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XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 07:23 AM
I need some data from some of the experts around here. I found a photo and artical about the P-38 that said all L-5 series had the K-14 gunsight. Early P-38L's did not because of a shortage (P-51 was using them all). I need photo's of the K-14 installed in a P-38L and any data at all for this. I need it for Oleg. If I cant find referances, he will need to put the standard N-9 gunsight in the late model L's! Please, anyone? I cant find the photo that I had.

Gib

All hail the ME-262 Fliegenm├┬Ądchen!

XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 07:23 AM
I need some data from some of the experts around here. I found a photo and artical about the P-38 that said all L-5 series had the K-14 gunsight. Early P-38L's did not because of a shortage (P-51 was using them all). I need photo's of the K-14 installed in a P-38L and any data at all for this. I need it for Oleg. If I cant find referances, he will need to put the standard N-9 gunsight in the late model L's! Please, anyone? I cant find the photo that I had.

Gib

All hail the ME-262 Fliegenm├┬Ądchen!

XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 08:20 AM
The CAF at Camarillo airport have a P-38L (1944), I will contact them tomorrow and see if it is installed and is in its original configuration.

S!
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Black 1
TX Squadron XO
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XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 08:31 AM
Hmmm... - tricky one.


http://p38.webzdarma.cz/Galerie/bw/cockpit.jpg

http://www.barnstormers.com/uploads/adphotos/a8034p1690501120orig.jpg

& the control box:

http://www.barnstormers.com/uploads/adphotos/a4424p1335164928orig.jpg

in a P51:

http://www.p51.mustangsmustangs.com/Pics/Military/EarlyYears/11.jpg

- showing the little frame where you dial the enemyÔ┬┤s wingspan.

S!

M0NS (authorized P39 pyrotechnician)



"Blow up the outside world"

http://www.flugwerk.de/images/01k.jpg
My garage!



Message Edited on 09/23/0307:55AM by M0NS

XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 09:29 AM
I think Gibbage knows what the sight looks like (and regardless, it has already been modelled for the P-51). What he is looking for is photographic proof that this sight was used on the P-38L so that Oleg will include it in the game that way, rather than using the older sight commonly found in P-38s.

--AKD

http://www.flyingpug.com/pugline2.jpg

fluke39
09-23-2003, 09:47 AM
sorry to invade this thread when i have nothing to contribute to the original post.....

but...

the picture you posted with the sights in mons - the no hand hold cushion thingy - was that nothing to do with the k-14 sight but rather a standard cushion thingy fitted to all american planes?

anyway BUMP to the top this thread goes

and i hope you find what ur looking for gibbage
(p.s k-14 in p51 and possibly in p38 - does this mean we will actually be able to work it? - )

<center><img src=http://mysite.freeserve.com/Angel_one_five/flukelogo.jpg>

XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 11:28 AM
BUMP. Ya. The P-51 has a working K-14 gunsight. That will help out a lot. I want it in a P-38.

fluke39 wrote:
- sorry to invade this thread when i have nothing to
- contribute to the original post.....
-
- but...
-
- the picture you posted with the sights in mons - the
- no hand hold cushion thingy - was that nothing to do
- with the k-14 sight but rather a standard cushion
- thingy fitted to all american planes?
-
- anyway BUMP to the top this thread goes
-
- and i hope you find what ur looking for gibbage
- (p.s k-14 in p51 and possibly in p38 - does this
- mean we will actually be able to work it? - )
-
- <center><img
- src=http://mysite.freeserve.com/Angel_one_five/flu
- kelogo.jpg>
-



All hail the ME-262 Fliegenm├┬Ądchen!

XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 12:45 PM
Sorry guys - did my best. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif - but you said you needed anything...

S!

M0NS (authorized P39 pyrotechnician)



"Blow up the outside world"

http://www.flugwerk.de/images/01k.jpg
My garage!

Message Edited on 09/23/0311:54AM by M0NS

RichardI
09-23-2003, 12:59 PM
Gib:-
I have a complete pilot's manual in .pdf on DVD at home. I'm not sure if its an L model though. Actually, I sent it once to Jeroen who I think did the cockpit? Anyway I'll take a look when I get home and see if it's shown - there are lots of pictures in the manual.

Rich /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

<Center>http://www.ghosts.com/images/postimages/THUNDERBOLT.jpg <Center>I've got 140 109's cornered over Berlin!

XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 01:02 PM
Gibbage that's tricky, but.........do you know David Copley? He's a true P-38 expert, I knows him from the old CFS2-netwings days. Ask him about stuff.

Here the link to his site.

http://www.kazoku.org/xp-38n/index.htm



"......und mein Herz steigt wie ein Falke in die L├╝fte!"

EJGr.Ost Kimura

http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/image/ejgrost.gif


http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/Forums/

XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 01:40 PM
Thanks. I just tried the link you sent me and sent him an E-mail. It bounced back on me. Do you have his E-mail addy?

Gib

KIMURA wrote:
- Gibbage that's tricky, but.........do you know David
- Copley? He's a true P-38 expert, I knows him from
- the old CFS2-netwings days. Ask him about stuff.
-
- Here the link to his site.
-
- <a href="http://www.kazoku.org/xp-38n/index.htm"
- target=_blank>http://www.kazoku.org/xp-38n/index.h
- tm</a>
-
-
-
-
- "......und mein Herz steigt wie ein Falke in die
- L├╝fte!"
-
- EJGr.Ost Kimura
-
<img
- src="http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/image/ejgrost.gi
- f">
-
-
- <a href="http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/Forums/"
- target=_blank>http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/Forums/
- </a>
-
-
-
-
-



All hail the ME-262 Fliegenm├┬Ądchen!

XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 01:43 PM
doppelmoppel



Message Edited on 09/23/0301:47PM by KIMURA

XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 01:46 PM
His member name at netwings.org is DCC. Here a link to one of his posts. PM him via netwings, maybe that works better.
http://www.netwings.org/dcforum/DCForumID2/664.html



"......und mein Herz steigt wie ein Falke in die L├╝fte!"

EJGr.Ost Kimura

http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/image/ejgrost.gif


http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/Forums/



Message Edited on 09/23/0301:48PM by KIMURA

XyZspineZyX
09-23-2003, 04:20 PM
Gib,

ItÔ┬┤s really hard to come by any info on the K-14 - IÔ┬┤ve read somewhere that it shouldÔ┬┤ve been made by Kodak (?!)based on an earlier British "Feranti" design. Every search on K-14 gunsight will lead you to a P51 or Korea page. Seems that it was used in the Sabres too.
Another thing: Do you know if it will be adjustable when implemented in the game?

S!

M0NS (authorized P39 pyrotechnician)



"Blow up the outside world"

http://www.flugwerk.de/images/01k.jpg
My garage!

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 06:07 AM
Gib, when contacting David Copley be sure to include P-38 in the subject line. Hands down he is probably the foremost expert on virtual P-38s.

The P-38 at the USAF Museum is an L Model, maybe you could get some info there?

I will search through what I have and get back with you as soon as possible.

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 06:40 AM
The K-14 gunsight would be nice, but I think its best to have the N-9 gunsight in there anyways. If the K-14 sight was used, I'd hazard to say it wasn't put in more than 100-200 P-38L. But I'm no expert on that.

http://www.mechmodels.com/images/klv_ubisig1a.jpg


Oh yeah, I'm a P-63 whiner too! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 06:46 AM
M0NS wrote:
- Hmmm... - tricky one.
-
http://p38.webzdarma.cz/Galerie/bw/cockpit.jpg


BTW - that's probably a P-38F, G or H. Note the date on the lower right hand corner.

http://www.mechmodels.com/images/klv_ubisig1a.jpg


Oh yeah, I'm a P-63 whiner too! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 07:43 AM
vmf513 sandman should know gibbage


http://mysite.verizon.net/vze4jz7i/ls.gif

Good dogfighters bring ammo home, Great ones don't. (c) Leadspitter

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 08:13 AM
Gibbage, if you find the info you need, please consider not putting the K-14 in if it turns out only a tiny percentage of L models had them, and especially if that percentage was mostly used in Pacific after surrender of Germany.

I'm still looking for more info, but have so far found some references to the K-14 in the P-38, but no photos and no indication of theater deployed.

--AKD

http://www.flyingpug.com/pugline2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 09:05 AM
It will be up to Oleg, not me. I doubt Oleg will allow it if only a few units had the K-14, but from my understanding, all L-5's had them and thats a significant number!

Gib

A.K.Davis wrote:
- Gibbage, if you find the info you need, please
- consider not putting the K-14 in if it turns out
- only a tiny percentage of L models had them, and
- especially if that percentage was mostly used in
- Pacific after surrender of Germany.
-
- I'm still looking for more info, but have so far
- found some references to the K-14 in the P-38, but
- no photos and no indication of theater deployed.
-
---AKD
-
http://www.flyingpug.com/pugline2.jpg
-



No fancy quote or cool photo.... YET

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 09:23 AM
A.K.Davis wrote:
- Gibbage, if you find the info you need, please
- consider not putting the K-14 in if it turns out
- only a tiny percentage of L models had them, and
- especially if that percentage was mostly used in
- Pacific after surrender of Germany.

Is there really a need to count up those Russian UFO's in FB which were produced as prototype or in few numbers, less than 10, but mananged to made it into the game?/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif



"......und mein Herz steigt wie ein Falke in die L├╝fte!"

EJGr.Ost Kimura

http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/image/ejgrost.gif


http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/Forums/

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 09:54 AM
That's all info Ihave about P-38L. But which Lightning will be in FB? I hear about P-38J.

C:\Documents and Settings\Sergey Rudzitis\My Documents\My eBooks\P38L_1.jpg

C:\Documents and Settings\Sergey Rudzitis\My Documents\My eBooks\P38L_2.jpg

C:\Documents and Settings\Sergey Rudzitis\My Documents\My eBooks\P38L_3.jpg

C:\Documents and Settings\Sergey Rudzitis\My Documents\My eBooks\P38L_4.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 12:06 PM
Furball. Your liked the images from your hard drive. That wont work. You can E-mail them to gibbage@gibbageart.com

Also, I did both the J and L

C:\Documents and Settings\Sergey - Rudzitis\My Documents\My eBooks\P38L_1.jpg

No fancy quote or cool photo.... YET

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 12:36 PM
GOOD NEWS ALL!!! I found it!!! I already sent it to Oleg. I forgot I got the book "P-38 Walkaround" and it was in there as clear as day. It even says it was on J models! Here it is for your viewing pleasure! Sorry Luftwhiners. The P-38 just got a lot deadlier.

http://www.gibbageart.com/images/p-38withk14s.jpg


GIB!



No fancy quote or cool photo.... YET

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 12:42 PM
Gib, any way you can to the P-38D? It would be nice to have one for '42 servers.

<center>http://www.acompletewasteofspace.com/pics/cb.jpg </center>

<center>We are recruiting: www.92ndfg.com</center> (http://www.92ndfg.com</center>)

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 12:50 PM
I dont know. There are a LOT of changes needed. It would be a good B&Z aircraft. I think one of the fastest aircraft in 42. But just dont take to steep of a dive http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Gib

Cardinal25 wrote:
- Gib, any way you can to the P-38D? It would be nice
- to have one for '42 servers.
-
- <center><img
- src="http://www.acompletewasteofspace.com/pics/cb.
- jpg"></center>
-
- <center>We are recruiting: www.92ndfg.com</center> (http://www.92ndfg.com</center>)



No fancy quote or cool photo.... YET

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 01:11 PM
All photos about both L an J are mailed to You

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 01:36 PM
At least there won't be any disengaging by the enemy unless the P-38 jockey so chooses. The P-38 WAS the fastest plane in '42.

I can't wait...<rubs hands together>




http://home.earthlink.net/~aclzkim1/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/il2sig2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 07:51 PM
KIMURA wrote:
- A.K.Davis wrote:
-- Gibbage, if you find the info you need, please
-- consider not putting the K-14 in if it turns out
-- only a tiny percentage of L models had them, and
-- especially if that percentage was mostly used in
-- Pacific after surrender of Germany.
-
- Is there really a need to count up those Russian
- UFO's in FB which were produced as prototype or in
- few numbers, less than 10, but mananged to made it
- into the game?

Is there really any need to count up the number of mods and load-outs for various aircraft not included by Mr. Maddox because they were not typically used? P-38 is one of my favorite fighters. I just want to see an accurate representation of what flying one in the European Theater was like.

--AKD

http://www.flyingpug.com/pugline2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 09:04 PM
gibbage, what is the isbn of the book "P-38 walk around"

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 10:10 PM
Its 0-89747-453-8

pinche_gabacho wrote:
- gibbage, what is the isbn of the book "P-38 walk
- around"
-
-



No fancy quote or cool photo.... YET

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 10:25 PM
Manufacturer: Squadron/Signal books from USA

Subject: P-38 Lightning Walk Around

Stock No: SS5530

Type: Books Air

Description: P-38 Lightning Walk Around (SC). Davis. Inside and out coverage of Lockheed's vaunted fork-tailed devil with a special emphasis on the P-38J and later variants as well as the recon Lightnings based on their airframes. 18 full color profiles, numerous full color photos, 3-view dwgs. 40 pgs in color. 80 pgs.

MSRP: $14.95



Message Edited on 09/24/03Ô 02:28PM by tenmmike

Message Edited on 09/24/0302:36PM by tenmmike

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 10:40 PM
Huh, thats news to me. I just assumed all P-38J and L were equipped with the so-called "N-3" gunsight.

I will admit, the K-14 seems a little awkward to me, but hey... "no-miss-um", right? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://www.mechmodels.com/images/klv_ubisig1a.jpg


Oh yeah, I'm a P-63 whiner too! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 10:46 PM
A.K.Davis wrote:
-
- Is there really any need to count up the number of
- mods and load-outs for various aircraft not included
- by Mr. Maddox because they were not typically used?
- P-38 is one of my favorite fighters. I just want to
- see an accurate representation of what flying one in
- the European Theater was like.

Davis seems you misinterpreted my post./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif I'm m absolutely agree to model the K-14 into the L-5, although it was very rarely used, especially in ETO.



"......und mein Herz steigt wie ein Falke in die L├╝fte!"

EJGr.Ost Kimura

http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/image/ejgrost.gif


http://www.jagdgruppe-ost.de/Forums/

XyZspineZyX
09-24-2003, 11:27 PM
KIMURA wrote:
- A.K.Davis wrote:
--
-- Is there really any need to count up the number of
-- mods and load-outs for various aircraft not included
-- by Mr. Maddox because they were not typically used?
-- P-38 is one of my favorite fighters. I just want to
-- see an accurate representation of what flying one in
-- the European Theater was like.
-
- Davis seems you misinterpreted my post./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif I'm m absolutely agree to model
- the K-14 into the L-5, although it was very rarely
- used, especially in ETO.

Do you have numbers for K-14s used on P-38s in ETO? If so, I'm sure Gibbage would find that useful. If not, what the hell are you talking about?

