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crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 01:33 PM
You know, after reading PF, GD and ORR forums€¦I am really disappointed in you guys, not all of you...but still. Where did that time go when we were happy with a little tiny bitty patches, that were addressing much smaller things. This patch required a lot of work, much more work then you think. And instead OF APPRICIATION all is see is disappointment€¦ What gives? Because you didn`t get couple of planes that were promised? Is that it? So€¦ issues with carrier take offs€¦ graphical problems are not important? Couple more planes is what need to make your day? This is really sad.

crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 01:33 PM
You know, after reading PF, GD and ORR forums€¦I am really disappointed in you guys, not all of you...but still. Where did that time go when we were happy with a little tiny bitty patches, that were addressing much smaller things. This patch required a lot of work, much more work then you think. And instead OF APPRICIATION all is see is disappointment€¦ What gives? Because you didn`t get couple of planes that were promised? Is that it? So€¦ issues with carrier take offs€¦ graphical problems are not important? Couple more planes is what need to make your day? This is really sad.

georgeo76
01-18-2005, 01:36 PM
I bet no body will even fly the betty when it dose arrive :S

harryklein66
01-18-2005, 01:38 PM
What Ivan said!

xTHRUDx
01-18-2005, 01:38 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>What gives? Because you didn`t get couple of planes that were promised? Is that it? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


interesting sentence. &lt;ducks&gt;

CD_Turbo
01-18-2005, 01:40 PM
Hello Ivan!

Yes people are bound to get disapointed "gamers/developers" at each other because this is a community and people speak freely.

I truly believe that we should wait for the Addon because some things like the graphic fixes are borrowed from it if i remember right.

Keep this community alive everyone and post your oppinions in a respectful way.

NoBunny
01-18-2005, 01:40 PM
Well - I have no more room to *****.

With this patch and the new CAT 5.10's I must say that the game has never ran, or looked better for me.

SKULLS_Exec01
01-18-2005, 01:42 PM
Well said Ivan!!
Also those with the 3.04 beta will probably NOT see any changes, because you already have them! (I would think) THis is just the finished NON beta version...

F19_Olli72
01-18-2005, 01:43 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by georgeo76:
I bet no body will even fly the betty when it dose arrive :S <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ill take that bet http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Dunkelgrun
01-18-2005, 01:44 PM
Well I was joking.
http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=400102&f=26310365&m=8701072562

You must remember though, that this patch only fixes that which was buggered up by the last one. No real addition to the game, is it?

Also, I've been writing a campaign for the Betty since Day 1 of PF, so I am going to fly it. Or, more likely, suffer a multitude of fiery deaths http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif.

Cheers!

TheGozr
01-18-2005, 01:46 PM
Agree , Should get patches to fix what was wrong or face lift on what is already existing.

CD_Frank
01-18-2005, 01:47 PM
Greetings CrazyIvan
We of the gaming community have lashings of patience (especially for IL2, you have to have)more than you give us credit. So please indulge us and give out a COMPLETED add on, not half measures just to appease the whiners who need there favourite plane to be a 150% über fighter
because they can't fly on even terms.
Please inform "Steve V" forums are for venting good AND bad topics or is the stigma of totalitarian state still hanging over Ubi!
IL2FB PF is a really good flight sim but needs negative input not just butt kissers blowing sunshine up the botty otherwise it will never be the best

Capt._Tenneal
01-18-2005, 01:47 PM
With respect to Oleg, crazyivan, it's not the new aircraft that are doing it for me. My main thing is, since an addon is coming anyway, this could have been included with the addon. I waited patiently until now, what's another few weeks. It's not like Oleg and Co. still did not do any hard work -- they did. And I'm still thankful and still in Oleg's corner, don't get me wrong.

Maybe it's because I've only been with the IL-2 series since 2003, so I was not there in the days of "small patches to fix small changes". If that's the case, then pardon me.

steve_v
01-18-2005, 01:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CD_Frank:
Please inform "Steve V" forums are for venting good AND bad topics or is the stigma of totalitarian state still hanging over Ubi!
IL2FB PF is a really good flight sim but needs negative input not just butt kissers blowing sunshine up the botty otherwise it will never be the best <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif Don't know how to use a PT? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

And remember, this site has nothing to do with freedom of speech. It's a privately owned game forum. You want freedom of speech - write for a newspaper. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

TheGozr
01-18-2005, 01:53 PM
If a small patch to fix problems can be downloaded this way and things like facelift or Bugs can be fixed i'm up for it, 18 mb patch is not bad at all and quick easy install.

If all those patchs have their twins for the servers parts is cool to me.

A litle patch here and there to fix things it's great go head and release as many Oleg can.

SO PAPA OLEG go head and make as many patches you can.

3.41, 3.42, 3.43 etcc it great...

SeaFireLIV
01-18-2005, 01:56 PM
IL2/Fb is a great sim, always has been. Maybe I came in late after small Patches (though I think I remember one very small one to fix the 109 rudder).

With the expectations that i foolishly let myself get excited about, a come-down had to happen and I suppose receiving a Patch that seems to do so little was an anti-climax. It wasn`t so much the size, but what it does.

It didn`t even fix the `returning heading indicater` that reaapears every mission. It`s really a take-off carrier in PF/ ATI-Graphics fix.

Anyway, we probably got spoilt... to be honest.

No, Crazy Ivan, we are entitled to express a little Human dissapointment today.

crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 01:59 PM
The problem is.. you can`t enjoy sim as is, you want more. This approach was forming up for the past 3 yearsNobody here has any ideas on the level of changes that are coming in addon. This patch was a neccessary measure to combat existing problems with 303 and i am THANKFULL that it`s out. Now i can run carrier based COOPs without half people crashing into the water... now i don`t see graphical anomalies... i am happy that it was addressed. It was critical, much more critical then couple of planes. But that just me.

WOLFMondo
01-18-2005, 02:01 PM
Ivan, i think from olegs post people were expecting something with more content, you can't blame people for thinking that given some feel there owed a cd's worth of content. olegs posts did could easily lead people to this conclusion. gotta say though, most games the age of fb would no longer be getting any patches or updates, especially with content so dues have to goto 1c for continued support.

can you get us a complete list of changes for this patch please? maybe then people can appreciate the work it took oleg and team.

crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 02:07 PM
It`s basically carrier based planes FM adjustments and graphics optimisations. There is no list mate. Think every carrier based plane had some adjustments to compromise static/moving carrier take offs. And graphics, mostly texture corruption related, flickering...etc, etc, which was released before - those two small DLL`s.

SKULLS_Exec01
01-18-2005, 02:07 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>can you get us a complete list of changes for this patch please? maybe then people can appreciate the work it took oleg and team. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good idea...bumpsy

TheGozr
01-18-2005, 02:10 PM
crazyivan1970
For combat the carrier bug with the respawn of 2 k full loaded after carrier sunk that is more important in a fight than the F2 or load on take off. I M O

DId they fix the load on take of of the F4?

Don' t we all messup some time?
Did they fix the bug "in perfect mode" in Reccording?

TheGozr
01-18-2005, 02:11 PM
More patches is cool bring them on http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

TheGozr
01-18-2005, 02:14 PM
We need a Patch for the beta testers.
We need to have new testers that is very importants, UBI made a lots of troubles for Oleg and beta tester don't really test the tests.

????? infos?????

harryklein66
01-18-2005, 02:15 PM
I take that bet too!
look it's me one the left! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif
http://www.gnt.net/~jrube/images/bombers.jpg
GGNNNNIIIIIAAAAAAWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!

Stiglr
01-18-2005, 02:18 PM
For me, I can't think of a single reason to ever be disappointed with a patch you can get with a free download; with the one possible exception of a patch that actually breaks stuff that worked before. At the very least, we're getting more support than most sims ever dream of.

As for people wanting more and more planes (even box-promised ones), I too am of the school of thought that says, if people ever got all those planes, they'd likely fly them twice or three times, then go back to their usual list of 2 or 3 ueberplanes. The torpedo plane brouhaha comes to mind. 90% of the folks who fly this sim don't wanna be gliding along level and fat at 150 knots into a curtain of flak. They'll get blasted a few times then go back to more glamourous work.

The real problems that truly need patching are just the things that would make the entire sim more believable: universal flight model changes and changes to certain weapons and planes to, in all candor, take the politics and propoganda out of them (German 20mm springs to mind here). I simply cannot grasp the concept of having to "just make changes to carrier borne planes so they can take off of decks"; if they don't take off decks as they're modelled, then there's a basic physics problem, or a need to just "hold our nose and accept a 35-knot-wind-over-the-deck kludge" of some kind.

Once again, the idea of prioritizing things: all the cosmetic eye candy in the world won't save a poorly simulated physical world.

crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 02:18 PM
Trying to make your way into beta testing team Gozr http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif There isnt`t one http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Tallyho1961
01-18-2005, 02:19 PM
I was happy with IL2 yesterday.
I'm happy with it today.
I will no doubt be happy with it tomorrow.

Now go take on the day.

S!

Chuck_Older
01-18-2005, 02:22 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by steve_v:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CD_Frank:
Please inform "Steve V" forums are for venting good AND bad topics or is the stigma of totalitarian state still hanging over Ubi!
IL2FB PF is a really good flight sim but needs negative input not just butt kissers blowing sunshine up the botty otherwise it will never be the best <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif Don't know how to use a PT? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

And remember, this site has nothing to do with freedom of speech. It's a privately owned game forum. You want freedom of speech - write for a newspaper. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh Steve, please let me whine and moan to my heart's content, oh pretty please?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v441/Chuck_Older/prayerkitty.jpg

goshikisen
01-18-2005, 02:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
And instead OF APPRECIATION all is see is disappointment€¦ What gives? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Anything 1C can do for us is appreciated... I supposed my problem is the spotty information on what's coming and what isn't. I don't know if it's because we've been spoiled by the developer or not... but on occasions it seems like 1C disappears behind the dark side of the moon when it comes to contact with the community. On the other hand there are times when they've been more than brilliant when it comes to community support. I suppose consistency would be the thing I'd be most interested in.

I've seen many dev. updates on this "official" website showing screenshots of really interesting aircraft (Tempest, Ohka, Jill, Irving) but then we hear nothing about them for ages and wonder if we were imagining the update. I'd like to see the aircraft (and ships for that matter) added to the sim but it'd be nice to have concrete information every once in a while instead of rumours and disinformation. If they can't be added... that's fine but showing screenshots of aircraft that won't show up in the sim is tantamount to teasing.

It seems a precedent has been set in terms of support by 1C over the years... and the community, spoiled or not, gets a little antsy when everything goes quiet.

Oleg... thanks for everything you've done with this amazing sim. I hope you can drop by and let us know how things are going when you get the chance.

Regards, Goshikisen.

VMF223_Anderson
01-18-2005, 02:26 PM
&lt;S!&gt;

Good point Ivan, These forums are usually a bigger bummer than informative anymore. No wonder Oleg doesn't frequent them as much, don't blame him. I got my two-bits worth
out of the Sim http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

GerritJ9
01-18-2005, 02:33 PM
I'm grateful for ANY patch, big or small..... ESPECIALLY one that corrects the F2A-2's speed http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

ИолÑŒÑˆоµ Ñ¿?с¸бо, žлµ³ ¸ соÑ"ру´н¸º¸'!!!!!!!!!!

VMF-214_HaVoK
01-18-2005, 02:35 PM
What cracks me up is that so many whine and whine for new fighters and bombers and when they finally get them they tinker with them for about a day and its back into the Yaks, LAs, 109s, and 51s.
Even more so for the bombers. So many whine for them but rarely fly them. The BF-110 and P-38 were whined for forever and how many people you see flying them on a regular basis online?

I cant lie I love getting patches and become anxious upon there release. But Im also grateful that I get them. You show me ONE other dev team that offers up as much free stuff and support and you can call me sissy lala from here on out with no complaint from me. Usually Oleg does his best to give the customers what they want...take the FB/PF compatibility thing. When people heard it was stand alone only they went nuts, but it was the calm respectful rational ones that went into ORR and with use of email offered suggestions that would make everyone happy and keep the community together.

Many devs and pubs would have washed thier hands of this sim by now and moved on.

FI_Macca44
01-18-2005, 02:37 PM
Ivan is right.That is all.

joeap
01-18-2005, 02:48 PM
Well I'm happy with this. Anyway, I actually can wait for a couple more patches, and also for BoB to be really polished next year. Because I won't be able to get a nice new system before then. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

jensenpark
01-18-2005, 02:58 PM
CI: don't let the friggin' whiners get to you.

It fixed the carrier take off issue and that is great...we can all wait a bit for the add ons.

I laugh at all the "I bought this game because I saw a flyable Betty" comments. Yea right - there was a huge pent up demand in the sim community for the Betty and that is what spurred thier purchase.

Now, had we been promised a flyable Veronica, I could see their point.

Capt_Kernel
01-18-2005, 03:10 PM
Someone better get Ivan a large crying towel, I thiknk he's goona start balling his eyes out. Oh, yea, maybe a diaper too.<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
You know, after reading PF, GD and ORR forums€¦I am really disappointed in you guys, not all of you...but still. Where did that time go when we were happy with a little tiny bitty patches, that were addressing much smaller things. This patch required a lot of work, much more work then you think. And instead OF APPRICIATION all is see is disappointment€¦ What gives? Because you didn`t get couple of planes that were promised? Is that it? So€¦ issues with carrier take offs€¦ graphical problems are not important? Couple more planes is what need to make your day? This is really sad. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Gibbage1
01-18-2005, 03:15 PM
Ivan. I thought the Betty was to big to fit on the CD's? If that was the case, why was it not released.

Look. There have been a LOT of promises made by Oleg, you, and so many others. Promises that keep getting missed. Do I even need to remind you of the "Two weeks, be sure!" joke?

There is a huge list of promised aircraft. Im all for waiting, but PLEASE! Just shut UP!!! Stop saying "soon". Stop saying "Two weeks". Just SHUT UP! If your going to say anything, just say "when its done" OK? Stop promising things. Your always getting our hopes up, and now your crying because its pissed off a lot of users? This is your own grave you dug. Deal with it.

Gib

icrash
01-18-2005, 03:17 PM
Only thing I'm disappointed with is my big comp is out of action & I can't install the patches in the first place http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif. I'll either get it running or start an electrical bonfire!!!

crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 03:31 PM
Ahem... first of all i don`t need a towel... but some of you do.

Now back to Gibbage...actually no comment.. not worth it.

TheGozr
01-18-2005, 03:35 PM
Gibbage1
I advise you to not talk i'm still waiting about your Countries prejudice conversation . I'm still waiting in Comms. Not here.

BTW Yvan is right about No worth it on your comments

Philipscdrw
01-18-2005, 03:39 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Ahem... first of all i don`t need a towel... but some of you do.

Now back to Gibbage...actually no comment.. not worth it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ivan, why can't we be kept informed as to what is going on? Kicking our heels waiting for the next file is maddening - if Oleg was ill, why did no-one tell the community? Do they think that none of us care? I don't mind waiting, but being kept in the dark is not good...

Well, while waiting for the patches, I will be flying 727s around Finland. See you in a couple of weeks!

Gibbage1
01-18-2005, 03:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Ahem... first of all i don`t need a towel... but some of you do.

Now back to Gibbage...actually no comment.. not worth it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ivan. Try it out. Next time someone ask's you "when?" just reply "when its done!"

That way you KNOW your telling the truth. Its simple, it works, and its an industry standard now. Well not here at least.

Blackdog5555
01-18-2005, 03:45 PM
LOL..Well it look like Oleg told some children that Christmas has been cancelled. But really, I think 95% of the PF fans have no problem waiting for the "addon". Well, Somebody is hoping that, as they say the ole days, "Utinam barbari spatium proprium tuum invadant"! : May barbarians invade your personal space! Cheers

blairgowrie
01-18-2005, 03:47 PM
I accept your comments as completely valid CI.

But sometimes I think what is needed is some better "sales" communication. That readme was almost a downer. Jazz it up man. Tell us ignorant sods why it is good for us like you are doing in this thread. I used to work for a bank and the readme reminds me of some of the bank circulars that were issued by HEAD OFFICE.They could make good news sound like the Titanic announcement.

Potatodip
01-18-2005, 03:48 PM
Hmmm ok......some might jump in a new plane and then leave it just as fast as they got it. But some like me have flown the HE-111 (Japanese)since PF came out. It is proberbly 100 times better than the G4M, takes alot more damedge etc, but it just doent feel right. I can live with it some time more, it is just not funny to know that a Japanese bomber is done and is collecting dust while some more fancy planes are being tuned.

I doent care about KI-100`s or the N1K2 i just want a higly flameble Japanese bomber to die in. No one have to make it, its done......and im waiting. But The 3.04 have helped me out with some graph probs, and that will make the arival of the "lighter" so mucth better.....so i keep fly my "lend and lease" HE-111 and i know that in two weeks http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif it will be here lol....

Small bugs killed will make addon even better
OM take your time...im patient....patient.....patient.....(but also i tiny bit unpatient)

Gibbage1
01-18-2005, 03:49 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TheGozr:
Gibbage1
I advise you to not talk i'm still waiting about your Countries prejudice conversation . I'm still waiting in Comms. _ Not here._

BTW Yvan is right about No worth it on your comments <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have no idea what your talking about. Wanna clue me in? In PM?

crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 03:50 PM
Philips, i get info out as i get it. And i constantly ask for it. We exchange e-mails with Oleg and some other dev team members every night. But i am not allowed to say anything without permission. I am always in contact with Oleg, but you have to understand, he`s a very busy man. At this point all i can say is... addon will be huge. Lots of changes. And there are more things in it that were not promised then promised ones. As i said, when Oleg is back in the office, will try to update you all with fresh info.

BenvZijl
01-18-2005, 03:50 PM
i'm not dissapointed, every patch is another present for this community cause it improves the game.


(in most cases *cough* tribes 2*cough*)

People should stop whining and appreciate that we have some developers who continue to work on a great game instead of giving out a few patches and then stop every work on a game

crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 03:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gibbage1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Ahem... first of all i don`t need a towel... but some of you do.

Now back to Gibbage...actually no comment.. not worth it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ivan. Try it out. Next time someone ask's you "when?" just reply "when its done!"

That way you KNOW your telling the truth. Its simple, it works, and its an industry standard now. Well not here at least. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Gibbage, try this out: Find one post where i said with 100% confidence: two weeks...or 3 weeks... or whatever. Link please? Which part of pissible, hopefully or maybe is not getting thru?

crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 03:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by blairgowrie:
I accept your comments as completely valid CI.

But sometimes I think what is needed is some better "sales" communication. That readme was almost a downer. Jazz it up man. Tell us ignorant sods why it is good for us like you are doing in this thread. I used to work for a bank and the readme reminds me of some of the bank circulars that were issued by HEAD OFFICE.They could make good news sound like the Titanic announcement. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

blairgowrie, you are correct sir! But what Oleg has to do with communication? Dev teams make products, they don`t interract with the customers. Whoever sells products DO. The fact that Maddox communicates with us is rather unique then common, don`t you agree?

Gibbage1
01-18-2005, 03:57 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Gibbage, try this out: Find one post where i said with 100% confidence: two weeks...or 3 weeks... or whatever. Link please? Which part of pissible, hopefully or maybe is not getting thru? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I remember clearly a post by you that you said a patch for FB/Aces would be out "this week" and Oleg came in and said it was not true. Also, you have said in HL many times "Soon, very soon" and similar things. Also, its not just you, but many people also close to the dev team like Ian Boys at SimHQ and a few others.

Just stop baiting us with promises. Its not just me. Read some of the threads in here (Like the ones you locked) and you can tell that everyone was expecting more. All 3.04 does is fix what 3.03 broke.

Potatodip
01-18-2005, 03:59 PM
One thing that would be cool is ( i have high respect for them both)is that Ivan and Gib would solve this over a dogfight http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif and not here http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

My favorite modeller and my Favorite moderator in a war on words.......to make this day perfect all that are missing is my puter to break down......

Lets keep it friendly here...and do the word smashing in PM......with all due respect sirs

"I am really disapointed" so am i...but i get over it...tommorow is a brand new day...and im playing 3.04

GregSM
01-18-2005, 03:59 PM
I'm delighted again at the generosity and resolve of Oleg and all involved in continuing to refine the game and further its content.

Regarding those unable to appreciate it, I'd be delighted if they would dedicate themselves to making better apologies for pure greed.


Cheers,


Greg

CD_Frank
01-18-2005, 04:00 PM
Thanks for the eloquently charming reply Steve_V.
It would seem I don't know how to use a "PT" whatever that is but if you put a forum up for people who use IL2,Aces and PF then expect (for the most part) honest opinions hanging on the line for all to see!
By the way it's "if you want freedom of speech write TO a newspaper". It would seem civility and grammar are both somewhat lacking in that small world you inhabit.
Please remember people who pay for games, etc are customers and without them it's dole queue.
CD_Frank

ucanfly
01-18-2005, 04:01 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Philips, i get info out as i get it. And i constantly ask for it. We exchange e-mails with Oleg and some other dev team members every night. But i am not allowed to say anything without permission. I am always in contact with Oleg, but you have to understand, he`s a very busy man. At this point all i can say is... addon will be huge. Lots of changes. And there are more things in it that were not promised then promised ones. As i said, when Oleg is back in the office, will try to update you all with fresh info. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks for the pseudo update. A shame we can't get all the info you have, but I understand I guess. Looks like I will have some time to make room in my HDD.

crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 04:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gibbage1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Gibbage, try this out: Find one post where i said with 100% confidence: two weeks...or 3 weeks... or whatever. Link please? Which part of pissible, hopefully or maybe is not getting thru? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I remember clearly a post by you that you said a patch for FB/Aces would be out "this week" and Oleg came in and said it was not true. Also, you have said in HL many times "Soon, very soon" and similar things. Also, its not just you, but many people also close to the dev team like Ian Boys at SimHQ and a few others.

Just stop baiting us with promises. Its not just me. Read some of the threads in here (Like the ones you locked) and you can tell that everyone was expecting more. All 3.04 does is fix what 3.03 broke. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Where is the link? I am waiting http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Oh wait.. you will never find it, because i am not stupid to say something like this without talking to Oleg. Words cheap without prove... move along now Gibb, good day.

harryklein66
01-18-2005, 04:05 PM
for you whiners! :
http://orangecow.org/pythonet/audio/zipped/BrightSideofLife.zip

e5kimo
01-18-2005, 04:07 PM
i have just totally lost track of what was/is promised.

dont know, dont care. not gonna listen to any promises any more. i enjoy il2 for what it is. i just wish they stop changing things back and forth. make a decision (re take off speeds) and stick to it!

VMF-214_HaVoK
01-18-2005, 04:07 PM
Hey Gib! Where is that PBY you promised? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

VVS-Manuc
01-18-2005, 04:27 PM
so with patch 3.04 the carrier take off is corrected which Oleg stated to be correct in 3.03 already? Strange world...

blairgowrie
01-18-2005, 04:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by blairgowrie:
I accept your comments as completely valid CI.

But sometimes I think what is needed is some better "sales" communication. That readme was almost a downer. Jazz it up man. Tell us ignorant sods why it is good for us like you are doing in this thread. I used to work for a bank and the readme reminds me of some of the bank circulars that were issued by HEAD OFFICE.They could make good news sound like the Titanic announcement. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

blairgowrie, you are correct sir! But what Oleg has to do with communication? Dev teams make products, they don`t interract with the customers. Whoever sells products DO. The fact that Maddox communicates with us is rather unique then common, don`t you agree? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think Oleg is brilliant and he will always have my undying loyalty and gratitude. If he wants to communicate with us that's fine. But wouldn't you agree that communication or understanding what is happening may be one of the reasons there is so much whining. I'll take the patch and enjoy. I am tired of crashing with my full Corsair bomb load.

SeaFireLIV
01-18-2005, 04:39 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by blairgowrie:
But wouldn't you agree that communication or understanding what is happening may be one of the reasons there is so much whining. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think this is true.

Anyway, I reckon we`re all being too hard on Crazy Ivan, he does the best for us . It`s a small Patch, it`s done - no big deal. I`ll just be more cautious in future (which I usually am)... That way i get no surprises. IL2/FB/PF is still the best Sim around, nothings been taken from it.

Clan_Graham
01-18-2005, 04:42 PM
Well said.
Just what I was thinking.

vroelofs
01-18-2005, 04:48 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>... addon will be huge. Lots of changes. And there are more things in it that were not promised then promised ones. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Whoohoo.......read this,no read it,have you read it?

Gibbage1
01-18-2005, 04:48 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
Hey Gib! Where is that PBY you promised? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thats out of my hands. Im waiting for Oleg to announce that as he promised.

crazyivan1970
01-18-2005, 04:50 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gibbage1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
Hey Gib! Where is that PBY you promised? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thats out of my hands. Im waiting for Oleg to announce that as he promised. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

What`s there to anounce, it`s not even complete yet. And you have a nerve to talk about promises. Where is the world coming to...

Spider_439th
01-18-2005, 04:56 PM
I may be wrong but we have to think that creating this simulation is expensive and i don't think programmers and modeler work for free(i don't) so they have to create selling addon for development. Did you see Bill Gates answer directly to his customer on a forum of CFS3 or FS, worst, they don't admit the idea to do a patch on their product even six month after the release. Continue good work and give us somes news more often http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

x__CRASH__x
01-18-2005, 05:01 PM
For me it's not about what was promised. Hell, if Oleg told me that they couldn't release the planes I would quickly get over it. For me it's about the lack of information. True, Oleg pops in and gives little nuggets. More than most other games I'm guessing, but still, more info would prevent the shock of getting a small "fix" patch when we were intially told the patch would be an addition patch.

Thats all. I don't like the game any less or will fly it any less.

SeaFireLIV
01-18-2005, 05:12 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gibbage1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
Hey Gib! Where is that PBY you promised? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thats out of my hands. Im waiting for Oleg to announce that as he promised. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Gibbage, using this Patch dissappointment of sim players to put the boot in on Crazy Ivan and Oleg is beginning to get really annoying. CAN IT.

Besides, I thought you said you were never coming back to this `filth bucket` again- ever!

That obviously didn`t last long.

Gibbage1
01-18-2005, 05:15 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:


Besides, I thought you said you were never coming back to this `filth bucket` again- ever!

That obviously didn`t last long. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I said "till it was cleaned up" and I think some of the new mods did a great job at cleaning it up. So I came back.

Philipscdrw
01-18-2005, 05:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Philips, i get info out as i get it. And i constantly ask for it. We exchange e-mails with Oleg and some other dev team members every night. But i am not allowed to say anything without permission. I am always in contact with Oleg, but you have to understand, he`s a very busy man. At this point all i can say is... addon will be huge. Lots of changes. And there are more things in it that were not promised then promised ones. As i said, when Oleg is back in the office, will try to update you all with fresh info. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Excellent, I'll wait in peace then.

LOL, reading this thread makes me realise that no matter what you choose to do, people will ask you why you didn't choose the other... What did that guy say 'Make the readme more readable'? But if the readme came via the marketing & localisation departments, we wouldn't have this pseudo-contact with the developers... there's no way to win! Which means that whatever you do, there wasn't a better way... which takes off the load a bit!

Philipscdrw
01-18-2005, 05:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gibbage1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:


Besides, I thought you said you were never coming back to this `filth bucket` again- ever!

That obviously didn`t last long. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I said "till it was cleaned up" and I think some of the new mods did a great job at cleaning it up. So I came back. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

While we're waiting for the patch, Gibbage, could you stir us up some models of the Akron and Macon, and try to find a way to make the arrestor harnesses work? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

blairgowrie
01-18-2005, 05:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SeaFireLIV:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by blairgowrie:
But wouldn't you agree that communication or understanding what is happening may be one of the reasons there is so much whining. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think this is true.

Anyway, I reckon we`re all being too hard on Crazy Ivan, he does the best for us . It`s a small Patch, it`s done - no big deal. I`ll just be more cautious in future (which I usually am)... That way i get no surprises. IL2/FB/PF is still the best Sim around, nothings been taken from it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I would never be hard on CI. If I didn't agree with him, I would just hold my tongue. He has done so much for me personally over the last couple of years, I could never repay him. He got me overclocking, flying on line, advice on modems, comms headsets and all kinds of other things I have forgotten about. I just hate to see him disappointed with some of us. We ain't worth it.

As my old Latin teacher used to say "Non illegitimus carborundum". Don't let the bas***** grind you down. Imagine my horror, years later, when I found out this really wasn't Latin.

Zarathael
01-18-2005, 05:53 PM
Ivan,

The reason some on the game are dissappointed with the lack of new planes is that well, we've been informed and hinted at since the game came out that they were just around the bend. We're not disappointed at the fact that the patches are fixing things, that's great. 3.03 really improved things on my system, I haven't DL'd 3.04 yet, but I'm sure it will drastically improve things as well, and I will be very grateful for it. I also have seen so many minor whines and gripes being made into mountainous crises on here, that I can understand you guys being ready to pull your hair out and throw in the towel. I for one am very grateful to have this sim at all. Thank you.

Understand also that with the amount of speculation and half truths floating around here, that it's really easy for someone to draw ANY kind of conclusion. The most bothersome at the moment is that you guys are getting ready to dump PF altogether and focus on BOB only. Certainly hope there's no credence to that one.

Oh well that's enough of that. Just in case you get too distraught at all the negativity here, remember, the squeaky wheel isn't always important.

Pail-Male
01-18-2005, 05:54 PM
Look I don't want to start a bunch of ****, but I begin to grow angry and there is a primitive and brutal beast which begins to awaken! I am just that sort of s.o.b. that would carry a grudge forever and would actively seek out every chance to bad mouth, ridicule, damage and drive off customers, from any company which I perceive to have wronged me or angered me.

This is the thing. I only have PF and I very, very anxiously and excitedly awaited PF's release. Since I have had it I have had extremely little enjoyment in it. As a matter of fact it is at times a very big freaking hassle! So let me list my complaints.

1-While perhaps not having specifically clamed to be able to fly a torp plane. It was absolutely implied. There is a freaking torp plane right on the cover of the MF-ing box and I know that some of the advertising that I saw also implied. That is the number one main reason I made the purchase!!!!!!!!! Who could possibly imagine a WWII pacific theater flight sim with no torp planes?

2- This is a direct quote from the read me that came with the game, "Attention:
We simply ran out of space on our 2 CDs and had to remove some cockpits for
several flyable aircraft. Free add-on containing these aircraft will be made
available at www.pacific-fighters.com (http://www.pacific-fighters.com) for a free download". That says several not one (betty), it also implies that they are done and complete and that it was just a simple matter of space on the cd's.

3- I have seen nothing but excuse after excuse after excuse after excuse! Most of which I absolutely DO NOT BELIEVE! We are expected to believe that a company worked on, developed (most games take about 2 years from concept to market) and invested in a product and along the way no one had one single thought, like golly gee wiz Bevier you think we might need to check into licensing and trademark stuff? No Wally that's just stupid. Not more than two weeks ago PBS ran a documentary on the founder of the Boeing corp. and it said that as soon as we went to war all, ALL of America's plane makers immediately openly shared all plane designs, technologies and even materials and made it all PUBLIC DOMAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!! In an effort to speed production and help win the war.

4-This game has the most extremely and severely lack of info and documentation of any game I have ever owned! No guides on how to dive bomb, none on how to level bomb, attack ships or ground targets, nothing about plane characteristics (like you can not make such&such maneuver with this plane) and any thing you could possibly want to know, you must seek out and rely on any info you can glean from third party help! While not having bought a flight sim in some time and not having played a large number of them, the ones which I have had, all came with detailed manuals and instructions. Be they electronic or other.

5-An absolute bewilderment while playing the game. Hey I spotted the enemy ship or plane or downed pilot or a big flying space bugger! No way to relay info, no way to know hey do they know I've spotted, what do I do, will I get credit in mission for finding whatever? In post mission brief it says nothing like pilot rescued or enemy spotted by such&such pilot. You know stuff like when on recon and having spotted enemy ship, is it better to get the heck out of there fast in the hopes that they haven't spotted me and maybe get back with strike force and surprise them, maybe catch them with planes on deck? Does the game even track such things? Why do our own pilots crash into each other, is it part of the game or maybe my cpu or ram producing errors? Is there any chance that if I stay out of time skip, that I might spot something that time skip would have passed over? Why have I been condimed to have to spend so much time looking over forums and third party web pages, just to get some info or learn how to do something in the game or to try and find a resolution to my many questions, INSTEAD OF PLAYING THE GAME??????????

6- I plan to purchase TrackIr and voice buddy to greatly improve my situational awareness and skill before going on line. Is this perhaps an ill conceived investment because the game will never have what would satisfy me? What about any poor s.o.b. that bought this game and doesn't have an internet conection?

