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ZG77_Nagual
09-09-2003, 03:58 PM
Well, even though I love flying this plane - I banned it.
Since the patch, it's one weakness - climb - is gone and people are starting to get good in it. Rightly flown this bird is a frustration machine for everyone behind a fan. The technique is simply to stay fast and use the great rudder and instantaneous turn to pull snap shots from very close. You can rack up incredible kills-per-flight this way and never get touched. Last night, after getting clipped just after takeoff and twice on the tarmac I decided I'd just ban the thing. I think the modeling is very good - the 262 was a truly superior aircraft - but it's no fun either spending the whole mission climbing so you can maybe dive on one - or spraying and praying after you evade an 800kph pass in hopes of hitting an engine from almost 1k out (works, by the way - fairly often).

Bottom line is once you get the 262 sorted out you are going to do very well.

http://pws.chartermi.net/~cmorey/pics/p47janes.jpg

ZG77_Nagual
09-09-2003, 03:58 PM
Well, even though I love flying this plane - I banned it.
Since the patch, it's one weakness - climb - is gone and people are starting to get good in it. Rightly flown this bird is a frustration machine for everyone behind a fan. The technique is simply to stay fast and use the great rudder and instantaneous turn to pull snap shots from very close. You can rack up incredible kills-per-flight this way and never get touched. Last night, after getting clipped just after takeoff and twice on the tarmac I decided I'd just ban the thing. I think the modeling is very good - the 262 was a truly superior aircraft - but it's no fun either spending the whole mission climbing so you can maybe dive on one - or spraying and praying after you evade an 800kph pass in hopes of hitting an engine from almost 1k out (works, by the way - fairly often).

Bottom line is once you get the 262 sorted out you are going to do very well.

http://pws.chartermi.net/~cmorey/pics/p47janes.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 04:14 PM
i agree.. it`s a fun plane to fly .. but it`s very annoying to fly ├ gainst ..

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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 04:16 PM
Well we know the 262 completely unblances everything in a standard dogfight. In truth it really should not be in FB at all as flyable. Why?
Historically the Germans needed time to get used to these planes and really learn them. Which they never had. Often German pilots couldn`t get used to the rapid closure speed.

Faulty parts, problems with the jets.

Inexperienced pilots.

What we are seeing on the net is what MAY have happened if the Germans had had time (maybe a half year or 2) to really get to grips with the thing and had a lot more ME262s as well.
Of course the Brits would have had the Meteor by then and I`m sure the US would`ve had their Jet plane, so it would all equal itself.

On the net, the ME262 is an anomoly.

I don`t blame you for banning it.


edit: I`d say keep it flyable for offline campaigns... /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif


"Tis better to work towards an Impossible Good, rather than a Possible Evil."

SeaFireLIV.
(Escape Whiner Member - The need to return home!)


Message Edited on 09/09/0303:19PM by SeaFireLIV

Cpt.LoneRanger
09-09-2003, 04:47 PM
Right, but the same is for K4, LA5FN, P39, etc.

All the uber-planes had faults, that aren't modelled in FB.

LA5FN, especially the LA7 were only available in small numbers and only a few of them were built according the original plans like the LAs in IL2FB. They had a lot of problems with the engines and the wooden structure, most of them had only 50% ammo, when taking off to intercept, according to history books.

The P39 suffered from problems with the cannon (jamming) and was a VERY hard to fly plane, not to speak of aiming and hitting a fighter with that gun.

262s are a hard opponent, but it's the pilots that make them deadly, just like any other plane. Infact, I fly P40, most of the time, and downed several 262s. A single hit will turn them into a flying torch and even without complexe engine management they're a nice sitting duck, taxiing and during take-off.

greets
Cpt.LoneRanger


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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 04:52 PM
Cpt.LoneRanger wrote:
-
- The P39 suffered from problems with the cannon
- (jamming) and was a VERY hard to fly plane, not to
- speak of aiming and hitting a fighter with that gun.
-

Dunno,about the Las, but the P-39 does seem to be too nice to fly. I aways heard it was a very difficult plane to master, but in FB it`s a bit of a rocket and easy to fly.
Also, jamming guns. You`ve just reminded me that guns NEVER jam in hard turns, manouevers- they should sometimes.





"Tis better to work towards an Impossible Good, rather than a Possible Evil."

