PDA

View Full Version : Yak3 damage and guns vs bf109k4 guns



F19_Ob
01-01-2004, 05:58 PM
Maybe this has been up already......but is there something wrong with the yak3 DM??

Been playing fb since it came out...(and old il2 too)


I have hit yak3's on so many occasions, 2 or 3 hits with the 30mm canon of the bf109k4 and With big hitexplosions but often without visible damage.... ofcourse sometimes the wing or tail get blown off after a burst but I shoot 109s to pieces in a yak3 with a single short one sec burst more often....can this be right??

Or is the yak damaged even if it dsnt show?

And is the structure on the bf 109k4 just weak
or is the yak3 guns just more powerfull than the guns of the messerschmitt??


Anyone else experienced this?

F19_Ob
01-01-2004, 05:58 PM
Maybe this has been up already......but is there something wrong with the yak3 DM??

Been playing fb since it came out...(and old il2 too)


I have hit yak3's on so many occasions, 2 or 3 hits with the 30mm canon of the bf109k4 and With big hitexplosions but often without visible damage.... ofcourse sometimes the wing or tail get blown off after a burst but I shoot 109s to pieces in a yak3 with a single short one sec burst more often....can this be right??

Or is the yak damaged even if it dsnt show?

And is the structure on the bf 109k4 just weak
or is the yak3 guns just more powerfull than the guns of the messerschmitt??


Anyone else experienced this?

WUAF_Badsight
01-01-2004, 06:27 PM
the visible damadge model & the hits a plane recieves are not linked 100%


with arcade mode on in the QMB you can see the full extent of the damadge a plane recieves

pourshot
01-01-2004, 06:39 PM
I was testing the german heavy MG's against the lagg3 yesterday and did not find the lagg that hard to kill so the 30mm should have little trouble.I think the problem is with how the damage is shown not how much damage is done.

http://members.optusnet.com.au/~andycarroll68/mybaby.jpeg.JPG
Ride It Like Ya Stole It

pourshot
01-01-2004, 07:30 PM
I just tested the 30mm and got kills with the first or second shots from dead six( plane was blown to bits).One time I hit the lagg and no parts came of so I just followed him for a while and he crash landed,so IMHO I see nothing wrong with it.

EDIT; I miss read the first post I see now he's talking about YAK not LaGG DOH!

http://members.optusnet.com.au/~andycarroll68/mybaby.jpeg.JPG
Ride It Like Ya Stole It

BigganD
01-03-2004, 07:01 PM
I know what you are talking about, Yak can take Mk108 hits with no damage, that i just an big bug..

No one is an ace!

blabla0001
01-03-2004, 08:00 PM
I do have one question for all you guys with the Yak DM.

Did you toss the 1.21 patch over the previous or beta patches?

I used to run the public beta patch over the patch and then tossed the 1.21 (Full) over the beta one.
Several planes were really though after that and some were completely immune for small arms fire.
So I un-installed FB, deleted the UbiSoft folder from my Programs file and did a clean install of FB with the 1.21 full patch and everything is pretty much ok now for me.

I performed a test 2 days ago with the MK108 against the Yak3 and attacked from the side, above and from dead six and the Yak3's fell down like flies.
I got most of em in the first pass.

S77th-brooks
01-03-2004, 08:17 PM
put a hole clip in it with G2 at full gun sight ,lol and she will still fly a way

S77th-brooks
01-03-2004, 08:21 PM
20mm weak as 108mk weak as ,my steel weak as ,wish i had a wooden plane lol

blabla0001
01-03-2004, 08:35 PM
Brooks, I suggest you either do as I suggested above or learn how to aim.

I just did a quick test in a G2 against 2 Yak3's and I made 2 B&Z attacks and got them both on the first pass.
The first one lost the entire tail section and the second one lost a main wing and had it's engine completely destroyed.

EDIT: I recorded a track of it so anyone who want's it can send me a PM with a mail address and I send it to you.

S77th-brooks
01-03-2004, 09:08 PM
read the post,fulled the hole gun sight

WUAF_Co_Hero
01-04-2004, 04:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I think the problem is with how the damage is shown not how much damage is done.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would have to disagree here: the problem is with the damage registering in incruments. ie: if you hit, and it shows no damage (and none inside the cockpit) then there is none. I think the problem is that sometimes there is either too much, or too little damage done, for certain hits. In other words... it's like having the temperatures on your oven read "Warm" and "Incredibly Hot"

There needs to be an inbetween i think.

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day...

Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life.

blabla0001
01-04-2004, 05:41 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by S77th-brooks:
read the post,fulled the hole gun sight<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Then why don't I have the same problem Brooks?

jeanba2
01-06-2004, 02:27 AM
I am playing a hungarian 1945 campaign with a 109 G10, and I can assure you that the Yak-3 is as the most fragile plane I fight : 1 short burst of 30 mm is ok, and a slightly longer burst of mg is enough most of the time.

robban75
01-06-2004, 04:21 AM
The Yak-3 is undoubtably the hardest plane to down. Whenever I set up a fight in the QMB against the Yak-3 in my D-9 it usually takes several passes to down a single aircraft, even when hit by multiple 20mm rounds. The most fragile part is the wingtips, but the fuselage, especially around the cockpit and wingroot area is virtually invunerable. Strange since there were no canopy armour at all. A srewed up plane for sure. It climbs too good aswell.

http://members.chello.se/unni/Dora-9-3.JPG

When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!

blabla0001
01-06-2004, 04:37 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by robban75:
The Yak-3 is undoubtably the hardest plane to down. Whenever I set up a fight in the QMB against the Yak-3 in my D-9 it usually takes several passes to down a single aircraft, even when hit by multiple 20mm rounds. The most fragile part is the wingtips, but the fuselage, especially around the cockpit and wingroot area is virtually invunerable. Strange since there were no canopy armour at all. A srewed up plane for sure. It climbs too good aswell.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No it isn't, I have a track at home where I down 2 Yak3's in a G2 so that's with only 1 20mm cannon and 2 puny MG's in one pass for each Yak3.
First Yak3 lost the entire tail section and the second Yak3 lost the entire main wing and it's engine was completely wrecked.

I had a problem with invulnerable planes (Not all but some) when I tossed the 1.21 full patch over the RC01/02 Beta patch so I decided to completely remove FB and did a clean install and only applied the 1.21 full patch over the clean 1.0 version and I have zero problems with ANY plane in this game regarding DM issues.

I don't know about the climb issue but in the gun test I did the Yak3's where unable to beat my G2 in a susstained climb and totally fell behind and even stalled out when it tried to follow me in a zoom climb after I made my first B&Z attack. (Although that was only one attempt on the Yak3's behalf because in my second B&Z attack it was destroyed)

LEXX_Luthor
01-06-2004, 04:43 AM
Blew a Yak~3 wing off with 8 Hurri guns.

I think its too small to hit. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

__________________
RUSSIAN lexx website http://www.lexx.ufo.ru/members.shtml
Stanly is a moron, kai is a walking dead beet, Xev just want sex.

robban75
01-06-2004, 05:13 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Cappadocian_317:

No it isn't,<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, that's not how I see it. I've filled that plane so full of 20mm it's not even funny. All other planes in FB goes down with 1/10 of that damage. IMO of course.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
I don't know about the climb issue but in the gun test I did the Yak3's where unable to beat my G2 in a susstained climb and totally fell behind and even stalled out when it tried to follow me in a zoom climb after I made my first B&Z attack. (Although that was only one attempt on the Yak3's behalf because in my second B&Z attack it was destroyed)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

In a sustained climb the Yak-3 outclimbs the MW50 boosted D-9. Not so in RL. The Yak-3's max climbrate was 4265ft/min, whereas the D-9 climbed at 4331ft/min. In FB the Yak-3 easily catches up to the D-9.

http://members.chello.se/unni/Dora-9-3.JPG

When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!

blabla0001
01-06-2004, 05:23 AM
"Well, that's not how I see it. I've filled that plane so full of 20mm it's not even funny. All other planes in FB goes down with 1/10 of that damage. IMO of course"

Selective quoting is really anoying if you ask me.

How did you patch your game?

How come I can gun down Yak3's a lot easier with a lot less firepower and you can't with twice the firepower?

Heck, Lexx even managed to shoot a wing off with the puny .303 machine guns.

PS: During my gum test I did not even use the manual prop pitch exploit.

robban75
01-06-2004, 05:41 AM
Well the MG 151's on the D-9 are not effective enough against the Yak-3. Sure I can get a lucky hit on the Yak, but hitting it around the cockpit area is useless. I can only tell you how I experience it. On the other hand the D-9 is the most unstable gunplattform in the game anyways. I'm sure that fits into the equation aswell.

About selective quoting, I think it looks nice.

http://members.chello.se/unni/Dora-9-3.JPG

When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!

blabla0001
01-06-2004, 05:44 AM
Okay, so how did you patch you game?

And if you want I can send you the track.
When I fired at the second Yak 95% of the hits occured around the cockpit and it wrecked the engine and ripped a main wing clean off.

You can see it very clearly and even better in 1/4 speed mode.

robban75
01-06-2004, 05:50 AM
With the 1.21 for FB 1.11.

http://members.chello.se/unni/Dora-9-3.JPG

When it comes to aircombat, I'd rather be lucky than good any day!

blabla0001
01-06-2004, 06:19 AM
And you did not have the RC01/02 public or leaked beta's installed?

I don't know what kind of connection you have but you might try to do a complete un-install (also delete the IL2 Sturmovik FB Folder) and a clean re-install with only the 1.21 full patch.

In order to save your settings, skins, missions, joystick input slider settings and key config assignments I can help if you want.
Normally I always had to re-assign all the keys until I got fed up with that and started digging around where they where saved and I found them so it only takes a bit of copy/paste work to get FB fully configured the was it was before, saving a lot of time.

blabla0001
01-06-2004, 01:25 PM
Or you guys can keep on complaining while I keep on smoking your so called "indestrucable" Yak3's with my single mounted 20mm and puny 7.92mm MG's in a single pass.

Whatever makes you feel happy....

pourshot
01-06-2004, 01:29 PM
I want to see a track were it takes "a full clip"

http://members.optusnet.com.au/~andycarroll68/mybaby.jpeg.JPG
Ride It Like Ya Stole It

blabla0001
01-06-2004, 01:40 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by pourshot:
I want to see a track were it takes "a full clip"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I am sure they are there.

When I smacked the 1.21 (full) patch over my RC01/02 install I could unload a Hurricane IIc into a Heinkel or a Stuka and only messed up the paint job and make a few holes here and there.

Then I cleaned FB off my drive and did a nice fresh install and applied the 1.21 (full) patch and voila, no more problem.
I swat down those Heinkels and Stuka's like swatting flies with a 6 foot wide fly swatter.

WUAF_Badsight
01-06-2004, 03:09 PM
was the weak guns affecting on-line as well ?

were they stronger on-line after your re-install as well ?

blabla0001
01-06-2004, 03:21 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WUAF_Badsight:
was the weak guns affecting on-line as well ?

were they stronger on-line after your re-install as well ?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The difference was noticeble online and offline.

JaBo_HH--Gotcha
01-07-2004, 01:56 AM
Hi Guys,

we had this debate some days ago already. CLint Ruin (SAlute) and me bashed our heads a bit on ths topic. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

He was so kind to send me his tracks to prove his view.

In these tracks you see that you can take the YAk-3 apart quite easy with 0.50 cal guns (two tracks showing that a P47 and P51 will kill a yak from 100m easily.
He also sent me a track showing a FW190d-9 killing YAK-3 AI (set on "valium", since they don't react) and you can see that the FW190d-9 has to put some more into them but you should ask for them yourself and judge yourself.

I have two links here for you where you can see that the DM is ODD (at least for me).

First track are from some Online dogfights of an FW190-A8 with Mk108 vs a YAK-3

http://www.black-crusade.de/hellhounds/records.zip

Slow down the videos to 1/4 as soon the FW190 comes near 200m (My aim is crap but you can count the hits..)

the second video shows that the YAK-3 is a serious threat even at high alt since it has no problems in battling it out with a FW190d

http://www.black-crusade.de/hellhounds/high-alt.zip

However this track was not to show some serious dogfight but just show that the YAK suffers no real disadvantage up there.

Sorry for my aim, but it was fist time to be caught on camera... *joke http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Good Hunting...

blabla0001
01-07-2004, 02:56 AM
I already did a test with a FW190 with 2x30mm MK108 cannons and the result was the same as with the G2, both Yak3's destroyed in the first pass.

I will do my own tests with the D9 this evening at high alt.
I know that at low and medium alt the Yak3 had a severe problem keeping up with the G2 in both susstained and especially zoom climb during my test.

blabla0001
01-07-2004, 11:30 AM
Well I did a quick test with the D9 late vs the Yak3's and it was indeed a bit harder to overcome them but this is mostely because I hardly fly in the FW190's since I prefer the Bf109's.

As for the DM, this is again no problem, small burst with all 4 guns and the Yak3's engine stoped and then it blew up, all in a fraction of a second.

S77th-brooks
01-07-2004, 12:02 PM
your the only one ,and a good shot http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

NorrisMcWhirter
01-07-2004, 12:14 PM
Hi,

I fly the Yak 3 about 60% of the time and have to say that it I have often made it make with wings full of holes after taking hits from mg fire. Cannon fire, esp from the 108, usually ends up with my crate falling apart rapidly.

As I have said before...in my experience, the Yak 3 can often be crippled by relatively little fire (without exploding spectaculary), which is as good as a kill.

Reversing the discussion a little bit, I must admit that I will always choose going after a 109 over a 190 online as I know that the 109 will come apart quite easily - very important with the low ammo count of the Yak. In fact, I fear just about everything in the 109, which I fly about 30% of the time, as it is very fragile indeed....very often frustratingly fragile.

Regards,
Norris

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ob_swe:
Maybe this has been up already......but is there something wrong with the yak3 DM??

Been playing fb since it came out...(and old il2 too)


I have hit yak3's on so many occasions, 2 or 3 hits with the 30mm canon of the bf109k4 and With big hitexplosions but often without visible damage.... ofcourse sometimes the wing or tail get blown off after a burst but I shoot 109s to pieces in a yak3 with a single short one sec burst more often....can this be right??

Or is the yak damaged even if it dsnt show?

And is the structure on the bf 109k4 just weak
or is the yak3 guns just more powerfull than the guns of the messerschmitt??


Anyone else experienced this?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Chris Morris : Blue Jam : http://cabinessence.cream.org/

More irreverence:
http://www.tvgohome.com/

blabla0001
01-07-2004, 01:19 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by S77th-brooks:
your the only one ,and a good shot http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

First, I am not the only one.

Second, if what you guys claim is true, does it really matter if I am a good shot or not since the Yak3 is indestrucable.

The only conclusion I can draw is you either miss 99% of the time or you have a messed up patch installation, or worse, a combination of both.

So my initial view on the matter still stands, you guys rather complain then root out the cause of your problem.

[This message was edited by Cappadocian_317 on Wed January 07 2004 at 12:33 PM.]

VW-IceFire
01-07-2004, 01:32 PM
This isn't the first time I've heard that a patch installation has caused problems. Someone found the AI to be not working very well (crashing, not doing much of anything, not being agressive, etc). The guy reinstalled the game and noticed a huge difference...which is strange. Because that shouldn't be so.

Yak 3 is a slippery target but I still haven't found it to be invulnerable.

- IceFire
http://home.cogeco.ca/~cczerneda/sigs/spit-sig.jpg

blabla0001
01-07-2004, 01:36 PM
The patch over patch over patch problems have been there since the original IL2.

I also think that most of the weird issues people had or still have are due to that + in some cases lack of enough skill.