7-Lucky 7 the bottom line. Even with all this I still have an interest in this game and can see great potential for much enjoyment! The bottom line. I will wait just a little longer. Be forewarned whatever the surprises what's his name said were coming our way, had better be some MF-ing good ****!!! Lest the beast awaken and I set loose the dogs of war upon 1C!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

P.S. Please forgive me when I rant I'm bipolar. Take any of my comments with a grain of salt as they say. I do not mean anything personaly and am most happy for any and all effort for game. It's just that I went a few rounds with Toys R Us after xmas over false advertising and very much disapionting to me and my sweet darling little girl and some punk trying to spew **** from his mouth and especting me to believe it (done with them forever). If the addon meets or even partly meets exspectations. I will be a stonch supporter of 1c and ever commetted follower.


"Never give in - never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large or petty, never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy".

Jersey_Seven
01-18-2005, 07:01 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> The problem is.. you can`t enjoy sim as is, you want more. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Forgive me. I am new to this forum and all. But I have to add an observation.

If I knew that no more was coming, I would be content and would enjoy what was there. However, what I hear from my comrades is that our expectations have been raised for even more. Can you really be that surprised that there is impatience and disappointment?

Personally, I hate getting too involved in any game when I know that a significant patch is in the works. I'd rather wait until its complete. So I don't play this game that I've had for months waiting for the big addon that's been promised since the readme. Whether it meets expectations or not, at least when it appears I will know that no more is coming and I will be content with what I have.

Is this really so crazy, Ivan?

Best wishes to you.

RocketRobin__
01-18-2005, 07:17 PM
I got to thinking, maybe Ivan is right.
After all, I've become so lackadaisical about new patches that I can't even bother to complain about the negative aspects, let alone praise the positives.
So I said to myself, "Self, you must change your bad attitude." Whereupon I took a couple of Prozaks and dropped half a dozen hits of Windowpane and commenced agaming.

For the first hour or so, the new patch seemd much like others, but it was definitely a LOT more fun. Then I began to notice how the ultra neon colours of the land flora complimented the effervessence of the ocean, in contrast to the rainbows in the sky. I especially liked the strobe-like doppler effects of shells fired at me, several minutes before my plane was actually struck. Fortunately, most of the ordinance didn't stick on my plane and just went through the wings and fuel tanks and stuff. It's a good thing too, or my plane might have gotten too heavy to fly.
Later on my joystick got too flaccid and I couldn't fly down anymore, so put out the sparkler on the end of it, bailed out and spectated for a while. I was admiring the psychedelic paint schemes on many of the aircraft and was especially impressed with the similarity between USN cammo and Van Gogh landscapes, juxtaposed by the endless roses painted on the Japanese planes.

All things considered, 3.03m is one of the best patches I've been on. Keep up the good work!

Clan_Graham
01-18-2005, 07:22 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RocketRobin__:
I got to thinking, maybe Ivan is right.
After all, I've become so lackadaisical about new patches that I can't even bother to complain about the negative aspects, let alone praise the positives.
So I said to myself, "Self, you must change your bad attitude." Whereupon I took a couple of Prozaks and dropped half a dozen hits of Windowpane and commenced agaming.

For the first hour or so, the new patch seemd much like others, but it was definitely a LOT more fun. Then I began to notice how the ultra neon colours of the land flora complimented the effervessence of the ocean, in contrast to the rainbows in the sky. I especially liked the strobe-like doppler effects of shells fired at me, several minutes before my plane was actually struck. Fortunately, most of the ordinance didn't stick on my plane and just went through the wings and fuel tanks and stuff. It's a good thing too, or my plane might have gotten too heavy to fly.
Later on my joystick got too flaccid and I couldn't fly down anymore, so put out the sparkler on the end of it, bailed out and spectated for a while. I was admiring the psychedelic paint schemes on many of the aircraft and was especially impressed with the similarity between USN cammo and Van Gogh landscapes, juxtaposed by the endless roses painted on the Japanese planes.

All things considered, 3.03m is one of the best patches I've been on. Keep up the good work! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thank G0d, you saw that too?
I thought my vid driver had gone for a ****!
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

BlitzPig_DDT
01-18-2005, 07:26 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
You know, after reading PF, GD and ORR forums€¦I am really disappointed in you guys, not all of you...but still. Where did that time go when we were happy with a little tiny bitty patches, that were addressing much smaller things. This patch required a lot of work, much more work then you think. And instead OF APPRICIATION all is see is disappointment€¦ What gives? Because you didn`t get couple of planes that were promised? Is that it? So€¦ issues with carrier take offs€¦ graphical problems are not important? Couple more planes is what need to make your day? This is really sad. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You're on the money there, but I will add that the sound of this take off thing is ominous. It sounds like people whined it back to UFO-dom. To be honest I haven't tried it, but that's the sound of it so far, and like I said, it's ominous.

TheGozr
01-18-2005, 07:31 PM
I had a feeling while flying under 3.04m that it was better than usual.

The feeling was that Oleg didn't say entirely what he did change in teh read me file. 18 mb it's not only for the fix of the F2A or tuning or the lift on carriere there are some others.

have new noticed all the new environement sounds?

Many litles things are not quite the same.
It Felt very good..

ElAurens
01-18-2005, 07:37 PM
DDT, I have only tried the F6F and F4U 1D from the static Saratoga. T.O. with absolute max loadouts is still not possible, (thankfully), but they both will get off the deck with the 5 inch HVARS and 25% fuel. I tried the F6f with the HVARS, a 1000 pund bomb and 25% fuel and I was in the drink.

Things are not totally UFO'd.

And I agree with Ivan...

So many grown men acting like sissy Mary little girls, shameful.

ThreeCrow
01-18-2005, 07:44 PM
I am not truly worried about the timing or content of patches. They will come when they come and, in the mean time, I practice flying.... I am getting to know the SBD rather well and the topography of Hawaii is becoming very familiar. I have found that arrests in bad weather on a rolling ship are quite satisfying. Still need practice on dive bombing. So much to do before the career starts.

I am much more concerned about the status of "Il2Skins".... I really do miss that site.

J_Weaver
01-18-2005, 07:48 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ThreeCrow:
I am much more concerned about the status of "Il2Skins".... I really do miss that site. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yea...Me too. Does anyone have any news on it?

LEXX_Luthor
01-18-2005, 08:05 PM
Thanks crazie (or Bear) for cleansing Oleg's Recovery Room.

What's with Oleg being sick?

Jazz01
01-18-2005, 08:30 PM
Well, I really appreciate all the effort and hard work 1C et al. are putting in this great sim http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif. It is even above my expectations they release patches and from time to time add-ons, for free http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif. Hell if they'd asked me to pay 10 bucks I'd also do http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

But a word on the 'disappointment' by some people.
Several promises were made lately, for a patch/add-on started with the original PF release. After 4 months of this release, that particular promise still isn't fullfilled, but some 'additional' patches have been released since. The point on the disappointment is that people EXPECTED to see that patch/add-on, as it was PROMISED some earlier day. So they didn't get what they really wanted.
As for this current patch 3.04 things are the same again... A promise was made at the release of 3.03 that the next one, 3.04 was to contain 'the big stuff'. Even the development updates page was updated with WIP pictures. So again, some expectations were given to the people by the developpers. Now we have 3.04, of which I myself too was, at first sight, a little disappointed to see it wasn't this '3rd CD' data, to be really honost and let a few words out http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif. But reading the forum I accepted and understand the decission to fix some 'major buggs' first.
As I'm flying FB/AEP/PF for half a year now, I don't know the early days of IL-2 and it's patch releases. But to me I don't wonder things were not promised like it is done now, but that's just a wild guess so don't blame me if I'm wrong. So in those days People had NO expectations on what to get from developpers. That's the reason people weren't complaining those days, because... what should they complain about?!?

So, what I'm trying to say is... Be careful on making promises on content of future released patches/add-ons or a time of releases, unless you're 100% sure. People rely on it and expect it this promise is kept! That's the whole point here, PROMISES and EXPECTATIONS. If something doesn't fullfill the expectation of it, people complain, just a natural reaction. Unfortunately some people cannot maintain a right attitude and 'complain' in an adult way.

If a small(er) patch is released prior an anounced big one, like now for instance, it may have been better to give some background on that release on the website itself, rather then hided in the forum.

Thanks for all the good work so far and I hope this work will continue 1C http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

~S~

WTE_DuStA
01-18-2005, 09:46 PM
my only gripe and one that has really got our members angry was how long it took to get the dedicated server. Very nearly killed the game for alot of us

Krt_Bong
01-19-2005, 12:36 AM
You know a lot of you have very insightful and perceptive comments to make in this forum and some have been hysterically funny, while others seriously need to consult a dictionary. I love this Sim and I have had quite a few (games), some with not even one patch from developers after release. But really the main hassle here is that everytime one thing gets fixed someone will find something else to complain about. I would like to see it finished so I can stop having to patch and wait for the servers to catch-up, (my fault really) and I do fly every A/C that is available if only to see what it might have been like to fly it, deathtrap or uber-(still hate that word)fighter. All of you here are obviously passionate about your flight simming but seriously take a big deep breath(and a valium) and get over it. It's a game. It's supposed to be fun, It is years of hard work by people who are into seeing sometimes 50 year-old Planes flying in all their glory where they may be enjoyed by those of us who might even know that some are not around still flying anymore. Yes they know that there were implied promise of things to come and I'm sure they would like to finish and go on to the next project! Why don't you try flying full real with historically accurate planes that actually fought each other and try to be happy with what you have so far, be pleasantly suprised when the content gets updated, and quit being such a pain to those of us who are happy that we got sooo many aircraft to choose from now. Fly among the Eagles instead of being Turkeys

woofiedog
01-19-2005, 12:49 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif To Ivan's Orginal statement... Bravo!
It takes alot of people and alot of time to give us these add-on's. I don't see to many other Games giving their patrons as Much Attention and Product as Oleg & Team and UBI.
Thank's Oleg and Team!

Philipscdrw
01-19-2005, 06:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Krt_Bong:
You know a lot of you have very insightful and perceptive comments...Fly among the Eagles instead of being Turkeys <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good post!

I'm just going to play PF when I feel like it, play FS when I feel like it, play MoH:PA when I feel like it, and check this site three times a day until 3.1 is released, when I will probably feel like playing PF more!

EnGaurde
01-19-2005, 07:31 AM
in line with Ivans original post, geez these forums are becoming worse than that Airport show, screened here in Oz, filled with whinging fat poms... the one with the stress frazzled airport staff trying to shut them up?

sheesh http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

you;d swear Oleg took some posters first born sons, such is the incessant complaining and force of lament? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

thanks god for the occasional nuggets of historical gold i can sluice out of the white noise. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

bravo.

nuff complaining eh? we KNOW its busted in some parts.

i reckon Oleg and his buddies do too? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Capt._Tenneal
01-19-2005, 07:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EnGaurde:


you;d swear Oleg took some posters first born sons, such is the incessant complaining and force of lament? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you're saying that just from this thread, then I guess you haven't seen the REAL heated threads that have been going on in the forums, the classics. This is kindergarten compared to those. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Some of those not exactly enamored of 3.04 make good points, I'd go easy on them. They go out of their way to say that they still support Oleg, for chrissakes, but they get jumped on anyways ! One gets the feeling that ANY remark about 3.04 other than the usual praise and thank yous is forbidden.

AWL_Spinner
01-19-2005, 08:15 AM
I'm with Ivan and co. The amount of trouble this game is still causing 1C when they're being beaten around the head to get on with Battle of Britain is really quite considerable. It's testament to this communities good relations with the developers that we're still getting patches and by the sounds of it, a frickin' huge (free) addon. Long may that continue.

The perverse thing about this situation is if they hadn't released this 3.04 there wouldn't have been any of this whining. People would have just carried on waiting for "the big one" much as they have been since before Christmas.

My heart sank when I saw the readme, not because of the content but because you could just tell what it would be like in here for a couple of days.

On the flipside, though I don't agree with Gibbage that there have been any broken promises per se, I do think there could be a much better job done of expectation management.

These patches just appear on the UBI server with no warning or context. A one-sentence post beforehand to say "Patch 3.1 contains the new content and is nearing completion, in the meantime to keep you updated and manage the size of the download we're going to release the graphical updates as 3.04 with a new dedicated server" would have saved 90% of the grief.

IMHO http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

When all's said and done and whilst waiting for "the big one", flying 3.04 PF online in Hyperlobby which is full almost EVERY NIGHT now is a blast, and helps pass the time http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

m.manson2004
01-19-2005, 09:48 AM
I'm dissapointed,


MIKEY MOUSE

goshikisen
01-19-2005, 10:10 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AWL_Spinner:
A one-sentence post beforehand to say "Patch 3.1 contains the new content and is nearing completion, in the meantime to keep you updated and manage the size of the download we're going to release the graphical updates as 3.04 with a new dedicated server" would have saved 90% of the grief.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's it in a nutshell... with all the hard work it takes to put these patches together you'd think it would be an easy thing to take 2 or 3 minutes to type "Here is a patch that deals with a few of the issues you've been having... the addon is nearing completion and will be available sometime in the near future." A brief official blurb would have completely sidestepped the brouhaha.

Regards, Goshikisen.

cajun16
01-19-2005, 10:25 AM
Man. most of you guys don't know when you have it good. Ever tried to get satisfaction or even a reply from the likes of EA Games, Gathering (TakeTwo Co.) Gotham, Novalogic, etc.? Forget it. I couldn't believe when a few months ago I emailed Oleg with a small problem and within a few days I got an answer from him on a solution to my problem. When I sent the email I thought, Boy this is like spitting in the wind. I can't believe the lengths these guys will go and have gone to support a game like this. Guys, let's count our blessings. I told Oleg when I heard from him...He has a fan for life, and I mean it! Haven't been able to download the 304m patch yet. Going this afternoon to pick up my new AMD64 super duper computer and will do it then. Yep, I can do that. I'm retired with a slight disability that doesn't allow me out of the house very much. This game and these forums are what I get up for everyday. I just hope we don't spoil it......

goshikisen
01-19-2005, 10:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by cajun16:
Man. most of you guys don't know when you have it good. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think we all know it (or at least most of us)... it's just that we've been spoiled for a good long time now.

goshikisen
01-19-2005, 11:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jazz01:
A promise was made at the release of 3.03 that the next one, 3.04 was to contain 'the big stuff'. Even the development updates page was updated with WIP pictures. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

For the record... Oleg never promised planes in 3.04. In one of the stickies about 3.03 he said that 3.04 was going to be a "small" patch... unfortunately, to make way for the 3.04 bug report stickies the mods have removed all of the 3.03 threads.

Regards, Goshikisen.

Aztek_Eagle
01-19-2005, 12:02 PM
Betty is the plane witch i was looking forward on pacific fighters.... a certain death to fly it... what more can i witch for?..........

but well... here i am still waiting for it.... realy getting me annoyed each time i tghink of it... but... well.....

AnalFissure
01-19-2005, 12:37 PM
I actually bought FB with add-ons like the Ju88 in mind.

Still waiting for that one...

Chivas
01-19-2005, 01:01 PM
Waiting is a fact of life....

TheGozr
01-19-2005, 01:25 PM
I think Oleg don't read the emails, and i think someone else post under his name here.

I feel that for some very bugs he doesn't care.

edwardk1964
01-19-2005, 01:25 PM
I recently purchased both Pacific Fighters and the Forgotten Battles Gold Pack. I like the work that was done by Oleg & Crew. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Regarding the missing planes that were left out because of lack of room, how big of a file are we talking about here if this was available as a download? After reading the below quote from Ivan, I'm sure Pacific Fighters will be that much better when finished. We just have to exercise that "P" word. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

"After Lots of changes. And there are more things in it that were not promised then promised ones."

Edward K.

XyZspineZyX
01-19-2005, 01:31 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TheGozr:
I think Oleg don'tread the emails, and i think someone else post under his name here.
I feel that for some very bugs he doesn't care. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are to be banned ....be sure.

GonzoX
01-19-2005, 01:33 PM
Why is it that being a moderator here seems to always have to = being critical and judgmental of posters and their opinions?

It should be the other way around, WE should be critical as WE are the customers.

Why do some people here want to always turn the natural order of the universe on it's head?

Jumping into an existing flame war to fix it or end it is a given, but for a moderator to actually START a thread to start incite people into one is almost surreal to me. Why do it?

Is this what a moderator is supposed to do? Incite hate and discontent by insulting people and our intelligence.

crazyivan1970
01-19-2005, 02:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Oleg-Maddox:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TheGozr:
I think Oleg don'tread the emails, and i think someone else post under his name here.
I feel that for some very bugs he doesn't care. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are to be banned ....be sure. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, it`s you that are so banned, be sure http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Hope you don`t have other accounts, cause they will go too http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

@Gonzo, re-read my post again. I think you reading it backwards. And what, moderators are not allowed to speak their mind? Only customers do? You lost me there.

Cheers!

Targ
01-19-2005, 03:29 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Oleg-Maddox:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TheGozr:
I think Oleg don'tread the emails, and i think someone else post under his name here.
I feel that for some very bugs he doesn't care. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are to be banned ....be sure. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, it`s you that are so banned, be sure http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Hope you don`t have other accounts, cause they will go too http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

@Gonzo, re-read my post again. I think you reading it backwards. And what, moderators are not allowed to speak their mind? Only customers do? You lost me there.

Cheers! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That would be a shame as I just deleted that account completly. Oh wait, maybe that would be a good thing.

crazyivan1970
01-19-2005, 03:33 PM
Dang Targ, itchy ban finger? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif heheeee.

Targ
01-19-2005, 04:38 PM
I could not help myself.
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Tvrdi
01-19-2005, 04:58 PM
I dont know what is the big deal here...we can wait for big patch with lots of new stuff...let them do the job right...some of the planes promised in the release didnt came with the last patch..np again for me, playin this sim back from 2001. i got lots of planes for free!
no fixes in readme? np for me also,.. i noticed changes in 304...lots of things changed and imagine the list which would appear in readme...a huge list...really, the worst thing is a bad patch (who came rushed after users impatience).....its the only f "game" Im playin from 2001. ....all others became fast childish fun compared to this true simulator..first of this kind on market....so everybody, this isnt a robbery! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

J_Weaver
01-19-2005, 05:13 PM
I think many people (myself included) have been spoiled. Oleg and crew create these great sims and then give us loads of free stuff. Every time something is released it sets the bar a little higher for the next release. Then we get a small patch that fixes some importent things and we all starting moaning and whining because we didn't get more goodies. This is the only sim i've ever seen that gets this much support. Lets all just take a deep breath and think back to what we had before Oleg gave us the IL2 series. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Zatorski
01-19-2005, 05:19 PM
I'll weigh in on this.
I don't really care when the big addon comes, and this 18MB patch was nice. I think the sim looks better now. If there was another patch like this in a few weeks that would be nice too.

heywooood
01-19-2005, 05:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
You know, after reading PF, GD and ORR forums€¦I am really disappointed in you guys, not all of you...but still. Where did that time go when we were happy with a little tiny bitty patches, that were addressing much smaller things. This patch required a lot of work, much more work then you think. And instead OF APPRICIATION all is see is disappointment€¦ What gives? Because you didn`t get couple of planes that were promised? Is that it? So€¦ issues with carrier take offs€¦ graphical problems are not important? Couple more planes is what need to make your day? This is really sad. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

misscommunicaton and missinformation will cause headaches, be certain.

It is all a matter of perception and when people/customers perceive a deception?....they get nasty. There is no way around that, no way at all.

I blame UBI and not 1c...the box was deceiving...period.
You had to know where to look on these boards to know what was what - and sometimes that info was cloudy...

cwojackson
01-19-2005, 05:41 PM
[/QUOTE]

misscommunicaton and missinformation will cause headaches, be certain.

It is all a matter of perception and when people/customers perceive a deception?....they get nasty. There is no way around that, no way at all.

I blame UBI and not 1c...the box was deceiving...period.
You had to know where to look on these boards to know what was what - and sometimes that info was cloudy...[/QUOTE]Exactly. When I purchased PF I was told that the game was incomplete (by a whole CD worth of data) but that it would be available in two weeks. I could accept that...but that was back in November. Since then I've seen very little at all from 1CMaddox.

All the speculations and dissatisfaction could be ended with a simple message from 1CMaddox regarding the status of the original claim of another CD worth of data and hot button issues like English ships at Pearl Harbor, the lack of carrier torpedo aircraft, the lack of maps, the lack luster campaigns, etc.

Spider_439th
01-19-2005, 05:47 PM
I don€t want so badly the betty and the avenger theses planes are sitting ducks!... I remember flying these planes in anothers sims it was very difficult just to stay in the air and with all the flack the missions was short.

Sure! I missed the JU-88, Typhoons, B-17 flyable and Lancaster but first i remember that like this game for the flight modeling, maps, large amount of planes and now with the 3.04 perfect mode is better than ever(I have Ati card) so we can wait a little for more.

The only thing that makes me anxious is €¦..

When do we have screenshot of BOB??€¦I CAN€T WAIT !
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

james_ander
01-19-2005, 08:36 PM
I was briefly disappointed with the patch. You must admit that since the game was released there has been an expectation that a number of planes would show in upcoming patches.

There was the issue of not haveing enough CD space.
Then it was the sick programmers.
Then it was the trademark issue.

So there were definately expectations created and I can understand why some are disappointed.

From my perspective, I got my $39.99 worth ages ago and I have no complaints about an unfinished game. I still haven't flown all the planes in this sim and missing a couple doesn't really change my gaming experience.

It is clear that the developer supports this sim extremely well. It is nice to know that development and improvement are continuing.

What would be nice is being kept in the loop about what is really happening with planes, patches etc. Then maybe expectations would be kept in line and there would be less disappointement.

I am hearing about an add-on but I have no information. I would welcome a pay add-on like AEP. I would be willing to pay for add-ons for this sim.

T_O_A_D
01-19-2005, 08:57 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-mad.gifDang it Ivan I ought to Ban you for starting this thread. Right before you leave for Holiday http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

I agree with the original post, but Geeze, some of this, or well most of this, is all trash. I waisted several minutes of my life reading it this and I'll never get it back. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

crazyivan1970
01-19-2005, 08:58 PM
You can ban me on Friday... if you wont... i`ll ban myself http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Targ
01-19-2005, 09:16 PM
Please ban me as well http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif
Thank you
Targ

Snootles
01-19-2005, 09:37 PM
I don't come around here much these days (too busy with playing games and the such), but I'm not the least perturbed. In fact I think it's nice that they released a patch to fix specific issues instead of holding the fixes back for a larger add-on patch.

BTW, speaking of taking off from carriers loaded, is there any chance that catapults might become part of the gameplay some day?

Krt_Bong
01-19-2005, 09:44 PM
To the Moderators of this Forum:
you have my sympathy
To Oleg Maddox:
Great game Thank you!
To the consistant whiners:
OMG will you please just take a pill or something

Old_Canuck
01-20-2005, 12:09 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Targ:
Please ban me as well http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif
Thank you
Targ <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ban them all.
Let God sort 'em out. http://htomc.dns2go.com/anim/anim/gun-guy.gif http://htomc.dns2go.com/anim/anim/machgun1.gif http://htomc.dns2go.com/anim/anim/machgun2.gif

FI_Macca44
01-20-2005, 12:36 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
The problem is.. you can`t enjoy sim as is, you want more. This approach was forming up for the past 3 years. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



Yes Ivan, ppl moved from playing the game to complaining the patches are too small,too few planes etc. BTW...as fa as I remember...patch is to repair sth.Wait when Oleg calls it an addon.

For me the game is ok with the planes avaliable now, only one torpedo plane for each side would be cool, but I will survive without that and enjoy the great game.Fixes are more important to me.

Howgh!
S!

Bearcat99
01-20-2005, 08:08 AM
I just couldnt take the whole 7 pages of this mess.... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif but ask yourself.. and think of every other sim you have flown...... EVER since the your first flight sim experience.... How many of them do you still fly? How many updates did you get for those products? How many patches did you get to fix problems? How much free new content did you get.... that was consistant with the overall standard of the original in terms of graphics, DM FM etc? How many times have you sent an email to developer XXX and had him reply to you....... directly... and pretty d@mn quick to boot? How many times have you had a product that was so good....... that you were willing to go out and spend hundreds of dollars or pounds or whatever it is your currency is..... a months wages, sometimes two or 3 months wages if added all up...... just to run it to its fullest potential... even when what you were running it at was still head and shoulders above whatever else you had on your hard drive that called itself a flight sim? Can ANY OF YOU who have so much to say come up with an equivalent? I know I cant..... and if you can then I have to ask again... why arent you flying it now? Oh.... because it is old and outdated huh? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif Ohhhhhhh... the graphics dont stand up to the standard you are used to huh..... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif?

How many of you who cry and groan so loud or have so much negative stuff to say boot up FB 3.0 after you walk in the door and maybe take a whizz first.....? How many of you sit at the desk at work or the dinner table going.... "I wonder if I can move my XXX control over to this button and put my ZZZ over there on that slider etc. etc. etc..."?

Life is good..... enjoy yourselves..... bit@h less...... fly more.

BH-21
01-20-2005, 08:29 AM
If all of this is so, then explain why since the first release of PF you haven't fixed the floating village on the early Guadicanal map near Cape Esperance. There are many other things, including ones from version one of IL-2 still out there. Getting the game fixed to a level that more people can play it is a good thing, but for thoroughness you have dropped the ball many times. Once again I have shelved this game due to its short comings.

IVJG51_Dart
01-20-2005, 08:57 AM
So far I think this patch is among the best ever released. Thanks Oleg and Co!

AND, what Bearcat said above. Spot on buddy.

crazyivan1970
01-20-2005, 10:55 AM
Good post BC http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

flyingscampi
01-20-2005, 11:06 AM
Happy days are here again
The skies above are clear again
So let's sing a song of cheer again
Happy days are here again http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

I loooove looking forward to new patches.

Old_Canuck
01-20-2005, 12:51 PM
So true Bearcat. This might be the "ungrateful generation" we've read about. I remember drawing pictures of dogfights in school (not too long after WWII) when the teacher wasn't looking and comparing with my buddy's pictures. Now we can send tracks and screenshots to each other of action so realistic the old veterans of WWII have voiced their affirmation.

Don't give up sending out these reality calls, BC, some of these jokers have short attention spans and the b!tching will start again after the next patch.

Bearcat99
01-20-2005, 02:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BH-21:
If all of this is so, then explain why since the first release of PF you haven't fixed the floating village on the early Guadicanal map near Cape Esperance. There are many other things, including ones from version one of IL-2 still out there. Getting the game fixed to a level that more people can play it is a good thing, but for thoroughness you have dropped the ball many times. <span class="ev_code_RED">Once again I have shelved this game due to its short comings</span>. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Uhhhhhhh maybe its because Im just a forum moderator.. not a programmer.. and I didnt make te sim.....LMAO..... And these things are show stoppers for you??!!?! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif So much so that you shelved the product http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif??!!

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

PFFTTT!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

So are you stillflying WW2 sims?

I wont go on a CFS bashing tear... that horse has been beaten, resurrected and killed again and again (and deservedly so)..... it has become the Rasputin of sim topics... in fact it still is worth a few more smacks.... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif I just dont have the time...... but.... so.. what are you doing now... If you shelved the sim due to its shortcomings does that mean you will be leaving here too??!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

I dunno man......... what about the other things... the things that DO work well..? I gotta go and try to find this floating villiage and all this "other stuff" since IL2 that you are referring to because frankly its the first I am hearing about it...... which of course doesnt mean that its not real...

Oh welll!!!!! C-Ya!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

initjust
01-20-2005, 03:18 PM
I shelved it too. It just doesn't meet my needs.

I periodically check back here just to see if, perhaps, one of the many patches resolves some of the issues I consider to be 'show stoppers'. So far the existing patches haven't and it is entirely possible that the IL2 engine itself won't allow these issues to be resolved.

Some day someone will come up with a PTO sim that will have what I am looking for. At that point, regardless of who makes the sim, I will use it.

Until that time I will continue using what best meets my needs and keep looking around to see if there is anything better than what I have now.

Supr
01-20-2005, 03:28 PM
"bit@h less, Fly More"


http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/351.gifbest quote of the whole thread.

Oh, and its funny that some guys mention all these problems or bugs that have been around since il2, yet guys that have actually been around since il2( me included) have never heard of them. And please tell us, what are the show stoppers you have? Thats another first

DarthBane_
01-20-2005, 03:58 PM
Ahhhhh, no new planes? No reflections and bump mapping in graphic engine? Still wasting time with radeon support? How about floating camera, heat blur effect, or motion blur effects, or reflections and bump maps for 6800u?
Jane's WW2 has reflections and this game doesnt?
Why for gods sake? And than no new planes???

d451dart
01-20-2005, 04:38 PM
I guess I just don't get it! All the negativity...I'm pretty happy...I can take off an aircraft carrier now! Thank you very much for the patch!

Slingn
01-20-2005, 04:41 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by DarthBane_:
Ahhhhh, no new planes? No reflections and bump mapping in graphic engine? Still wasting time with radeon support? How about floating camera, heat blur effect, or motion blur effects, or reflections and bump maps for 6800u?
Jane's WW2 has reflections and this game doesnt?
Why for gods sake? And than no new planes??? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

lol, he joking, right? Or is he just the joke itself.

Skycat_2
01-20-2005, 04:48 PM
Random thoughts ...

BH-21
The phrase "Once again I have shelved this game due to its short comings" made me chuckle. Once again. That says it all. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I've seen minorly floating ground objects since IL-2, like when buildings are on a slope ... but you have to be panning with a ground-level camera view to really see those. The conventional wisdom that this is an airplane sim and not a tank sim, etc., applies. (On the other hand, I was obsessive about a certain clump of bushes growing on the ramp of a bridge on the Crimea QMB map, so I understand your issues.)

initjust,
What are you looking for in a PTO sim? I'm not criticizing or bashing; I'm simply curious.

In my case (not a serious PTO buff), I always found the lack of US vs. Japanese "ground attack" missions a serious shortcoming in CFS-2. If you look in CFS-2's objects folders, there are no Japanese tanks and I don't think there are any convoy vehicles either. PF has several Japanese tanks, soft vehicles, trains, and bunkers, so I can at least build my own missions with them in FMB.

DarthBArne_,
Those are some intriguing suggestions ... but do we really need a motion blur effect?

As for Jane's WWII Fighters having reflections, I believe you are mistaken. CFS-3 is the only WWII air combat sim I can think of that has a "reflections moving on bare aluminum" visual effect. Similarly, FB+ is the only WWII air combat sim that I know of that models reflections on water surfaces.

Treetop64
01-20-2005, 05:06 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BH-21:
If all of this is so, then explain why since the first release of PF you haven't fixed the floating village on the early Guadicanal map near Cape Esperance. There are many other things, including ones from version one of IL-2 still out there. Getting the game fixed to a level that more people can play it is a good thing, but for thoroughness you have dropped the ball many times. Once again I have shelved this game due to its short comings. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

BH-21, (and similarly like-minded individuals), with an attitude like that, you deserved the lashing Bearcat gave you. Do you realize software developers lose money on patches? They don't have to patch a product at all if they don't want to. Do you have any idea of the amount of funds, material, and energy that goes into making a product that you so easily condemn?

Hell, the retail versions of the entire IL-2 series is stellar out of the box - I've only recently downloaded all of the patches. I've never had a single complaint about any of the IL-2 sims.

Appropriately addressed gripes are, of course, understandable and welcomed by the developers. However, these "this-game-sucks-and-all-the-patches-suck" mentality is silly and ignorant, and frankly, should be beneath the notice of acknowledgment. Please understand that nothing in life is perfect, and all things (including your capacity to appreciate fine products) has room for improvement.

I simply cannot understand how anyone can b*tch so confidently about trite details in a product that hasn't a remote equal in terms of quality and depth. It just confirms the notion that there are those who will ignore a million good entries to make an issue of the one or two blots in the copybook, so to speak. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Treetop

Treetop64
01-20-2005, 05:14 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by initjust:
I shelved it too. It just doesn't meet my needs.

I periodically check back here just to see if, perhaps, one of the many patches resolves some of the issues I consider to be 'show stoppers'. So far the existing patches haven't and it is entirely possible that the IL2 engine itself won't allow these issues to be resolved.

Some day someone will come up with a PTO sim that will have what I am looking for. At that point, regardless of who makes the sim, I will use it.

Until that time I will continue using what best meets my needs and keep looking around to see if there is anything better than what I have now. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good grief, people... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/351.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

Treetop

Zneg1
01-20-2005, 05:21 PM
This reminds me of a LARGE painting in MOMA (Musuem of Modern Art). Its a large canvas of more than 8-10 feet high with a pin head black dot in the middle. If you ask what people see, they say its the BLACK DOT. Most ignore than fact that its vrtually WHITE with a very small DOT in the middle. People choose to SEE the black dot. I for one thank 1C:maddox and Oleg since I know what it takes to do something of this magnitude. yes I am not just a fli-sim gamer but I also do 3D modeling among other things so I know what it takes to do this kind of quality.

ZG77_Nagual
01-20-2005, 05:32 PM
Amazing and subtle work on this patch. As I posted right after it came out in ORR- this is some fine work.

I think the problem with alot of the complaining is it just feeds some psychological need - some sort of gratification to be able to find fault and flap about it on the internet and get a rise outta somebody, or at least have some sort of intense sensation - righteous indignation or whatever - and imagine you are being 'heard'.

If you look at this simm in context it's a masterful work of art. It's great that the developer is willing to listen and change things. And I suppose inevitable that there'll be abuse of that.

goshikisen
01-20-2005, 05:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by initjust:
I shelved it too. It just doesn't meet my needs.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

With all due respect, I'm curious as to what currently meets your needs... and what do you consider "show stoppers" in terms of problems?

There are definitely flaws with the current iteration PF but on the whole I can't think of anything else out there that comes even close to what 1C have created. Hopefully the add on will address the issues some have with the sim but, as it stands, I'm more than happy with my purchase.

Regards, Goshikisen.

carguy_
01-20-2005, 06:34 PM
The thread should be raised once in a while everytime one starts complaining.

Me,I complain everytime this game gets unplayable for me.The biggest problem of all IMO is stutters and lags,warps online.
If I can get to run a 16player sortie smoothly I soooo hooked I find myself sitting to very late night/morning hours.

This whole sim and support exceeded my expectations long time ago.IMO the only thing a patch should cover are bugs.There should be no FM,DM fixes or adding new features or planes or blahblahblah

Get all those new stuff on a CD and make ppl pay 10$ for it.They WILL pay,whatever they say.
Never will I understand why Oleg`s team keeps on sitting on this title after the release.It is not worth it.All you get is more complaints.

----------------------------------------------------------------
So my tip for Oleg is.Make a big addon on a CD with DM/FM/new planes for which ppl whine so much and give it to them for about 10$ or so.You say they won`t buy?You say they will just turn their back and go away?Maybe 1C:Maddox Games will lose the support quality fame?BS!People have been getting screwded by M$ fro the last 4 years so bad they will pay for the addon and will be sending thankful emails.

1C:Maddox Games spoiled this community so bad that this has to be changed or we won`t see more of their sims.

----------------------------------------------------------------
You think if Oleg stopped all the thing...the MG151,the FM and all the rest would I dump the game?Surely not.Everytime I look at it as a whole I am satisfied as a gamer and really can`t think of anything more vital to my gaming experience.All those whines...they are little whines really.Just say it:"We don`t plan on giving you free new stuff besides fixing bugs(FM,DM are not bugs!)".Ok,nothing I wouldn`t expect.

BTW the whining of groups like Ameriwhiners or Luftwaffles are a perfect proof that we get hooked so much that we lose the distance to this game and really face with emotions characteristic to a 12 year olds.

You know,when I go vertical with 400kph IAS in my G6 and a Yak1B catches me I run for home and #$@%*!#^! after the sortie cuz he beat me and I know I can`t do anything but to analize what have I done wrong.Those are the emotions I have never felt playing a PC game.

Moreover this was to be expected.If PF was meant to be a success then we get lotsa n00bs coming here.Big part of them whining over nothing without knowing the 3 year legacy of 1C:Maddox Games support to this fine sim.

All in all I say this.If you gonna whine more- stop,remove your fingers from the keyboard,step away from the monitor and count to 100.

initjust
01-20-2005, 06:51 PM
Skycat,

PF has many great features. The graphics are excellent. The ac are very well done and the ships are stunning.

What it lacks, and these are show stoppers for me, is a working model of the physical atmosphere, contiguous maps of the real world allowing for long range flights and simulation of real world navigation challenges.

I recognize that I am an extreme minority here and some (most) will poo-pah my opinion but for me the point of combat is only a small percentage of what I am looking for in a PTO simulation.

For me the challenge of finding and reporting the location of enemy units, doing the nav calcs and strike planning and then getting to and from the target area needing to deal with a 'simulation' of the navigation and flight challenges pilots in the PTO faced is a bigger part of the 'experience' than the actual bomb/torpedo run, bomber intercept or fighter furball.

For me flying over islands/land masses and being able to id them by looking at a real world map of islands in the area I am flying over is critical.

As an example of the importance of a working model of the atmosphere just look at all the time and effort (and complaints) spent on this forum trying to figure out how to deal with no wind over the deck of the carriers. There has been, and will be, much discussion regarding whether or not this or that ac FM has been 'changed' to accomodate the absence of wind.

A reasonable working model of the atmosphere might have made all this discussion moot.

TOcarroll
01-20-2005, 07:18 PM
I, for one, am VERY GREATFUL to the designer/programmer/manufacturer, for producing a fantastic game, and for providing customer support that I have not seen equalled by any competetor. I hope you folks realize that most of the satisfied customers do not post "thank-you's".

THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR A JOB WELL DONE!!

Skycat_2
01-20-2005, 07:59 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by initjust:
... For me the challenge of finding and reporting the location of enemy units, doing the nav calcs and strike planning and then getting to and from the target area needing to deal with a 'simulation' of the navigation and flight challenges pilots in the PTO faced is a bigger part of the 'experience' than the actual bomb/torpedo run, bomber intercept or fighter furball ... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Fair enough. I see where you're coming from.

GR142-Pipper
01-20-2005, 08:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
You know, after reading PF, GD and ORR forums€¦I am really disappointed in you guys, not all of you...but still. Where did that time go when we were happy with a little tiny bitty patches, that were addressing much smaller things. This patch required a lot of work, much more work then you think. And instead OF APPRICIATION all is see is disappointment€¦ What gives? Because you didn`t get couple of planes that were promised? Is that it? So€¦ issues with carrier take offs€¦ graphical problems are not important? Couple more planes is what need to make your day? This is really sad. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> You know, it probably has to do with expectations. When they're set high it's tough sometimes to "clear the bar".

When new aircraft get introduced it can take a while to get the flight and damage models right. That said, we have so many new aircraft that it will definitely take a long time to get many of these things resolved. The net of it is that many things simply don't get addressed in a timely matter dispite all the good intentions.

We simply have far too many aircraft types in this game than the development/support/quality assurance resources can support. This leads to disappointment. Going forward, I hope Oleg and company learn from this to help ensure quality remains high in future product offerings.

...Just my take.

GR142-Pipper

WTE_Gog
01-20-2005, 08:15 PM
Patch,,,yeah great.....but where's my stinkin' aircraft?

GR142-Pipper
01-20-2005, 08:19 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TheGozr:
We need a Patch for the beta testers.
We need to have new testers that is very importants, UBI made a lots of troubles for Oleg and beta tester don't really test the tests.

????? infos????? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I would agree with you on this point, Gozr. I've long felt that the beta testers either didn't do a decent job beta testing or that their beta observations to the developers went unheard. There seems to be a disconnect somewhere.

GR142-Pipper

RocketRobin__
01-20-2005, 09:13 PM
I can't add anything more cynical to this thread, without exceeding the bounds of good taste.
Since my last edition appears to have exceeded the limitations of most intellects, I secede.
As a Frostback, I won't engage in a war I can't win.

Bearcat99
01-20-2005, 10:48 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by initjust:
Skycat,

PF has many great features. The graphics are excellent. The ac are very well done and the ships are stunning.

What it lacks, and these are show stoppers for me, is a working model of the physical atmosphere, contiguous maps of the real world allowing for long range flights and simulation of real world navigation challenges.

I recognize that I am an extreme minority here and some (most) will poo-pah my opinion but for me the point of combat is only a small percentage of what I am looking for in a PTO simulation.

For me the challenge of finding and reporting the location of enemy units, doing the nav calcs and strike planning and then getting to and from the target area needing to deal with a 'simulation' of the navigation and flight challenges pilots in the PTO faced is a bigger part of the 'experience' than the actual bomb/torpedo run, bomber intercept or fighter furball.

For me flying over islands/land masses and being able to id them by looking at a real world map of islands in the area I am flying over is critical.

As an example of the importance of a working model of the atmosphere just look at all the time and effort (and complaints) spent on this forum trying to figure out how to deal with no wind over the deck of the carriers. There has been, and will be, much discussion regarding whether or not this or that ac FM has been 'changed' to accomodate the absence of wind.

A reasonable working model of the atmosphere might have made all this discussion moot. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually I would love to see that stuff too. Especially the maps and the weather..... but it seems to me what you want is this sim with features from FS2K4... which is fair enough.. but ... and this is just my opinion... none of these are show stoppers to this... a WW2 sim. In my opinion the fact that people even look at PF as "the sim" and not the whole FB package as one big 5CD sim says a lot to me.. and thats where I am coming from.

Sure there are things that I would love to see.. but the fact that I know that some of these things I will never see in this sim make it so much easier for me to say OK.... well this is what we have... I can live with that. I still think it is light years above any other WW2 sim on the market for all the things that are important to me... and it just amazes me that people would settle for CFS style graphics and DMs when this stuff is available. I have heard alot about the 1%planes.... and I just dont buy it. No matter how "accurate" (and I dont really think they are........ accurate to what is the real question..) the planes may or may not be the overall package to me is the biggest show stopper and though this sim has many flaws.. none are glaring enough to make it unenjoyable. But thats just me....... and BTW.. what you are asking for can be done... some of those Pacific maps are huge..... I am working on a concept i will share with the community once the 332nd gets it all ironed out.

initjust
01-21-2005, 02:28 AM
The ETO just does not interest me in any way shape of form so the IL2/FB/AEP collection is not a consideration for me. I look at PF as a stand alone PTO sim since that is how I intended to use it.

I bought IL2 and FB (didn't bother to get AEP) when they were released. I spent a good deal of time trying to get 'into' the ETO. It didn't happen and no sim, regardless of how well done it is, will change that. I simply have no interest in the ETO so saying that PF needs to be considered as a part of a greater whole misses the mark for me since I am only interested in the PTO.

I bought PF as soon as it was available hoping that it would, as a PTO sim, fill in some of the holes and be a better PTO sim. In some respects it is and, in my opinion, in others it is not.

You are right on target when you say that what I want is a sim that combines what PF has to offer and what FS9 has to offer. Some day someone will do just that and then that will be the sim I will spend my time on.

We each decide what we can and can't live with or without in a given sim. We each decide what the major make/break factors are in a given sim/game.

You, and many others, are content with what PF has to offer and that is as it should be. On the other hand, for me, PF is lacking in some of the make/break areas that I, personally, consider to be critical.

WOLFMondo
01-21-2005, 02:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ElAurens:
So many grown men acting like sissy Mary little girls, shameful. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Its funny how grown up men with responsible jobs, mortgages, children etc act with the anonimity of the internet at there disposal.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
The BF-110 and P-38 were whined for forever and how many people you see flying them on a regular basis online? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I see them used quite allot when there available. Its not uncommon recently to see 3 or 4 working together of either type. 4 P38's is a proffessional vulching team! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

VF51_Flatspin
01-21-2005, 10:04 AM
I didn't read all 8 pages of this, so sorry if I'm saying something that's already been said.

This sim has been patched more than any sim or game I've ever owned. And most needed it worse. Most developers I've had experience with will patch once or twice (if that) then it's off to the next game. The wants of the consumer are not heard. Oleg & his crew have supported us like no other, they've set the bar as far as I'm concerned, and I doubt whether anyone will ever be able to jump as high.

NorrisMcWhirter
01-21-2005, 10:48 AM
Hi,

Funny, really, as a lot of the success of this title is due to the enthusiastic community...a community who is now being 'berated' for suggesting that things could be done in a better way.

Of course, you can never please everyone all of the time but I don't see as you can expect those people who are not pleased to say nothing about it, either. No one has made a personal attack on Oleg (well, apart from the dedi server thing) about it; they've mostly posted their opinions in a reasonable manner.

If more (non-fantastical) communication took place in terms of feedback over problems and the order of their correction, I'm sure things would be smoother in here. For instance, releasing proper statements rather than piecemeal glib remarks about when/what things are coming out would be beneficial because, at the moment, it just looks like someone is trying to say 'I know more than you do and I'm going to give you little snippets giving me power over you'.

Also, I don't see how anyone can complain about people being disappointed about missing planes, either - that's ridiculous - they are on the box but not in the game and you don't need to be Freud to know that is a wrong thing to do to your customer base no matter how 'friendly' they are.

In short, though, I'd be more worried if no one posted around here, Ivan, as it would mean that the interest was waning...

Cheers,
Norris

crazyivan1970
01-21-2005, 11:00 AM
You missing a point Norris. This thread is not about critizism. It`s about simple appriciation. Saying patch sucks, because still no planes is lame in my book. Patch is patch, things were corrected and improved and simple "thank you" is in order. That`s all.

cwojackson
01-21-2005, 11:14 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Patch is patch, things were corrected and improved and simple "thank you" is in order. That`s all. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Thank you for still not giving me the product I purchased? Hmmmmmm?

I've got this old Hugo you might be interested in. I could give it to you for a very good price.

crazyivan1970
01-21-2005, 11:16 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by cwojackson:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Patch is patch, things were corrected and improved and simple "thank you" is in order. That`s all. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Thank you for still not giving me the product I purchased? Hmmmmmm?

I've got this old Hugo you might be interested in. I could give it to you for a very good price. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So, you purchased Betty, not the pacific fighters. That`s where you getting? Oh boy...

Supr
01-21-2005, 11:43 AM
WOW! sometimes thats all there is to say.

Asgeir_Strips
01-21-2005, 11:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
You know, after reading PF, GD and ORR forums€¦I am really disappointed in you guys, not all of you...but still. Where did that time go when we were happy with a little tiny bitty patches, that were addressing much smaller things. This patch required a lot of work, much more work then you think. And instead OF APPRICIATION all is see is disappointment€¦ What gives? Because you didn`t get couple of planes that were promised? Is that it? So€¦ issues with carrier take offs€¦ graphical problems are not important? Couple more planes is what need to make your day? This is really sad. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

But im disappointed that Oleg and Co Lied to us, in the first place, we shouldn't have to download those patches because PF should be finished without so alarmingly many bugs. Some programmers must have been doing something else when Oleg taught them about the Pacific war.. The Unpatched PF is a perfect example of that.
So i dont think you have the right to be disappointed of us, i think we have the right to be disappointed on the dev team, allthough i must state that i play the game almost every day, but i think there are a LOT of things that needs to be straightened out...

crazyivan1970
01-21-2005, 12:09 PM
Of course, i have no right... of course dev team is responcible for this mess. Amazing http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Asgeir_Strips
01-21-2005, 12:49 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Of course, i have no right... of course dev team is responcible for this mess. Amazing http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes of course they are, after all, they are the one that actually made the 'kin game! And i think its stupid that they wont model an aircraft because they cant get enough information on one single gauge or something similar... And when they promise something on the box i think its unfair that it isn't included on the finished product.. I could go on and on 'bout missing objects and stuff, but im sure that most of it has been mentioned before.. Personally i prefer a delayed release date before a totally unfinished product.. but thats just me.

crazyivan1970
01-21-2005, 12:55 PM
Well, that pretty much sums it up. Unfortunately you didn`t understand how game development works.

Slingn
01-21-2005, 02:57 PM
WOW!

There are some really ignorant people here. They don€t have a clue, do they? Looks like they need to go back to their playstation and leave these flight sims to the grown ups. I mean its funny, really. Guys that have been here for only a few months are passing judgment on a game that has had more support and developer participation over the last 3 years, than any game I've ever seen. Its amazing. I don€t think you could beat reason into some of these guys€ heads with a baseball bat, but I€m sure some wouldn't mind trying. Someone said that they should have made this an add on only, as opposed to a stand-alone. That sure sounds like a good idea now. I cant wait till they threaten to sue because the picture on the box doesnt match the plane in the game

cwojackson
01-21-2005, 03:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by cwojackson:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Patch is patch, things were corrected and improved and simple "thank you" is in order. That`s all. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Thank you for still not giving me the product I purchased? Hmmmmmm?

I've got this old Hugo you might be interested in. I could give it to you for a very good price. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So, you purchased Betty, not the pacific fighters. That`s where you getting? Oh boy... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>No, just the whole product I paid full price for.

NorrisMcWhirter
01-21-2005, 06:43 PM
Hi,

I understand what you are saying, Ivan, but my point was that you have to remember that some people have been through the mill what with missing items and such like.

Personally, I'm not particularly bothered that the Betty isn't flyable but rather that it is supposed to be there and, more importantly, that we were told that the extra aircraft would be available immediately after PF was in the shops. So, it's more of a matter of principle to me that we were obviously lied to - I'm hardly going to say thank you for that nor am I particularly pleased about bugs being introduced of late possibly due to things being rushed/incompletely tested. Now, you might say, 'well, if it wasn't for people demanding patches etc' but they were demanding because they were told things were going to appear in 'two weeks' so they had an expectation. As I've said before, it's best to tell people something will be out in 6 weeks and give it to them in 6 weeks working than saying '2 weeks' and give it to them in 4 weeks when it isn't working.

Don't get me wrong, though - I do feel sorry for Oleg as he appears to be run ragged what with copyright issues, whining (including my own), development team wores, missing planes and BoB...but I think that a lot more sympathy would be on offer if 'officials' had been more open to begin with.

Cheers,
Norris

PS: Slingn - I hope that wasn't directed at me. If it was, check my registration date - it preceeds yours by a long time.

Even at that, those people who ARE new to Il-2 should be the ones who are treated with some respect. If they turn up after purchasing this game and find it to be a shambles/are abused, they are unlikely to stick around/buy anything else and that spells trouble for so-called 'adults who fly flight sims' such as yourself.

If they have a valid complaint and present it in a reasonable manner, they should be answered constructively. It's the old timers who should know better than to complain because they will have experience of Oleg sorting things out (with luck). Doesn't mean that you can't criticise in the meantime, however.

k5054
01-22-2005, 04:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Don't get me wrong, though - I do feel sorry for Oleg as he appears to be run ragged what with copyright issues, whining (including my own), development team wores, <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I know that last word is a typo, but waht word did you mean???????????

sapre
01-22-2005, 04:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
Personally, I'm not particularly bothered that the Betty isn't flyable but rather that it is supposed to be there and, more importantly, that we _were told that the extra aircraft would be available immediately after PF was in the shops._ . <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Was it?
I don't remember it clearly...
Can you show the old topic perhaps?

F19_Ob
01-22-2005, 09:00 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by F19_Olli72:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by georgeo76:
I bet no body will even fly the betty when it dose arrive :S <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ill take that bet http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

me too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif
Betty will be a fun plane to fly as a fighter.

NorrisMcWhirter
01-22-2005, 10:08 AM
Hi,

hehe...should have been 'woes' - I'd had a few pints when I wrote that.

wrt 'extra', I remember that Oleg said certain planes wouldn't be flyable because they simply wouldn't fit on the two CDs. I don't have a link (search is erratic) but it's common knowledge (or so I thought). That's not a complaint - it's just a reminder to those who are disappointed in people who are disappointed as to why they might be disappointed http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Ta,
Norris

Jester_159th
01-22-2005, 10:13 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sapre:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
Personally, I'm not particularly bothered that the Betty isn't flyable but rather that it is supposed to be there and, more importantly, that we _were told that the extra aircraft would be available immediately after PF was in the shops._ . <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Was it?
I don't remember it clearly...
Can you show the old topic perhaps? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not that I really agree with the way their case has been put across at times, but I'm afraid on this one I suspect Ubi has hung all of us (1C included) out to dry.

It states that clearly in the readme file on your PF disc. Go have a look.

Although I really doubt that the readme was written by a 1C employee. I'll bet that was written by Ubi.

heywooood
01-22-2005, 11:07 AM
conjecture - hearsay - circumstancial - BS

only time will tell this tale -

F19_Olli72
01-22-2005, 11:21 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sapre:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NorrisMcWhirter:
Personally, I'm not particularly bothered that the Betty isn't flyable but rather that it is supposed to be there and, more importantly, that we _were told that the extra aircraft would be available immediately after PF was in the shops._ . <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Was it?
I don't remember it clearly...
Can you show the old topic perhaps? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


(Frontpage news 28.10.04)
"Pacific Fighters add-on news

We are pleased to announce the add-on for Pacific Fighters is close to release (two weeks ;p). The package will make available a new set of flyable and AI aircraft including the F2A-2 and G4M-11 as well as new maps and fixes to most of the issues reported by players since the release of the game. A number of improvements suggested by the more advanced users have also been added.
Stay posted for more information soon. "

I know the "two weeks" is used left and right on the forums. But still..... october.... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

NorrisMcWhirter
01-22-2005, 06:42 PM
Hi,

Just for completeness; you're right - the readme says:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Attention:
We simply ran out of space on our 2 CDs and had to remove some cockpits for
several flyable aircraft. Free add-on containing these aircraft will be made
available at www.pacific-fighters.com (http://www.pacific-fighters.com) for a free download.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Of course, it doesn't say a date http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Cheers,
Norris

StG77_Fritz_X
01-25-2005, 06:53 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by F19_Ob:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by F19_Olli72:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by georgeo76:
I bet no body will even fly the betty when it dose arrive :S <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ill take that bet http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

me too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif
Betty will be a fun plane to fly as a fighter. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Y'ALL LOSE!!!! I will fly the Betty, and quiet often as well.
Can I cash in now?

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

cwojackson
01-25-2005, 05:11 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
"Stay posted for more information soon. "

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
We are staying "posted" but 1CMaddox is staying silent. They could eliminate a lot of speculation and grumbling with a simple and honest update.