM)

ok this is a walkthrough of the game but they guy is speaking his own mind

look at walkthrogh for the fist 5 mission
it Somes up alot of what dark siders mean

RaulO4
04-15-2010, 12:02 AM
Feedback (http://g4tv.com/thefeed/blog/post/703925/Feedback----Gears-of-War-3-and-Splinter-Cell-Conviction-Edition.html)

they talk about God of War 3
and ask if Scc is still Sc
i dont know what they say is good or bad but take a look
i have not yet seen it

blue1988
04-15-2010, 12:09 AM
Originally posted by mattduck69:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by sammyboy1981:
Yikes, this is a "preview" from a longtime SC fan? She (I presume from the author) mentions words like headshots, firefights...and since when is Sam considered a "trained killer"?

yer i know aye wen they kept on saying trained killer i was thinking they got sam mixed up with agent 47
Well in a since he is a train killer from the books he was a Navy Seal, moved to CIA before he ascended to the NSA/3E no matter what agency you work for espcially field work you're trained to kill, but with different methods.