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Deadly_107
02-12-2006, 01:56 PM
We have been thinking of adding communications to our squadron that is more inline with real world communications. The only way I can think to do this is to treat all airfields as uncontrolled airstrips since we can not actually speak to the tower unless one of us takes on that job instead of flying.
We dont wont to clutter the radio with traffic but on the other hand, real world radio is pretty cluttered and sometime broken.
Below is a link to a video I made of myself and OddBall (real flight instructor) flying a left hand pattern around the USS Lexington. Our pattern airspeed is 170MPH at 1,000 FEET. I have also been talking to another one of our members who was an F/A-18 flight instructor in the Marine Corps.
One mistake we made in this video was when we called "Two down and locked" we did this before we realized that the tail wheel actually comes down with the gear. So the call should have been "Three down and locked".
Im also working on a new way to incode my videos so that they retain better quality.
I hope this thread will generate some feedback into what you all think about using more realistic flight communications and how better to apply them.
VIDEO LINK:

http://www.vfa107.com/test.html

We were using the built in voice coms in Pacific Fighters.

Deadly
VFA-107 Sea Dragons
http://www.vfa107.com

stelr
02-12-2006, 03:46 PM
Loved the video. Very professional TTPs used as well. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

I fly with BSS (Blacksheep) and we often reserve Friday nights for CQs (although we've let this routine lapse lately), led by BSS Vidar, our CO, was a Naval aviator for over 20 years.

He would flog us for leaving flaps extended and nav lights on after we'd cleared the wire. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif I was a repeat offender.

Anyway, the main differences in our TTPs was that when we entered the pattern from the spin, as soon as we broke at the bow, we'd dirty up (extend flaps, drop gear and hook) and call the downwind, keeping about 600' alt. As soon as we were abeam, we'd call it and wait 1-2 secs before turning left for a landing approach. We'd call "at the 90" and "on final" continuing the left hand banking turn until just above the aft part of the deck when we'd steady up and settle onto the deck. applying back pressure to catch the wire. Didn't use the seat adjustment in game that provides a better view over the nose of the Hog. Had to rely on the constant turning approach to allow the pilot to see the LSO/deck before leveling up and hitting the deck. I'm told this technique was unique to the Corsair due to the pilot being positioned so far back, having a restricted forward, low view.

We'd have regular LSOs each night, grading the traps and post the "Greenie Board" on the squad web site with a competition to achieve the highest boarding rate each month.

Great fun, even though nary a shot was fired! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

All said, it's great to see there are other squads that appreciate using actual procedures and dedicated to the "immersive effect" that IL2 offers.

Guess one of my pet peeves is when you see a guy online that jumps into a cockpit, guns the engine and takes off across the taxiway & runway, regardless of who is rolling for takeoff or who is on final. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Deadly_107
02-12-2006, 04:45 PM
stelr,

Thanks for the reply. This is just the type of feedback Im looking for. Hopefuly more people will chime in with ideas and such. You are correct about flaps and lights . It would look better if we cleaned them up right after we came to a complete stop on deck (I will add that to our procedures list).
If I get enough replys to this thread I will save it for future reference when I start to write out a set of procedures for our squad and post post on the website. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Deadly
VFA-107 Sea Dragons
http://www.vfa107.com

p-11.cAce
02-12-2006, 05:44 PM
I am a rl pilot (just ga stuff) and love the immersive aspects of this sim - I hate that so few use TS when it is FREE! Anyway I am one of those weird guys that likes to fly gunner postitions in coops and would find it fun and interesting to work as a "LSO" for anyone interested. For a stationary airfield working ATC would be as simple as a TS channel and an appropriatly place static camera for my views...as for a carrier I am not sure what the best view solution would be. If we organized a list of procedures that were to be followed and practiced a bit I think this would be great fun!

stelr
02-12-2006, 06:50 PM
Deadly,

If you are interested in seeing what BSS has posted WRT Carrier Quals, our web site link is below. Just go to the Tactics Tab, then to CQs.

http://www.bss214.com/

BTW, visited you site. Hat's off to you web master! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

Great team work on the video as well.

<S>!

Deadly_107
02-12-2006, 06:58 PM
p-11.cAce,

Thanks for the offer. A good ground controller would be a rare find so stick around and if we get to that point in our coms work I will drop you a line.
We use the older free version of Roger Wilco (without the game spy) as our main communication program because it is simple to setup and can easily be integrated into a webpage as a running server.
However, when we are flying in Pacific Fighters the built in coms work great and (we prefer them) you can switch channels on the fly and should be able to create your own channels aswell. You can also save the mission track files and all voice coms will replay with the mission track.
So, if more squads used the built in coms for flights in Pacific Fighters then no one would have to download and install a special program just to fly inter squadron missions.
The only problem I have encountered with the built in voice coms is that when playing the older maps in the game the voice is a little broken for some reason but it works perfectly clear on all of the Pacific Fighters mission maps. I cant tell you how nice it is to be able to watch a mission replay and hear all of the voice coms. It makes the playbacks much more interesting to watch.

Deadly
VFA-107 Sea Dragons
http://www.vfa107.com

Deadly_107
02-12-2006, 07:10 PM
stelr,

Thank you for the link and thats a very nice site. I bookmarked it and will use it as one of my many references during this coms project.
Thanks also for the complement on our site. I dont always have the time to keep it upto date though so it runs a little behind on information. We are also pretty new to this sim so its a work in progress.
The flight sim community isnt what it used to be so we are going to work on quality instead of quantity these days.

Deadly
VFA-107 Sea Dragons
http://www.vfa107.com

p-11.cAce
02-12-2006, 08:41 PM
I will be here - am looking fwd to how this works out http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

stelr
02-12-2006, 09:48 PM
We use RW as well for squad ops, but you are the first I've heard that uses the "in-game" comms. I, for one have never tried them, but now that you mention that it has the ability to switch cannels in flight, this opens up a lot of possibilities.

This would make squad/group operations much more plausible. As we have it now, everyone is always stepping on each other's transmissions due to lack of proper RT procedures and, quite frankly, too many people on the same net with different missions.

Thanks for the idea. I'm going to try them out. Any trick in using them, or is it pretty intuitive?

MLudner
02-12-2006, 10:13 PM
You guys need to study Military Radio Proceedures a little. The methods we used helped smooth commo.

Messages should always be formatted:

"So-and-so, this is me;
"Yadda-yadda-yadda, blah-blah;
Over."
Like:

"Green 3, this is Green 1; In bound bandits from the north and above; Over."

"Green 1, this is Green 3; Roger, bandits in sight; Over."

"Green 3, this is Green 1; Break and attack by elements, you close from their east; Over."

Green 1, this is Green 3; Wilco; Out."

If someone feels something is important enough to interrupt (Say, he saw the other bandits closing from above and behind everyone else had missed), he should always begin with:

"Break! Break! Green 1, this is Green 4..."

"Over" means: you are finished talking and expecting a reply.

"Out" means: You are done talking, no reply expected or needed.

"Roger" means: I have received and understand your transmission.

"Wilco" means: I have received and understand your transmission and WILl COmply.

Never say "Over and Out"; you are contradicting yourself.

Never say "Roger Wilco" as you are being redundant.

Deadly_107
02-12-2006, 10:17 PM
stelr,

The in game coms are pretty easy to use. The Pacific Fighters manual spells it out pretty good. Like I mentioned in a previous post, the coms work best when using the pacific fighters maps.
There is a person on this board named "rnzoli" who has been using the in game voice coms for a long time. If you have any problems he is a pretty good source for information.
Im not sure how to post a smaller link on this board but here is a link to a post by rnzoli the was a great help in setting up the coms:

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m...601067304#5601067304 (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/8921037304/r/5601067304#5601067304)

Im sure that other channels can be setup in the game but Im going to have to do a little research on that subject. Maybe if rnzoli sees this he can help.
I was also going over my old Jane's F/A-18 manual and may have come accross something that might help with radio traffic on the same channel. We could setup a Marshal Point somewhere behind the carrier to limit the amount of traffic in the pattern at one time. The Marshal Point could be called by the flight comtroller if there is one or by the flight leader in uncontrolled air-traffic situations.
My biggest offline sources for information is Microsofts Flight Simulator and some Jeppesen Private Pilot Flight Manuals I have laying around. I have a few questions for my flight instructor friends so I will be in touch with them on the phone and in e-mail.

Deadly
VFA-107 Sea Dragons
http://www.vfa107.com

Deadly_107
02-12-2006, 10:24 PM
MLudner,

We are familiar with some of the information you posted and some of it is also new but we have not gotten to the combat stage with coms yet but that is comming. The combat video on our website was made before I took on this coms project so it will be interesting in the weeks to come how much it will all change.
Thanks for the info and I will be referencing it aswell.

Deadly
VFA-107 Sea Dragons
http://www.vfa107.com