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View Full Version : If you could build a WW2 plane...



Haigotron
09-20-2006, 07:40 AM
What would you call it:
What year would it appear:
What would it be: (twin engined fighter...interceptor...)
Armament: (be realistic)
Features: Powerplant, wing profile, construction...
Strenghts: (it "pwns everyone" is not an answer)
Weaknesses: (YES THEY HAVE IT)
Misc: markings, color...

Include images if you wish http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif <span class="ev_code_RED">Idea is to have plausible and interesting ideas posted </span> http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Planes have to be technologically possible from 1935 to 1946 time. No transformer option please...Robots in disguise were not known back then...

My plane:
-The Pigeon
-1942
-Twin engined bomber/fighter
-2 cannons in the nose with lots of ammo
- Wing tip bomb rack to carry small ordinance (idea is to mimic wingtip tanks)Plus internal bomb bay to carry multiple small ordinances; would have a rear gunner/radio operator.
-Strenghts: capable of carrying large amounts of small ordinance - idea is to drop many small bombs instead of a few larger ones (heated debate with Air Force Officials about this one) on softer targets and quickly get out...
-Weakness: low speed and wingtip bomb rack caused instability...ambitious but obsolescent by the time it came out...designer dies in a test flight...<span class="ev_code_GREEN">A man can dream...</span>

Foo.bar
09-20-2006, 08:02 AM
My favourite: Henschel Hs-123

http://www.luftwaffepics.com/LCBW/Hs123-A1-8.jpg

Feathered_IV
09-20-2006, 08:06 AM
Mitsubishi A5M4 http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/heart.gif

Haigotron
09-20-2006, 08:11 AM
Let me rephrase it: If you invented a new design, concept or a new type of plane that didnt exist...a hypotheticla one! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Sorry for the confusion....I assume the pigeon doesnt exist...

R988z
09-20-2006, 09:16 AM
Originally posted by Haigotron:
Let me rephrase it: If you invented a new design, concept or a new type of plane that didnt exist...a hypotheticla one! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Sorry for the confusion....I assume the pigeon doesnt exist...

To be honest I don't think there is all that much scope left for new ideas in that era, especially with all the nutter ideas the Germans came up with (though the allies had their own range of crazy concepts and prototypes)

Feathered_IV
09-20-2006, 09:27 AM
Maybe a tiny, single seat, superfast torpedo carrier with a pusher propeller and plenty of pilot armour http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/touche.gif.

TheCrux
09-20-2006, 09:31 AM
A what if? in a time warp/parallel universe.

If I were to muse to myself as a designer/builder from a beleagured airforce looking for a plane to turn the tide:

1 ) A sleek single engined fighter looking like cross between a Ki-61 and a Mig-3.

2) Would use an inverted Allison V1710 w/two stage supercharger. ( plentiful and durable basic engine is the main reason for choosing the Allison ) making 1700 HP. Would use modern alloys for rods/pistons.

3) Would be manuverable, but more in rate of roll than turn radius.

4) Armament of 2 synchronized Browning M2 12.7mm above engine and two Hispano 20mm cannon in wings close to the fuselage.

5) Use of modern alloys or composites ( Kevlar, carbon fiber, honeycomb, titanium, 5056 aluminum ) for weight/strength in structures/armor. Reduced weight would make a good climber.

Haigotron
09-20-2006, 09:47 AM
Use of modern alloys or composites ( Kevlar, carbon fiber, honeycomb, titanium, 5056 aluminum ) for weight/strength in structures/armor. Reduced weight would make a good climber.

Good point, but how many of those alloys or composites existed back then....well if its an alternate universe that it could have existed http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Airmail109
09-20-2006, 09:48 AM
1) Twin engined push/pull propellor system like the DO335A

2) Bubble Canopy

3) Air intakes below the the wings much like an f-15

4) Cheek "skirts" to give added lift like an F-18

5) Fairly wide flat body which tapers into the wings smoothly

6) 4 x 14.7 or 15mm Machine guns + 2 x 20 mm Cannon

7) Highly tuned 18 litre (light weight instead of say 27 litres) V12s producing 2000hp

8) As much weight saving materials as possible/composites....if not available..a geodetic fu****e for strength

9) Internal Bombay for carriage of 1500lb of ordanance

8) Kevlar + Titanium amor for engines, Fuel tank, Cockpit, and wing roots.

9) Low drag wings

10) Monoquoqe construction with next to no rivets on the outside of the fighter, Smooth clean flowing lines to improve areodynamics.

11) Both engines mounted in the middle of the fighter, giving the pilot better visibility over the nose and perhaps a better centre of gravity!

Fighterduck
09-20-2006, 09:49 AM
this one!

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y67/Fighterphone/20041128-porco.jpg

...but with 2x12.5 guns and a 20mm cannon.

Haigotron
09-20-2006, 10:14 AM
Originally posted by Fighterduck:
this one!

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y67/Fighterphone/20041128-porco.jpg

...but with 2x12.5 guns and a 20mm cannon.

now that would pwn everyone http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Fighterduck
09-20-2006, 11:18 AM
indeed http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

p1ngu666
09-20-2006, 11:26 AM
4 engine mossie, or mossie with napier sabres

or the supermarine bomber, or thingy who designed the bouncing bomb, his uber bomber http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

Sergio_101
09-20-2006, 11:48 AM
http://www.aero-web.org/database/aircraft/showimage.php?id=84

GoodYear F2G-2
Also known as a "Super Corsair".
P&W R-4360 @ 3,000hp.
Could be fitted with 4 20mm cannon.

Sergio

HayateAce
09-20-2006, 12:37 PM
Extreme pwnage.

http://fighter-collection.com/images/bearcat.jpg

gdfo
09-20-2006, 01:53 PM
What the heck is 'pwnage'?

jolly_magpie
09-20-2006, 02:09 PM
Geez, check out the old PC game Crimson Skies for some fun designs.

It's funny, warbirds are becoming so valuable some folks are building them from scratch. I saw a P-51B in some magazine that was built from sheet metal and plans.

Low_Flyer_MkVb
09-20-2006, 02:17 PM
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y231/Low_Flyer/miles20m39b.jpg

Sergio_101
09-20-2006, 02:17 PM
Originally posted by jolly_magpie:
Geez, check out the old PC game Crimson Skies for some fun designs.

It's funny, warbirds are becoming so valuable some folks are building them from scratch. I saw a P-51B in some magazine that was built from sheet metal and plans.

Given the current selling price for P-51s I would
venture a guess that new ones will be manufactured in the near future.
Last I knew Piper Aircraft owns the rights.

New engines will obviously be a problem.
RR may not want to build new Merlins
but someone could build a modernised substitute
that would fit the same space.

Sergio

leitmotiv
09-20-2006, 02:51 PM
Of course we have the new build Me 262s and, I believe, somebody is making new Ki-43s.

slo_1_2_3
09-20-2006, 03:16 PM
Originally posted by Low_Flyer_MkVb:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y231/Low_Flyer/miles20m39b.jpg Argh! you stole my idea, realy I was thinking about a twin engined canard design, o well back to the drawing board

Snow_Wolf_
09-20-2006, 03:31 PM
The all Mighty Zero

http://www.clubhyper.com/images/bearimages/a6m5wallpapertd_1.jpg

fordfan25
09-20-2006, 04:11 PM
just off the top of my head,something close to a tiger cat or p38. 2 radial engiens. probly same used in the corsair. 4 to 6 20mm cannons in the nose with large ammo supplie. would be a multi roll fighter/bomber. could cary multi clusters of rockets/bombs surpassing that of even the -4 sair. carrier based. bubble canopy. time frame mid '43. she would be fast and built like a tank. B&Z when used as a fighter. manuvrable probly a bit less than the REAL p-38. as fast as a p-51 or 47 at high alt but with a better climb rate and a higher excelaration rate. dive's like the Italin navy hehehe. and would be fast at low alt as well do to haveing twin DW. would have very long range when escorting do to the fact that the twin double wasp engines allow in the power to carry four large drop tanks http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

fordfan25
09-20-2006, 04:14 PM
another would be a mix between the mustang D and the p-38. picture basicly the frount half of the stang "canopy and forward" minus the moter. in its place 6 50's or 20mm's but wityh the wings,engiens and fork tailed disighn of the 38 all blended togather semlessly http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif photo shop please

Sergio_101
09-20-2006, 06:47 PM
http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/050317-F-1234P-032.jpg

Sergio

LStarosta
09-20-2006, 06:51 PM
It won the war twice before refuelling.

fordfan25
09-20-2006, 06:57 PM
Sergio_101
not even close to what i was talking about.

JG53Frankyboy
09-20-2006, 07:45 PM
What would you call it: Junkers Ju 393 "Habicht"

What year would it appear: early 1944

What would it be: single engined Tankhunter/assault plane, one pilot

Armament: in the nose one MK214A , 50mm canon (160rpm, V0 920m/s) loaded with Tungsten AP rounds or HE shells, depending on the mission / one belly rack for one AB250, AB500 or WB81 (gunpod with 3 MG81Z)

Features: canard design, shape similar to the japanese J7W, but larger ; engine low level rated BMW801

Strenghts: fast at low level, manouverable because of its canard design

Weaknesses: not heavy armoured, bad rearview


to stop the soviet tank hordes.........

Daiichidoku
09-20-2006, 09:05 PM
What would you call it: Bf-185(Z)3xB20,+25lbs

What year would it appear:3074

What would it be: (twin engined fighter...interceptor...)supercalli***ilistic conveyance

Armament: (be realistic) 4X mk108+1X mk103...wait, you said realistic...ummm 3X Berezin pulse lasers in the 40 megawatt range..umm wait.....

Features: Powerplant:ylithium/tachyon-based anti-gravity generator driving torqueless, same turning twins props

wing profile:supercritical eliptical low drag high lift sections, featuring slats patented by mandrake the magician

construction: FB airfield "concrete" grass thatch, sandwiched by deltawood, naturally

Strenghts: it pwns everyone...plus, its is missing 300kg of weight as a bonus

Weaknesses: uncomfortable throttle lever...also early versions are equipped with R-2800s, 50cals, have pilot-blinding bar in cockpit, and suffer from compressability

Misc: too difficult to fly, even for the most seasoned veterans, no-one will ever become an ace in one of these

markings, colour: any, but always with a great big yellow stripe down the back


:P

Daiichidoku
09-20-2006, 09:10 PM
ok....

instead of all that...id just build a .80 scale replica P38, that seats 2 people http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

id go here to get all i need to do it, too:

http://www.team-38.com/

Thanatos833
09-20-2006, 10:11 PM
What would you call it: Pi-3.14159
What year would it appear:1942

What would it be: : Twin engined monoplane fighter and light bomber

Armament:4 20 mm hispano cannons in nose, 1 500 lb bomb under fuselage and 1 250 pound bomb under each wing 4 0.5 caliber machine guns in remotely controlled dorsal turret,

Features: 1)Powerplant 2 1700 HP(2100 HP with emergency boost) BMW 801D 18 cylinder two-row air cooled radials with 4 bladed contra rotating propellers. 2 fire extinguisher charges in each engine.

2) Profile.

a Span 16.5 m
b Length 13.6 m
c Height 5.03 m
d Wing Area 42.2 sq m.

Construction : Structure made entirely out of wood and fabric, steel only in absolutely essential bracings to provide strength to structure with essential bracing and in armour.

This type of construction allows for extra weight to be invested in thick armour in vulnerable areas such as engines , fuel tanks and cockpit. Think electrically powered steel cables for extra durability for flight controls.

Strengths: Great Durability and firepower. good speed , climbing ability and range.

Weaknesses: Low manuverability, the only way for it to survive in a a dogfight is to use it's dorsal turret and to fight in the vertical
taking advantage of it's good climbing ability.

Misc: No special markings except for mottled olive green and drab brown color on top as well as sky blue color below for camouflage. The top coloring provides both camouflage in the air and especially when the plane is on the ground.

Oh yeah and if you were wondering I borrowed parts liberally from other planes, If anyone can guess which parts are borrowed and where I got them from I'll give them a cookie. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Vanderstok
09-21-2006, 02:17 AM
My plane would look something like this:
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l304/vanderstok/He-100/He100-d1-1.jpg
Fast, compact, efficient single prop pursuit fighter and ofcourse it should look fast as hell, even when on the ground...

MrBlueSky1960
09-21-2006, 02:51 AM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v187/Secudus/Boulton-Paul-P10002.jpg

ste_lakey
09-21-2006, 07:33 AM
Think I found a niche in the market. Design is for a battlefield support/CSAR aircraft also capable of dropping agents into france. Based on a modified B25 fuselage with enlarged tail section, the Vulture Mk I is an autogyro allowing very short takeoffs capable of delivering 6 fully armed troops direct to the battlefield, with the low aspect ratio wings offering good low level agility. Ceiling is 10000ft with max speed of 210mph and radius of 150 miles. Standard armament is 4 50 cal fixed forward firing guns, 1 x 50 cal gun in observers nose compartment and 2 x 20mm in the tail turret. Small bombload of upto 2000lb can be carried in small bomb bay and two underwing pylons to support troops. Plans are under way for the Vulture Mk 2, based on a Lancaster fuselage powered by two RR Griffons, with a single Napier Sabre linked through a gear box to power the rotor, offering better short field performance. Here is the Mk I:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v645/ste_lakey/autogyrocopy.jpg

Got the idea from the Fairey Rotodyne:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v645/ste_lakey/rotodyne03.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v645/ste_lakey/3299L-1.jpg

ploughman
09-21-2006, 09:42 AM
Strenghts: it pwns everyone...plus, its is missing 300kg of weight as a bonus


Here's the 300kg you're missing. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif


http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/mctomney/fattyherman.jpg

Yambretta
09-21-2006, 01:44 PM
Fly by wire donno if it will catch on http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

http://www.rob.com/pic/oops/oops4.jpg

Closter
09-21-2006, 02:09 PM
I would say a bf-109 with elliptical wings, and tricycle gear...



http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

JSG72
09-21-2006, 02:22 PM
Think the Martin baker MB-5

Would've been Nice

But DH Hornet could be hard to top!

Saburo_0
09-21-2006, 04:09 PM
Originally posted by Closter:
I would say a bf-109 with elliptical wings, and tricycle gear...
ME 309 close enough?
http://www.michas-bastelstube.de/Thumbs/Me309_1thu.jpg

http://www.scaleworkshop.com/gallery/me309an_1.htm
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

Manu-6S
09-21-2006, 04:16 PM
A Dora: safe, with good landing gear and a large cockpit for my 6'6".

Phil_C
09-22-2006, 12:13 AM
Anyone remember this show?

http://epguides.com/TaleSpin/logo.jpg

I forget the name of that plane, something duck from what i remember, but it always looked like a cross between the C119 and a PBY..

Yeah so its a slow lumbering target but id still love to fly around in it.

Thanatos833
09-22-2006, 09:17 AM
^^^ The seaduck, yeah I've always wondered how that transport plane in faster and more manuverable than the fighters of the airpirates.
True they are bipane fighters but still.

GerritJ9
09-22-2006, 10:00 AM
Basically I would build an upgraded Buffalo: a more powerful Cyclone (as was fitted to the FM-2), a modified wing with one 20mm on each side (Brewster actually built several of these wings), refine the plane aerodynamically and cut weight to that of the F2A-1, and go over the design to simplify production. Then get General Motors to build it instead of the Wildcat.

Friendly_flyer
09-22-2006, 04:59 PM
Most €œjack-of-all-trades€ planes are alls €œmaster-of-non€. I would therefore like to make a good pre-war/early war pure fighter/interceptor.

First, engine. I find the Merlin a nice engine, but the pre war version had some problems, notably the negative cut out and lack of high altitude performance. I€d turn the thing over to Miss Shilling for ironing out the problems. She€d probably be able to add a turbocharger or something similar for altitude performance.

Armament: I like the Russian 20mm€s. I would like two of those, mounted in the nose for easy aiming. If I can have something like 120 rounds for each, I think I can dispense with MGs, but I€d need an ammo metre in the cockpit.

Wings: The semi laminar, elliptical Spitfire wings are hard to beat for sheer speed and turning ability. Without the guns in them, they could be even lighter. I€d use some of the spare room to do something about the wheel-wells, giving my plane very wide landing carriage.

Fuselage: With the nose-mounted guns, the balance point would tip a bit forward compared to a spitfire. A simple solution would be to shorten the fuselage a bit, but that would hurt longitudal stability. I rather think I would pull the guns back, having them at the sides, below the cockpit. I would possibly make the cockpit a tad taller, giving the pilot better view at the same time. The increased weight would be countered by adding a bit of lift to the tail, like on later mark Spitfires.

Materials: Outer wing tips, tail and fuselage made from plywood over duraluminium tubing, strong and light. The rest of the plane would have standard armour. This would save quite a bit of weight. All control surfaces made of metal to avoid €œsoggy€ controls.

All in all I think we€d see a very fast, very manoeuvrable plane with a heavy punch!

fordfan25
09-23-2006, 12:06 AM
Originally posted by Phil_C:
Anyone remember this show?

http://epguides.com/TaleSpin/logo.jpg

I forget the name of that plane, something duck from what i remember, but it always looked like a cross between the C119 and a PBY..

Yeah so its a slow lumbering target but id still love to fly around in it. yes i loved that show as a kid. i built some impressive lego version of the seaduck. not kits' but out of a random box of left over pasrts http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif. that plane is what lead to my love of both the PBY and the P-38 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif. the resone it was faster over the pirates planes is it had super powerfull engiens "bult by chevy i bet, sux it haywooood http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif " and the air pirates had cra*y wore out planes. much better power to weight. though i qustion your claim to it being more manuverble. it was the fact that the AP fighter could not perform negative G mavuvers and would kill the moters iir http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif plus Balue was the love child of chuck yager and Momma bear from The Story of Goldilocks http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.dont beleave the rumors He paid all his child support on time http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif momma bears brother yogie made sure of that http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/crackwhip.gif