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FI_Macca44
11-23-2004, 05:52 PM
I've been playing a Royal navy Corsair campaign and have noticed that AI has sometimes problems with taking off Corsairs with bombs and rockets.I managed to take off, next plane also but 3rd and 4th splashed into the water,even though they had more free runway then me and the second Corsair.Does it have something to do with the ordnance load or is it just the infamous AI of IL/PF?

Snootles
11-23-2004, 06:35 PM
I believe it's a combination thereof. The heavy ordnance is the sort of thing that was usually solved with catapults (not modeled in PF yet). The problem is compounded by the fact that the AI doesn't have quite as fine high-AoA control or acute a "sense" of the envelope as human pilots, even with no force feedback.

johann63
11-23-2004, 07:27 PM
with a heavy bomb load I find it impossible to make a take off if the carrier is still, like in a df map, but if it is moving its doable just have to be careful.

Stanger_361st
11-23-2004, 07:44 PM
It uesd to be not a problem, after the patch it is a problem. I know the flight models have changed. Do not know now if it is historicaly correct now are not. I am looking in the internet for facts about payloads off carriers and can not find any. Does anybody know?
Thanks Stanger

stansdds
11-24-2004, 04:25 AM
Corsairs operating from carriers during WW II would usually not carry more than one 154 gallon drop tank on the starboard pylon, one 500 pound bomb on the port pylon and eight 5 inch HVAR's. This payload represented a total of about 2700 to 2800 pounds of external ordnance. Corsairs could lift this without a catapult from the large carriers, but required a long deck run at full throttle and full flaps with the carrier turned into the wind.

FI_Macca44
11-24-2004, 06:35 AM
I see.So this could be the reason why some of the planes controlled by AI splash into the water.But I'm better-I can take off even though I'm the first to do this and have the shortest runway.Even though I love this gamehttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gifBut now I know why the ordnance chosen by computer was only 500 lb bombs and with my 8 rockets and 3000 lb they splashed....

SeaFireLIV
11-24-2004, 07:10 AM
I remember F16 Falcon 3.0 (boy did I have some fun with that...Exec.bat config, aaaarrghhh! The older boys will understand) would have the ground Crew Chief tell you when you were taking too much or wrong ordnance for a mission.

Perhaps IL2/PF should have a little caption pop up in FB when you take too much saying something like, " I wouldn`t advise that sir, the boys may not be able to take off with such a heavy amount of bombs."

stansdds
11-24-2004, 07:34 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I remember F16 Falcon 3.0 (boy did I have some fun with that...Exec.bat config, aaaarrghhh! The older boys will understand) would have the ground Crew Chief tell you when you were taking too much or wrong ordnance for a mission <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I remember that!!!! So long ago, I was using a Pentium 120 MHz at the time (or was it a Commodore Amiga?) and that was darned near state of the art! I also liked the conversation that came from the RIO in the F-14 in Jane's U.S. Navy Fighters.

BinaryFalcon
11-24-2004, 09:28 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I remember F16 Falcon 3.0 (boy did I have some fun with that...Exec.bat config, aaaarrghhh! The older boys will understand) would have the ground Crew Chief tell you when you were taking too much or wrong ordnance for a mission. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I remember something similar in Falcon (1) as well. Well, that and "The last one was stolen, Sir" when I'd try to load up on certain weapons. Even at that young age, I always thought that was a rather lame excuse. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

As for the old autoexec/config.sys stuff, I remember it well. Worst program I ever had to deal with was Fleet Defender. IIRC, it required somewhat just over 600KB of base memory free.

Try fitting all of the requirements for an advanced late era DOS game plus normal system requirements on a bootdisk in less than 20-30k. It was rough.

scootertgm
11-24-2004, 10:12 AM
Aye, it was rough, but htere was a real feeling of acomplishment when you could get the stuff you needed and still squeeze out 624kb available http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Kompan
11-24-2004, 12:33 PM
I downloaded some missions from www.flightsim.com (http://www.flightsim.com) and some had the Corsair fitted with 2 bombs, rockets, and 50% fuel. I would go swimming everytime. Once I got rid of the rockets or bombs, I was able to take off easier. Weight is an issue... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

stansdds
11-24-2004, 01:59 PM
You should be able to waddle off the deck with two 500 pound bombs and eight HVARS, that load out is actually some 600 pounds lighter than eight HVARS, one 500 pounder and one 154 gallon drop tank. Of course the carrier needs to be steaming into the wind. I think the speed of the carrier combined with the prevailing winds gave the pilots about a 40 to 60 knot head start. Hold the brakes (chocks in PF), bring the engine up to 100%, then release the brakes. Big thing to remember about any carrier take off, do not haul back on the stick when you leave the deck or you will stall. Let the plane settle and suck up the landing gear as fast as you can. Once you have gained sufficient speed, begin a very gentle climb, once you have some speed and altitude you can begin to retract the flaps. This is the way real pilots did it, this is the way I do it in CFS2 and unless something is screwy with PF, it should work.

Fliger747
11-24-2004, 03:10 PM
The above works just fine! A shallow right turn was initated on departure to prevent getting run over by the ship in case of a (ahem) problem.

The issue is wind over the deck, which may or may not be a patchable issue with the sim engine. At home (don't try this at the office) I set the carriers up steaming at about 30 knots, which provids a minimal realistic wind over the deck for opeations. Online this is a problem, CFS2 never solved it either.

My AI guyz are always cashing into the water, one even flew into the side of the ship.

In real ops of the time, allowable weight was determined by condition (by guess or expeience) and launch position on the deck. Torpedo Bombers were often spotted last. Wind over the deck was the biggest consideration and catapults were necessary for some of the heavier launches in less than favorable conditions, or especially on CVE's!