SeaFireLIV.
(Spitfire & Escape Whiner Member - The need to return home!)


"Tis better to work towards an Impossible Good, rather than a Possible Evil."

SeaFireLIV.
(Escape Whiner Member - The need to return home!)

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:08 PM
oh well, i dont know about the 39 being that uber, it is a bit overwmodelled perhaps. But you can still beat it without much problem in a G-2 with Gunpods!, i can.

http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/griffon.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:14 PM
I hear ya mate. I put a bun on the damn thing pretty soon after FB was released. In situation where server setup is Axis vs Allies... i think was the only 109 flying...rest were 262s lol.

Regards,
VFC*Crazyivan
http://www.rmutt.netfirms.com/ivan-reaper.gif

"No matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down." Ivan Kozhedub

Hawgdog
09-09-2003, 05:17 PM
So.......you're all a bunch of wussies? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
LOL, the lamest of all reasons to ban a plane- its too good

jeez..........






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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:39 PM
I dunno, on servers where the 262 is available on the both sides, I have a lot of fun just camping over the enemy base and vulching them. But I am a bit demented.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:44 PM
I thought you more into Axis vs Allies scenario Rall /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Regards,
VFC*Crazyivan
http://www.rmutt.netfirms.com/ivan-reaper.gif

"No matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down." Ivan Kozhedub

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:47 PM
then why are we having p63 ? =)

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:52 PM
Nagual,

If your the host, ban as you see fit. It's your server and you can ban if you want to.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:52 PM
SeaFireLIV wrote:
-
-
- Inexperienced pilots.
-

What do you call in-experienced pilots? Most pilots converting to the 262 were high time experienced combat pilots.

- What we are seeing on the net is what MAY have
- happened if the Germans had had time (maybe a half
- year or 2) to really get to grips with the thing and
- had a lot more ME262s as well.
- Of course the Brits would have had the Meteor by
- then and I`m sure the US would`ve had their Jet
- plane, so it would all equal itself.
-
-

Only if it is the MK 4, the early Marks could easily be taken care off by any late war prop job.

Some of the best 'fights' I had was P-47 or P-51 or Tempest vs 262s in EAW. One needed patience, so if you want instant gratification forget it.


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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:53 PM
I have had my guns jam in the P-39 in hard turns. Just last night in fact (offline.) I was making a pass on a from behind Ju88 and got a little too close. I rolled left and pulled hard while still blasting away. Two guns jammed. I got his engines burning though!

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:54 PM
hawgdog the jet is totally UNtouchable if flown correctly. ONLY another jet can down a jet. if you shoot a jet down flying a p40 you just shot a total noob down who takes stupid chances. weve experimented with this subject for months on mastiffs server. what happens is one guy takes a jet. then the other team takes a jet to counter and vice versa till its half jets. this destroys any tactics of prop planes. everyone then has to jump in jets. we finally banned it even though many on our team love the jet including me. it unbalances a dogfight. if you dont believe me just ask any good squad on the net to have 3 of their guys take jets. they should be able to RUIN any game they are in .

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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 06:00 PM
You're all wusses./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif






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http://www.redneckengineering.com/photogallery/photo23581/curves-done-03.jpg


"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 06:37 PM
I dont have nothing about the 262, its rate of turn is too slow, turning radius toowide and too fast, and you can shoot it down ery easy with deflection shooting...what should be banned is the non operational BE1.



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ZG77_Nagual
09-09-2003, 07:00 PM
Caveat - well-flown 262s! I too have downed quite a few of them - either because the pilot tried a little to hard to turn and misjudged my e state - or sniping em after a high speed pass - they light up very easily. Conversely - if you are good in that thing you don't make those mistakes (actually, I flew it last night and screwed up royally - I was flying along, getting ready to vaporize an la7 when suddenly everything started lagging like crazy for about 15 seconds - suddenly I had a yak .20k off my tail and no e!)

The wuss argument doesn't fly with me - I know what it's like to fly this plane well - nobody messes with you unless they've been planning it for like 20minutes and you arent' paying attention. Anywho - the reason is the server is divided into blue/red sides. True - red does have the la7 - but then blue has the 190a9 /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Also - it is true all the planes are modeled best case scenario - certainly the 262 benefits from that.

True also that I am seeing guns jamm and other stuff that is more random in the flight models.

I dunno though - it's gonna be cool when we get the salamander vs the 262.

For the lebenteenth time - the P-63 saw action on the Eastern front - I've seen a couple different sources on this - one posted by Oleg.



http://pws.chartermi.net/~cmorey/pics/p47janes.jpg

Hawgdog
09-09-2003, 07:07 PM
MiloMorai wrote:
-
-
- You're all wusses./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


Aint it the truth. LOL!! I'm a wuss, your a wuss, wouldn't you like to be a wuss too...wuss tooooo......


Whatever happened to the P.11 only servers?!?!?!

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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 07:19 PM
Hmmmmm

So you want to ban a plane even make it unflyable !!!!!!

are you mad !!!!

Try a coop mission for once with the 262 doing the job it was built for not in a DF server messing around vulching and being abused, to ban it really shows your shallowness of experience in IL2 FB.

Alpha

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 08:39 PM
Now that Ive read all this, I'm starting to get angry a bit. Especially on that "actually the 262 wasnt seeing that much action" point and its variants.

Hel-lo! Why doesnt anyone complain about having the BI-1 available like it was built in masses? As far as I know, the BI-1 didnt even make it past its prototype state.
But noone complains about it, and why? Cause the BI-1 rarely is good for anything.
But when it comes to the 262, some people suddenly get "historically correct" - B*LLSH*T!

FB is probably the best WW2 sim ever to hit the PC, but its still just virtuallity.

So the next time you start to pull off the "historically correct" thingy, remember this: no "historical correct" pilot had the chance to get better or fly again after his death!
So you're all in fact no longer "correct" by the first time you hit the "refly" button after your VIRTUAL plane took you to a VIRTUAL death.


From a VIRTUAL point of view, I think the 262 should stay on as many servers as possible.... cause the ones who cant use it properly will get caught and/or choose some other plane no matter what, and the really good 262 pilots will add some extra juice to the GAME.

See ya out there.....

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 08:56 PM
In this game, if the 262 has a massive advantage over prop planes, well, then they got it right. In real life it had a massive advantage.

Why do you think props died out shortly after WWII?

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 09:05 PM
262s are forever

http://avia.russian.ee/pictures/germany/me-262.gif


I mean beat these guns!!!
http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/images/lrg0740.jpg

http://www.luft46.com/armament/mk108-6.jpg


hehehe

-----------------------------------
Its A known fact that Mighty Demons are here to kill. I know I am
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Zayets
09-09-2003, 09:09 PM
Wussies! I eat any 262 in my Jug! The only thing I need is to get airborne , then I'm not afraid of any 262. I've been downed by many planes but never by a Me-262.I mean it! Never. And it will stay like that especially now that ppl start baning the thing.

Zayets out

http://www.arr.go.ro/iar81c.JPG

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 10:08 PM
KG26_Alpha wrote:
- Hmmmmm
-
- So you want to ban a plane even make it unflyable
- !!!!!!
-
- are you mad !!!!
-
- Try a coop mission for once with the 262 doing the
- job it was built for not in a DF server messing
- around vulching and being abused, to ban it really
- shows your shallowness of experience in IL2 FB.
-
- Alpha

I think Nagual has a lot more experience with IL2 FB then you.
Besides, what he does on his server is his business, not yours.
Don't like it, setup your own server or go somewhere else.

Simple, isn't it?

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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 10:29 PM
i dunno if its been used yet but i'd like to start the phrase "***** plane" :P

Hawgdog
09-09-2003, 11:10 PM
Future- wrote:
-
-
- Hel-lo! Why doesnt anyone complain about having the
- BI-1 available like it was built in masses? As far
- as I know, the BI-1 didnt even make it past its
- prototype state.

Excellent point. IF the B1 started to get popular and some little child got shot down twice in a row, they'd get the torches and pitchforks and storm olegs castle!!

<center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be fooled by fneb imitations
Vulching can be a contact sport
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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:13 PM
BI-1 Banned as well /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Regards,
VFC*Crazyivan
http://www.rmutt.netfirms.com/ivan-reaper.gif

"No matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down." Ivan Kozhedub

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:19 PM
I don't see too many B1's flying around even if they are available.
Every once in a while I see a newbie taking one for a spin or someone just having some fun with it.

But I agree, if you ban one you ban the other as well.

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Cpt.LoneRanger
09-09-2003, 11:22 PM
Exactly!

That's what I'm talking about. You had to ban any plane in the game, cause if you know how to handle it, it's automatically "uber" for some other folks.

The P39 is still easy to fly, at least compared to the much more complex flight modell in IL2.

I shot down several 262 in my old P40, too. It's all a question of tactics and knowing a planes weaknesses. I actually feel the balance is quite well now, after that last patch. All fans of specific a/c are whining evenly, so maybe they've done it right /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

greets
Cpt.LoneRanger


http://www.cptloneranger.privat.t-online.de/CptLoneRanger.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:24 PM
Cpt.LoneRanger wrote:
- Right, but the same is for K4, LA5FN, P39, etc.
-
- All the uber-planes had faults, that aren't modelled
- in FB.
-

Sure are alot of uber planes now, I thouht by its very nature, there should only be one "uber" plane

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:26 PM
I have downed the 262 with a I-153Ps cannons many times. Not hard to down just have to take it head on and aim true then break hard. Banning the 262 is like the world banning countries from using superior aircraft because its unfair. If your the host do what you want its your game, but I enjoy a challenge.


Dave

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:38 PM
i agree. i stopped flying the me-262 in 1.0 for how uber it was. then in 1.1b i hated it for its speed and climb and was constantly shot down, and nearly everyone i talked to wouldnt fly it because of how bad it was, but i took some time to fly with it, and became very very good. now its right back to the way it was and im no longer flying it, but im sure all of the whiners are happy. im sorry but i liked it better in 1.1b. and on a side note its climb was correct in 1.1b just the high altitude performance, and energy loss in turns was bad.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:44 PM
No worse or annoying than those 190s and 109s that stay up in the strasosphere and dive down on an unsuspecting pray only to zoom back up to altitude.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:47 PM
I can't think of a smarter way to get kills. If it annoys you, all the better.

ZG77_Nagual
09-10-2003, 12:04 AM
hehe,, you guys!

What happened last night is two or three people who were actually GOOD in the 262 got on there at the same time. I know all about tactics for killing 262s and stuff - basically you need alt or speed. Forget about turning against someone who is good - second time I flew it I got 8 kills in one flight - all la7s and late yaks who thought they could evade me at the last minute - the thing has a tremendous instantaneous turn and at close range the mk108s are like a shotgun - and the inst turn costs almost nothing in speed. It is an absolute blast to whip in outta the blue and blow those fan jobs away like they were flyin slo-mo. I liked the climb handicap - though I know it was not accurate. No doubt it should be the very definition of uber - minus technical problems it was and is a tremendous plane.

As for boom and zoom - what? you want we should fight vvs planes on their own terms? I think not..

It's true though - I am shallow about FB.../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

http://pws.chartermi.net/~cmorey/pics/p47janes.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 01:13 AM
hmmmm I think your trying to say that really its the pilot who is uber. As ppl have said they can waste inexperienced 262's in their prop fighters. I can agree, I've killed one that tried to turn with my P-39N-1. The jet does and always will have soft spots and times of great vulnerability. Countering pilots just have to know where and when they are, and exploit it.

Someone who takes the time to make tactics that give them near invincibility will become an awesome jet driver. The jets not uber or n00bish, its just well flown and understood for its capabilities by those who spend time on it. You want uber, in my opinion the La-7 is that, just cause its very fast and turns well and its 3 tight packed cannons are quite powerful. But then, a well flown jet can get above it and deliver its attack.

Just a helpfull hint for us experienced jet drivers out there. If you encounter a Bi-1 missile drop the nose and apply full throttle soon you'll pass 800km/h, and if the missile follows it will enter a forced nose down and crash not long after. Plus it cannot turn with us and it is possible to catch up to one if you catch it at a bad time.

MD_FuryFighter

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 01:23 AM
I think if we see some more high performance prop planes and jets in the expansion pack we can probably get the Me-262 back because we'll have several options available and not just one plane. Late war prop planes like the Tempest (both variants) Spitfire XIV, the D9 which we already have, and others were close matches to the more tricky to fly jets.

Most people I still see flaming out on takeoff with the 262 so its not like all have mastered it yet.

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XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 01:26 AM
be interesting to see how a fyable P51d fares against the me262 being historically the only prop fighter that seem to have a hope.



for any 262 fans check out this link for an interesting story on why valuable aircraft should never be donated to goverment museums:

http://members.ozemail.com.au/~fiveds/history.html




<center> http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0SQDLAtUWiWZ3BKw19!aryp7v3C1h1DuNwpHOOuqhlraGSyMAY KiPEOZAA1OBgsLu*Sa0UQ2my0PiFyvNkJ5K7Clsoy7yNtEvOXY nHDuPNiotpZACY2oJxw/aircraftround.jpg </center>

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 01:50 AM
aghhhhh why would they destroy an Me-262 like that.....
I wonder if the AWM has a website or online contact details..... if enough of us aussie FB'ers and WW 2 enthusiasts get together we might be able to convince them to resume restoration.......

MD_FuryFighter

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 03:39 AM
It appears to me you boys aint doin' sumthin right. lol /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
Me262's....i dont seem to have a big problem with /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 04:26 AM
Troll2k wrote:
- No worse or annoying than those 190s and 109s that
- stay up in the strasosphere and dive down on an
- unsuspecting pray only to zoom back up to altitude.
-
-

I would say those are smart pilots. Thats where and how those planes perform best. If your not going to climb up there and play, then B&Z is what you can expect from a German plane. Anyone who flies 109's or 190's and knows what they are doing, will retain the altitude and speed advantage. They wont get suckered into a turn fight with planes that turn better and perform better at lower altitudes.

...and once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward,
for there you have been and there you long to return.
~leonardo de vinci

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 05:33 AM
ZG77_Nagual wrote:
- hehe,, you guys!
-
- What happened last night is two or three people who
- were actually GOOD in the 262 got on there at the
- same time. I know all about tactics for killing 262s
- and stuff - basically you need alt or speed. Forget
- about turning against someone who is good - second
- time I flew it I got 8 kills in one flight - all
- la7s and late yaks who thought they could evade me
- at the last minute - the thing has a tremendous
- instantaneous turn and at close range the mk108s are
- like a shotgun - and the inst turn costs almost
- nothing in speed. It is an absolute blast to whip in
- outta the blue and blow those fan jobs away like
- they were flyin slo-mo. I liked the climb handicap -
- though I know it was not accurate. No doubt it
- should be the very definition of uber - minus
- technical problems it was and is a tremendous plane.
-
- As for boom and zoom - what? you want we should
- fight vvs planes on their own terms? I think not..
-
- It's true though - I am shallow about FB.../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif
-
<img
- src="http://pws.chartermi.net/~cmorey/pics/p47jane
- s.jpg">
-

this is what i dont really like about the way it is now. in 1.1b i took great pride in knowing i could control the skys in the me-262 and not many other ppl could, now nearly everyone can get in it, and if they get past takeoff, they will start shooting props down. it took much more getting used to in 1.1b that the kiddies wouldnt wait through, and would just come to the forums to complain about how slow it is. then oleg changed its performance even tho it seemed better in 1.1b (other than high alt performance).

P.S. im kinda in a bad mood ever since my joystick broke so thats why i sound cranky



Message Edited on 09/09/0308:37PM by jj8325

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 07:15 AM
MD FURYFIGHTER . you will NOT kill a B1 rocket by pointing your nose of jet at ground and getting the rocket following you over 800. that will only kill a total noob flying a rocket. the rocket just follows the nose down all the way with stick down and it completes a circle now flying upside down or angled back up but upside down. at any speed. rockets that dive into ground due to speed are flown by noobs only. thatll never get a real ace.

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XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 07:44 AM
If is SOMEONE annoyed by Me262, then I have an advice for him: next time DON'T Sset up a 1944 server and go for ex. 41,42 or 43 servers. Me262 was organic attempt of LW to make superior fighter that would be UNTOUCHABLE (where I heared that LOL) by props. Just imagine how good would Germany had PROPS fighters if effort and resources that were going to Me262 were going to Me209 or Ta152/153?
Every country in WWII had its own ways to counter others, VVS had a lot crappy fighters while LW went for quality ones.Period.

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 07:47 AM
Ban away if you think it makes it more realisitc, or fair. If it's your server, go for it, your rules. Of course having other people claim that if you fly the ME-262 you're a nOOb or a hopeless pilot, is a gross generalisation. Effective use of the 262 will rule the skys, as will the effective use of a LA7, P47, Fw-190, hell even a 109 K series, could rule the skies. Good pilots know that the 262 lights up like a candle if you even nick an engine and that a 262 that enters a turn fight will enter at high speed, quickly bleed off it's energy and become a flaming brick in very quick time.

Keep up speed and bide your time in the 262 and you'll own the fight, conversely in a prop wait and eventually the 262 pilot will get annoyed and jsut enter a turn fight to get some action /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 07:49 AM
the me262 was not the only mk108 equipped prop-less high speed uber fighter.

There was also this 900kmh prop-less wonder-fighter:



Blohm & Vhoss Bv40 Assault Glider
Length : 5.7m
Wing Span : 7.9m
Hight : 1.63m
Wing Area : 8.70 Square Meter
All-Up Weight : 950Kg
Empty Weight : 835Kg
Engine : None
Max Speed : 900Km/h
Crew : 1
Armament : MK108 30mm X 1 , Machine Gun X 2


http://www.strange-mecha.com/german/luftvaffe/bv/bv40.JPG





<center> http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0SQDLAtUWiWZ3BKw19!aryp7v3C1h1DuNwpHOOuqhlraGSyMAY KiPEOZAA1OBgsLu*Sa0UQ2my0PiFyvNkJ5K7Clsoy7yNtEvOXY nHDuPNiotpZACY2oJxw/aircraftround.jpg </center>

Hawgdog
09-10-2003, 02:09 PM
Those whiners and this thread crack me up.
I've read between the lines and what really want is to have their favorite plane on their airbase and TB's and IL2's on the other base. Its not the jet, its better pilots they dont like bwaa haa haaa

long live the jet! Why doesnt someone host a jet ONLY server?

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Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
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XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 02:13 PM
This must be the weakest argument for banning a fighter, because it's too good, even if it's perfectly realistic. Nag did you ever thought of banning the 15 sec turn La7? Or no speed loss Yak3?


<center> http://www.stormbirds.com/images/discussion-main.jpg </center>

Message Edited on 09/10/0308:13AM by Huckebein_FW

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 03:41 PM
Nige_Reconman wrote:
- Ban away if you think it makes it more realisitc, or
- fair. If it's your server, go for it, your rules.
- Of course having other people claim that if you fly
- the ME-262 you're a nOOb or a hopeless pilot, is a
- gross generalisation. Effective use of the 262 will
- rule the skys, as will the effective use of a LA7,
- P47, Fw-190, hell even a 109 K series, could rule
- the skies. Good pilots know that the 262 lights up
- like a candle if you even nick an engine and that a
- 262 that enters a turn fight will enter at high
- speed, quickly bleed off it's energy and become a
- flaming brick in very quick time.


I think Reconman hit the nail on this one.

Last week, I was in a 190a9 on an open server and got about 2000k altitude over a 262 and dove. I caught him and hit him good with my first burst. I climbed and did it twice more, getting one engine to smoke and putting the other in flames. Just as I was lining up my fourth pass, a 262 on my side darts in and steals the kill. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif I worked pretty hard for that one and expressed my unhappiness in no uncertain terms.

It's rather arrogant and incorrect to think that only a 262 (or other jet) can kill a 262. It just takes a bit of work and luck, which reflects RL accounts of 262 kills.

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 06:12 PM
I find it much more enjoyable when it's allowed on both sides even if it is historically wrong to have red 262s.

Servers that use cockpit only and icons are nice for this.

Historically accurate servers with 262's are fun for about 10min, then after awhile everyone on blue is flying 262s and it gets silly. I end up flying the thing myself.

Still by far the best historically accurate full real servers are 41-43 servers. Though 41 may be a little bit too easy for germans cause that f4 turns circles around every plane but i-16 and that bi-plane thingy.

Hawgdog
09-10-2003, 06:16 PM
The two posts above this fuel my sentiments accurately.
Well put.

<center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be fooled by fneb imitations
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-10-2003, 06:44 PM
Good pilots will master it, bad pilots will flame and give me 100 points. In most take off servers 262's will generally balance out(most off the time), but in easy start in air servers 262 use will escalate like nukes. By the way, P47's shot quite a few of them in WWII, not just Mustangs.

The plane that REALLY should be banned, for the sake of decent balanced online play, is the IP-153 "biplane thingy".
Wandered into an easy server last nite where everybody had degenerated to 262's and 153's. UGGGGHHH



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"Remember, that's war. We're all in one boat. He who thinks only of himself will destroy himself too. Such selfishness will not be tolerated!"


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