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XyZspineZyX
09-02-2003, 12:10 PM
Humm,

We keep on having deadly rear gunners on bombers.

Another thing interesting is that one or two hits in your fighter engine is enought to shoot you down (specially in 109s), if you get some hits in a bomber engine it keep on.

Ack-ack gets incredible shoots (i was in a dive at 450km/h in my 109E and a i got my engine k.O.)

Compare dogfigthing between CFS2 and FB (CFS2 better for me), few hits are enough, now the distance is shorter.

8 Mgs of P-47 are a fake. (4 Mgs of a B-239 are more lethal ho ho ho ...).

P-47 missions are ridiculous, when you aproach close your target you normally encounter enemy fighters, and the P-47 begin to fly in circles like idiots, and one by one are falling down (shoot down). No real evasive action.


Game has improved.

Good luck.

Johann

XyZspineZyX
09-02-2003, 12:10 PM
Humm,

We keep on having deadly rear gunners on bombers.

Another thing interesting is that one or two hits in your fighter engine is enought to shoot you down (specially in 109s), if you get some hits in a bomber engine it keep on.

Ack-ack gets incredible shoots (i was in a dive at 450km/h in my 109E and a i got my engine k.O.)

Compare dogfigthing between CFS2 and FB (CFS2 better for me), few hits are enough, now the distance is shorter.

8 Mgs of P-47 are a fake. (4 Mgs of a B-239 are more lethal ho ho ho ...).

P-47 missions are ridiculous, when you aproach close your target you normally encounter enemy fighters, and the P-47 begin to fly in circles like idiots, and one by one are falling down (shoot down). No real evasive action.


Game has improved.

Good luck.

Johann

XyZspineZyX
09-02-2003, 12:46 PM
HansvonEnde wrote:
- We keep on having deadly rear gunners on bombers.

Just stay away from them. They are supposed to shoot you down, not just to make some fireworks!

- Another thing interesting is that one or two hits in
- your fighter engine is enought to shoot you down
- (specially in 109s), if you get some hits in a
- bomber engine it keep on.

2 motors bombers can fly on one engine, 4 motors on 2.
And liquid cooled fighters such as 109 were prone to get serious engine damages on few hits, due to the architecture
of their cooling system and so on.

- Ack-ack gets incredible shoots (i was in a dive at
- 450km/h in my 109E and a i got my engine k.O.)

Keep engine RPMs and temperature within reasonable limits and it will be ok. Moreover, when you dive decrease throttle (and decrease prop pitch % if manual-regulated).

- Compare dogfigthing between CFS2 and FB (CFS2 better
- for me), few hits are enough, now the distance is
- shorter.

I have CFS3, and combats are less accurate, since planes behave more or less the same, they stall very rarely and graphics suck!

- 8 Mgs of P-47 are a fake. (4 Mgs of a B-239 are more
- lethal ho ho ho ...).

Just shot at convergence distance!

- P-47 missions are ridiculous, when you aproach close
- your target you normally encounter enemy fighters,
- and the P-47 begin to fly in circles like idiots,
- and one by one are falling down (shoot down). No
- real evasive action.

That can be true. I don't know since I never fly the Jug... it's too much... a jug!
Other planes (Yaks, 190s, 109s, I-16, etc) behave OK.

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XyZspineZyX
09-02-2003, 01:23 PM
HansvonEnde wrote:
- Humm,
-
- We keep on having deadly rear gunners on bombers.

Nope. Naturally rear gunners do have _some_ effect. Do you think they were just for show?

- 8 Mgs of P-47 are a fake. (4 Mgs of a B-239 are more
- lethal ho ho ho ...).

Make sure to press mg trigger AND cannon trigger. They both fire 4 .50cals each.




--
Joques
Ok, so you've got a Yak
That don't impress me much

XyZspineZyX
09-02-2003, 11:53 PM
HansvonEnde wrote:
- Humm,
-
- We keep on having deadly rear gunners on bombers.
-

I agree. All combatants found that sending unescorted daylight bombers into contested air space was suicide yet these flexible gunners can shoot a house fly's eye out going 300 kh at a range of 500 m. If actual flexible gunners were that good, there would have been no need for escort fighters. We are not asking to make flexible gunners impotent (both von Richtofen and Suburu Sakai (to name two famous fighter pilots) were struck by flexible gunners) but they shouldn't be the Annie Oakleys they are now.

Link to photos of the helmet Suburu Sakai was wearing when a flexible gunner got him:

http://www.j-aircraft.com/walk/randy_Stiefer/miscellaneous_items.htm

Another feture I thought might just be fun is towed target sleeves as a training mission. In the Eighth Air Force, fighter pilots were expected to hit a towed target sleeve with 5% of their bullets. The game could give us the stats on how well we do at gunnery on a target sleeve.

I know not what course others may choose, but as for me, give me computer games or give me television!

Message Edited on 09/02/0304:56PM by RexFeral

XyZspineZyX
09-03-2003, 01:40 AM
Gunners are not so accurate if you have your speed up! The only way to be killed by an AI gunner is to float up on a bomber's 6 and start cruising into their fire arcs. NO-ONE would do this in real life, which is why sending unescorted bombers in daylight was suicide.

If you are making an attack on a bombers 6, you should be closing at around 200-300 kph at least. They have the same sorts of MGs as you, or in some cases better (eg, dual MG81Z in Stuka D), they can aim the gun instead of the whole plane, and they can point right at the vulnerable front of your AC, and you expect to be able to shoot the bomber down first?!?

Use up-and-under attacks, high speed dives, attacks on the 3 o clock line, stand off attacks with rockets or 30/37mm, somthing! Don't just cruise up to it like you would with a fighter.

XyZspineZyX
09-03-2003, 01:53 AM
Bnej_03 wrote:
- Gunners are not so accurate if you have your speed
- up! The only way to be killed by an AI gunner is to
- float up on a bomber's 6 and start cruising into
- their fire arcs. NO-ONE would do this in real life,
- which is why sending unescorted bombers in daylight
- was suicide.
-
- If you are making an attack on a bombers 6, you
- should be closing at around 200-300 kph at least.
- They have the same sorts of MGs as you, or in some
- cases better (eg, dual MG81Z in Stuka D), they can
- aim the gun instead of the whole plane, and they can
- point right at the vulnerable front of your AC, and
- you expect to be able to shoot the bomber down
- first?!?
-
- Use up-and-under attacks, high speed dives, attacks
- on the 3 o clock line, stand off attacks with
- rockets or 30/37mm, somthing! Don't just cruise up
- to it like you would with a fighter.
-
-

Yep agree here, bombers won't simply let you line up a shot if they can help it, you need to either get higher or lower then them and decide where you want to strike then go for it. Whether it's a climb underneath them to stay in the least amount of firing arcs or to simple aid your stealth tehn strike at the wingroot or engines. Or come in at 3 o'clock high and strafe the aircraft across the wing and cockpit. Or my favourite coming from 12 - 11 o'clock high and attacking the cockpit or engines in a dive attack.
Of course follow through is just as important as the actual attack run so once you pass your objective/target don't turn for an immediate another attack keeping diving or if climbing split-s off and then resume the same attack position or a new position. It usually takes several passes this way to down an enemy four engine bomber.

XyZspineZyX
09-03-2003, 02:39 AM
These comments on AI bombers gunners being too accurate are completely wrong. They`ve been softened seen the original FB. Now if you fly against bombers properly it`s VERY hard for gunners to shoot you down.
I reckon some of you whiners have gotta be making a slow beeline right behind a bomber and therefore being easily shot by gunners who were specifically stuck in the rear of bombers for targets like that.

If Olegg made the gunners any less effective they would be pointless to have and I`d drop the patch with that in or FB altogether. I personally think ground AAA is too soft as it is, but I digress.

I want realistic enemy gunners, not `gunners who shoot at me and scare me a bit but never hit!`

"Tis better to work towards an Impossible Good, rather than a Possible Evil."

SeaFireLIV.