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View Full Version : Captured F86 article & Mig15 max Mach



XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 09:47 PM
Spotted an interesting article in this month's Flight Journal regarding the Soviet recovery and testing of a crash landed F86 during the Korean War. The plane was apparently not able to fly, but several of its avionics and internal sub-systems were reverse-engineered and adopted by the Soviets, including full hydraulic power system for flying control surfaces and pilot G-suit. Lots more in the article, which is well worth reading.

Also recent show on Discovery Wings re flight testing of captured Mig-15. Original test pilot was interviewed. He stated categorically that the Mig-15 could not exceed Mach 0.93 in any sort of flight regime. At that speed the Mig would pitch up so powerfully that it could not be countered by the pilot. He and Yeager, who also tested the same a/c, even tried diving it inverted in a 90 degree plus dive in order to get it past the 0.93 number - no happiness.

And BTW, the N Korean pilot who defected with the a/c mentioned that the 37mm was of such low muzzle velocity that its projectile trajecory would begin to fall off beyond 100 meters. Must have made for a nightmare scenario trying to get convergence with the 23mm's. I have read where a number of F86 pilots would find themselves sandwiched between 23's flying over them and the 37 going well beneath them.


Blutarski

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 09:47 PM
Spotted an interesting article in this month's Flight Journal regarding the Soviet recovery and testing of a crash landed F86 during the Korean War. The plane was apparently not able to fly, but several of its avionics and internal sub-systems were reverse-engineered and adopted by the Soviets, including full hydraulic power system for flying control surfaces and pilot G-suit. Lots more in the article, which is well worth reading.

Also recent show on Discovery Wings re flight testing of captured Mig-15. Original test pilot was interviewed. He stated categorically that the Mig-15 could not exceed Mach 0.93 in any sort of flight regime. At that speed the Mig would pitch up so powerfully that it could not be countered by the pilot. He and Yeager, who also tested the same a/c, even tried diving it inverted in a 90 degree plus dive in order to get it past the 0.93 number - no happiness.

And BTW, the N Korean pilot who defected with the a/c mentioned that the 37mm was of such low muzzle velocity that its projectile trajecory would begin to fall off beyond 100 meters. Must have made for a nightmare scenario trying to get convergence with the 23mm's. I have read where a number of F86 pilots would find themselves sandwiched between 23's flying over them and the 37 going well beneath them.


Blutarski

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 10:10 PM
Well, US AirForce couldn't wait to get one Mig 15 and figure out why it flies so well.

Russians trained Koriens to fly MIGs and only a few Russina pilots flew in Korea. Veterans recall that Koreans were really poor pilots and they would bail out as soon as F86 opens fire. This would explain high victories/losses ratio for american pilots. The few russian pilots were very skilled WW2 veterans with many victories on their accounts.

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 11:29 PM
So what are you saying, that if it was mostly russian pilots against US and not korean pilots then the US pilots would not have been succesful?

Or is it because the us hardware waxed the russian hardware?

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 11:38 PM
Sokol,

I re-read my post and it does sound like I am criticizing the Mig15. Such was not intended. Just reporting the details for those interested. I thought it was fascinating that the Soviets had obtained an F86 - never heard of it before.


Blutarski

XyZspineZyX
08-06-2003, 11:55 PM
I read an article last month in Air&Space about, what I believe, is the same story you have. It was a very good read.

----------------------------------------
"When you hit hell, tell 'em I sent ya!"

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 12:39 AM
Sokol,
-
- I re-read my post and it does sound like I am
- criticizing the Mig15. Such was not intended. Just
- reporting the details for those interested. I
- thought it was fascinating that the Soviets had
- obtained an F86 - never heard of it before.
-
Yeah, it was Oct 6 1951 when Russias top ace Yevgeniy Pepelyayev damaged an F-86 he tried to get him to crash in the ocean so the pilot could be rescued, but the pilot ditched on a beach. A 3 hour battle then ensued as the russians tried to prevent the sabre's destruction, they lost 7 more migs. The chinese later cut the wings off and shipped it by truck in underground tunnels to the russian airfield at Antung. The pilots examined it for a week and then it was sent to Moscow. Pepelyayev said he was amazed at the G suit.

This same article states the first jet to jet victory goes to the soviets. Lt Khominich claimed a f-80 on Nov 1 1950. 7 days before Brown claimed his Mig (which it turns out did not crash).

http://utenti.lycos.it/AEREOFAN/images/saetta.jpg

caccia buon!

<center>http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/images/mash_henry_blake.jpg (http://www.bloggerheads.com/mash_quiz/)</center>

XyZspineZyX
08-07-2003, 04:49 AM
mike_espo that would make for way cool reading .... is there a link to that article at all ?