--AKD

http://www.flyingpug.com/pugline2.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-25-2003, 12:26 AM
the p-38 was the fastest plane in any theater..pacific or european. corsair couldnt match it's zoom climb and that was 1 of our better fighters in the pacific. it would outturn and outclimb the p-47, but couldnt outdive the jug.

there was a mock dogfight between a p-38-h and a spitfire that was seen by 79 pilots on the ground. no matter what the spit driver did, the 38 stayed with him. it was said the 38 driver would do a cloverleaf manuver, ride the forktail in a stall, and stayed with the spit in turns, climbs, and dives.

since this is the p-38-L, i expect it to climb faster than any bird in the game...real life, it would...and supposedly fb is to be as close to real as it can get. for as big as the 38 was, it could turn with the luftwaffe fighters, outclimb/outdive, and rip the wings off with ease...hence the term, forktailed devil tag from the germans. they didnt want to take the 38 on if possible. the p-47 was an agile bird in the war and would turn with the 190's and 109's in the war...in the game, no chance. the 38 would outturn the jug easy, but wouldnt outdive it.

the 38's had 1 20mm cannon and 4x50 caliber guns. all nose mounted. the concentrated fire would kill from 1000' out with ease. there were no convergance zone for lightnings. it was a point and shoot; anything in that stream was dead meat. if the american guns were as weak in real life as they are in fb, we'd all be speakin russian, german or japanese. get with the program oleg, the 50 cal's were feared by the luftwaffe.

if the 38 is on a pay patch, it will be garenteed that if the 38 doesnt perform the way it should in all aspects.....from guns to flight performance, i will send it back and i want my cash back. i wont buy anything that's of mediocre quality and i only give 1 chance.

XyZspineZyX
09-25-2003, 01:21 AM
Wow this was very cool. lol
I was just wondering today as i was 40+ feet in the air hanging a lighted sign on the side of a new dept store
(drilling holes in the wall and humming to my self) "Gee Lee wonder what kinda Gunsight is going to be in the Lightning?"
Then when i got in and saw your post i was like wow this plane keeps getting better & better. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
Thanks for anwering my question before i aksed it Kevin. lol

Now while we're on the subject could some of our resident experts please post some info on the K-14. I'm pretty curriuos. I know very little about this device. Inquiring minds want to know /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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XyZspineZyX
09-25-2003, 01:28 AM
I'm no expert on the K-14, but basically - a special gunsight designed later in the war, which used a gyro to calculate where the rounds were going at the range it was calibrated to. It would take into effect the force of gravity and the speed you were going. Also referred to as the K14 "no-miss-um" gunsight.

http://www.mechmodels.com/images/klv_ubisig1a.jpg


Oh yeah, I'm a P-63 whiner too! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-25-2003, 01:31 AM
Ummm was it in the P-63?

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XyZspineZyX
09-25-2003, 01:34 AM
I wish it was. Sorry, but I have no referances what so ever of it in the P-63. None were used by the US, and all were test beds or sent to USSR or France. As we all know, the US would have NEVER sent a K-14 to France or Russia. We did send a bunch to Britin and I think late Mk Spits used them and some other late British aircraft.

Copperhead310th wrote:
- Ummm was it in the P-63?
-

No fancy quote or cool photo.... YET

XyZspineZyX
09-25-2003, 01:35 AM
Was used in the P-51D and onwards, late P-47D models, P-80/F-80, F-86 and I'm pretty sure a few others. No, it wasn't in the P-63.

http://www.mechmodels.com/images/klv_ubisig1a.jpg


Oh yeah, I'm a P-63 whiner too! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-25-2003, 03:13 AM
Cardinal25 wrote:
- Gib, any way you can to the P-38D? It would be nice
- to have one for '42 servers.

Cardinal,
The info. I have says that only 36 P-38Ds were produced and no P-38D ever left the U.S., that may be wrong but I think the earliest version in Europe would be the "F" model. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
KickinMule

XyZspineZyX
09-25-2003, 03:42 AM
Earliest P-38 to be used in anger AFAIK was the P-38E. I believe the first to actually shoot something down was the P-38F.

http://www.mechmodels.com/images/klv_ubisig1a.jpg


Oh yeah, I'm a P-63 whiner too! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif