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View Full Version : Hackers try to steal Storm of War... Crikey!



Feathered_IV
09-30-2010, 05:15 AM
News just in from the banana lounge:



Originally Posted by Oleg Maddox:
You are right. However new office - new problems. Just I have external emal, not working yet network as it should, etc... We are even not unpacking completely, especially me with my couple of thousands aviation books....

And main thing.... from my home PC there was attempt of grab the very early version of BoB (without any interface and other things... ) by special spy program (probably that was done especially for this purpose and it was unknown)
Antivirus company spend two days to solve problem with my home PC.

However this spy program wan't able to grab SoW... due to fact that my home network is too slow at the moment...

In my practice it is the second such case. First was with Forgotten Battles or Pacific (don't remember exactly). there we identified from where was attempt. Now... hackers became more and more smart...

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

stalkervision
09-30-2010, 06:35 AM
They were probably just looking for the release date ! LOL! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Feathered_IV
09-30-2010, 06:41 AM
Oh, you mean Play.com? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

Bearcat99
09-30-2010, 07:03 AM
Originally posted by stalkervision:
They were probably just looking for the release date ! LOL! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

This really isn't funny.. people bit(h & moan about securom and boontybox and all that... yet this is why we even have that crap n the first place...

That's a d@mn shame...

stalkervision
09-30-2010, 07:46 AM
It's just a basic fact of the cyber world BC. Even Oleg isn't immune apparently.

you would think oleg would have much better security though. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Feathered_IV
09-30-2010, 08:17 AM
All bravado aside, pretty significant event in the history of the series. Must have been quite the effort to try to hack his home computer. Makes you wonder who did it. Whether they were players, pirates or industrial espionage types.

DrHerb
09-30-2010, 08:36 AM
bunch of jackholes if you ask me.

R_Target
09-30-2010, 08:49 AM
Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
All bravado aside, pretty significant event in the history of the series. Must have been quite the effort to try to hack his home computer. Makes you wonder who did it. Whether they were players, pirates or industrial espionage types.

They were just tired of waiting. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

stalkervision
09-30-2010, 08:59 AM
Originally posted by R_Target:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
All bravado aside, pretty significant event in the history of the series. Must have been quite the effort to try to hack his home computer. Makes you wonder who did it. Whether they were players, pirates or industrial espionage types.

They were just tired of waiting. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

TgD Thunderbolt56
09-30-2010, 01:18 PM
Actually, I don't look at this occurrence as anything similar as to the reasons for Securerom or Boontybox.

Sure, bypassing any retail purchase or any other legal means of procurement IS stealing, but this is different. This is pre-meditated attempted burglary. It's the difference between a shoplifter and someone actually coming into your living room and snatching your big screen.

It's different.

On a funny note though (and an upside if there is one), he said they failed because his pc/network was too slow. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Urufu_Shinjiro
09-30-2010, 03:21 PM
Small correction (it's a pet peeve), piracy is not theft, it's copyright infringement, it's still wrong and it's still illegal, but it's not theft or stealing.

AndyJWest
09-30-2010, 03:38 PM
Actually, this isn't piracy anyway. Hacking into a computer to get at confidential data isn't the same thing as producing unlicensed copies of publicly-available data. I've no idea what the law is in Russia, but in the UK for example, this is a criminal offence under the Computer Misuse Act 1990, and could lead to 6 months' imprisonment, or a £5000 fine.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_Misuse_Act_1990

Urufu_Shinjiro
09-30-2010, 03:41 PM
In Soviet Russia, law hack you....Lol, couldn't resist.

major_setback
09-30-2010, 04:34 PM
How do you tell if someone is hacking into your computer?
I couldn't tell....but I'd like to know how you can see it.

Chivas
09-30-2010, 04:51 PM
Taking something that doesn't belong to you is. STEALING

WTE_Galway
09-30-2010, 04:53 PM
Originally posted by major_setback:
How do you tell if someone is hacking into your computer?
I couldn't tell....but I'd like to know how you can see it.

Lots of network activity when you clearly are not downloading or updating anything yourself is a good start.

Heavy_Weather
09-30-2010, 04:59 PM
oh great I can see it now. One will have to log into Steam or Battlenet to play.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Urufu_Shinjiro
10-01-2010, 09:10 AM
Originally posted by Chivas:
Taking something that doesn't belong to you is. STEALING

No, not according to the law. The legal definition of stealing is "The wrongful or willful taking of money or property belonging to someone else with intent to deprive the owner of its use or benefit either temporarily or permanently".
Theft:
"the generic term for all crimes in which a person intentionally and fraudulently takes personal property of another without permission or consent and with the intent to convert it to the taker's use (including potential sale)."

Larceny:
"Illegal taking and carrying away of personal property belonging to another with the purpose of depriving the owner of its possession."

These crimes all REQUIRE physical property and the intent to deprive the original owner of said property. The copying and unauthorized distribution of intellectual property does NOT deprive the original owner of the property. Thus we have separate laws.

Old_Canuck
10-01-2010, 10:18 AM
legal hair-splitting aside. Theft or piracy. It's still stealing.

Messaschnitzel
10-01-2010, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by Urufu_Shinjiro:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chivas:
Taking something that doesn't belong to you is. STEALING

No, not according to the law. The legal definition of stealing is "The wrongful or willful taking of money or property belonging to someone else with intent to deprive the owner of its use or benefit either temporarily or permanently".
Theft:
"the generic term for all crimes in which a person intentionally and fraudulently takes personal property of another without permission or consent and with the intent to convert it to the taker's use (including potential sale)."

Larceny:
"Illegal taking and carrying away of personal property belonging to another with the purpose of depriving the owner of its possession."

These crimes all REQUIRE physical property and the intent to deprive the original owner of said property. The copying and unauthorized distribution of intellectual property does NOT deprive the original owner of the property. Thus we have separate laws. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's interesting. It does make sense, although it might seem that the written laws reflect that it might not be keeping up with the speed of technology as it is today.

Consider if a company or an individual had put years of effort and money into an original CAD design for a device, (or even software for a computer game) and that designer/creator's computer was successfully hacked by an outside source, how is this action legally defined? I would think that such a victim would be SOL if they had not yet taken any intellectual property legal precautions since the project might be incomplete at the time.

If someone were to use the defense of "Hey, I didn't physically take anything. All I did was make a copy for myself, and besides, they still have the original!", I would compare it to this: When I was a kid, I would watch the 'Mission Impossible' crew sneak in, take pictures of top secret documents with a mini camera in a supposedly secure room in a supposedly secure facility, and then GTFO to make their way back to safety. Pretty cool, but I did think of it as taking something that didn't belong to them in the first place. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

waffen-79
10-01-2010, 12:58 PM
ahhaha In sowiet russia, game releases you!

maybe it was SoW itself that wants to be released

Xiolablu3
10-01-2010, 01:44 PM
If I was Oleg, I wouldnt bother telling anyone about my next project until 3 months before release.
Keep it completely secret.

That would stop the pre-pubescant kids whining for a release before its ready, and also hackers even knowing there was anything to steal.

Urufu_Shinjiro
10-01-2010, 04:08 PM
Originally posted by Messaschnitzel:
Consider if a company or an individual had put years of effort and money into an original CAD design for a device, (or even software for a computer game) and that designer/creator's computer was successfully hacked by an outside source, how is this action legally defined?

In that example it would be considered industrial espionage, which is generally considered a more serious crime than theft.

In the case of file sharing (music, movies, etc.), since the original owner has not been deprived of the use of their property, but merely the exclusive rights to distribute copies of their property as afforded them by the copyright laws, it is not theft or stealing, it is copyright infringement. The problem is the laws were intended to operate on a corporate scale, it wasn't envisioned that the private citizen would be able to engage in mass distribution of intellectual property, thus verdicts that fine single mothers almost $2billion.

Chivas
10-01-2010, 05:37 PM
You can use all the legalese you want, but its still STEALING.

Old_Canuck
10-02-2010, 07:09 PM
From Webster's dictionary:

Definition of STEAL
intransitive verb
1
: to take the property of another wrongfully and especially as a habitual or regular practice
2
: to come or go secretly, unobtrusively, gradually, or unexpectedly
3
: to steal or attempt to steal a base
transitive verb
1
a : to take or appropriate without right or leave and with intent to keep or make use of wrongfully <stole a car> b : to take away by force or unjust means <they've stolen our liberty> c : to take surreptitiously or without permission <steal a kiss> d : to appropriate to oneself or beyond one's proper share : make oneself the focus of <steal the show>
2
a : to move, convey, or introduce secretly : smuggle b : to accomplish in a concealed or unobserved manner <steal a visit>
3
a : to seize, gain, or win by trickery, skill, or daring <a basketball player adept at stealing the ball> <stole the election> b of a base runner : to reach (a base) safely solely by running and usually catching the opposing team off guard
— steal·able\?st?-l?-b?l\ adjective
— steal·er noun
— steal a march on
: to gain an advantage on unobserved
— steal one's thunder
: to grab attention from another especially by anticipating an idea, plan, or presentation; also : to claim credit for another's idea
Examples of STEAL

1. They stole thousands of dollars' worth of jewelry from the store.
2. He discovered that his car had been stolen.
3. The store manager accused the boy of stealing.
4. I stole a cookie from the cookie jar.
5. They stole our best pitcher away from our team.
6. His outstanding performance stole the show.
[7. He attempted to steal code from Oleg's computer but failed because the connection was too slow.]

Origin of STEAL
Middle English stelen, from Old English stelan; akin to Old High German stelan to steal
First Known Use: before 12th century

====================================

Urufu_Shinjiro
10-02-2010, 08:19 PM
Originally posted by Chivas:
You can use all the legalese you want, but its still STEALING.

Say it however many times you like, no one has ever be charged with theft for downloading anything. It's no less illegal, no less morally wrong, but copyright infringement is not theft. The equating of illegal filesharing and theft is pure propaganda from the media industries that stand to profit from the legalized extortion they are perpetrating upon their customers. Just recently a lawyer that handles copyright suits accidentally posted his entire website up to the public as a backup, including all his private and business emails. He basically admits in these emails that they send out millions of letters threatening suit for illegal filesharing in hopes that a certain percentage will settle for a few hundred to a few thousand dollars, and they know that quite a number of these letters go out to completely innocent people. The media industries scream and cry about lost profits and how filesharing is killing the industry, they make this noise in order to lobby for stricter copyright laws and enforcement, all the while they are making record profits even in this economic downturn. There is a bill in congress right now that will require the DOJ to police the internet and gives them extremely broad powers to shut down sites that may be used for piracy. This bill is so broad that if it had been enacted several years back then youtube would not exist today. Copyright is set up specifically as a civil matter, and all enforcement is to be pursued in civil court by the rights holder, this bill and others the industry have and are lobbying for will REQUIRE that the government prosecute violators on behalf of the media industry. Not only are they making record profits, not only do they want tighter and tighter control over every aspect of the way we are or are not allowed to consume our media, they want the federal government and our tax dollars to do their job of protecting their interests.

So when people parrot their propaganda, I take exception. Illegal filesharing is NOT theft, it is copyright infringement! Violators of copyright are legally and rightfully subject to civil suit by the rightsholders, thieves have committed misdemeanors or felonies and are subject to arrest, fines, and incarceration. Do you see the difference, and more importantly do you see the dangers involved in culturally equating the two?

Feathered_IV
10-02-2010, 11:54 PM
Remotely sneaking onto Olegs home computer and trying to take a copy of the unreleased title, knowingly against the wishes of its rightful owner is most certainly an attempt at theft.

Urufu_Shinjiro
10-03-2010, 07:28 AM
Originally posted by Feathered_IV:
Remotely sneaking onto Olegs home computer and trying to take a copy of the unreleased title, knowingly against the wishes of its rightful owner is most certainly an attempt at theft.

Well theft requires the intent to deprive the owner use of said propery so no, that would be industrial espianage. My previous post though was not in response to the hacking, but others posts about filesharing.

Chivas
10-05-2010, 05:12 PM
Its still STEALING.

VW-IceFire
10-05-2010, 05:43 PM
Originally posted by Chivas:
Its still STEALING.
Actually Urufu_Shinjiro has very nicely summarized the legal position on what file sharing is and is not. Such activities are not stealing... they are considered copyright infringement. It would be a really good idea if people did not confuse the two.

x6BL_Brando
10-05-2010, 06:45 PM
Well, there's legalese and then there's reality. People who host copyrighted files so that people can download them at no cost may call themselves champions of some freedom or another, but the truth is that they are aiding and abetting people in the commision of a crime. Label it what you will, but it's getting something for nothing when it should be paid for. It's unfortunate that some poor sucker gets made an example of by the courts, but they should have been aware of the consequences in the first place.

WTE_Galway
10-05-2010, 06:57 PM
In essence it comes down to the fact that the big corporate movie/music/book publishers have no idea what to do with the unusual new market the internet presents and are trying "round peg in square hole" fashion to make this new paradigm fit the traditional way they always did business.

The whole DRM/theft etc issue stems from a total lack of imagination on the part of the big corporations.

As a case in point my step-daughter by 15 had amassed over 100Gb of MP3 music. She never listened to most of it and tended to often buy the CDs for the music she liked and listened to regularly.

Now the music industry would claim she "stole" that 100Gb of music and would otherwise as a typical 15 year old girl have gone out and spent the $50,000 or so to buy all 3000 odd Cd's . Totally ludicrous.

BillSwagger
10-05-2010, 07:25 PM
Originally posted by x6BL_Brando:
Well, there's legalese and then there's reality. People who host copyrighted files so that people can download them at no cost may call themselves champions of some freedom or another, but the truth is that they are aiding and abetting people in the commision of a crime. Label it what you will, but it's getting something for nothing when it should be paid for. It's unfortunate that some poor sucker gets made an example of by the courts, but they should have been aware of the consequences in the first place.

It gives me a business idea for protecting software and other types of IP.
Basically, they just need a third party to introduce bunk software into the pirated market so anyone looking for pirated copies of their material will always find copies that don't work or invite spam. If they wanted to take it one step further they could even introduce a malicious component to it that doesn't take effect right away so the user is uncertain of the causes when problems arise. If they complain its another way of them admitting they stole software. Sometimes its not so much that a case need to be drawn or that catching hackers/pirates is essential. They just need to be deterred the same way a thief would pass up on breaking into a house with a well known alarm system installed. You use a third party so any damage can't be directly linked to the originator of the software.
This third party speaks every language except the one the complainer/thief is from.


Bill

Chivas
10-05-2010, 08:32 PM
Keep calling it whatever you like. Its still STEALING.

WTE_Galway
10-05-2010, 08:48 PM
Originally posted by Chivas:
Keep calling it whatever you like. Its still STEALING.

That's an extremely debatable question in common law countries as theft devolves from the old English offense of larceny which involved carrying away and depriving the rightful owner of tangible personal property.

Unless you mean in the overly simplistic general sense that for example you might tell a child "regardless of the circumstances that is a lie and lies are bad" (then get upset when they tell the Gestapo where the Jews are hiding).

Or in the sense you might tell a sexually active teenage girl "I don't care what the legal situation is your behavior upsets me and your still a depraved little tramp".

In the end what the "moral majority" might condemn as stealing and something "people like us never do" is irrelevant, its only what the law currently states (and that of course may change) that counts.

Chivas
10-06-2010, 11:42 AM
I thank everyone for the all the legalese, but anyone with a modicum of common sense know, ITS STILL STEALING.

Urufu_Shinjiro
10-06-2010, 12:49 PM
Originally posted by BillSwagger:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by x6BL_Brando:
Well, there's legalese and then there's reality. People who host copyrighted files so that people can download them at no cost may call themselves champions of some freedom or another, but the truth is that they are aiding and abetting people in the commision of a crime. Label it what you will, but it's getting something for nothing when it should be paid for. It's unfortunate that some poor sucker gets made an example of by the courts, but they should have been aware of the consequences in the first place.

It gives me a business idea for protecting software and other types of IP.
Basically, they just need a third party to introduce bunk software into the pirated market so anyone looking for pirated copies of their material will always find copies that don't work or invite spam. If they wanted to take it one step further they could even introduce a malicious component to it that doesn't take effect right away so the user is uncertain of the causes when problems arise. If they complain its another way of them admitting they stole software. Sometimes its not so much that a case need to be drawn or that catching hackers/pirates is essential. They just need to be deterred the same way a thief would pass up on breaking into a house with a well known alarm system installed. You use a third party so any damage can't be directly linked to the originator of the software.
This third party speaks every language except the one the complainer/thief is from.


Bill </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh they already do this, flood the channels with bad files. They pay third parties lots of money for this. These third parties also hack sites and perform ddos attacks on sites their clients deem threats. The software companies also tried that trick of making pirate copies of their games glitch at critical parts, that backfired when word of mouth got out from early reviews that the game was buggy and didn't work, so they abandoned that.