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View Full Version : nice WWII footage taken by Australian damien parer in the pacific



barrykrocker1
04-02-2008, 08:58 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azanISsx19c

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98ja1xdN8Ic

Lead-Brick
04-02-2008, 05:49 PM
Excellent!

Thanks for posting

ricbar89
04-02-2008, 05:53 PM
Machine gunning <span class="ev_code_RED">Japanese</span> in lifeboats...

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/touche.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

Very brave of them http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

skarden
04-02-2008, 06:39 PM
great footage there Barry,the stuff from the backseat the the baufighter was amazing to watch.
As far as straffing lifeboats and whatnot,guys ya gotta remember these men wern't out there playing tiddlywinks,it was war,they were defending their country and that kinda thing happened a LOT on EVERY side of the war.to think it didnt is a bit naive to be honest.
cheers for the post

vpmedia
04-03-2008, 12:31 AM
I say only 2 words: war crime, Geneva conventions http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

vpmedia
04-03-2008, 12:37 AM
btw what a ***** does Barbara Bush know about the war?

skarden
04-03-2008, 01:45 AM
Originally posted by vpmedia:
btw what a ***** does Barbara Bush know about the war?

absolutely nothin,it's one of those irony things i found funny http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif (it's my sig,not anything to do with this thread)

as far as "war crimes" like i said every country did things like that,not that that make's it right but it's easy for us to criticize them almost 70 years later enjoying democracy from our computer desk's isnt it.

Skoshi Tiger
04-03-2008, 02:11 AM
Originally posted by ricbar89:
Machine gunning <span class="ev_code_RED">Japanese</span> in lifeboats...

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/touche.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

Very brave of them http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Honest at least!

You can blame MacArthur for that one, He was in charge and giving orders, and if I'm not mistaken, the Americans did their fair share as well. The same thing was done after the Battle of the Coral Sea.

There a lot of ways you can justify it. First off, War is Hell!

The only life raft from the HMAS Sydney - sunk in 41with all hands missing - was found riddled with bullet holes on the Coccos Islands!

Not one Australian soldier captured by the Japanese during the Kokoda Campaign was found alive!

These were Japanese soldiers in Japanese held waters, in their landing barges (and life boats) They were still combatant, and still possibly armed in enemy teritory.

It's great to be able to sit back 70 years after an event and make snide remarks about people that have shown more bravery and devotion to their country and loved ones, and made more sacrifiices that we can't even begin to understand.

Its very hard to judge these people by the standards of our day.

Skoshi Tiger
04-03-2008, 02:13 AM
Originally posted by vpmedia:
I say only 2 words: war crime, Geneva conventions http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

See above, and by the way it's actually 4 words!

Also, if you look into it, you'll find that although the Japanese Government signed the Geneva Convention as a diplomatic expediant, they never actually ratified the convention (due to internal conflict. The military wouldn't let them) and therefore never felt it was bound by the terms of the convention.

Diplomatically the Japanese said that "Every effort should be made to correspondingly apply the provisions of the treaties regarding any prisoners of enemy countries that fall under the authority of Japan", but as history shows the conditions suffered by prisoners held by the Japanese were really bad!

Tater-SW-
04-03-2008, 08:00 AM
Given the suicidal nature of the enemy (fight to the death, or at least ~96% fight to the death based on surrender statistics), and troops pulled from the water would have either been killed by allied troops, or starved/bombed to death wherever they were bypassed.

The bottom line is that they would have been just as dead regardless. The only difference is that allied troops and pilots would have been ADDED to the death toll.

tater

HotelBushranger
04-03-2008, 08:16 AM
Gah, not one of these threads again. As many have said, it was war and it was 60 years ago.


On topic, I have a DVD of Damien Parer's 'Kokoda' footage. It is truly excellent and he was a great cameraman, it is a shame he is not a household name of sorts. Unfortunately, he was killed filming US Marines storming a beach. He was in front of the soldiers, with his back to the Japanese. Stupid or not, it was bloody brave.

MB_Avro_UK
04-03-2008, 06:12 PM
Hi all,

Good post http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif But if the guys in the lifeboats had been German... This thread would have been 30 pages!!

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

WTE_Googly
04-03-2008, 06:32 PM
As one war vet' I saw on television said a while ago about the japanese, "They made the rules, not us."

Truely brilliant footage, thanks for that!

Gumtree
04-03-2008, 10:16 PM
It amazes me that we can see something like this and immediately place our 2008 values upon them. I suppose it either shows our ignorance, or just an individuals lack of knowledge on what was actually going on back then.

barrykrocker1
04-03-2008, 11:29 PM
men in lifeboats or escaping enemies?

barrykrocker1
04-03-2008, 11:32 PM
On topic, I have a DVD of Damien Parer's 'Kokoda' footage. It is truly excellent and he was a great cameraman, it is a shame he is not a household name of sorts. Unfortunately, he was killed filming US Marines storming a beach. He was in front of the soldiers, with his back to the Japanese. Stupid or not, it was bloody brave.

that's true, he was apparently very religious.

my mother's parents were very close friends with him and my grandfather thinks that he was killed by friendly fire from americans

Pirschjaeger
04-04-2008, 01:05 AM
Originally posted by MB_Avro_UK:
Hi all,

Good post http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif But if the guys in the lifeboats had been German... This thread would have been 30 pages!!

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

I think you are misreading things. Here's a few point to consider;

1) As far as I've seen, the German part of the community has little interest in the Pacific theater. I've seen the title a few times but didn't bother.

2) We just did the Enola Gay thread. That was about the Japanese and you saw how passionate that got. We're in peace time. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

3) Look at the posts after yours. Enola Gay thread almost word for word. It's been said an done.

In fact, I won't even bother responding to the replies that I expect my post will inspire.

It's got nothing to do with 'Had they been German..'. In fact, the only reason I posted in here now is that I got an invite in pm.

Fritz

MB_Avro_UK
04-05-2008, 07:26 PM
Originally posted by Pirschjaeger:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MB_Avro_UK:
Hi all,

Good post http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif But if the guys in the lifeboats had been German... This thread would have been 30 pages!!

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

I think you are misreading things. Here's a few point to consider;

1) As far as I've seen, the German part of the community has little interest in the Pacific theater. I've seen the title a few times but didn't bother.

2) We just did the Enola Gay thread. That was about the Japanese and you saw how passionate that got. We're in peace time. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

3) Look at the posts after yours. Enola Gay thread almost word for word. It's been said an done.

In fact, I won't even bother responding to the replies that I expect my post will inspire.

It's got nothing to do with 'Had they been German..'. In fact, the only reason I posted in here now is that I got an invite in pm.

Fritz </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hi Fritz,

Your post has left me confused. What exactly is the problem?

Best Regards,
MB_Avro.

smokincrater
04-05-2008, 08:09 PM
Hello all. Just to point out a few facts. The Carey float recovered from HMAS Sydney doesn`t have any bullet holes in it. The damage recevied is quite clearly the result of splinters caused during Sydneys last fight. Although Sydneys other lifeboats are yet to be accounted for(and probably never will be). It is highly unlikely that Sydneys survivors were machine gunned by any Axis force.

With this business of killing shipwrecked soldiers, drowned fliers etc. The overriding order for any soldier is to kill enemy soldiers where ever they maybe met. That is the grim reality of war. I have only come across one example of the axis forces killing shipwrecked sailors. U-168 commanded by kaptain leuitant Pich was found to have attacked and killed survivors from a ship he had just sank. I can offer many occasions allied personnel did the same. For instance USS Wahoo sunk a merchant ship and then proceeded to machine gun survivors. Aircraft from USS Card strafed survivors from sinking U-Boat. Of the cases above only Pich and his senior officers were commited to trial and hung. The International Military Tribunal was seen very much as victors justice and I leave to the reader to judge that. But never take the moral high ground that World War II was the good guys taking on the bad guys and winning. It was just a global killing ground where fifty five million people died.

leitmotiv
04-05-2008, 10:58 PM
I am certain Avro was making reference to certain fanatical defenders of German amour propre who are, paradoxically, not even German!

joeap
04-06-2008, 05:24 AM
Originally posted by smokincrater:

But never take the moral high ground that World War II was the good guys taking on the bad guys and winning. It was just a global killing ground where fifty five million people died.

