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Waldo.Pepper
01-29-2007, 02:31 PM
http://englishrussia.com/?p=533

Hoenire
01-29-2007, 02:49 PM
Sadness is wrong. I'm happy because the broken up planes are no longer a threat to anyone.

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

VMF-214_HaVoK
01-29-2007, 03:09 PM
SAD!! You have no idea how many B-52s have been murdered with I-beams do you?!?! Do you! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

DuxCorvan
01-29-2007, 04:24 PM
Originally posted by Hoenire:
Sadness is wrong. I'm happy because the broken up planes are no longer a threat to anyone.


They wouldn't be a threat in a museum, either, but pieces of History. And those Aeroflot Antonov transports don't look so menacing to me.

Tater-SW-
01-29-2007, 04:26 PM
It took them a long time to come up wtith pretty airplanes, and those pics don't show any http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

tater

jarink
01-29-2007, 09:47 PM
Originally posted by DuxCorvan:
And those Aeroflot Antonov transports don't look so menacing to me.

That's 'cause you're not flying somewhere as a passenger in one.
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Enforcer572005
01-29-2007, 10:21 PM
Im kinda surprised they are torching the TU22Ms.

Ob.Emann
01-29-2007, 11:06 PM
The Buran space shuttle (actually one of the testbeds), once the pride and hope of the Soviet space program, now sitting out in the open at Baikonur, a ghost of an era long past. Kinda creepy, really.

http://www.buran.ru/images/jpg/bbur70.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/buran_2/1.jpg

Buran (http://englishrussia.com/?p=361#more-361)

EnglishRussia, best blog on the Net! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

BfHeFwMe
01-29-2007, 11:26 PM
If it carried nukes, hack it in two, we're all better off. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

furyan65
01-30-2007, 12:41 AM
Governments aren't sentimental. Anyway those planes are just so ULGY and theres lots of them.

On the fact some mentioned about the US destroying WW2 greats like the B25's etc.. now that's a crying shame!

Termitedelight
01-30-2007, 01:15 AM
It would be nice to purchase a Backfire!

DuxCorvan
01-30-2007, 08:26 AM
Mmmmm, look like scenes from some creepy movie about post-nuclear war future with wasted cities and rests of civilization here and there a-la-Planet-of-Apes. Yikes!

Taylortony
01-30-2007, 04:15 PM
Originally posted by Termitedelight:
It would be nice to purchase a Backfire!

I will sell you my car, it comes with lots of them http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Sergio_101
01-30-2007, 04:20 PM
Originally posted by DuxCorvan:
Mmmmm, look like scenes from some creepy movie about post-nuclear war future with wasted cities and rests of civilization here and there a-la-Planet-of-Apes. Yikes!

The last B-25 scrapped at DM was around 1958.
The bombers mentioned are B-52s.
Hundreds have been Guillotined.
It seems the dyslexic get those two mixed up often.

In the US the military has been pretty careful
about scrapping the last of a type since the
aircraft massacre after WWII.

During the chaotic scrapping of aircraft many
"last of a type"'s were destroyed.

Currently the big scrap-fest at DM is the destruction
of all C-141s. Word is none will be sold.
At least a half dozen are already in museums.
I worked on C-141s during my time in the USAF.
It was a wonderful machine, extremely reliable
and safe. C-141 is a VERY efficent trash hauler.

Sergio

tigertalon
01-30-2007, 04:45 PM
Originally posted by furyan65:
Anyway those planes are just so ULGY and theres lots of them.

Well, Tu-22M3 is one of the best lookin planes ever. In my eyes. Of course not that scraped remains of it.

http://www.avions-militaires.net/images/photos/photo2/tu22m.jpg

http://wmilitary.neurok.ru/tu22m3-bw.jpg

papotex
01-30-2007, 05:08 PM
remembering Nikita Khrushchev, the shows he use to put up at the United Nations.

I really wonder, since he was a smart man,
if he knew that the direction he was stearing his nation was gona ultimatedly lead to its demise.

Pirschjaeger
01-30-2007, 07:37 PM
Actually, with exception to some of the debris laying around, it looks pretty much like the air museum in Beijing. Next time I go I'll make a point to bring my camera.

But, from the same site posted above, you guys will have a laugh from this:

Funny (http://englishrussia.com/?p=475)

Dogfighter1969
01-31-2007, 05:05 AM
I am neither sad not glad. True that those planes can't harm anybody anymore (like Hoenire said). Only thing about human kind is that planes like those are left there because the country to which they belong normally has come up with newer and more dangerous planes to replace them with. Sure, Russia may not have done so because of their political changes that has taken place over the last few years. However, as far as I know there is such a graveyard in a desert in the USA as well. The same argument applies to those planes. Also ex-killers.
But as a aviation enthusiast, I believe that at least a few units of each type of plane ever developed and produced should be preserved for the sake of the generations to come. I would love to see a Spit, Me-109, Zero, P-51, etc, etc in flight at an airshow or at least in a museum, irrespective of which side the plane was fighting for. Where I come from we don't have that opportunity.

Pirschjaeger
01-31-2007, 11:00 AM
Interestingly, if these planes hadn't been scrapped and many were still around, they wouldn't be so interesting. Imagine if there were a few thousand 109's in flying condition. No one would care about them.

BillyTheKid_22
01-31-2007, 11:05 AM
Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
Actually, with exception to some of the debris laying around, it looks pretty much like the air museum in Beijing. Next time I go I'll make a point to bring my camera.

But, from the same site posted above, you guys will have a laugh from this:

Funny (http://englishrussia.com/?p=475)

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif Lol!~!~!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Waldo.Pepper
01-31-2007, 12:01 PM
it looks pretty much like the air museum in Beijing.

You mean this one -

http://www.skyviking.com/skysoul.html

(Love that AWAC Tupolev BTW!!)

or this one? -

http://www.china.org.cn/english/features/museums/126479.htm


I though the Russian pics were sad for several reasons.

Philosophically sad that humans feel the need to waste the treasure and talent on the creation of such things (B-52's as well!) And also sad because in another 70s years our airplane nut progeny will look upon these airplanes as we do toward a Lagg or a Zero or something.

As historic artifacts, that had we had more foresight we could have preserved.

So that when Oleg Maddox (the Fifth) is looking for some cockpit info for an Il-28 Beagle or something, he would be able to find it readily.

MB_Avro_UK
01-31-2007, 12:50 PM
Hi all,

Good thread http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

After WW2 there was a wholesale slaughter of RAF aircraft with little regard for history.

Today,there is NO:

Whitley:

http://www.rafbombercommand.com/aircraft_medium.html

Halifax:

http://www.rafmuseum.org.uk/handley-page-halifax-ii.htm

Hampden:

http://www.rafbombercommand.com/aircraft_medium.html

Stirling:

http://www.stirling.box.nl/home.htm

There is however a salvaged wreck from a Norwegian lake of a Halifax at the RAF museum at Hendon.

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/archie_bombercomman...48tls_continued.html (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/archie_bombercommand/1048tls_continued.html)

There are probably other examples of 'lost' history http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sadeyes.gif

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

WWMaxGunz
01-31-2007, 01:40 PM
I wonder if a fuselage from one of those (any big one) would make the basis for a nice diner?
Really, much of the scrap could fetch a better than salvage price as souveniers or at least
identifiable pieces by shape or markings. Instruments too, how much would you pay for a
bombsight or a gunsight? I tell ya, there's money to be made right there! What part would
be cool to mount inside or on an old car?

Stackhouse25th
01-31-2007, 03:40 PM
its russian **** who cares. cost more to fly it then buy it.

Waldo.Pepper
01-31-2007, 04:27 PM
Halifax:

http://www.rafmuseum.org.uk/handley-page-halifax-ii.htm

Hampden:

http://www.rafbombercommand.com/aircraft_medium.html


Canada has both a Halifax and a Hampton. Though the Hampton is a poor (but still welcome ) restoration.

Sergio_101
01-31-2007, 06:12 PM
Other than prototypes there are fortunately
few USAF or USN WWII combat types that are totaly extinct.

Notably, until one was found in a lake
in the Russia the Brewster F2A Buffalo.
Consolidated B-32 Dominator
Curtiss CW-21 Deamon

A few prototypes that should have become museum pieces are....

Douglas B-19A
Boeing B-15

Both did excellent service during the war as transports.

A couple of civillian types...

Douglas DC-5 (I'll bet most of you never heard of that one)
Boeing B-314 "Clipper"

There are other notable extinct types, but I have not got time to dig now.
I'll up date this later.

Sergio

Waldo.Pepper
02-01-2007, 05:33 PM
Drove past the Museum housing the Hampton today. Didn't go in, no time of course. But did have a camera with me to take a quick snap from the car.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v516/WaldoPepper/hampton%20quickie/DSCI0019.jpg

Beaufort-RAF
02-02-2007, 10:20 AM
Drove past the Museum housing the Hampton today.

Hampden. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

ploughman
02-02-2007, 10:25 AM
The Yorkshire Air Museum has a Halifax III, named Friday the 13th, although she's a composite reconstruction and not an original production aircraft, which is sort of your point Avro.

smokincrater
02-02-2007, 05:05 PM
Originally posted by Dogfighter1969:
I am neither sad not glad. True that those planes can't harm anybody anymore (like Hoenire said). Only thing about human kind is that planes like those are left there because the country to which they belong normally has come up with newer and more dangerous planes to replace them with. Sure, Russia may not have done so because of their political changes that has taken place over the last few years. However, as far as I know there is such a graveyard in a desert in the USA as well. The same argument applies to those planes. Also ex-killers.
But as a aviation enthusiast, I believe that at least a few units of each type of plane ever developed and produced should be preserved for the sake of the generations to come. I would love to see a Spit, Me-109, Zero, P-51, etc, etc in flight at an airshow or at least in a museum, irrespective of which side the plane was fighting for. Where I come from we don't have that opportunity.

If you live in Australia you can see all those types in one hall at the Australian War Memorial. Also you can see something even rarer an Australian designed and built Warplane, the Wirraway.

Sergio_101
02-02-2007, 05:20 PM
Originally posted by smokincrater:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Dogfighter1969:
I am neither sad not glad. True that those planes can't harm anybody anymore (like Hoenire said). Only thing about human kind is that planes like those are left there because the country to which they belong normally has come up with newer and more dangerous planes to replace them with. Sure, Russia may not have done so because of their political changes that has taken place over the last few years. However, as far as I know there is such a graveyard in a desert in the USA as well. The same argument applies to those planes. Also ex-killers.
But as a aviation enthusiast, I believe that at least a few units of each type of plane ever developed and produced should be preserved for the sake of the generations to come. I would love to see a Spit, Me-109, Zero, P-51, etc, etc in flight at an airshow or at least in a museum, irrespective of which side the plane was fighting for. Where I come from we don't have that opportunity.

If you live in Australia you can see all those types in one hall at the Australian War Memorial. Also you can see something even rarer an Australian designed and built Warplane, the Wirraway. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Wirraway, a adapted NAA trainer, based on a T-6
I believe.

Sergio

-HH-Dubbo
02-02-2007, 05:30 PM
Although I love the Wirraway, it's a bit of a stretch to call it "Australian-designed". It's really more of a "Australian-adapted" version that filled a gap (quite well I might add)

I mean let's face it, the Texan/Harvard would have been better with bomb-racks and guns. And it certainly looked better with a 3-bladed prop. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Marcel_Albert
02-02-2007, 05:38 PM
Originally posted by DuxCorvan:
They wouldn't be a threat in a museum, either, but pieces of History. And those Aeroflot Antonov transports don't look so menacing to me.

Agreed , it's sad to see these planes that were once majestic , in scraped-pieces now .. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

MB_Avro_UK
02-02-2007, 05:43 PM
Originally posted by Waldo.Pepper:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Halifax:

http://www.rafmuseum.org.uk/handley-page-halifax-ii.htm

Hampden:

http://www.rafbombercommand.com/aircraft_medium.html


Canada has both a Halifax and a Hampton. Though the Hampton is a poor (but still welcome ) restoration. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks for this.. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

Pirschjaeger
02-02-2007, 08:21 PM
Wow, Waldo, I sort of heard of the second place, with the Black Widow, but never tried to go there. People told me there was nothing there, besides the Widow. I'll have to go visit the second one in HaiDian. I'm a little embarrassed to admit I used to live near it. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

There is a third museum in Beijing that has a P-51, Pe2 and a the wreckage of a U2 spyplane. China has 90+ P-51s because when Mr.Mao took power he told all foreign forces to get out of China but leave their equipment. It was his way of offering nice "thanks" to those who helped save his people from the Japanese. But what would you expect from a coward that hid in the bushes while his country and people were being ravished? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Anyways, back to the topic, the first link is the museum I was talking about. They have some interesting planes on display. It's heaven for Mig fans.

The Yak 11 is still flown here and used as a trainer. I was in another city a few months ago for a meeting and our meeting place was beside an airforce base. These Yaks were passing over every 2 minutes. They may not be WW2 a/c but they definitely had the WW2 sound. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/inlove.gif

They were even painted the same as the one in the photo.

It doesn't say when the author of that site visited Beijing but it has changed. I saw the Sturmovik he photographed but there is now a second in much better, although terrible, condition. Maybe he's not interested in WW2 a/c but there are much more intresting planes than what he posted. Next time I go back there I'll bring my camera and post a lot of pics here.

BTW, I don't know if you remember a few years ago but I started a post in here looking for info on museum a/c maintanance and cleaning. I had gotten a group together, including a reporter from a Chinese aviation magazine, for the purpose of doing volunteer work to clean up and look after the a/c in the museum. The leaders of the museum gave us the permission but we were never able to organize. Our jobs and schedules varied too much. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif