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View Full Version : OT.. Just trying Falcon 4 Allied Force...



SeaFireLIV
04-28-2006, 06:27 AM
Ok, I decided to try Falcon 4 Allied Force. Got it originally about 6 years ago when new, but never had TIR or any of the gubbins. Never really gave it a proper chance. Thought I`d try again...


WOW!

The manual said that the F16 was an easy plane to fly, but I never realised how easy. It`s like flying an arcade game! I can do just about anything in this plane with only a slight `buffer` stall warning (on my FF). I did create an intentional `deep` stall where I`m flopping about as the F16 computer tries to correct but blows it (tsk- typical AI http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif ).

IL2 aircraft are much more work to keep straight and maintain, but this is actually ACCURATE, even the F16 manual says WWII planes were MUCH harder work and needed much more skill to fly, especially planes like the P51. So all those potential `P51 Aces` need to know that you can`t fling `em around like an modern aircraft, as with all WWII planes they need work. Flying inverted at 200 feet in a WWII plane`s almost impossible, in Falcon 4, it`s enjoyably easy!

This is all on full real settings!

Compared to WWII aircraft the F16 is a total (and refreshing) breeze to fly.

Guess, the hard bit must be all the weapons and radar stuff.

Looking forward to the dynamic Campaign. Don`t think I`ll be flying it until a month though, printer`s still printing half a forest worth of manual...

Capt.LoneRanger
04-28-2006, 06:33 AM
F4:AF is really a great game, definitely one of my alltime-favourites and it is still alive!

Yes, the flying is often called to be unrealistic and arcadish, but it is not. I read many interviews with Falcon-Jocks and they all confirmed, that this is really what the plane feels like.

But actually the great modelling of the avionics, the weapons and sysems and of course the still to be bet dynamical campaign-system is making this game one of the best sims, even though the core of the game is about 10 years old! (IIRC...)

Really great game! Glad you like it.

huggy87
04-28-2006, 11:59 AM
I can't speak for the viper (maybe sensei and blottog can, they both flew it), but I have 1300 hours in hornets from the B to F model. It is an incredibly EASY plane to fly. The auto trim takes care of pitch trim, the rudders only need trimmed maybe once a flight, and the ailerons need very little. The few times I have flown prop planes they have required much more attention. Friends who have been to test pilot school and flown old warbirds like the mustang comment on how much more muscle and attention they require. That being said, todays planes take a lot more attention and training to fight well, so it is a good thing that they are so easy to fly.

Megile_
04-28-2006, 12:06 PM
t'aye... its a decent sim alright.

alert_1
04-28-2006, 12:08 PM
F16 as the other modern fighters is easy to fly but hard to fight in

Pig_Mac
04-28-2006, 12:18 PM
Hurry up and buy HiTilesAF and you will never regret it! Makes the game look a damn lot better, well at least the terrain.

tHeBaLrOgRoCkS
04-28-2006, 12:22 PM
Hey SeaFireLIV, Was thinking about a little retro gaming myself recently also. So I got hold of this little beauty.

Hind 95 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

kept me grinning like a chimp on fermented mango (mind you I had been up all night)

Found some vids for the curious

http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=E89932527A07AC69

NonWonderDog
04-28-2006, 01:00 PM
The Viper really is easy to fly in Falcon 4.0 AF, but I must admit that it took me a while to get used to landing. It's just so unlike landing a GA aircraft that it's hard to come to grips with. Apparently you really are supposed to maintain a constant 13 degree angle of attack with the nose pointed way over the horizion, during the entire final approach, with full speedbrakes and 70% throttle, and almost no flare on touchdown... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

Capt.LoneRanger
04-28-2006, 01:14 PM
The Hind from DiD?

Wow, man, that was a great game! Almost as good as Longow, almost.

appulluk
04-28-2006, 01:22 PM
I was not happy with this sim. It's all-cockpit nothing else it seems. Have you see what happens when you crash? You don't even quite explode, just break into a few pieces with your fuselage quite intact, and the little explosions are weak looking.

The terrain tiles can look obvious too, which means ugly. And the training? Just read-and-jump-in again, ugh.

I wanted to love that sim - the only thing I loved was the depth of the cockpit, everything else, blah.

jjtasker
04-28-2006, 02:42 PM
A family friend flew F106's in the ARNG, then converted to F16s for a while before he "retired" to a non flying job with them. He told me F4 was pretty damned accurate, but the 2 huge things you never can simulate were the amazing "riding on top" view the F16 has, and the "feeling" of pulling G's. The "buttonology" was close enough to let real Viper guys do things without the game manual in some cases.

Dew-Claw
04-28-2006, 03:17 PM
I love it, Manual starts with setting up the Nav/weap computer is spot on.
I got into an arguement with an ex f-16 jocky about the accuracy of the sim, he had never seen.
He bet $10 bucks it was simplified and wrong.

After watching me start it up, taxi it out and fly it off the runway and bring it in for a perfect landing, he decided that if I ever was able to sneak on a base I just might be able to get away with one if they are sleeping on the job.
easy $10

He now flys the sim himself and claims its very accurate, minus the feel of really being in the air of course.

I would be in absolute heaven if IL2 adopted a similar dynamic campaign engine.

SeaFireLIV
04-28-2006, 03:33 PM
Thnx, guys.

Seems like Falcon 4`s really got the pedigree. I`m taking re-learning it week by week!

XyZspineZyX
04-28-2006, 03:48 PM
Originally posted by appulluk:
I was not happy with this sim. It's all-cockpit nothing else it seems. Have you see what happens when you crash? You don't even quite explode, just break into a few pieces with your fuselage quite intact, and the little explosions are weak looking.

The terrain tiles can look obvious too, which means ugly. And the training? Just read-and-jump-in again, ugh.

I wanted to love that sim - the only thing I loved was the depth of the cockpit, everything else, blah.

The game was first released in 1999, wtf did you expect, LOMAC?

Toten_Waffe
04-28-2006, 04:42 PM
Just got Falcon 4.0 myself a few days ago and its taken me nearly two days solid trying to work out how to operate the nose wheel when taxiing.......turns out you use the joystick http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif and not the rudder controls when on the ground http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/1072.gif

Also i wish they would sell a hard copy of the manual.....im definitely not printing out 700 odd pages on my ickle epson ink jet.

Check out the HiTiles website for the terrain mod....looks most excellant.

Capt.LoneRanger
04-28-2006, 04:46 PM
Please forgive me, appulluk, but isn't sitting in a cockpit what a flightsim is actually about. Well I read some discussions here about the wish to run around with a pistol after bailing out but... well..

And unspectacular?

1. Don't crash - so you won't be annoyed by your unspectacular death
2. This is a flightsim, not a crash-sim. I heared NASA invented one, though?

Dew-Claw
04-28-2006, 05:23 PM
Originally posted by Toten_Waffe:
Just got Falcon 4.0 myself a few days ago and its taken me nearly two days solid trying to work out how to operate the nose wheel when taxiing.......turns out you use the joystick http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif and not the rudder controls when on the ground http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/1072.gif

Also i wish they would sell a hard copy of the manual.....im definitely not printing out 700 odd pages on my ickle epson ink jet.

Check out the HiTiles website for the terrain mod....looks most excellant.


My girlfriend works in a printshop...a fully bound manual seemed to somehow find its way into my possession.
Its a lifesaver.

LEXX_Luthor
04-28-2006, 05:46 PM
jjtasker::
A family friend flew F106's in the ARNG, then converted to...
<span class="ev_code_yellow">Interview</span> this man. http://www.ubisoft.de/smileys/chatten.gif


http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d178/Lexx_Luthor/55fbb6a5.jpg http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d178/Lexx_Luthor/7e0a015b.jpg

SeaFireLIV
04-28-2006, 07:56 PM
Originally posted by Toten_Waffe:
Just got Falcon 4.0 myself a few days ago and its taken me nearly two days solid trying to work out how to operate the nose wheel when taxiing.......turns out you use the joystick http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif and not the rudder controls when on the ground http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/1072.gif

Also i wish they would sell a hard copy of the manual.....im definitely not printing out 700 odd pages on my ickle epson ink jet.

Check out the HiTiles website for the terrain mod....looks most excellant.

Yep. Took me a while to work out the nose wheel steering too. So far, I`ve yet to see the need for rudder pedals, they do very little, if anything.

I actually got quite anarak and tried a complete pre-systems start. I did it, but it took about 30 minutes. Learnt more about the F16 cockpit in that one time than I need to know! Made the Taxi easy enough and tok off.

Tried landing. 1st attempt hit the end fence, 2nd attempt landed, but best the jet engine behind me and third attempt landed properly, but got told off by the Tower lady for not getting new landing clearance (she wanted me to abort).

Now to work on the air fighting and radar stuff and I should be ready for actual service!

I agree, a proper manual should be available, even if they charged an extra fiver and sold it separately- it would be worthy. I`ll look at that website for the terrain. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

The-Pizza-Man
04-28-2006, 08:35 PM
I've got it but it demoralised me with how complicated it is. I know how long it took me to be halfway competant with LOMAC and I don't have that sort of time to spare learning F4. It would be great if there was a bit more in game tutoring. I can't emphasise enough how helpful voice over or even on screen text prompted tutorials are.

wayno7777
04-28-2006, 08:58 PM
What is the difference between F4 and F4:AF?

appulluk
04-28-2006, 10:05 PM
Originally posted by Skunk241981:
The game was first released in 1999, wtf did you expect, LOMAC?

Don't tell me they couldn't have a better crash/explosion effect + less repetetive tiles (an artistic issue not a technological one) in 1999.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/sleepzzz.gif

C'mon, don't you guys like your sims to be consistent? Or are you just flight-model jockeys? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

NonWonderDog
04-28-2006, 11:37 PM
Originally posted by wayno7777:
What is the difference between F4 and F4:AF?

Allied Force plays much like F4 with all the mods from the last five years installed (except those that let you fly "other planes"). The flight model is much improved, there are more planes, more ground objects, more weapons, an an additional theatre, and a bit of a graphic upgrade, especially in regards to the F-16 itself.

The difference between Allied Force and Falcon 4.0 with all the modern mods installed is stability, usability, and stability, not to mention stability. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif The user interface is quite improved, and the sim is actually stable enough to fly online. I haven't had it crash once... not once. There are some very nice looking exclusive cockpits you can't find in the mods, too.

The terrain tiles are straight out of the original Falcon 4.0, unfortunately, and they look fairly ****. You really need to purchase the third-party "HiTilesAF" for it to look decent.

The explosion effects are perfectly adequate, as long as you're not the one exploding. They look fine from a half-mile out, and you'll usually see them from that far or further. They look like 1998 if you see them from ten feet away. Actually, they're only about average for 1998 if you see them ten feet away; the explosions aren't quite as pretty as in Battlezone (from '98), even.

Hmmm..... I guess I have to retract that. My version of Battlezone ran on a Voodoo 2 SLI rig. What I saw of Falcon 4.0 didn't (I didn't buy it back in '98).

wayno7777
04-28-2006, 11:44 PM
Thanks, I was wondering cause I have F4 with SP4. As a side note to the graphics, I used a mod for EAW that used F4 graphics. It was cool for the time....

NonWonderDog
04-28-2006, 11:52 PM
Oh, in that case, I forgot to mention the best part: you put the CD in the drive and it installs, and when the ticker gets to 100%, you can fly! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

It only takes five minutes, too! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

The-Pizza-Man
04-29-2006, 12:33 AM
Originally posted by NonWonderDog:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wayno7777:
What is the difference between F4 and F4:AF?

Allied Force plays much like F4 with all the mods from the last five years installed (except those that let you fly "other planes"). The flight model is much improved, there are more planes, more ground objects, more weapons, an an additional theatre, and a bit of a graphic upgrade, especially in regards to the F-16 itself.

The difference between Allied Force and Falcon 4.0 with all the modern mods installed is stability, usability, and stability, not to mention stability. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif The user interface is quite improved, and the sim is actually stable enough to fly online. I haven't had it crash once... not once. There are some very nice looking exclusive cockpits you can't find in the mods, too.

The terrain tiles are straight out of the original Falcon 4.0, unfortunately, and they look fairly ****. You really need to purchase the third-party "HiTilesAF" for it to look decent.

The explosion effects are perfectly adequate, as long as you're not the one exploding. They look fine from a half-mile out, and you'll usually see them from that far or further. They look like 1998 if you see them from ten feet away. Actually, they're only about average for 1998 if you see them ten feet away; the explosions aren't quite as pretty as in Battlezone (from '98), even.

Hmmm..... I guess I have to retract that. My version of Battlezone ran on a Voodoo 2 SLI rig. What I saw of Falcon 4.0 didn't (I didn't buy it back in '98). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've actually had stability problems with AF as well as problems with the mis-sized cockpit pictures, it's very frustrating actually.

Capt.LoneRanger
04-29-2006, 12:49 AM
Infact, appulluk, we gratefully agree to these points, cause if your points for critizism is all you can criticize on Falcon4, then it seems to be a flawless game.

@wayno7777
Falcon4 was the original release back in 1995, more than 10 years ago. There were some patches, before Microprose, the company was bought by HasrboInteractive, which was then bought by Atari.
The official support stopped, but fans kept working on the title, making it even more immersive, more detailed and more real. The Avionics and Campaign-System were greatly enhanced, mainly by 2 different groups, eFalcon and RealFalcon.

Falcon4:AF is the rerelease of the original Falcon, completely reworked by the RealFalcon-Team, with a second campaign, refreshes graphics and effects and a vastly more complex avionics and interactive campaign-system than any release before.

On the downside Atari, now having the rights for the title, didn't give the permission to modify the F4.exe-file itself. Though internally F4 seems to be running on DX9 with extremely enhanced graphics, these changes were not allowed for a commercial release and are practically illegal, as they modify the original code. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

It still looks better than many other sims being released in the recent years http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

WTE_Ibis
04-29-2006, 12:56 AM
http://premium1.uploadit.org/Ibissix//P1010028.JPG

.

Capt.LoneRanger
04-29-2006, 01:49 AM
Good morning, then http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Yes, I never saw something even close to size and quality of the Falcon-Series handbooks. And the original book was within the box, not just a PDF-file on the disk! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

panther3485
04-29-2006, 02:31 AM
Hi there, Capt.LoneRanger

Quote:
"Falcon4 was the original release back in 1995, more than 10 years ago."

Taxing my memory here but AFAIK, the original Falcon 4.0 was released late 1998. There was an earlier version, released around 1995 I think, (again, AFAIK) which was called Falcon 3 or something?

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif


Best regards,
panther3485

EDIT: I've got the original Falcon 4.0, boxed, full manual, the works - with 1998 on the CD-ROM. I've also purchased Falcon4 AF and apart from the crappy terrain tiles I reckon it's pretty darned good, mate!

SeaFireLIV
04-29-2006, 04:55 AM
Yep, my file`s about 2\3rds to that size as well, WTE_Ibis . Just another 400 pages to go!

Yes, graphically, it doesn`t look as good as IL2. Some stuff is pretty good, I like the fact that all the vehicles and trucks look good and you`ve got little road side markers telling you where runway x is, etc. Fellow I16s look realistic. Pity I don`t see any people walking about, but no sim yet has this.

And yep, your own personal crashes look rubbish. You basically get a few puffs of smoke when it ought to be a raging inferno with a fireball. It does make me wonder why they never worked more on explosions and crashes, I mean, is it really so hard to add more smoke and just make it blacker?

What makes it nice though is the constant communications you get, which while at first strange, becomes more legible. For instance, dawdle about too long on taxi and the Tower will ask you what the problem is. They`ll also inform you that you`re holding up the whole traffic. Stuff like this I really like and for me, is more important than glorious graphics; gameplay immersion first, 21st century graphics later.

I also hear that Patch 1.6 will add some new graphics.

I`m trying to get this new tiles disc at the moment which should fix up the ground.

wayno7777
04-29-2006, 05:45 PM
Well then, I may have to try it out. I have the original F4 demo. It came on a short lived UK Ultimate PC mag demo disk.I bought F4 at Best Buy on a weekend that they had it on sale for $14.99. Got the whole works, manual, looseleaf binder and all. The only real problem other than running it in software mode was that I found EAW and Jane's WWII Fighters. Oh, and a demo for this little Russian sim. Like I said before, i have the F4 official pathes and the SP patches. I do play it for time to time....