...and for the 100th time, the number of people especially civilians deliberately killed by Axis forces as policy greatly outnumbers those killed by the Allies. That is also fact.

jurinko
04-06-2008, 05:27 AM
Since those ships were sunk close to Japanese coast bases where these reinforcements were heading and most of the survivors could get it to the coast, they were legitimate targets. Who feels sorry for German infantry strafed by IL-2? That´s just war.

Skoshi Tiger
04-06-2008, 08:33 AM
Originally posted by smokincrater:
Hello all. Just to point out a few facts. The Carey float recovered from HMAS Sydney doesn`t have any bullet holes in it. The damage recevied is quite clearly the result of splinters caused during Sydneys last fight.


Sorry, your talking about the one in the Australian war memorial found nine or so days after the battle, I was actually refering to the second life raft that washed up on the Christmas Islands (Not Coccos, my mistake ) on the 6 February 1942 with the body of the sailor (2 and a bit months after the Sydney was lost). This raft was also believed to be from the Sydney, though there is a bit of contraversy surounding it's origin. I believe they are trying to find where the body was buried to identify the sailor.

Anyway, with the Sydney found there will be a naval board of enquiry that might answer a few of the questions about her fate (And hopefully kill off some of the conspiracy theories about her....or maybe it will just be a coverup!) )

Tater-SW-
04-06-2008, 08:45 AM
As I said, they were troops who, had they survived would have:

1. Fought to the death any battle they didn't win (they'd not be winning any, either, do the math).

or

2. Succumbed to disease/depravation/bombing being skipped over in some tract-less jungle, with the occasional swarm of B-25s or B-24s making their lives hell.

or

3. Died in the life rafts or been eaten by sharks (or both).

Bottom line is that they would almost all end up dead anyway, we just helped them along a little.

MOH_MADMAN
04-07-2008, 12:34 PM
Excellent footage, thanks for posting.

MAD

Lurch1962
04-07-2008, 07:53 PM
I just love the tone of the narration of these newsreels! The language would in some cases be a little non-PC in today's world.

And yes, quite good footage. I'd donate a lesser-used organ or two just to have access to the vaults containing gems like these... even raw film.

smokincrater
04-09-2008, 05:09 AM
Originally posted by Skoshi Tiger:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by smokincrater:
Hello all. Just to point out a few facts. The Carey float recovered from HMAS Sydney doesn`t have any bullet holes in it. The damage recevied is quite clearly the result of splinters caused during Sydneys last fight.


Sorry, your talking about the one in the Australian war memorial found nine or so days after the battle, I was actually refering to the second life raft that washed up on the Christmas Islands (Not Coccos, my mistake ) on the 6 February 1942 with the body of the sailor (2 and a bit months after the Sydney was lost). This raft was also believed to be from the Sydney, though there is a bit of contraversy surounding it's origin. I believe they are trying to find where the body was buried to identify the sailor.

Anyway, with the Sydney found there will be a naval board of enquiry that might answer a few of the questions about her fate (And hopefully kill off some of the conspiracy theories about her....or maybe it will just be a coverup!) ) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don`t hold your breath. The only accont that managed to survive comes from German sources and that one will be the final accont unless something out of the blue happens. The float that you refer too has not been identified as coming from Sydney(as yet) all though it is most likely.

During the later half of the conflict Gossadmiral Doenitz asked his man in Japan if Sydney had been captured by the Japanese. The reply came back negative. Sydney remained on the Axis order of battle for the reminder of the war, although marked as heavily damaged. Which shows that the axis members were in the dark just as much we were.

KG66_Gog
04-10-2008, 03:01 AM
The German survivors that sheltered in the cave on the WA coast after the sinking said that they had buried a Leica Camera in there that contained pictures of the entire battle....but it was never found!

If, and I must emphasis IF, there was a camera, I will put money on that it was found and its film is safely hidden and lost in a long forgotten wartime file because the government was in no hurry to advertise the fact that a RAN Cruiser had been sunk by a merchant ship, especially when the country's morale was already at an all time low.

Maybe one day, they will see the light of day?